I would not advise it as a career field, even with the unemployment we're seeing....sure, Blackbeard and William Kidd were legends in their own time, and the whole yo ho ho and abottle of rum bit sounds like a good life, but you never hear how they died....If you do want to become a pirate, you have to be smarter than those bums in Somalia too. I suggest investing in some heavy weaponry, AA guns and anti-ship missles to scare off the navies of the world, then you could go to town in the more lawless segments of the globe.
Regardless of how wrong piracy is, it's just not going anywhere, it's just too popular. Stop blaming people for the industry and government's actions, nobody is forcing their crooked hands.
Who else to blame for anti-piracy measures if not the pirates themselves?
And who is forcing organizations like the RIAA and MPAA's hands when they try multiple things to curb piracy, but to no avail? There's endless examples. Another would be the MPAA's alliance with the founders/creators of BitTorrent years ago to ensure the technology be used legally; but the nature of the technology allows for public trackers no single company can control the entirity of.
So, would the MPAA be wrong if ever they sought help from the federal government to to target the technology, peer-to-peer pirates and the individual participants themselves? No, because those organizations have been made credible by years of pursuing this and that to curtail piracy, but to no avail, and thus it's easy for 'em to go to Washington and sell revenue losses and consequent impacts on our entire economy.
Piracy will never be left along as some overlooked past-time which some people seem to want. It's detriment is as real as the benefits of preventing and lowering piracy.
So there's a relatively peaceful way out of it (digital distribution, cloud computing, hardware upon which piracy is made difficult/impossible like consoles, Kindle, Zune), and there's a rather oppressive way out of it (the new intellectual property czar we're due to have; who's hands will stretch across a number of departments including the department of justice in all matters concerning intellectual property).
Piracy has dwindled and will continue to dwindle. Again, I just personally hope it does before its lawyers hired by the DOJ writing you instead of an ISP suspension.
For all the bravado some of you show in rampant piracy; its not like any of you are really brave enough to burn DVDs and stand outside of your local mall peddling pirated works. You're brave because you have that anonymity the internet affords, so if that anonymity remains a problem, what do you expect to happen to it?
Well I don't know if you've noticed lately, but you can't do hardly anything on the street these days, let alone "sell Pirated DVDs".
Your words emanate fascism.
Got a better word for it when the RIAA can go to Washington, get a bill passed virtually unimposed by either party creating a new Intellectual Property Enforcement Coordinator that reaches across multiple departments of our government? All against the wishes of the DOJ that felt they'd be undermined.
Like I said, the industry's lawyers and resources out, our government's lawyers and resources in.
You people that scream for blood and justice amuse me. Do you realize how many people would be jailed if they started cracking down like you want? Do you? There wouldn't be enough prisons in the world.
Furthermore, what I'm really tired of is the "Pirates Are Causing the Govt. To Make Bad Laws". Piracy is a changing of the times because people were tired of the old model. The industry isn't suffering as much as you claim it is.
Yet you all sit here and scold anybody that's downloaded.. like they're causing everything?
You all remind me of a mother who scolds a child after the father mercilessly beat the child, because she thinks it was the child's fault.
Regardless of how wrong piracy is, it's just not going anywhere, it's just too popular. Stop blaming people for the industry and government's actions, nobody is forcing their crooked hands.
--- If you're going to go so far as to believe the government has planned this all along and wanted it be freely available to give way for rightful excuses to pass legislation, then I think you people would realize that they also planned for people to hate eachother so they don't have to do the footwork. It's called divide and conquer.
Your logic is deeply flawed here. "It can't be wrong because everyone does it" is not a valid argument.
Nor is "piracy isn't wrong because you can't possibly punish all the people that do it."
Also, why do you assume I'm on the side of the industry? I LOATHE businesspeople that make a living by taking advantage of artists. I don't give a damn about the record company, I care about the ARTISTS that create the things we love in the first place.
And for the love of god would you PLEASE quit using the argument "I only pirate stuff that I wouldn't have been willing to pay for anyway...."
Are you KIDDING ME? Something that is so crappy you wouldn't buy you still apparently want to have??
That's like shoplifting ugly furniture to furnish your house with. Moronic.
Just admit it people... piracy is nothing more than the selfish, greedy, stupid side of human nature leading people to do unsavory things that end up hurting EVERYONE.
You can try to spin it any way you want, but that's the simple truth. Everything said to the contrary is rationalization.. you know it, and I know it.
And YES pirates are DIRECTLY responsible for the draconian DRM that makes everything such a pain in the ass.
And YES these whiny little twits are guilty of providing just the excuse that the govenment is going to use to obliterate privacy rights for everyone.
This argument will go on ad nauseam however, because this same group of people are almost certainly incapable of taking responsibility for anything.
deviliscious: (PS. I have been told that when I use scientific language, it does not make me sound more intelligent, it only makes me sound like a jackass. It makes me appear that I am not knowledgable enough in the subject I am discussing to be able to translate it for people outside the field to understand. Some advice you might consider as well)
Sorry chief, speaking out against criminal violation of peoples' rights isn't fascism.
Nor is someone telling you that you can't do whatever you want without regard for the rights of others.
deviliscious: (PS. I have been told that when I use scientific language, it does not make me sound more intelligent, it only makes me sound like a jackass. It makes me appear that I am not knowledgable enough in the subject I am discussing to be able to translate it for people outside the field to understand. Some advice you might consider as well)
And for the love of god would you PLEASE quit using the argument "I only pirate stuff that I wouldn't have been willing to pay for anyway...." Are you KIDDING ME? Something that is so crappy you wouldn't buy you still apparently want to have?? That's like shoplifting ugly furniture to furnish your house with. Moronic.
