as a L2 ganker and Shadowbane roller, LotRO PvE content is so much more fun then listening to some noob cry about the leggings or loot you just ganked. Mosnter play is just enough to satify mmy needs and if I really need to pwn noobs , I play counter Strike Source. THe whole notion that someone "needs" pvp to enjoy a game is false, the only people who need PVP are those who fail at PVE content. PVE content is so much more challenging then rolling people 20 levels lower then yourself.. Think the oinly noobs in this current era of mmorpg gaming are so called PVPers. People who have no clue what pvp is really about and hide behind the title of pvp cause they are to scared they may enjoy pve content.
Haha....you can't be serious. And whats the pics you posted? Good god...thank god I left lol. The armor in LOTRO is still the worst I've seen and I've played 3-4 new MMOs since leaving LOTRO.
Its great that you only enjoy PVE but everything you claim of PVPers is a joke...Seriously dude, get a clue.
as a L2 ganker and Shadowbane roller, LotRO PvE content is so much more fun then listening to some noob cry about the leggings or loot you just ganked. Mosnter play is just enough to satify mmy needs and if I really need to pwn noobs , I play counter Strike Source. THe whole notion that someone "needs" pvp to enjoy a game is false, the only people who need PVP are those who fail at PVE content. PVE content is so much more challenging then rolling people 20 levels lower then yourself.. Think the oinly noobs in this current era of mmorpg gaming are so called PVPers. People who have no clue what pvp is really about and hide behind the title of pvp cause they are to scared they may enjoy pve content.
"l2 ganker and shadowbane roller"
Ah, you mean a noskilled PvPer that has to pick on sheep to be able to win, instead of actually attacking other wolves. I see.
LOl and i'm sure you're the supreme end all be all of pvp skills ...LOL. If you never played shadowbane, you should probably just sit down, it was the most intensive pvp games ever built. DAoC was a wonderland lollipop kids game compared to Shadowbane. You entire discussion is forum fail , simple because you have no real connection to the pvp community at large. GG.
This guy cant be serious...you need to get out more dude
That's why you have a seperate PvP-only server. That way all the PvE-lovers can choose not to ever be pked and the pvpers can all gank each other all day.
But again, as was posted several times, pvp between same races makes no sense as it's not part of the current world or story.
That's like saying you want to play a game based on the hardy boys where both brothers hate each other and never talk to each other.
This is not to say that there aren't racial tensions but that is not what the story is about.
Or maybe it's like playing Star Wars where the Empire attacks it's own bases and the rebellion attacks it's own people. But heck, I and others posted quite a lot of info as to why it doesn't work. So if you are interested, please read and comment on that.
+1 for a Hardy Boys comparison in an MMO discussion.
You do realize there may be some people here that have no idea who the Hardy Boys are right, lol.
I still enjoyed the comparison none the less.
LOL! good point. I feel so old.
And it's a good thing I didn't use "Alfred Hitchcock and the Three Investigators" as that would have been worse!
It's a "joke" for the same reason that crafting in AoC is a "joke". It was never the focus of LotRO to provide an optimum, ffa PvP experience. The lore simply doesn't call for it.
There's nothing I've seen in any of the books where hobbits are ganking each other out in the streets, or orcs invading the Shire. Aside from Saruman and Wormtongue taking over, the folk of the Shire were entirely oblivious to the threat of Sauron. Bree, pretty much the same way. They saw Striders' coming as a bad omen. If a ranger riles people, you can imagine that day to day life is pretty dull and/or free from peril.
As far as raiding towns as a monster, I'd probably be all right with that... IF all monsters would aggro as if you were a PC(even if you're the same species, you're still treading in their territory), AND if when you died you were ported back to the monster zone. However, I don't think this would really improve the player experience for anybody.
Personally, I think the best way to do it all up is to open up Monster play zones around Orthanc and Moria. And all monster players should be ffa pvp, there. The lore certainly allows for orcs fighting other orcs, and the other animal types would certainly fight for dominance. And it would allow for monster players to do something in the absence of Free People players.
But for now, I'm glad there's not a big focus on PvP. I think the PvE experience is likely a better one, for not having to address PvP balancing gripes and griefing issues.
That's why you have a seperate PvP-only server. That way all the PvE-lovers can choose not to ever be pked and the pvpers can all gank each other all day.
But again, as was posted several times, pvp between same races makes no sense as it's not part of the current world or story.
That's like saying you want to play a game based on the hardy boys where both brothers hate each other and never talk to each other.
This is not to say that there aren't racial tensions but that is not what the story is about.
Or maybe it's like playing Star Wars where the Empire attacks it's own bases and the rebellion attacks it's own people. But heck, I and others posted quite a lot of info as to why it doesn't work. So if you are interested, please read and comment on that.
+1 for a Hardy Boys comparison in an MMO discussion.
You do realize there may be some people here that have no idea who the Hardy Boys are right, lol.
I still enjoyed the comparison none the less.
