I thought old school gamers were the ones that played pong when it originally launched. The guys that saw pinball give rise to arcade, give rise to console.
Most mmo players today weren't even embryos when I was dropping quarters into Space Invaders, Asteroids, Pacman, Galaga, Centipede, Red Baron, and Tempest arcades.
I spent all nighters playing Misslecommand and Pitfall on Atari 2600. On PC I was determined to beat Oregon Trail and some text based dungeon crawl I can't remember the name of, till I got banned from the computer.
Thanks Terranah,
I remember when pong was initially refered to as T.V. Tennis/Hockey and the pinball to arcade transition. Lol, the memories of saving my allowance up to blow on the quarter eaters. Good times.
Edit-
Rofl, you guys and the C64 while I was stuck with Vic20 and casette Chuck Norris martial arts stick man game. The hero white stick man kicked from his knee down and ..got'em!, the red stick man went *poof*.
Original atari breakout was lots of fun, too.
Oh, the IBM PC with the 3.5 inch green and black vga that had the keybord that would snap into place over the drives and screen. I was playing some type of WW1 flight sim and I can't remember it's name. God that Pc was heavy for a young kid.
* Life is not black or white, it's shades of grey. But, at it's best/worst, it hints at 32bit color. -Me (a.k.a. RuthlessTimes)
* I do not need to know how to make a better game than you. I just need to know how to cancel my subscription. -Antarious(a slight misquote but the sentiment remains)
Getting back on track.... defining an old school "gamer" and an old school "mmo gamer" is what this post is really about. MMO's have nothing to do with pen and paper rpg's... so what if they are using some of the ideas from older genres of RPG's., it's a different industry. It would be legal to say that an mmorpg player from the late 90's to early 00's is an old school "MMO Gamer", not an old school "gamer". Some of you are taking the whole idea of this post out of context.
Not sure who mentioned pnp games, but if you really want to look at "old school" mmo's, you need to start in the late 70's or early 80's with Mud's. The old bbs's had multi player stuff going way back.
I often disagree with pretentious 'old-school' gamers, which I suppose I am as well, but there will always be someone more old-school, someone who believes that because another person hasn't played an older generation MMO that he cannot make informed comments about gameplay or mechanics.
Spending 10 hours in the same exact spot in EQ1 day after day to grind AA points because it was the most efficient camp, might be 'old-school' and hardcore but compared to even the worst MMOs today, it still sucked. Even though I admit I loved it at the time. That's just an example of a mechanic that's obviously inferior to what we have today, but people will attach themselves emotionally to their games and won't let go.
Some day in the future WoW will be considered 'old-school', and given the following it has, will probably remembered as a golden age in MMO gaming - much to the horror of people around here I suppose I used to find the anti-WoW sentiment disturbing, but now I just find it amusing.
It's like music, when your parents say that the old songs are the best, and children's TV isn't as good as when you were a child, and all of that.
I personally think that MMOs have come a looooonnnng way since UO and EQ1 and that we're spoiled for good games. However I am aware that this is not a popular opinion on this site, which is why most of my time on this site is spent in disagreement with other posters. :P
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
OP, you must be very disgruntled if something as petty as this disturbs you as much as you seem to be indicating... breath deeply every once in awhile, it's good for your health.
I remember playing ET for the 2600 when it first came out, beating it in less than 15 minutes too...
I also own almost every console system made to date (rest in peace my turbo graphics 16...)
I also remember having to load games via DOS and my beta invite to UO. Do I believe I am more oldschool than the next gamer? Nope. Do I think I have a broader video game history than most? Maybe. Did I cause a friend to have to get 4 stitches on his forehead when we first tried the Wii? I plead the 5th...
I loved spending hours at the arcade dropping quarters for hours on end. The day AOL offered a new all inclusive monthly fee for unlimited internet access was like Christmas, and my first 56k modem was like godly. I remember PC games and the Code Wheels they gave you as anti pirating devices.
Anyone remember Starflight for PC?
Do I believe I'm a more qualified gamer than the next? nope.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
I am 38 I have ben playing RPG's since the 80's on comadore 64, TI994a, and an apple IIc, I was there from the begining of MMORPG's Ultima and EQ started it all in my humble opinion. If you started with those and have played most the MMO's since then I think you have a good grasp on mmorpg's and what it is you want from them.
Agreed. I'm old, old, old, old school, I was playing tabletop D&D back in 1974 and was online with BBSs back before anyone ever heard of networking. I get really tired of people who think anything older than 5 years is a "classic". You think you're old-school? Tell me that again when you get out of diapers.
