Aion has a interesting slant, but does not seem to be a groundbreaker for MMO innovation. Innovation does not always work, look at the problems with AoC and WAR. If it does the MMO job well its worth a look.
But one thing it really does lack over existing MMO’s is time to bed in, I would not play at launch, give it a month for the hype to fade and then take a look.
Improvement works if the game stays on the right track and doesn't suddenly take a turn for the worse, WoW abandoning its old ranking system was a example of that. You had a handful of top ranked people with the best possible gear, that's not overpowered or exaggerated...but instead of a ranking system that meant for most of the player base to rely on skill and not gear(since equal rank gear was the same), WoW chose to have players rely on itemization, which in my op was a bad judgement call since it basically meant that anyone with enough time on their hands can eventually leech off some pvp equipment and newly arrived people wont stand a chance not because of skill but because they lack gear Hopefully Aion adopts a simllar ranking system and promotes skill over gear rather than the contrary, and improve from it...fun is when you are sure you beat that player with your skills rather then because you had more time to farm gear then him Nobody can accurately point out if this game will indeed stand out from the rest, we hope it does since many before it promised so much but in the end failed so badly to deliver what was promised
Actually the old ranking system heavily favored people with excess time on their hands. The system heavily rewarded time spent, to the point where virtually all of the max rank PvPers had 40+ (and often 60+ or 80+) hours a week spent on battlegrounds. Skill was virtually unrewarded in any real sense.
I really hope Aion does nothing like the old WoW system.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
Now, what does Aion have to make people stay after buying the game? Aion has the ingredients to be an entertaining game, it has a developed PvE system, the combat has potential and is a step further into the same old concept, which means it's easy to get into, but also has a luck factor and makes you stay active while using your skills. Aion has that addictive factor many new games have been missing. Aion's features work nicely with each other, for example, some people would come here and ask for an arena rewards system and what not, what they wouldn't see is that they'd be killing the world pvp slowly by dividing the pvp population. As it is right now, the game design is thought out and features mesh properly. The game at its current status is hella polished, the servers perform incredibly, the massive fights are as massive as they can be, the range of computers working with those graphics is incredibly high considering the quality, things like that are basic for a game to start well.
The problem is that that whole description is so vague and subjective that it could be said of most of the games on this site's gamelist and be no less true than they are of Aion.
You could note that that doesn't apply to your description of Aion's endgame, but endgames to MMORPGs are almost invariably awful, to the degree that a game with no endgame at all has an above average endgame. The odds that Aion would break that trend without trying anything radical are zilch.
Shajarat said:
PvPvE - a method of creating realm-based PvP that doesn't suffer from the general flaws of population imbalance.
I'm all in favor of realm-based PvP that doesn't suffer from population issues, whether one side outnumbering the other, or too few players around at all, gameplay varying widely by time of day as populations fluctuate, or the various other such problems that plague many games.
But the question is, how do you fix those problems? Merely observing that it would be nice if the problems were fixed isn't going to get it done.
Shajarat said:
Interesting combat - they've worked on refining combat mechanics, feedback has been generally positive. From flying on down, they're promising more involved combat than most MMOs.
Interesting zones worth exploring - between flying and the effort they've put into the zones, this is a world that they want you to explore.
PvE - They're angling for rewarding group content with a high challenge level
Stigmas and character customization - they're trying to make unique characters while leaving open the abilities of the class. Instead of essentially taking away class abilities, they offer new abilities that you can learn to make your character unique.
As before, these are things that most games try to do. If what you're after is a game that tries to do those things, you've got dozens of choices from among games already released, without having to wait for a new game.
Can you name a single game with combat that didn't try to make combat interesting? The hard part is not determining that combat should be interesting. The hard part is making it so that combat is, in fact, interesting.
Once again, the question is how does Aion try to make combat interesting? Flying is commonly cited, but I mentioned that in the original post to this thread. Combat that involves flying could mean too many radically different things to be a meaningful description without elaboration.
I think your first two comments can be answered together.
I think the higher level areas/end game for Aion is in the Abyss so all players at that level will be there in order to progress. That would take care of the imbalencing issues as far as faction population is concerned.
Also, the term PvPvE seems justified in Aion since there is an NPC faction that are active, not just random field mobs waiting to be killed. How that faction is integrated into the game I'm not sure.
Concerning the combat system I only know of a few differences. You get additional abilities while flying than you do on the ground. Second is abilities that are triggered and third is a "DP" meter (the green bar on the UI) that once filled unlocks high-powered signature moves.
The point of this game for me is it combines a proven format with a few extras and packages it in a great art style. That said if it doesn't have smooth gameplay and a good storyline I will not last long. From all of the reports I've heard so far though I'm not worried about that.
Other games might have the same base mechanics but thats just a base. What you build off of it makes a huge difference in my opinion.
