Now, I could be wrong on this but I'm just recalling from a long time ago. The original Star Trek Online plan - before Cryptic took the game into their hands - was just that, or something along those lines. Orginally you'd have your entire ship readily accessiable (Cryptic plans to get there) and you could walk about the ship freely. They never said details on the ships and game play but they did state that every player was required. You'd need sickbay personel, you'd need engineers - and so forth. Of course they also were important for away missions, every player was required and it was highly team-oriented. And it was that which made me instantly fall in love with Star Trek Online. Originally I figured to myself, that a big ship like in the movies was going to be guild-like or further, higher level - in the earlier stages they'd have to find away for smaller ships. That was what I first thought.
Wow... ya know, that would SEEM cool as critter crap, but it's entirely unfeasible as a MMO. The reasons are clear to anyone that remembers the POB ships in SWG. They were a blast but no one used them. Because one POB ship was nowhere near as potent as all those players in their own ships. And if you increase potency to where 5 crewmembers make a ship 5 times more powerful, how do you balance mobs for another ship with a crew of 2 players and 3 npcs?
I'm not sure there's a deader horse on this forum.
Your expectations make you clueless. In YOUR opinion STO in not worthy of the name, and yes you guys are siting bugs and other stuff as proof of YOUR opinions.
I simply pointed out the truth, that all MMOs start out this way, and the rest is only your opinion, which is bases on a few days of BETA testing,,, its laughable!
Name a single bug that has been mentioned in the thread. I can't find any.
Another thing is that open beta is representative of how the game will look, play and feel for at least the first year, no matter how much the developers and publisher will want you to believe otherwise. It's always been that way and i very much doubt STO will break that tradition.
And lastly, this thread is all about expectations. Your only contribution so far has been your own opinion that i am clueless, aswell as not actually reading the thread seeing as you keep going on about bugs while no one in the thread has mentioned any.
More lies... you WoW fanbois are pathetic.
Everysingle MMO I have ever played (been playing since Ultima Online) has gone thru major changes in the first year, some good and some bad. The ones that have made it were EVE, Anarchy Online, WoW and EQ and there still here after many years, the others like Conan and WAR didnt, and they are gone or will be soon.
So your opinions are very flimsy at best. I have backed up my opinion with historical facts, you simply lie.
Originally posted by DoomsDay01OMG. I can't believe you went there. You are a star ship captain, your not a member of the council. Your not out negotiating a treaty with the klingons, they are leaving that in far more capable hands than you. Heck, in one mission, I helped a klingon defeat a common enemy and he thanked me for helping and warned me at the same time that, next time we met in battle he would kill me. Thats EXACTLY the kind of things that went on in star trek. Your mind is just to closed to what you wanted it to be, that you can't even see it has those elements, at least on some level, in the game.
As for exploration, what do you think your doing on those missions? Have you been to those planets or those solar systems before? Your freaking exploring them as your doing missions. Sure, its not wide open exploration but if you open your eyes and look, again, it is there. Sorry you don't like the game, but it is far from the way your describing it. It simply didn't fall under what YOU wanted from star trek. Again, not a bad thing, but please, don't try to make it out as a $5 wii game, because its not.
a) What's so special about being a captain when everyone else is a captain too? Not to mention when, in a few months time, every single player you meet will be an admiral. How immersive and believable.
Because its a freaking MMO. How immersive is it that you had to sit down in your chair and LOG into a GAME. Seriously, your just being petty here.
b) I'm not talking about negotiating on behalf of the Federation. I'm talking on a ship to ship level.
Maybe, JUST maybe, the klingons dont give a rats ass what you got to say and would just try to blow you out of space for being near them. So far, thats the impressions I got. Oh yeah, I forgot, we are at WAR.
c) So you found a mission where you got a henchman to shoot stuff. It doesn't change the gameplay. The mission might aswell have another federation ship helping you out instead - The "conversation" you had is just a big tease.
Still, it was exactly the kind of thing that happened in star trek. you can not deny that. How many times did archer save the klingons and how many times did the klingons tell him when they met again, he would be destroyed. What you want is a true RPG. get your friends together and let your imagination run wild!
d) If it was truly exploration, then why are there constantly other federation ships in my mission areas?
I admit that true exploration is hard to do, but i have to point out (yet again) that i never said it should be the focus of the game. It should be an option, an option you don't have in STO.
Again, the problem is on YOUR side. Go into the social panel, turn off open instances and set it to allow invites only. Now it will only be you in those instances (with the exception of fleet incidences and sector missions). Now, I wont deny that free exploration would be nice and I think will be possible down the road, but exploration is there. Don't worry about getting missions, just take off and visit systems. I have gotten missions just from entering systems that I didnt even get a mission to go to. You CAN explore, you just happen to be exploring the known universe as it is.
LOL @ RexNebular. We agreee to disagree. Others argue so much. We can agree, you don't like it and don't play. I like it and play. That is so simple, why do people have to argue so much and try to make their opinion someone else's. The people that argue and fight NEVER change each others mind despite all the screaming. LOL, oh well different strokes for different folks.
I'm old not dead. (Nov8tr is pronounced innovator)
I think a lot of what you want will likely come as STO evolves. HOwever the name of the game at this point is ensure a solid foundation from which you can grow.
You my friend are a dreamer. None of the things the OP wants added will be added. The game design will not allow it. I will not be looking foward to your review as you are obviously clueless
Currently Playing: Fallen Earth Played and liked: TCOS, Vanguard, Guild Wars, DDO Played and didn't like: CO, MO, STO, DF, AoC, WAR, WoW, EQ2, EVE, most f2p Waiting for: Earthrise, Guild Wars 2, Secret World
Originally posted by DoomsDay01OMG. I can't believe you went there. You are a star ship captain, your not a member of the council. Your not out negotiating a treaty with the klingons, they are leaving that in far more capable hands than you. Heck, in one mission, I helped a klingon defeat a common enemy and he thanked me for helping and warned me at the same time that, next time we met in battle he would kill me. Thats EXACTLY the kind of things that went on in star trek. Your mind is just to closed to what you wanted it to be, that you can't even see it has those elements, at least on some level, in the game.
