I agree with him on Legendary items, they should be like the new Bind on Account gear and level accordingly (not actually bound to an account but level as one of those) just make the drop rate not so big as for the Illidans blades.
Legendary should always stay legendary, regardless of your level.
Well this game has truely gone to shit in wotlk. I mean recycling towers and buildings is one thing but to have the main raid content be nothing but a recycled zone from 2 years ago is really pathetic. Everyone talks about blizzard and wow being greedy ect. Well activision-blizzard posted a quarterly LOSS of over 70 million so yeah wow makes money but the like many of these huge corporate giants they really are not in very good shape financially. Don't expect anything other than what you have been getting from wow. They will continue to produce as little as possible to keep the 11 million suckers hanging on waiting for the next crumb of content.
I have no problem with replacing my warglaives with another legendary once I get them, but a green item no matter what level it is should NEVER be better than a legendary weapon. As I said in my first post, I wouldn't even really mind if level 75+ epics were equal to them, but they're Legendary for a reason. They're supposed to rock no matter what. Blizzard has done this twice to us, and I'm just not gonna take it anymore. I spent months getting a hand of ragnaros for my paladin only to find out when TBC came out, greens were 2x as good as it. Now my rogue used greens from 70-76, then switched to epics. Legendary items should stay Legendary.
In the next expansion you're going to have people with ~40k hp and dealing ~30k damage a hit if Blizzard keeps their currently progression of stats from the last 2 expansions. It's just lost that feeling that my Tauren warrior with 5k hp was 'omg awesome'
Everything since the Burnng Crusade has been recycled content that people keep paying a monthly fee for. Blizzard definitely knows how to market games but they are far from an innovative bunch when it comes to mmos.
Personally I felt that after BC Blizzard were no longer providing value for money. There was far too much recycled content for my liking, they should have provided a more large scale expansion to the game itself rather than just mostly just adding new "maps". The game basically stayed exactly the same after BC, you could use the if it's not broke don't fix it arguement but I that's not good enough for me. In order for me keep paying them they would have needed to expand the actual game experience not just rehashed the vanila game with extra maps and not much else.
I agree about all the other big gaming companies that have been laid low by the test of time, it happens to them all eventually and new upstarts replace them as king of the hill. It will happen to Blizzard as well. Some people haven't been watching the game industry long enough to appreciate it but there are plenty of other companies that have sat on the throne that Blizzard now occupies, it is just keeping it warm for next developer. Blizzard has made some awesome games and people should be happy about that fact but realise at the same time that for a variety of reasons it's impossible to maintain such high standards forever.
You are definitely not giving EA enough credit. The curent war is between EA and Activision Blizzard. They are fighting tough battles on all fronts of the computer and console marktets.
------------------------------ "Capitalism is currently working as intended."
Your point about major patch every 5/6 months is not entirely accurate. From launch to BC we averaged a major patch every 2.4 months. From BC to Wrath the average went up to one major patch every 5.5 months. I can only hope that Wrath we will get that number smaller.
I sort of get what you mean by this, but the thing to remember is that most of those patches from original release to BC were adding content that we now take for granted like Battlegrounds, honour systems, battlemasters, linked auction houses, improvements to levelling and so on. By the time we got to BC the basic structure of the game was pretty well complete and the development cycle switched to creating more content around that structure and tweaking it as required to fit that new content.
I have never really had a problem with the patch rate as it has always seemed to just 'fit' for the casual pace, which i always maintain that Blizzard aims at more so than anything else. The only time i would have an issue is if they were taking this amount of time and the patches were released bugged to the hilt.
Well back in BC days the major patches 1-4, really only 4 added a lot to the game. Patch 2.1 was Black Temple, which really meant BC was now where it should of been at release (Illidan was in the cinematic but not ingame at release). The next patch added Voice Chat, which got a luke-warm at best reception from the players. I never read anything about players asking for this, as most people use ventrilo or teamspeak. Zul'aman in 2.3 really just added one 10-man post kara instance. Plopping it in the blood elf lowbie lands probably wasn't the best idea either. At least with 2.4 we got a whole island, numerous dailies on and off that island, two new instances (5/25 man), new badge vendors, and a completion of the main storyline.
They really need to step up the development of free content. With their vast resources, this shouldn't be a problem unless there is something internal in the company we are not aware of. Also, I don't think that all new content should only cater to 80's or pvp. Adding more under 60 content would encourge people to dust off lowbie alts or make a new character altogether.
