Case closed for me. Guess I'll be waiting on DC Universe Online to get my superhero fix..
Sadly SOE have said that DCUO is likely to include MTs. They even went so far in one interview as to hint at it being free-to-play. Though their official stance at the moment on the final payment model is that they're watching industry developments...
Case closed for me. Guess I'll be waiting on DC Universe Online to get my superhero fix..
Sadly SOE have said that DCUO is likely to include MTs. They even went so far in one interview as to hint at it being free-to-play. Though their official stance at the moment on the final payment model is that they're watching industry developments...
Well if CO bombs terribly hopefully Sony will take notice and not do the same with DCOU.
Will the ability to purchase premium items out of the game with real money cause imbalance and overpowered characters to dominate the PvP? – CameronChampion
There are no items available for purchase with real money that upset the balance of the game.
MMO pay models are changing. MT for extras will become more and more common.
Will the ability to purchase premium items out of the game with real money cause imbalance and overpowered characters to dominate the PvP? – CameronChampion There are no items available for purchase with real money that upset the balance of the game.
MMO pay models are changing. MT for extras will become more and more common.
That's rubbish.
All we've seen a few bloggers decry that MTs are the way of the future - and even then, they speak of this way in the context of small, cheaply developed mmos using the freebie + MTs model - not triple A mmos trying to have it both ways.
So what are the facts?
There's a global financial crisis, but the subscription mmo market continues to grow. It grew by 22% in 2008. Growth outside of WOW is also on the rise - it was 12% in 2007 and 27% in 2008.
SOE's Free Realms, while hailed as a "success" in their PR releases, had its launch very quickly followed by SOE laying off 5% of their staff. That's not something they'd have done if it profits hadn't been lower than expected.
They're approaching 5 million registered users. That's not actual players, just people who have tried the game.
So best case scenario, using the statistics reported by another mmo using a similar model, they have an income from the game approximately equivalent to 100k subscribers.
Payment model is a defining factor for mmos. Players who like the freebie + MTs model, like the freebie element, not the MTs. Only a small fraction of players will ever use MTs, but they tend to spend stupid amounts of money on them - that's how those models work. Players who like the subscription model want the full mmo service for a set fee. Add MTs into the mix and they're not getting their money's worth from the subscription.
MTs have their place - but it's not in bed with subscriptions.
Case closed for me. Guess I'll be waiting on DC Universe Online to get my superhero fix..
Sadly SOE have said that DCUO is likely to include MTs. They even went so far in one interview as to hint at it being free-to-play. Though their official stance at the moment on the final payment model is that they're watching industry developments...
Well if CO bombs terribly hopefully Sony will take notice and not do the same with DCOU.
Lol, I wish it was possible, but I think Sony stopped taking notice a long time ago, they will just pick the worst thing possible to do and go with that , probably just to give people something to whinge about on the internet, I swear Smed does it for a laugh now.
Anyhow, it's not often that I hope a game fails, but I find myself more and more hoping that CO ends up a complete failure. I hope it fails miserably and that other companies do take notice, they look at it and realise that Subs+Box+MT just will not fly. They can only get away with this is we the customers let them. If enough people are not happy, if enough people refuse to purchase and play the game, then it will indeed fail and people will take notice.
I will take no pleasure in it if CO does fail, I think it is always sad to see any MMO fail, but in this case I think the very future of how we pay for MMO's is at stake, if CO is a success then we can all look forward to Subs+Box+MT for ever and a day
Case closed for me. Guess I'll be waiting on DC Universe Online to get my superhero fix..
Sadly SOE have said that DCUO is likely to include MTs. They even went so far in one interview as to hint at it being free-to-play. Though their official stance at the moment on the final payment model is that they're watching industry developments...
Well if CO bombs terribly hopefully Sony will take notice and not do the same with DCOU.
Lol, I wish it was possible, but I think Sony stopped taking notice a long time ago, they will just pick the worst thing possible to do and go with that , probably just to give people something to whinge about on the internet, I swear Smed does it for a laugh now.
Anyhow, it's not often that I hope a game fails, but I find myself more and more hoping that CO ends up a complete failure. I hope it fails miserably and that other companies do take notice, they look at it and realise that Subs+Box+MT just will not fly. They can only get away with this is we the customers let them. If enough people are not happy, if enough people refuse to purchase and play the game, then it will indeed fail and people will take notice.
I will take no pleasure in it if CO does fail, I think it is always sad to see any MMO fail, but in this case I think the very future of how we pay for MMO's is at stake, if CO is a success then we can all look forward to Subs+Box+MT for ever and a day
wouldnt not using the item store be the same as not having one?
wouldnt not using the item store be the same as not having one?
I guess it depends on how much you are against what they are doing. Some people have no problem at all and will happily pay the sub and buy lots of content from the item store, others will not be happy with, or are just not bothered about the store so will pay the monthly sub and just ignore the item store. Then there are those, like me, who are so against it that they may just not bother with the game at all.