As for exploration, what do you think your doing on those missions? Have you been to those planets or those solar systems before? Your freaking exploring them as your doing missions. Sure, its not wide open exploration but if you open your eyes and look, again, it is there. Sorry you don't like the game, but it is far from the way your describing it. It simply didn't fall under what YOU wanted from star trek. Again, not a bad thing, but please, don't try to make it out as a $5 wii game, because its not.
a) What's so special about being a captain when everyone else is a captain too? Not to mention when, in a few months time, every single player you meet will be an admiral. How immersive and believable.
What would be the point of being an engineer when everyone else can be an engineer, too? Medic? WoW Death Knight? Not sure I get your logic, here. It's always been a part of MMO's that everyone be given the opportunity to achieve the things others have ingame. Even in Eve every person has the opportunity to participate in, say, the destruction of a Titan.
Other than that, I tend to agree with you on the topic of exploration. But if alot of it is turned off as CB folks have said, there still may be something there.
Of course MMO change during the first year, but the core gameplay always the stay the same. They will add content, new ships, new skills, new systems but guess what, you'll still be shooting stuff 90% of the time.
BTW why do you assume anyone who has a negative opinion about the game plays WoW ? I don't like STO, does this mean I'm a WoW fanboy ?
Originally posted by Adalwulff More lies... you WoW fanbois are pathetic. Everysingle MMO I have ever played (been playing since Ultima Online) has gone thru major changes in the first year, some good and some bad. The ones that have made it were EVE, Anarchy Online, WoW and EQ and there still here after many years, the others like Conan and WAR didnt, and they are gone or will be soon. So your opinions are very flimsy at best. I have backed up my opinion with historical facts, you simply lie.
I'll just take your "historical facts" and experience with MMO's with a grain of salt. I don't really take the word from anonymous people who registered just a few hours ago and have only posted flames, and only in this forum.
You're not helping your credibility along with insulting me at every turn either.
You also still are trying to deviate from the topic. This thread is about "how STO could have been", not about "this game has bugs". And still, i have yet to mention a single bug, and so does everyone else in this thread. If you don't have anything to contribute to the topic, you have the option to not post in it at all.
c) So you found a mission where you got a henchman to shoot stuff. It doesn't change the gameplay. The mission might aswell have another federation ship helping you out instead - The "conversation" you had is just a big tease.
Still, it was exactly the kind of thing that happened in star trek. you can not deny that. How many times did archer save the klingons and how many times did the klingons tell him when they met again, he would be destroyed. What you want is a true RPG. get your friends together and let your imagination run wild!
You forgot that one episode when the Klingon broke from the script and punched Shatner in the face.
See, I don't want the story to be scripted and go down the same path every time, I want it to be like the TV show! :P
Been playing the open beta meself. The game strikes me as being as deep as a dinner plate. It has no substance, no imagination and is boring. Where is the depth to this game. It's as if they took no time to make it thinking and knowing that trekkies would jump right in sight unseen. I don't expect it to last over a couple of years unless the trekkie fans can keep it propped up.
I pity those who forked out the big cash for pre orders. Should be a lesson. Never buy an MMO until you can play open beta or can get a trial account. Never.
Originally posted by Robsolf Originally posted by ChromeBallz
Originally posted by DoomsDay01OMG. I can't believe you went there. You are a star ship captain, your not a member of the council. Your not out negotiating a treaty with the klingons, they are leaving that in far more capable hands than you. Heck, in one mission, I helped a klingon defeat a common enemy and he thanked me for helping and warned me at the same time that, next time we met in battle he would kill me. Thats EXACTLY the kind of things that went on in star trek. Your mind is just to closed to what you wanted it to be, that you can't even see it has those elements, at least on some level, in the game. As for exploration, what do you think your doing on those missions? Have you been to those planets or those solar systems before? Your freaking exploring them as your doing missions. Sure, its not wide open exploration but if you open your eyes and look, again, it is there. Sorry you don't like the game, but it is far from the way your describing it. It simply didn't fall under what YOU wanted from star trek. Again, not a bad thing, but please, don't try to make it out as a $5 wii game, because its not.
a) What's so special about being a captain when everyone else is a captain too? Not to mention when, in a few months time, every single player you meet will be an admiral. How immersive and believable. What would be the point of being an engineer when everyone else can be an engineer, too? Medic? WoW Death Knight? Not sure I get your logic, here. It's always been a part of MMO's that everyone be given the opportunity to achieve the things others have ingame. Even in Eve every person has the opportunity to participate in, say, the destruction of a Titan.
Other than that, I tend to agree with you on the topic of exploration. But if alot of it is turned off as CB folks have said, there still may be something there.
You can have a team of 20-30 engineers on a starship, but there can be only one captain. Higher ranks should be earned through the social infrastructure, not through a grind. Also, a captain is not an engineer - An engineer is a profession which can have ranks from ensign up to lieutenant commander. Commander, captain and admiral are ranks which are only available to the command branch of Starfleet.
What i mean here is more something along the lines of titles. Yes, you can have levels, but to associate titles with them seems rather odd. Instead, you reward the best x % of players in the game at a certain time with a certain rank, so you have a proper distribution of ranks throughout the game which is redistributed every x months to adjust for activity.
My point here was that i don't see why ranks have to be linked to levels, something i can't really see the point of.
Originally posted by DoomsDay01OMG. I can't believe you went there. You are a star ship captain, your not a member of the council. Your not out negotiating a treaty with the klingons, they are leaving that in far more capable hands than you. Heck, in one mission, I helped a klingon defeat a common enemy and he thanked me for helping and warned me at the same time that, next time we met in battle he would kill me. Thats EXACTLY the kind of things that went on in star trek. Your mind is just to closed to what you wanted it to be, that you can't even see it has those elements, at least on some level, in the game.
As for exploration, what do you think your doing on those missions? Have you been to those planets or those solar systems before? Your freaking exploring them as your doing missions. Sure, its not wide open exploration but if you open your eyes and look, again, it is there. Sorry you don't like the game, but it is far from the way your describing it. It simply didn't fall under what YOU wanted from star trek. Again, not a bad thing, but please, don't try to make it out as a $5 wii game, because its not.
a) What's so special about being a captain when everyone else is a captain too? Not to mention when, in a few months time, every single player you meet will be an admiral. How immersive and believable.
