I suspect that there is something else going on most of the time, I played LOTRO (taking a break right now too busy for too many mmo's and I'm playing STO for a change of pace now) and have never had a problem finding a group, why? I have an awesome fellowship and we are always organizing groups for all types of content both high level and low.
What has always tripped me out about these types of posts is that the people who seem to cry for groups seem to be so inept at "making in game friends" *shrug*. I haven't played since october so maybe things are vastly different but I can say LOTRO is one of the best and most friendly communities I've ever played in and I just find it hard to believe that people can't make friends and find people to join them on content. But again I'm not there right now but I really do suspect things haven't gotten as bad as this post makes it seem in only two months.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
I suspect that there is something else going on most of the time, I played LOTRO (taking a break right now too busy for too many mmo's and I'm playing STO for a change of pace now) and have never had a problem finding a group, why? I have an awesome fellowship and we are always organizing groups for all types of content both high level and low. What has always tripped me out about these types of posts is that the people who seem to cry for groups seem to be so inept at "making in game friends" *shrug*. I haven't played since october so maybe things are vastly different but I can say LOTRO is one of the best and most friendly communities I've ever played in and I just find it hard to believe that people can't make friends and find people to join them on content. But again I'm not there right now but I really do suspect things haven't gotten as bad as this post makes it seem in only two months.
lol this has to be the most ignorant post in here. Tell you what come to Angmar, right now, with your "awesome" social skills, and find me a pug group for 6 man groups I'm stuck on. No seriously do that and I'll edit the first post of this thread and ask the mods to delete it.
Before you do that though I advice you at least read this post I made :
"
So please don't think this a rant coming from a pro-grouper. I'm solo'd majority of Angmar and the only quests that I'm stuck on are all 6 man quests in Imlad Balchorth, Battle For Aughaire/Before Rammas Deluon, etc which btw, I've been trying to get a group for since 3 weeks now without success. I've spent entire days (weekends), shouting out in /LFF to get 6 people for these quests without success so to those posters who think its easy to find groups etc, they've obviously are speaking about some crowded place like Moria or Mirkwood now, or they're just in a super sized kin with a lot of good members willing to help.
"
Still think I'm socially inept? (which is ironic because I'm the one here who started this thread about Turbine "DELETING" Group content) Come show me how its done. I want to learn from the best
I cant say I have noticed a decline in grouping. Then again I belong to a huge Kinship with members from all ranges so it is never an issue. I have noticed slightly less people in several areas but it looks to be enough for a group. The raids are about pointless in SoA so why bother? The quests in LoTRO have always been soloable (besides raid content of course) but they do seem to be even easier now. Heck, I solo'ed to cap a year ago!
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It's hard to find groups now as it is in most level-based games once the population is mostly max level. It doesn't mean the game is dead or dying, there is great grouping going on at level cap. My kin is active and having fun. I easily get into groups whenever I want (at cap.)
If I were you, I'd post on the server boards and see if anyone is interested in grouping to level low-level toons on a regular basis. Recently, I saw such a group of six players form up on one of the boards.
This game is dying a slow death. Groups are incredibly hard to find in places that have been now made useless (like Angmar...as in Shadows Of Angmar..forget about finding a group to help you finish 6 man quests here). Even in the most populated server, Brandywine, its going to be incredibly hard for you to find groups, do old raid content like fighting the freakin' Balrog of Morgoth. The game's major population is dominated by soloists, who don't even want the LFF/LFG options to improve. Who have absolutely no problem with Turbine turning every group quest into a solo quest. They have already started, Lone-Lands, which was 80% 6 man quests 6 months ago, is now 100% (yeah - One Hundred Percent - Means all of it) Solo content. And its the direction they are heading in now. Very disappointed and hurt to see Turbine take LoTRO in this direction. I guess they want the game to be incredibly easy to the new players so they can experience the end-game faster. But deleting group quests just pisses me off, I don't get it. Its an "MMORPG" for ****'s sake, and the game already barely has any real raiding content at all. Helegrod and Rift are the only 2 real raid instances in this game and nobody, literally nobody, in all the server never visits those places anymore.
So, just giving you heads up on the state of things. 1. Even on most crowded server - Brandywine - in lots of areas it will be impossible to complete group quests 2. Before they are deleted/converted into kid easy solo quests. 3. Raid content is impossible to do at this moment unless you join a really special raiding kin that likes to do the old raid runs for fun only.
Pretty game though and if you play the trial and think you'll enjoy solo'ing to 65 all the way then buy the game, otherwise, don't. Its a PVE game, means if you want to solo you can just buy a single player RPG out there for much less than you'll end up paying for LoTRO.
The Lone Lands is not 100% solo content. I would love for you to go and try to do GA solo and let me know how that goes for you. :P
I agree with Params7. LFF Panel should be improved long time ago and its true that its very difficult to find 6 people group in Angmar. I had to skip many group quests not only in Angmar, because not able to find a group.
As for LFF Panel, Its completely useless. I play this game something around 4 month and never found a team to join using LFF panel. Instead I had to use LFF chat to find someone and it often worked. I don't understand why Turbine do not improve LFF panel in this game while they have very good example of social panel from their other game Dungeons and Dragons Online.
In DDO Social Panel is great. It display all teams created by users and all people who looking for team in the whole region. It shows how many people there are in each team, which quest they are doing, level of the quest, for which classes they are looking, and if its open team or closed private team. You could just choose any team and join.