I think your first two comments can be answered together. I think the higher level areas/end game for Aion is in the Abyss so all players at that level will be there in order to progress. That would take care of the imbalencing issues as far as faction population is concerned. Also, the term PvPvE seems justified in Aion since there is an NPC faction that are active, not just random field mobs waiting to be killed. How that faction is integrated into the game I'm not sure. Concerning the combat system I only know of a few differences. You get additional abilities while flying than you do on the ground. Second is abilities that are triggered and third is a "DP" meter (the green bar on the UI) that once filled unlocks high-powered signature moves. The point of this game for me is it combines a proven format with a few extras and packages it in a great art style. That said if it doesn't have smooth gameplay and a good storyline I will not last long. From all of the reports I've heard so far though I'm not worried about that. Other games might have the same base mechanics but thats just a base. What you build off of it makes a huge difference in my opinion.
Only if you are a PvE story line fanatic or thats what you paly MMOs for. For the person that plays for the people, game play, and character development this isn't enough.
The problem is that that whole description is so vague and subjective that it could be said of most of the games on this site's gamelist and be no less true than they are of Aion. You're asking US what's the point of this game, expect subjectivity.
There's no way to say objectivily that certain feature-set is perfect for everyone, because there are always exceptions.
I could go ahead and tell you what I like of Aion, but then you'd come back telling me that X game has done it before, that every game attempts to do it, or that it's subjective, so, what's the point really? Try to be a bit less shallow, look at the whole picture, you have all the features listed, use your experience from previous MMORPGs to put those features together and find out if you would at least be interested in trying out such a game. It's all about feature sets, sets being the keyword there, no game can play like Aion, cause no game had the same features set.
You could note that that doesn't apply to your description of Aion's endgame, but endgames to MMORPGs are almost invariably awful, to the degree that a game with no endgame at all has an above average endgame. The odds that Aion would break that trend without trying anything radical are zilch. That's your opinion. In my opinion, endgame can be the best stage of a game if done properly. These kind of games lead you through a path the whole time untill you're done with your personal progression, once you have all the gear you want and the max level, games should have tools for community interaction. Aion has those tools already.
If the world and Realm vs realm situation is changing constantly, there's always a reason to play, to try and reach the maxium control, to help your friends, to become even better...Endgame guilds in WoW try to compete in order to see who kills X boss before, endgame guilds in L2 try to fight for heros and castles, endgame guilds in GW fight for complete domination on the tournaments, it keeps players entertained since there's always a reason to log in and play.
Shajarat said: PvPvE - a method of creating realm-based PvP that doesn't suffer from the general flaws of population imbalance.
I'm all in favor of realm-based PvP that doesn't suffer from population issues, whether one side outnumbering the other, or too few players around at all, gameplay varying widely by time of day as populations fluctuate, or the various other such problems that plague many games. But the question is, how do you fix those problems? Merely observing that it would be nice if the problems were fixed isn't going to get it done. The Balaur is conditionated by the server's status, if a side controls 80% of the fortresses in certain server, they'll hit them harder than if the odds were a bit more even, by hitting them harder, I mean that they will show up for sieges against them, and the draconic carrier (their ship) will be around their zones hunting people down. Balaurs could pick a side in a faction vs faction fight and kill only 1 side, Balaurs can also claim fortresses for themselves, so even if your servers rivals suck, you'll always have someone attacking your fortresses and RvR control points.
Shajarat said: Interesting combat - they've worked on refining combat mechanics, feedback has been generally positive. From flying on down, they're promising more involved combat than most MMOs. Interesting zones worth exploring - between flying and the effort they've put into the zones, this is a world that they want you to explore. PvE - They're angling for rewarding group content with a high challenge level Stigmas and character customization - they're trying to make unique characters while leaving open the abilities of the class. Instead of essentially taking away class abilities, they offer new abilities that you can learn to make your character unique.
As before, these are things that most games try to do. If what you're after is a game that tries to do those things, you've got dozens of choices from among games already released, without having to wait for a new game. Can you name a single game with combat that didn't try to make combat interesting? The hard part is not determining that combat should be interesting. The hard part is making it so that combat is, in fact, interesting. Once again, the question is how does Aion try to make combat interesting? Flying is commonly cited, but I mentioned that in the original post to this thread. Combat that involves flying could mean too many radically different things to be a meaningful description without elaboration. Elaboration of flying combat? Well, you click page up and you pop up your wings, while flying, some of your stats are boosted, and some of your skills are impossible to trigger, you have 1 minute before your wings wear off so you have to use it wisely. Some classes have advantage against flying targets, some others have a hard time against them, it adds a 3rd dimension to the character's control, which remarks a bit more player's skill. Flying is mainly adding another dimensions to combat and strategy, a guild could decide to attack them from the air in order to surprise them instead of attacking them from the front, flight can also be used in order to lure people out of the floor so rushing can be possible. There are a lot of applications to flight, look up for youtube Aion videos and think how would you use flight in your advantage.