What would be the point of being an engineer when everyone else can be an engineer, too? Medic? WoW Death Knight? Not sure I get your logic, here. It's always been a part of MMO's that everyone be given the opportunity to achieve the things others have ingame. Even in Eve every person has the opportunity to participate in, say, the destruction of a Titan.
Other than that, I tend to agree with you on the topic of exploration. But if alot of it is turned off as CB folks have said, there still may be something there.
You can have a team of 20-30 engineers on a starship, but there can be only one captain. Higher ranks should be earned through the social infrastructure, not through a grind. Also, a captain is not an engineer - An engineer is a profession which can have ranks from ensign up to lieutenant commander. Commander, captain and admiral are ranks which are only available to the command branch of Starfleet.
What i mean here is more something along the lines of titles. Yes, you can have levels, but to associate titles with them seems rather odd. Instead, you reward the best x % of players in the game at a certain time with a certain rank, so you have a proper distribution of ranks throughout the game which is redistributed every x months to adjust for activity.
My point here was that i don't see why ranks have to be linked to levels, something i can't really see the point of.
OK, that's clearer. So now let's look at that as a MMO.
Players have to work their way up the ranks to be a Captain. That means they spend some time on a ship until they've garnered enough experience to earn a command position. They eventually captain their own vessel; something to be revered in the game community.
I imagine you see where I'm going...
Launch day. 1st level. Nobody is a captain. How do you get XP serving another captain when there aren't any?
I assume there would be NPC captains that you would serve under? Other than not directly controlling the ship, how would this be different?
How does that make being a captain special? People would still have the opportunity to rank up, they just wouldn't have their ship until later in the game. Most peoples goals would be to do so, so sooner or later, you'd have a game full of admirals, just as you had before.
So then what? Do you limit the number of people who can be in higher ranks? So that if you don't buy the game at launch time and want to captain your own ship, you're screwed?
:edit: ah, that IS what you're saying. how did I miss that? Well... there's a phrase that was uttered on this board many times, and it goes, "People won't pay $14.95 a month to be someone else's bitch.". Nobody who doesn't play 24/7 is going to keep subbing to a game in which they can't pilot their own ship because others DO play 24/7. It's that simple.
Now, I could be wrong on this but I'm just recalling from a long time ago. The original Star Trek Online plan - before Cryptic took the game into their hands - was just that, or something along those lines. Orginally you'd have your entire ship readily accessiable (Cryptic plans to get there) and you could walk about the ship freely. They never said details on the ships and game play but they did state that every player was required. You'd need sickbay personel, you'd need engineers - and so forth. Of course they also were important for away missions, every player was required and it was highly team-oriented. And it was that which made me instantly fall in love with Star Trek Online. Originally I figured to myself, that a big ship like in the movies was going to be guild-like or further, higher level - in the earlier stages they'd have to find away for smaller ships. That was what I first thought.
Wow... ya know, that would SEEM cool as critter crap, but it's entirely unfeasible as a MMO. The reasons are clear to anyone that remembers the POB ships in SWG. They were a blast but no one used them. Because one POB ship was nowhere near as potent as all those players in their own ships. And if you increase potency to where 5 crewmembers make a ship 5 times more powerful, how do you balance mobs for another ship with a crew of 2 players and 3 npcs?
I'm not sure there's a deader horse on this forum.
Like I said, it SEEMed cool. I never said that it was going to be, I said seemed and thats what made me pay close attention - I was young, didn't have the exact mind I have now.
I've played SWG, and I recall the POBs quite well - they were hardly used it was just a little fun to be on. Functionality of the POBs was diffacult but still doable, the correct crew would strike well. That's just like real life... an naval warship does not handle it self, it requires everyone to play a role - its not computer run, it required many many people to keep moving, 1 person could not handle the ship - you need people on radar, you need people on comm, you need people in the engine room, you need people operating the guns, you need people loading the guns/missles (or torpedos in the sense of a sub), its not all done by a single person. But this crew has trained together, they've been through a great deal of training, they've been through drills after drills, and thats why the ship continues to function and the crew comes home alive.
As I later said in that exact same post, I said it wasn't easy and it would be extremly diffacult to do.
I agreed with you before you posted but I didn't expand. It would be hard to due and the balance issue would be horriable. A lot of the time, as I have said - the bigger is not always the better - many little ships can take down a single battle cruiser, with the right pilots. But again, you still need the training, the practice and so forth. A large ship might have a bigger hull, or stronger shields, but all that comes at a pricem which is usually manuverability and speed. A bunch of little guns that are stationary will not always take down a capital ship, you need the little guys.
What I was saying, the orginial concept SOUNDED COOL - it empthsized on teamplay and roleplay, two things I highly enjoy. However, that was many years ago - I never looked at the actual mechanics, I just thought the idea was cool. As I got older and studied further, I realize many things. Such as what they purposed. Cool in concept, but in actuality/functionality not so.
Always gotta look at the bigger picture and see how things would go, but don't always look at the big picture because that destroys dreams and can often drain much fun out of concepts.
I'm not arguing (or at least I'm not trying to argue.) It was just my previous thoughts.
Like I said, it SEEMed cool. I never said that it was going to be, I said seemed and thats what made me pay close attention - I was young, didn't have the exact mind I have now.
Righty O! Hopefully I didn't come off as too argumentative. Your post seemed pretty pragmatic, IMO; I was just speaking to that bit.
I've played SWG, and I recall the POBs quite well - they were hardly used it was just a little fun to be on. Functionality of the POBs was diffacult but still doable, the correct crew would strike well. That's just like real life... an naval warship does not handle it self, it requires everyone to play a role - its not computer run, it required many many people to keep moving, 1 person could not handle the ship - you need people on radar, you need people on comm, you need people in the engine room, you need people operating the guns, you need people loading the guns/missles (or torpedos in the sense of a sub), its not all done by a single person. But this crew has trained together, they've been through a great deal of training, they've been through drills after drills, and thats why the ship continues to function and the crew comes home alive.