Yes, because so many MMOs have a history of making old raid content worth your while -.- The game's questing was horribly designed after your first, or second time doing it. The Bree-land, and Lone-lands NEEDED revamping, big time. Why was I receiving quests on the eastern side of Lone-Lands to go BACK to the western questing hubs just to kill a few boars or lynx, that had a horrible respawn rate and not a designated spawn area? Lone-Lands is a huge example of how bad the questing was designed in the early levels of LOTRO. Bree-Land was also designed by, but it was still fun. You used to have to go hunting for quests to find enough just to level and not enter a new zone underleveled, with the revamp, they're making sure its clear that you know where the questing hubs are and that you leave the zone at the appropriate level. It shouldn't ever be a chore to find quests to level. Plus, they want to get people out of those areas and into the new ones. What's the harm in that? Requiring a group or full group to level is a thing of the past. Requiring a group to do end game content is still there, but you're not forced to group at end game to accomplish things. I don't see the point in complaining about their old content being made easier. If they are dumbing down their new raid content,then its a legitimate concern. Leveling shouldn't require a lot of forced grouping, it's frankly not that fun. STILL, you level much faster in LOTRO if you're in a group, even today. Why? Most experience comes from quests, mobs don't give you a lot of exp unless you're rested, even then it's still not a lot. Grouping to complete quests means you complete them faster which = faster leveling. I just recently leveled a guardian in a trio with the new changes and we flew through the content and the levels. Solo, it never would've gone that fast.
Actually the most xp comes from doing skirmishes now heh only problem is you make next to no money doing them.
Oh that's neat, haven't tried skirmishes myself, took a break right before SoM came out.
I suspect that there is something else going on most of the time, I played LOTRO (taking a break right now too busy for too many mmo's and I'm playing STO for a change of pace now) and have never had a problem finding a group, why? I have an awesome fellowship and we are always organizing groups for all types of content both high level and low. What has always tripped me out about these types of posts is that the people who seem to cry for groups seem to be so inept at "making in game friends" *shrug*. I haven't played since october so maybe things are vastly different but I can say LOTRO is one of the best and most friendly communities I've ever played in and I just find it hard to believe that people can't make friends and find people to join them on content. But again I'm not there right now but I really do suspect things haven't gotten as bad as this post makes it seem in only two months.
lol this has to be the most ignorant post in here. Tell you what come to Angmar, right now, with your "awesome" social skills, and find me a pug group for 6 man groups I'm stuck on. No seriously do that and I'll edit the first post of this thread and ask the mods to delete it.
Before you do that though I advice you at least read this post I made :
"
So please don't think this a rant coming from a pro-grouper. I'm solo'd majority of Angmar and the only quests that I'm stuck on are all 6 man quests in Imlad Balchorth, Battle For Aughaire/Before Rammas Deluon, etc which btw, I've been trying to get a group for since 3 weeks now without success. I've spent entire days (weekends), shouting out in /LFF to get 6 people for these quests without success so to those posters who think its easy to find groups etc, they've obviously are speaking about some crowded place like Moria or Mirkwood now, or they're just in a super sized kin with a lot of good members willing to help.
"
Still think I'm socially inept? (which is ironic because I'm the one here who started this thread about Turbine "DELETING" Group content) Come show me how its done. I want to learn from the best
I play on Brandywine and I see people wanting to do the old dungeons all the time. This is back when you still had to run them to get your legendary traits, which is a GOOD change that you don't have to anymore.
Some builds are based on Legendary Traits, having to rely on 5 others and a drop just to ensure I get those couple good traits is a bad design choice, especially when the content is 15 levels old. Hooray that they finally changed it with Skirmish Marks now.
You're a completionist aren't you? You can't just look at quests and drop them.
. The Bree-land, and Lone-lands NEEDED revamping, big time. Why was I receiving quests on the eastern side of Lone-Lands to go BACK to the western questing hubs just to kill a few boars or lynx, that had a horrible respawn rate and not a designated spawn area? Lone-Lands is a huge example of how bad the questing was designed in the early levels of LOTRO.
I guess you expect the game to be : Quest hub A - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub B - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub C - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub D - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub E - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub F - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub G - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub H - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub I - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub J - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub K - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub L - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub M - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub N - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub O - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub P - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Instance 1 to get first piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 2 to get second piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 3 to get third piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 4 to get fourth piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 5 to get fifth piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 6 to get sixth piece of radiance, which then leads to Raid 1 and then GAME OVER.
I guess this is your vision of the quests and the gameflow. Well my vision is that quests should contain exploration & combat & travel & social-grouping parts as well. In Lone-lands the quest about boars, you could actually also finish around the eastern border, you did not need to travel to the western one -- but for that, you would need to first explore and discover their spawn place.
LotRO, WoW and EQ2 have it right though that non current outdoor content should be easy street to the cap. WoW's new LFG tool is just awesome for group content and the other two are in catch up.
WoW fixed the root cause of group problems with their new LFG tools. Whereas Turbine thought about improving LFG, took suggestions from the community....then forgot all about it..and instead, deleted group quests all together, making the already damaged LFG system even more useless. lol.
Thats the thing that really bugged me about lotro it is just horrible trying to find groups for quests and dungeons before you hit max level.
Part of their problem is that they have soloable content then "suddnely" you need a group for a quest or two and then it's back to solo.