Personally I'm tired of other games I've played because they have become stale. So every few years I move to another. They don't always have to be completely different just new in look, storyline, people, economy, strategy, anything else to pass time. Heck I've gone through EQ2 to L2 to WoW and i still play the always enjoyable Ragnarok. All those games are very similar in one way or another. So the reason I, and I asume others change games is simply for a fresh start and a new feel every now and again. I also go back and start all over on those same old games time and again just to have a bit of the old fun i used to with them.
Aion looks like a game I would like therefore I will play it. Worse case scenario I go back to another.
I think your first two comments can be answered together. I think the higher level areas/end game for Aion is in the Abyss so all players at that level will be there in order to progress. That would take care of the imbalencing issues as far as faction population is concerned. Also, the term PvPvE seems justified in Aion since there is an NPC faction that are active, not just random field mobs waiting to be killed. How that faction is integrated into the game I'm not sure. Concerning the combat system I only know of a few differences. You get additional abilities while flying than you do on the ground. Second is abilities that are triggered and third is a "DP" meter (the green bar on the UI) that once filled unlocks high-powered signature moves. The point of this game for me is it combines a proven format with a few extras and packages it in a great art style. That said if it doesn't have smooth gameplay and a good storyline I will not last long. From all of the reports I've heard so far though I'm not worried about that. Other games might have the same base mechanics but thats just a base. What you build off of it makes a huge difference in my opinion.
Only if you are a PvE story line fanatic or thats what you paly MMOs for. For the person that plays for the people, game play, and character development this isn't enough.
You're right, just having a good storyline isn't enough and I mentioned other things in my post like gameplay. Even then the style of gameplay, no matter how good, might not be the type others are looking for.
As far as the people and character development I won't know how the general tone of the community is until I actually play Aion. The Stigma system seems interesting from a character development standpoint though and I'll look forward to checking that out.
Now, what does Aion have to make people stay after buying the game? Aion has the ingredients to be an entertaining game, it has a developed PvE system, the combat has potential and is a step further into the same old concept, which means it's easy to get into, but also has a luck factor and makes you stay active while using your skills. Aion has that addictive factor many new games have been missing. Aion's features work nicely with each other, for example, some people would come here and ask for an arena rewards system and what not, what they wouldn't see is that they'd be killing the world pvp slowly by dividing the pvp population. As it is right now, the game design is thought out and features mesh properly. The game at its current status is hella polished, the servers perform incredibly, the massive fights are as massive as they can be, the range of computers working with those graphics is incredibly high considering the quality, things like that are basic for a game to start well.
The problem is that that whole description is so vague and subjective that it could be said of most of the games on this site's gamelist and be no less true than they are of Aion.
You could note that that doesn't apply to your description of Aion's endgame, but endgames to MMORPGs are almost invariably awful, to the degree that a game with no endgame at all has an above average endgame. The odds that Aion would break that trend without trying anything radical are zilch.
Why, Mr. Quizzical do you need to be so patronising in your comments? I've read many responses where people try to give clear and helpful answers and you shoot down their responses.
Clearly many answers will be vague when people have not actually played the game, and you can't seriously complain because responses are subjective -really? What exactly do you expect on a forum.
Large scale PvP with minimum lag and good reliability would be enough for me. That single point is enough to make me want to try the game. I also like the graphical style.
Still, I'm happy to try every Shiny New Thing because it's fun to try new games and then stick with the one(s) you like. (I'm still playing FFXI). There's no limit to just one game, you can actually play (or try) more than one you know.
Since you seem so dismissive of people's comments you might be well advised to try each game yourself, after all it's probably the only way to be sure that you don't miss a game which appeals to you. Furthermore, if you hate endgames so much you should relish the opportunity to move on to new games as soon as you've reached max level.
That's an honest question. I've dug through the game's official site and read some on this forum and on aionsource. I don't see a clear answer. Much of what I see screams "WoW-clone", which from a business perspective might be it, I guess, but doesn't explain the player-driven hype. What is there that makes it so that someone who doesn't like WoW could like Aion? Or that gives someone who does like WoW a reason to quit that game for Aion? The graphics are stunning, of course. While that's not a bad thing, the history of video games is littered with awful games that had graphics that were quite impressive in their time. Much has been said about flying, but to say that a game involves flying could mean so many different things that it means basically nothing without elaboration. EVE involves flying. Microsoft Flight Simulator involves flying. Super Mario World involves flying. Civilization 2 involves flying. But no two of those mean anything remotely similar by flying. The PvPvE system could mean a lot of different things, too. As best I can tell, it might mean nothing more than a pve area where you can get attacked by other players. That's hardly an innovation. Is there some stronger reason for NCsoft to coin a new term, apart from hype? Is there something else I've missed? Other threads to ask about the same question have been shouted down in such an absurd manner that one could easily be left to conclude there isn't a point to the game. It's as if Aion fanboy idiots are trying to outdo Darkfall fanboy idiots; the latter may be completely nuts, too, but can at least point to a number of attempted innovations in Darkfall.
As several other posters have said, you just can expect subjective answers. Not only because most of us haven’t played the game but because what is appealing some people and give them fun, could be boring and pointless for others.