LOL! good point. I feel so old.
And it's a good thing I didn't use "Alfred Hitchcock and the Three Investigators" as that would have been worse!
So just curious why LOTRO doesnt have any open-world PvP at all? It would be a good game with 1 PvP server. I understand that most people just love to pay 15$ a month to kill computers and get a false sense of accomplishement but some people like playing against other players. The system they have now where monsters fight good guys is pretty weak, basically just follow a raid around and fight the other raid. There is little-to-no small group or 1v1 opportunities. The "class" system on the monster side is completely different from the good guys making balance very hard to achieve. Its basically a lame attempt to incorporate the "lore" of the LOTR world into the game where good guys fight bad guys. So why not make a system where elves can attack other elves in the real world (outside moors) and etc. If LOTR had a real PvP system this game would attract not only all the people who love to kill mobs all day and pay real money for it but also people who are avoiding this game because there is no real PvP.
Where is the rule that says an MMO MUST have PvP? LOTRO is a PvE game. Not everyone wants or cares about PvP.
as a L2 ganker and Shadowbane roller, LotRO PvE content is so much more fun then listening to some noob cry about the leggings or loot you just ganked. Mosnter play is just enough to satify mmy needs and if I really need to pwn noobs , I play counter Strike Source. THe whole notion that someone "needs" pvp to enjoy a game is false, the only people who need PVP are those who fail at PVE content. PVE content is so much more challenging then rolling people 20 levels lower then yourself.. Think the oinly noobs in this current era of mmorpg gaming are so called PVPers. People who have no clue what pvp is really about and hide behind the title of pvp cause they are to scared they may enjoy pve content.
Haha....you can't be serious. And whats the pics you posted? Good god...thank god I left lol. The armor in LOTRO is still the worst I've seen and I've played 3-4 new MMOs since leaving LOTRO.
Its great that you only enjoy PVE but everything you claim of PVPers is a joke...Seriously dude, get a clue.
as a L2 ganker and Shadowbane roller, LotRO PvE content is so much more fun then listening to some noob cry about the leggings or loot you just ganked. Mosnter play is just enough to satify mmy needs and if I really need to pwn noobs , I play counter Strike Source. THe whole notion that someone "needs" pvp to enjoy a game is false, the only people who need PVP are those who fail at PVE content. PVE content is so much more challenging then rolling people 20 levels lower then yourself.. Think the oinly noobs in this current era of mmorpg gaming are so called PVPers. People who have no clue what pvp is really about and hide behind the title of pvp cause they are to scared they may enjoy pve content.
Haha....you can't be serious. And whats the pics you posted? Good god...thank god I left lol. The armor in LOTRO is still the worst I've seen and I've played 3-4 new MMOs since leaving LOTRO.
Its great that you only enjoy PVE but everything you claim of PVPers is a joke...Seriously dude, get a clue.
I don't think people are asking for free for all pvp. Just open world. Obviously you couldnt kill your own race, although Ive been slaughtering Sharky's goons in bree alot lately. It could work and fit in the lore fine.
Now im not asking for or suggesting that. Turbine is in the best place to make that call. I trust them to do whats best, or to realize when its not and fix it. Thats one thing I like about LOTRO. I never ever have to visit the official forums to find out wtf happened. every thing Ive thought was borked, was fixed to my satisfaction. I trust them to do whats best to keep the game alive and healthy. If pvp is ever needed to do that, I trust them to do what they believe is best.
See you in the dream.. The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
as a L2 ganker and Shadowbane roller, LotRO PvE content is so much more fun then listening to some noob cry about the leggings or loot you just ganked. Mosnter play is just enough to satify mmy needs and if I really need to pwn noobs , I play counter Strike Source. THe whole notion that someone "needs" pvp to enjoy a game is false, the only people who need PVP are those who fail at PVE content. PVE content is so much more challenging then rolling people 20 levels lower then yourself.. Think the oinly noobs in this current era of mmorpg gaming are so called PVPers. People who have no clue what pvp is really about and hide behind the title of pvp cause they are to scared they may enjoy pve content.
That's why you have a seperate PvP-only server. That way all the PvE-lovers can choose not to ever be pked and the pvpers can all gank each other all day.
But again, as was posted several times, pvp between same races makes no sense as it's not part of the current world or story.
That's like saying you want to play a game based on the hardy boys where both brothers hate each other and never talk to each other.
This is not to say that there aren't racial tensions but that is not what the story is about.
Or maybe it's like playing Star Wars where the Empire attacks it's own bases and the rebellion attacks it's own people. But heck, I and others posted quite a lot of info as to why it doesn't work. So if you are interested, please read and comment on that.
Just because there aren't any instances of an elf attacking another elf or a dwarf in the books doesn't mean its not part of the lore. There are hundreds of NPC's in the game that were never mentioned in the book, and by your logic they should all be deleted because they are not part of the lore. It's not about "racial tensions" or anything of the like its just that some people might be criminals or murderers etc.. and those are the pvpers.