I've no idea how this will turn out, although I will not hide the fact that my hope is for the game to fail as a direct result of them trying Sub+box+mt. I guess CO is going to be a great litmus test for where we are heading in the future, it is the first big name 'Western' game I can think of to launch with this kind of MT crap in it, so it will be interesting so see how it plays out.
I'm not that fussed either way, as long as it's subscription somehow. I just wish they'd confirm exactly what the deal is, with pricing and what is available to buy.
The world is evolving and so is the MMO community, that been said i think the way we pay also changes along side our interests so CO's MT system could present its self as a reference on how future MMO'should operate under a MT system. The groundwork for MT MMO's could be formed by us sooner than later and provide companies with info.So with all this in mind i think we should act with caution towards CO's MT system and be harsh or linient as a whole (unless we want to present our selfs as sheep and have the companies think they can rip us off because we are desparate)
It's said by the people who charge us we should embrace new payment models, another way to phrase it is, "come into my parlour, said the spider to the fly." At this point they're one step away from buying a panel van with a free candy sign scrawled on the side and just rolling us for change and a quick rape in broad daylight. As consumers we do not have to adapt to a new way of making the companies even more money. We're not fossils mired in past times because we refuse to let a company find new and interesting ways to fleece us. We're consuming smartly is all, and it to be honest the way companies shit on every facet of our lives we should be even more aggressive and intelligent consumers.
There is a Free to Play market with MT stores and a monthly subscriber market, combining the two will not benifit the coonsumer one bit. This new payment model where you charge for the game, a monthly fee and have a store upon the game's inception is completely slanted towards generating money for the company. We assume the risk of developing (full price box), we maintain the servers, pay the staff and provid a profit (monthly fee) and as of now they also want us to buy them gold played toilets and send strippers to college (mt store). They can kiss the broadest part of my fat nerdy, ass.
You do yourself a great disservice as a person to not stand up for yourself against greed. It's not even a person you're telling to pound sand, it's an entity that's screwing you over. And it's ok to kill companies, companies have no feelings. Or it's fish, I can't remember. Either way let these greedy bastards and anyone who attatches themselves to them wither on the vine.
wouldnt not using the item store be the same as not having one?
Wouldn't we just go and play a free mmo with a shopping mall, if that were the case?
For many of us, part of what we pay for with a subscription is the absence of a shopping mall.
Exactly, aside from the quality issue in the free to play games it's the fact you don't have to buy this and that to keep up with the Jones'. The funny thing is you don't hear Roper spewwing lines about how in the long run the MT store would benifit us. He just speaks volumes of how it's ok to sell us stuff, heck, I'm suprised he didn't pull a Sam's card out and explain, "You pay a fee to go to Sam's Club, but those tubesocks and 58 packs of papertowels are like micro-transactions! And you just didn't walk to Sam's you had to buy a car, the initial invest of the car allowed you to carry those micro-tubesocks. Plus, if you hate MT stores, you pretty much hate America. WoW supports terrorism. Buy my stuff or I eat this baby!"
Originally posted by Chuckanar Yup I WILL be buying the game. I am one of those ppl that has a job and family. I dont have 16+ hours a day to play and like the idea that I can buy the hello kitty cape for my kids toon or whatever for myself instead of having to deal with some spoiled punks for that raid only item. I like the idea that I can just play and socialize with my limited time and if I really want that spiffy item i can spend a few dollars and get it. I think this idea (MT purchased items) just upsets the supposed elitists. Whom shouldnt feel threatened. Your still Elite, hell i used to be elite.. but life isnt just about games for us adult gamers, we have work, KIDS, and a spouse.
I have no doubt this is true in some cases. But couldn't the reverse also be true in other cases?
Somebody with money is thrown into a situation ( a game without MT ) where their money cannot buy special advantages or treatment and they don't like it.
People with more time than money want their time to mean more in game, people with more money than time want their money to mean more. I don't know where the happy median is...
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own. -- Herman Melville
Originally posted by Chuckanar Yup I WILL be buying the game. I am one of those ppl that has a job and family. I dont have 16+ hours a day to play and like the idea that I can buy the hello kitty cape for my kids toon or whatever for myself instead of having to deal with some spoiled punks for that raid only item. I like the idea that I can just play and socialize with my limited time and if I really want that spiffy item i can spend a few dollars and get it. I think this idea (MT purchased items) just upsets the supposed elitists. Whom shouldnt feel threatened. Your still Elite, hell i used to be elite.. but life isnt just about games for us adult gamers, we have work, KIDS, and a spouse.
I have no doubt this is true in some cases. But couldn't the reverse also be true in other cases?
Somebody with money is thrown into a situation ( a game without MT ) where their money cannot buy special advantages or treatment and they don't like it.
People with more time than money want their time to mean more in game, people with more money than time want their money to mean more. I don't know where the happy median is...
The happy median would be the status quo - separate freebie+MT payment models for some and subscription payment models for others.
This game just failed before it was even released.
