Being a superhero is cool and all but there is nothing to do in that game except grind. Many others have expressed this same view. What do YOU think that EQ2 or WOW (or any other upcoming MMORPG) is going to offer BESIDES the same grind to level by killing mobs? I am very curious to see what you have to say so please don't just blow this off.
Ok I played CoH and feel that this game was a spectacular success and failure at the same time. Let me explain briefly then I'll address your question.
CoH was successful because it was well written, the story and characters were very believable in a super hero context, the UI and game mechanics were quite intuitive and the overall rollout was well executed. I played for about 1.5-2 months and enjoyed my time playing the game.
CoH was not successful because there was absolutely no depth, the number of game dynamics were oversimplified and not only was there an obvious grind but because of shallow gameplay and lack of game dynamics the grind became the focal point of the whole game.
It's funny, when I started CoH I thought "what a relief not to have to worry about GP's". But what I found was that instead of finding an alternative to GP's they just have it another name (Influence) and tried to tie it directly to character enhancements.
The effect this had on me as a player, was that I now have currency I can only spend in one way (for enhancements/inspirations) ... basically for character enhancement. You can always throw in the "RP" arguement, however this is not a valid argument when discussing the strength/weakness of a game since even an older style mud offers the same thing.
In the end, I think the games I'm waiting for (Dark and Light, Darkfall and PotBS) will have much more appeal since they will provide you with more game dynamics and deeper gameplay.
For instance, having a supergroup in CoH is simply "there because" and really has little effect on your day to day gameplay - it is superfical. OTOH I envision D&L and Darkfall guilds as being much more like Shadowbane - you live and die with the protection of your guildmates. In these games you will build/conquer buildings and towns, manage cities and empires, war and ally with other factions, be able to become a merchant, smith, warrior, bounty hunter, mercenary, etc....
In the end CoH was a single player game brought to the MMORPG format. I think the positives are that it was a clean, elegant and fluid game and the negatives that it simply does not offer the longetevity or dynamic gameplay we have come to expect of MMORPG's.
I think CoH is a great game for causal gamers. For Instance I can just log in for an hour or so and blast some Freaks with some friends. I think the community is really nice there. True there is not much more to do except grind but the graphics are great and its really easy just to log on with some friends and have one. When I want some more depth I log onto Eve online(which I just started) and its gives my the depth that I need. All in all I think CoH is a very polished game and City of Villians in going to bring some really good PvP into the mix.
-------------------------------------------- Current Games:
CoH LVL 20 AR/DEV Blaster - Dj Mystic Blue
SwG (Voted with my Wallet) Account Cancelled on 7/21/04
In the end, I think the games I'm waiting for (Dark and Light, Darkfall and PotBS) will have much more appeal since they will provide you with more game dynamics and deeper gameplay. For instance, having a supergroup in CoH is simply "there because" and really has little effect on your day to day gameplay - it is superfical. OTOH I envision D&L and Darkfall guilds as being much more like Shadowbane - you live and die with the protection of your guildmates. In these games you will build/conquer buildings and towns, manage cities and empires, war and ally with other factions, be able to become a merchant, smith, warrior, bounty hunter, mercenary, etc.... In the end CoH was a single player game brought to the MMORPG format. I think the positives are that it was a clean, elegant and fluid game and the negatives that it simply does not offer the longetevity or dynamic gameplay we have come to expect of MMORPG's.
This is an excellent point of view. I also am incredibly excited about Darkfall in particular. I believe Darkfall will be the beginning of new games that will erode the playerbase in WoW and EQ2. Having played Shadowbane, I realize how loathsome it is to go back to a game that has no depth and where your existence has no meaning in the grand scheme of things. While I will be purchasing WoW because I am a huge Warcraft fan, I already know the game is going to fail on several levels where Shadowbane (ugly as it is graphicswise) succeded. Creating cities, controlling territory and limitless character variation have all become my new standard of gameplay and while I am an experienced grinder and quester, nothing can replace the depth these elements bring to a game. Darkfall looks incredible. In my mind, I envision the game to be the second incarnation of Shadowbane. If Darkfall can successfully incorporate the elements that made Shadowbane unique, I think the incumbant MMORPGs are going to have a run for their money.
(Of course, I'd always be down for playing Shadowbane II! Hopefully we may see it...)
Originally posted by imfurious I wouldn't be surprised if 100,000+ people have subscribed to CoH for purely the fun factor alone but I bet that number will be a far lower six months after release.
