Nah, personally I think it will spike high on sales and then dwindle quite a bit on subs, especially after WotLK arrives. It's too much of a one trick pony.
I do not think it will happen with WoTLK, I know alot of PvPers that are not happy about the idea of PVP armor or weapontry tied to both Regular PvP and the Arena. Now this might now happen before launch, but the idea of it happening have friends of mine going back to Starwars Galaxies and Sony (Faint). I for one will not go back to wow now, I have experienced the WAR pvp set and their is no going back.
Its, funny. I'm browsing this and other War forums right now over that decision by Blizzard. I detest their duel in a box PVP and the desicion to make any and all PVP gear tied to it made me decide to cancel 2 accounts and start looking elsewhere.
Actually WOW has three ways to get PVP gear.. you get it from Arena, you get it from Battlegrounds and now you get it from Lake Wintergrasp (open world RvR) Some of the best gear will require Arena ratings, some will require battleground tokens, and some will require you to win Lake Wintergrasp.
And to put in Warhammer's terms. Yes, in WOW there are a few pieces that you can only get by winning in the Arena. But isn' that the same as Warhammer.. Isn't Order going to be 'locked out' of the best pvp gear because they are losing on that server? WOW, just like War, gives the best gear to players who win, but they give the losing side gear that is good enough to be competitive.
I can't wait for another month when not only is destruction steamrollong on most servers because of population imbalance, but they will also have better gear. There is already a lot of QQ now, wait til then.
Nah, personally I think it will spike high on sales and then dwindle quite a bit on subs, especially after WotLK arrives. It's too much of a one trick pony.
I do not think it will happen with WoTLK, I know alot of PvPers that are not happy about the idea of PVP armor or weapontry tied to both Regular PvP and the Arena. Now this might now happen before launch, but the idea of it happening have friends of mine going back to Starwars Galaxies and Sony (Faint). I for one will not go back to wow now, I have experienced the WAR pvp set and their is no going back.
Its, funny. I'm browsing this and other War forums right now over that decision by Blizzard. I detest their duel in a box PVP and the desicion to make any and all PVP gear tied to it made me decide to cancel 2 accounts and start looking elsewhere.
Actually WOW has three ways to get PVP gear.. you get it from Arena, you get it from Battlegrounds and now you get it from Lake Wintergrasp (open world RvR) Some of the best gear will require Arena ratings, some will require battleground tokens, and some will require you to win Lake Wintergrasp.
And to put in Warhammer's terms. Yes, in WOW there are a few pieces that you can only get by winning in the Arena. But isn' that the same as Warhammer.. Isn't Order going to be 'locked out' of the best pvp gear because they are losing on that server? WOW, just like War, gives the best gear to players who win, but they give the losing side gear that is good enough to be competitive.
I can't wait for another month when not only is destruction steamrollong on most servers because of population imbalance, but they will also have better gear. There is already a lot of QQ now, wait til then.
Perhaps you haven't been following recent developments in Beta of Wrath. But ALL PVP gear, even the blue starter sets now require a combination of arena points and honor. In fact, the number of points needed would have an avg play on an avg team 2-4 months to get a starter PVP set.
I'm not convinced that WAR will be pulling in all that flak though. I'm seeing more and more people already moving on to the next line of MMO's again. It's like an endless chairdance. Newest MMO comes around, they play it a while, get sick of it and move to the next.
I'm not convinced that WAR will be pulling in all that flak though. I'm seeing more and more people already moving on to the next line of MMO's again. It's like an endless chairdance. Newest MMO comes around, they play it a while, get sick of it and move to the next.
It's because no gaming companies are willing to push the envelopes. Every MMO is about elves, dwarves, ogres, and fantasy that has been coming out (a little bit of sci-fi can come again once in a while as well). I'm so sick of the damn fantasy genre. Nobody really gets that if you make a good MMORPG that is hyped enough and has at least some slight difference to WoW, it will be successful. AoC failed with this because their game wasn't finished. WAR will do alright, but not amazing because they're playing it on the safe route.
Trust me, I've been having some great fun with this game but I don't see how people can go about and say that this isn't just another MMO trying to take a free ride off of WoW. It isn't a bad thing, if others did it like WAR has been doing then all WoW copies with extra sprinkles would do semi-successful. These gaming companies need to realize that some of us are freakin' sick of WoW. And we don't want another WoW.
I see WAR growing in numbers actually. It's a game that just keeps getting better as you level. I quit WoW for 3 months after hitting level 59 with my first character. It was just burning me out with all the instances, and gear grind, and Tarren Mill zergfests.
WAR seems to be the opposite. I'm levelling while I'm PvPing. My guild is getting cooler stuff just hitting Rank 12. Keeps are starting to get contested heavily, and soon Guilds are going to be able to claim them.