I don't see why that's so insane. I pirate shit all the time that I wouldn't have even considered buying. Like the Sims 3. I pirated the leaked version, just because I was bored that day and wanted to mess around with it for a little while. It's a boring, shitty rehash for the most part, but you can get about an hour or two of mindless entertainment from it before it gets stale and you uninstall it forever. If I had payed $50 for that, I'd feel ripped off. When it's free, though, it's easy to ignore what sucks about it and enjoy what doesn't.
I will concede that with any PC game (especially MMOs) I will never again purchase a game that doesn't offer a free trial.
Still no justification for piracy.
I also don't beleve that most people that find they really enjoy a pirated game or album will then go out and pay for a legit copy.
In the early days this was a built in safegueard for music, because tape reproductions were always lower quality than the original- this is no longer true with digital media.
deviliscious: (PS. I have been told that when I use scientific language, it does not make me sound more intelligent, it only makes me sound like a jackass. It makes me appear that I am not knowledgable enough in the subject I am discussing to be able to translate it for people outside the field to understand. Some advice you might consider as well)
I will pull furniture out of a skip to furnish my house with that I would never dream of buying.
Wanting something is not the same as placing value on something.
I'd never dream of renting a DVD for example. Let alone buying one, but if you gave me one I might well watch it.
I think Film and Video games is a slightly different ball game. Music is not expensive to produce. Video and movies games are.
While the standard production model is still clearly very profitable, I feel the writing is on the wall for them.
DvD rental stores are all going out of business. (Not being a service I have ever used, I'm not saddened by their departure).
Computer games are changing their revenue models, increasingly providing a service as well as a game. Online servers etc. They are also moving into digital distribution, taking out the whole outdated publisher and distributer factor.
Not sure where it will end for Hollywood, lower budget films I expect.
It will all end with us drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage.
Wages of selfishness.
The bottom line here is that piracy is dishonest, and dishonesty has consequences.
The difference between right and wrong seems to be lost on a lot of folks these days.
deviliscious: (PS. I have been told that when I use scientific language, it does not make me sound more intelligent, it only makes me sound like a jackass. It makes me appear that I am not knowledgable enough in the subject I am discussing to be able to translate it for people outside the field to understand. Some advice you might consider as well)
It will all end with us drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage. Wages of selfishness. The bottom line here is that piracy is dishonest, and dishonesty has consequences. The difference between right and wrong seems to be lost on a lot of folks these days.
Along with people losing their sense of right and wrong, I believe piracy also relates to people desire for material objects. Lots of people have holes in their life and are trying to fill them with shiny toys and cheap thrills.
When a piscating wizard floods every thread I can understand why people leave.
It will all end with us drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage. Wages of selfishness. The bottom line here is that piracy is dishonest, and dishonesty has consequences. The difference between right and wrong seems to be lost on a lot of folks these days.
While I can go with the dishonesty of piracy, although I am also inclined not to think of it as a very serious sin, file sharing certainly doesn't equate to theft as nothing is stolen.
I am unable to go with your whole drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage motif. I don't find low budget projects any more or less mediocre than high budget projects. It just strikes me that you perhaps have very poor taste or perhaps have had more a limited repertoire of material to base your opinions on. Perhaps you equate high budget only with good entertainment. I don't.
You want other people to feel morally obliged to sponsor the music you love. And if they don't, you wish to guilt them into it so that you can keep getting more of your favourite music without paying the whole cost you value it at yourself. Who is selfish now?
You think the music you love is worth more than the rest of us think it is. You think it's quality is dependant on how much money the people who make and publish it receive. The rest of us don't.
While I don't think the difference between right and wrong is lost on everyone, I think a tempered and porportional approach is clearly lost on you.
Piracy is not a crime. Like it or not.
Murder is a crime. Piracy isn't. It is at most a civil offence. But certainly not a criminal one and frankly it is laughable that anyone should wish to make it one.
Equally it is wrong not give up your seats to old people on the bus. And while you can be fined for not doing so, it is also not a crime. It's important to keep things in perspective.
Ultimately I feel it boils down to a sort of Dr Spock type moral dilemma where the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
It is far more moral for many poorer people to get access to cheaper entertainment than it is for a few rich people to make more millions selling the same entertainment. The anti-piracy movement is motivated on greed just as the piracy movement is. The question is, who's side are you on, the masses or the few? If you work in a publishing industry or wish to, I can see you choosing the side of self-intrest, if not, I can see you down with the masses of others who don't.
Either way selfishness is most peoples motivation on both sides of the argument.
It will all end with us drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage. Wages of selfishness. The bottom line here is that piracy is dishonest, and dishonesty has consequences. The difference between right and wrong seems to be lost on a lot of folks these days.
While I can go with the dishonesty of piracy, although I am also inclined not to think of it as a very serious sin, file sharing certainly doesn't equate to theft as nothing is stolen.
I am unable to go with your whole drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage motif. I don't find low budget projects any more or less mediocre than high budget projects. It just strikes me that you perhaps have very poor taste or perhaps have had more a limited repertoire of material to base your opinions on. Perhaps you equate high budget only with good entertainment. I don't.