Statesman announced about a month ago they reached 100,000 paid subscriptions. If I wasn't so tired right now, I'd go find the post. I'll edit it on later.
-------------------------------------------- Frodo has failed. Bush has The Ring.
---------------------------------------------- "Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb." -- Batman
I personally think that when the release of those new games this one will take a big hit but maybe not, I just never had to much fun playing this game and think that it is a really fun game for the first while and than it begins to become repetitive and I slowly lost interest. I hope to see the number of subscribers increase as it is a pretty decent game and I give it props for the type of idea.
- - - - - - MMORPG RETIRED: - Everquest - Dark Age of Camelot - Lineage II - Runescape - BETA ACCEPTIONS: - Planetside - Everquest - Guildwars - World War II Online - Lineage II - EVE Online -
Originally posted by Helixwolf Thought I'd run this question by everyone in COH: Do you think once WoW and EQ2 come out that alot of people will leave COH? (Leaving COH for WoW when it comes out! )
Wars may end, but war itself will never end!
You are _always_ going to get player migration when a new game is released - whether this is short lived or not depends on alot of factors
But I've said it before and I'll say it again, I predict that WoW will have a similar reception to SWG - in that players expectations are WAYYYYY too high, the game will, as a result, 'SUCK' (i.e. not deliver) and players will be bitching about it anywhere and everywhere they can - since its likely to attract the battle.net crowd (I apologise for generalising here) this will put alot of players off the game
Its quite possible that EQ2 will also suffer from this (but if its anything like the original I'll steer clear)
Originally posted by Helixwolf Do you think once WoW and EQ2 come out that alot of people will leave COH? (Leaving COH for WoW when it comes out! )
Probably.
Not me though, I think those two look boring and childish (you may guess which is which). On the other hand I will probably cancel my CoH account in order to do more Eve Online again. Otherwise CoH will almost certainly go when Dark and Light is released...
I really like CoH.....I don't think I'll give it up.....it gives me a break from the other mmorpgs(eve) and its just fun to play. I think CoH will survive espically when CoV comes out people will come back to the game. Anway its all about prefrence.
-------------------------------------------- Current Games:
CoH LVL 20 AR/DEV Blaster - Dj Mystic Blue
SwG (Voted with my Wallet) Account Cancelled on 7/21/04
COh will see a dip, but with 200k users I'm pretty sure the genre and solidness of the game will keep the vast majority. I personally Like alot about EQ2, but my faith in Soney is nil. The game is pretty much guaranteed to have a horrible release. After a few months if the reviews aren't terrible I might try it if SOR isn't very good (i have heard mixed things). I have played WOW on a friends beta account (recently)...it's going to be a disapointment. It's like a MMOG for 10 year olds...it's really...simple.
Originally posted by bverji COh will see a dip, but with 200k users I'm pretty sure the genre and solidness of the game will keep the vast majority. I personally Like alot about EQ2, but my faith in Soney is nil. The game is pretty much guaranteed to have a horrible release. After a few months if the reviews aren't terrible I might try it if SOR isn't very good (i have heard mixed things). I have played WOW on a friends beta account (recently)...it's going to be a disapointment. It's like a MMOG for 10 year olds...it's really...simple.
I'm curious what you mean by WoW being really simple. Howso? I'm honestly curious.
What I mean about WOW being simple is that the graphics are a little cartoonish. No more so then the other Warcraft games and not a big deal, but a factor. The races are really split up and there really isn't much interaction between races. Most of the the difference between weapons, spells and such seem very cosmetic. I realize that is true with a lot of MMOGs but magic weapons for example are mostly just different skins...very little difference in what they can do. There arent many classes to choose from, not much customization of avatars. The combat is pick target and wait for monster to fall. Aggro control isn't very good. All the skins for NPCs are the same. You can go fight a wolf and it be like level 1 and see another be ready to fight and it be like level 15. Strength of the creatures seem random as well. You could be fighting a bear that is like level 5 and come across a level 10 wolf. The classes are very pigeoned holed not any diversity between them and there aren't many classes. No content nothing really to do (which doesnt bother me I expect a game to grow).
As for warstrike yes my friend broke the NDA (I did not) not like he is the first person to do so and live. Not all reviews by people for this game have been favorable, dont know where you get that from obviously this isnt true, everyone isn't going to like the same game. Did all these LEGIT beta testers break the NDA too? There are going to be people who enjoy the game and Im not saying that it wont have its following, but it doesnt come close to living up to the hype that has been circled around it, which is more common then not.