So, for players who do want to group, what usually happens is that they join a group, do the quest and then the group disbands.
I remember that in Lineage 2 there were areas that were clearly group oriented and that the xp was pretty good as well as the rewards (when they did drop) yet one could be a soloist and still be able to play all day if they wanted.
It's not that hard to cater to these play styles in one game.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
. The Bree-land, and Lone-lands NEEDED revamping, big time. Why was I receiving quests on the eastern side of Lone-Lands to go BACK to the western questing hubs just to kill a few boars or lynx, that had a horrible respawn rate and not a designated spawn area? Lone-Lands is a huge example of how bad the questing was designed in the early levels of LOTRO.
I guess you expect the game to be : Quest hub A - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub B - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub C - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub D - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub E - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub F - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub G - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub H - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub I - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub J - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub K - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub L - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub M - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub N - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub O - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub P - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Instance 1 to get first piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 2 to get second piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 3 to get third piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 4 to get fourth piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 5 to get fifth piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 6 to get sixth piece of radiance, which then leads to Raid 1 and then GAME OVER.
I guess this is your vision of the quests and the gameflow. Well my vision is that quests should contain exploration & combat & travel & social-grouping parts as well. In Lone-lands the quest about boars, you could actually also finish around the eastern border, you did not need to travel to the western one -- but for that, you would need to first explore and discover their spawn place.
Innovation and exploration is great. My very first character on LOTRO that quested I had ZERO problems with the questing design. I had to search and explore for quests, it was fun, I loved it.
My second time, I started to see what was kind of frustrating, going way out of my way for a couple quests, just to be taken way out of the way, but I dealt with it because it wasn't too bad.
On my 5th or 6th character? No, it wasn't fun anymore. Ultimately it led to me never wanting to reroll ever again until they did something about it. Oh look, they did. Why? Cause people were tired of it.
If you play one character, stick with him and never roll an alt, of course you're not going to mind your questing experience on the first time, its new and exciting. Replay value is what you need to go for on an MMO when you can easily make 7-10 different characters and may want to explore them all.
And gear gating has nothing to do with questing, the fact that you would even compare the two is just silly. Gear gating has never, and will never, be fun. Faster character progression on content you've done countless times before? More fun.
Don't be an idiot.
And if you want to pick out one quest to talk about, fine. The quest with boars and lynx, yeah, there were Boars out by the entrance to Trollshaws, but did it solve the problem of the Lynx who have no set spawn and SHARE A spawn with other wildlife that you don't need for quests at the current time? Nope.
The quest progression is bad, and Turbine saw this, that's why its called for a revamp. If it was good, they wouldn't change it.
I could go on all day about LOTRO's quest design, but I still think its a great game. After the Angmar revamp, and they added in Forochel and Evendim, questing was just fine. They learned from their mistakes in the beginning. Eregion was fun, Moria's fun. They want to make the other zones more like that.
You want to explore? Fine, go ahead, you might unlock a trait for seeing that tower off in the distance and exploring it. That's good exploration.
LotRO, WoW and EQ2 have it right though that non current outdoor content should be easy street to the cap. WoW's new LFG tool is just awesome for group content and the other two are in catch up.
WoW fixed the root cause of group problems with their new LFG tools. Whereas Turbine thought about improving LFG, took suggestions from the community....then forgot all about it..and instead, deleted group quests all together, making the already damaged LFG system even more useless. lol.
Thats the thing that really bugged me about lotro it is just horrible trying to find groups for quests and dungeons before you hit max level.
Part of their problem is that they have soloable content then "suddnely" you need a group for a quest or two and then it's back to solo.
So, for players who do want to group, what usually happens is that they join a group, do the quest and then the group disbands.
I remember that in Lineage 2 there were areas that were clearly group oriented and that the xp was pretty good as well as the rewards (when they did drop) yet one could be a soloist and still be able to play all day if they wanted.
It's not that hard to cater to these play styles in one game.
True. People are talking about how the LFG needs to be improved and perhaps it does, but another solution is to simply not need groups to get stuff done. As mentioned above, having a chain quest which is entirely soloable except for the last quest. That sucks IMO. Either make it all group or no grouping required. From what I've read here, the game is not yet soloable enough. If they change it so I'm able to a) complete all the book quests and b) get the best loot without grouping/raiding, I'll resign.
Grouping should be done for fun and for expediency, never out of necessity.
I run on the brandwywine server and whenever i roll an alt (have 2 new ones, one at lvl 22 and another at 37) i never have any problems grouping and i see group replies all the time.
FYI, there are only 3 group quests that where removed, Goblin-Leader, Weavers in the Ruins and Our Greatest Find and that was because they were quest-chains that started out as solo and ended up as group. All the GA quests are still there and that revitalized a somewhat hated are. Lone-Land was (not anymore) the zone that people hated the most in the whole game and Orion did a hell of a job with it.
Maybe if you weren't such a douche you would find more groups.
Originally posted by wickedpt Maybe if you weren't such a douche you would find more groups.
This is universally applicable - beyond LOTRO and beyond MMOs.