And I'd love a game that could reproduce this in a way that's fun and everyone feel they have an important role to play. I recall the POB's being a blast, and it still amazes me that they were able to do it to the extent that they did(other games had housing. SWG let you take your house for a cruise in space!!!). But even then, you couldn't find a crew for them; and you didn't even need any specialized skills to participate. One of those sad instances where as a dev you give people what they would most certainly, obviously want, and those people go... "meh.". What's the famous dev phrase? "It's what I asked for but not what I wanted."
As I later said in that exact same post, I said it wasn't easy and it would be extremly diffacult to do.
I agreed with you before you posted but I didn't expand. It would be hard to due and the balance issue would be horriable. A lot of the time, as I have said - the bigger is not always the better - many little ships can take down a single battle cruiser, with the right pilots. But again, you still need the training, the practice and so forth. A large ship might have a bigger hull, or stronger shields, but all that comes at a pricem which is usually manuverability and speed. A bunch of little guns that are stationary will not always take down a capital ship, you need the little guys.
Eve does a pretty good job of making this happen, IMO. Even so, the most multiple players can do in a big ship is park their ship inside it.
What I was saying, the orginial concept SOUNDED COOL - it empthsized on teamplay and roleplay, two things I highly enjoy. However, that was many years ago - I never looked at the actual mechanics, I just thought the idea was cool. As I got older and studied further, I realize many things. Such as what they purposed. Cool in concept, but in actuality/functionality not so.
When we have holodecks in real life, we just may be able to have this game... until then...
Always gotta look at the bigger picture and see how things would go, but don't always look at the big picture because that destroys dreams and can often drain much fun out of concepts.
You knows it! Sometimes I wish folks would stop asking rhetorical questions and actually TRY to find the answer, as quite often, there are perfectly logical answers out there that teach us alot more than just assuming devs are too greedy/lazy/dumb to make a game exactly the way we want.
Like I said, it SEEMed cool. I never said that it was going to be, I said seemed and thats what made me pay close attention - I was young, didn't have the exact mind I have now.
Righty O! Hopefully I didn't come off as too argumentative. Your post seemed pretty pragmatic, IMO; I was just speaking to that bit.
I've played SWG, and I recall the POBs quite well - they were hardly used it was just a little fun to be on. Functionality of the POBs was diffacult but still doable, the correct crew would strike well. That's just like real life... an naval warship does not handle it self, it requires everyone to play a role - its not computer run, it required many many people to keep moving, 1 person could not handle the ship - you need people on radar, you need people on comm, you need people in the engine room, you need people operating the guns, you need people loading the guns/missles (or torpedos in the sense of a sub), its not all done by a single person. But this crew has trained together, they've been through a great deal of training, they've been through drills after drills, and thats why the ship continues to function and the crew comes home alive.
And I'd love a game that could reproduce this in a way that's fun and everyone feel they have an important role to play. I recall the POB's being a blast, and it still amazes me that they were able to do it to the extent that they did(other games had housing. SWG let you take your house for a cruise in space!!!). But even then, you couldn't find a crew for them; and you didn't even need any specialized skills to participate. One of those sad instances where as a dev you give people what they would most certainly, obviously want, and those people go... "meh.". What's the famous dev phrase? "It's what I asked for but not what I wanted."
As I later said in that exact same post, I said it wasn't easy and it would be extremly diffacult to do.
I agreed with you before you posted but I didn't expand. It would be hard to due and the balance issue would be horriable. A lot of the time, as I have said - the bigger is not always the better - many little ships can take down a single battle cruiser, with the right pilots. But again, you still need the training, the practice and so forth. A large ship might have a bigger hull, or stronger shields, but all that comes at a pricem which is usually manuverability and speed. A bunch of little guns that are stationary will not always take down a capital ship, you need the little guys.
Eve does a pretty good job of making this happen, IMO. Even so, the most multiple players can do in a big ship is park their ship inside it.
What I was saying, the orginial concept SOUNDED COOL - it empthsized on teamplay and roleplay, two things I highly enjoy. However, that was many years ago - I never looked at the actual mechanics, I just thought the idea was cool. As I got older and studied further, I realize many things. Such as what they purposed. Cool in concept, but in actuality/functionality not so.
When we have holodecks in real life, we just may be able to have this game... until then...
Always gotta look at the bigger picture and see how things would go, but don't always look at the big picture because that destroys dreams and can often drain much fun out of concepts.
You knows it! Sometimes I wish folks would stop asking rhetorical questions and actually TRY to find the answer, as quite often, there are perfectly logical answers out there that teach us alot more than just assuming devs are too greedy/lazy/dumb to make a game exactly the way we want.
Hey - you've got nothing but agreement from me.
I was once asked, (since you made mention of it) 'If I could have any peice of Star Trek Technology, what would it be?' My answer has and always will be: HOLODECK! =D They look to be too much fun.
How many here have actually opened the launcher more than once?
It says right there the only thing in OB at present is federation and klingon space. Seeing as though Federation space is friendly to all of those playing right now, and klingon space is unfinished I would guess the other areas such as romulan etc.. are where you can find hostile worlds sectors to explore, I would guess.
They say the rest will be open later in beta (right on the launcher), which means before launch. Patience before speculating is always better than putting your foot in your mouth.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
You dont have a clue. You have no idea what your talking about. Almost every successfull MMO today, started the same way, you sir are completly clueless!!!
Pretty much a pointless post from a rabid fanboy?
I agree with the OP. This MMO could have been so much more. Every successfull MMO today? Which ones? CO? AoC? Warhammer? They all start off by ripping off a popular IP and making a single player game and trying to call it a MMO?
This game has almost nothing star trekkie about it. Take away the starfleet uniforms, the ships and you pretty much have Champions online. Small instaced worlds, a horrible grid with billboards called space, and single planet solar systems that you can't even land on.
Wow, That sounds a lot like Eve to. How long has Eve been out and you still cant even walk around on the space stations? You sill can't do anything but look at the planets! Yeah, whatever. The game is good, its not without its problems but it is at least fun and sure feels like star trek to me. So, here is hoping that one day, you to can actually be happy, playing a video game.
At least with Eve...you know it is about space, combat and you are only going to see that ship. At least in eve...space is not just a grid road map. If STO space would have been more like that in Eve...not just small zones with sector space looking like a roadmap on the GPS...it would have been alot better.
