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what is wrong with MMO's today ?poll?
aleos
Member UncommonPosts: 1,943
Judging from the way things have been going these last couple of years...
Comments
I said this a couple times but let me point out a short fall that are making MMO gaming less interesting.
Most MMOs being released are focused on the graphics. Some of the newer games like AoC just don't have any real purpose to play except to get levels and kill each other. Most of the game is based on look and feel and lacks any real immersion beyond quests. Some of the game has broken or missing content. Adding the vital pieces to a released game shows lack of development for sight. I am still subed since I take a couple hrs a week to unwind.
I have played 10 online games over the last 7 years and every one has its good and bad. DAOC I just spent WAY' to much of my life playing and took a break. When I came back, I was back doing the same 6 runs a week and just said I need a change. DAoC is a great game.
After playing a couple F2P and AoC I just said screw the MMO playing it is time to make a game that I would want to play. It is not an easy task but, hell, I got time because I don't spent my 50+ hrs a week playing them, I design my own. I could care less if it ever gets published or if it does, i get 2000 subs. I can live off 2000 subs.
I said this a couple times but let me point out a short fall that are making MMO gaming less interesting.
Most MMOs being released are focused on the graphics. Some of the newer games like AoC just don't have any real purpose to play except to get levels and kill each other. Most of the game is based on look and feel and lacks any real immersion beyond quests. Some of the game has broken or missing content. Adding the vital pieces to a released game shows lack of development for sight. I am still subed since I take a couple hrs a week to unwind.
I have played 10 online games over the last 7 years and every one has its good and bad. DAOC I just spent WAY' to much of my life playing and took a break. When I came back, I was back doing the same 6 runs a week and just said I need a change. DAoC is a great game.
After playing a couple F2P and AoC I just said screw the MMO playing it is time to make a game that I would want to play. It is not an easy task but, hell, I got time because I don't spent my 50+ hrs a week playing them, I design my own. I could care less if it ever gets published or if it does, i get 2000 subs. I can live off 2000 subs.
Graphics? If you want to call Warhammer and WoW graphics then you obviously don't know good graphics. Sure they are decent but to me, they aren't real graphics. I guess it's really based on personal opinions and what kind of graphics players are looking for. I myself like realistic looking graphics that don't take a ton of memory to run. Lineage 2 for example. Runs perfect in big pvp groups and never lags on high settings. Graphics are really clear. Movement system sucks. But overall, the graphics on the game are great. We need more games with realistic graphics.
Good luck on creating an mmorpg.
I own a text based game with an active base of over 500 players, since we came back this summer and already have around 600 players. They are active until December hits then we start weeding out inactives. It's fun working with Adobe Photoshop and Dreamweaver and working with cpanel and database tables etc....
I've played over 50 mmorgps and am still in search for a new genre of games. Something creative. I want something new and fresh. New world and environment. Darkfall does look nice but I won't get my hopes up like I did with Warhammer.
The problem with all these games coming out are they are ALL cookie-cutter games. They are the same as the last one that was released. If a game will come out that has lots of change in it and lots of new features such as Aging and Skill System linked to Gear and cities where some are in a closed environment and you have to enter keys to get inside the city....etc....big unique changes. I'm ready for some new genres.
Comming out half ready and buggy.
the community
Playing: EVE Online
Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online
Looking forward to: Archeage, Kingdom Under Fire 2
KUF2's Official Website - http://www.kufii.com/ENG/ -
To much is focused around the PVP.
No mmorpg feeling.
The focus is on the individual rather than the group/community.
All in all the mmos have reached the point ion where u kind of play singleplayer, even thoe you are grouped. It might sound wierd, but its true.
I'm also not a big fan of PvP. I do like to solo though it's starting to bore me a lot. It would be nice to see a good group based dungeon crawler come out again like EQ. All PvE, but group based with lots of neat dungeons ranging from deep dark forests, to underwater, to desearts, to snowy/icy dungeons, to fiery dungeons, etc. Pure PvE based around small group content. Right now I believe that devs are trying to do to many things and end up not doing anything well.