MMORPG's are like playing golf. You can play it to compete against others but in reality you just compete against yourself. Adding in MT's is like being able to pay to lower your score. Those who play to compete against other people are not going to play because the competition has been removed. Those that compete against themselve have just cheapened their own play experience.
What achievement have you earned by buying something in the shop? You proved you have a large bank account? Sure you can get the item by in-game questing but that's like you working your butt off to get a trophy while your neighbor bought one. The achievement factor is a major drive in playing MMO's and it has just been thrown out the window. Just because its cosmetic items changes nothing in any of these arguements. When people raid to get full epic gear of armor they want it to look good, they want people to admire them and send them a tell saying gratz. And like other people said it starts with minor non-game changing items than quickly changes. besides if its just cosmetic aren't you just branding yourself as the guy who had to buy your hero suit?
Retread player: "look guys at my cool custome!"
Everyone else: "Um dude you just bought it, no big deal"
Retread: "But it looks cool, I'm special!"
Everyone else: "Special like Jerry's kids special maybe"
Retread: "wait no I earned it I didn't buy it."
Everyone else: "yea right, learn to play retread."
This is just an example of catering to the lowest common denominator. Oh you aren't good enough to get the gear yourself so if you give us money we'll give it to you. It's like how now in school everyone makes the honor roll or everyone gets a trophy in little league.
This is going to make a large demogrqaphic of the MMO community pass this game by. This is most likely a group of hardcore players and, this is just my opinion but the casuals who this systema will apeeal:
1) Don't get into a game until after it reaches a certain point which it never will without the hardcore players 2) won't leave WOW no matter what 3) Will realize they are paying way more than they realized.
I feel sorry for those who don't read the forums or net carefully and get duped into buying this. I would hate to be a CSR having to deal with those angry people demanding their money back.
This game just failed before it was even released. MMORPG's are like playing golf. You can play it to compete against others but in reality you just compete against yourself. Adding in MT's is like being able to pay to lower your score. Those who play to compete against other people are not going to play because the competition has been removed. Those that compete against themselve have just cheapened their own play experience. What achievement have you earned by buying something in the shop? You proved you have a large bank account? Sure you can get the item by in-game questing but that's like you working your butt off to get a trophy while your neighbor bought one. The achievement factor is a major drive in playing MMO's and it has just been thrown out the window. Just because its cosmetic items changes nothing in any of these arguements. When people raid to get full epic gear of armor they want it to look good, they want people to admire them and send them a tell saying gratz. And like other people said it starts with minor non-game changing items than quickly changes. besides if its just cosmetic aren't you just branding yourself as the guy who had to buy your hero suit? Retread player: "look guys at my cool custome!" Everyone else: "Um dude you just bought it, no big deal" Retread: "But it looks cool, I'm special!" Everyone else: "Special like Jerry's kids special maybe" Retread: "wait no I earned it I didn't buy it." Everyone else: "yea right, learn to play retread." This is just an example of catering to the lowest common denominator. Oh you aren't good enough to get the gear yourself so if you give us money we'll give it to you. It's like how now in school everyone makes the honor roll or everyone gets a trophy in little league. This is going to make a large demogrqaphic of the MMO community pass this game by. This is most likely a group of hardcore players and, this is just my opinion but the casuals who this systema will apeeal: 1) Don't get into a game until after it reaches a certain point which it never will without the hardcore players
2) won't leave WOW no matter what
3) Will realize they are paying way more than they realized. I feel sorry for those who don't read the forums or net carefully and get duped into buying this. I would hate to be a CSR having to deal with those angry people demanding their money back.
QFT. I planned on getting this until they announced the MT crap. Oh well, won't be much better gameplaywise than CoX anyway.
1) Microtransactions enable us to have a larger development team
Potentially more funding for a relatively easy time investment
2) Microtransactions are mostly aesthetic (costume pieces, pets, etc.)
Nothing new here really. You can purchase cosmetic or vanity items from the shop using real money. So, if you absolutely MUST HAVE the purple haircut of butchery, feel free to drop down $5 or w/e it costs. Does that make you better than anyone? No. Does it mean you have $5 and decided you wanted to blow it on a purely cosmetic item? Yes. OP? No.
3) If a microtransaction does have any sort of in game effect, then it can be also be earned in game. As long as it's not top level gear, this is fine with me. Although I'd like to see a decrease from the standard $15/month charge with such an item mall.
1) Microtransactions enable us to have a larger development team Potentially more funding for a relatively easy time investment
Unlikely.
The former owners of Cryptic stand to net themselves up to an additional $48 million for the sale of Cryptic to Infogrames (who gave it to the then broke Atari), based on profits by I think it was March 2011.
This game just failed before it was even released.
QFT. I planned on getting this until they announced the MT crap. Oh well, won't be much better gameplaywise than CoX anyway.
I think the sad thing is that it might have been.
They've done two things in CO which might have made it better. The open world design instead of instancing - which should make gameplay less repetitive; and much more limited use of cooldowns (except for the power armor framework) - which puts a bit more control in the player's hands.