You want other people to feel morally obliged to sponsor the music you love. And if they don't, you wish to guilt them into it so that you can keep getting more of your favourite music without paying the whole cost you value it at yourself. Who is selfish now?
You think the music you love is worth more than the rest of us think it is. You think it's quality is dependant on how much money the people who make and publish it receive. The rest of us don't.
While I don't think the difference between right and wrong is lost on everyone, I think a tempered and porportional approach is clearly lost on you.
Piracy is not a crime. Like it or not.
Murder is a crime. Piracy isn't. It is at most a civil offence. But certainly not a criminal one and frankly it is laughable that anyone should wish to make it one.
Equally it is wrong not give up your seats to old people on the bus. And while you can be fined for not doing so, it is also not a crime. It's important to keep things in perspective.
Ultimately I feel it boils down to a sort of Dr Spock type moral dilemma where the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
It is far more moral for many poorer people to get access to cheaper entertainment than it is for a few rich people to make more millions selling the same entertainment. The anti-piracy movement is motivated on greed just as the piracy movement is. The question is, who's side are you on, the masses or the few? If you work in a publishing industry or wish to, I can see you choosing the side of self-intrest, if not, I can see you down with the masses of others who don't.
Either way selfishness is most peoples motivation on both sides of the argument.
Piracy is a crime. It's against the law. What part of those statements do you not understand? Your trying to make yourself feel better for breaking the law by putting it up against murder.
There is a line. Right and wrong. Piracy is on the wrong no matter how close you think it might be to right.
If you can be fined for not giving up a seat because there is a law for that, its a crime.
It's hard to get more simple than that. If you can't understand that you need to go back to school.
When a piscating wizard floods every thread I can understand why people leave.
Originally posted by baff Piracy is not a crime. Like it or not. Murder is a crime. Piracy isn't. It is at most a civil offence. But certainly not a criminal one and frankly it is laughable that anyone should wish to make it one.
Of course piracy is a crime. What gave you the idea that it wasn't?
Furthermore, the anti-piracy organizations are winning. The Pirate Bay was cited as having as much as 50% of BitTorrent traffic; and only two or three other sites make up the rest of the majority of trackers filled with illegal content. There's no safe haven here in the US, it's just that the MPAA and RIAA had to go overseas to eliminate the biggest fish.
Despite the guys over there receiving millions of dollars of fines and a year jail sentence, the MPAA is appealing that decision in pursuit of even harsher sentencings: http://www.imdb.com/news/ni0795035/
So they're succeeding in the international arena as well as home with the Intellectual Property Enforcement Act that rolled out at the end of last year.
What the above means is that even where the MPAA, ESA and RIAA don't succeed (which they are), its now become the job of the Department of Justice's lawyers to go on the offensive when it comes to protecting copyrights. So from now on, we're basically paying taxes to fund the lawyers of those organizations; lawyers that are specifically tasked to both prosecute file sharers and recup losses for them.
Our government is their willful thug thanks to piracy runamuck.
But like I've said, this isn't the worst it can get. There's bigger threats like net neutrality being pushed to the wayside if it means companies like Comcast can throttle peer-to-peer technology when its detected, or even more drastic measures like censorship of our otherwise open web if our country resorted to blocking foreign sites like the Pirate Bay all together.
It's all very really and developing at a rapid pace. Like I've said myself though, I hope it ends with the big sites being taken down and kept down, and things end there 'til the next craze of piracy pops up; ideally not in a way so detrimental to the openness of the internet itself.
When you get a speeding ticket, you break the law, but you are not a criminal.
When you don't pay back your credit cards, you have acted illegally, you can be taken to court and succcessfully prosecuted, but you are not a criminal. When you call some one names in public without reason, you have acted illegally and can be sued for damages in court but you have not commited a crime.
Acting illegally does not make you a criminal. Commiting a crime does.
Piracy is not a crime. Not in any country in the world.
The advert at the start of the movie says "Piracy is Theft". It isn't.
When you get a speeding ticket, you break the law, but you are not a criminal. When you don't pay back your credit cards, you have acted illegally, you can be taken to court and succcessfully prosecuted, but you are not a criminal. When you call some one names in public without reason, you have acted illegally and can be sued for damages in court but you have not commited a crime. Acting illegally does not make you a criminal. Commiting a crime does.
Piracy is not a crime. Not in any country in the world.
The advert at the start of the movie says "Piracy is Theft". It isn't.
Yes, yes it is a crime.
Again, it's just that the anti-piracy organizations have focused on the companies enabling piracy moreso than the pirates themselves, because it's easier to target the four guys operating the Pirate Bay than their estimated tens of millions of users individually. The enablers are subject to different laws than the actual pirates.
You can get those that pick the fruit or you can study the roots. Copyright holders tend to do the latter, so even though measures like the NET Act and ART Act cover peer-to-peer file sharing of copyrighted works as theft punishable with prison terms and fines, law of averages is on your side since you're but one of tens of millions around the world participating in piracy and aren't really a group that's being targeted.
What you're doing is illegal and can land you in jail, it's just that no one is looking to put you there. Yet anyway, who knows now that it's the job of federal and state attorney's to enforce these laws; and there's no end of Intellectual Property and Copyright laws that cover this or that.