As for Sony it didnt make or release EQ and EQ has lasted based upon the player base it has managed to keep and the foundations of a solid game (for when it was made). If you would like to go down the list of other Sony MMOGs and how they have crashed we can. I exaggerated by stating that Sony was " guranteed" a bad release, but my point was that their track record hasn't been good thus far and it was an obviouse exaggeration to illustrate the point.
Also warstrike I guarantee you I am articulate enough to engage in critical analysis. if you cant disagree like an adult without resulting to insults and personal sarcasm then maybe you should refrain from posting. If you continue to be belligerent I will report you.
I gave my opinion based on my experience, which is what this thread asked for. If you cannot appreciate that you can at least be respectful that it is my opinion and just because it differs from yours it doesnt make me simpleminded
Originally posted by tu_uilwen I know i will be playing CoH for awhile once i get it.......
Flat out, the only reason you are drooling on your shirt for this game is because you don't own it. The game stinks, plain and simple.
The vast majority of people have already left. But a small amount of the Nintedo type players will stay because it is a good gameboy type game. But the game will go down in MMORPG history as a really bad game.
"The reality of the poor in America isn't the difference between The Haves and The Have Nots, it is the difference between The Haves and The Have Lots."
Originally posted by tu_uilwen I know i will be playing CoH for awhile once i get it.......
Flat out, the only reason you are drooling on your shirt for this game is because you don't own it. The game stinks, plain and simple.
The vast majority of people have already left. But a small amount of the Nintedo type players will stay because it is a good gameboy type game. But the game will go down in MMORPG history as a really bad game.
I disagree completely with almost every statement you just made.
He's drooling over the game because it looks good, sounds great and is highly acclaimed... I drool over it too and I own it, so that can't be the reason. The game stinks *to you* and that's all. Stop projecting so hard.
The vast majority of people have NOT already left. If so that means that CoH was once past the 400K+ mark and I'm sure they would've announced something like that. Perhaps the vast majority of your friends have left, but your statement, as is, cannot possibly be correct.
This Nintendo kick you're on I just don't understand. That "small" group, somewhere between 100K and 200K subscribers, will stay because they enjoy the game. It's fun and simple and makes you feel good.
And of course, the articles (history) we have so far all proclaim that CoH is one of the greatest, or at least highest quality, MMOs of all time. It is only a small vocal sect of harcore exprienced and often jaded MMOers that hate the game. Everyone else seems to love it.
I started playing CoH as just a hold over until EQ2 or WoW came out. I'm not sure now I love CoH it's my type of game. I have played other MMORPG's (UO, AC, FFXI, EQOA) and this is by far my favorite. I will still wait and see how E2 and/or WoW turns out but I plan on playing CoH even after they come out now.
There are some people that got CoH as a mere holdout until EQII, WoW, or some other MMO comes out. Mostly they are the ones leaving and often complain that CoH does not have what they want in a MMO, because they want they EQII and the WoW system. As I have stated before if you want a deep MMO with alot of crafting and tasks that may take you forever to complete then stay away from CoH and save us CoH fans the headache of your complaints.
By all means if you want to sit down and have some good and quick fun then come on and get into CoH.
I have to go the daily maintenance on the servers has finished and I need my 'fix' for the day.
especailly with the new updates and highly anticipated City of Villains comming out i think this game is gonna be solid for a looong time and also there is no other game that provides Marvel Style different type of gameplay instead of the old hack and slash orcs , elves , humans , dwarfs or w/e other name u call the same type of char.
1) New MMO chasers... whatever new MMO comes out, they get it...
2) EQ or WoW fanboys
3) People just playing CoH til something they like better comes along
None of these people are in CoH's main target audeinces... "droves" is rediculous... there is no basis for that statement and evidence to the contrary...
---------------------------- City of Heroes Fanboy Future Game Designer All-around bad mutha-shutchomouf
I don't know really. I mean CoH is the first truly different MMO to come out in awhile (honestly people if its called EQ, EQ2, WoW or FF XI, its still High Fantasy and you kill things with sharp swords, not really new) so I might stick with it awhile. Of Course it realy depends how City of Villains works, that's the one thing (PvP, Nemesi and Guild wars) is what the game really needs. I think CoH has a lot of staying power. But I mean, its Blizzard, those people are incabable of making bad games.
Comments
Ok I played CoH and feel that this game was a spectacular success and failure at the same time. Let me explain briefly then I'll address your question.
CoH was successful because it was well written, the story and characters were very believable in a super hero context, the UI and game mechanics were quite intuitive and the overall rollout was well executed. I played for about 1.5-2 months and enjoyed my time playing the game.
