I can very strongly say after playing every p2p mmo but eve and planetside, that iv'e figured out why wow is so popular. Simplicity Why simplicity?
Look at All the MMO's that have come out since 2008 you need a up to date computer to play it.Most people i know have a Old Dell from the dude im getting a dell commercial.Which runs wow fine.
Then we have newer games which like for a person that does absolutely no fancy stuf on your computer (talking a P4 HT with no AGP or PCI-E slot here) they will make your computer explode... Also the game play is for lack of a better term "Jack of all trades" good at all master of none. PvP is good if you just play for the occasional break in leveling.PvE is pve lol not like grind alot(Aion) or do Quests till your Eyes bleed(Lotro)Raiding is fun on a casual basis,And the crafting isn't mega time consuming(Aion)being Being ganked (asherons call and aion <..>) Basically its your ultimate Pick up and Play MMO your old grandma can play it, without being super confused. Dont get me wrong if you past a Casual Gamer like the guys that delete thier Character on youtube no clue why or the dudes on CODMW2 who have prestige rank 10 which is like damn .... its probably gonna get kinda dry and boring after a while. Just so you know i play Age of Conan and other shooters and my Mother and sister play world of warcraft like a relaxed basis they just hit 80 after 5 months .This is no way shape or form a fanboy post cuz i like pretty much every(P2P) mmo ive ever played , just a opinion.
Thanks for telling us something we didn't know.
WoW is not for purists, its for people new to the genre.
Not true at all pal people who like mmo's in general. The only game that is more complicated than WoW is Eve.
The underlined part....yeah, that's a real "WTF moment" there...
WTF? Oooookay.
Let me guess....
The only MMOs you have PLAYED are WoW and EVE.
Yeah, this is actually one of the most idiotic comments I've ever seen on this site. And let me tell you....that's saying a LOT.
EDIT:
I should add here, that I played WoW from release until a few months ago. But I've also played a myriad of other MMOs.
I don't have anything particularly terrible to say about WoW. I enjoyed it while I was playing it, but....
to say that the only game that is more complicated than WoW is EVE? Well that....that's just downright delusional at worst, and stupid at best. It's delusional if you've played anything other than WoW and EVE, because there are assorted games out there that make WoW look like a feisty game of Candyland. It's stupid to say what you said if you haven't played any games other than WoW and EVE, because then...you'd just be talking out your ass. But if that's the case....dont' feel bad....it's a common occurrence around here.
Interesting, I've always felt that for every active WOW player there are about 2 who've played it and quit hence there is huge number of people with a negative opinion of the game right now.
And I wish most of them would raise some decent issues about it.
There are a few people on this forum who do that, but most of them are some really uneducated rants.
It's like I'm in high school again: You must do everything you can to badmouth your former girlfriend!
Interesting, I've always felt that for every active WOW player there are about 2 who've played it and quit hence there is huge number of people with a negative opinion of the game right now.
And I wish most of them would raise some decent issues about it.
There are a few people on this forum who do that, but most of them are some really uneducated rants.
It's like I'm in high school again: You must do everything you can to badmouth your former girlfriend!
Interesting, I've always felt that for every active WOW player there are about 2 who've played it and quit hence there is huge number of people with a negative opinion of the game right now.
And I wish most of them would raise some decent issues about it.
There are a few people on this forum who do that, but most of them are some really uneducated rants.
It's like I'm in high school again: You must do everything you can to badmouth your former girlfriend!
LOL
You said what I was thinking.
And yet I assume that you somehow think comments like "the only game harder than WoW is EVE," coming from a WoW player are what....brilliant?
Please, come on here. There are two sides to this coin. Neither the fanbois NOR the haters generally make comments that have much of real value to say. So it becomes a "Pot, meet Kettle" sort of conversation.
Sadly, there are not many people able to be completely objective about WoW. Why? Well, your girlfriend analogy is pretty spot on, in a way.....
ANALOGY:
When you break up with someone, say...that you've been seeing for oh...5 years...there's usually a reason that you're breaking up. Maybe the things about her that you ONCE thought were cute....aren't so cute anymore. Like...it used to be really adorable how she'd smack her gum when she chewed it...but after five years of listening to that...now it's just fucking annoying, and yet....she won't stop....even when you tell her it's driving you insane.
Or maybe....maybe you used to spend time together and it was just so much fun...adventure, exciting....you felt like kids together. But as time went on...you changed...you grew apart. She didn't seem to grow with you, or in the same direction....but she changed, nonetheless, although....the changes just drove a wedge further and further between you, until she suddenly didn't seem AT ALL like the girl you knew five years ago....and you just weren't having fun any more. Her personality seemed to change to the point, you didn't feel like you even knew her anymore, and the "new her"....wasn't someone you liked.
So, eventually...... you break up.