The Burning Crusade - RUINED THE GAME INTO CRAPPY CAREBEAR & ESPORT CRAP GAME, They removed the PVP rank system There whas simply nothing to do for an goal minded player anymore, who dosnt care about raiding og multidueling.
Wrath of the Lich King - GAME FIX, GAME IS ENJOYABLE AND FUN AGAIN. The achevement system atleast gives something to do for a goal minded player.
same goes with wow-europes lack of costumer support, but it seems to have become better after they moved it to blizzards homepage.
The biggest stars of the last 3-4 years of gaming are without a doubt Blizzard....
Well right there you are wrong. Blizzard hasn't been the biggest star for the last 3-4 years, they have been the biggest star for the last 16 years. Timeline for those who have forgotten is below. Sure, they continue to go back to the well with Warcraft, Starcraft and Diablo, but why not? People are dieing to get their hands on those games, should Blizzard just ignore all their fans? Sorry, but Blizzard doesn't do that. Blizzard lives and dies with it's fans. It's one of the reasons they have continued to be successful 16 years later. Now if you're right that they can't come up with anything other than Diablo, Warcraft or Starcraft in the future it will be a shame, but I got a feeling that Blizzard is about to announce a new IP and a new beginning to a long standing franchise. I'm actually quite excited to see what the future brings.
A lot of people here are talking about re-cycled content. Really the only thing i can think of as being re-cycled is Naxx itself. There was also an explanation of why they did this. Was quite a while back now but the gist of it was that approx. 0.2% of ALL players at the time Naxxramas was first out had seen inside it let alone kill KT at the end.
It was placed there by Blizzard as an intentional stop to the hardcore raiders who had finished AQ40 and would have a long wait before TBC came out.
There idea was that it would be so impossiby hard that it would keep the hardcore interested long enough for them to finish the first expansion. It was never meant to be finished/seen by the majority of players. It is for this reason that they brought it back in WotLK along with the fact that it fitted into the lore.
People were clamouring to see the place. People who started playing during TBC would hear about this magical dungeon Naxxrama which needed 40 players and about 200g worth of consumables to get past just the first wing (And this is before dailies etc when gold wasn't easy to find).
I myself had never seen the place apart from a quick zerg through the construct wing at level 70 where we STILL managed to die when we tried Thaddius.
Oh well.It will always be just one persons opinion v anothers with no one willing to budge.
Thanks T
"The problem with the French is that they don't have a word for entrepreneur." -George W. Bush, discussing the decline of the French economy with British Prime Minister Tony Blair
You're saying Blizzard is a soulless corporation? HO LY CRAP Blizzard only seems big because they actually make their own games. Instead of the other companies you listed that always farms out projects to smaller teams they own. Blizzard has only ever farmed out projects twice and they were both cancelled because they were not up to Blizzard standards. Blizzard has a few hundred developers split between 3 projects. And if you dont think WoW is of great quality then not only should you just leave the MMORPG genre but video games altogether. You have simply lost the ability to appreciate a good game.
What is this Blizzard standard. Blizzard specializes in simple and generic. As for the remark if you don't think WOW is great quality you should leave MMORPG that is crap. WOW is not high quality. It is simply a MMO released at the right time feeding off of a popular franchise. The game does nothing innovative and has become so big that new MMOs coming out fail solely on the bases that most players have just become too use to WOW. That being said I do like Diablo a lot but thats about it from them.
They produce little content for WoW, taking 3-4 months to patch in new content when they could have the manpower to produce 4 times over in a month. The content they do release is nothing but recycled materials from the minds of greater creative game designers long gone - very much like the upcoming DIable sequel. And the pressure to appeal to the lowest common denominator, making the game less of a challenge to appeal to the masses - well that is an executive decision from a management who has taken over what was once a great gamer's game, and turned it into a cash machine. Sounds like Resident Evil or Tomb Raider all over again? That's because it is.
First of all speculating as to how much manpower it takes to produce content is, well, retarded. They're working on diablo 3 and Starcraft 2 while simultaniously patching and working on expansions for WoW.
Also have you not read about their new MMO IP that they've been working on?
Originally posted by GTwander:
How are you an MMO? Or any of us for that matter?
I say we strike all users from the site for not being MMOs.
