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so how did the ECONOMY get to this point today- Democrats are the answer you seek.
bluberryhaze
Member Posts: 1,702
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aSKSoiNbnQY0
" Greenspan's Warning
The clear gravity of the situation pushed the legislation forward. Some might say the current mess couldn't be foreseen, yet in 2005 Alan Greenspan told Congress how urgent it was for it to act in the clearest possible terms: If Fannie and Freddie ``continue to grow, continue to have the low capital that they have, continue to engage in the dynamic hedging of their portfolios, which they need to do for interest rate risk aversion, they potentially create ever-growing potential systemic risk down the road,'' he said. ``We are placing the total financial system of the future at a substantial risk.''
What happened next was extraordinary. For the first time in history, a serious Fannie and Freddie reform bill was passed by the Senate Banking Committee. The bill gave a regulator power to crack down, and would have required the companies to eliminate their investments in risky assets.
But the bill didn't become law, for a simple reason: Democrats opposed it on a party-line vote in the committee, signaling that this would be a partisan issue. Republicans, tied in knots by the tight Democratic opposition, couldn't even get the Senate to vote on the matter."
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
Comments
Ron Paul tried to warn us about this housing bubble long before the democraps were voted in by pissed off citizens. Try July 16, 2002.
www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2002/cr071602.htm
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Wow, title seems to point at a different angle, but I'm glad to see others are not taken in by the utter stupidity of today's politics!
unaccountable.
lets hang the ones who actually had a chance to do something before the meltdown began.
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
Yup. here's where I reference two other good articles on the subject:
http://fishermage.blogspot.com/2008/09/ibd-confirms-blame-clinton.html
Here I refenece a much earlier article:
http://fishermage.blogspot.com/2008/09/decent-analysis.html
Also we should not that in terms of campaign contributions from fannie mae and freddie mac, Obama is at number 3, with $105K and Hillary Clinton is at 4, with $75K.
http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2008/07/top-senate-recipients-of-fanni.html
McCain isn't even in the top 25.
Neither side is innocent in this, but Democrats have much closer ties to Feddie Mae and Fannie Mac, which is one of the root causes of the issue. They are the ones who allowed a non-capitalist entity run amock in the center of a mostly capitalist system; thus taking advantage of the benefits of the free market, without having to pay the consequences.
Whenever we have a situation like that. the results are not good.
fishermage.blogspot.com
unaccountable.
lets hang the ones who actually had a chance to do something before the meltdown began.
I bought my condo right before the "BOOM" in 2003. I had a strange feeling this would happen when larger property around me was going for insane prices and the banks were giving them out like crazy. All I had to do was show up at the settlement and I could have had a 1.2m house.
IMO the people who are really at fault here are the people who decided to live astronomically outside their means when they accepted these ARM loans for property they could not afford. This just shows how irresponsible people out there can F things up for the rest of us and now the govt has to step in. Those who make bad decisions should be responsible for their actions. If we are ever going to have less govt in this country people need to stand up and take responsibility for their actions and NOT go blindly into a situation expecting something to bail them out if things don't go as planned.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Indeed, we libertarians have been talking about these government sponsored nightmares for a long time.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Wait, 2005?
When Republicans controlled the House, the Senate and the Presidency?
You know, the Republicans blame everything on Democrats meme was getting old during the Clinton administration, but this is pathetic. If those spineless 'tards are claiming that with the house, the senate, and the presidency they somehow couldn't pass this miraculous bill that would have headed off this crisis, they are seriously expecting their voters to have the intelligence of potted plants.
Unfortunately their voters seem to be supporting this assertion.
Go ahead and blame both parties, I think its fair to say neither one especially did anything to head this off, but painting this as the noble Republican majority somehow oppressed and persecuted by the Democrat minority is asking me to swallow a whole lot of smelly brown stuff.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
Both are certainly at fault, but democrats blocked reform, and that is how our congress works. The minority party CAN block things. It's a great system most of the in that it prevents one party from completely dominating everything even if they in control. It is another example of how we are a democratic federal republic, not a democracy.
fishermage.blogspot.com
happened next was extraordinary. For the first time in history, a serious Fannie and Freddie reform bill was passed by the Senate Banking Committee. The bill gave a regulator power to crack down, and would have required the companies to eliminate their investments in risky assets.
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
This is just the beginning. We will all be united on this side of the globe eventually. I present to you all our new currency. The Amero.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Hilarious. You linked to the homepage of a democratic senator that appears to show... err... nothing.
Once again, if the Republicans, while controlling both houses of congress and the presidency, considered this an extremely important issue but were unable to even get it to vote, they are probably among the most incompetent human beings ever to waste oxygen on this planet. The three stooges look like Einstein in comparison.
I will happily blame both parties, but to say this is an "evil democrat" thing is complete hogwash. The only way this is an 'evil democrat' thing is if the Republicans are about as good at governing as Toads are at building safe castles for the Princess.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
Hilarious. You linked to the homepage of a democratic senator that appears to show... err... nothing.
Once again, if the Republicans, while controlling both houses of congress and the presidency, considered this an extremely important issue but were unable to even get it to vote, they are probably among the most incompetent human beings ever to waste oxygen on this planet. The three stooges look like Einstein in comparison.
I will happily blame both parties, but to say this is an "evil democrat" thing is complete hogwash. The only way this is an 'evil democrat' thing is if the Republicans are about as good at governing as Toads are at building safe castles for the Princess.
Actually, that's how our government works. The minority party can block almost anything if it wants to.