How dare you present him with logic! Don't you understand? He fights epic fights, in epic games, with epic toons....eats epic food and takes epic dumps! He has more e..pic..icity...ness in his little finger than you have in your whole unepic body! - ChicagoCub
To the OP, Find a Kinship. I run on the brandwywine server and whenever i roll an alt (have 2 new ones, one at lvl 22 and another at 37) i never have any problems grouping and i see group replies all the time. FYI, there are only 3 group quests that where removed, Goblin-Leader, Weavers in the Ruins and Our Greatest Find and that was because they were quest-chains that started out as solo and ended up as group. All the GA quests are still there and that revitalized a somewhat hated are. Lone-Land was (not anymore) the zone that people hated the most in the whole game and Orion did a hell of a job with it. Maybe if you weren't such a douche you would find more groups.
lol look an idiot :
Retake Weathertop
Sever the White Hand
Weavers Beneath the Ruins
The Goblin Leader
Our Greatest Find
Enemies of the Eglain
Book 2 epic quests (including Breeders of the Dead)
Pursued by the Past
Plus various Agamaur quests.
Doesn't like 3 quests to me, dumbass. Good point about the kin though but like I said I already joined one when I reached 50. I wouldn't be posting this right now if I would have gotten a group for any single one of Angmar's 6 man quests after 2 weeks of searching.
Grouping should be done for fun and for expediency, never out of necessity.
Exactly. If you have 6 people who are soling along and suddenly part of the quest chain requires a group, they will find that group/make that group, do the quest and then everyone will leave.
this is NOT the way to do it.
The converse is true as well. Having everyone be in a group and then suddenly have a soloable part. It tends to break up the momentum.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
To the OP, Find a Kinship. I run on the brandwywine server and whenever i roll an alt (have 2 new ones, one at lvl 22 and another at 37) i never have any problems grouping and i see group replies all the time. FYI, there are only 3 group quests that where removed, Goblin-Leader, Weavers in the Ruins and Our Greatest Find and that was because they were quest-chains that started out as solo and ended up as group. All the GA quests are still there and that revitalized a somewhat hated are. Lone-Land was (not anymore) the zone that people hated the most in the whole game and Orion did a hell of a job with it. Maybe if you weren't such a douche you would find more groups.
lol look an idiot :
Retake Weathertop
Sever the White Hand
Weavers Beneath the Ruins
The Goblin Leader
Our Greatest Find
Enemies of the Eglain
Book 2 epic quests (including Breeders of the Dead)
Pursued by the Past
Plus various Agamaur quests.
Doesn't like 3 quests to me, dumbass. Good point about the kin though but like I said I already joined one when I reached 50. I wouldn't be posting this right now if I would have gotten a group for any single one of Angmar's 6 man quests after 2 weeks of searching.
Here's an idea...move on? Must you complete every single quest you find? There are PLENTY of solo quests to take you to Moria without NEEDING to group, so why must you complete those Angmar quests? Cause you feel like you have to? Whose fault is that, the player's or the company's fault? You seem to think its the company's fault for not making the games leveling dependent on groups. Sorry, but people don't really want that anymore, if you do, go play FFXI. It requires grouping almost the entire time to get anything done at a remotely decent speed.
You'll still level way faster in this game in a group than solo.
Grouping should be done for fun and for expediency, never out of necessity.
Exactly. If you have 6 people who are soling along and suddenly part of the quest chain requires a group, they will find that group/make that group, do the quest and then everyone will leave.
this is NOT the way to do it.
The converse is true as well. Having everyone be in a group and then suddenly have a soloable part. It tends to break up the momentum.
People don't find grouping to be fun in Lotro because:
The kill exp is too slow. Like in Vanguard, for players that seek to hit the cap as fast as possible, give large group experience killing bonus, so fastest grind exp per hour is doable in group.
Improve item or coin drop for group mobs. For players that seek to improve their gear as often as possible during the level up, this would be an adequate motivation.
Exactly like you mentioned, don't make the quest lines solo solo group solo group, either make a pure solo quest chain or pure group chain. Anyway, the less chains and requirements - the better.
Make the most graphically attractive looking places, to be group-only. Give there best loot for that level, and lots of experience.
Turbine discarded all this (too hard to implement I guess), and basically just removed all the group based content during their area revamp. Now noone is looking for groups, everyone is playing alone, and when they hit the end-game, they keep playing alone in their own instanced solo skirmishes. Great game.
What amazes me is I hear so many bad things about the game lately but I have never once Heard of a server merge.
So I know this game is still doing great and that players are having a blast. Personally I think the way they are improving the game is great, But I agree they need a heavy focus on PvP.
I hope they expand this game all the way till Mordor. With a huge PvP patch in Rohan and Gondor. Thats where the PvP needs to pick up.
What amazes me is I hear so many bad things about the game lately but I have never once Heard of a server merge.
So I know this game is still doing great and that players are having a blast. Personally I think the way they are improving the game is great, But I agree they need a heavy focus on PvP.
Grouping should be done for fun and for expediency, never out of necessity.
Exactly. If you have 6 people who are soling along and suddenly part of the quest chain requires a group, they will find that group/make that group, do the quest and then everyone will leave.
this is NOT the way to do it.
The converse is true as well. Having everyone be in a group and then suddenly have a soloable part. It tends to break up the momentum.
People don't find grouping to be fun in Lotro because:
The kill exp is too slow. Like in Vanguard, for players that seek to hit the cap as fast as possible, give large group experience killing bonus, so fastest grind exp per hour is doable in group.
Improve item or coin drop for group mobs. For players that seek to improve their gear as often as possible during the level up, this would be an adequate motivation.