They produce little content for WoW, taking 3-4 months to patch in new content when they could have the manpower to produce 4 times over in a month. The content they do release is nothing but recycled materials from the minds of greater creative game designers long gone - very much like the upcoming DIable sequel. And the pressure to appeal to the lowest common denominator, making the game less of a challenge to appeal to the masses - well that is an executive decision from a management who has taken over what was once a great gamer's game, and turned it into a cash machine. Sounds like Resident Evil or Tomb Raider all over again? That's because it is.
First of all speculating as to how much manpower it takes to produce content is, well, retarded. They're working on diablo 3 and Starcraft 2 while simultaniously patching and working on expansions for WoW.
Also have you not read about their new MMO IP that they've been working on?
You are right that its dumb to speculate on manpower but I think the point thats coming out of that is WOW so thoroughly beats every other MMO and earns so much money from subscriptions that the fact another MMO can release patches as often as WOW and pale in cash flow seems a little odd. They are working on other stuff but with the money they're making working on the other titles while updating more often in WOW should be easy.
You are right that its dumb to speculate on manpower but I think the point thats coming out of that is WOW so thoroughly beats every other MMO and earns so much money from subscriptions that the fact another MMO can release patches as often as WOW and pale in cash flow seems a little odd. They are working on other stuff but with the money they're making working on the other titles while updating more often in WOW should be easy.
I think you're right on that, but to that extent I would make the argument of quality over quantity (in the general sense). But as it pertains to WoW specifically I would say, yeah a lot of content has been breezed through far too easily and there needs to be more difficult quality content developed a bit faster.
Originally posted by GTwander:
How are you an MMO? Or any of us for that matter?
I say we strike all users from the site for not being MMOs.
Off topic but I love the Khorne symbol. Shame WAR is not doing so hot. Waiting for the wet dream when 40k could work as an MMO.
Haha, yeah I hear ya. I think WAR really dropped the ball in not letting the chaos faction choose their specific faction. On top of that calling a game WAR and not having Khorne, the blood god, that only loves war and death, not be the representativeative faction for the army of chaos? Wtf, that's some bull.
Originally posted by GTwander:
How are you an MMO? Or any of us for that matter?
I say we strike all users from the site for not being MMOs.
They produce little content for WoW, taking 3-4 months to patch in new content when they could have the manpower to produce 4 times over in a month. The content they do release is nothing but recycled materials from the minds of greater creative game designers long gone - very much like the upcoming DIable sequel. And the pressure to appeal to the lowest common denominator, making the game less of a challenge to appeal to the masses - well that is an executive decision from a management who has taken over what was once a great gamer's game, and turned it into a cash machine. Sounds like Resident Evil or Tomb Raider all over again? That's because it is.
First of all speculating as to how much manpower it takes to produce content is, well, retarded. They're working on diablo 3 and Starcraft 2 while simultaniously patching and working on expansions for WoW.
Also have you not read about their new MMO IP that they've been working on?
You are right that its dumb to speculate on manpower but I think the point thats coming out of that is WOW so thoroughly beats every other MMO and earns so much money from subscriptions that the fact another MMO can release patches as often as WOW and pale in cash flow seems a little odd. They are working on other stuff but with the money they're making working on the other titles while updating more often in WOW should be easy.
I think that really hits the truth.
Other MMO's have less subs, therefore less income, yet turn out more free content than WoW. Some of WoW's "major" patchers weren't even that major (patch 2.2). They are nickel and diming us with paid name changes, character recustomization, autenticators, etc. Now *I* don't need or use those services but I'm sure the moment that Fanboi Bob got the chance to change his race/sex he forked up money and did it. Now do other games have paid name change or server transfer features? Yes they do. Do they charge as much as Blizzard? No they don't.
Originally posted by DrowNoble Other MMO's have less subs, therefore less income, yet turn out more free content than WoW. Some of WoW's "major" patchers weren't even that major (patch 2.2). They are nickel and diming us with paid name changes, character recustomization, autenticators, etc. Now *I* don't need or use those services but I'm sure the moment that Fanboi Bob got the chance to change his race/sex he forked up money and did it. Now do other games have paid name change or server transfer features? Yes they do. Do they charge as much as Blizzard? No they don't.
Yes other MMO's have less subs, but that doesn't follow that pro-rata they have less income as it depends on the costs they have involved in running/maintaining their services. I hear people harp on about all the free content that EVE brings out for their members, but they also charge almost 50% more a month for their subscription too (£8.99 for wow, £13.20 for EVE), so in fact i would actually end up paying more for my eve subscription with "free" expansions that i would for my WOW sub and paying for expansions, go figure!!!