1) Microtransactions enable us to have a larger development team Potentially more funding for a relatively easy time investment
2) Microtransactions are mostly aesthetic (costume pieces, pets, etc.) Nothing new here really. You can purchase cosmetic or vanity items from the shop using real money. So, if you absolutely MUST HAVE the purple haircut of butchery, feel free to drop down $5 or w/e it costs. Does that make you better than anyone? No. Does it mean you have $5 and decided you wanted to blow it on a purely cosmetic item? Yes. OP? No.
3) If a microtransaction does have any sort of in game effect, then it can be also be earned in game.
As long as it's not top level gear, this is fine with me. Although I'd like to see a decrease from the standard $15/month charge with such an item mall. Just my 2¢.
1. In F2P games, somewhere like 1-5% of the playerbase pay the bill for the rest of the players. In a P2P game with Microtransactions, how many players are scared away by subscription AND Microtransactions? Would 1-5% of the playerbase make up for the thousands of players NOT paying 15$ a month? Oh, and it's VERY rare that any developer pushes most revenue into developement... So even if they make 1000-100.000$ extra a month from microtransactions, the odds for seeing even one more dev working on the game are minimal(Personally, you have bigger chance of being eaten by a shark while flying a plane).
2. 1 part of the playerbase, mainly RP'ers get the short end of the stick. They HAVE to pay extra for the game, while the PvE content grinders or the PvP monkeys, all who only care for stats, couldnt care less that the playerbase they love to rag and hate on actually pays for their fun. Can you imagine the shitstorm if it was the PvP monkeys that had to pay for the others fun? Or the PvE content grinders? Supporting any microtransaction form when you're not even part of the playerbase that has to pay extra for their gameplay... Well, thats like supporthing Apartheid while you're safely squared away where it wont affect you say, like Uzbekistan. Makes me wish there would be a microtransaction/F2P that had the others pay....
3. Experience shows that IF microtransaction items has an effect on gameplay (for the usually non affected per #2) it's not available for non paying. If it were, they wouldnt be paying now would they? And lowering monthly fee would never happend, because that would lowering the safe income to swap it with a not so safe income.
15$ a month from 100.000 players "swing" less than 5-20$ a month from 1000-10.000 players. This you can find by looking at F2P companies and P2P companies. A F2P dev team is usually smaller than a P2P(And it really shows in patches. Less patches, less bugfixes, less added content, not counting additions to the microtransaction store).
Thats my 2€ (Woulda been 2¢ but my playstyle has me paying your bills too).
1) Microtransactions enable us to have a larger development team Potentially more funding for a relatively easy time investment This is the biggest game wrecker for me, the devs will focus on this to make money, their main focus will not be for the customers who pay 15 bucks a month. You're funding to make more crap, but only crap you can buy. Oh sure they'll be some minor content updates but you can bet the best and brightest looking stuff will be here. The sole purpose of the MT is to make MORE money, how can games like EvE push out massive content with a standard fee only and Champions not? If they have to charge extra to continue developing a game they charge a premium fee for they are running the game wrong. Just rename it Hellgate: Champions right now and be done with it.
2) Microtransactions are mostly aesthetic (costume pieces, pets, etc.) Nothing new here really. You can purchase cosmetic or vanity items from the shop using real money. So, if you absolutely MUST HAVE the purple haircut of butchery, feel free to drop down $5 or w/e it costs. Does that make you better than anyone? No. Does it mean you have $5 and decided you wanted to blow it on a purely cosmetic item? Yes. OP? No. It can be argued your subscription fee should allow you regular updates of content, they want to gouge us for more money over time, make a stupid ex-pac and increase the banal level cap...their prime motive is to make money ASAP.
3) If a microtransaction does have any sort of in game effect, then it can be also be earned in game.
As long as it's not top level gear, this is fine with me. Although I'd like to see a decrease from the standard $15/month charge with such an item mall. How many times have we been told one thing prior to release and then it's changed? Their foot is in the door with this one, all they have to do is make something attainable with a really shitty drop rate or a horrid grind and they've kept their word. They can make it so bad it takes you months to get, or ten seconds to buy. Just my 2¢. Save it, you'll need the money for features.