Exactly like you mentioned, don't make the quest lines solo solo group solo group, either make a pure solo quest chain or pure group chain. Anyway, the less chains and requirements - the better.
Make the most graphically attractive looking places, to be group-only. Give there best loot for that level, and lots of experience.
Turbine discarded all this (too hard to implement I guess), and basically just removed all the group based content during their area revamp. Now noone is looking for groups, everyone is playing alone, and when they hit the end-game, they keep playing alone in their own instanced solo skirmishes. Great game.
You're blaming the game because the players choose to play solo?
Newsflash, you can still group even if the content is solo. Groups do get experience bonuses in the sense that you LEVEL FASTER if you're in a group. Why? Cause you complete quests faster. Questing is the quickest form of leveling(aside from skirmishes so I'm told), so that faster you complete them, the quicker you level.
I ONLY level in LOTRO in a group cause I play MMOs with my friends, we've never been short on cash. We've always had enough gold to buy all the upgrades we needed, train, and buy our mounts. Money and loot isn't an issue even in a group.
If you're doing group quests, and the next quest in the chain is a solo quest, you don't HAVE to disband. There's not a huge reason to unless the people you're grouping with are idiots.
Removing all the group based content in their area revamp is a GOOD idea. I've already stated in previous posts why removing group content in the early levels is a good idea.
If the players chose to run skirmishes at end game solo rather than run skirmishes with 12-24(cause of the Soldiers) others then that's their loss. If they choose to run skirmishes solo instead of run instances, that's their loss. You can't blame the developer for giving their players CHOICE, then getting mad at the developer cause their players chose to do something you don't like.
Skirmishes are a great idea lore wise and gameplay wise. I for one, support them adding more in patches.
What amazes me is I hear so many bad things about the game lately but I have never once Heard of a server merge.
So I know this game is still doing great and that players are having a blast. Personally I think the way they are improving the game is great, But I agree they need a heavy focus on PvP.
I hope they expand this game all the way till Mordor. With a huge PvP patch in Rohan and Gondor. Thats where the PvP needs to pick up.
This game shouldn't ever make PvP the main focus. PvP should have more added to it, yes, but it shouldn't become the main focus, ever.
If I want to deal with PvP/PvE balancing acts, I'll go back to WoW. No thank you.
I do agree they should have other zones for PvP when they open those areas.
Edit: The people having a blast are the ones playing. Don't trust forums, ever, to determine if a game is good or not. Look how popular WoW is yet look at all the negativity on the forums. Been like that for years.
Grouping should be done for fun and for expediency, never out of necessity.
Exactly. If you have 6 people who are soling along and suddenly part of the quest chain requires a group, they will find that group/make that group, do the quest and then everyone will leave.
this is NOT the way to do it.
The converse is true as well. Having everyone be in a group and then suddenly have a soloable part. It tends to break up the momentum.
People don't find grouping to be fun in Lotro because:
The kill exp is too slow. Like in Vanguard, for players that seek to hit the cap as fast as possible, give large group experience killing bonus, so fastest grind exp per hour is doable in group.
Improve item or coin drop for group mobs. For players that seek to improve their gear as often as possible during the level up, this would be an adequate motivation.
Exactly like you mentioned, don't make the quest lines solo solo group solo group, either make a pure solo quest chain or pure group chain. Anyway, the less chains and requirements - the better.
Make the most graphically attractive looking places, to be group-only. Give there best loot for that level, and lots of experience.
Turbine discarded all this (too hard to implement I guess), and basically just removed all the group based content during their area revamp. Now noone is looking for groups, everyone is playing alone, and when they hit the end-game, they keep playing alone in their own instanced solo skirmishes. Great game.
You're blaming the game because the players choose to play solo?
Newsflash, you can still group even if the content is solo. Groups do get experience bonuses in the sense that you LEVEL FASTER if you're in a group.
Of course this is not true.
Players choose to solo, because group content give them not enough reward, and because of the horrific LFG in-game tools, and because they made the leveling so fast, that there's basically too few people around your level. I remember it was easy to find a group 1-2.5 years ago. (basically before the level up speed nerf)
It's not like people have a strong inclination towards solo or towards group. People want to get things done, and they want to do it the most accessible way (in most cases anyway). If you give them plenty of options to socialize, they will. But Turbine went the other way.
Comments
I suspect that there is something else going on most of the time, I played LOTRO (taking a break right now too busy for too many mmo's and I'm playing STO for a change of pace now) and have never had a problem finding a group, why? I have an awesome fellowship and we are always organizing groups for all types of content both high level and low.
What has always tripped me out about these types of posts is that the people who seem to cry for groups seem to be so inept at "making in game friends" *shrug*. I haven't played since october so maybe things are vastly different but I can say LOTRO is one of the best and most friendly communities I've ever played in and I just find it hard to believe that people can't make friends and find people to join them on content. But again I'm not there right now but I really do suspect things haven't gotten as bad as this post makes it seem in only two months.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
lol this has to be the most ignorant post in here. Tell you what come to Angmar, right now, with your "awesome" social skills, and find me a pug group for 6 man groups I'm stuck on. No seriously do that and I'll edit the first post of this thread and ask the mods to delete it.