And I am sick of people feeling a need to slap descriptives and labels on everything and everyone, and of everyone feeling a need to compare epeen sizes all day long. Why do we need to quantify these sorts of things to ourselves all the time?
Although I admit, 300 baud was good times, on the c64
If we're talking 'gaming' in general and not just MMORPG's...
Anyone who played the original console systems when they were considered 'new', expensive, and cutting edge. (I don't even think the term 'cutting edge' was around back then, that I remember. And if it was, it is what you used in shop class.)
If you were playing pnp/electronic games before the birth of rap music, then you were old school before people worried about who was old school and who wasn't. You were 'pop's', 'dad', 'grandpa', 'old-timer', or something of the sort.
I've got some legit-'old school' gamer friends. They did the FPS thing IRL. When they left the service, they kept playing FPS's via console/computer... 'not enough targets' while they were in, they said.
Guys, old school players are those that have been playing MMO's for years, not just since the start of WoW lol, at least get that right. We are talking people that were there at the start of the original Uo, EQ, DAoC etc. before WoW was even a twinkle in Blizzards eye.
Old skool MMO players were/are MUD players. MMOs didn't even exist when MUDs began! lol
I'm sick of gamers who don't know the difference between "there," "their," and "they're." Perhaps they should cut back on the gaming and hit the books a bit harder. That is, unless they won't mind working at McDonald's their entire life.
All that stuff about pong and stuff brings up memories... but for me, it was PAC MAN !
I remember a friend and I would take a quarter each and go down to the Pizza Hut during our first year of college (1982) and play for 1-2 hours. We got pretty good i guess. That was pretty much all we could afford.... uh.... maybe I'm glad those days are over?!
Gaming has definitely come a long way.... and there's still a lot to be done in the future. MMOs tapped in to that social thing... you know, friendship and crap like that. Stuff that turns even the most boring activities like drinking, watching a game, or fishing into something fun.
The only concern I have about the genre is that they are now big-ticket items, major capital investments, and that just yields more and more sameness, because the investors want to keep tight reigns on the risk. Kind of like movies lately...
We should cheer for the innovators... even if we don't like what they come up with.
OP wrote: "Sick of new gamers who think their old school"
I'm sick of gamers who don't know the difference between "there," "their," and "they're." Perhaps they should cut back on the gaming and hit the books a bit harder. That is, unless they won't mind working at McDonald's their entire life.
Do not think you can count MUD's they are a different form of gaming. If you want to use MUD's then you have to use pnp players before that as old school. I think it starts with UO for the current MMORPG world.
Do not think you can count MUD's they are a different form of gaming. If you want to use MUD's then you have to use pnp players before that as old school. I think it starts with UO for the current MMORPG world.
See, I would count PnP and MUDs, They are the grandfathers of what grew up to be the MMORPG. Sure its like comparing the Model-T to todays Mustangs, but it was still a car none the less.
A gamer is a gamer no matter the medium they started in in my opinion.
Now if they were talking about just from the start of the graphical MMOs, then I would discount many MUDs and all PnP games. Some MUDs did use a form of graphics.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Getting back on track.... defining an old school "gamer" and an old school "mmo gamer" is what this post is really about. MMO's have nothing to do with pen and paper rpg's... so what if they are using some of the ideas from older genres of RPG's., it's a different industry. It would be legal to say that an mmorpg player from the late 90's to early 00's is an old school "MMO Gamer", not an old school "gamer". Some of you are taking the whole idea of this post out of context.
Wow, I started playing card games and board games in 1968. So that makes me old school........THANKS!
OP wrote: "Sick of new gamers who think their old school"
I'm sick of gamers who don't know the difference between "there," "their," and "they're." Perhaps they should cut back on the gaming and hit the books a bit harder. That is, unless they won't mind working at McDonald's their entire life.
My two copper, Oy.
Since we're on the subject of being sick of things.. I am very sick of the grammar police and their nazi rules about language. If it was up to them, we'd all still be speaking monkey-caveman (grunt grunt ugh ooga booga grunt grunt!) to each other, because according to them language is a static thing that has to follow set rules and never changes, instead of say.. the evolving thing language actually is. In other words, if popular use within a social group of "there, their and they're" is not the same as some dusty old book's version of it.. welcome to how language works. I blame the education system.
And then there are people who take the stance that if you're english is not 100%, you are somehow stupid or retarded, and nevermind that say.. english is not the most common language on the planet, and its just as likely the person writing something with typos might be some genius who only speaks mandarin or japanese or some such, and you'll look like a moron for dissing on them for bad english
OP wrote: "Sick of new gamers who think their old school"
I'm sick of gamers who don't know the difference between "there," "their," and "they're." Perhaps they should cut back on the gaming and hit the books a bit harder. That is, unless they won't mind working at McDonald's their entire life.