1. In F2P games, somewhere like 1-5% of the playerbase pay the bill for the rest of the players. In a P2P game with Microtransactions, how many players are scared away by subscription AND Microtransactions? Would 1-5% of the playerbase make up for the thousands of players NOT paying 15$ a month? Oh, and it's VERY rare that any developer pushes most revenue into developement... So even if they make 1000-100.000$ extra a month from microtransactions, the odds for seeing even one more dev working on the game are minimal(Personally, you have bigger chance of being eaten by a shark while flying a plane). 2. 1 part of the playerbase, mainly RP'ers get the short end of the stick. They HAVE to pay extra for the game, while the PvE content grinders or the PvP monkeys, all who only care for stats, couldnt care less that the playerbase they love to rag and hate on actually pays for their fun. Can you imagine the shitstorm if it was the PvP monkeys that had to pay for the others fun? Or the PvE content grinders? Supporting any microtransaction form when you're not even part of the playerbase that has to pay extra for their gameplay... Well, thats like supporthing Apartheid while you're safely squared away where it wont affect you say, like Uzbekistan. Makes me wish there would be a microtransaction/F2P that had the others pay.... 3. Experience shows that IF microtransaction items has an effect on gameplay (for the usually non affected per #2) it's not available for non paying. If it were, they wouldnt be paying now would they? And lowering monthly fee would never happend, because that would lowering the safe income to swap it with a not so safe income. 15$ a month from 100.000 players "swing" less than 5-20$ a month from 1000-10.000 players. This you can find by looking at F2P companies and P2P companies. A F2P dev team is usually smaller than a P2P(And it really shows in patches. Less patches, less bugfixes, less added content, not counting additions to the microtransaction store).
Thats my 2€ (Woulda been 2¢ but my playstyle has me paying your bills too).
Imagine if they charged you for each arena, or you had to pay to open up a BG? Heh each person in the raid had to buy an attunement stone. Crap Roper is probably writing this all down, I better stop.
Originally posted by wolfmann Originally posted by apocalance1) Microtransactions enable us to have a larger development team Potentially more funding for a relatively easy time investment2) Microtransactions are mostly aesthetic (costume pieces, pets, etc.) Nothing new here really. You can purchase cosmetic or vanity items from the shop using real money. So, if you absolutely MUST HAVE the purple haircut of butchery, feel free to drop down $5 or w/e it costs. Does that make you better than anyone? No. Does it mean you have $5 and decided you wanted to blow it on a purely cosmetic item? Yes. OP? No.3) If a microtransaction does have any sort of in game effect, then it can be also be earned in game. As long as it's not top level gear, this is fine with me. Although I'd like to see a decrease from the standard $15/month charge with such an item mall. Just my 2¢.
1. In F2P games, somewhere like 1-5% of the playerbase pay the bill for the rest of the players. In a P2P game with Microtransactions, how many players are scared away by subscription AND Microtransactions? Would 1-5% of the playerbase make up for the thousands of players NOT paying 15$ a month? Oh, and it's VERY rare that any developer pushes most revenue into developement... So even if they make 1000-100.000$ extra a month from microtransactions, the odds for seeing even one more dev working on the game are minimal(Personally, you have bigger chance of being eaten by a shark while flying a plane). 2. 1 part of the playerbase, mainly RP'ers get the short end of the stick. They HAVE to pay extra for the game, while the PvE content grinders or the PvP monkeys, all who only care for stats, couldnt care less that the playerbase they love to rag and hate on actually pays for their fun. Can you imagine the shitstorm if it was the PvP monkeys that had to pay for the others fun? Or the PvE content grinders? Supporting any microtransaction form when you're not even part of the playerbase that has to pay extra for their gameplay... Well, thats like supporthing Apartheid while you're safely squared away where it wont affect you say, like Uzbekistan. Makes me wish there would be a microtransaction/F2P that had the others pay.... 3. Experience shows that IF microtransaction items has an effect on gameplay (for the usually non affected per #2) it's not available for non paying. If it were, they wouldnt be paying now would they? And lowering monthly fee would never happend, because that would lowering the safe income to swap it with a not so safe income. 15$ a month from 100.000 players "swing" less than 5-20$ a month from 1000-10.000 players. This you can find by looking at F2P companies and P2P companies. A F2P dev team is usually smaller than a P2P(And it really shows in patches. Less patches, less bugfixes, less added content, not counting additions to the microtransaction store).
Thats my 2 (Woulda been 2¢ but my playstyle has me paying your bills too).
Conjecture is a bad thing. Total obfuscation is awful. Your post falls somewhere after that. Facts w/o foundation, assumptions w/o basis. I don't even know where to start.
You've paid bills for me? You are truly off your rocker.
Comments
Sadly SOE have said that DCUO is likely to include MTs. They even went so far in one interview as to hint at it being free-to-play. Though their official stance at the moment on the final payment model is that they're watching industry developments...
Sadly SOE have said that DCUO is likely to include MTs. They even went so far in one interview as to hint at it being free-to-play. Though their official stance at the moment on the final payment model is that they're watching industry developments...
Well if CO bombs terribly hopefully Sony will take notice and not do the same with DCOU.
Alltern8 Blog | Star Wars Space Combat and The Old Republic | Cryptic Studios - A Pre Post-Mortem | Klingon Preview, STO's Monster Play
http://www.champions-online.com/dev_blog/ask_cryptic_07-24-09
Check out the lastest from Cryptics CO website...
Will the ability to purchase premium items out of the game with real money cause imbalance and overpowered characters to dominate the PvP? – CameronChampion
There are no items available for purchase with real money that upset the balance of the game.
MMO pay models are changing. MT for extras will become more and more common.