When you get a speeding ticket, you break the law, but you are not a criminal. When you don't pay back your credit cards, you have acted illegally, you can be taken to court and succcessfully prosecuted, but you are not a criminal. When you call some one names in public without reason, you have acted illegally and can be sued for damages in court but you have not commited a crime. Acting illegally does not make you a criminal. Commiting a crime does.
Piracy is not a crime. Not in any country in the world.
The advert at the start of the movie says "Piracy is Theft". It isn't.
If piracy and speeding aren't crimes why are people getting jail time for them on top of fines, I always thought jails were for criminals.
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8003799.stm as has been pointed out before the guys running pirate bay have gotten jail time, as well as fines that is a pretty harsh sentence for something that isn't a crime.
Simple fact of the matter is that it doesn't matter how we view it as individuals, it is how these acts are being used to gain control over EVERYBODIES access to information, these are not good things.
With all the bad movies these days with over used plots and themes, the ONLY way im ever going to watch them is from torrents. With games, very very few are being made these days for PC that are actually worth a damn. If the game needs a cd key i will glady buy it if it gets good reviews and looks like something i would like to play.
The people in the film industry already have millions and millions. Why do you want to make them richer? So they can get the gulfstream 5 with the surroundsound dvd player remote control? Why do they need more money.
Although, since we live (americans) in a democracy, where slowly our freedoms are being stripped away, i can see a world where net neutrality does not exist. I think piracy will be a thing of the past in the comming years. Thats why you gotta stockpile all the dvd rips %($*ing socialists.
Edit : Oh and when it comes to music, i could really careless about the music being produced these days. People rapping about making bad decisions with some funky beat, and some rock band using chord progression as the rhythem.. Terrible.. Only music i listen to is 70's led zeppelin and the doors, where actual guitar playing is needed to produce rythem and long solos, and not some idiot dressed up like a fool playing a 6 chord progression.
There's a really disturbing 3 Doors Down video called "Citizen Soldier", and it is literally just some over-dramatic Army recruitment music video. I find it quite ridiculous.. and I've spent 6 years in the Army, 3 years in Iraq. Needless to say, if "Hot Bands" are making Army recruitment videos, there may be a serious problem.
Edit:
If you watch the video on YouTube, note the obvious psychological methods of - "Dark and Foreboding Atmosphere, then.. Bam, Here Comes the Light, the Army!,, YAY! Cure your sadness, join the military."
Mainstream music and literal propaganda have become increasingly fuzzy to distinguish between each other these past few years. This kind of contributes to many people not giving two-shits about the record industry, among other things.
When you get a speeding ticket, you break the law, but you are not a criminal. When you don't pay back your credit cards, you have acted illegally, you can be taken to court and succcessfully prosecuted, but you are not a criminal. When you call some one names in public without reason, you have acted illegally and can be sued for damages in court but you have not commited a crime. Acting illegally does not make you a criminal. Commiting a crime does.
Piracy is not a crime. Not in any country in the world.
The advert at the start of the movie says "Piracy is Theft". It isn't.
And that makes it better? You are out of touch with reality.
When a piscating wizard floods every thread I can understand why people leave.
It's part of a cycle - the population (90%) is poor, so they by pirate material. That's bad for businesses, as selling videogames and games to a poor population that only (the few who can) buys the videogames (because they have to be original) and then only buys the pirate games, doesn't make enough profit, so they leave the country, which also eliminates direct and indirect jobs. The country loses money to the piracy and even the 10% "rich" suffer, as Sony and Microsoft, for example, restrict their online services for their videogames in South America, and thus Brazil.
And keep in mind that when talking to South Americans, the person is likely to not have enough education to really perceive that buying pirate products means to support indirectly the mafias and the drug trafficking, as the people who sell pirate products may also be taking part in other ILLEGAL activities.
When you get a speeding ticket, you break the law, but you are not a criminal. When you don't pay back your credit cards, you have acted illegally, you can be taken to court and succcessfully prosecuted, but you are not a criminal. When you call some one names in public without reason, you have acted illegally and can be sued for damages in court but you have not commited a crime. Acting illegally does not make you a criminal. Commiting a crime does.
Piracy is not a crime. Not in any country in the world.
The advert at the start of the movie says "Piracy is Theft". It isn't.
And that makes it better? You are out of touch with reality.
Yes mate, it makes it better.
Piracy is not theft.
There is no need to be extreme about everything.
There is a difference between wrong and very wrong. There is a difference between naughty and bad. There is a difference between bad and evil.
There is a difference between downloading a pirated copy and stealing the DVD from a shop. In first case, no one has lost anything. There person you downloaded the copy from still has his copy. In the second case the shop keeper is out of pocket for one DVD. The DVD he used to own is now gone.
In the first case, the copywright holder has not made any money on the pirated copy. He hasn't lost any either, but he hasn't made any and he would have liked to.
Is speeding really so immoral. No, it isn't. Most people do it because they recognise that when they do so they are not hurting anyone or at risk of doing so. They understand the rules, they understand why the rules exist, but they trust their own judgements more.
It's illegal, but it isn't criminal behaviour.
It's naughty, but it isn't bad.
Things should be kept in porportion.
There is a difference between illegal and criminal and if you can't see that, it is you that has lost track of reality.
There is no need to be extreme about everything. There is a difference between wrong and very wrong. There is a difference between naughty and bad. There is a difference between bad and evil.