Before you do that though I advice you at least read this post I made :
"
So please don't think this a rant coming from a pro-grouper. I'm solo'd majority of Angmar and the only quests that I'm stuck on are all 6 man quests in Imlad Balchorth, Battle For Aughaire/Before Rammas Deluon, etc which btw, I've been trying to get a group for since 3 weeks now without success. I've spent entire days (weekends), shouting out in /LFF to get 6 people for these quests without success so to those posters who think its easy to find groups etc, they've obviously are speaking about some crowded place like Moria or Mirkwood now, or they're just in a super sized kin with a lot of good members willing to help.
"
Still think I'm socially inept? (which is ironic because I'm the one here who started this thread about Turbine "DELETING" Group content) Come show me how its done. I want to learn from the best
I cant say I have noticed a decline in grouping. Then again I belong to a huge Kinship with members from all ranges so it is never an issue. I have noticed slightly less people in several areas but it looks to be enough for a group. The raids are about pointless in SoA so why bother? The quests in LoTRO have always been soloable (besides raid content of course) but they do seem to be even easier now. Heck, I solo'ed to cap a year ago!
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Good fun for solo'ists and groups. Join a kinship and you should be ok.
It's hard to find groups now as it is in most level-based games once the population is mostly max level. It doesn't mean the game is dead or dying, there is great grouping going on at level cap. My kin is active and having fun. I easily get into groups whenever I want (at cap.)
If I were you, I'd post on the server boards and see if anyone is interested in grouping to level low-level toons on a regular basis. Recently, I saw such a group of six players form up on one of the boards.
The Lone Lands is not 100% solo content. I would love for you to go and try to do GA solo and let me know how that goes for you. :P
I agree with Params7. LFF Panel should be improved long time ago and its true that its very difficult to find 6 people group in Angmar. I had to skip many group quests not only in Angmar, because not able to find a group.
As for LFF Panel, Its completely useless. I play this game something around 4 month and never found a team to join using LFF panel. Instead I had to use LFF chat to find someone and it often worked. I don't understand why Turbine do not improve LFF panel in this game while they have very good example of social panel from their other game Dungeons and Dragons Online.
In DDO Social Panel is great. It display all teams created by users and all people who looking for team in the whole region. It shows how many people there are in each team, which quest they are doing, level of the quest, for which classes they are looking, and if its open team or closed private team. You could just choose any team and join.
Actually the most xp comes from doing skirmishes now heh only problem is you make next to no money doing them.
Oh that's neat, haven't tried skirmishes myself, took a break right before SoM came out.
lol this has to be the most ignorant post in here. Tell you what come to Angmar, right now, with your "awesome" social skills, and find me a pug group for 6 man groups I'm stuck on. No seriously do that and I'll edit the first post of this thread and ask the mods to delete it.
Before you do that though I advice you at least read this post I made :
"
So please don't think this a rant coming from a pro-grouper. I'm solo'd majority of Angmar and the only quests that I'm stuck on are all 6 man quests in Imlad Balchorth, Battle For Aughaire/Before Rammas Deluon, etc which btw, I've been trying to get a group for since 3 weeks now without success. I've spent entire days (weekends), shouting out in /LFF to get 6 people for these quests without success so to those posters who think its easy to find groups etc, they've obviously are speaking about some crowded place like Moria or Mirkwood now, or they're just in a super sized kin with a lot of good members willing to help.
"
Still think I'm socially inept? (which is ironic because I'm the one here who started this thread about Turbine "DELETING" Group content) Come show me how its done. I want to learn from the best
I play on Brandywine and I see people wanting to do the old dungeons all the time. This is back when you still had to run them to get your legendary traits, which is a GOOD change that you don't have to anymore.
Some builds are based on Legendary Traits, having to rely on 5 others and a drop just to ensure I get those couple good traits is a bad design choice, especially when the content is 15 levels old. Hooray that they finally changed it with Skirmish Marks now.
You're a completionist aren't you? You can't just look at quests and drop them.
I guess you expect the game to be : Quest hub A - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub B - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub C - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub D - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub E - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub F - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub G - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub H - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub I - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub J - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub K - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub L - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub M - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub N - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub O - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub P - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Instance 1 to get first piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 2 to get second piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 3 to get third piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 4 to get fourth piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 5 to get fifth piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 6 to get sixth piece of radiance, which then leads to Raid 1 and then GAME OVER.
I guess this is your vision of the quests and the gameflow. Well my vision is that quests should contain exploration & combat & travel & social-grouping parts as well. In Lone-lands the quest about boars, you could actually also finish around the eastern border, you did not need to travel to the western one -- but for that, you would need to first explore and discover their spawn place.
REALITY CHECK
WoW fixed the root cause of group problems with their new LFG tools. Whereas Turbine thought about improving LFG, took suggestions from the community....then forgot all about it..and instead, deleted group quests all together, making the already damaged LFG system even more useless. lol.
Thats the thing that really bugged me about lotro it is just horrible trying to find groups for quests and dungeons before you hit max level.
Part of their problem is that they have soloable content then "suddnely" you need a group for a quest or two and then it's back to solo.
So, for players who do want to group, what usually happens is that they join a group, do the quest and then the group disbands.
I remember that in Lineage 2 there were areas that were clearly group oriented and that the xp was pretty good as well as the rewards (when they did drop) yet one could be a soloist and still be able to play all day if they wanted.