That's rubbish.
All we've seen a few bloggers decry that MTs are the way of the future - and even then, they speak of this way in the context of small, cheaply developed mmos using the freebie + MTs model - not triple A mmos trying to have it both ways.
So what are the facts?
There's a global financial crisis, but the subscription mmo market continues to grow. It grew by 22% in 2008. Growth outside of WOW is also on the rise - it was 12% in 2007 and 27% in 2008.
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=23003
SOE's Free Realms, while hailed as a "success" in their PR releases, had its launch very quickly followed by SOE laying off 5% of their staff. That's not something they'd have done if it profits hadn't been lower than expected.
What do we know of their actual numbers?
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=24557
They're approaching 5 million registered users. That's not actual players, just people who have tried the game.
So best case scenario, using the statistics reported by another mmo using a similar model, they have an income from the game approximately equivalent to 100k subscribers.
Payment model is a defining factor for mmos. Players who like the freebie + MTs model, like the freebie element, not the MTs. Only a small fraction of players will ever use MTs, but they tend to spend stupid amounts of money on them - that's how those models work. Players who like the subscription model want the full mmo service for a set fee. Add MTs into the mix and they're not getting their money's worth from the subscription.
MTs have their place - but it's not in bed with subscriptions.
Sadly SOE have said that DCUO is likely to include MTs. They even went so far in one interview as to hint at it being free-to-play. Though their official stance at the moment on the final payment model is that they're watching industry developments...
Well if CO bombs terribly hopefully Sony will take notice and not do the same with DCOU.
Lol, I wish it was possible, but I think Sony stopped taking notice a long time ago, they will just pick the worst thing possible to do and go with that , probably just to give people something to whinge about on the internet, I swear Smed does it for a laugh now.
Anyhow, it's not often that I hope a game fails, but I find myself more and more hoping that CO ends up a complete failure. I hope it fails miserably and that other companies do take notice, they look at it and realise that Subs+Box+MT just will not fly. They can only get away with this is we the customers let them. If enough people are not happy, if enough people refuse to purchase and play the game, then it will indeed fail and people will take notice.
I will take no pleasure in it if CO does fail, I think it is always sad to see any MMO fail, but in this case I think the very future of how we pay for MMO's is at stake, if CO is a success then we can all look forward to Subs+Box+MT for ever and a day
Sadly SOE have said that DCUO is likely to include MTs. They even went so far in one interview as to hint at it being free-to-play. Though their official stance at the moment on the final payment model is that they're watching industry developments...
Well if CO bombs terribly hopefully Sony will take notice and not do the same with DCOU.
Lol, I wish it was possible, but I think Sony stopped taking notice a long time ago, they will just pick the worst thing possible to do and go with that , probably just to give people something to whinge about on the internet, I swear Smed does it for a laugh now.
Anyhow, it's not often that I hope a game fails, but I find myself more and more hoping that CO ends up a complete failure. I hope it fails miserably and that other companies do take notice, they look at it and realise that Subs+Box+MT just will not fly. They can only get away with this is we the customers let them. If enough people are not happy, if enough people refuse to purchase and play the game, then it will indeed fail and people will take notice.
I will take no pleasure in it if CO does fail, I think it is always sad to see any MMO fail, but in this case I think the very future of how we pay for MMO's is at stake, if CO is a success then we can all look forward to Subs+Box+MT for ever and a day
wouldnt not using the item store be the same as not having one?
I guess it depends on how much you are against what they are doing. Some people have no problem at all and will happily pay the sub and buy lots of content from the item store, others will not be happy with, or are just not bothered about the store so will pay the monthly sub and just ignore the item store. Then there are those, like me, who are so against it that they may just not bother with the game at all.
I've no idea how this will turn out, although I will not hide the fact that my hope is for the game to fail as a direct result of them trying Sub+box+mt. I guess CO is going to be a great litmus test for where we are heading in the future, it is the first big name 'Western' game I can think of to launch with this kind of MT crap in it, so it will be interesting so see how it plays out.
I'm not that fussed either way, as long as it's subscription somehow. I just wish they'd confirm exactly what the deal is, with pricing and what is available to buy.
The world is evolving and so is the MMO community, that been said i think the way we pay also changes
along side our interests so CO's MT system could present its self as a
reference on how future MMO'should operate under a
MT system. The groundwork for MT MMO's could be formed by us sooner than later and provide
companies with info.So with all this in mind i think we should act with caution towards CO's MT system and be harsh or
linient as a whole (unless we want to present our selfs as sheep and have the companies think they can rip us
off because we are desparate)
Wouldn't we just go and play a free mmo with a shopping mall, if that were the case?
For many of us, part of what we pay for with a subscription is the absence of a shopping mall.