Also, he linked to what the link said -- the Senate Banking Commitee. Dodd is the charman.
fishermage.blogspot.com
For comparison, here is Dodd's homepage:
http://dodd.senate.gov/
Sadly, he's my senator, so I oughta know...
fishermage.blogspot.com
Yeah, I have one word for you: Bull.
This bill was NOT killed in committee. From his own words:
"For the first time in history, a serious Fannie and Freddie reform bill was passed by the Senate Banking Committee. "
Now you're saying the bill was killed in committee. The amount of story not straight among the True BelieversTM here is pretty scary.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
Yeah, I have one word for you: Bull.
This bill was NOT killed in committee. From his own words:
"For the first time in history, a serious Fannie and Freddie reform bill was passed by the Senate Banking Committee. "
Now you're saying the bill was killed in committee. The amount of story not straight among the True BelieversTM here is pretty scary.
who was the senate banking commitee chairman in 2005?
republicans held the majority in 2005.
did you read the article, mr. obama supporter?
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
Yeah, I have one word for you: Bull.
This bill was NOT killed in committee. From his own words:
"For the first time in history, a serious Fannie and Freddie reform bill was passed by the Senate Banking Committee. "
Now you're saying the bill was killed in committee. The amount of story not straight among the True BelieversTM here is pretty scary.
Then where did the bill die and who or what killed it?
fishermage.blogspot.com
Actualy, if you read the OP carefully, he first makes reference to it "passing," then to it being killed in committee. I think that is more to do with a lack of editing than Bull. The fact is the Bill did die in the Senate Committee, as I have consitently said. Why you went after MY post and accused ME of Bull is beyond me.
All research I can do tells me it did not pass the senate banking committee, and most references claim the democrats for stalling it there. If you can find me a better source or a reference where it shows that republicans themselves caused it to die, please do so.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Plus, you COULD just READ the article he linked to. It's very informative.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aSKSoiNbnQY0
fishermage.blogspot.com
Andrew Cuomo can share in some of the heat too.
http://www.villagevoice.com/2008-08-05/news/how-andrew-cuomo-gave-birth-to-the-crisis-at-fannie-mae-and-freddie-mac/1
freddie and fannie going bellie up was the start of this meltdown.
how did freddie and fannie go bellie up?
give loans to those who don't deserve them.
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
Now me a guy who works at near minimum wage can afford a 3 bedroom 2 bath house in San Diego. I have benefited so much from the blunders of socialist legislation. I think its time for change. I think its time for the Libertarian Party.
(I will try to be calm. I promise).
Introduction
The OP has all of this mixed-up.
The Federal Reserve
The origins of this crisis is known as "easy money." From 2003 to 2005, the Fed kept interest rates BELOW the level of expected inflation, which created an ENORMOUS subsidy for debt that BOTH (1) households and (2) financial markets exploited.
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac
Both created by government, and able to borrow at rates LOWER than proviate corporations because of the "implied" backing from YOU (taxpayers). These firms bought questionable mortgages (Alt-A and subprime loans). [Brief aside: IF I can find the Memo I wrote, when I was an officer of a development company, warning what these loans would do to the real estate industry and how to guard against it.]
Mae and Mac have patrons in Washington who will simply bail them out and nothing more.
Credit-Rating
As a result of federal, and state, law a small number of credit rating agencies are allowed to assess risk for all debt securities in the market. Many of their assessments are wrong.
Moody's and S&P are the government chosen credit rating agencies, and at least Moody's is sending signals it will actually have no choice but to lower the Federal Government's perfect credit-rating.
Yes. It is THAT bad.
Banking Regulation
Simply put, bank regulation was not lacking during the Bush Administration... it did not exist. It is a government that hates regulators, people who ensure fairness, honesty, and accuracy to prevent these type of crises.
[Brief aside: wait until the least regulated firms, hedge funds and private-equity companies, start to implode as well.]
The Bear Stearns Bail-Out
This is where I admire Ron Paul. Yes. He knew, and this crisis has shown, that just bailing-out companies will delay a more serious crisis.
(1) bad debts, (2) bail-out, and (3) future crisis.
Taxpayer gets screwed in each stage.
Conclusion
The current crisis we are in has Republican prints ALL over it.
It is (1) banks + (2) big business + (3) non-regulation requiring the taxpayers to loose their assets, loose their homes, and then pay for the bail-out. God Bless America. No. God Bless Republicans.
who's running under the libertarian party?
I only see 2 contestants. a democrat and a republican. according to the tv and newspapers. according to the internet, too.
first lets get rid of media than perhaps real change in america can begin.
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
did you know, that you cannot just put any toilet bowl in your home? that too is regulated.
no sorry, OP replier. you have it all wrong,
we are looking for the start of this problem.
the start of this problem is the government- the government regulating fannie and freddie. forcing freddie and fannie to make risky loans.
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-
did you know, that you cannot just put any toilet bowl in your home? that too is regulated.
no sorry, OP replier. you have it all wrong,
we are looking for the start of this problem.
the start of this problem is the government- the government regulating fannie and freddie. forcing freddie and fannie to make risky loans.
Ha! ha! ha!
The start of the problem, as I wrote in my post, was the Federal Reserve and "easy money" and the exploitation of that easy money by (1) households and (2) financial markets.
The lack of oversight, analysts, and regulators is how it got out-of-control.
I think some of you do not know what "regulation" entails, and you think of it as a "Big Brother" thing.
ok. so what about my original post?
how come democrats chose to walk the party line rather than heed greenspans words?
-I will subtlety invade your psyche-