One hard raid does not make a game hardcore. WoW holds virtually no challenge until you get to the last raid. WoW has near no risk at all. WoWs game world is solo centric. So no WoW is not a hardcore game.
FAIL all over. Take the RAiD achievements: only 1% of Raiders have the top Raider titles and achievements.
And PvP gear in WotLK is based on a rated chess like ladder competition.
Meaning the best PvP weapons can only be gained at 1850 rating. Meaning the only best pvp players can have them.
... the title of Deadly Gladiator and achievement is ONLY awarded to the best player of 20 clustered servers.
That is the best out of a ... 200.000 players.
----- > If that is not a hardcore COMPETITION than nothing is hardcore.
Wow trolls always loose against Blizzard.
You should know that.
There is no need to accuse him of Trolling, hes merely stating his opinion, hes not seeking a hostile response you just gave him one anyway.
The fluff at the end doesn't make a game "hardcore"
Giving titles to people who are really good at the game, does not make it hard core.
Making only the BEST gear available to the BEST players does not make it hard core when that gear is just as good as PvE raid gear that is easily obtained by people who even barely contributed.
Again the word hardcore is objective but in most people's mind I imagine it would be difficult to progress, not just difficult to get the BEST.
Zorn and I have history, its ok were always hostile twords eachother lol.
One hard raid does not make a game hardcore. WoW holds virtually no challenge until you get to the last raid. WoW has near no risk at all. WoWs game world is solo centric. So no WoW is not a hardcore game.
FAIL all over. Take the RAiD achievements: only 1% of Raiders have the top Raider titles and achievements.
And PvP gear in WotLK is based on a rated chess like ladder competition.
Meaning the best PvP weapons can only be gained at 1850 rating. Meaning the only best pvp players can have them.
... the title of Deadly Gladiator and achievement is ONLY awarded to the best player of 20 clustered servers.
That is the best out of a ... 200.000 players.
----- > If that is not a hardcore COMPETITION than nothing is hardcore.
Wow trolls always loose against Blizzard.
You should know that.
Just so I can see where your really coming from have you ever even played any other MMOs???
Originally posted by redhands123 lol EXACTLY! A hardcore game would scare the shit out of people with its super harsh death penalties / ganking / SUPER un-user-friendly gameplay / difficult combat thrown in there for good measure.
It would also scare the shit out of any company potentially interested in financing such a game. I dont disagree that something like this would be fun, but I think its ultimately impossible in this market to make a decent hardcore game and maintain the subs to keep it healthy.
Suggestion: If you want to play a hardcore game with harsh penalties and realistic combat situations, return to RPG roots and play you pen and paper RPG of choice. I like these because they have the fairest death penalty, permenant (unless someone drags your chopped up corpse to a cleric) As an added benefit, these games do not have subscription fees, you can even get all of the rules directly from the internet so you wont have to buy books.
Originally posted by redhands123 lol EXACTLY! A hardcore game would scare the shit out of people with its super harsh death penalties / ganking / SUPER un-user-friendly gameplay / difficult combat thrown in there for good measure.
It would also scare the shit out of any company potentially interested in financing such a game. I dont disagree that something like this would be fun, but I think its ultimately impossible in this market to make a decent hardcore game and maintain the subs to keep it healthy.
Suggestion: If you want to play a hardcore game with harsh penalties and realistic combat situations, return to RPG roots and play you pen and paper RPG of choice. I like these because they have the fairest death penalty, permenant (unless someone drags your chopped up corpse to a cleric) As an added benefit, these games do not have subscription fees, you can even get all of the rules directly from the internet so you wont have to buy books.
Yeah my friend recently started playing NWN2 again and he wasnt really into it before.
I've got an eye out for Mortal Online it just sucks that DFO just came out giving the concept of Sandbox a bad name.
WoW is the complete opposite of what you consider a "Hardcore MMO".
No death penalty, death has no meaning
WoW has a death penalty, just just a very light one... run back to corpse and take a 10% durability hit... which is just money, and money equal time. No risk
Technically there is no risk in any game... because it's a game. Instances, the cancer of MMOs. You get your own private little dungeon where you can kill the boss in peace. No fighting over bosses, no PKing to compete for dungeon bosses and their loot.
I never will understand this mentality, why someone would want to fight over boss spawns.