There is a difference between downloading a pirated copy and stealing the DVD from a shop. In first case, no one has lost anything. In the second case the shop keeper is out of pocket for one DVD. The DVD he used to own is now gone. Is speeding really so immoral. No, it isn't. Most people do it because they recognise that when they do so they are not hurting anyone or at risk of doing so. They understand the rules, they understand why the rules exist, but they trust their own judgements more. It's illegal, but it isn't criminal behaviour. It's naughty, but it isn't bad.
Things should be kept in porportion.
There is a difference between illegal and criminal and if you can't see that, it is you that has lost track of reality.
What dictates what's criminal and isn't criminal to you? I mean, obviously the law doesn't, because our laws clearly state that copyright infringement is criminal through means of electronic theft.
If its just a gut feeling you have; then ok you make more sense. But to speak of reality and say piracy is neither "theft" or "criminal", you ignore the reality that in our laws, it is, and is also punishable with prison terms.
When you get a speeding ticket, you break the law, but you are not a criminal. When you don't pay back your credit cards, you have acted illegally, you can be taken to court and succcessfully prosecuted, but you are not a criminal. When you call some one names in public without reason, you have acted illegally and can be sued for damages in court but you have not commited a crime. Acting illegally does not make you a criminal. Commiting a crime does.
Piracy is not a crime. Not in any country in the world.
The advert at the start of the movie says "Piracy is Theft". It isn't.
And that makes it better? You are out of touch with reality.
Yes mate, it makes it better.
Piracy is not theft.
There is no need to be extreme about everything.
There is a difference between wrong and very wrong. There is a difference between naughty and bad. There is a difference between bad and evil.
There is a difference between downloading a pirated copy and stealing the DVD from a shop. In first case, no one has lost anything. There eprson you downloaded the copy from still has his copy. In the second case the shop keeper is out of pocket for one DVD. The DVD he used to own is now gone.
Is speeding really so immoral. No, it isn't. Most people do it because they recognise that when they do so they are not hurting anyone or at risk of doing so. They understand the rules, they understand why the rules exist, but they trust their own judgements more.
It's illegal, but it isn't criminal behaviour.
It's naughty, but it isn't bad.
Things should be kept in porportion.
There is a difference between illegal and criminal and if you can't see that, it is you that has lost track of reality.
No, your blurring the lines to make reality like you want. Your bending the truth to get what you want. You don't care about anyone else as long as you can justify it in the end. If you don't like the laws you can participate and contribute money to groups that support your cause. Until then the actions you take are are forbidden by law with criminal penalties/jail time and civil lawsuits.
When a piscating wizard floods every thread I can understand why people leave.
Comments
I would not advise it as a career field, even with the unemployment we're seeing....sure, Blackbeard and William Kidd were legends in their own time, and the whole yo ho ho and abottle of rum bit sounds like a good life, but you never hear how they died....If you do want to become a pirate, you have to be smarter than those bums in Somalia too. I suggest investing in some heavy weaponry, AA guns and anti-ship missles to scare off the navies of the world, then you could go to town in the more lawless segments of the globe.
Who else to blame for anti-piracy measures if not the pirates themselves?
And who is forcing organizations like the RIAA and MPAA's hands when they try multiple things to curb piracy, but to no avail? There's endless examples. Another would be the MPAA's alliance with the founders/creators of BitTorrent years ago to ensure the technology be used legally; but the nature of the technology allows for public trackers no single company can control the entirity of.
So, would the MPAA be wrong if ever they sought help from the federal government to to target the technology, peer-to-peer pirates and the individual participants themselves? No, because those organizations have been made credible by years of pursuing this and that to curtail piracy, but to no avail, and thus it's easy for 'em to go to Washington and sell revenue losses and consequent impacts on our entire economy.
Piracy will never be left along as some overlooked past-time which some people seem to want. It's detriment is as real as the benefits of preventing and lowering piracy.
So there's a relatively peaceful way out of it (digital distribution, cloud computing, hardware upon which piracy is made difficult/impossible like consoles, Kindle, Zune), and there's a rather oppressive way out of it (the new intellectual property czar we're due to have; who's hands will stretch across a number of departments including the department of justice in all matters concerning intellectual property).
Piracy has dwindled and will continue to dwindle. Again, I just personally hope it does before its lawyers hired by the DOJ writing you instead of an ISP suspension.
For all the bravado some of you show in rampant piracy; its not like any of you are really brave enough to burn DVDs and stand outside of your local mall peddling pirated works. You're brave because you have that anonymity the internet affords, so if that anonymity remains a problem, what do you expect to happen to it?
Well I don't know if you've noticed lately, but you can't do hardly anything on the street these days, let alone "sell Pirated DVDs".
Your words emanate fascism.
Got a better word for it when the RIAA can go to Washington, get a bill passed virtually unimposed by either party creating a new Intellectual Property Enforcement Coordinator that reaches across multiple departments of our government? All against the wishes of the DOJ that felt they'd be undermined.
Like I said, the industry's lawyers and resources out, our government's lawyers and resources in.
Your logic is deeply flawed here. "It can't be wrong because everyone does it" is not a valid argument.
Nor is "piracy isn't wrong because you can't possibly punish all the people that do it."
Also, why do you assume I'm on the side of the industry? I LOATHE businesspeople that make a living by taking advantage of artists. I don't give a damn about the record company, I care about the ARTISTS that create the things we love in the first place.
And for the love of god would you PLEASE quit using the argument "I only pirate stuff that I wouldn't have been willing to pay for anyway...."