People are just now starting to run the instances inside Altdorf, and the RvR lakes are ramping up in their intensity. It's also not hard to get a second character to Rank 40 to help out, but you'll have to pick and choose which ones you want to get to RR80 and whatever benefits that brings.
I dunno, I've never seen an MMO quite like this one. So far it just seems to be getting better.
Obviously as stated many times this is only registered accounts not actual subs. I see the game suffereing the same fate as DAOC did. The first year they reached 500k subs which was actually pretty good but after that it was a steady decline downward. I see the game doing no better than DAOC did which would mean just another subpar mmo to choose from.
Obviously as stated many times this is only registered accounts not actual subs. I see the game suffereing the same fate as DAOC did. The first year they reached 500k subs which was actually pretty good but after that it was a steady decline downward. I see the game doing no better than DAOC did which would mean just another subpar mmo to choose from.
I second what Saint has to say here.....And numbers huh...AoC realeased with huge numbers and I don't see you talking about it? I would be shocked if they have 100k by Christmas considering the way they go about fixing issues..
Hell they move faster on gold spammers and to hide the true numbers of players faster then they fix major issues...I mean them changing the way you /who people and guild numbers is ridiculous and the only reason is, is because people started figuring out how many numbers were on servers...Unreal
The fact that the Destruction (zerg) side has about 1.5 :1 or 2:1 population in guild membership indicates that they do have extremely competent players. Relying on the skill of one side to make up for a lack of population will not save this game. Destruction players are VERY good players. I have played against alot of them, and I know.
In the Scenarios, when with an organized order side, I've never had a problem fighting destruction on equal groups or beating them pretty solidly.
When you get out into the open world, their 1.5:1 ratio (guild wise on Chaos Wastes) becomes a huge factor, as does when people come down a tier and you find yourself facing greater numbers, and those numbers are 5+ levels higher. You know you have a problem when you have a warparty in a keep, and the other side can just zerg right into it and completely wipe out everything without any real losses.
When you're around level 20 as a healer, and a lvl 27-29 DPSer hits you, you've got about 2-3 seconds to live.
Yeah AOC came out of the gate selling like 900k copies and are now down around 400k from last I heard so I wouldnt get a bit too caught up in early sales figures. I do believe that WAR has the potential to gain more subscribers than this initial 500k which is a very good thing though.
AoC didn't sell 900k to players at the start, that is what they sold to retailers (WAR sold around 1.5m to retailers). Also AoC had 400k subs still active (used or not) at the end of Q2. That's June 30th, so it's not 400k still unless the pvp patch was a blessed miracle from God.
Originally posted by Mcpoopypants Your post has no originality either, why do you need me to be original when your not? same old fanboy cry. Valid argument? Whose trying to argue, just saying, War is in the same vein as Wow, easy mode made for lowest common denominator, anyone can play. That's cool too, my 6 year old nephew plays and owns in it, I think its a really good game for kids and beginners. I just hate that since it's the "Any-mans" game, that also means it gets the highest sales, which means other companies copy the formula. It's making mmo's that require player-skill and thought to become more rare. Try not to get your fanboy panties in a twist and talk like your not a foaming at the mouth fanboy
I play EVE and have for several years and find warhammer to be just fine. Perhaps it's just you but I've found the same things that let you roflstomp people in EVE is what does it in WAR as well. Sure it's no contest that WAR isn't as harsh but it's still fun. I don't care if idiots are playing, that just gives me those fun against the odds kills, like when you jump a group in a PQ, solo, and wipe them out with some NPC assistance.
I still think WAR has potencial to reach much more people and in time i think players will realize its just not another something-clone and come to play it.
Pretty much after the first couple of updates we will be able to see what WAR will actually become. If they include the other cities in a years time and do regular updates this will make it a more wanted and popular game. I would love to see the 4 cities added (2 Free Expansions) and 4 free expansions which would just expand the lore and game. 6 expansions might be to much though.
Nah, personally I think it will spike high on sales and then dwindle quite a bit on subs, especially after WotLK arrives. It's too much of a one trick pony.
I do not think it will happen with WoTLK, I know alot of PvPers that are not happy about the idea of PVP armor or weapontry tied to both Regular PvP and the Arena. Now this might now happen before launch, but the idea of it happening have friends of mine going back to Starwars Galaxies and Sony (Faint). I for one will not go back to wow now, I have experienced the WAR pvp set and their is no going back.
Its, funny. I'm browsing this and other War forums right now over that decision by Blizzard. I detest their duel in a box PVP and the desicion to make any and all PVP gear tied to it made me decide to cancel 2 accounts and start looking elsewhere.
Actually WOW has three ways to get PVP gear.. you get it from Arena, you get it from Battlegrounds and now you get it from Lake Wintergrasp (open world RvR) Some of the best gear will require Arena ratings, some will require battleground tokens, and some will require you to win Lake Wintergrasp.