It's said by the people who charge us we should embrace new payment models, another way to phrase it is, "come into my parlour, said the spider to the fly." At this point they're one step away from buying a panel van with a free candy sign scrawled on the side and just rolling us for change and a quick rape in broad daylight. As consumers we do not have to adapt to a new way of making the companies even more money. We're not fossils mired in past times because we refuse to let a company find new and interesting ways to fleece us. We're consuming smartly is all, and it to be honest the way companies shit on every facet of our lives we should be even more aggressive and intelligent consumers.
There is a Free to Play market with MT stores and a monthly subscriber market, combining the two will not benifit the coonsumer one bit. This new payment model where you charge for the game, a monthly fee and have a store upon the game's inception is completely slanted towards generating money for the company. We assume the risk of developing (full price box), we maintain the servers, pay the staff and provid a profit (monthly fee) and as of now they also want us to buy them gold played toilets and send strippers to college (mt store). They can kiss the broadest part of my fat nerdy, ass.
You do yourself a great disservice as a person to not stand up for yourself against greed. It's not even a person you're telling to pound sand, it's an entity that's screwing you over. And it's ok to kill companies, companies have no feelings. Or it's fish, I can't remember. Either way let these greedy bastards and anyone who attatches themselves to them wither on the vine.
Wouldn't we just go and play a free mmo with a shopping mall, if that were the case?
For many of us, part of what we pay for with a subscription is the absence of a shopping mall.
Exactly, aside from the quality issue in the free to play games it's the fact you don't have to buy this and that to keep up with the Jones'. The funny thing is you don't hear Roper spewwing lines about how in the long run the MT store would benifit us. He just speaks volumes of how it's ok to sell us stuff, heck, I'm suprised he didn't pull a Sam's card out and explain, "You pay a fee to go to Sam's Club, but those tubesocks and 58 packs of papertowels are like micro-transactions! And you just didn't walk to Sam's you had to buy a car, the initial invest of the car allowed you to carry those micro-tubesocks. Plus, if you hate MT stores, you pretty much hate America. WoW supports terrorism. Buy my stuff or I eat this baby!"
I have no doubt this is true in some cases. But couldn't the reverse also be true in other cases?
Somebody with money is thrown into a situation ( a game without MT ) where their money cannot buy special advantages or treatment and they don't like it.
People with more time than money want their time to mean more in game, people with more money than time want their money to mean more. I don't know where the happy median is...
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
I have no doubt this is true in some cases. But couldn't the reverse also be true in other cases?
Somebody with money is thrown into a situation ( a game without MT ) where their money cannot buy special advantages or treatment and they don't like it.
People with more time than money want their time to mean more in game, people with more money than time want their money to mean more. I don't know where the happy median is...
The happy median would be the status quo - separate freebie+MT payment models for some and subscription payment models for others.
This game just failed before it was even released.
MMORPG's are like playing golf. You can play it to compete against others but in reality you just compete against yourself. Adding in MT's is like being able to pay to lower your score. Those who play to compete against other people are not going to play because the competition has been removed. Those that compete against themselve have just cheapened their own play experience.
What achievement have you earned by buying something in the shop? You proved you have a large bank account? Sure you can get the item by in-game questing but that's like you working your butt off to get a trophy while your neighbor bought one. The achievement factor is a major drive in playing MMO's and it has just been thrown out the window. Just because its cosmetic items changes nothing in any of these arguements. When people raid to get full epic gear of armor they want it to look good, they want people to admire them and send them a tell saying gratz. And like other people said it starts with minor non-game changing items than quickly changes. besides if its just cosmetic aren't you just branding yourself as the guy who had to buy your hero suit?
Retread player: "look guys at my cool custome!"
Everyone else: "Um dude you just bought it, no big deal"
Retread: "But it looks cool, I'm special!"
Everyone else: "Special like Jerry's kids special maybe"
Retread: "wait no I earned it I didn't buy it."
Everyone else: "yea right, learn to play retread."
This is just an example of catering to the lowest common denominator. Oh you aren't good enough to get the gear yourself so if you give us money we'll give it to you. It's like how now in school everyone makes the honor roll or everyone gets a trophy in little league.
This is going to make a large demogrqaphic of the MMO community pass this game by. This is most likely a group of hardcore players and, this is just my opinion but the casuals who this systema will apeeal:
1) Don't get into a game until after it reaches a certain point which it never will without the hardcore players
2) won't leave WOW no matter what
3) Will realize they are paying way more than they realized.
I feel sorry for those who don't read the forums or net carefully and get duped into buying this. I would hate to be a CSR having to deal with those angry people demanding their money back.
QFT. I planned on getting this until they announced the MT crap. Oh well, won't be much better gameplaywise than CoX anyway.
1) Microtransactions enable us to have a larger development team
Potentially more funding for a relatively easy time investment
2) Microtransactions are mostly aesthetic (costume pieces, pets, etc.)
Nothing new here really. You can purchase cosmetic or vanity items from the shop using real money. So, if you absolutely MUST HAVE the purple haircut of butchery, feel free to drop down $5 or w/e it costs. Does that make you better than anyone? No. Does it mean you have $5 and decided you wanted to blow it on a purely cosmetic item? Yes. OP? No.