What's wrong with MMOs today?
1. WoW -- I've spent my share of time playing WoW and enjoyed it, but it's killing the industry. Most companies capable of producing a big-budget MMO look at WoW's subscription numbers and tell their developers "do that!". It is the root of many of the following problems.
2. Too easy -- MMOs are sliding towards risk-free cakewalks, where there is little to no penalty for doing things the wrong way. Death is a temporary debuff and minor inconvenience. Questing is simplified so greatly that an NPC explains to you in painfully clear detail what to do, shows you exactly on your map where to go, you are guided by a floating arrow to get there, and tooltips show you precisely what to kill or gather. Despie this, most quests are of the "bring me X of item Y"...incredible creativity there! Combat no longer requires skill. Gear is so freakishly easy to get that there is little reward in excelling at anything. Leveling has been abandoned in favor of super-fast progressions, because nobody has the patience to build a character and advance themselves. Now, its "rush to endgame in a week or two, then spend the rest of your life in endless, generic battlegrounds bashing eachother in the head". In short, effort, thought, danger and excitement have been removed to pander to the lowest common denominator.
3. The people -- Sorry, but anybody who has been playing for a while knows that it didn't used to be like this. There were always people who bitched & whined, but today developers appear to be slaves to them. I know absolutely that this statement is elitist, but...there used to be a better caliber of player. The floodgates have now opened to anybody that can screech and pound their way through Guitar Hero. And that's where the money is at, the masses. As if that weren't bad enough to start with, people cry a river if they aren't satisfied immediately--"I WANT IT ALL I WANT IT NOW GIVE IT TO ME ITS NOT FAIR IF I CANT HAVE IT!"
4. The companies -- Steaming pile of crap releases. WAR is mediocre, but it broke the spell of abysmal major title releases of the past few years. I can count the number of professional, polished (major) MMOs on one hand. Yep, WoW is one of them, because Blizzard has a reuptation for doing things right, and it shows. Vanguard was a disaster, and is just now getting fixed into proper shape, but it may never recover. Funcom had a golden opportunity and squandered it by lying to then taking a dump on their customers--AoC will probably never recover. AoC alone frothed up bored-with-WoW players so much that many just lost faith in MMOs alltogether when the dust settled.
5. The market -- The market is a sewer. F2P cash-shop asia-grinders multiply like rabbits. Most major title that haven't been disasters have fallen into small niches that can only get smaller (LOTRO, DDO, PotBS), or been so utterly mediocre that they are dead or nearly dead already (Auto Assault, TR, Matrix Online)...the few original MMOs that really do shine seem to be cursed, coming from companies that can't get themselves together (Ryzom, old mangement).
6. The sites -- including this one. See #3...but MMO site (official or 3rd party) forum trolls should just be shot. Seriously.
7. Nothing REALLY new and exciting -- I'm still waiting for a "next-gen" MMO. Whatever that is, we haven't seen it yet, and it needs to appear soon.
that right there
------------------------------
Meow
Well said gorecki.
Nobody likes to group any more and if they do no one talks. Sorry I just don't get why no one talks.
General chat is a sewer in most games. I got out of Jr. high school many years ago, I dont want to hear that mess again.
There is no community. Seems even in guilds everyone is out for themselves.
Games are now single player with a chat room.
Support Bacteria, its the only culture some people have.
I said this a couple times but let me point out a short fall that are making MMO gaming less interesting.
Most MMOs being released are focused on the graphics. Some of the newer games like AoC just don't have any real purpose to play except to get levels and kill each other. Most of the game is based on look and feel and lacks any real immersion beyond quests. Some of the game has broken or missing content. Adding the vital pieces to a released game shows lack of development for sight. I am still subed since I take a couple hrs a week to unwind.