And to put in Warhammer's terms. Yes, in WOW there are a few pieces that you can only get by winning in the Arena. But isn' that the same as Warhammer.. Isn't Order going to be 'locked out' of the best pvp gear because they are losing on that server? WOW, just like War, gives the best gear to players who win, but they give the losing side gear that is good enough to be competitive.
I can't wait for another month when not only is destruction steamrollong on most servers because of population imbalance, but they will also have better gear. There is already a lot of QQ now, wait til then.
Perhaps you haven't been following recent developments in Beta of Wrath. But ALL PVP gear, even the blue starter sets now require a combination of arena points and honor. In fact, the number of points needed would have an avg play on an avg team 2-4 months to get a starter PVP set.
and also, Lake Wintergraps won't give ArenaPoints on the Live Servers. that is only a Beta thing, so that Beta players can get enough Arena Points to use the Arena Gear on the Beta Server.
it's basically going to be Arena or Die. and Arena sucks ass.
Non-Arena PvPers are pissed. this is a good opportunity for WAR or DAoC(if they ever get around to launching the Origins server) to pick up some disgruntled PvPers
Accounts created = open beta, early access (through CE and standard pre-order) and of course Open Bate in the last days were given FREE on a dozen of websites.
I can STILL use my OPEN BETA and EARLY acces account (although even cancelled my CE) and I can play as a "created account" till October, tx to GOA and the days they gave away free.
So 500 K sold is simply not true, it is accounts created with the open beta and pre launched added together.
Proof? Look at what Mark Jacobs said himself the very first day of lauch...
So there is certainly something "fishy" about "accounts created". Wy not just give units SOLD ?
They wanted hype, but accounts created on a server means nothing. Someone could easely say 30 M accounts created for that matter (but no more paying of course).
So before juping too high, first read what the press release says....
Accounts created = open beta, early access (through CE and standard pre-order) and of course Open Bate in the last days were given FREE on a dozen of websites.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Accounts created = open beta, early access (through CE and standard pre-order) and of course Open Bate in the last days were given FREE on a dozen of websites.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Well I had CE: entered my account.
Open Beta than had my early access now still play the regular game with the same account although I cancelled the CE in the shop days ago.
I can still play till Oct tx to the compesation of GOA (free days).
So my account is counted.
Look at the interview with Mark Jacoobs by the way on the opning day: he said between 375K and 600 K were there (depending on the multiply factor of 75K concurrent users).
So accounts created include certainly pre release and (in my case) Open Beta. Thousands of open beta were given free a few days at the end of the period on a dozen websites. Are these also counted ?
I can only see that the number of Xfre users during the past week stayed the same and even stagnated (now for the weekend it could climb of course like all MMO's btw), but during the last 5 working days, exaclty the same number of players were online (even less yesterday).
Accounts created = open beta, early access (through CE and standard pre-order) and of course Open Bate in the last days were given FREE on a dozen of websites.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Well I had CE: entered my account.
Open Beta than had my early access now still play the regular game with the same account although I cancelled the CE in the shop days ago.
I can still play till Oct tx to the compesation of GOA (free days).
So my account is counted.
That must be something thats not in the states because I know several people who were in open beta that had to use there codes for the game.
Accounts created = open beta, early access (through CE and standard pre-order) and of course Open Bate in the last days were given FREE on a dozen of websites.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Look at the interview with Mark Jacoobs by the way on the opning day: he said between 375K and 600 K were there (depending on the multiply factor of 75K concurrent users).
So accounts created include certainly pre release and (in my case) Open Beta. Thousands of open beta were given free a few days at the end of the period on a dozen websites. Are these also counted ?
I can only see that the number of Xfre users during the past week stayed the same and even stagnated (now for the weekend it could climb of course like all MMO's btw), but during the last 5 working days, exaclty the same number of players were online (even less yesterday).
On opening day there was that many. Of course that was including everyone including people who don't pay. That is a very big leap saying those people are still being counted a week after that since beta people here in the states can not play.
Xfire numbers actually prove that more people are paying to play the game then those ones during beta still playing at the starting date. Because those numbers haven't changed. Unless of course everyone from day one is still playing. Which according to the ANTIwar people on here they are not. So new people are coming in and the ANTIwar people are leaving.
Xfire shows that its been holding a Steady #5 spot btw everyone.
Edit
Let me clean up the wording on that. I am at work.
Accounts created = open beta, early access (through CE and standard pre-order) and of course Open Bate in the last days were given FREE on a dozen of websites.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Look at the interview with Mark Jacoobs by the way on the opning day: he said between 375K and 600 K were there (depending on the multiply factor of 75K concurrent users).
So accounts created include certainly pre release and (in my case) Open Beta. Thousands of open beta were given free a few days at the end of the period on a dozen websites. Are these also counted ?
I can only see that the number of Xfre users during the past week stayed the same and even stagnated (now for the weekend it could climb of course like all MMO's btw), but during the last 5 working days, exaclty the same number of players were online (even less yesterday).