Are you KIDDING ME? Something that is so crappy you wouldn't buy you still apparently want to have??
That's like shoplifting ugly furniture to furnish your house with. Moronic.
Just admit it people... piracy is nothing more than the selfish, greedy, stupid side of human nature leading people to do unsavory things that end up hurting EVERYONE.
You can try to spin it any way you want, but that's the simple truth. Everything said to the contrary is rationalization.. you know it, and I know it.
And YES pirates are DIRECTLY responsible for the draconian DRM that makes everything such a pain in the ass.
And YES these whiny little twits are guilty of providing just the excuse that the govenment is going to use to obliterate privacy rights for everyone.
This argument will go on ad nauseam however, because this same group of people are almost certainly incapable of taking responsibility for anything.
deviliscious: (PS. I have been told that when I use scientific language, it does not make me sound more intelligent, it only makes me sound like a jackass. It makes me appear that I am not knowledgable enough in the subject I am discussing to be able to translate it for people outside the field to understand. Some advice you might consider as well)
Sorry chief, speaking out against criminal violation of peoples' rights isn't fascism.
Nor is someone telling you that you can't do whatever you want without regard for the rights of others.
deviliscious: (PS. I have been told that when I use scientific language, it does not make me sound more intelligent, it only makes me sound like a jackass. It makes me appear that I am not knowledgable enough in the subject I am discussing to be able to translate it for people outside the field to understand. Some advice you might consider as well)
I don't see why that's so insane. I pirate shit all the time that I wouldn't have even considered buying. Like the Sims 3. I pirated the leaked version, just because I was bored that day and wanted to mess around with it for a little while. It's a boring, shitty rehash for the most part, but you can get about an hour or two of mindless entertainment from it before it gets stale and you uninstall it forever. If I had payed $50 for that, I'd feel ripped off. When it's free, though, it's easy to ignore what sucks about it and enjoy what doesn't.
I will concede that with any PC game (especially MMOs) I will never again purchase a game that doesn't offer a free trial.
Still no justification for piracy.
I also don't beleve that most people that find they really enjoy a pirated game or album will then go out and pay for a legit copy.
In the early days this was a built in safegueard for music, because tape reproductions were always lower quality than the original- this is no longer true with digital media.
deviliscious: (PS. I have been told that when I use scientific language, it does not make me sound more intelligent, it only makes me sound like a jackass. It makes me appear that I am not knowledgable enough in the subject I am discussing to be able to translate it for people outside the field to understand. Some advice you might consider as well)
I will pull furniture out of a skip to furnish my house with that I would never dream of buying.
Wanting something is not the same as placing value on something.
I'd never dream of renting a DVD for example. Let alone buying one, but if you gave me one I might well watch it.
I think Film and Video games is a slightly different ball game. Music is not expensive to produce. Video and movies games are.
While the standard production model is still clearly very profitable, I feel the writing is on the wall for them.
DvD rental stores are all going out of business. (Not being a service I have ever used, I'm not saddened by their departure).
Computer games are changing their revenue models, increasingly providing a service as well as a game. Online servers etc. They are also moving into digital distribution, taking out the whole outdated publisher and distributer factor.
Not sure where it will end for Hollywood, lower budget films I expect.
It will all end with us drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage.
Wages of selfishness.
The bottom line here is that piracy is dishonest, and dishonesty has consequences.
The difference between right and wrong seems to be lost on a lot of folks these days.
deviliscious: (PS. I have been told that when I use scientific language, it does not make me sound more intelligent, it only makes me sound like a jackass. It makes me appear that I am not knowledgable enough in the subject I am discussing to be able to translate it for people outside the field to understand. Some advice you might consider as well)
Along with people losing their sense of right and wrong, I believe piracy also relates to people desire for material objects. Lots of people have holes in their life and are trying to fill them with shiny toys and cheap thrills.
When a piscating wizard floods every thread I can understand why people leave.
While I can go with the dishonesty of piracy, although I am also inclined not to think of it as a very serious sin, file sharing certainly doesn't equate to theft as nothing is stolen.
I am unable to go with your whole drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage motif. I don't find low budget projects any more or less mediocre than high budget projects. It just strikes me that you perhaps have very poor taste or perhaps have had more a limited repertoire of material to base your opinions on. Perhaps you equate high budget only with good entertainment. I don't.
You want other people to feel morally obliged to sponsor the music you love. And if they don't, you wish to guilt them into it so that you can keep getting more of your favourite music without paying the whole cost you value it at yourself. Who is selfish now?
You think the music you love is worth more than the rest of us think it is. You think it's quality is dependant on how much money the people who make and publish it receive. The rest of us don't.
While I don't think the difference between right and wrong is lost on everyone, I think a tempered and porportional approach is clearly lost on you.
Piracy is not a crime. Like it or not.
Murder is a crime. Piracy isn't. It is at most a civil offence. But certainly not a criminal one and frankly it is laughable that anyone should wish to make it one.
Equally it is wrong not give up your seats to old people on the bus. And while you can be fined for not doing so, it is also not a crime. It's important to keep things in perspective.
Ultimately I feel it boils down to a sort of Dr Spock type moral dilemma where the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
It is far more moral for many poorer people to get access to cheaper entertainment than it is for a few rich people to make more millions selling the same entertainment. The anti-piracy movement is motivated on greed just as the piracy movement is. The question is, who's side are you on, the masses or the few? If you work in a publishing industry or wish to, I can see you choosing the side of self-intrest, if not, I can see you down with the masses of others who don't.