3) If a microtransaction does have any sort of in game effect, then it can be also be earned in game.
As long as it's not top level gear, this is fine with me. Although I'd like to see a decrease from the standard $15/month charge with such an item mall.
Just my 2¢.
so...
Unlikely.
The former owners of Cryptic stand to net themselves up to an additional $48 million for the sale of Cryptic to Infogrames (who gave it to the then broke Atari), based on profits by I think it was March 2011.
That's a lot of incentive to pump up the profits.
QFT. I planned on getting this until they announced the MT crap. Oh well, won't be much better gameplaywise than CoX anyway.
I think the sad thing is that it might have been.
They've done two things in CO which might have made it better. The open world design instead of instancing - which should make gameplay less repetitive; and much more limited use of cooldowns (except for the power armor framework) - which puts a bit more control in the player's hands.
im going to blow every dime i have in the item store right off to bat just to get everything they have to offer.
1. In F2P games, somewhere like 1-5% of the playerbase pay the bill for the rest of the players. In a P2P game with Microtransactions, how many players are scared away by subscription AND Microtransactions? Would 1-5% of the playerbase make up for the thousands of players NOT paying 15$ a month? Oh, and it's VERY rare that any developer pushes most revenue into developement... So even if they make 1000-100.000$ extra a month from microtransactions, the odds for seeing even one more dev working on the game are minimal(Personally, you have bigger chance of being eaten by a shark while flying a plane).
2. 1 part of the playerbase, mainly RP'ers get the short end of the stick. They HAVE to pay extra for the game, while the PvE content grinders or the PvP monkeys, all who only care for stats, couldnt care less that the playerbase they love to rag and hate on actually pays for their fun. Can you imagine the shitstorm if it was the PvP monkeys that had to pay for the others fun? Or the PvE content grinders? Supporting any microtransaction form when you're not even part of the playerbase that has to pay extra for their gameplay... Well, thats like supporthing Apartheid while you're safely squared away where it wont affect you say, like Uzbekistan. Makes me wish there would be a microtransaction/F2P that had the others pay....
3. Experience shows that IF microtransaction items has an effect on gameplay (for the usually non affected per #2) it's not available for non paying. If it were, they wouldnt be paying now would they? And lowering monthly fee would never happend, because that would lowering the safe income to swap it with a not so safe income.
15$ a month from 100.000 players "swing" less than 5-20$ a month from 1000-10.000 players. This you can find by looking at F2P companies and P2P companies. A F2P dev team is usually smaller than a P2P(And it really shows in patches. Less patches, less bugfixes, less added content, not counting additions to the microtransaction store).
Thats my 2€ (Woulda been 2¢ but my playstyle has me paying your bills too).
Imagine if they charged you for each arena, or you had to pay to open up a BG? Heh each person in the raid had to buy an attunement stone. Crap Roper is probably writing this all down, I better stop.
I don't know if that would work, green. The business models for MT games and P2P are so different they force constrictions on game design.
1. In F2P games, somewhere like 1-5% of the playerbase pay the bill for the rest of the players. In a P2P game with Microtransactions, how many players are scared away by subscription AND Microtransactions? Would 1-5% of the playerbase make up for the thousands of players NOT paying 15$ a month? Oh, and it's VERY rare that any developer pushes most revenue into developement... So even if they make 1000-100.000$ extra a month from microtransactions, the odds for seeing even one more dev working on the game are minimal(Personally, you have bigger chance of being eaten by a shark while flying a plane).
2. 1 part of the playerbase, mainly RP'ers get the short end of the stick. They HAVE to pay extra for the game, while the PvE content grinders or the PvP monkeys, all who only care for stats, couldnt care less that the playerbase they love to rag and hate on actually pays for their fun. Can you imagine the shitstorm if it was the PvP monkeys that had to pay for the others fun? Or the PvE content grinders? Supporting any microtransaction form when you're not even part of the playerbase that has to pay extra for their gameplay... Well, thats like supporthing Apartheid while you're safely squared away where it wont affect you say, like Uzbekistan. Makes me wish there would be a microtransaction/F2P that had the others pay....
3. Experience shows that IF microtransaction items has an effect on gameplay (for the usually non affected per #2) it's not available for non paying. If it were, they wouldnt be paying now would they? And lowering monthly fee would never happend, because that would lowering the safe income to swap it with a not so safe income.
15$ a month from 100.000 players "swing" less than 5-20$ a month from 1000-10.000 players. This you can find by looking at F2P companies and P2P companies. A F2P dev team is usually smaller than a P2P(And it really shows in patches. Less patches, less bugfixes, less added content, not counting additions to the microtransaction store).
Thats my 2 (Woulda been 2¢ but my playstyle has me paying your bills too).
Conjecture is a bad thing. Total obfuscation is awful. Your post falls somewhere after that. Facts w/o foundation, assumptions w/o basis. I don't even know where to start.
You've paid bills for me? You are truly off your rocker.
so...