Just makes the game less enjoyable to me.
That being said, it was kinda fun fighting off the alliance, while trying to take down that world raid boss, in Aszura (that blue dragon)...
I didn't NEED to kill that dragon, I just wanted too... If I needed him, fighting off the alliance wouldn't have been as fun. Instanced, consensual PvP, where you choose to PvP if you want.
OK I'll give you this... BGs killed World PvP. Why can't I kill whoever I want? That other Orc is a little 7 year old, and he's telling me he fucked my mom, now he's stealing my kills. Wait, WHAT!? I can't kill him? He's on my team!?! Let me fucking kill whoever I want if I wish!
RvR is the style of PvP I prefer, giving me a set group of enemies and set group of "friends".
Tho, yea there are times, I wish I could attack, those on my own side just becausing they are being asshats.
Anyway hardcore game can be PvE only too... It doesn't need PvP to be hardcore
WoW, did have some hardcore raids, back in classic and TBC, but WotLK has been more what I call semi-casual.
Not really Hardcore... but not completely casual either.
I had people call me hardcore, because I use play for like 4 to 6 hours a day, and on my weekends I'd would play 8 to 12 hours a day... I was like "I just play alot, that doesn't make me hardcore"...
Zorn will always try to prove his point by pointing out how many people actually play WoW. Hell zorn is defending Instanced pvp, god damn Arena and calling it hardcore because it has a cash prize lol! I's pathetic really, WoW could be entirely a newb game and because people could win money it means all that shit doesnt count and wow is hardcore lol.
The topic was: is Wow a hardcore game?
And I proved it can be played as a hardcore game if you play it the hard way.
There is nothing harder than a human competition.
You constantly fight a loosing battle, because everyone knows this.
Every competition can be played hardcore, every game, every hobby, every passion.
Even Wow hate can be played hardcore. But you lack insight to play it like a pro. )))
All games are for hardcore gamers. You’d just have to spend enough time and focus on it to be one of the best players. The fallacy of the title is that it assumes only hardcore gamers can play WoW; which isn’t true. People play games because it’s fun. Some people get sucked into games for various reasons. People get sucked into WoW because of guilds and high replay value. It’s the same way CS is; substitute clans in place of guilds. There’s hardcore DoTA players even though it’s a specialized map inside of Warcraft 3. There’s also hardcore Warcraft 3 players who don’t bother with DoTA.
Hardcore gamers pick their games to play; the games don’t pick the players.
This whole hardcore gamer notion is a load of crap. I’m sorry, but a 10 year old girl who spends hour after hours feeding her horses or playing on webkinz is just as hardcore as the 15 year old boy who spends hour after hour playing a FPS.
Spoils of War - The quickest way of ending a war is to lose it.
Zorn will always try to prove his point by pointing out how many people actually play WoW. Hell zorn is defending Instanced pvp, god damn Arena and calling it hardcore because it has a cash prize lol! I's pathetic really, WoW could be entirely a newb game and because people could win money it means all that shit doesnt count and wow is hardcore lol.
The topic was: is Wow a hardcore game?
And I proved it can be played as a hardcore game if you play it the hard way.
There is nothing harder than a human competition.
You constantly fight a loosing battle, because everyone knows this.
Every competition can be played hardcore, every game, every hobby, every passion.
Even Wow hate can be played hardcore. But you lack insight to play it like a pro. )))
Anygame can be played Hardcore.
Hell I could DL and load up hellokitty online and play it all day.
One hard raid does not make a game hardcore. WoW holds virtually no challenge until you get to the last raid. WoW has near no risk at all. WoWs game world is solo centric. So no WoW is not a hardcore game.
FAIL all over. Take the RAiD achievements: only 1% of Raiders have the top Raider titles and achievements.
And PvP gear in WotLK is based on a rated chess like ladder competition.
Meaning the best PvP weapons can only be gained at 1850 rating. Meaning the only best pvp players can have them.
... the title of Deadly Gladiator and achievement is ONLY awarded to the best player of 20 clustered servers.
That is the best out of a ... 200.000 players.
----- > If that is not a hardcore COMPETITION than nothing is hardcore.
Wow trolls always loose against Blizzard.
You should know that.
Is this kid for real?
Not many people in this thread have played WoW arena much so i will tell you how much this guy exaggerated it and has probably never played past 2200.