My two copper, Oy.
Since we're on the subject of being sick of things.. I am very sick of the grammar police and their nazi rules about language. If it was up to them, we'd all still be speaking monkey-caveman (grunt grunt ugh ooga booga grunt grunt!) to each other, because according to them language is a static thing that has to follow set rules and never changes, instead of say.. the evolving thing language actually is. In other words, if popular use within a social group of "there, their and they're" is not the same as some dusty old book's version of it.. welcome to how language works. I blame the education system.
And then there are people who take the stance that if you're english is not 100%, you are somehow stupid or retarded, and nevermind that say.. english is not the most common language on the planet, and its just as likely the person writing something with typos might be some genius who only speaks mandarin or japanese or some such, and you'll look like a moron for dissing on them for bad english
hmm... I dont know if I agre. I mene, if just say stuf and cant fuking spel, then how the heck we are going to comunicate?
hmm... I dont know if I agre. I mene, if just say stuf and cant fuking spel, then how the heck we are going to comunicate?
Communication isn't about spelling or any particular medium, so if you say stuff and can't fracking spell, and I am unable to understand.. its up to me to ask for clarification isn't it? Then again most oldschoolers can read typoese without thinking about it
OP wrote: "Sick of new gamers who think their old school"
I'm sick of gamers who don't know the difference between "there," "their," and "they're." Perhaps they should cut back on the gaming and hit the books a bit harder. That is, unless they won't mind working at McDonald's their entire life.
My two copper, Oy.
Since we're on the subject of being sick of things.. I am very sick of the grammar police and their nazi rules about language. If it was up to them, we'd all still be speaking monkey-caveman (grunt grunt ugh ooga booga grunt grunt!) to each other, because according to them language is a static thing that has to follow set rules and never changes, instead of say.. the evolving thing language actually is. In other words, if popular use within a social group of "there, their and they're" is not the same as some dusty old book's version of it.. welcome to how language works. I blame the education system.
And then there are people who take the stance that if you're english is not 100%, you are somehow stupid or retarded, and nevermind that say.. english is not the most common language on the planet, and its just as likely the person writing something with typos might be some genius who only speaks mandarin or japanese or some such, and you'll look like a moron for dissing on them for bad english
OP wrote: "Sick of new gamers who think their old school"
I'm sick of gamers who don't know the difference between "there," "their," and "they're." Perhaps they should cut back on the gaming and hit the books a bit harder. That is, unless they won't mind working at McDonald's their entire life.
My two copper, Oy.
Since we're on the subject of being sick of things.. I am very sick of the grammar police and their nazi rules about language. If it was up to them, we'd all still be speaking monkey-caveman (grunt grunt ugh ooga booga grunt grunt!) to each other, because according to them language is a static thing that has to follow set rules and never changes, instead of say.. the evolving thing language actually is. In other words, if popular use within a social group of "there, their and they're" is not the same as some dusty old book's version of it.. welcome to how language works. I blame the education system.
And then there are people who take the stance that if you're english is not 100%, you are somehow stupid or retarded, and nevermind that say.. english is not the most common language on the planet, and its just as likely the person writing something with typos might be some genius who only speaks mandarin or japanese or some such, and you'll look like a moron for dissing on them for bad english
hmm... I dont know if I agre. I mene, if just say stuf and cant fuking spel, then how the heck we are going to comunicate?
That was cute
And it is even more fun to quote someone quoting another that quoted a quote, if we keep this up we can do whole pages of just one post!
Comments
I remember when pong was initially refered to as T.V. Tennis/Hockey and the pinball to arcade transition. Lol, the memories of saving my allowance up to blow on the quarter eaters. Good times.
Edit-
Rofl, you guys and the C64 while I was stuck with Vic20 and casette Chuck Norris martial arts stick man game. The hero white stick man kicked from his knee down and ..got'em!, the red stick man went *poof*.
Original atari breakout was lots of fun, too.
Oh, the IBM PC with the 3.5 inch green and black vga that had the keybord that would snap into place over the drives and screen. I was playing some type of WW1 flight sim and I can't remember it's name. God that Pc was heavy for a young kid.
* Life is not black or white, it's shades of grey. But, at it's best/worst, it hints at 32bit color. -Me (a.k.a. RuthlessTimes)
* I do not need to know how to make a better game than you. I just need to know how to cancel my subscription. -Antarious(a slight misquote but the sentiment remains)
There are kids gaming today that weren't alive when I started.