About factions, maybe it was inevitable. Still it makes no sense to shoehorn every single race in Star Trek into two factions warring with each other, taking the Ferengi and Orion Syndicate as examples. They're traders, and profit most from trading, not choosing sides and dying for someone who might not even be paying them. At least Ferengi won't do that anyway.
I'll agree with you on these points because it is similiar to how I feel the Ferengi should be in this game and I stated as such on the official boards many times. Now we did have NOG on DS9 who joined starfleet, but the majority of Ferengi are about profit. Glad you brought the Orions up because that could be a rival faction for the Ferengi. Those two factions could be created for the non-combat folks who always want to try and do business in the Star Trek universe. I was always rebuffed because the argument against it was "Federation doesn't need money." To which I always reminded them that the Federation was the only one who "claimed" to not need money even though I saw this rule broken many times.
"The Orions, ah, the Orions make properly grateful allies. We gave them a planet and our protection, and they gave us beautiful women to serve our great houses."
I couldn't find anything about Ferengi and Federation. However, you pointed out Nog being in the Federation in DS9, so it is not out of the question that a stray Ferengi may choose that path. As to an alliance between Federation and Ferengi, I couldn't find any information on that on their website.
You dont have a clue. You have no idea what your talking about. Almost every successfull MMO today, started the same way, you sir are completly clueless!!!
Pretty much a pointless post from a rabid fanboy?
I agree with the OP. This MMO could have been so much more. Every successfull MMO today? Which ones? CO? AoC? Warhammer? They all start off by ripping off a popular IP and making a single player game and trying to call it a MMO?
This game has almost nothing star trekkie about it. Take away the starfleet uniforms, the ships and you pretty much have Champions online. Small instaced worlds, a horrible grid with billboards called space, and single planet solar systems that you can't even land on.
Wow, That sounds a lot like Eve to. How long has Eve been out and you still cant even walk around on the space stations? You sill can't do anything but look at the planets! Yeah, whatever. The game is good, its not without its problems but it is at least fun and sure feels like star trek to me. So, here is hoping that one day, you to can actually be happy, playing a video game.
At least with Eve...you know it is about space, combat and you are only going to see that ship. At least in eve...space is not just a grid road map. If STO space would have been more like that in Eve...not just small zones with sector space looking like a roadmap on the GPS...it would have been alot better.
I wont disagree with you there. I feel sector space is rather bad. I don't like the grid maps and I dont like the feeling that even though we are supposed to be warping to that next planet or next sector, it just feels like we are going at full impulse. like I said, the game has its problems, just like all other games do, and even ones that have been out for years, but I am at least enjoying myself in it and I am a fan of star trek and an avid MMO player. I can accept what they had to do to try and combine the two and still be able to enjoy the game. But the great thing about this is that cryptic can see that people don't like something and maybe they will change things around. I am worried about sector space, especially considering it is the main travel mode in the game, Im not sure if they would even be willing to try and revamp that or not.
Comments
I don't have anything to say, just like you, but decided to say it anyway. Cheers.
Wow... ya know, that would SEEM cool as critter crap, but it's entirely unfeasible as a MMO. The reasons are clear to anyone that remembers the POB ships in SWG. They were a blast but no one used them. Because one POB ship was nowhere near as potent as all those players in their own ships. And if you increase potency to where 5 crewmembers make a ship 5 times more powerful, how do you balance mobs for another ship with a crew of 2 players and 3 npcs?
I'm not sure there's a deader horse on this forum.
Name a single bug that has been mentioned in the thread. I can't find any.
Another thing is that open beta is representative of how the game will look, play and feel for at least the first year, no matter how much the developers and publisher will want you to believe otherwise. It's always been that way and i very much doubt STO will break that tradition.
And lastly, this thread is all about expectations. Your only contribution so far has been your own opinion that i am clueless, aswell as not actually reading the thread seeing as you keep going on about bugs while no one in the thread has mentioned any.
More lies... you WoW fanbois are pathetic.
Everysingle MMO I have ever played (been playing since Ultima Online) has gone thru major changes in the first year, some good and some bad. The ones that have made it were EVE, Anarchy Online, WoW and EQ and there still here after many years, the others like Conan and WAR didnt, and they are gone or will be soon.
So your opinions are very flimsy at best. I have backed up my opinion with historical facts, you simply lie.
a) What's so special about being a captain when everyone else is a captain too? Not to mention when, in a few months time, every single player you meet will be an admiral. How immersive and believable.
Because its a freaking MMO. How immersive is it that you had to sit down in your chair and LOG into a GAME. Seriously, your just being petty here.
b) I'm not talking about negotiating on behalf of the Federation. I'm talking on a ship to ship level.
Maybe, JUST maybe, the klingons dont give a rats ass what you got to say and would just try to blow you out of space for being near them. So far, thats the impressions I got. Oh yeah, I forgot, we are at WAR.
c) So you found a mission where you got a henchman to shoot stuff. It doesn't change the gameplay. The mission might aswell have another federation ship helping you out instead - The "conversation" you had is just a big tease.
Still, it was exactly the kind of thing that happened in star trek. you can not deny that. How many times did archer save the klingons and how many times did the klingons tell him when they met again, he would be destroyed. What you want is a true RPG. get your friends together and let your imagination run wild!
d) If it was truly exploration, then why are there constantly other federation ships in my mission areas?
I admit that true exploration is hard to do, but i have to point out (yet again) that i never said it should be the focus of the game. It should be an option, an option you don't have in STO.
Again, the problem is on YOUR side. Go into the social panel, turn off open instances and set it to allow invites only. Now it will only be you in those instances (with the exception of fleet incidences and sector missions). Now, I wont deny that free exploration would be nice and I think will be possible down the road, but exploration is there. Don't worry about getting missions, just take off and visit systems. I have gotten missions just from entering systems that I didnt even get a mission to go to. You CAN explore, you just happen to be exploring the known universe as it is.
LOL @ RexNebular. We agreee to disagree. Others argue so much. We can agree, you don't like it and don't play. I like it and play. That is so simple, why do people have to argue so much and try to make their opinion someone else's. The people that argue and fight NEVER change each others mind despite all the screaming. LOL, oh well different strokes for different folks.