It's not that hard to cater to these play styles in one game.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I guess you expect the game to be : Quest hub A - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub B - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub C - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub D - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub E - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub F - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub G - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub H - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub I - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub J - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub K - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub L - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub M - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub N - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub O - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Quest hub P - 10 quests, all in close vicinity - all a few chains, final chain leads to Instance 1 to get first piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 2 to get second piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 3 to get third piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 4 to get fourth piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 5 to get fifth piece of radiance, which then leads to Instance 6 to get sixth piece of radiance, which then leads to Raid 1 and then GAME OVER.
I guess this is your vision of the quests and the gameflow. Well my vision is that quests should contain exploration & combat & travel & social-grouping parts as well. In Lone-lands the quest about boars, you could actually also finish around the eastern border, you did not need to travel to the western one -- but for that, you would need to first explore and discover their spawn place.
Innovation and exploration is great. My very first character on LOTRO that quested I had ZERO problems with the questing design. I had to search and explore for quests, it was fun, I loved it.
My second time, I started to see what was kind of frustrating, going way out of my way for a couple quests, just to be taken way out of the way, but I dealt with it because it wasn't too bad.
On my 5th or 6th character? No, it wasn't fun anymore. Ultimately it led to me never wanting to reroll ever again until they did something about it. Oh look, they did. Why? Cause people were tired of it.
If you play one character, stick with him and never roll an alt, of course you're not going to mind your questing experience on the first time, its new and exciting. Replay value is what you need to go for on an MMO when you can easily make 7-10 different characters and may want to explore them all.
And gear gating has nothing to do with questing, the fact that you would even compare the two is just silly. Gear gating has never, and will never, be fun. Faster character progression on content you've done countless times before? More fun.
Don't be an idiot.
And if you want to pick out one quest to talk about, fine. The quest with boars and lynx, yeah, there were Boars out by the entrance to Trollshaws, but did it solve the problem of the Lynx who have no set spawn and SHARE A spawn with other wildlife that you don't need for quests at the current time? Nope.
The quest progression is bad, and Turbine saw this, that's why its called for a revamp. If it was good, they wouldn't change it.
I could go on all day about LOTRO's quest design, but I still think its a great game. After the Angmar revamp, and they added in Forochel and Evendim, questing was just fine. They learned from their mistakes in the beginning. Eregion was fun, Moria's fun. They want to make the other zones more like that.
You want to explore? Fine, go ahead, you might unlock a trait for seeing that tower off in the distance and exploring it. That's good exploration.
My level 32 alt never has any problem finding a fellowship.
He is on the Secret Hobbit Channel, which helps a lot....
My level 65 main hardly ever does anything alone anymore.
Not because he can't, some things are just more fun in a fellowship.
Especially skirmishes.
WoW fixed the root cause of group problems with their new LFG tools. Whereas Turbine thought about improving LFG, took suggestions from the community....then forgot all about it..and instead, deleted group quests all together, making the already damaged LFG system even more useless. lol.
Thats the thing that really bugged me about lotro it is just horrible trying to find groups for quests and dungeons before you hit max level.
Part of their problem is that they have soloable content then "suddnely" you need a group for a quest or two and then it's back to solo.
So, for players who do want to group, what usually happens is that they join a group, do the quest and then the group disbands.
I remember that in Lineage 2 there were areas that were clearly group oriented and that the xp was pretty good as well as the rewards (when they did drop) yet one could be a soloist and still be able to play all day if they wanted.
It's not that hard to cater to these play styles in one game.
True. People are talking about how the LFG needs to be improved and perhaps it does, but another solution is to simply not need groups to get stuff done. As mentioned above, having a chain quest which is entirely soloable except for the last quest. That sucks IMO. Either make it all group or no grouping required. From what I've read here, the game is not yet soloable enough. If they change it so I'm able to a) complete all the book quests and b) get the best loot without grouping/raiding, I'll resign.
Grouping should be done for fun and for expediency, never out of necessity.
To the OP,
Find a Kinship.
I run on the brandwywine server and whenever i roll an alt (have 2 new ones, one at lvl 22 and another at 37) i never have any problems grouping and i see group replies all the time.
FYI, there are only 3 group quests that where removed, Goblin-Leader, Weavers in the Ruins and Our Greatest Find and that was because they were quest-chains that started out as solo and ended up as group. All the GA quests are still there and that revitalized a somewhat hated are. Lone-Land was (not anymore) the zone that people hated the most in the whole game and Orion did a hell of a job with it.
Maybe if you weren't such a douche you would find more groups.
This is universally applicable - beyond LOTRO and beyond MMOs.
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lol look an idiot :
Retake Weathertop
Sever the White Hand
Weavers Beneath the Ruins
The Goblin Leader
Our Greatest Find
Enemies of the Eglain
Book 2 epic quests (including Breeders of the Dead)
Pursued by the Past
Plus various Agamaur quests.
Doesn't like 3 quests to me, dumbass. Good point about the kin though but like I said I already joined one when I reached 50. I wouldn't be posting this right now if I would have gotten a group for any single one of Angmar's 6 man quests after 2 weeks of searching.
Exactly. If you have 6 people who are soling along and suddenly part of the quest chain requires a group, they will find that group/make that group, do the quest and then everyone will leave.
this is NOT the way to do it.
The converse is true as well. Having everyone be in a group and then suddenly have a soloable part. It tends to break up the momentum.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
lol look an idiot :
Retake Weathertop
Sever the White Hand
Weavers Beneath the Ruins
The Goblin Leader
Our Greatest Find
Enemies of the Eglain
Book 2 epic quests (including Breeders of the Dead)
Pursued by the Past
Plus various Agamaur quests.