If the game is supposed to be based on the books and the lore why cant i start attacking the good guys towns with a monster? When you ask yourself that its when you realize PvP was just an afterthought with this game and how bad the current system really is. Either that or they figured that people who liked the LOTR lore couldn't handle a game where they would get killed by other players.
Bingo. Yes...it WAS just an afterthought, because whinning little children (not just an age assessment) from other games would come over to LotRO and piss and moan about it, so...Turbine tried to give them SOMETHING to soothe them and stop their stomping feet, while still staying within the game's lore as much as possible.
LotRO is predominantly played by fans of Tolkien's writing, which, it seems, is no longer required reading in the school systems, sadly. So you get all these kids that have no idea that there is an actual story behind this, that was not just written as "game lore," and that Tolkien had his works LEGALLY protected from alteration in any media format.
I would like to know, why some people seem to think that PvP HAS TO BE INCLUDED in every damn game? It's almost as if they have some sense of entitlement, and the world OWES it to them. You see far less people in Darkfall's forums whining for more PvE than you do here, people whining for more, better, whatever PvP. If a game's primary focus isn't PvP....then what sense does it make to expect standard style PvP in it? That would be like expecting a PvP oriented game, like Darkfall, to have standardized PvE comparable to EQ2 or WoW or something similar. That's just foolish. It's not a PvP game. Get over it.
If you don't like the style of PvP or don't like that a game doesn't HAVE PvP....go play something else and leave the adults to their roleplaying games, thank you very much. You...."kids".....can always go "pwn n00bs" somewhere else. It's really quite a simple solution and doesn't require whining on the forums, or for those that play (or played) LotRO having to constantly respond to comments and questions that are asked more out of the "why can't I have my WAY" mentality, than they are sincere questions.
These kind of "Oooooo waaaa, I want better PvP" posts LITERALLY give me the mental picture of a 2 year old laying on the floor of a grocery store throwing a public fit to get candy from the check out lane. And it makes me think about the same thing, too. That kid needs a "time out," or a brief meeting with a paddle to the butt cheeks.
as a L2 ganker and Shadowbane roller, LotRO PvE content is so much more fun then listening to some noob cry about the leggings or loot you just ganked. Mosnter play is just enough to satify mmy needs and if I really need to pwn noobs , I play counter Strike Source. THe whole notion that someone "needs" pvp to enjoy a game is false, the only people who need PVP are those who fail at PVE content. PVE content is so much more challenging then rolling people 20 levels lower then yourself.. Think the oinly noobs in this current era of mmorpg gaming are so called PVPers. People who have no clue what pvp is really about and hide behind the title of pvp cause they are to scared they may enjoy pve content.
That's why you have a seperate PvP-only server. That way all the PvE-lovers can choose not to ever be pked and the pvpers can all gank each other all day.
But again, as was posted several times, pvp between same races makes no sense as it's not part of the current world or story.
That's like saying you want to play a game based on the hardy boys where both brothers hate each other and never talk to each other.
This is not to say that there aren't racial tensions but that is not what the story is about.
Or maybe it's like playing Star Wars where the Empire attacks it's own bases and the rebellion attacks it's own people. But heck, I and others posted quite a lot of info as to why it doesn't work. So if you are interested, please read and comment on that.
Just because there aren't any instances of an elf attacking another elf or a dwarf in the books doesn't mean its not part of the lore. There are hundreds of NPC's in the game that were never mentioned in the book, and by your logic they should all be deleted because they are not part of the lore. It's not about "racial tensions" or anything of the like its just that some people might be criminals or murderers etc.. and those are the pvpers.
What you are talking about is the huge diconnect that some players have between playing in a particular setting and adapting that setting to be a game.
They are apples and oranges.
I highly doubt that there were many citings of squirrels or badgers or a variety of other wild life in the books. Furthermore, there was never any mention of shops or bathrooms if I recall.
Your argument doesn't work.
A book is a book and solely deals with story and character. Unless there is a reason to mention bathrooms or squirrels or badgers or shops it's just not going to be there. But since they are making a game world the world needs to be realistic and work as a world. Fair enough?
So they look at what is needed. Shops is a design decision as they intend to have an economy. LOTRO could have been made without trading or shops but many mmo players expect some sort of economy. A world needs wildlife so badgeres, squirrels and birds seem like a natural fit. Bathrooms? Well, I could see them putting the in for "realism" but it's really not needed as our characters are not going to be making use of them and it's just an art asset for the sake of it.
Elves against elves during the war of the ring? That is a complete rewriting of the story. It goes beyond just adding and subtracting things in order to make a world. To take that further, there was no mention of sub machine guns or biological warfare or radio. Throwing that in would just not fit because it doesn't fit into the world.
During the war of the ring there were no elves figthing against hobbits or dwarves. Perhaps much earlier in middle earth's history (and I'm sure there are Lord of the Rings scholars who can cite this info) but not during the time of the game. The time that the hobbit or the lord of the rings is set.