As for the 'nickel & diming' thing, well do they charge for services, yes they do, but do you have to buy those services, well no you don't.
Activision/Blizzard can only make as much money as people are willing to hand over, no-one is forced at gunpoint to spend their money and as long as they see value in Blizzards services and continue to pay for them, why should Blizzard make any changes at all??
It must be Thursday, i never could get the hang of Thursdays.
Yes other MMO's have less subs, but that doesn't follow that pro-rata they have less income as it depends on the costs they have involved in running/maintaining their services. I hear people harp on about all the free content that EVE brings out for their members, but they also charge almost 50% more a month for their subscription too (£8.99 for wow, £13.20 for EVE), so in fact i would actually end up paying more for my eve subscription with "free" expansions that i would for my WOW sub and paying for expansions, go figure!!! As for the 'nickel & diming' thing, well do they charge for services, yes they do, but do you have to buy those services, well no you don't. Activision/Blizzard can only make as much money as people are willing to hand over, no-one is forced at gunpoint to spend their money and as long as they see value in Blizzards services and continue to pay for them, why should Blizzard make any changes at all??
When you are selling 30 times as much as the competitions you do make most money. And the percentage of the running costs get lower when you have millions of players instead of a few 100K. It is always cheaper to buy a lot of stuff instead of a few (counting the price for a single unit of course).
Still it is possible that Eve earn more money than Wow for a single user, maybe even twice the ammount.
But I don't see any reason for Blizzard to change their rutines right now either, they are making loads of cash. Why kill the goose that lays golden eggs?
Its been 10 years since the last Starcraft game and 8 years since the last Diablo game, its time for a welcome return to these world IMHO & millions agree. Dont forget the millions who have never played the oringinal SC and Diablo.
Blizzard could easily of sub contracted sequels for SC and Diablo and waited for the cash to roll in.. or even sold the rights out of to a faceless developer/publisher many years ago.
I like that I know who runs Blizzard they have a human face and thats good.
If you want an example of a souless game that once had soul until greed took over look at c&c and tomb raider .. great games but far to many expansions and versions.
WoW is a huge hit, far bigger than even Blizzard hoped and I think for a long time Blizzard were lost , no doubt they had plans for new games, maybe even getting SC2/D3 out sooner but that all changed as they had to roll with WoW .. millions of people to keep happy and a great revenue stream they would be fools to pass up.
Only now they are back on track, starcraft 2 this year, Diablo 3 next year and maybe even the new MMO the year after 2011 =D
I agree with the OP when it comes to WoW right now. However, the creative recruitments they have done (Andy Chambers from GW was brilliant as an example) shows that they have a core team that most likely is working alot with game design that is much more creative than what TBC and WotLK has shown.
Looking at the titles at hand I see SC2 and see nothing new - and I really mean nothing. It is close to get SC Ghost or the Warcraft Adventure feel when looking at the released material - so far it would clearly be the least sexy product they have ever released in my book. I look at DIII and see a title that really can push the envelope if they do it right (and it looks like it). DIII can hardly take all their manpower though. This leads me to their next MMO. If I am to bet (and people on these Boards normally bash me since I have been pretty critical to WoW since the release of TBC) I think their next MMO will take us by surprise when it is announced. My reasoning is that Blizzard's next MMO will cannibilize on WoW - alot. Given that, they will most likely announce the title VERY late in the development cycle. I would even go as far as betting that it will be released within 24months since I am not convinced WoW can take another 'been there, done that' expansion - especially after having faced Arthas. Arthas is really the natural end of the WoW life-cycle (WoW will ofc remain with servers etc after this but any expansion after Northrend will be bland by definition - on the other hand TBC was a joke lore wise so they might pull off something).