But honestly, doesn't every generation of teenager think they 'know it all'?
Anyone who paid to play a game by the hour would probably be 'old school' by my standards. But that's just me.
Not sure who mentioned pnp games, but if you really want to look at "old school" mmo's, you need to start in the late 70's or early 80's with Mud's. The old bbs's had multi player stuff going way back.
There are kids gaming today that weren't alive when I started.
But honestly, doesn't every generation of teenager think they 'know it all'?
Anyone who paid to play a game by the hour would probably be 'old school' by my standards. But that's just me.
QFT
I often disagree with pretentious 'old-school' gamers, which I suppose I am as well, but there will always be someone more old-school, someone who believes that because another person hasn't played an older generation MMO that he cannot make informed comments about gameplay or mechanics.
Spending 10 hours in the same exact spot in EQ1 day after day to grind AA points because it was the most efficient camp, might be 'old-school' and hardcore but compared to even the worst MMOs today, it still sucked. Even though I admit I loved it at the time. That's just an example of a mechanic that's obviously inferior to what we have today, but people will attach themselves emotionally to their games and won't let go.
Some day in the future WoW will be considered 'old-school', and given the following it has, will probably remembered as a golden age in MMO gaming - much to the horror of people around here I suppose
I used to find the anti-WoW sentiment disturbing, but now I just find it amusing.
It's like music, when your parents say that the old songs are the best, and children's TV isn't as good as when you were a child, and all of that.
I personally think that MMOs have come a looooonnnng way since UO and EQ1 and that we're spoiled for good games. However I am aware that this is not a popular opinion on this site, which is why most of my time on this site is spent in disagreement with other posters. :P
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
OP, you must be very disgruntled if something as petty as this disturbs you as much as you seem to be indicating... breath deeply every once in awhile, it's good for your health.
I remember playing ET for the 2600 when it first came out, beating it in less than 15 minutes too...
I also own almost every console system made to date (rest in peace my turbo graphics 16...)
I also remember having to load games via DOS and my beta invite to UO. Do I believe I am more oldschool than the next gamer? Nope. Do I think I have a broader video game history than most? Maybe. Did I cause a friend to have to get 4 stitches on his forehead when we first tried the Wii? I plead the 5th...
I loved spending hours at the arcade dropping quarters for hours on end. The day AOL offered a new all inclusive monthly fee for unlimited internet access was like Christmas, and my first 56k modem was like godly. I remember PC games and the Code Wheels they gave you as anti pirating devices.
Anyone remember Starflight for PC?
Do I believe I'm a more qualified gamer than the next? nope.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
Doin' it old skool baby! Hell yeah!
Not playing anything right now.. waiting for AoC.. WAR is just... too damn ugly.. and kinda boring gameplay too.
I'm all the way from UO, but I don't consider myself as an old school gamer. I'm a present day gamer
And I am sick of people feeling a need to slap descriptives and labels on everything and everyone, and of everyone feeling a need to compare epeen sizes all day long. Why do we need to quantify these sorts of things to ourselves all the time?
Although I admit, 300 baud was good times, on the c64
If we're talking 'gaming' in general and not just MMORPG's...
Anyone who played the original console systems when they were considered 'new', expensive, and cutting edge. (I don't even think the term 'cutting edge' was around back then, that I remember. And if it was, it is what you used in shop class.)
If you were playing pnp/electronic games before the birth of rap music, then you were old school before people worried about who was old school and who wasn't. You were 'pop's', 'dad', 'grandpa', 'old-timer', or something of the sort.
I've got some legit-'old school' gamer friends. They did the FPS thing IRL. When they left the service, they kept playing FPS's via console/computer... 'not enough targets' while they were in, they said.
Old skool MMO players were/are MUD players. MMOs didn't even exist when MUDs began! lol
.:| Kevyne@Shandris - Armory |:. - When WoW was #1 - .:| I AM A HOLY PALADIN - Guild Theme |:.
OP wrote:
"Sick of new gamers who think their old school"
I'm sick of gamers who don't know the difference between "there," "their," and "they're." Perhaps they should cut back on the gaming and hit the books a bit harder. That is, unless they won't mind working at McDonald's their entire life.
My two copper,
Oy.
All that stuff about pong and stuff brings up memories... but for me, it was PAC MAN !
I remember a friend and I would take a quarter each and go down to the Pizza Hut during our first year of college (1982) and play for 1-2 hours. We got pretty good i guess. That was pretty much all we could afford.... uh.... maybe I'm glad those days are over?!