Doesn't like 3 quests to me, dumbass. Good point about the kin though but like I said I already joined one when I reached 50. I wouldn't be posting this right now if I would have gotten a group for any single one of Angmar's 6 man quests after 2 weeks of searching.
Here's an idea...move on? Must you complete every single quest you find? There are PLENTY of solo quests to take you to Moria without NEEDING to group, so why must you complete those Angmar quests? Cause you feel like you have to? Whose fault is that, the player's or the company's fault? You seem to think its the company's fault for not making the games leveling dependent on groups. Sorry, but people don't really want that anymore, if you do, go play FFXI. It requires grouping almost the entire time to get anything done at a remotely decent speed.
You'll still level way faster in this game in a group than solo.
Exactly. If you have 6 people who are soling along and suddenly part of the quest chain requires a group, they will find that group/make that group, do the quest and then everyone will leave.
this is NOT the way to do it.
The converse is true as well. Having everyone be in a group and then suddenly have a soloable part. It tends to break up the momentum.
People don't find grouping to be fun in Lotro because:
Turbine discarded all this (too hard to implement I guess), and basically just removed all the group based content during their area revamp. Now noone is looking for groups, everyone is playing alone, and when they hit the end-game, they keep playing alone in their own instanced solo skirmishes. Great game.
REALITY CHECK
What amazes me is I hear so many bad things about the game lately but I have never once Heard of a server merge.
So I know this game is still doing great and that players are having a blast. Personally I think the way they are improving the game is great, But I agree they need a heavy focus on PvP.
I hope they expand this game all the way till Mordor. With a huge PvP patch in Rohan and Gondor. Thats where the PvP needs to pick up.
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Yes, they are having a blast.
Make a short visit here: http://community.codemasters.com/forum/lord-rings-online-general-discussion-424 (general EU forum)
And check US forum that adopted poster reputation, which will eventually filter out all negativity sooner or later.
REALITY CHECK
Exactly. If you have 6 people who are soling along and suddenly part of the quest chain requires a group, they will find that group/make that group, do the quest and then everyone will leave.
this is NOT the way to do it.
The converse is true as well. Having everyone be in a group and then suddenly have a soloable part. It tends to break up the momentum.
People don't find grouping to be fun in Lotro because:
Turbine discarded all this (too hard to implement I guess), and basically just removed all the group based content during their area revamp. Now noone is looking for groups, everyone is playing alone, and when they hit the end-game, they keep playing alone in their own instanced solo skirmishes. Great game.
You're blaming the game because the players choose to play solo?
Newsflash, you can still group even if the content is solo. Groups do get experience bonuses in the sense that you LEVEL FASTER if you're in a group. Why? Cause you complete quests faster. Questing is the quickest form of leveling(aside from skirmishes so I'm told), so that faster you complete them, the quicker you level.
I ONLY level in LOTRO in a group cause I play MMOs with my friends, we've never been short on cash. We've always had enough gold to buy all the upgrades we needed, train, and buy our mounts. Money and loot isn't an issue even in a group.
If you're doing group quests, and the next quest in the chain is a solo quest, you don't HAVE to disband. There's not a huge reason to unless the people you're grouping with are idiots.
Removing all the group based content in their area revamp is a GOOD idea. I've already stated in previous posts why removing group content in the early levels is a good idea.
If the players chose to run skirmishes at end game solo rather than run skirmishes with 12-24(cause of the Soldiers) others then that's their loss. If they choose to run skirmishes solo instead of run instances, that's their loss. You can't blame the developer for giving their players CHOICE, then getting mad at the developer cause their players chose to do something you don't like.
Skirmishes are a great idea lore wise and gameplay wise. I for one, support them adding more in patches.
This game shouldn't ever make PvP the main focus. PvP should have more added to it, yes, but it shouldn't become the main focus, ever.
If I want to deal with PvP/PvE balancing acts, I'll go back to WoW. No thank you.
I do agree they should have other zones for PvP when they open those areas.
Edit: The people having a blast are the ones playing. Don't trust forums, ever, to determine if a game is good or not. Look how popular WoW is yet look at all the negativity on the forums. Been like that for years.
Exactly. If you have 6 people who are soling along and suddenly part of the quest chain requires a group, they will find that group/make that group, do the quest and then everyone will leave.
this is NOT the way to do it.
The converse is true as well. Having everyone be in a group and then suddenly have a soloable part. It tends to break up the momentum.
People don't find grouping to be fun in Lotro because:
Turbine discarded all this (too hard to implement I guess), and basically just removed all the group based content during their area revamp. Now noone is looking for groups, everyone is playing alone, and when they hit the end-game, they keep playing alone in their own instanced solo skirmishes. Great game.
You're blaming the game because the players choose to play solo?
Newsflash, you can still group even if the content is solo. Groups do get experience bonuses in the sense that you LEVEL FASTER if you're in a group.
Of course this is not true.
Players choose to solo, because group content give them not enough reward, and because of the horrific LFG in-game tools, and because they made the leveling so fast, that there's basically too few people around your level. I remember it was easy to find a group 1-2.5 years ago. (basically before the level up speed nerf)
It's not like people have a strong inclination towards solo or towards group. People want to get things done, and they want to do it the most accessible way (in most cases anyway). If you give them plenty of options to socialize, they will. But Turbine went the other way.
REALITY CHECK