I'm old not dead. (Nov8tr is pronounced innovator)
You my friend are a dreamer. None of the things the OP wants added will be added. The game design will not allow it. I will not be looking foward to your review as you are obviously clueless
Currently Playing: Fallen Earth
Played and liked: TCOS, Vanguard, Guild Wars, DDO
Played and didn't like: CO, MO, STO, DF, AoC, WAR, WoW, EQ2, EVE, most f2p
Waiting for: Earthrise, Guild Wars 2, Secret World
a) What's so special about being a captain when everyone else is a captain too? Not to mention when, in a few months time, every single player you meet will be an admiral. How immersive and believable.
What would be the point of being an engineer when everyone else can be an engineer, too? Medic? WoW Death Knight? Not sure I get your logic, here. It's always been a part of MMO's that everyone be given the opportunity to achieve the things others have ingame. Even in Eve every person has the opportunity to participate in, say, the destruction of a Titan.
Other than that, I tend to agree with you on the topic of exploration. But if alot of it is turned off as CB folks have said, there still may be something there.Of course MMO change during the first year, but the core gameplay always the stay the same. They will add content, new ships, new skills, new systems but guess what, you'll still be shooting stuff 90% of the time.
BTW why do you assume anyone who has a negative opinion about the game plays WoW ? I don't like STO, does this mean I'm a WoW fanboy ?
I'll just take your "historical facts" and experience with MMO's with a grain of salt. I don't really take the word from anonymous people who registered just a few hours ago and have only posted flames, and only in this forum.
You're not helping your credibility along with insulting me at every turn either.
You also still are trying to deviate from the topic. This thread is about "how STO could have been", not about "this game has bugs". And still, i have yet to mention a single bug, and so does everyone else in this thread. If you don't have anything to contribute to the topic, you have the option to not post in it at all.
Playing: WF
Played: WoW, GW2, L2, WAR, AoC, DnL (2005), GW, LotRO, EQ2, TOR, CoH (RIP), STO, TSW, TERA, EVE, ESO, BDO
Tried: EQ, UO, AO, EnB, TCoS, Fury, Ryzom, EU, DDO, TR, RF, CO, Aion, VG, DN, Vindictus, AA
You forgot that one episode when the Klingon broke from the script and punched Shatner in the face.
See, I don't want the story to be scripted and go down the same path every time, I want it to be like the TV show! :P
Been playing the open beta meself. The game strikes me as being as deep as a dinner plate. It has no substance, no imagination and is boring. Where is the depth to this game. It's as if they took no time to make it thinking and knowing that trekkies would jump right in sight unseen. I don't expect it to last over a couple of years unless the trekkie fans can keep it propped up.
I pity those who forked out the big cash for pre orders. Should be a lesson. Never buy an MMO until you can play open beta or can get a trial account. Never.
What a waste of a fine title.
{ Mod Edit }
a) What's so special about being a captain when everyone else is a captain too? Not to mention when, in a few months time, every single player you meet will be an admiral. How immersive and believable.
What would be the point of being an engineer when everyone else can be an engineer, too? Medic? WoW Death Knight? Not sure I get your logic, here. It's always been a part of MMO's that everyone be given the opportunity to achieve the things others have ingame. Even in Eve every person has the opportunity to participate in, say, the destruction of a Titan.
Other than that, I tend to agree with you on the topic of exploration. But if alot of it is turned off as CB folks have said, there still may be something there.
You can have a team of 20-30 engineers on a starship, but there can be only one captain. Higher ranks should be earned through the social infrastructure, not through a grind. Also, a captain is not an engineer - An engineer is a profession which can have ranks from ensign up to lieutenant commander. Commander, captain and admiral are ranks which are only available to the command branch of Starfleet.
What i mean here is more something along the lines of titles. Yes, you can have levels, but to associate titles with them seems rather odd. Instead, you reward the best x % of players in the game at a certain time with a certain rank, so you have a proper distribution of ranks throughout the game which is redistributed every x months to adjust for activity.
My point here was that i don't see why ranks have to be linked to levels, something i can't really see the point of.
Playing: WF
Played: WoW, GW2, L2, WAR, AoC, DnL (2005), GW, LotRO, EQ2, TOR, CoH (RIP), STO, TSW, TERA, EVE, ESO, BDO
Tried: EQ, UO, AO, EnB, TCoS, Fury, Ryzom, EU, DDO, TR, RF, CO, Aion, VG, DN, Vindictus, AA
a) What's so special about being a captain when everyone else is a captain too? Not to mention when, in a few months time, every single player you meet will be an admiral. How immersive and believable.
What would be the point of being an engineer when everyone else can be an engineer, too? Medic? WoW Death Knight? Not sure I get your logic, here. It's always been a part of MMO's that everyone be given the opportunity to achieve the things others have ingame. Even in Eve every person has the opportunity to participate in, say, the destruction of a Titan.
Other than that, I tend to agree with you on the topic of exploration. But if alot of it is turned off as CB folks have said, there still may be something there.
You can have a team of 20-30 engineers on a starship, but there can be only one captain. Higher ranks should be earned through the social infrastructure, not through a grind. Also, a captain is not an engineer - An engineer is a profession which can have ranks from ensign up to lieutenant commander. Commander, captain and admiral are ranks which are only available to the command branch of Starfleet.
What i mean here is more something along the lines of titles. Yes, you can have levels, but to associate titles with them seems rather odd. Instead, you reward the best x % of players in the game at a certain time with a certain rank, so you have a proper distribution of ranks throughout the game which is redistributed every x months to adjust for activity.
My point here was that i don't see why ranks have to be linked to levels, something i can't really see the point of.
OK, that's clearer. So now let's look at that as a MMO.
Players have to work their way up the ranks to be a Captain. That means they spend some time on a ship until they've garnered enough experience to earn a command position. They eventually captain their own vessel; something to be revered in the game community.
I imagine you see where I'm going...
Launch day. 1st level. Nobody is a captain. How do you get XP serving another captain when there aren't any?
I assume there would be NPC captains that you would serve under? Other than not directly controlling the ship, how would this be different?
How does that make being a captain special? People would still have the opportunity to rank up, they just wouldn't have their ship until later in the game. Most peoples goals would be to do so, so sooner or later, you'd have a game full of admirals, just as you had before.