In my case I’m going to try Aion just for three reasons:
High fantasy game with some Asian style in the art design and good graphics. Then I know I’ll like the environment. It’s just a plus not a main reason.
It’s a game made by NCSoft. Have some guaranty to me about being well done and polished to some extend. Also that give me some concerns about RMT and bots but in the worse case I learned to live with this in Lineage II.
And the key point to me. Apparently an important part of the “end game” in Aion is about group conflict and power (Abyss/factions), will be better to me if it was more free than just factions (I’m a fan of Lineage II conflict system) but anyway.
Combat mechanics, level system, skill system and other things that I know are important to other people aren’t to me, but all in all Aion looks as a good package able to give me fun for some time.
Anyway I cross the fingers, my last experiences in MMORPGs haven’t been a big success.
Quiz, you're straight up trolling at this point. The PvPvE system has been well explained, multiple times, on how it will fix population imbalance. Stating that it's a hypothetical situation when it is actually working in a released game is being a troll.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
<snip> But now I think I've got my answer: the game is meant to be a Shiny New Thing for people who are perpetually moving from one game to another, always pursuing the Next Big Thing. And Aion will have the budget and the polish to do that very well, probably selling impressive numbers of boxes early on. Of course, no game can remain the Shiny New Thing for long, so most of those players will move on pretty quickly, when the next big blockbuster comes out. That doesn't mean that Aion will die or be a commercial failure. It will probably retain a sizeable playerbase, especially in Korea, relying largely on attracting players who haven't played the various games that it borrows heavily from, much the way that WoW does. But a game where the point of the game doesn't involve game mechanics is not for me. Anyway, thanks for the replies.
That is exactly it, I think.
It's the shiny new thing. And if Aion manages to do that better than all the other ones who are still in development, or recently released, then that is reason enough to choose this game instead of the others. This is the answer to your question why one should choose this game.
If you are really looking for a game that adds a new game mechanic, then this may indeed not be for you.
All I want is L2 style world PvP, where I can gank and form my clan up to fight over something of value (not +pvp points, ie: a castle or raid boss), rather than have to fight in arena's, scenarios and fight alongside random, uncoordinated people like in most RvR battles.
Quiz, you're straight up trolling at this point. The PvPvE system has been well explained, multiple times, on how it will fix population imbalance. Stating that it's a hypothetical situation when it is actually working in a released game is being a troll.
Where exactly is the explanation? It's certainly not on this thread. It's not on the official site, or at least not on the English language one. It's not on any of the wikis I found, though all of those were pretty sparse, so Google might have mistakenly ranked the "main" one rather low or something. I've dug through some fan sites and not found a coherent explanation, though with over 200k posts on aionsource, I didn't read them all and am not going to.
I know that there is a third faction, the Balaur, that is strictly NPCs and not players. From what I've read, they can temporarily be the de facto allies of either the Asmodians or the Elyos, at least locally. Going from there to "population balance issues fixed" is an enormous jump that absolutely requires more explanation. Ephimero took a stab at it (post #57 on this thread), saying that they could tend to ally with whichever side is losing.
A couple sources I found seemed to state that they could also ally with whichever side is winning, thus making a mockery of population balance. What happens if the sides are pretty close to evenly matched? If the Balaur ally with either, that side has a huge advantage; rather than fixing population balance issues, the Balaur would thus break them.
If there is a detailed explanation of the PvPvE system on some external site somewhere, a link would be appreciated.
-----
As for subjective, were my descriptions of Guild Wars and Puzzle Pirates (in post #9 in this thread) subjective? The claim wasn't that the games were vaguely better, but rather, here's how they're different. Some people would think that makes the game better, and some would think it makes the game worse.
The Balaur are a server-controlled NPC faction, so players cannot choose to play them.
However, just because they are controlled by the server doesn't mean they are stupid; they can make choices, and players will never quite know what they are going to do.
For example, imagine a castle siege-style scenario, where one of the player factions, the Asmodians, is attacking the Elyos faction's castle. In the middle of this siege, the Balaur may appear.
When they arrive, no-one will know what they are going to do. They may have previously helped the Asmodians, but that doesn't matter; in the siege, they might betray them and help the Elyos. Or they might help the Ma to siege the Elyos's castle.
Or... they might try and take the castle for themselves, fighting against both the Elyos and the Asmodians.
The important thing to realize is that the Balaur are not typical NPCs. They are the third faction in the game, and they have free will, which makes them very unpredictable.
Come on Quizz, your being stright up silly now. What do you think pvpve means? Its a way to explain the enviroment that any gamer can understand.
PVP + PVE = PVPVE at the same time.......How can that be so hard for you to understand.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Mr. OP... to pick up ephi's question again.... what do you WANT in a game? What is it your looking for? What games have you played that you enjoyed? Why did you enjoy them? It would be so much easier for us to give you less "vague" answers.