On opening day there was that many. Of course that was including everyone including people who don't pay. Thats a very big leap saying those people are still being counted a week after that. Xfire numbers actually prove that more people are paying to play the game then those ones during beta. Because those numbers haven't changed. Unless of course everyone from day one is still playing. Which according to the ANTIwar people on here they are not.
Xfire shows that its been holding a Steady #5 spot btw everyone.
The total number of players is holding steady (via xfire numbers and server population numbers), but Box sales have plummeted. Warhammer is now down below #30 for PC sales, which means not a lot of replacements coming in. These forums, and others are not really 'crazy' good either, you can expect the normal 25% dropoff on Oct 16th. 500-600k is as good as it's going to get and will likely see another drop off when Wraith launches.
Accounts created = open beta, early access (through CE and standard pre-order) and of course Open Bate in the last days were given FREE on a dozen of websites.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Look at the interview with Mark Jacoobs by the way on the opning day: he said between 375K and 600 K were there (depending on the multiply factor of 75K concurrent users).
So accounts created include certainly pre release and (in my case) Open Beta. Thousands of open beta were given free a few days at the end of the period on a dozen websites. Are these also counted ?
I can only see that the number of Xfre users during the past week stayed the same and even stagnated (now for the weekend it could climb of course like all MMO's btw), but during the last 5 working days, exaclty the same number of players were online (even less yesterday).
On opening day there was that many. Of course that was including everyone including people who don't pay. Thats a very big leap saying those people are still being counted a week after that. Xfire numbers actually prove that more people are paying to play the game then those ones during beta. Because those numbers haven't changed. Unless of course everyone from day one is still playing. Which according to the ANTIwar people on here they are not.
Xfire shows that its been holding a Steady #5 spot btw everyone.
The total number of players is holding steady (via xfire numbers and server population numbers), but Box sales have plummeted. Warhammer is now down below #30 for PC sales, which means not a lot of replacements coming in. These forums, and others are not really 'crazy' good either, you can expect the normal 25% dropoff on Oct 16th. 500-600k is as good as it's going to get and will likely see another drop off when Wraith launches.
Actually I am expecting a 10 to 15% drop in numbers. I am expecting it to climb back up after a month's time. All this game can do is go up because it is that well done. I am expecting the population to be in the +400K mark.
Personally I think the well has been poisoned for the MMO genre in general.
Once upon a time, players were content to find a MMO they enjoyed, dug in and played it - in many cases they're still playing (EQ1, AC, AO, DAoC, etc).
They weren't and still aren't constantly looking for the "next new shiny game that was going to blow the entire genre out of the water", because they're happy where they are.
WoW came along, popularized the genre and since then it's been this rapid roller-coaster ride of hype and disappointment. People jumping into the newest game, expecting it to be "revolutionary and ground-breaking", then crying foul when it isn't... all the while, keeping their eye on the next MMO which will *certainly* be "revolutionary and groundbreaking"... That one comes along with the same result... So they start looking for the *next* MMO... ad infinitum.
As long as we keep looking to the companies with the biggest names and the most financial backing for our "next fix", the days of "revolutionary and groundbreaking" MMOs are all but over for at least one simple reason:
They've become a popular and viable type of game that are proven to potentially earn big bucks.
The reason many companies wouldn't go near MMOs before and you only saw the occasional smaller companies going near them, is because they weren't "proven". Companies didn't "get" them, or how they could be profitable.
Well, along comes WoW which blows the doors off the industry, becomes insanely popular and profitable... So now all those companies who wouldn't go near MMOs before are cranking them out like there's no tomorrow... making sure to copy WoW's model as much as possible so as to ideally pull from that group. They don't just want a slice of the MMO pie... they want a piece of the WoW MMO pie. That's where the money is, and they don't dare deviate too far from it.
I would bet money that it's not going to be a big name company that's going to truly revolutionize the genre (remember, Blizzard didn't revolutionize MMOs. They popularized them). It's going to be some small, possibly independent company that hardly anyone's heard of... Counterintuitive as it seems, the smaller companies have the most room to take the most risks. They have the least to lose. They don't have a publisher breathing down their necks to "make it more like "popular game here".
So... If people are really, genuinely looking for something new and innovative... Ignore the big companies. Try looking into the more obscure ones. You'll likely not find the "next run-away hit"... but you may well find the "new and different" type of game you're looking for.
Don't be so quick to dismiss them because they're smaller, or lesser-known or don't have the backing of a multi-million dollar publisher. Find something that looks promising and spread the word.
I think it's pretty clear where the AAA-level MMOs are going and what we can expect from them... Pretty much "more of the same".