First of all the PvP gear in WotLK is only able to be bought with people with a decent rating. However 3 pieces are also dropped by the easiest pve boss in the game that you will have hard time finding a pug that wont beat him.
The Best pvp weapons can only be gained at 1850 rating, however this does not mean only the BEST pvp players can get them. 1850 is quite frankly a joke to get if you have any time to play at all as you will face mainly keyboard turning clickers up till that point. And many people simply pay money to decent players to carry them to that rating so it really means nothing at all.
The title Deadly gladiator is only awarded to the best player of 20 clustered servers? Okay let me tell you how this works, basically the person with the highest rating gets the title obviously, but everyone knows the BEST players never face eachother if they happen to the losing team just stops queing for arena for the night, and most teams just que in the middle of the night to farm noob teams and just raise there rating above everyone elses.
That is a best of 200,000 players but the fact is 199,900 of them suck hardcore.
Hardcore competition? I hit 2300 in arena BEFORE WOTLK when they added the easy mode rating system where you gain 20 points if you win and lose 1 point when you lose. And i can honestly tell you how it went, I que for a game i meet noobs in the 1500's(what rating your team starts at) for like 20 games in a row winning 1 point each. Then i meet a 2200 team and we faceroll them and take 10 points and then we never see them again because they know we are queing again and we will probably face eachother as we are the only two teams high ranked queing at the time. Then we go back to stomping scrubs for a few hours till were bored.
ITs only hardcore if you stand to lose something....There is nothing to lose in WoW.......If you cant beat a raid encounter, so what?? Its not like you suffered a severe death penalty or anything......
Instead of saying the arguments are flawed ( I wont even mention childish) why dont you give some insight? It will not be fair to remark something childish without giving counter arguments.
I find zorn's comments are resonable though not wholly agreeable.
Yes I think Hardcore people can play WOW. I am sure there are Firemen, Policemen, Military personel all playing the game. Those are the hardcores. If you are just playing a game and consider yourself to be hardcore because of how you play it. Your kidding yourself. There is no such thing as a hardcore player. they are just video games. That is my opinion.
Think you nailed it. Can't be hadcore in a game. Addicted probably but slaying more pixels than other people does not make you hard core.
Last time I checked, we are on MMORPG.com, and last time I checked everyone here should play MMOs quite a bit. So when talking about "hardcore" we are not referring to what we do outside of games, but what we do while playing games, specifically MMOs. So.. here you are wrong to make an accusation that slaying more in-game monsters is somehow not "hardcore", since that is what this website is meant to promote and be talked about.
If you think being in the military is hardcore, that's great, but this isn't a website about real-life personalities or anything of that nature, it's about MMOs and what happens in them. So when we talk about what is hardcore and what is not, it is relative to the MMO genre.
Yes I think Hardcore people can play WOW. I am sure there are Firemen, Policemen, Military personel all playing the game. Those are the hardcores. If you are just playing a game and consider yourself to be hardcore because of how you play it. Your kidding yourself. There is no such thing as a hardcore player. they are just video games. That is my opinion.
Think you nailed it. Can't be hadcore in a game. Addicted probably but slaying more pixels than other people does not make you hard core.
Last time I checked, we are on MMORPG.com, and last time I checked everyone here should play MMOs quite a bit. So when talking about "hardcore" we are not referring to what we do outside of games, but what we do while playing games, specifically MMOs. So.. here you are wrong to make an accusation that slaying more in-game monsters is somehow not "hardcore", since that is what this website is meant to promote and be talked about.
If you think being in the military is hardcore, that's great, but this isn't a website about real-life personalities or anything of that nature, it's about MMOs and what happens in them. So when we talk about what is hardcore and what is not, it is relative to the MMO genre.
A more unambiguous way of approach towards this is to define what is "hardcore" Are we talking about a human capabilities in playing a game? Or are we talking about a certain context?
Define hardcore in a mmo needs a benchmark. Are we going to use EQ? WoW? UO? Some will argue EQ is more hardcore than WoW, however some will say WoW is simply more advance in time compared to EQ and thus incapable to compare "hardcoreness"
It is like saying a horse carriage and an automobile. Horse carriage driver will say they are much more hardcore compared to auto mobile driver, is it a fair comment?