I agree with the OP when it comes to WoW right now. However, the creative recruitments they have done (Andy Chambers from GW was brilliant as an example) shows that they have a core team that most likely is working alot with game design that is much more creative than what TBC and WotLK has shown. Looking at the titles at hand I see SC2 and see nothing new - and I really mean nothing. It is close to get SC Ghost or the Warcraft Adventure feel when looking at the released material - so far it would clearly be the least sexy product they have ever released in my book. I look at DIII and see a title that really can push the envelope if they do it right (and it looks like it). DIII can hardly take all their manpower though. This leads me to their next MMO. If I am to bet (and people on these Boards normally bash me since I have been pretty critical to WoW since the release of TBC) I think their next MMO will take us by surprise when it is announced. My reasoning is that Blizzard's next MMO will cannibilize on WoW - alot. Given that, they will most likely announce the title VERY late in the development cycle. I would even go as far as betting that it will be released within 24months since I am not convinced WoW can take another 'been there, done that' expansion - especially after having faced Arthas. Arthas is really the natural end of the WoW life-cycle (WoW will ofc remain with servers etc after this but any expansion after Northrend will be bland by definition - on the other hand TBC was a joke lore wise so they might pull off something).
If you can't see anything new in SC2 then you are just not looking hard enough. The parts where it looks the same are the parts that didn't require change. After original SC there wasn't an RTS of that style and quality, C&C was resurce gathering and base building but nowhere near the fidelity of SC.
Dawn of War, Company of heroes and couple others were an interesting evolution of the genre but that doesen't mean we have to completly abandon the old style.
Biggest changes are in the single player campaign structure and Battlenet. Change is ok, but not if the only reason for it is change itself. Alot of people, me included like the new squad based style, not dependant on macro, but I like that in single player, for multyplayer I seek more chalenge and macro is what gives me that.
D3 has some interesting aspects in it and D3 version of phasing sounds really fun, especially if they choose to implement something like that in their upcoming MMO.
You could be right about the next expansions for WoW, but not so much because they will be bland or becasue Blizzard lore guys couldn't come up with new interesting lore, but just because WoW will be live for such a long time by then and not many people will be left who could feel like it's something new and interesting. That's just natural for any form of entertainment.
I believe the new MMO will be like WoW, succesfull enough to breed oposition, regardless of it's style and setting, but nontheless can't wait to find out more about it. You are dead wrong on 24 months release window, maybe, and I mean just maybe an announcement, but release? That's just silly.
Comments
I agree with him on Legendary items, they should be like the new Bind on Account gear and level accordingly (not actually bound to an account but level as one of those) just make the drop rate not so big as for the Illidans blades.
Legendary should always stay legendary, regardless of your level.
Well this game has truely gone to shit in wotlk. I mean recycling towers and buildings is one thing but to have the main raid content be nothing but a recycled zone from 2 years ago is really pathetic. Everyone talks about blizzard and wow being greedy ect. Well activision-blizzard posted a quarterly LOSS of over 70 million so yeah wow makes money but the like many of these huge corporate giants they really are not in very good shape financially. Don't expect anything other than what you have been getting from wow. They will continue to produce as little as possible to keep the 11 million suckers hanging on waiting for the next crumb of content.
I have no problem with replacing my warglaives with another legendary once I get them, but a green item no matter what level it is should NEVER be better than a legendary weapon. As I said in my first post, I wouldn't even really mind if level 75+ epics were equal to them, but they're Legendary for a reason. They're supposed to rock no matter what. Blizzard has done this twice to us, and I'm just not gonna take it anymore. I spent months getting a hand of ragnaros for my paladin only to find out when TBC came out, greens were 2x as good as it. Now my rogue used greens from 70-76, then switched to epics. Legendary items should stay Legendary.
In the next expansion you're going to have people with ~40k hp and dealing ~30k damage a hit if Blizzard keeps their currently progression of stats from the last 2 expansions. It's just lost that feeling that my Tauren warrior with 5k hp was 'omg awesome'
Everything since the Burnng Crusade has been recycled content that people keep paying a monthly fee for. Blizzard definitely knows how to market games but they are far from an innovative bunch when it comes to mmos.
Personally I felt that after BC Blizzard were no longer providing value for money. There was far too much recycled content for my liking, they should have provided a more large scale expansion to the game itself rather than just mostly just adding new "maps". The game basically stayed exactly the same after BC, you could use the if it's not broke don't fix it arguement but I that's not good enough for me. In order for me keep paying them they would have needed to expand the actual game experience not just rehashed the vanila game with extra maps and not much else.
I agree about all the other big gaming companies that have been laid low by the test of time, it happens to them all eventually and new upstarts replace them as king of the hill. It will happen to Blizzard as well. Some people haven't been watching the game industry long enough to appreciate it but there are plenty of other companies that have sat on the throne that Blizzard now occupies, it is just keeping it warm for next developer. Blizzard has made some awesome games and people should be happy about that fact but realise at the same time that for a variety of reasons it's impossible to maintain such high standards forever.