If ever there was a time for lesser-known developers to be given more recognition, it's now.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
<snip> ...Well, along comes WoW which blows the doors off the industry, becomes insanely popular and profitable... So now all those companies who wouldn't go near MMOs before are cranking them out like there's no tomorrow... making sure to copy WoW's model as much as possible so as to ideally pull from that group. They don't just want a slice of the MMO pie... they want a piece of the WoW MMO pie. That's where the money is, and they don't dare deviate too far from it. <snip>
QFT
I underlined and italicized that one part as it really jumped for me. Too many gaming companies just want the fast and easy route, which I can't blame them for. Alot of companies don't realize though that there is reward in risk. If someone made an MMO with the quality of WoW in a completely different environment with a completely unique game style and different genre, who knows how popular it could become. Another copy of WoW like this game (I'm a fan of this game, but I don't see how anyone doesn't see WAR as riding off the success of WoW) will not be the next WoW. A game that is actually new and different, I'm sure, would do far more successful. FC, although I despise their business antics, did attempt something slightly different with AoC. The combat system was a nice change and a base around medieval times rather then fantasy was (although AoC definitely still constitutes as fantasy) better than goobledyland of the trolls or mushroom palace of the elves. What failed for them was the actual quality of their game, and how FC conducted business.
If we had something like AoC, a game that is similar to WoW in some ways but in others slightly different, while pertaining a great amount of quality and features, then it could be a runaway smash hit. But nobody wants to take that risk when they have a money sink formula right in front of them. It's always easier to go with the flow rather then to try something new or foreign.
Comments
I do not think it will happen with WoTLK, I know alot of PvPers that are not happy about the idea of PVP armor or weapontry tied to both Regular PvP and the Arena. Now this might now happen before launch, but the idea of it happening have friends of mine going back to Starwars Galaxies and Sony (Faint). I for one will not go back to wow now, I have experienced the WAR pvp set and their is no going back.
Its, funny. I'm browsing this and other War forums right now over that decision by Blizzard. I detest their duel in a box PVP and the desicion to make any and all PVP gear tied to it made me decide to cancel 2 accounts and start looking elsewhere.
Actually WOW has three ways to get PVP gear.. you get it from Arena, you get it from Battlegrounds and now you get it from Lake Wintergrasp (open world RvR) Some of the best gear will require Arena ratings, some will require battleground tokens, and some will require you to win Lake Wintergrasp.
And to put in Warhammer's terms. Yes, in WOW there are a few pieces that you can only get by winning in the Arena. But isn' that the same as Warhammer.. Isn't Order going to be 'locked out' of the best pvp gear because they are losing on that server? WOW, just like War, gives the best gear to players who win, but they give the losing side gear that is good enough to be competitive.
I can't wait for another month when not only is destruction steamrollong on most servers because of population imbalance, but they will also have better gear. There is already a lot of QQ now, wait til then.
I do not think it will happen with WoTLK, I know alot of PvPers that are not happy about the idea of PVP armor or weapontry tied to both Regular PvP and the Arena. Now this might now happen before launch, but the idea of it happening have friends of mine going back to Starwars Galaxies and Sony (Faint). I for one will not go back to wow now, I have experienced the WAR pvp set and their is no going back.
Its, funny. I'm browsing this and other War forums right now over that decision by Blizzard. I detest their duel in a box PVP and the desicion to make any and all PVP gear tied to it made me decide to cancel 2 accounts and start looking elsewhere.
Actually WOW has three ways to get PVP gear.. you get it from Arena, you get it from Battlegrounds and now you get it from Lake Wintergrasp (open world RvR) Some of the best gear will require Arena ratings, some will require battleground tokens, and some will require you to win Lake Wintergrasp.
And to put in Warhammer's terms. Yes, in WOW there are a few pieces that you can only get by winning in the Arena. But isn' that the same as Warhammer.. Isn't Order going to be 'locked out' of the best pvp gear because they are losing on that server? WOW, just like War, gives the best gear to players who win, but they give the losing side gear that is good enough to be competitive.
I can't wait for another month when not only is destruction steamrollong on most servers because of population imbalance, but they will also have better gear. There is already a lot of QQ now, wait til then.
Perhaps you haven't been following recent developments in Beta of Wrath. But ALL PVP gear, even the blue starter sets now require a combination of arena points and honor. In fact, the number of points needed would have an avg play on an avg team 2-4 months to get a starter PVP set.
I'm not convinced that WAR will be pulling in all that flak though. I'm seeing more and more people already moving on to the next line of MMO's again. It's like an endless chairdance. Newest MMO comes around, they play it a while, get sick of it and move to the next.
It's because no gaming companies are willing to push the envelopes. Every MMO is about elves, dwarves, ogres, and fantasy that has been coming out (a little bit of sci-fi can come again once in a while as well). I'm so sick of the damn fantasy genre. Nobody really gets that if you make a good MMORPG that is hyped enough and has at least some slight difference to WoW, it will be successful. AoC failed with this because their game wasn't finished. WAR will do alright, but not amazing because they're playing it on the safe route.