It's almost 2010, and I am just not wiling to tolerate clunky graphics while being told that "gameplay is more important than graphics". That excuse won't wash with me any more. I expect my games to have both good graphics and good gameplay. -Quote Isoke(VN boards)
Come on Quizz, your being stright up silly now. What do you think pvpve means? Its a way to explain the enviroment that any gamer can understand. PVP + PVE = PVPVE at the same time.......How can that be so hard for you to understand.
No, PvP + PvE at the same time is just a PvP game, like L2, AoC or EVE, where the focus of the game is on open world PvP, people will attack you wherever you are, for whatever reasons, opposed to a game like WoW which is mainly PvE based (even the PvP servers aren't trulely PvP since the addition of inter-server BG's), and PvP is something you do at an arena or in a specific spot, and that the game's focus for PvP is in arena's and scnearios away from everything else.
PvPvE means nothing more than the Balaur act as a player faction, but can't be controlled by players. They will show up for castle sieges, raids, portals and randomly just for PvP style fights....nothing else.
Lineage 2 is based and thrives off of PvP and PvE at the same time...you are killing a raid boss, well some enemy clan wants the raid boss, they attack you in the middle of the raid and try take it for themselves...or for an Epic raid you fight to control the spawn of the boss, so that when it does spawn you get to go in and kill it. Or even something as simple as while PvEing, you're in the spot someone else wants, so they attack you for it. Thats just a PvP based game, and has nothing to do with PvPvE.
Come on Quizz, your being stright up silly now. What do you think pvpve means? Its a way to explain the enviroment that any gamer can understand. PVP + PVE = PVPVE at the same time.......How can that be so hard for you to understand.
No, PvP + PvE at the same time is just a PvP game, like L2, AoC or EVE, where the focus of the game is on open world PvP, people will attack you wherever you are, for whatever reasons, opposed to a game like WoW which is mainly PvE based (even the PvP servers aren't trulely PvP since the addition of inter-server BG's), and PvP is something you do at an arena or in a specific spot, and that the game's focus for PvP is in arena's and scnearios away from everything else.
PvPvE means nothing more than the Balaur act as a player faction, but can't be controlled by players. They will show up for castle sieges, raids, portals and randomly just for PvP style fights....nothing else.
Lineage 2 is based and thrives off of PvP and PvE at the same time...you are killing a raid boss, well some enemy clan wants the raid boss, they attack you in the middle of the raid and try take it for themselves...or for an Epic raid you fight to control the spawn of the boss, so that when it does spawn you get to go in and kill it. Or even something as simple as while PvEing, you're in the spot someone else wants, so they attack you for it. Thats just a PvP based game, and has nothing to do with PvPvE.
From the main website. Saying its the Balaur is a reach at best. The fights with them is few and far between (mass encounters and not the solo balaur mobs you grind on in the abyss). I prefer the the first part in this paragraph below. But whatever, There just using a phrase (coined the word) to explain there environment in the game, Yes its nothing new to a mmo except for the Balaur (mass) encounters. In the end who gives a rats azz.
What is PvPvE?
PvPvE is an acronym that stands for Player versus Player versus Environment. PvPvE symbolises the constant and dynamic war that rages in the Abyss between both player factions and the Balaur, a non-playable race of brutal creatures.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Well done Aion community. I have heard mention of this game on other forums and thought I'd pop over and have a look, see what the game waas about, see what people thought about it. When I spotted this thread I was pleased to find somene so obviously looking for the same things as myself, namely, some highlights i could fix on that would attract me to cancelling any other subscription I may have and take up playing Aion instead for a nice change.
So well done Aion community. I have to admit to only reading the first 4 pages of replies to this thread, and marvelling at the vague, evasive, at time almost esoteric answers "What's the use of playing any game?" (WTF! are you even capable of reading a question and understanding the purpose of it?)
I am left the with the abiding feeling that none who i read have even the slightest idea what sets Aion apart from the rest of the MMO games of the genre. I am completely as in the dark as i was when i clicked the thread link.
Actually that isn't so, i have deduced that if the preumed fans who frequent these boards can't come up with one unique hook to attract me to the game, there isn't one. Thank you for your information. Thanks, bye bye.
Well done Aion community. I have heard mention of this game on other forums and thought I'd pop over and have a look, see what the game waas about, see what people thought about it. When I spotted this thread I was pleased to find somene so obviously looking for the same things as myself, namely, some highlights i could fix on that would attract me to cancelling any other subscription I may have and take up playing Aion instead for a nice change. So well done Aion community. I have to admit to only reading the first 4 pages of replies to this thread, and marvelling at the vague, evasive, at time almost esoteric answers "What's the use of playing any game?" (WTF! are you even capable of reading a question and understanding the purpose of it?) I am left the with the abiding feeling that none who i read have even the slightest idea what sets Aion apart from the rest of the MMO games of the genre. I am completely as in the dark as i was when i clicked the thread link. Actually that isn't so, i have deduced that if the preumed fans who frequent these boards can't come up with one unique hook to attract me to the game, there isn't one. Thank you for your information. Thanks, bye bye.