You are definitely not giving EA enough credit. The curent war is between EA and Activision Blizzard. They are fighting tough battles on all fronts of the computer and console marktets.
------------------------------
"Capitalism is currently working as intended."
I sort of get what you mean by this, but the thing to remember is that most of those patches from original release to BC were adding content that we now take for granted like Battlegrounds, honour systems, battlemasters, linked auction houses, improvements to levelling and so on. By the time we got to BC the basic structure of the game was pretty well complete and the development cycle switched to creating more content around that structure and tweaking it as required to fit that new content.
I have never really had a problem with the patch rate as it has always seemed to just 'fit' for the casual pace, which i always maintain that Blizzard aims at more so than anything else. The only time i would have an issue is if they were taking this amount of time and the patches were released bugged to the hilt.
Well back in BC days the major patches 1-4, really only 4 added a lot to the game. Patch 2.1 was Black Temple, which really meant BC was now where it should of been at release (Illidan was in the cinematic but not ingame at release). The next patch added Voice Chat, which got a luke-warm at best reception from the players. I never read anything about players asking for this, as most people use ventrilo or teamspeak. Zul'aman in 2.3 really just added one 10-man post kara instance. Plopping it in the blood elf lowbie lands probably wasn't the best idea either. At least with 2.4 we got a whole island, numerous dailies on and off that island, two new instances (5/25 man), new badge vendors, and a completion of the main storyline.
They really need to step up the development of free content. With their vast resources, this shouldn't be a problem unless there is something internal in the company we are not aware of. Also, I don't think that all new content should only cater to 80's or pvp. Adding more under 60 content would encourge people to dust off lowbie alts or make a new character altogether.
The Burning Crusade - RUINED THE GAME INTO CRAPPY CAREBEAR & ESPORT CRAP GAME, They removed the PVP rank system There whas simply nothing to do for an goal minded player anymore, who dosnt care about raiding og multidueling.
Wrath of the Lich King - GAME FIX, GAME IS ENJOYABLE AND FUN AGAIN. The achevement system atleast gives something to do for a goal minded player.
same goes with wow-europes lack of costumer support, but it seems to have become better after they moved it to blizzards homepage.
Well right there you are wrong. Blizzard hasn't been the biggest star for the last 3-4 years, they have been the biggest star for the last 16 years. Timeline for those who have forgotten is below. Sure, they continue to go back to the well with Warcraft, Starcraft and Diablo, but why not? People are dieing to get their hands on those games, should Blizzard just ignore all their fans? Sorry, but Blizzard doesn't do that. Blizzard lives and dies with it's fans. It's one of the reasons they have continued to be successful 16 years later. Now if you're right that they can't come up with anything other than Diablo, Warcraft or Starcraft in the future it will be a shame, but I got a feeling that Blizzard is about to announce a new IP and a new beginning to a long standing franchise. I'm actually quite excited to see what the future brings.
The Lost Vikings 1992
Rock N' Roll Racing 1993
Shanghai II: Dragon's Eye 1994
Blackthorne 1994
The Death and Return of Superman 1994
Warcraft: Orcs & Humans 1994
The Lost Vikings II 1995
Justice League Task Force 1995
Warcraft II: Tides of Darkness 1995
Warcraft II: Beyond the Dark Portal 1996
Diablo 1996
StarCraft 1998
StarCraft: Brood War 1998
Warcraft II: Battle.net Edition 1999
Diablo II 2000
Diablo II: Lord of Destruction 2001
Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos 2002
Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne 2003
World of Warcraft 2004
World of Warcraft: The Burning Crusade 2007
World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Lich King 2008
A lot of people here are talking about re-cycled content. Really the only thing i can think of as being re-cycled is Naxx itself. There was also an explanation of why they did this. Was quite a while back now but the gist of it was that approx. 0.2% of ALL players at the time Naxxramas was first out had seen inside it let alone kill KT at the end.
It was placed there by Blizzard as an intentional stop to the hardcore raiders who had finished AQ40 and would have a long wait before TBC came out.
There idea was that it would be so impossiby hard that it would keep the hardcore interested long enough for them to finish the first expansion. It was never meant to be finished/seen by the majority of players. It is for this reason that they brought it back in WotLK along with the fact that it fitted into the lore.
People were clamouring to see the place. People who started playing during TBC would hear about this magical dungeon Naxxrama which needed 40 players and about 200g worth of consumables to get past just the first wing (And this is before dailies etc when gold wasn't easy to find).