It just didn't exist.
And this is a huge problem that some players have because they really can't detach themselves from a very specific world setting and some generic dungeons and dragons or generic fantasy setting. The Lord of the Rings is not "The Lord of the Rings" because of elves, dwarves and hobbits. It is the lord of the rings becuase of the story and how these races and how the main characters interacted.
Changing these things completely changes any sense of the world you are playing in. Whether they mention it or not.
This goes for any game world.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Why is it that every PvE MMO out there inevitably has people coming into its threads insisting that the game would be better if it had open PvP... even when popular consensus (aka the people enjoying it as is) shows otherwise?
Why is it that when they're given perfectly valid answers to the first question - especially in this case where the reasons are *well* known - such people can't accept that as the answer and instead have to keep arguing?
Why is it that in every such thread, those arguing for open PvP in a PvE MMO inevitably start insulting the game and/or those who play it - even if indirectly (e.g. "PvE takes no skill" and myriad other canned mantras)?
Darkfall, Lineage 2, Mortal Online and a number of other MMOs current and upcoming support, or will support open world PvP where you can kill anyone almost anywhere you like (if you're able) as you please. So why not check those games out? It would be like me going into forums for Darkfall and arguing that it would be better if PvP was consensual. It would make absolutely no sense in that game, and so I wouldn't bother. I would simply go play a MMO that has consensual PvP if that's what I was looking for.
Well said.
Why the hell is it that some folks think every single MMO needs to cater to their peculiar tastes? Whether you like sandboxes, directed content, forced grouping, solo content, FFA PvP, consensual PvP, deep crafting, or no crafting...there are games out there that cater to your tastes. If more players would go play something that is aimed at their tastes instead whining like a five year old about all the games that don't, the world would be a better place.
Of course if more folks did that these message boards would likely die.. ;-)
I don't want to write this, and you don't want to read it. But now it's too late for both of us.
Asking for an FFA pvp server on lotro is like me going into DF and asking for a pve server. It's not gonna happen. If you want FFA pvp, go play DF. If you want pve, play lotro.
Asking for an FFA pvp server on lotro is like me going into DF and asking for a pve server. It's not gonna happen. If you want FFA pvp, go play DF. If you want pve, play lotro.
So just curious why LOTRO doesnt have any open-world PvP at all? It would be a good game with 1 PvP server. I understand that most people just love to pay 15$ a month to kill computers and get a false sense of accomplishement but some people like playing against other players. The system they have now where monsters fight good guys is pretty weak, basically just follow a raid around and fight the other raid. There is little-to-no small group or 1v1 opportunities. The "class" system on the monster side is completely different from the good guys making balance very hard to achieve. Its basically a lame attempt to incorporate the "lore" of the LOTR world into the game where good guys fight bad guys. So why not make a system where elves can attack other elves in the real world (outside moors) and etc. If LOTR had a real PvP system this game would attract not only all the people who love to kill mobs all day and pay real money for it but also people who are avoiding this game because there is no real PvP.
It is exactly this kind of elitist undertone found in your post (PvE is for newbies, everyone can beat a computer, PvP is for real players) that makes me wishing PvP should NOT be developed in LOTRO.
I do find that PvP has two inherent problems: it caters more to immature players, who wants to mindlessly bash each other's brains the whole day and it heightens conflicts, whether at a kin or individual level (I pawned you, no I was ganked >>> this kid of lame childish discourse).
The majority of the players in LOTRO couldn't care less about PvP. I myself am playing this game since 6 months and have tried twice to play monster side, but have found it very uninspiring. I know almost all my kin shares my same thought. The PvPers are a community very vocal on the forums, but very small in numbers. Turbine is no fool. If the majority would have asked for PvP, they would have develop the PVPM more.
So just curious why LOTRO doesnt have any open-world PvP at all? It would be a good game with 1 PvP server. I understand that most people just love to pay 15$ a month to kill computers and get a false sense of accomplishement but some people like playing against other players. The system they have now where monsters fight good guys is pretty weak, basically just follow a raid around and fight the other raid. There is little-to-no small group or 1v1 opportunities. The "class" system on the monster side is completely different from the good guys making balance very hard to achieve. Its basically a lame attempt to incorporate the "lore" of the LOTR world into the game where good guys fight bad guys. So why not make a system where elves can attack other elves in the real world (outside moors) and etc. If LOTR had a real PvP system this game would attract not only all the people who love to kill mobs all day and pay real money for it but also people who are avoiding this game because there is no real PvP.
It is exactly this kind of elitist undertone found in your post (PvE is for newbies, everyone can beat a computer, PvP is for real players) that makes me wishing PvP should NOT be developed in LOTRO.
I do find that PvP has two inherent problems: it caters more to immature players, who wants to mindlessly bash each other's brains the whole day and it heightens conflicts, whether at a kin or individual level (I pawned you, no I was ganked >>> this kid of lame childish discourse).