I have played 10 online games over the last 7 years and every one has its good and bad. DAOC I just spent WAY' to much of my life playing and took a break. When I came back, I was back doing the same 6 runs a week and just said I need a change. DAoC is a great game.
After playing a couple F2P and AoC I just said screw the MMO playing it is time to make a game that I would want to play. It is not an easy task but, hell, I got time because I don't spent my 50+ hrs a week playing them, I design my own. I could care less if it ever gets published or if it does, i get 2000 subs. I can live off 2000 subs.
Graphics? If you want to call Warhammer and WoW graphics then you obviously don't know good graphics. Sure they are decent but to me, they aren't real graphics. I guess it's really based on personal opinions and what kind of graphics players are looking for. I myself like realistic looking graphics that don't take a ton of memory to run. Lineage 2 for example. Runs perfect in big pvp groups and never lags on high settings. Graphics are really clear. Movement system sucks. But overall, the graphics on the game are great. We need more games with realistic graphics.
Good luck on creating an mmorpg.
I own a text based game with an active base of over 500 players, since we came back this summer and already have around 600 players. They are active until December hits then we start weeding out inactives. It's fun working with Adobe Photoshop and Dreamweaver and working with cpanel and database tables etc....
I've played over 50 mmorgps and am still in search for a new genre of games. Something creative. I want something new and fresh. New world and environment. Darkfall does look nice but I won't get my hopes up like I did with Warhammer.
The problem with all these games coming out are they are ALL cookie-cutter games. They are the same as the last one that was released. If a game will come out that has lots of change in it and lots of new features such as Aging and Skill System linked to Gear and cities where some are in a closed environment and you have to enter keys to get inside the city....etc....big unique changes. I'm ready for some new genres.
I did say MMOs that are being released
. I tried out WoW graphics are ok. Not my cup of tea but over all a good game. Warhammer, not going to even bother with it because it will be the same rinse and repeat.
In my game you build a faction on a political level and every action has effects. Everyone starts neutral. By how you carry out a series of quests will determine which faction you will go. Once you make a faction change you are either neutral(green), left(red) or right(blue). The left and right have open warfare around the world (open PvP ) Faction standing grant bonus perks for the faction you side with and you loose those perks if you standing falls to low. Higher you get the more perks. The neutral faction can only have warfare in battle grounds and gains and looses faction on who he/she sides with. The neutral can just PvE in the world and can not be kill outside a battle ground. However, If a neutral continues to gain more points on one side as compare to the other then they will switch faction from neutral. Every kill against an oposing faction has effect to gain and loose points. If you attack a like faction (exception is arena battles or duels, which do not award faction points) you loose points with that faction and gain with the other. Yes you can kill your own faction memebrs but it is going to cost you standings in your own faction and you will gain points in the opposing faction.
that right there
No, the game. Games have to force a good community. Games now are all about having fun and not a single compromised situation. So you don't need the help of anyone. That's a big mistake.
Yes a I agree. Most of these problems all go back to developers trying to release cutting edge technology. There is only so much money/time that can go into a game. When most of its spent making graphics it leave nothing for gameplay.
All the players cry about how much they want graphics, then they go play WoW, go figure. When are the developers going to learn that instead of trying to distinguish themselves from WoW with graphics they should instead focus on gameplay. Bring a good polished game with features and the playerbase will come.
I have yet to see a game in the last 10 years have more overall gameplay features then UO, which I played back in 1997. Pretty sad.
More incentive for grouping. I seriously HATE the fact that you can get by so often without grouping. WoW (don't hurt me) had an inkling of the right idea - carrots offered for grouping up that you can't solo, but which are hardly necessary to complete the game. Too bad everyone whined and complained until Blizzard started handing out welfare epics.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
Well, basicly the problem is that MMOs are to much like eachother... They all feel like an updated version of Everquest with possible a different setting. No problem with any game but we need more variation.