Yes I think Hardcore people can play WOW. I am sure there are Firemen, Policemen, Military personel all playing the game. Those are the hardcores. If you are just playing a game and consider yourself to be hardcore because of how you play it. Your kidding yourself. There is no such thing as a hardcore player. they are just video games. That is my opinion.
Think you nailed it. Can't be hadcore in a game. Addicted probably but slaying more pixels than other people does not make you hard core.
Last time I checked, we are on MMORPG.com, and last time I checked everyone here should play MMOs quite a bit. So when talking about "hardcore" we are not referring to what we do outside of games, but what we do while playing games, specifically MMOs. So.. here you are wrong to make an accusation that slaying more in-game monsters is somehow not "hardcore", since that is what this website is meant to promote and be talked about.
If you think being in the military is hardcore, that's great, but this isn't a website about real-life personalities or anything of that nature, it's about MMOs and what happens in them. So when we talk about what is hardcore and what is not, it is relative to the MMO genre.
A more unambiguous way of approach towards this is to define what is "hardcore" Are we talking about a human capabilities in playing a game? Or are we talking about a certain context?
Define hardcore in a mmo needs a benchmark. Are we going to use EQ? WoW? UO? Some will argue EQ is more hardcore than WoW, however some will say WoW is simply more advance in time compared to EQ and thus incapable to compare "hardcoreness"
It is like saying a horse carriage and an automobile. Horse carriage driver will say they are much more hardcore compared to auto mobile driver, is it a fair comment?
My post was not in any attempt to define or say what hardcore is, but rather to explain that just because you are a military officer, does not make you hardcore on a website made for MMOs. I was just saying you can't say that some guy who plays MMOs all day is not hardcore, when in fact we are on a site dedicated to them.
To me, WoW is not hardcore, it is far too easy to do anything, except maybe a few achievements. I would say EQ is more hardcore, and to say it's not as advanced as WoW, we need to remember WoW is five years old. What is hardcore? To me, it is doing things that take extensive time and effort.. but how extensive? It is a tricky question and as you pointed out will vary from person to person, which is why words like hardcore, sandbox, etc. are really poor to use and are used way too loosely.
Instead of labeling things as Sandbox or Hardcore, we should just talk about the features. However, to say WoW is or is not hardcore, I don't think is an argument. It had well-made hardcore elements in endgame raiding pre-BC and even to an extent in BC. If you want to explain to me how WoW is hardcore, I'll listen, but I doubt I'll be convinced.
Yes I think Hardcore people can play WOW. I am sure there are Firemen, Policemen, Military personel all playing the game. Those are the hardcores. If you are just playing a game and consider yourself to be hardcore because of how you play it. Your kidding yourself. There is no such thing as a hardcore player. they are just video games. That is my opinion.
Think you nailed it. Can't be hadcore in a game. Addicted probably but slaying more pixels than other people does not make you hard core.
Last time I checked, we are on MMORPG.com, and last time I checked everyone here should play MMOs quite a bit. So when talking about "hardcore" we are not referring to what we do outside of games, but what we do while playing games, specifically MMOs. So.. here you are wrong to make an accusation that slaying more in-game monsters is somehow not "hardcore", since that is what this website is meant to promote and be talked about.
If you think being in the military is hardcore, that's great, but this isn't a website about real-life personalities or anything of that nature, it's about MMOs and what happens in them. So when we talk about what is hardcore and what is not, it is relative to the MMO genre.
A more unambiguous way of approach towards this is to define what is "hardcore" Are we talking about a human capabilities in playing a game? Or are we talking about a certain context?
Define hardcore in a mmo needs a benchmark. Are we going to use EQ? WoW? UO? Some will argue EQ is more hardcore than WoW, however some will say WoW is simply more advance in time compared to EQ and thus incapable to compare "hardcoreness"
It is like saying a horse carriage and an automobile. Horse carriage driver will say they are much more hardcore compared to auto mobile driver, is it a fair comment?
My post was not in any attempt to define or say what hardcore is, but rather to explain that just because you are a military officer, does not make you hardcore on a website made for MMOs. I was just saying you can't say that some guy who plays MMOs all day is not hardcore, when in fact we are on a site dedicated to them.