Does it have to be set apart from any other MMORPG? I mean think about some other forms of entertainment, like watching movies or reading books. You may read a fantastic novel and love every page. Then you read it again, and maybe even a third time. Or a sequel (a-la expansion) comes out and you read that too. Does that mean you can't read and enjoy some other novel which might not be nearly as good as the first, but still gives you entertainment? Maybe you're tired of reading the super-duper novel and just want something similar (fantasy novels for instance) yet new.
Comments
Aion has a interesting slant, but does not seem to be a groundbreaker for MMO innovation. Innovation does not always work, look at the problems with AoC and WAR. If it does the MMO job well its worth a look.
But one thing it really does lack over existing MMO’s is time to bed in, I would not play at launch, give it a month for the hype to fade and then take a look.
Actually the old ranking system heavily favored people with excess time on their hands. The system heavily rewarded time spent, to the point where virtually all of the max rank PvPers had 40+ (and often 60+ or 80+) hours a week spent on battlegrounds. Skill was virtually unrewarded in any real sense.
I really hope Aion does nothing like the old WoW system.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
The problem is that that whole description is so vague and subjective that it could be said of most of the games on this site's gamelist and be no less true than they are of Aion.
You could note that that doesn't apply to your description of Aion's endgame, but endgames to MMORPGs are almost invariably awful, to the degree that a game with no endgame at all has an above average endgame. The odds that Aion would break that trend without trying anything radical are zilch.
Shajarat said:
PvPvE - a method of creating realm-based PvP that doesn't suffer from the general flaws of population imbalance.
I'm all in favor of realm-based PvP that doesn't suffer from population issues, whether one side outnumbering the other, or too few players around at all, gameplay varying widely by time of day as populations fluctuate, or the various other such problems that plague many games.
But the question is, how do you fix those problems? Merely observing that it would be nice if the problems were fixed isn't going to get it done.
Shajarat said:
Interesting combat - they've worked on refining combat mechanics, feedback has been generally positive. From flying on down, they're promising more involved combat than most MMOs.
Interesting zones worth exploring - between flying and the effort they've put into the zones, this is a world that they want you to explore.
PvE - They're angling for rewarding group content with a high challenge level
Stigmas and character customization - they're trying to make unique characters while leaving open the abilities of the class. Instead of essentially taking away class abilities, they offer new abilities that you can learn to make your character unique.
As before, these are things that most games try to do. If what you're after is a game that tries to do those things, you've got dozens of choices from among games already released, without having to wait for a new game.
Can you name a single game with combat that didn't try to make combat interesting? The hard part is not determining that combat should be interesting. The hard part is making it so that combat is, in fact, interesting.
Once again, the question is how does Aion try to make combat interesting? Flying is commonly cited, but I mentioned that in the original post to this thread. Combat that involves flying could mean too many radically different things to be a meaningful description without elaboration.
I think your first two comments can be answered together.
I think the higher level areas/end game for Aion is in the Abyss so all players at that level will be there in order to progress. That would take care of the imbalencing issues as far as faction population is concerned.
Also, the term PvPvE seems justified in Aion since there is an NPC faction that are active, not just random field mobs waiting to be killed. How that faction is integrated into the game I'm not sure.
Concerning the combat system I only know of a few differences. You get additional abilities while flying than you do on the ground. Second is abilities that are triggered and third is a "DP" meter (the green bar on the UI) that once filled unlocks high-powered signature moves.
The point of this game for me is it combines a proven format with a few extras and packages it in a great art style. That said if it doesn't have smooth gameplay and a good storyline I will not last long. From all of the reports I've heard so far though I'm not worried about that.
Other games might have the same base mechanics but thats just a base. What you build off of it makes a huge difference in my opinion.
Just not worth my time anymore.
Only if you are a PvE story line fanatic or thats what you paly MMOs for. For the person that plays for the people, game play, and character development this isn't enough.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Personally I'm tired of other games I've played because they have become stale. So every few years I move to another. They don't always have to be completely different just new in look, storyline, people, economy, strategy, anything else to pass time. Heck I've gone through EQ2 to L2 to WoW and i still play the always enjoyable Ragnarok. All those games are very similar in one way or another. So the reason I, and I asume others change games is simply for a fresh start and a new feel every now and again. I also go back and start all over on those same old games time and again just to have a bit of the old fun i used to with them.
Aion looks like a game I would like therefore I will play it. Worse case scenario I go back to another.
Only if you are a PvE story line fanatic or thats what you paly MMOs for. For the person that plays for the people, game play, and character development this isn't enough.
You're right, just having a good storyline isn't enough and I mentioned other things in my post like gameplay. Even then the style of gameplay, no matter how good, might not be the type others are looking for.
As far as the people and character development I won't know how the general tone of the community is until I actually play Aion. The Stigma system seems interesting from a character development standpoint though and I'll look forward to checking that out.
Just not worth my time anymore.
The problem is that that whole description is so vague and subjective that it could be said of most of the games on this site's gamelist and be no less true than they are of Aion.