Only game in recent year (Not counting SF games) that is different is Guildwars.
We need new thinking, that's the problem with todays MMOs, more difference in how hard the game is, different ways to solve the combat systems, skills, questing and some other way to progress without levels.
The devs are trying to build a game with many gameplays, but which force you to play their favorite gameplay.
There are over 10 gameplays in a MMO...but somehow, the devs figure it is better if you play this, or that, rather than what you like. There are various ways to force their favorite gameplays, the better rewards is the one which annoys me the most. The worst thing about this, is their heavy focus on each gameplay, displaying how you can do this, or that. But somehow, they fail to explain that ultimately, you have only 1 real gameplay in the game and that all other are nothing worth been done.
If you put a gameplay in a game and try to please peoples with it, then it should be self sufficient...aka nobody coming from other gameplays should be automatically better than the peoples practicing this gameplay. Somehow, the devs want everyone playing their favorite aspect of the game, no matter if it ruins everything else in the long run. Freedom is an illusion in most MMOs; unless you are a zen-oriented person (you can't expect the average player to be that zen).
Devs kinda feel as kindergarden kids, trying to have everything done their way.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
Players think only AAA mmos are worth playing, forcing developers to risk more than they have to.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
Nice summary gorecki.
IMO, the biggest issue is that current MMOs are not much more than single player theme parks. Theres very little ambition or scope with most of these games. Just connect the dots from one cheap, pointless, static quest to the next. Sure, theres more money in the genre now and more potential for polished games, but theres also more demand for bland games that don't offend or challenge anyone.
My main problem with last 4-5 MMO's I've played is they're just too easy. The risk vs reward is way off keel. Players usually risk nothing, blindly charging into fights they won't win, knowing it doesn't matter. A few games have tried making harsh death penalties only to get toned down after a few vocal whiners complain. I've yet to play a MMO where there was a penalty for failing a quest or mission. There's always nice rewards waiting if you succeed but nothing happens if you fail. It doesn't always have to be xp lose either. Losing money, skill points, reputation, gear, collectibles, mounts, etc... could all be put on the table (not necessarily at the same time) as consequences for dying/failing.
As others have said previously, I"ve grown to dislike the fact that most new MMO's can be done completely solo. There are plenty of single player RPG games out there for people who want to play alone, the MMO's should be team oriented. Group composition shouldn't be such a big factor. I think that's what would make a game that forced teamwork more apealing to the masses. Nobody likes having to spam "looking for healer" for an hour just get started. Forcing people to work together could help get the community in check too. If somebody acts like an idiot one too many times they start having difficulty finding groups forcing them to either get their behavior in check, re-roll or quit. Unfortunately the latter is exactly what the game companies are trying to avoid.
But seeing as how the "popular" games are the complete opposite of what I'm describing, I must be the minority opinion.
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
I agree with you on the death penalty thing that MMOS are becoming more donkey kong with no need to worry and one of the biggest issues that kept me from grouping much. Hell, is D2 hardcore on Bnet I probably played solo once in a blue moon because everyone knew the risk and helped each other survive. Seems that connection is missing in todays MMO games.
On the second point I disagree. many players that were hardcore gamers are now starting to have to deal with real life and don't have the time they once had to sit for 5 hours. Games need to have a means to keep these players active and some times solo is only way to go. I would rather take the approach that a game could be soloed as well as grouped from a PvE standpoint if that is what a player wanted to do., INCLUDING 'gasp' raid loot. The real game should be completive and contested control of land areas where groups would be more required. The rewards of the battles has a bigger reward in standings on a website that shows who is king of the hill so to speak.
Now not everyone will agree on this. I accept that and go on.
I do not like death penalties very much. But I do not like so called "easy-mode" as well. From my own experience games with death penalty only lead to a situation where everyone is just afraid to try anything. Players stick to their well-known tactics, afraid to try something new, because they might fail and get penalized.