To me, WoW is not hardcore, it is far too easy to do anything, except maybe a few achievements. I would say EQ is more hardcore, and to say it's not as advanced as WoW, we need to remember WoW is five years old. What is hardcore? To me, it is doing things that take extensive time and effort.. but how extensive? It is a tricky question and as you pointed out will vary from person to person, which is why words like hardcore, sandbox, etc. are really poor to use and are used way too loosely.
Instead of labeling things as Sandbox or Hardcore, we should just talk about the features. However, to say WoW is or is not hardcore, I don't think is an argument. It had well-made hardcore elements in endgame raiding pre-BC and even to an extent in BC. If you want to explain to me how WoW is hardcore, I'll listen, but I doubt I'll be convinced.
No arguments here, talking about features has more substances than "hardcore"
Nobody has mentioned Darkfall yet? It's pretty hardcore IMO depending on your mindset. Free for all full loot means that you will lose everything equiped or in your inventory. Most people bring a good amount of items for raids which means dying will make most people pissed off unless they have lots of extras. Add the fact that you can be attacked anywhere in the game makes it more exciting.
WOW is casual at best. Everything is spoon feed and you can max level quickly then geek raid to get the silly gear. The game is made for kids and so its geared for kids making it easy. Some may call it "hardcore" but I doubt they have played many MMOs for comparison. Questing is cake and PvP is paltry. A game that has ZERO risk for the reward is not Hardcore. It has 12million players because its easy, not hardcore.
The Marines I have seen around the world have the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps! Eleanor Roosevelt, First Lady of the United States, 1945
Players whose first MMO was WoW probably think it is hardcore....Those of us that came from EQ, UO, and some of hte older games found it easy because it was alot easier than the games we came from......Its also hard to convince me that a game with no real death penalty is hardcore.......
Comments
FAIL all over. Take the RAiD achievements: only 1% of Raiders have the top Raider titles and achievements.
And PvP gear in WotLK is based on a rated chess like ladder competition.
Meaning the best PvP weapons can only be gained at 1850 rating. Meaning the only best pvp players can have them.
... the title of Deadly Gladiator and achievement is ONLY awarded to the best player of 20 clustered servers.
That is the best out of a ... 200.000 players.
----- > If that is not a hardcore COMPETITION than nothing is hardcore.
Wow trolls always loose against Blizzard.
You should know that.
There is no need to accuse him of Trolling, hes merely stating his opinion, hes not seeking a hostile response you just gave him one anyway.
The fluff at the end doesn't make a game "hardcore"
Giving titles to people who are really good at the game, does not make it hard core.
Making only the BEST gear available to the BEST players does not make it hard core when that gear is just as good as PvE raid gear that is easily obtained by people who even barely contributed.
Again the word hardcore is objective but in most people's mind I imagine it would be difficult to progress, not just difficult to get the BEST.
Zorn and I have history, its ok were always hostile twords eachother lol.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
FAIL all over. Take the RAiD achievements: only 1% of Raiders have the top Raider titles and achievements.
And PvP gear in WotLK is based on a rated chess like ladder competition.
Meaning the best PvP weapons can only be gained at 1850 rating. Meaning the only best pvp players can have them.
... the title of Deadly Gladiator and achievement is ONLY awarded to the best player of 20 clustered servers.
That is the best out of a ... 200.000 players.
----- > If that is not a hardcore COMPETITION than nothing is hardcore.
Wow trolls always loose against Blizzard.
You should know that.
Just so I can see where your really coming from have you ever even played any other MMOs???
No more than any other game. It is whatever you make it.
It would also scare the shit out of any company potentially interested in financing such a game. I dont disagree that something like this would be fun, but I think its ultimately impossible in this market to make a decent hardcore game and maintain the subs to keep it healthy.
Suggestion: If you want to play a hardcore game with harsh penalties and realistic combat situations, return to RPG roots and play you pen and paper RPG of choice. I like these because they have the fairest death penalty, permenant (unless someone drags your chopped up corpse to a cleric) As an added benefit, these games do not have subscription fees, you can even get all of the rules directly from the internet so you wont have to buy books.
It would also scare the shit out of any company potentially interested in financing such a game. I dont disagree that something like this would be fun, but I think its ultimately impossible in this market to make a decent hardcore game and maintain the subs to keep it healthy.