You could note that that doesn't apply to your description of Aion's endgame, but endgames to MMORPGs are almost invariably awful, to the degree that a game with no endgame at all has an above average endgame. The odds that Aion would break that trend without trying anything radical are zilch.
Why, Mr. Quizzical do you need to be so patronising in your comments? I've read many responses where people try to give clear and helpful answers and you shoot down their responses.
Clearly many answers will be vague when people have not actually played the game, and you can't seriously complain because responses are subjective -really? What exactly do you expect on a forum.
Large scale PvP with minimum lag and good reliability would be enough for me. That single point is enough to make me want to try the game. I also like the graphical style.
Still, I'm happy to try every Shiny New Thing because it's fun to try new games and then stick with the one(s) you like. (I'm still playing FFXI). There's no limit to just one game, you can actually play (or try) more than one you know.
Since you seem so dismissive of people's comments you might be well advised to try each game yourself, after all it's probably the only way to be sure that you don't miss a game which appeals to you. Furthermore, if you hate endgames so much you should relish the opportunity to move on to new games as soon as you've reached max level.
As several other posters have said, you just can expect subjective answers. Not only because most of us haven’t played the game but because what is appealing some people and give them fun, could be boring and pointless for others.
In my case I’m going to try Aion just for three reasons:
High fantasy game with some Asian style in the art design and good graphics. Then I know I’ll like the environment. It’s just a plus not a main reason.
It’s a game made by NCSoft. Have some guaranty to me about being well done and polished to some extend. Also that give me some concerns about RMT and bots but in the worse case I learned to live with this in Lineage II.
And the key point to me. Apparently an important part of the “end game” in Aion is about group conflict and power (Abyss/factions), will be better to me if it was more free than just factions (I’m a fan of Lineage II conflict system) but anyway.
Combat mechanics, level system, skill system and other things that I know are important to other people aren’t to me, but all in all Aion looks as a good package able to give me fun for some time.
Anyway I cross the fingers, my last experiences in MMORPGs haven’t been a big success.
As you can see very subjective.
Quiz, you're straight up trolling at this point. The PvPvE system has been well explained, multiple times, on how it will fix population imbalance. Stating that it's a hypothetical situation when it is actually working in a released game is being a troll.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson
That is exactly it, I think.
It's the shiny new thing. And if Aion manages to do that better than all the other ones who are still in development, or recently released, then that is reason enough to choose this game instead of the others. This is the answer to your question why one should choose this game.
If you are really looking for a game that adds a new game mechanic, then this may indeed not be for you.
All I want is L2 style world PvP, where I can gank and form my clan up to fight over something of value (not +pvp points, ie: a castle or raid boss), rather than have to fight in arena's, scenarios and fight alongside random, uncoordinated people like in most RvR battles.
What is the point of life?
What is the point of sex?
HMMMM IM THINKING HARD.
I have an idea for a new ground-breaking game.
The game is called groundbreaker.
You break ground, and then you dig holes and make underground cities to defend by using this ground breaking theme.
Where exactly is the explanation? It's certainly not on this thread. It's not on the official site, or at least not on the English language one. It's not on any of the wikis I found, though all of those were pretty sparse, so Google might have mistakenly ranked the "main" one rather low or something. I've dug through some fan sites and not found a coherent explanation, though with over 200k posts on aionsource, I didn't read them all and am not going to.
I know that there is a third faction, the Balaur, that is strictly NPCs and not players. From what I've read, they can temporarily be the de facto allies of either the Asmodians or the Elyos, at least locally. Going from there to "population balance issues fixed" is an enormous jump that absolutely requires more explanation. Ephimero took a stab at it (post #57 on this thread), saying that they could tend to ally with whichever side is losing.
A couple sources I found seemed to state that they could also ally with whichever side is winning, thus making a mockery of population balance. What happens if the sides are pretty close to evenly matched? If the Balaur ally with either, that side has a huge advantage; rather than fixing population balance issues, the Balaur would thus break them.
If there is a detailed explanation of the PvPvE system on some external site somewhere, a link would be appreciated.
-----
As for subjective, were my descriptions of Guild Wars and Puzzle Pirates (in post #9 in this thread) subjective? The claim wasn't that the games were vaguely better, but rather, here's how they're different. Some people would think that makes the game better, and some would think it makes the game worse.
the 3rd faction may be opposed to both player factions too
Interview with Ju-hyun Jang, Producer
www.aionsource.com/forum/cmps_index.php
The Balaur are a server-controlled NPC faction, so players cannot choose to play them.
However, just because they are controlled by the server doesn't mean they are stupid; they can make choices, and players will never quite know what they are going to do.
For example, imagine a castle siege-style scenario, where one of the player factions, the Asmodians, is attacking the Elyos faction's castle. In the middle of this siege, the Balaur may appear.
When they arrive, no-one will know what they are going to do. They may have previously helped the Asmodians, but that doesn't matter; in the siege, they might betray them and help the Elyos. Or they might help the Ma to siege the Elyos's castle.