CoH was not successful because there was absolutely no depth, the number of game dynamics were oversimplified and not only was there an obvious grind but because of shallow gameplay and lack of game dynamics the grind became the focal point of the whole game.
It's funny, when I started CoH I thought "what a relief not to have to worry about GP's". But what I found was that instead of finding an alternative to GP's they just have it another name (Influence) and tried to tie it directly to character enhancements.
The effect this had on me as a player, was that I now have currency I can only spend in one way (for enhancements/inspirations) ... basically for character enhancement. You can always throw in the "RP" arguement, however this is not a valid argument when discussing the strength/weakness of a game since even an older style mud offers the same thing.
In the end, I think the games I'm waiting for (Dark and Light, Darkfall and PotBS) will have much more appeal since they will provide you with more game dynamics and deeper gameplay.
For instance, having a supergroup in CoH is simply "there because" and really has little effect on your day to day gameplay - it is superfical. OTOH I envision D&L and Darkfall guilds as being much more like Shadowbane - you live and die with the protection of your guildmates. In these games you will build/conquer buildings and towns, manage cities and empires, war and ally with other factions, be able to become a merchant, smith, warrior, bounty hunter, mercenary, etc....
In the end CoH was a single player game brought to the MMORPG format. I think the positives are that it was a clean, elegant and fluid game and the negatives that it simply does not offer the longetevity or dynamic gameplay we have come to expect of MMORPG's.
--------------------------------------------
Current Games:
CoH
LVL 20 AR/DEV Blaster - Dj Mystic Blue
SwG
(Voted with my Wallet)
Account Cancelled on 7/21/04
Eve Online
Lord Thrawn - Just started
(Of course, I'd always be down for playing Shadowbane II! Hopefully we may see it...)
--------------------------------------------
Frodo has failed. Bush has The Ring.
----------------------------------------------
"Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb." -- Batman
- - - - - -
MMORPG RETIRED: - Everquest - Dark Age of Camelot - Lineage II - Runescape -
BETA ACCEPTIONS: - Planetside - Everquest - Guildwars - World War II Online - Lineage II - EVE Online -
You are _always_ going to get player migration when a new game is released - whether this is short lived or not depends on alot of factors
But I've said it before and I'll say it again, I predict that WoW will have a similar reception to SWG - in that players expectations are WAYYYYY too high, the game will, as a result, 'SUCK' (i.e. not deliver) and players will be bitching about it anywhere and everywhere they can - since its likely to attract the battle.net crowd (I apologise for generalising here) this will put alot of players off the game
Its quite possible that EQ2 will also suffer from this (but if its anything like the original I'll steer clear)
Probably.
Not me though, I think those two look boring and childish (you may guess which is which). On the other hand I will probably cancel my CoH account in order to do more Eve Online again. Otherwise CoH will almost certainly go when Dark and Light is released...
When WoW is released, I'll play both WoW and CoH. I liked CoH FAR more than I thought I would, and I don't see myself giving it up anytime soon.
I probably won't play EQ2. It's possible, but unlikely.
--------------------------------------------
Current Games:
CoH
LVL 20 AR/DEV Blaster - Dj Mystic Blue
SwG
(Voted with my Wallet)
Account Cancelled on 7/21/04
Eve Online
Lord Thrawn - Just started
COh will see a dip, but with 200k users I'm pretty sure the genre and solidness of the game will keep the vast majority. I personally Like alot about EQ2, but my faith in Soney is nil. The game is pretty much guaranteed to have a horrible release. After a few months if the reviews aren't terrible I might try it if SOR isn't very good (i have heard mixed things). I have played WOW on a friends beta account (recently)...it's going to be a disapointment. It's like a MMOG for 10 year olds...it's really...simple.
What I mean about WOW being simple is that the graphics are a little cartoonish. No more so then the other Warcraft games and not a big deal, but a factor. The races are really split up and there really isn't much interaction between races. Most of the the difference between weapons, spells and such seem very cosmetic. I realize that is true with a lot of MMOGs but magic weapons for example are mostly just different skins...very little difference in what they can do. There arent many classes to choose from, not much customization of avatars. The combat is pick target and wait for monster to fall. Aggro control isn't very good. All the skins for NPCs are the same. You can go fight a wolf and it be like level 1 and see another be ready to fight and it be like level 15. Strength of the creatures seem random as well. You could be fighting a bear that is like level 5 and come across a level 10 wolf. The classes are very pigeoned holed not any diversity between them and there aren't many classes. No content nothing really to do (which doesnt bother me I expect a game to grow).