The majority of the players in LOTRO couldn't care less about PvP. I myself am playing this game since 6 monhts and have tried twice to play monster side, but have found it very uninspiring. I know almost all my kin shares my same thought. The PvPers are a community very vocal on the forums, but very small in numbers. Turbine is no fool. If the the majority would have asked for PvP, they would have develop the PVPM more.
Exactly. This cannot be said enough.
MMO pvp is a joke. The crowd MMO pvp attracts is a joke.
Therefore, if you run a MMO, minimize pvp (i.e. cage it off) so your whole game doesn't become a joke.
So just curious why LOTRO doesnt have any open-world PvP at all? It would be a good game with 1 PvP server. I understand that most people just love to pay 15$ a month to kill computers and get a false sense of accomplishement but some people like playing against other players. The system they have now where monsters fight good guys is pretty weak, basically just follow a raid around and fight the other raid. There is little-to-no small group or 1v1 opportunities. The "class" system on the monster side is completely different from the good guys making balance very hard to achieve. Its basically a lame attempt to incorporate the "lore" of the LOTR world into the game where good guys fight bad guys. So why not make a system where elves can attack other elves in the real world (outside moors) and etc. If LOTR had a real PvP system this game would attract not only all the people who love to kill mobs all day and pay real money for it but also people who are avoiding this game because there is no real PvP.
-It's a PvE game....simple, why argue over something that have no point in arguing......play something else if you want PvP
-It's a PvE game....simple, why argue over something that have no point in arguing......play something else if you want PvP
Quoted for Truth, Awesome, and More Truth.
Raising a ruckus and arguing over PvP in LOTRO is like me arguing that there's no freaking Elves or spells in EVE Online: It's just not that kind of game. Don't like it, don't play it, stop bitching to us why you want it, it's not the market it aims for, it's hands are tied by the group that licenses the IP, it's just. Not. Going. To change.
PS -- to the clown that commented "the game has so much potential" I think the fact that it's been running for a few years, has a decent population and has frequent updates (including the recent Siege of Mirkwood expansion) is proof it's doing fine being a PvE-focused game. But as someone who played WAR and Aion, I will say this seems like the only modern MMO that can even touch the "RvR" style of PvP right. It has some kinks and flaws but it's still the game I come back and play for that sort of thing while the rest crashes, burns, and lags out.
There was never a case of hobbit on hobbit violence in any of Tolkien works, this is also true for elves.
If you take a step back, and look objectively. Monster play was quite an ingenious solution turbine came up with, and i fully expect it to be expanded as the game matures.
---------- "Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
The only way to have true PVP in Middle Earth would be to have the forces of Mordar as playable classes. FFA PVP would be out of the question and totally against the lore. There are several PVP game available if that is what one desires.
So just curious why LOTRO doesnt have any open-world PvP at all? It would be a good game with 1 PvP server. I understand that most people just love to pay 15$ a month to kill computers and get a false sense of accomplishement but some people like playing against other players. The system they have now where monsters fight good guys is pretty weak, basically just follow a raid around and fight the other raid. There is little-to-no small group or 1v1 opportunities. The "class" system on the monster side is completely different from the good guys making balance very hard to achieve. Its basically a lame attempt to incorporate the "lore" of the LOTR world into the game where good guys fight bad guys. So why not make a system where elves can attack other elves in the real world (outside moors) and etc. If LOTR had a real PvP system this game would attract not only all the people who love to kill mobs all day and pay real money for it but also people who are avoiding this game because there is no real PvP.
-It's a PvE game....simple, why argue over something that have no point in arguing......play something else if you want PvP
Agree totally. Personally i think they made a mistake putting the monster play in at all, it just led to moans and accusations from PVPers and was a half hearted nod towards PVP. The only way to do real PVP in LOTRO is to make Orcs, Trolls, Goblins etc... playable races, maybe with contestable realms like in DAoC, or maybe a totally PVP server with only towns, cities and camps safe. Now that would be cool.
It remains the best PvE game around, bar none, but it isn't a PVP game, or meant for PVPers.
Your in the wrong game dude, I suggest Aion... Beautiful game gone to waste is what I say which is overloaded by pvpers, go join the crowd and gank lowbies for fun so they can't enjoy the game >.>
Comments
Haha....you can't be serious. And whats the pics you posted? Good god...thank god I left lol. The armor in LOTRO is still the worst I've seen and I've played 3-4 new MMOs since leaving LOTRO.
Its great that you only enjoy PVE but everything you claim of PVPers is a joke...Seriously dude, get a clue.
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
"l2 ganker and shadowbane roller"
Ah, you mean a noskilled PvPer that has to pick on sheep to be able to win, instead of actually attacking other wolves. I see.
LOl and i'm sure you're the supreme end all be all of pvp skills ...LOL. If you never played shadowbane, you should probably just sit down, it was the most intensive pvp games ever built. DAoC was a wonderland lollipop kids game compared to Shadowbane. You entire discussion is forum fail , simple because you have no real connection to the pvp community at large. GG.