As I said before, I do not like easy mode either. I feel that many MMORPGs are way too easy, but not because due to the lack of death penality. The AI in most MMORPGs is just pathetic. There's really no skill needed to beat most monsters. All you do is to smash your same button sequence over and over again like a robot.
Then again MMORPGs try to appeal the mass market. Thus they have to be a bit easy because not every player is a pro player.
What worries me most, however, is the anti-social trend. Modern MMORPGs focus is always on the personal character progression. And in most cases at the cost of others. It's either me who gets the shiny epic or you. But better me than you. Grouping? It's only a necessary evil because otherwise you won't get access to those nice raid bosses.
Take WoW for example. Instead of encouraging players to work together it actually punishes them. Why do you get less XP in a group? It's always better to grind XP alone. Rolling against other players for a drop. Playing against your friends in the arena for arena points. And so on.
I believe that many players have become very selfish and extremly greedy as a result of this.
This is what I like about EvE Online. Yes, this game has its own problems as well, I know. But appart from this I like how it encourages players to work together. And you know what? Everyone benefits. It's a win-win for everyone. Take mining for example. Mining in EvE scales with players participating. And it benefits the entire corp. Because the corp can build ships, weapons or whatever and give it to corp members.
Emphasis on gear instead of character development.
Nothing. MMORPGs, just like movies, are expensive and hard to make. Most will be flops, and a few will be good.
Warhammer is fun. More MMORPGs are in the works, and most will be flops, and a couple will be fun.
The "pace" of MMOs has really changed. They've gone from the slow, mob grinding pace to the ultra fast, fly-through-the-quest-train-as-fast-as-possible pace. It's odd how the progression is so fast now, yet, theres really nothing to rush to at the end. Meaningless PvP? Grinding out gear in instances? It's all just a theme park.
I was open to the idea of more questing and instancing at first. Actually, I was into the idea, after all the grinding I did in DAOC back in the day. However, after playing LOTRO in open beta and for a couple months after release, I have to say that my opinion changed. Questing and instances give MMOs a VERY different feel and atmosphere. Everything is much more rushed and detached as everyone just runs from one attraction to the next. It really is the difference between a more worldly feel and a theme park feel. Some like this, some don't.
BINGO!
You hit the nail right on the head. It's not the games or the developers. It's the community.
If the game isn't what someone THINKS it should be, or if it's not exactly what they wanted or expected... it becomes a flamefest.
Then there's the famous people who love their game so much, they'll spend as much time as possible trying to flame the newest game out in the hopes that the community doesn't go flying to the new one and leave the other game in the dust.
You'd have to be crazy to be working in the MMO industry today. It's one of the most self-centered and rudest communities out there.
_________________________________
JonMichael
Currently: AION, an MMO Beta under NDA
Played: WAR, LOTRO, Hellgate: London, CoX, GW, SotNW, DAOC, EQ2, SWG, WoW, AO, Horizons, Second Life, There, TSO
Beta'd: There, Second Life, EQ2, DAOC:LotM, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, Gods and Heroes, Hellgate: London, Requiem:Bloodymare, AoC, WAR, DDO, Fallen Earth
I'd say the biggest problem is that they are not made for those who want to play the games. They are made for the masses that just want to be better than the next guy and wants to win (win what, that I do not know).
Many games have been decent or even good in Beta, but when finally released and after few months of patches they have been downgraded so that the 10-year olds can also play them with their eyes closed. There is no real achievements to be had (it is not achievement to be able to kill same mobs million times over, thus getting to the top level) and it seems that majority of the most vocal "players" want it that way. They whine that it is too hard etc etc and then devs make it easier. Why? Because that is the majority of what their forum users are saying. Sure that "majority" is actually not so great, but the real players do not bother to read or post in the games forums, because it is filled with whining jerks most of the time.
I myself like the adventure and journey to get to the end. The end is not the goal of mine, but the journey is where the fun is, and end is just something that will happen someday.