As for warstrike yes my friend broke the NDA (I did not) not like he is the first person to do so and live. Not all reviews by people for this game have been favorable, dont know where you get that from obviously this isnt true, everyone isn't going to like the same game. Did all these LEGIT beta testers break the NDA too? There are going to be people who enjoy the game and Im not saying that it wont have its following, but it doesnt come close to living up to the hype that has been circled around it, which is more common then not.
As for Sony it didnt make or release EQ and EQ has lasted based upon the player base it has managed to keep and the foundations of a solid game (for when it was made). If you would like to go down the list of other Sony MMOGs and how they have crashed we can. I exaggerated by stating that Sony was " guranteed" a bad release, but my point was that their track record hasn't been good thus far and it was an obviouse exaggeration to illustrate the point.
Also warstrike I guarantee you I am articulate enough to engage in critical analysis. if you cant disagree like an adult without resulting to insults and personal sarcasm then maybe you should refrain from posting. If you continue to be belligerent I will report you.
I gave my opinion based on my experience, which is what this thread asked for. If you cannot appreciate that you can at least be respectful that it is my opinion and just because it differs from yours it doesnt make me simpleminded
Flat out, the only reason you are drooling on your shirt for this game is because you don't own it. The game stinks, plain and simple.
The vast majority of people have already left. But a small amount of the Nintedo type players will stay because it is a good gameboy type game. But the game will go down in MMORPG history as a really bad game.
"The reality of the poor in America isn't the difference between The Haves and The Have Nots, it is the difference between The Haves and The Have Lots."
Flat out, the only reason you are drooling on your shirt for this game is because you don't own it. The game stinks, plain and simple.
The vast majority of people have already left. But a small amount of the Nintedo type players will stay because it is a good gameboy type game. But the game will go down in MMORPG history as a really bad game.
I disagree completely with almost every statement you just made.
He's drooling over the game because it looks good, sounds great and is highly acclaimed... I drool over it too and I own it, so that can't be the reason. The game stinks *to you* and that's all. Stop projecting so hard.
The vast majority of people have NOT already left. If so that means that CoH was once past the 400K+ mark and I'm sure they would've announced something like that. Perhaps the vast majority of your friends have left, but your statement, as is, cannot possibly be correct.
This Nintendo kick you're on I just don't understand. That "small" group, somewhere between 100K and 200K subscribers, will stay because they enjoy the game. It's fun and simple and makes you feel good.
And of course, the articles (history) we have so far all proclaim that CoH is one of the greatest, or at least highest quality, MMOs of all time. It is only a small vocal sect of harcore exprienced and often jaded MMOers that hate the game. Everyone else seems to love it.
Service Guarantees Citizenship!
The Illusion of Choice
CoH - Tortimer lvl 23 Blaster fire/dev Triumph
EQOA:F - Tortimer lvl 42 Human Ranger Hodstock
There are some people that got CoH as a mere holdout until EQII, WoW, or some other MMO comes out. Mostly they are the ones leaving and often complain that CoH does not have what they want in a MMO, because they want they EQII and the WoW system. As I have stated before if you want a deep MMO with alot of crafting and tasks that may take you forever to complete then stay away from CoH and save us CoH fans the headache of your complaints.
By all means if you want to sit down and have some good and quick fun then come on and get into CoH.
I have to go the daily maintenance on the servers has finished and I need my 'fix' for the day.
P4-3.0Ghz 800fsb
512mb DDR3200
160Gb 7200rpm HardDrive
GeForce4 Ti4200 Overclocked
level 50 Fire/Fire Blaster
level 50 Fire/Fire Blaster
level 44 Fire/Kinetics Controllrr
level 36 Fire/Ice Tanker
GW Alpha Member
Legion of Exile
""Do you think once WoW and EQ2 come out that alot of people will leave COH?""
of course..
"No doubt about it, once WoW and EQII come out, people will abandon CoH in droves."
Nope. Heard that one before, for various games. Never happened, wont this time.
/agree
The main groups that will abandon CoH are:
1) New MMO chasers... whatever new MMO comes out, they get it...
2) EQ or WoW fanboys
3) People just playing CoH til something they like better comes along
None of these people are in CoH's main target audeinces... "droves" is rediculous... there is no basis for that statement and evidence to the contrary...
----------------------------
City of Heroes Fanboy
Future Game Designer
All-around bad mutha-shutchomouf
The Illusion of Choice
I know......many people will leave
But why play a boring game when you can get fun?
I dont get it