Trust me, I've been having some great fun with this game but I don't see how people can go about and say that this isn't just another MMO trying to take a free ride off of WoW. It isn't a bad thing, if others did it like WAR has been doing then all WoW copies with extra sprinkles would do semi-successful. These gaming companies need to realize that some of us are freakin' sick of WoW. And we don't want another WoW.
I see WAR growing in numbers actually. It's a game that just keeps getting better as you level. I quit WoW for 3 months after hitting level 59 with my first character. It was just burning me out with all the instances, and gear grind, and Tarren Mill zergfests.
WAR seems to be the opposite. I'm levelling while I'm PvPing. My guild is getting cooler stuff just hitting Rank 12. Keeps are starting to get contested heavily, and soon Guilds are going to be able to claim them.
People are just now starting to run the instances inside Altdorf, and the RvR lakes are ramping up in their intensity. It's also not hard to get a second character to Rank 40 to help out, but you'll have to pick and choose which ones you want to get to RR80 and whatever benefits that brings.
I dunno, I've never seen an MMO quite like this one. So far it just seems to be getting better.
Obviously as stated many times this is only registered accounts not actual subs. I see the game suffereing the same fate as DAOC did. The first year they reached 500k subs which was actually pretty good but after that it was a steady decline downward. I see the game doing no better than DAOC did which would mean just another subpar mmo to choose from.
I second what Saint has to say here.....And numbers huh...AoC realeased with huge numbers and I don't see you talking about it? I would be shocked if they have 100k by Christmas considering the way they go about fixing issues..
Hell they move faster on gold spammers and to hide the true numbers of players faster then they fix major issues...I mean them changing the way you /who people and guild numbers is ridiculous and the only reason is, is because people started figuring out how many numbers were on servers...Unreal
In the Scenarios, when with an organized order side, I've never had a problem fighting destruction on equal groups or beating them pretty solidly.
When you get out into the open world, their 1.5:1 ratio (guild wise on Chaos Wastes) becomes a huge factor, as does when people come down a tier and you find yourself facing greater numbers, and those numbers are 5+ levels higher. You know you have a problem when you have a warparty in a keep, and the other side can just zerg right into it and completely wipe out everything without any real losses.
When you're around level 20 as a healer, and a lvl 27-29 DPSer hits you, you've got about 2-3 seconds to live.
AoC didn't sell 900k to players at the start, that is what they sold to retailers (WAR sold around 1.5m to retailers). Also AoC had 400k subs still active (used or not) at the end of Q2. That's June 30th, so it's not 400k still unless the pvp patch was a blessed miracle from God.
I play EVE and have for several years and find warhammer to be just fine. Perhaps it's just you but I've found the same things that let you roflstomp people in EVE is what does it in WAR as well. Sure it's no contest that WAR isn't as harsh but it's still fun. I don't care if idiots are playing, that just gives me those fun against the odds kills, like when you jump a group in a PQ, solo, and wipe them out with some NPC assistance.
exactly.
I still think WAR has potencial to reach much more people and in time i think players will realize its just not another something-clone and come to play it.
Pretty much after the first couple of updates we will be able to see what WAR will actually become. If they include the other cities in a years time and do regular updates this will make it a more wanted and popular game. I would love to see the 4 cities added (2 Free Expansions) and 4 free expansions which would just expand the lore and game. 6 expansions might be to much though.
I do not think it will happen with WoTLK, I know alot of PvPers that are not happy about the idea of PVP armor or weapontry tied to both Regular PvP and the Arena. Now this might now happen before launch, but the idea of it happening have friends of mine going back to Starwars Galaxies and Sony (Faint). I for one will not go back to wow now, I have experienced the WAR pvp set and their is no going back.
Its, funny. I'm browsing this and other War forums right now over that decision by Blizzard. I detest their duel in a box PVP and the desicion to make any and all PVP gear tied to it made me decide to cancel 2 accounts and start looking elsewhere.
Actually WOW has three ways to get PVP gear.. you get it from Arena, you get it from Battlegrounds and now you get it from Lake Wintergrasp (open world RvR) Some of the best gear will require Arena ratings, some will require battleground tokens, and some will require you to win Lake Wintergrasp.
And to put in Warhammer's terms. Yes, in WOW there are a few pieces that you can only get by winning in the Arena. But isn' that the same as Warhammer.. Isn't Order going to be 'locked out' of the best pvp gear because they are losing on that server? WOW, just like War, gives the best gear to players who win, but they give the losing side gear that is good enough to be competitive.
I can't wait for another month when not only is destruction steamrollong on most servers because of population imbalance, but they will also have better gear. There is already a lot of QQ now, wait til then.
Perhaps you haven't been following recent developments in Beta of Wrath. But ALL PVP gear, even the blue starter sets now require a combination of arena points and honor. In fact, the number of points needed would have an avg play on an avg team 2-4 months to get a starter PVP set.
and also, Lake Wintergraps won't give ArenaPoints on the Live Servers. that is only a Beta thing, so that Beta players can get enough Arena Points to use the Arena Gear on the Beta Server.
it's basically going to be Arena or Die. and Arena sucks ass.