Suggestion: If you want to play a hardcore game with harsh penalties and realistic combat situations, return to RPG roots and play you pen and paper RPG of choice. I like these because they have the fairest death penalty, permenant (unless someone drags your chopped up corpse to a cleric) As an added benefit, these games do not have subscription fees, you can even get all of the rules directly from the internet so you wont have to buy books.
Yeah my friend recently started playing NWN2 again and he wasnt really into it before.
I've got an eye out for Mortal Online it just sucks that DFO just came out giving the concept of Sandbox a bad name.
Anyway hardcore game can be PvE only too... It doesn't need PvP to be hardcore
WoW, did have some hardcore raids, back in classic and TBC, but WotLK has been more what I call semi-casual.
Not really Hardcore... but not completely casual either.
I had people call me hardcore, because I use play for like 4 to 6 hours a day, and on my weekends I'd would play 8 to 12 hours a day... I was like "I just play alot, that doesn't make me hardcore"...
The topic was: is Wow a hardcore game?
And I proved it can be played as a hardcore game if you play it the hard way.
There is nothing harder than a human competition.
You constantly fight a loosing battle, because everyone knows this.
Every competition can be played hardcore, every game, every hobby, every passion.
Even Wow hate can be played hardcore. But you lack insight to play it like a pro.
)))
All games are for hardcore gamers. You’d just have to spend enough time and focus on it to be one of the best players. The fallacy of the title is that it assumes only hardcore gamers can play WoW; which isn’t true. People play games because it’s fun. Some people get sucked into games for various reasons. People get sucked into WoW because of guilds and high replay value. It’s the same way CS is; substitute clans in place of guilds. There’s hardcore DoTA players even though it’s a specialized map inside of Warcraft 3. There’s also hardcore Warcraft 3 players who don’t bother with DoTA.
Hardcore gamers pick their games to play; the games don’t pick the players.
I suppose I should point out, that level 1 to the current level cap, is a casual playground, in WoW.
After that it can be hardcore-ish, if the player makes it that way.
EDIT:
See the post's above last line...
I agree with it.
Any game can be played hardcore, its the player that makes it so, or not so.
-
This whole hardcore gamer notion is a load of crap. I’m sorry, but a 10 year old girl who spends hour after hours feeding her horses or playing on webkinz is just as hardcore as the 15 year old boy who spends hour after hour playing a FPS.
Spoils of War - The quickest way of ending a war is to lose it.
The topic was: is Wow a hardcore game?
And I proved it can be played as a hardcore game if you play it the hard way.
There is nothing harder than a human competition.
You constantly fight a loosing battle, because everyone knows this.
Every competition can be played hardcore, every game, every hobby, every passion.
Even Wow hate can be played hardcore. But you lack insight to play it like a pro.
)))
Anygame can be played Hardcore.
Hell I could DL and load up hellokitty online and play it all day.
But is WoW a hardcore game? no not at all.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
FAIL all over. Take the RAiD achievements: only 1% of Raiders have the top Raider titles and achievements.
And PvP gear in WotLK is based on a rated chess like ladder competition.
Meaning the best PvP weapons can only be gained at 1850 rating. Meaning the only best pvp players can have them.
... the title of Deadly Gladiator and achievement is ONLY awarded to the best player of 20 clustered servers.
That is the best out of a ... 200.000 players.
----- > If that is not a hardcore COMPETITION than nothing is hardcore.
Wow trolls always loose against Blizzard.
You should know that.
Is this kid for real?
Not many people in this thread have played WoW arena much so i will tell you how much this guy exaggerated it and has probably never played past 2200.
First of all the PvP gear in WotLK is only able to be bought with people with a decent rating. However 3 pieces are also dropped by the easiest pve boss in the game that you will have hard time finding a pug that wont beat him.
The Best pvp weapons can only be gained at 1850 rating, however this does not mean only the BEST pvp players can get them. 1850 is quite frankly a joke to get if you have any time to play at all as you will face mainly keyboard turning clickers up till that point. And many people simply pay money to decent players to carry them to that rating so it really means nothing at all.
The title Deadly gladiator is only awarded to the best player of 20 clustered servers? Okay let me tell you how this works, basically the person with the highest rating gets the title obviously, but everyone knows the BEST players never face eachother if they happen to the losing team just stops queing for arena for the night, and most teams just que in the middle of the night to farm noob teams and just raise there rating above everyone elses.