So then what? Do you limit the number of people who can be in higher ranks? So that if you don't buy the game at launch time and want to captain your own ship, you're screwed?
:edit: ah, that IS what you're saying. how did I miss that? Well... there's a phrase that was uttered on this board many times, and it goes, "People won't pay $14.95 a month to be someone else's bitch.". Nobody who doesn't play 24/7 is going to keep subbing to a game in which they can't pilot their own ship because others DO play 24/7. It's that simple.
Wow... ya know, that would SEEM cool as critter crap, but it's entirely unfeasible as a MMO. The reasons are clear to anyone that remembers the POB ships in SWG. They were a blast but no one used them. Because one POB ship was nowhere near as potent as all those players in their own ships. And if you increase potency to where 5 crewmembers make a ship 5 times more powerful, how do you balance mobs for another ship with a crew of 2 players and 3 npcs?
I'm not sure there's a deader horse on this forum.
Like I said, it SEEMed cool. I never said that it was going to be, I said seemed and thats what made me pay close attention - I was young, didn't have the exact mind I have now.
I've played SWG, and I recall the POBs quite well - they were hardly used it was just a little fun to be on. Functionality of the POBs was diffacult but still doable, the correct crew would strike well. That's just like real life... an naval warship does not handle it self, it requires everyone to play a role - its not computer run, it required many many people to keep moving, 1 person could not handle the ship - you need people on radar, you need people on comm, you need people in the engine room, you need people operating the guns, you need people loading the guns/missles (or torpedos in the sense of a sub), its not all done by a single person. But this crew has trained together, they've been through a great deal of training, they've been through drills after drills, and thats why the ship continues to function and the crew comes home alive.
As I later said in that exact same post, I said it wasn't easy and it would be extremly diffacult to do.
I agreed with you before you posted but I didn't expand. It would be hard to due and the balance issue would be horriable. A lot of the time, as I have said - the bigger is not always the better - many little ships can take down a single battle cruiser, with the right pilots. But again, you still need the training, the practice and so forth. A large ship might have a bigger hull, or stronger shields, but all that comes at a pricem which is usually manuverability and speed. A bunch of little guns that are stationary will not always take down a capital ship, you need the little guys.
What I was saying, the orginial concept SOUNDED COOL - it empthsized on teamplay and roleplay, two things I highly enjoy. However, that was many years ago - I never looked at the actual mechanics, I just thought the idea was cool. As I got older and studied further, I realize many things. Such as what they purposed. Cool in concept, but in actuality/functionality not so.
Always gotta look at the bigger picture and see how things would go, but don't always look at the big picture because that destroys dreams and can often drain much fun out of concepts.
I'm not arguing (or at least I'm not trying to argue.) It was just my previous thoughts.
Like I said, it SEEMed cool. I never said that it was going to be, I said seemed and thats what made me pay close attention - I was young, didn't have the exact mind I have now.
Righty O! Hopefully I didn't come off as too argumentative. Your post seemed pretty pragmatic, IMO; I was just speaking to that bit.
I've played SWG, and I recall the POBs quite well - they were hardly used it was just a little fun to be on. Functionality of the POBs was diffacult but still doable, the correct crew would strike well. That's just like real life... an naval warship does not handle it self, it requires everyone to play a role - its not computer run, it required many many people to keep moving, 1 person could not handle the ship - you need people on radar, you need people on comm, you need people in the engine room, you need people operating the guns, you need people loading the guns/missles (or torpedos in the sense of a sub), its not all done by a single person. But this crew has trained together, they've been through a great deal of training, they've been through drills after drills, and thats why the ship continues to function and the crew comes home alive.
And I'd love a game that could reproduce this in a way that's fun and everyone feel they have an important role to play. I recall the POB's being a blast, and it still amazes me that they were able to do it to the extent that they did(other games had housing. SWG let you take your house for a cruise in space!!!). But even then, you couldn't find a crew for them; and you didn't even need any specialized skills to participate. One of those sad instances where as a dev you give people what they would most certainly, obviously want, and those people go... "meh.". What's the famous dev phrase? "It's what I asked for but not what I wanted."
As I later said in that exact same post, I said it wasn't easy and it would be extremly diffacult to do.
I agreed with you before you posted but I didn't expand. It would be hard to due and the balance issue would be horriable. A lot of the time, as I have said - the bigger is not always the better - many little ships can take down a single battle cruiser, with the right pilots. But again, you still need the training, the practice and so forth. A large ship might have a bigger hull, or stronger shields, but all that comes at a pricem which is usually manuverability and speed. A bunch of little guns that are stationary will not always take down a capital ship, you need the little guys.
Eve does a pretty good job of making this happen, IMO. Even so, the most multiple players can do in a big ship is park their ship inside it.
What I was saying, the orginial concept SOUNDED COOL - it empthsized on teamplay and roleplay, two things I highly enjoy. However, that was many years ago - I never looked at the actual mechanics, I just thought the idea was cool. As I got older and studied further, I realize many things. Such as what they purposed. Cool in concept, but in actuality/functionality not so.
When we have holodecks in real life, we just may be able to have this game... until then...
Always gotta look at the bigger picture and see how things would go, but don't always look at the big picture because that destroys dreams and can often drain much fun out of concepts.
You knows it! Sometimes I wish folks would stop asking rhetorical questions and actually TRY to find the answer, as quite often, there are perfectly logical answers out there that teach us alot more than just assuming devs are too greedy/lazy/dumb to make a game exactly the way we want.
Like I said, it SEEMed cool. I never said that it was going to be, I said seemed and thats what made me pay close attention - I was young, didn't have the exact mind I have now.
Righty O! Hopefully I didn't come off as too argumentative. Your post seemed pretty pragmatic, IMO; I was just speaking to that bit.
I've played SWG, and I recall the POBs quite well - they were hardly used it was just a little fun to be on. Functionality of the POBs was diffacult but still doable, the correct crew would strike well. That's just like real life... an naval warship does not handle it self, it requires everyone to play a role - its not computer run, it required many many people to keep moving, 1 person could not handle the ship - you need people on radar, you need people on comm, you need people in the engine room, you need people operating the guns, you need people loading the guns/missles (or torpedos in the sense of a sub), its not all done by a single person. But this crew has trained together, they've been through a great deal of training, they've been through drills after drills, and thats why the ship continues to function and the crew comes home alive.