Non-Arena PvPers are pissed. this is a good opportunity for WAR or DAoC(if they ever get around to launching the Origins server) to pick up some disgruntled PvPers
500 K accounts created .
Not subs (of course).
Part of the hype.
Accounts created = open beta, early access (through CE and standard pre-order) and of course Open Bate in the last days were given FREE on a dozen of websites.
I can STILL use my OPEN BETA and EARLY acces account (although even cancelled my CE) and I can play as a "created account" till October, tx to GOA and the days they gave away free.
So 500 K sold is simply not true, it is accounts created with the open beta and pre launched added together.
Proof? Look at what Mark Jacobs said himself the very first day of lauch...
So there is certainly something "fishy" about "accounts created". Wy not just give units SOLD ?
They wanted hype, but accounts created on a server means nothing. Someone could easely say 30 M accounts created for that matter (but no more paying of course).
So before juping too high, first read what the press release says....
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Well I had CE: entered my account.
Open Beta than had my early access now still play the regular game with the same account although I cancelled the CE in the shop days ago.
I can still play till Oct tx to the compesation of GOA (free days).
So my account is counted.
Look at the interview with Mark Jacoobs by the way on the opning day: he said between 375K and 600 K were there (depending on the multiply factor of 75K concurrent users).
So accounts created include certainly pre release and (in my case) Open Beta. Thousands of open beta were given free a few days at the end of the period on a dozen websites. Are these also counted ?
I can only see that the number of Xfre users during the past week stayed the same and even stagnated (now for the weekend it could climb of course like all MMO's btw), but during the last 5 working days, exaclty the same number of players were online (even less yesterday).
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Well I had CE: entered my account.
Open Beta than had my early access now still play the regular game with the same account although I cancelled the CE in the shop days ago.
I can still play till Oct tx to the compesation of GOA (free days).
So my account is counted.
That must be something thats not in the states because I know several people who were in open beta that had to use there codes for the game.
So I guess the low number can do that.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Look at the interview with Mark Jacoobs by the way on the opning day: he said between 375K and 600 K were there (depending on the multiply factor of 75K concurrent users).
So accounts created include certainly pre release and (in my case) Open Beta. Thousands of open beta were given free a few days at the end of the period on a dozen websites. Are these also counted ?
I can only see that the number of Xfre users during the past week stayed the same and even stagnated (now for the weekend it could climb of course like all MMO's btw), but during the last 5 working days, exaclty the same number of players were online (even less yesterday).
On opening day there was that many. Of course that was including everyone including people who don't pay. That is a very big leap saying those people are still being counted a week after that since beta people here in the states can not play.
Xfire numbers actually prove that more people are paying to play the game then those ones during beta still playing at the starting date. Because those numbers haven't changed. Unless of course everyone from day one is still playing. Which according to the ANTIwar people on here they are not. So new people are coming in and the ANTIwar people are leaving.
Xfire shows that its been holding a Steady #5 spot btw everyone.
Edit
Let me clean up the wording on that.
I am at work. 
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Look at the interview with Mark Jacoobs by the way on the opning day: he said between 375K and 600 K were there (depending on the multiply factor of 75K concurrent users).
So accounts created include certainly pre release and (in my case) Open Beta. Thousands of open beta were given free a few days at the end of the period on a dozen websites. Are these also counted ?
I can only see that the number of Xfre users during the past week stayed the same and even stagnated (now for the weekend it could climb of course like all MMO's btw), but during the last 5 working days, exaclty the same number of players were online (even less yesterday).
On opening day there was that many. Of course that was including everyone including people who don't pay. Thats a very big leap saying those people are still being counted a week after that. Xfire numbers actually prove that more people are paying to play the game then those ones during beta. Because those numbers haven't changed. Unless of course everyone from day one is still playing. Which according to the ANTIwar people on here they are not.
Xfire shows that its been holding a Steady #5 spot btw everyone.
The total number of players is holding steady (via xfire numbers and server population numbers), but Box sales have plummeted. Warhammer is now down below #30 for PC sales, which means not a lot of replacements coming in. These forums, and others are not really 'crazy' good either, you can expect the normal 25% dropoff on Oct 16th. 500-600k is as good as it's going to get and will likely see another drop off when Wraith launches.
Is that just your opinion or are you getting your info from someplace. It doesn't say that anyplace there.
Look at the interview with Mark Jacoobs by the way on the opning day: he said between 375K and 600 K were there (depending on the multiply factor of 75K concurrent users).
So accounts created include certainly pre release and (in my case) Open Beta. Thousands of open beta were given free a few days at the end of the period on a dozen websites. Are these also counted ?