That is a best of 200,000 players but the fact is 199,900 of them suck hardcore.
Hardcore competition? I hit 2300 in arena BEFORE WOTLK when they added the easy mode rating system where you gain 20 points if you win and lose 1 point when you lose. And i can honestly tell you how it went, I que for a game i meet noobs in the 1500's(what rating your team starts at) for like 20 games in a row winning 1 point each. Then i meet a 2200 team and we faceroll them and take 10 points and then we never see them again because they know we are queing again and we will probably face eachother as we are the only two teams high ranked queing at the time. Then we go back to stomping scrubs for a few hours till were bored.
ITs only hardcore if you stand to lose something....There is nothing to lose in WoW.......If you cant beat a raid encounter, so what?? Its not like you suffered a severe death penalty or anything......
Honor Titles over rank 10 pre BC was hardcore.
Instead of saying the arguments are flawed ( I wont even mention childish) why dont you give some insight? It will not be fair to remark something childish without giving counter arguments.
I find zorn's comments are resonable though not wholly agreeable.
Think you nailed it. Can't be hadcore in a game. Addicted probably but slaying more pixels than other people does not make you hard core.
Last time I checked, we are on MMORPG.com, and last time I checked everyone here should play MMOs quite a bit. So when talking about "hardcore" we are not referring to what we do outside of games, but what we do while playing games, specifically MMOs. So.. here you are wrong to make an accusation that slaying more in-game monsters is somehow not "hardcore", since that is what this website is meant to promote and be talked about.
If you think being in the military is hardcore, that's great, but this isn't a website about real-life personalities or anything of that nature, it's about MMOs and what happens in them. So when we talk about what is hardcore and what is not, it is relative to the MMO genre.
Think you nailed it. Can't be hadcore in a game. Addicted probably but slaying more pixels than other people does not make you hard core.
Last time I checked, we are on MMORPG.com, and last time I checked everyone here should play MMOs quite a bit. So when talking about "hardcore" we are not referring to what we do outside of games, but what we do while playing games, specifically MMOs. So.. here you are wrong to make an accusation that slaying more in-game monsters is somehow not "hardcore", since that is what this website is meant to promote and be talked about.
If you think being in the military is hardcore, that's great, but this isn't a website about real-life personalities or anything of that nature, it's about MMOs and what happens in them. So when we talk about what is hardcore and what is not, it is relative to the MMO genre.
A more unambiguous way of approach towards this is to define what is "hardcore" Are we talking about a human capabilities in playing a game? Or are we talking about a certain context?
Define hardcore in a mmo needs a benchmark. Are we going to use EQ? WoW? UO? Some will argue EQ is more hardcore than WoW, however some will say WoW is simply more advance in time compared to EQ and thus incapable to compare "hardcoreness"
It is like saying a horse carriage and an automobile. Horse carriage driver will say they are much more hardcore compared to auto mobile driver, is it a fair comment?
Think you nailed it. Can't be hadcore in a game. Addicted probably but slaying more pixels than other people does not make you hard core.
Last time I checked, we are on MMORPG.com, and last time I checked everyone here should play MMOs quite a bit. So when talking about "hardcore" we are not referring to what we do outside of games, but what we do while playing games, specifically MMOs. So.. here you are wrong to make an accusation that slaying more in-game monsters is somehow not "hardcore", since that is what this website is meant to promote and be talked about.
If you think being in the military is hardcore, that's great, but this isn't a website about real-life personalities or anything of that nature, it's about MMOs and what happens in them. So when we talk about what is hardcore and what is not, it is relative to the MMO genre.
A more unambiguous way of approach towards this is to define what is "hardcore" Are we talking about a human capabilities in playing a game? Or are we talking about a certain context?
Define hardcore in a mmo needs a benchmark. Are we going to use EQ? WoW? UO? Some will argue EQ is more hardcore than WoW, however some will say WoW is simply more advance in time compared to EQ and thus incapable to compare "hardcoreness"
It is like saying a horse carriage and an automobile. Horse carriage driver will say they are much more hardcore compared to auto mobile driver, is it a fair comment?
My post was not in any attempt to define or say what hardcore is, but rather to explain that just because you are a military officer, does not make you hardcore on a website made for MMOs. I was just saying you can't say that some guy who plays MMOs all day is not hardcore, when in fact we are on a site dedicated to them.