Either way selfishness is most peoples motivation on both sides of the argument.
While I can go with the dishonesty of piracy, although I am also inclined not to think of it as a very serious sin, file sharing certainly doesn't equate to theft as nothing is stolen.
I am unable to go with your whole drowning in an ocean of mediocre garbage motif. I don't find low budget projects any more or less mediocre than high budget projects. It just strikes me that you perhaps have very poor taste or perhaps have had more a limited repertoire of material to base your opinions on. Perhaps you equate high budget only with good entertainment. I don't.
You want other people to feel morally obliged to sponsor the music you love. And if they don't, you wish to guilt them into it so that you can keep getting more of your favourite music without paying the whole cost you value it at yourself. Who is selfish now?
You think the music you love is worth more than the rest of us think it is. You think it's quality is dependant on how much money the people who make and publish it receive. The rest of us don't.
While I don't think the difference between right and wrong is lost on everyone, I think a tempered and porportional approach is clearly lost on you.
Piracy is not a crime. Like it or not.
Murder is a crime. Piracy isn't. It is at most a civil offence. But certainly not a criminal one and frankly it is laughable that anyone should wish to make it one.
Equally it is wrong not give up your seats to old people on the bus. And while you can be fined for not doing so, it is also not a crime. It's important to keep things in perspective.
Ultimately I feel it boils down to a sort of Dr Spock type moral dilemma where the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
It is far more moral for many poorer people to get access to cheaper entertainment than it is for a few rich people to make more millions selling the same entertainment. The anti-piracy movement is motivated on greed just as the piracy movement is. The question is, who's side are you on, the masses or the few? If you work in a publishing industry or wish to, I can see you choosing the side of self-intrest, if not, I can see you down with the masses of others who don't.
Either way selfishness is most peoples motivation on both sides of the argument.
Piracy is a crime. It's against the law. What part of those statements do you not understand? Your trying to make yourself feel better for breaking the law by putting it up against murder.
There is a line. Right and wrong. Piracy is on the wrong no matter how close you think it might be to right.
If you can be fined for not giving up a seat because there is a law for that, its a crime.
It's hard to get more simple than that. If you can't understand that you need to go back to school.
When a piscating wizard floods every thread I can understand why people leave.
Of course piracy is a crime. What gave you the idea that it wasn't?
Furthermore, the anti-piracy organizations are winning. The Pirate Bay was cited as having as much as 50% of BitTorrent traffic; and only two or three other sites make up the rest of the majority of trackers filled with illegal content. There's no safe haven here in the US, it's just that the MPAA and RIAA had to go overseas to eliminate the biggest fish.
Despite the guys over there receiving millions of dollars of fines and a year jail sentence, the MPAA is appealing that decision in pursuit of even harsher sentencings: http://www.imdb.com/news/ni0795035/
So they're succeeding in the international arena as well as home with the Intellectual Property Enforcement Act that rolled out at the end of last year.
What the above means is that even where the MPAA, ESA and RIAA don't succeed (which they are), its now become the job of the Department of Justice's lawyers to go on the offensive when it comes to protecting copyrights. So from now on, we're basically paying taxes to fund the lawyers of those organizations; lawyers that are specifically tasked to both prosecute file sharers and recup losses for them.
Our government is their willful thug thanks to piracy runamuck.
But like I've said, this isn't the worst it can get. There's bigger threats like net neutrality being pushed to the wayside if it means companies like Comcast can throttle peer-to-peer technology when its detected, or even more drastic measures like censorship of our otherwise open web if our country resorted to blocking foreign sites like the Pirate Bay all together.
It's all very really and developing at a rapid pace. Like I've said myself though, I hope it ends with the big sites being taken down and kept down, and things end there 'til the next craze of piracy pops up; ideally not in a way so detrimental to the openness of the internet itself.
It's against civil law.
Not criminal law.
When you get a speeding ticket, you break the law, but you are not a criminal.
When you don't pay back your credit cards, you have acted illegally, you can be taken to court and succcessfully prosecuted, but you are not a criminal. When you call some one names in public without reason, you have acted illegally and can be sued for damages in court but you have not commited a crime.
Acting illegally does not make you a criminal. Commiting a crime does.
Piracy is not a crime. Not in any country in the world.
The advert at the start of the movie says "Piracy is Theft". It isn't.
Yes, yes it is a crime.
Again, it's just that the anti-piracy organizations have focused on the companies enabling piracy moreso than the pirates themselves, because it's easier to target the four guys operating the Pirate Bay than their estimated tens of millions of users individually. The enablers are subject to different laws than the actual pirates.
You can get those that pick the fruit or you can study the roots. Copyright holders tend to do the latter, so even though measures like the NET Act and ART Act cover peer-to-peer file sharing of copyrighted works as theft punishable with prison terms and fines, law of averages is on your side since you're but one of tens of millions around the world participating in piracy and aren't really a group that's being targeted.
What you're doing is illegal and can land you in jail, it's just that no one is looking to put you there. Yet anyway, who knows now that it's the job of federal and state attorney's to enforce these laws; and there's no end of Intellectual Property and Copyright laws that cover this or that.
If piracy and speeding aren't crimes why are people getting jail time for them on top of fines, I always thought jails were for criminals.
www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/wayoflife/11/05/aa.first.time.fines/ for speeding some states can give you up to a year in jail
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8003799.stm as has been pointed out before the guys running pirate bay have gotten jail time, as well as fines that is a pretty harsh sentence for something that isn't a crime.