This guy cant be serious...you need to get out more dude
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
But again, as was posted several times, pvp between same races makes no sense as it's not part of the current world or story.
That's like saying you want to play a game based on the hardy boys where both brothers hate each other and never talk to each other.
This is not to say that there aren't racial tensions but that is not what the story is about.
Or maybe it's like playing Star Wars where the Empire attacks it's own bases and the rebellion attacks it's own people. But heck, I and others posted quite a lot of info as to why it doesn't work. So if you are interested, please read and comment on that.
+1 for a Hardy Boys comparison in an MMO discussion.
You do realize there may be some people here that have no idea who the Hardy Boys are right, lol.
I still enjoyed the comparison none the less.
LOL! good point. I feel so old.
And it's a good thing I didn't use "Alfred Hitchcock and the Three Investigators" as that would have been worse!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Investigators
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
It's a "joke" for the same reason that crafting in AoC is a "joke". It was never the focus of LotRO to provide an optimum, ffa PvP experience. The lore simply doesn't call for it.
There's nothing I've seen in any of the books where hobbits are ganking each other out in the streets, or orcs invading the Shire. Aside from Saruman and Wormtongue taking over, the folk of the Shire were entirely oblivious to the threat of Sauron. Bree, pretty much the same way. They saw Striders' coming as a bad omen. If a ranger riles people, you can imagine that day to day life is pretty dull and/or free from peril.
As far as raiding towns as a monster, I'd probably be all right with that... IF all monsters would aggro as if you were a PC(even if you're the same species, you're still treading in their territory), AND if when you died you were ported back to the monster zone. However, I don't think this would really improve the player experience for anybody.
Personally, I think the best way to do it all up is to open up Monster play zones around Orthanc and Moria. And all monster players should be ffa pvp, there. The lore certainly allows for orcs fighting other orcs, and the other animal types would certainly fight for dominance. And it would allow for monster players to do something in the absence of Free People players.
But for now, I'm glad there's not a big focus on PvP. I think the PvE experience is likely a better one, for not having to address PvP balancing gripes and griefing issues.
But again, as was posted several times, pvp between same races makes no sense as it's not part of the current world or story.
That's like saying you want to play a game based on the hardy boys where both brothers hate each other and never talk to each other.
This is not to say that there aren't racial tensions but that is not what the story is about.
Or maybe it's like playing Star Wars where the Empire attacks it's own bases and the rebellion attacks it's own people. But heck, I and others posted quite a lot of info as to why it doesn't work. So if you are interested, please read and comment on that.
+1 for a Hardy Boys comparison in an MMO discussion.
You do realize there may be some people here that have no idea who the Hardy Boys are right, lol.
I still enjoyed the comparison none the less.
LOL! good point. I feel so old.
And it's a good thing I didn't use "Alfred Hitchcock and the Three Investigators" as that would have been worse!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Investigators
I can only imagine that porn fan fiction...
Where is the rule that says an MMO MUST have PvP? LOTRO is a PvE game. Not everyone wants or cares about PvP.
Playing: DDO, LOTRO, UO
Favorites: UO, DAoC, Asheron's Call
Waiting For: Nothing
Haha....you can't be serious. And whats the pics you posted? Good god...thank god I left lol. The armor in LOTRO is still the worst I've seen and I've played 3-4 new MMOs since leaving LOTRO.
Its great that you only enjoy PVE but everything you claim of PVPers is a joke...Seriously dude, get a clue.
Yes, thank God you left.
Haha....you can't be serious. And whats the pics you posted? Good god...thank god I left lol. The armor in LOTRO is still the worst I've seen and I've played 3-4 new MMOs since leaving LOTRO.
Its great that you only enjoy PVE but everything you claim of PVPers is a joke...Seriously dude, get a clue.
Yes, thank God you left.
QFT
I don't think people are asking for free for all pvp. Just open world. Obviously you couldnt kill your own race, although Ive been slaughtering Sharky's goons in bree alot lately. It could work and fit in the lore fine.
Now im not asking for or suggesting that. Turbine is in the best place to make that call. I trust them to do whats best, or to realize when its not and fix it. Thats one thing I like about LOTRO. I never ever have to visit the official forums to find out wtf happened. every thing Ive thought was borked, was fixed to my satisfaction. I trust them to do whats best to keep the game alive and healthy. If pvp is ever needed to do that, I trust them to do what they believe is best.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
As has been stated MANY times already, LOTRO is not a PvP game, PvMP was added later on.
There are many other games that do PvP to a greater extent than LOTRO, and have PvP servers. Go play one of them.
Open-world/ffa PvP ain't gonna happen, stop whining and deal with it, kthx.
That's why you have a seperate PvP-only server. That way all the PvE-lovers can choose not to ever be pked and the pvpers can all gank each other all day.
But again, as was posted several times, pvp between same races makes no sense as it's not part of the current world or story.