Gaming has definitely come a long way.... and there's still a lot to be done in the future. MMOs tapped in to that social thing... you know, friendship and crap like that. Stuff that turns even the most boring activities like drinking, watching a game, or fishing into something fun.
The only concern I have about the genre is that they are now big-ticket items, major capital investments, and that just yields more and more sameness, because the investors want to keep tight reigns on the risk. Kind of like movies lately...
We should cheer for the innovators... even if we don't like what they come up with.
lol
Do not think you can count MUD's they are a different form of gaming. If you want to use MUD's then you have to use pnp players before that as old school. I think it starts with UO for the current MMORPG world.
ZX80 FTW hehe
A gamer is a gamer no matter the medium they started in in my opinion.
Now if they were talking about just from the start of the graphical MMOs, then I would discount many MUDs and all PnP games. Some MUDs did use a form of graphics.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Wow, I started playing card games and board games in 1968. So that makes me old school........THANKS!
Since we're on the subject of being sick of things.. I am very sick of the grammar police and their nazi rules about language. If it was up to them, we'd all still be speaking monkey-caveman (grunt grunt ugh ooga booga grunt grunt!) to each other, because according to them language is a static thing that has to follow set rules and never changes, instead of say.. the evolving thing language actually is. In other words, if popular use within a social group of "there, their and they're" is not the same as some dusty old book's version of it.. welcome to how language works. I blame the education system.
And then there are people who take the stance that if you're english is not 100%, you are somehow stupid or retarded, and nevermind that say.. english is not the most common language on the planet, and its just as likely the person writing something with typos might be some genius who only speaks mandarin or japanese or some such, and you'll look like a moron for dissing on them for bad english
Since we're on the subject of being sick of things.. I am very sick of the grammar police and their nazi rules about language. If it was up to them, we'd all still be speaking monkey-caveman (grunt grunt ugh ooga booga grunt grunt!) to each other, because according to them language is a static thing that has to follow set rules and never changes, instead of say.. the evolving thing language actually is. In other words, if popular use within a social group of "there, their and they're" is not the same as some dusty old book's version of it.. welcome to how language works. I blame the education system.
And then there are people who take the stance that if you're english is not 100%, you are somehow stupid or retarded, and nevermind that say.. english is not the most common language on the planet, and its just as likely the person writing something with typos might be some genius who only speaks mandarin or japanese or some such, and you'll look like a moron for dissing on them for bad english
hmm... I dont know if I agre. I mene, if just say stuf and cant fuking spel, then how the heck we are going to comunicate?
Communication isn't about spelling or any particular medium, so if you say stuff and can't fracking spell, and I am unable to understand.. its up to me to ask for clarification isn't it? Then again most oldschoolers can read typoese without thinking about it
Since we're on the subject of being sick of things.. I am very sick of the grammar police and their nazi rules about language. If it was up to them, we'd all still be speaking monkey-caveman (grunt grunt ugh ooga booga grunt grunt!) to each other, because according to them language is a static thing that has to follow set rules and never changes, instead of say.. the evolving thing language actually is. In other words, if popular use within a social group of "there, their and they're" is not the same as some dusty old book's version of it.. welcome to how language works. I blame the education system.
And then there are people who take the stance that if you're english is not 100%, you are somehow stupid or retarded, and nevermind that say.. english is not the most common language on the planet, and its just as likely the person writing something with typos might be some genius who only speaks mandarin or japanese or some such, and you'll look like a moron for dissing on them for bad english
randomt 0
Godwin's Law 1
Since we're on the subject of being sick of things.. I am very sick of the grammar police and their nazi rules about language. If it was up to them, we'd all still be speaking monkey-caveman (grunt grunt ugh ooga booga grunt grunt!) to each other, because according to them language is a static thing that has to follow set rules and never changes, instead of say.. the evolving thing language actually is. In other words, if popular use within a social group of "there, their and they're" is not the same as some dusty old book's version of it.. welcome to how language works. I blame the education system.
And then there are people who take the stance that if you're english is not 100%, you are somehow stupid or retarded, and nevermind that say.. english is not the most common language on the planet, and its just as likely the person writing something with typos might be some genius who only speaks mandarin or japanese or some such, and you'll look like a moron for dissing on them for bad english
hmm... I dont know if I agre. I mene, if just say stuf and cant fuking spel, then how the heck we are going to comunicate?
That was cuteAnd it is even more fun to quote someone quoting another that quoted a quote, if we keep this up we can do whole pages of just one post!