To me, WoW is not hardcore, it is far too easy to do anything, except maybe a few achievements. I would say EQ is more hardcore, and to say it's not as advanced as WoW, we need to remember WoW is five years old. What is hardcore? To me, it is doing things that take extensive time and effort.. but how extensive? It is a tricky question and as you pointed out will vary from person to person, which is why words like hardcore, sandbox, etc. are really poor to use and are used way too loosely.
Instead of labeling things as Sandbox or Hardcore, we should just talk about the features. However, to say WoW is or is not hardcore, I don't think is an argument. It had well-made hardcore elements in endgame raiding pre-BC and even to an extent in BC. If you want to explain to me how WoW is hardcore, I'll listen, but I doubt I'll be convinced.
Think you nailed it. Can't be hadcore in a game. Addicted probably but slaying more pixels than other people does not make you hard core.
Last time I checked, we are on MMORPG.com, and last time I checked everyone here should play MMOs quite a bit. So when talking about "hardcore" we are not referring to what we do outside of games, but what we do while playing games, specifically MMOs. So.. here you are wrong to make an accusation that slaying more in-game monsters is somehow not "hardcore", since that is what this website is meant to promote and be talked about.
If you think being in the military is hardcore, that's great, but this isn't a website about real-life personalities or anything of that nature, it's about MMOs and what happens in them. So when we talk about what is hardcore and what is not, it is relative to the MMO genre.
A more unambiguous way of approach towards this is to define what is "hardcore" Are we talking about a human capabilities in playing a game? Or are we talking about a certain context?
Define hardcore in a mmo needs a benchmark. Are we going to use EQ? WoW? UO? Some will argue EQ is more hardcore than WoW, however some will say WoW is simply more advance in time compared to EQ and thus incapable to compare "hardcoreness"
It is like saying a horse carriage and an automobile. Horse carriage driver will say they are much more hardcore compared to auto mobile driver, is it a fair comment?
My post was not in any attempt to define or say what hardcore is, but rather to explain that just because you are a military officer, does not make you hardcore on a website made for MMOs. I was just saying you can't say that some guy who plays MMOs all day is not hardcore, when in fact we are on a site dedicated to them.
To me, WoW is not hardcore, it is far too easy to do anything, except maybe a few achievements. I would say EQ is more hardcore, and to say it's not as advanced as WoW, we need to remember WoW is five years old. What is hardcore? To me, it is doing things that take extensive time and effort.. but how extensive? It is a tricky question and as you pointed out will vary from person to person, which is why words like hardcore, sandbox, etc. are really poor to use and are used way too loosely.
Instead of labeling things as Sandbox or Hardcore, we should just talk about the features. However, to say WoW is or is not hardcore, I don't think is an argument. It had well-made hardcore elements in endgame raiding pre-BC and even to an extent in BC. If you want to explain to me how WoW is hardcore, I'll listen, but I doubt I'll be convinced.
No arguments here, talking about features has more substances than "hardcore"
Nobody has mentioned Darkfall yet? It's pretty hardcore IMO depending on your mindset. Free for all full loot means that you will lose everything equiped or in your inventory. Most people bring a good amount of items for raids which means dying will make most people pissed off unless they have lots of extras. Add the fact that you can be attacked anywhere in the game makes it more exciting.
come on guys, lets play some D&D. Real hardcore action, who will be the healer?
WOW played at top level is hardcore. I have a lvl 80 for about three months and can't do any raid yet, and not sure I will ever be able to, really.
WOW is casual at best. Everything is spoon feed and you can max level quickly then geek raid to get the silly gear. The game is made for kids and so its geared for kids making it easy. Some may call it "hardcore" but I doubt they have played many MMOs for comparison. Questing is cake and PvP is paltry. A game that has ZERO risk for the reward is not Hardcore. It has 12million players because its easy, not hardcore.
The Marines I have seen around the world have the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps!
Eleanor Roosevelt, First Lady of the United States, 1945
WoW has hardcore and casual players like every other mmo.
Players whose first MMO was WoW probably think it is hardcore....Those of us that came from EQ, UO, and some of hte older games found it easy because it was alot easier than the games we came from......Its also hard to convince me that a game with no real death penalty is hardcore.......