I myself had never seen the place apart from a quick zerg through the construct wing at level 70 where we STILL managed to die when we tried Thaddius.
Oh well.It will always be just one persons opinion v anothers with no one willing to budge.
Thanks T
"The problem with the French is that they don't have a word for entrepreneur." -George W. Bush, discussing the decline of the French economy with British Prime Minister Tony Blair
What is this Blizzard standard. Blizzard specializes in simple and generic. As for the remark if you don't think WOW is great quality you should leave MMORPG that is crap. WOW is not high quality. It is simply a MMO released at the right time feeding off of a popular franchise. The game does nothing innovative and has become so big that new MMOs coming out fail solely on the bases that most players have just become too use to WOW. That being said I do like Diablo a lot but thats about it from them.
First of all speculating as to how much manpower it takes to produce content is, well, retarded. They're working on diablo 3 and Starcraft 2 while simultaniously patching and working on expansions for WoW.
Also have you not read about their new MMO IP that they've been working on?
Originally posted by GTwander:
How are you an MMO? Or any of us for that matter?
I say we strike all users from the site for not being MMOs.
First of all speculating as to how much manpower it takes to produce content is, well, retarded. They're working on diablo 3 and Starcraft 2 while simultaniously patching and working on expansions for WoW.
Also have you not read about their new MMO IP that they've been working on?
You are right that its dumb to speculate on manpower but I think the point thats coming out of that is WOW so thoroughly beats every other MMO and earns so much money from subscriptions that the fact another MMO can release patches as often as WOW and pale in cash flow seems a little odd. They are working on other stuff but with the money they're making working on the other titles while updating more often in WOW should be easy.
I think you're right on that, but to that extent I would make the argument of quality over quantity (in the general sense). But as it pertains to WoW specifically I would say, yeah a lot of content has been breezed through far too easily and there needs to be more difficult quality content developed a bit faster.
Originally posted by GTwander:
How are you an MMO? Or any of us for that matter?
I say we strike all users from the site for not being MMOs.
Off topic but I love the Khorne symbol. Shame WAR is not doing so hot. Waiting for the wet dream when 40k could work as an MMO.
Haha, yeah I hear ya. I think WAR really dropped the ball in not letting the chaos faction choose their specific faction. On top of that calling a game WAR and not having Khorne, the blood god, that only loves war and death, not be the representativeative faction for the army of chaos? Wtf, that's some bull.
Originally posted by GTwander:
How are you an MMO? Or any of us for that matter?
I say we strike all users from the site for not being MMOs.
First of all speculating as to how much manpower it takes to produce content is, well, retarded. They're working on diablo 3 and Starcraft 2 while simultaniously patching and working on expansions for WoW.
Also have you not read about their new MMO IP that they've been working on?
You are right that its dumb to speculate on manpower but I think the point thats coming out of that is WOW so thoroughly beats every other MMO and earns so much money from subscriptions that the fact another MMO can release patches as often as WOW and pale in cash flow seems a little odd. They are working on other stuff but with the money they're making working on the other titles while updating more often in WOW should be easy.
I think that really hits the truth.
Other MMO's have less subs, therefore less income, yet turn out more free content than WoW. Some of WoW's "major" patchers weren't even that major (patch 2.2). They are nickel and diming us with paid name changes, character recustomization, autenticators, etc. Now *I* don't need or use those services but I'm sure the moment that Fanboi Bob got the chance to change his race/sex he forked up money and did it. Now do other games have paid name change or server transfer features? Yes they do. Do they charge as much as Blizzard? No they don't.
Yes other MMO's have less subs, but that doesn't follow that pro-rata they have less income as it depends on the costs they have involved in running/maintaining their services. I hear people harp on about all the free content that EVE brings out for their members, but they also charge almost 50% more a month for their subscription too (£8.99 for wow, £13.20 for EVE), so in fact i would actually end up paying more for my eve subscription with "free" expansions that i would for my WOW sub and paying for expansions, go figure!!!
As for the 'nickel & diming' thing, well do they charge for services, yes they do, but do you have to buy those services, well no you don't.
Activision/Blizzard can only make as much money as people are willing to hand over, no-one is forced at gunpoint to spend their money and as long as they see value in Blizzards services and continue to pay for them, why should Blizzard make any changes at all??
It must be Thursday, i never could get the hang of Thursdays.