Simple fact of the matter is that it doesn't matter how we view it as individuals, it is how these acts are being used to gain control over EVERYBODIES access to information, these are not good things.
With all the bad movies these days with over used plots and themes, the ONLY way im ever going to watch them is from torrents. With games, very very few are being made these days for PC that are actually worth a damn. If the game needs a cd key i will glady buy it if it gets good reviews and looks like something i would like to play.
The people in the film industry already have millions and millions. Why do you want to make them richer? So they can get the gulfstream 5 with the surroundsound dvd player remote control? Why do they need more money.
Although, since we live (americans) in a democracy, where slowly our freedoms are being stripped away, i can see a world where net neutrality does not exist. I think piracy will be a thing of the past in the comming years. Thats why you gotta stockpile all the dvd rips
%($*ing socialists.
Edit : Oh and when it comes to music, i could really careless about the music being produced these days. People rapping about making bad decisions with some funky beat, and some rock band using chord progression as the rhythem.. Terrible.. Only music i listen to is 70's led zeppelin and the doors, where actual guitar playing is needed to produce rythem and long solos, and not some idiot dressed up like a fool playing a 6 chord progression.
Or just bands selling out in general.
There's a really disturbing 3 Doors Down video called "Citizen Soldier", and it is literally just some over-dramatic Army recruitment music video. I find it quite ridiculous.. and I've spent 6 years in the Army, 3 years in Iraq. Needless to say, if "Hot Bands" are making Army recruitment videos, there may be a serious problem.
Edit:
If you watch the video on YouTube, note the obvious psychological methods of - "Dark and Foreboding Atmosphere, then.. Bam, Here Comes the Light, the Army!,, YAY! Cure your sadness, join the military."
Mainstream music and literal propaganda have become increasingly fuzzy to distinguish between each other these past few years. This kind of contributes to many people not giving two-shits about the record industry, among other things.
And that makes it better? You are out of touch with reality.
When a piscating wizard floods every thread I can understand why people leave.
I come from Brazil.
It's part of a cycle - the population (90%) is poor, so they by pirate material. That's bad for businesses, as selling videogames and games to a poor population that only (the few who can) buys the videogames (because they have to be original) and then only buys the pirate games, doesn't make enough profit, so they leave the country, which also eliminates direct and indirect jobs. The country loses money to the piracy and even the 10% "rich" suffer, as Sony and Microsoft, for example, restrict their online services for their videogames in South America, and thus Brazil.
And keep in mind that when talking to South Americans, the person is likely to not have enough education to really perceive that buying pirate products means to support indirectly the mafias and the drug trafficking, as the people who sell pirate products may also be taking part in other ILLEGAL activities.
And that makes it better? You are out of touch with reality.
Yes mate, it makes it better.
Piracy is not theft.
There is no need to be extreme about everything.
There is a difference between wrong and very wrong. There is a difference between naughty and bad. There is a difference between bad and evil.
There is a difference between downloading a pirated copy and stealing the DVD from a shop. In first case, no one has lost anything. There person you downloaded the copy from still has his copy. In the second case the shop keeper is out of pocket for one DVD. The DVD he used to own is now gone.
In the first case, the copywright holder has not made any money on the pirated copy. He hasn't lost any either, but he hasn't made any and he would have liked to.
Is speeding really so immoral. No, it isn't. Most people do it because they recognise that when they do so they are not hurting anyone or at risk of doing so. They understand the rules, they understand why the rules exist, but they trust their own judgements more.
It's illegal, but it isn't criminal behaviour.
It's naughty, but it isn't bad.
Things should be kept in porportion.
There is a difference between illegal and criminal and if you can't see that, it is you that has lost track of reality.
What dictates what's criminal and isn't criminal to you? I mean, obviously the law doesn't, because our laws clearly state that copyright infringement is criminal through means of electronic theft.
If its just a gut feeling you have; then ok you make more sense. But to speak of reality and say piracy is neither "theft" or "criminal", you ignore the reality that in our laws, it is, and is also punishable with prison terms.
And that makes it better? You are out of touch with reality.
Yes mate, it makes it better.
Piracy is not theft.
There is no need to be extreme about everything.
There is a difference between wrong and very wrong. There is a difference between naughty and bad. There is a difference between bad and evil.
There is a difference between downloading a pirated copy and stealing the DVD from a shop. In first case, no one has lost anything. There eprson you downloaded the copy from still has his copy. In the second case the shop keeper is out of pocket for one DVD. The DVD he used to own is now gone.
Is speeding really so immoral. No, it isn't. Most people do it because they recognise that when they do so they are not hurting anyone or at risk of doing so. They understand the rules, they understand why the rules exist, but they trust their own judgements more.
It's illegal, but it isn't criminal behaviour.
It's naughty, but it isn't bad.
Things should be kept in porportion.
There is a difference between illegal and criminal and if you can't see that, it is you that has lost track of reality.
No, your blurring the lines to make reality like you want. Your bending the truth to get what you want. You don't care about anyone else as long as you can justify it in the end. If you don't like the laws you can participate and contribute money to groups that support your cause. Until then the actions you take are are forbidden by law with criminal penalties/jail time and civil lawsuits.
When a piscating wizard floods every thread I can understand why people leave.