And I'd love a game that could reproduce this in a way that's fun and everyone feel they have an important role to play. I recall the POB's being a blast, and it still amazes me that they were able to do it to the extent that they did(other games had housing. SWG let you take your house for a cruise in space!!!). But even then, you couldn't find a crew for them; and you didn't even need any specialized skills to participate. One of those sad instances where as a dev you give people what they would most certainly, obviously want, and those people go... "meh.". What's the famous dev phrase? "It's what I asked for but not what I wanted."
As I later said in that exact same post, I said it wasn't easy and it would be extremly diffacult to do.
I agreed with you before you posted but I didn't expand. It would be hard to due and the balance issue would be horriable. A lot of the time, as I have said - the bigger is not always the better - many little ships can take down a single battle cruiser, with the right pilots. But again, you still need the training, the practice and so forth. A large ship might have a bigger hull, or stronger shields, but all that comes at a pricem which is usually manuverability and speed. A bunch of little guns that are stationary will not always take down a capital ship, you need the little guys.
Eve does a pretty good job of making this happen, IMO. Even so, the most multiple players can do in a big ship is park their ship inside it.
What I was saying, the orginial concept SOUNDED COOL - it empthsized on teamplay and roleplay, two things I highly enjoy. However, that was many years ago - I never looked at the actual mechanics, I just thought the idea was cool. As I got older and studied further, I realize many things. Such as what they purposed. Cool in concept, but in actuality/functionality not so.
When we have holodecks in real life, we just may be able to have this game... until then...
Always gotta look at the bigger picture and see how things would go, but don't always look at the big picture because that destroys dreams and can often drain much fun out of concepts.
You knows it! Sometimes I wish folks would stop asking rhetorical questions and actually TRY to find the answer, as quite often, there are perfectly logical answers out there that teach us alot more than just assuming devs are too greedy/lazy/dumb to make a game exactly the way we want.
Hey - you've got nothing but agreement from me.
I was once asked, (since you made mention of it) 'If I could have any peice of Star Trek Technology, what would it be?' My answer has and always will be: HOLODECK! =D They look to be too much fun.
But I'm straying from topic. Sorry
How many here have actually opened the launcher more than once?
It says right there the only thing in OB at present is federation and klingon space. Seeing as though Federation space is friendly to all of those playing right now, and klingon space is unfinished I would guess the other areas such as romulan etc.. are where you can find hostile worlds sectors to explore, I would guess.
They say the rest will be open later in beta (right on the launcher), which means before launch. Patience before speculating is always better than putting your foot in your mouth.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Pretty much a pointless post from a rabid fanboy?
I agree with the OP. This MMO could have been so much more. Every successfull MMO today? Which ones? CO? AoC? Warhammer? They all start off by ripping off a popular IP and making a single player game and trying to call it a MMO?
This game has almost nothing star trekkie about it. Take away the starfleet uniforms, the ships and you pretty much have Champions online. Small instaced worlds, a horrible grid with billboards called space, and single planet solar systems that you can't even land on.
Wow, That sounds a lot like Eve to. How long has Eve been out and you still cant even walk around on the space stations? You sill can't do anything but look at the planets! Yeah, whatever. The game is good, its not without its problems but it is at least fun and sure feels like star trek to me. So, here is hoping that one day, you to can actually be happy, playing a video game.
At least with Eve...you know it is about space, combat and you are only going to see that ship. At least in eve...space is not just a grid road map. If STO space would have been more like that in Eve...not just small zones with sector space looking like a roadmap on the GPS...it would have been alot better.
I'll agree with you on these points because it is similiar to how I feel the Ferengi should be in this game and I stated as such on the official boards many times. Now we did have NOG on DS9 who joined starfleet, but the majority of Ferengi are about profit. Glad you brought the Orions up because that could be a rival faction for the Ferengi. Those two factions could be created for the non-combat folks who always want to try and do business in the Star Trek universe. I was always rebuffed because the argument against it was "Federation doesn't need money." To which I always reminded them that the Federation was the only one who "claimed" to not need money even though I saw this rule broken many times.
www.startrekonline.com/factions - Klingon portion
"The Orions, ah, the Orions make properly grateful allies. We gave them a planet and our protection, and they gave us beautiful women to serve our great houses."
I couldn't find anything about Ferengi and Federation. However, you pointed out Nog being in the Federation in DS9, so it is not out of the question that a stray Ferengi may choose that path. As to an alliance between Federation and Ferengi, I couldn't find any information on that on their website.
Pretty much a pointless post from a rabid fanboy?
I agree with the OP. This MMO could have been so much more. Every successfull MMO today? Which ones? CO? AoC? Warhammer? They all start off by ripping off a popular IP and making a single player game and trying to call it a MMO?
This game has almost nothing star trekkie about it. Take away the starfleet uniforms, the ships and you pretty much have Champions online. Small instaced worlds, a horrible grid with billboards called space, and single planet solar systems that you can't even land on.
Wow, That sounds a lot like Eve to. How long has Eve been out and you still cant even walk around on the space stations? You sill can't do anything but look at the planets! Yeah, whatever. The game is good, its not without its problems but it is at least fun and sure feels like star trek to me. So, here is hoping that one day, you to can actually be happy, playing a video game.
At least with Eve...you know it is about space, combat and you are only going to see that ship. At least in eve...space is not just a grid road map. If STO space would have been more like that in Eve...not just small zones with sector space looking like a roadmap on the GPS...it would have been alot better.
I wont disagree with you there. I feel sector space is rather bad. I don't like the grid maps and I dont like the feeling that even though we are supposed to be warping to that next planet or next sector, it just feels like we are going at full impulse. like I said, the game has its problems, just like all other games do, and even ones that have been out for years, but I am at least enjoying myself in it and I am a fan of star trek and an avid MMO player. I can accept what they had to do to try and combine the two and still be able to enjoy the game. But the great thing about this is that cryptic can see that people don't like something and maybe they will change things around. I am worried about sector space, especially considering it is the main travel mode in the game, Im not sure if they would even be willing to try and revamp that or not.