That's like saying you want to play a game based on the hardy boys where both brothers hate each other and never talk to each other.
This is not to say that there aren't racial tensions but that is not what the story is about.
Or maybe it's like playing Star Wars where the Empire attacks it's own bases and the rebellion attacks it's own people. But heck, I and others posted quite a lot of info as to why it doesn't work. So if you are interested, please read and comment on that.
Just because there aren't any instances of an elf attacking another elf or a dwarf in the books doesn't mean its not part of the lore. There are hundreds of NPC's in the game that were never mentioned in the book, and by your logic they should all be deleted because they are not part of the lore. It's not about "racial tensions" or anything of the like its just that some people might be criminals or murderers etc.. and those are the pvpers.
Bingo. Yes...it WAS just an afterthought, because whinning little children (not just an age assessment) from other games would come over to LotRO and piss and moan about it, so...Turbine tried to give them SOMETHING to soothe them and stop their stomping feet, while still staying within the game's lore as much as possible.
LotRO is predominantly played by fans of Tolkien's writing, which, it seems, is no longer required reading in the school systems, sadly. So you get all these kids that have no idea that there is an actual story behind this, that was not just written as "game lore," and that Tolkien had his works LEGALLY protected from alteration in any media format.
I would like to know, why some people seem to think that PvP HAS TO BE INCLUDED in every damn game? It's almost as if they have some sense of entitlement, and the world OWES it to them. You see far less people in Darkfall's forums whining for more PvE than you do here, people whining for more, better, whatever PvP. If a game's primary focus isn't PvP....then what sense does it make to expect standard style PvP in it? That would be like expecting a PvP oriented game, like Darkfall, to have standardized PvE comparable to EQ2 or WoW or something similar. That's just foolish. It's not a PvP game. Get over it.
If you don't like the style of PvP or don't like that a game doesn't HAVE PvP....go play something else and leave the adults to their roleplaying games, thank you very much. You...."kids".....can always go "pwn n00bs" somewhere else. It's really quite a simple solution and doesn't require whining on the forums, or for those that play (or played) LotRO having to constantly respond to comments and questions that are asked more out of the "why can't I have my WAY" mentality, than they are sincere questions.
These kind of "Oooooo waaaa, I want better PvP" posts LITERALLY give me the mental picture of a 2 year old laying on the floor of a grocery store throwing a public fit to get candy from the check out lane. And it makes me think about the same thing, too. That kid needs a "time out," or a brief meeting with a paddle to the butt cheeks.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
That's why you have a seperate PvP-only server. That way all the PvE-lovers can choose not to ever be pked and the pvpers can all gank each other all day.
But again, as was posted several times, pvp between same races makes no sense as it's not part of the current world or story.
That's like saying you want to play a game based on the hardy boys where both brothers hate each other and never talk to each other.
This is not to say that there aren't racial tensions but that is not what the story is about.
Or maybe it's like playing Star Wars where the Empire attacks it's own bases and the rebellion attacks it's own people. But heck, I and others posted quite a lot of info as to why it doesn't work. So if you are interested, please read and comment on that.
Just because there aren't any instances of an elf attacking another elf or a dwarf in the books doesn't mean its not part of the lore. There are hundreds of NPC's in the game that were never mentioned in the book, and by your logic they should all be deleted because they are not part of the lore. It's not about "racial tensions" or anything of the like its just that some people might be criminals or murderers etc.. and those are the pvpers.
What you are talking about is the huge diconnect that some players have between playing in a particular setting and adapting that setting to be a game.
They are apples and oranges.
I highly doubt that there were many citings of squirrels or badgers or a variety of other wild life in the books. Furthermore, there was never any mention of shops or bathrooms if I recall.
Your argument doesn't work.
A book is a book and solely deals with story and character. Unless there is a reason to mention bathrooms or squirrels or badgers or shops it's just not going to be there. But since they are making a game world the world needs to be realistic and work as a world. Fair enough?
So they look at what is needed. Shops is a design decision as they intend to have an economy. LOTRO could have been made without trading or shops but many mmo players expect some sort of economy. A world needs wildlife so badgeres, squirrels and birds seem like a natural fit. Bathrooms? Well, I could see them putting the in for "realism" but it's really not needed as our characters are not going to be making use of them and it's just an art asset for the sake of it.
Elves against elves during the war of the ring? That is a complete rewriting of the story. It goes beyond just adding and subtracting things in order to make a world. To take that further, there was no mention of sub machine guns or biological warfare or radio. Throwing that in would just not fit because it doesn't fit into the world.
During the war of the ring there were no elves figthing against hobbits or dwarves. Perhaps much earlier in middle earth's history (and I'm sure there are Lord of the Rings scholars who can cite this info) but not during the time of the game. The time that the hobbit or the lord of the rings is set.
It just didn't exist.