I can only see that the number of Xfre users during the past week stayed the same and even stagnated (now for the weekend it could climb of course like all MMO's btw), but during the last 5 working days, exaclty the same number of players were online (even less yesterday).
On opening day there was that many. Of course that was including everyone including people who don't pay. Thats a very big leap saying those people are still being counted a week after that. Xfire numbers actually prove that more people are paying to play the game then those ones during beta. Because those numbers haven't changed. Unless of course everyone from day one is still playing. Which according to the ANTIwar people on here they are not.
Xfire shows that its been holding a Steady #5 spot btw everyone.
The total number of players is holding steady (via xfire numbers and server population numbers), but Box sales have plummeted. Warhammer is now down below #30 for PC sales, which means not a lot of replacements coming in. These forums, and others are not really 'crazy' good either, you can expect the normal 25% dropoff on Oct 16th. 500-600k is as good as it's going to get and will likely see another drop off when Wraith launches.
Actually I am expecting a 10 to 15% drop in numbers. I am expecting it to climb back up after a month's time. All this game can do is go up because it is that well done. I am expecting the population to be in the +400K mark.
Meh...
Personally I think the well has been poisoned for the MMO genre in general.
Once upon a time, players were content to find a MMO they enjoyed, dug in and played it - in many cases they're still playing (EQ1, AC, AO, DAoC, etc).
They weren't and still aren't constantly looking for the "next new shiny game that was going to blow the entire genre out of the water", because they're happy where they are.
WoW came along, popularized the genre and since then it's been this rapid roller-coaster ride of hype and disappointment. People jumping into the newest game, expecting it to be "revolutionary and ground-breaking", then crying foul when it isn't... all the while, keeping their eye on the next MMO which will *certainly* be "revolutionary and groundbreaking"... That one comes along with the same result... So they start looking for the *next* MMO... ad infinitum.
As long as we keep looking to the companies with the biggest names and the most financial backing for our "next fix", the days of "revolutionary and groundbreaking" MMOs are all but over for at least one simple reason:
They've become a popular and viable type of game that are proven to potentially earn big bucks.
The reason many companies wouldn't go near MMOs before and you only saw the occasional smaller companies going near them, is because they weren't "proven". Companies didn't "get" them, or how they could be profitable.
Well, along comes WoW which blows the doors off the industry, becomes insanely popular and profitable... So now all those companies who wouldn't go near MMOs before are cranking them out like there's no tomorrow... making sure to copy WoW's model as much as possible so as to ideally pull from that group. They don't just want a slice of the MMO pie... they want a piece of the WoW MMO pie. That's where the money is, and they don't dare deviate too far from it.
I would bet money that it's not going to be a big name company that's going to truly revolutionize the genre (remember, Blizzard didn't revolutionize MMOs. They popularized them). It's going to be some small, possibly independent company that hardly anyone's heard of... Counterintuitive as it seems, the smaller companies have the most room to take the most risks. They have the least to lose. They don't have a publisher breathing down their necks to "make it more like "popular game here".
So... If people are really, genuinely looking for something new and innovative... Ignore the big companies. Try looking into the more obscure ones. You'll likely not find the "next run-away hit"... but you may well find the "new and different" type of game you're looking for.
Don't be so quick to dismiss them because they're smaller, or lesser-known or don't have the backing of a multi-million dollar publisher. Find something that looks promising and spread the word.
I think it's pretty clear where the AAA-level MMOs are going and what we can expect from them... Pretty much "more of the same".
If ever there was a time for lesser-known developers to be given more recognition, it's now.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
QFT
I underlined and italicized that one part as it really jumped for me. Too many gaming companies just want the fast and easy route, which I can't blame them for. Alot of companies don't realize though that there is reward in risk. If someone made an MMO with the quality of WoW in a completely different environment with a completely unique game style and different genre, who knows how popular it could become. Another copy of WoW like this game (I'm a fan of this game, but I don't see how anyone doesn't see WAR as riding off the success of WoW) will not be the next WoW. A game that is actually new and different, I'm sure, would do far more successful. FC, although I despise their business antics, did attempt something slightly different with AoC. The combat system was a nice change and a base around medieval times rather then fantasy was (although AoC definitely still constitutes as fantasy) better than goobledyland of the trolls or mushroom palace of the elves. What failed for them was the actual quality of their game, and how FC conducted business.
If we had something like AoC, a game that is similar to WoW in some ways but in others slightly different, while pertaining a great amount of quality and features, then it could be a runaway smash hit. But nobody wants to take that risk when they have a money sink formula right in front of them. It's always easier to go with the flow rather then to try something new or foreign.
Very good post. I hope you are right about the future.
What if it's Darkfall? It's just too good to be true...
The real question isn't how many players they have a launch. Its how many they retain after the first month.
Its how many after 3 months, usually players allow devs to fix/add something but after it people start quitting.
Futilez[Do You Have What It Takes ?]