When you are selling 30 times as much as the competitions you do make most money. And the percentage of the running costs get lower when you have millions of players instead of a few 100K. It is always cheaper to buy a lot of stuff instead of a few (counting the price for a single unit of course).
Still it is possible that Eve earn more money than Wow for a single user, maybe even twice the ammount.
But I don't see any reason for Blizzard to change their rutines right now either, they are making loads of cash. Why kill the goose that lays golden eggs?
Its been 10 years since the last Starcraft game and 8 years since the last Diablo game, its time for a welcome return to these world IMHO & millions agree. Dont forget the millions who have never played the oringinal SC and Diablo.
Blizzard could easily of sub contracted sequels for SC and Diablo and waited for the cash to roll in.. or even sold the rights out of to a faceless developer/publisher many years ago.
I like that I know who runs Blizzard they have a human face and thats good.
If you want an example of a souless game that once had soul until greed took over look at c&c and tomb raider .. great games but far to many expansions and versions.
WoW is a huge hit, far bigger than even Blizzard hoped and I think for a long time Blizzard were lost , no doubt they had plans for new games, maybe even getting SC2/D3 out sooner but that all changed as they had to roll with WoW .. millions of people to keep happy and a great revenue stream they would be fools to pass up.
Only now they are back on track, starcraft 2 this year, Diablo 3 next year and maybe even the new MMO the year after 2011 =D
I agree with the OP when it comes to WoW right now. However, the creative recruitments they have done (Andy Chambers from GW was brilliant as an example) shows that they have a core team that most likely is working alot with game design that is much more creative than what TBC and WotLK has shown.
Looking at the titles at hand I see SC2 and see nothing new - and I really mean nothing. It is close to get SC Ghost or the Warcraft Adventure feel when looking at the released material - so far it would clearly be the least sexy product they have ever released in my book. I look at DIII and see a title that really can push the envelope if they do it right (and it looks like it). DIII can hardly take all their manpower though. This leads me to their next MMO. If I am to bet (and people on these Boards normally bash me since I have been pretty critical to WoW since the release of TBC) I think their next MMO will take us by surprise when it is announced. My reasoning is that Blizzard's next MMO will cannibilize on WoW - alot. Given that, they will most likely announce the title VERY late in the development cycle. I would even go as far as betting that it will be released within 24months since I am not convinced WoW can take another 'been there, done that' expansion - especially after having faced Arthas. Arthas is really the natural end of the WoW life-cycle (WoW will ofc remain with servers etc after this but any expansion after Northrend will be bland by definition - on the other hand TBC was a joke lore wise so they might pull off something).
StarCraft2 could be a span of 3 years
BlizzCon 2008: Starcraft 2 trilogy could span three years
www.thegeekmedia.com/entertainment/games/blizzcon-2008-starcraft-2-trilogy-could-span-three-years
EQ2 fan sites
If you can't see anything new in SC2 then you are just not looking hard enough. The parts where it looks the same are the parts that didn't require change. After original SC there wasn't an RTS of that style and quality, C&C was resurce gathering and base building but nowhere near the fidelity of SC.
Dawn of War, Company of heroes and couple others were an interesting evolution of the genre but that doesen't mean we have to completly abandon the old style.
Biggest changes are in the single player campaign structure and Battlenet. Change is ok, but not if the only reason for it is change itself. Alot of people, me included like the new squad based style, not dependant on macro, but I like that in single player, for multyplayer I seek more chalenge and macro is what gives me that.
D3 has some interesting aspects in it and D3 version of phasing sounds really fun, especially if they choose to implement something like that in their upcoming MMO.
You could be right about the next expansions for WoW, but not so much because they will be bland or becasue Blizzard lore guys couldn't come up with new interesting lore, but just because WoW will be live for such a long time by then and not many people will be left who could feel like it's something new and interesting. That's just natural for any form of entertainment.
I believe the new MMO will be like WoW, succesfull enough to breed oposition, regardless of it's style and setting, but nontheless can't wait to find out more about it. You are dead wrong on 24 months release window, maybe, and I mean just maybe an announcement, but release? That's just silly.
more like late 2010
if its anything like the previous expansions which each took around 2 years
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_Warcraft
The Burning Crusade, was released on January 16, 2007
Wrath of the Lich King, was released on November 13, 2008
if you want to call it exact -- WOTLK took 22 months to release after BC
EQ2 fan sites