Or... they might try and take the castle for themselves, fighting against both the Elyos and the Asmodians.
The important thing to realize is that the Balaur are not typical NPCs. They are the third faction in the game, and they have free will, which makes them very unpredictable.
EQ2 fan sites
Come on Quizz, your being stright up silly now. What do you think pvpve means? Its a way to explain the enviroment that any gamer can understand.
PVP + PVE = PVPVE at the same time.......How can that be so hard for you to understand.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Mr. OP... to pick up ephi's question again.... what do you WANT in a game? What is it your looking for? What games have you played that you enjoyed? Why did you enjoy them? It would be so much easier for us to give you less "vague" answers.
It's almost 2010, and I am just not wiling to tolerate clunky graphics while being told that "gameplay is more important than graphics". That excuse won't wash with me any more. I expect my games to have both good graphics and good gameplay.
-Quote Isoke(VN boards)
No, PvP + PvE at the same time is just a PvP game, like L2, AoC or EVE, where the focus of the game is on open world PvP, people will attack you wherever you are, for whatever reasons, opposed to a game like WoW which is mainly PvE based (even the PvP servers aren't trulely PvP since the addition of inter-server BG's), and PvP is something you do at an arena or in a specific spot, and that the game's focus for PvP is in arena's and scnearios away from everything else.
PvPvE means nothing more than the Balaur act as a player faction, but can't be controlled by players. They will show up for castle sieges, raids, portals and randomly just for PvP style fights....nothing else.
Lineage 2 is based and thrives off of PvP and PvE at the same time...you are killing a raid boss, well some enemy clan wants the raid boss, they attack you in the middle of the raid and try take it for themselves...or for an Epic raid you fight to control the spawn of the boss, so that when it does spawn you get to go in and kill it. Or even something as simple as while PvEing, you're in the spot someone else wants, so they attack you for it. Thats just a PvP based game, and has nothing to do with PvPvE.
No, PvP + PvE at the same time is just a PvP game, like L2, AoC or EVE, where the focus of the game is on open world PvP, people will attack you wherever you are, for whatever reasons, opposed to a game like WoW which is mainly PvE based (even the PvP servers aren't trulely PvP since the addition of inter-server BG's), and PvP is something you do at an arena or in a specific spot, and that the game's focus for PvP is in arena's and scnearios away from everything else.
PvPvE means nothing more than the Balaur act as a player faction, but can't be controlled by players. They will show up for castle sieges, raids, portals and randomly just for PvP style fights....nothing else.
Lineage 2 is based and thrives off of PvP and PvE at the same time...you are killing a raid boss, well some enemy clan wants the raid boss, they attack you in the middle of the raid and try take it for themselves...or for an Epic raid you fight to control the spawn of the boss, so that when it does spawn you get to go in and kill it. Or even something as simple as while PvEing, you're in the spot someone else wants, so they attack you for it. Thats just a PvP based game, and has nothing to do with PvPvE.
From the main website. Saying its the Balaur is a reach at best. The fights with them is few and far between (mass encounters and not the solo balaur mobs you grind on in the abyss). I prefer the the first part in this paragraph below. But whatever, There just using a phrase (coined the word) to explain there environment in the game, Yes its nothing new to a mmo except for the Balaur (mass) encounters. In the end who gives a rats azz.
What is PvPvE?
PvPvE is an acronym that stands for Player versus Player versus Environment. PvPvE symbolises the constant and dynamic war that rages in the Abyss between both player factions and the Balaur, a non-playable race of brutal creatures.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
to kill monsters and raise levels. have relaxation ouside real life.
Well done Aion community. I have heard mention of this game on other forums and thought I'd pop over and have a look, see what the game waas about, see what people thought about it. When I spotted this thread I was pleased to find somene so obviously looking for the same things as myself, namely, some highlights i could fix on that would attract me to cancelling any other subscription I may have and take up playing Aion instead for a nice change.
So well done Aion community. I have to admit to only reading the first 4 pages of replies to this thread, and marvelling at the vague, evasive, at time almost esoteric answers "What's the use of playing any game?" (WTF! are you even capable of reading a question and understanding the purpose of it?)
I am left the with the abiding feeling that none who i read have even the slightest idea what sets Aion apart from the rest of the MMO games of the genre. I am completely as in the dark as i was when i clicked the thread link.
Actually that isn't so, i have deduced that if the preumed fans who frequent these boards can't come up with one unique hook to attract me to the game, there isn't one. Thank you for your information. Thanks, bye bye.
Beautiful!
Does it have to be set apart from any other MMORPG? I mean think about some other forms of entertainment, like watching movies or reading books. You may read a fantastic novel and love every page. Then you read it again, and maybe even a third time. Or a sequel (a-la expansion) comes out and you read that too. Does that mean you can't read and enjoy some other novel which might not be nearly as good as the first, but still gives you entertainment? Maybe you're tired of reading the super-duper novel and just want something similar (fantasy novels for instance) yet new.
Are MMORPG's any different in that regard?