And this is a huge problem that some players have because they really can't detach themselves from a very specific world setting and some generic dungeons and dragons or generic fantasy setting. The Lord of the Rings is not "The Lord of the Rings" because of elves, dwarves and hobbits. It is the lord of the rings becuase of the story and how these races and how the main characters interacted.
Changing these things completely changes any sense of the world you are playing in. Whether they mention it or not.
This goes for any game world.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Well said.
Why the hell is it that some folks think every single MMO needs to cater to their peculiar tastes? Whether you like sandboxes, directed content, forced grouping, solo content, FFA PvP, consensual PvP, deep crafting, or no crafting...there are games out there that cater to your tastes. If more players would go play something that is aimed at their tastes instead whining like a five year old about all the games that don't, the world would be a better place.
Of course if more folks did that these message boards would likely die.. ;-)
I don't want to write this, and you don't want to read it. But now it's too late for both of us.
Open war is upon you whether you would risk it or not.
To come all this way only to quit right when War comes to dominate all life in middle earth.
Will you fight!!?!!
LOL just kiddin guys.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
Asking for an FFA pvp server on lotro is like me going into DF and asking for a pve server. It's not gonna happen. If you want FFA pvp, go play DF. If you want pve, play lotro.
Seems like a no-brainer, doesn't it?
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
It is exactly this kind of elitist undertone found in your post (PvE is for newbies, everyone can beat a computer, PvP is for real players) that makes me wishing PvP should NOT be developed in LOTRO.
I do find that PvP has two inherent problems: it caters more to immature players, who wants to mindlessly bash each other's brains the whole day and it heightens conflicts, whether at a kin or individual level (I pawned you, no I was ganked >>> this kid of lame childish discourse).
The majority of the players in LOTRO couldn't care less about PvP. I myself am playing this game since 6 months and have tried twice to play monster side, but have found it very uninspiring. I know almost all my kin shares my same thought. The PvPers are a community very vocal on the forums, but very small in numbers. Turbine is no fool. If the majority would have asked for PvP, they would have develop the PVPM more.
It is exactly this kind of elitist undertone found in your post (PvE is for newbies, everyone can beat a computer, PvP is for real players) that makes me wishing PvP should NOT be developed in LOTRO.
I do find that PvP has two inherent problems: it caters more to immature players, who wants to mindlessly bash each other's brains the whole day and it heightens conflicts, whether at a kin or individual level (I pawned you, no I was ganked >>> this kid of lame childish discourse).
The majority of the players in LOTRO couldn't care less about PvP. I myself am playing this game since 6 monhts and have tried twice to play monster side, but have found it very uninspiring. I know almost all my kin shares my same thought. The PvPers are a community very vocal on the forums, but very small in numbers. Turbine is no fool. If the the majority would have asked for PvP, they would have develop the PVPM more.
Exactly. This cannot be said enough.
MMO pvp is a joke. The crowd MMO pvp attracts is a joke.
Therefore, if you run a MMO, minimize pvp (i.e. cage it off) so your whole game doesn't become a joke.
-It's a PvE game....simple, why argue over something that have no point in arguing......play something else if you want PvP
Quoted for Truth, Awesome, and More Truth.
Raising a ruckus and arguing over PvP in LOTRO is like me arguing that there's no freaking Elves or spells in EVE Online: It's just not that kind of game. Don't like it, don't play it, stop bitching to us why you want it, it's not the market it aims for, it's hands are tied by the group that licenses the IP, it's just. Not. Going. To change.
PS -- to the clown that commented "the game has so much potential" I think the fact that it's been running for a few years, has a decent population and has frequent updates (including the recent Siege of Mirkwood expansion) is proof it's doing fine being a PvE-focused game. But as someone who played WAR and Aion, I will say this seems like the only modern MMO that can even touch the "RvR" style of PvP right. It has some kinks and flaws but it's still the game I come back and play for that sort of thing while the rest crashes, burns, and lags out.
There was never a case of hobbit on hobbit violence in any of Tolkien works, this is also true for elves.
If you take a step back, and look objectively. Monster play was quite an ingenious solution turbine came up with, and i fully expect it to be expanded as the game matures.
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"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
The only way to have true PVP in Middle Earth would be to have the forces of Mordar as playable classes. FFA PVP would be out of the question and totally against the lore. There are several PVP game available if that is what one desires.
-It's a PvE game....simple, why argue over something that have no point in arguing......play something else if you want PvP
Agree totally. Personally i think they made a mistake putting the monster play in at all, it just led to moans and accusations from PVPers and was a half hearted nod towards PVP. The only way to do real PVP in LOTRO is to make Orcs, Trolls, Goblins etc... playable races, maybe with contestable realms like in DAoC, or maybe a totally PVP server with only towns, cities and camps safe. Now that would be cool.
It remains the best PvE game around, bar none, but it isn't a PVP game, or meant for PVPers.
Your in the wrong game dude, I suggest Aion... Beautiful game gone to waste is what I say which is overloaded by pvpers, go join the crowd and gank lowbies for fun so they can't enjoy the game >.>