Now...when you think of her (remember...you're now irritated and disillusioned, probably a little disappointed, maybe feeling like the last five years was wasted, and you might even be a little heartsick, and hurt)....do you think of "gee all the good times we used to have together" or....do you remember how fucking annoying it was when she smacked her gum?
Yeah. I thought so.
(And THAT.....is what I think, makes objectivity about it....difficult for most people.) But you're right in the fact...that even though her gum smacking is all I can remember....I, personally, don't find a need to go tell everyone that on a web forum, but hey....people have different ways of working through gamer angst, I guess. lol
"Another thought I have is that you have to also remember that the subscriber base of WoW today is not just the one we had when we launched. There's a whole bunch of people who tuned out of WoW two years ago or four years ago, but who really enjoyed it, and when another MMO comes out that tickles their fancy, they'll jump into it. I don't know what the exact number is off-hand, but the total number of subscribers we've had is easily more than double - maybe closer to triple - the current subscriber base. "
So with what was said and considering the 12 million number to be the total number they have had, could one say that WOW currently has 6-8 million subs? Ive seen these numbers posted here on this site.
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
WoW is just a well polished game with much to do and works on the most basic computers.. WoW targets the largest base of players, not just some lil segment of gamers..
Is wow starting to stumble.. a lil because end game is getting boring.. BUT.. There is NOTHING out there as clean and simple as WoW is to compete with it.. Why? That part boggles me.. I and friends have written down a great idea for a MMO.. We've even done alot of the data and number crunching on computer programs.... Why no one since LoTRO has tried to buck the giant is beyond me.. I know that our small guild is looking for new blood, Aion failed Who's next?
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
I'm curious why someone who says 12 million without a credible source is guessing, but when you say it isn't 12 million you don't feel that you are making a guess without credible source.
"Another thought I have is that you have to also remember that the subscriber base of WoW today is not just the one we had when we launched. There's a whole bunch of people who tuned out of WoW two years ago or four years ago, but who really enjoyed it, and when another MMO comes out that tickles their fancy, they'll jump into it. I don't know what the exact number is off-hand, but the total number of subscribers we've had is easily more than double - maybe closer to triple - the current subscriber base. "
So with what was said and considering the 12 million number to be the total number they have had, could one say that WOW currently has 6-8 million subs? Ive seen these numbers posted here on this site.
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
That's not the point. The point is that the number of active and non-active subscribers is approximately 3 times that number. What is the current active subscriber number is irrelevent. Grandpagamer had misunderstood the quote, that's all I was pointing out.
Besides, this quote was from an interview about WoW turning 5 which was in November, so the quote pertains to whatever the active subscriber count was in November approximately a year after WoTLK was released. I only used the 12 million number to illustrate my point, it wasn't meant to be taken literally.
And then again maybe you should heed your own advice.
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
I'm curious why someone who says 12 million without a credible source is guessing, but when you say it isn't 12 million you don't feel that you are making a guess without credible source.
Last time Blizzard posted any numbers was last year(sorry i don't have a link). I also never said I wasn't guessing.
I guess you missed the point I was trying to make in that post.
"Another thought I have is that you have to also remember that the subscriber base of WoW today is not just the one we had when we launched. There's a whole bunch of people who tuned out of WoW two years ago or four years ago, but who really enjoyed it, and when another MMO comes out that tickles their fancy, they'll jump into it. I don't know what the exact number is off-hand, but the total number of subscribers we've had is easily more than double - maybe closer to triple - the current subscriber base. "
So with what was said and considering the 12 million number to be the total number they have had, could one say that WOW currently has 6-8 million subs? Ive seen these numbers posted here on this site.
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
That's not the point. The point is that the number of active and non-active subscribers is approximately 3 times that number. What is the current active subscriber number is irrelevent. Grandpagamer had misunderstood the quote, that's all I was pointing out.
Besides, this quote was from an interview about WoW turning 5 which was in November, so the quote pertains to whatever the active subscriber count was in November approximately a year after WoTLK was released. I only used the 12 million number to illustrate my point, it wasn't meant to be taken literally.
And then again maybe you should heed your own advice.
Whats more complicated than wow then? EQ2? No. LOTRO? No. EQ1? No. AoC? No. EVE probably is, but I've never played it.
Complications being good, for the sake of being complicated? Or you have specific aspects of depth of gameplay you want to talk about? The most complicated MMO is one you play when blind folded and try to listen to teammates on vent.
Having complications just for the sake of making things complicated does not make for a good game if you ask me. However I found the shear amount of things I needed to learn along the way with EVE, kept my interest for the game at a high rate for a very long time. I still don't know everything about the game. I like that. But everything has purpose in EVE. It all fits together like an expertly well spun spider web.
Now if you take a glance at my new infatuation (Darkfall), even though it is nowhere near as complex, I find myself excited to log in just to explore, taking out some of my favorite mobs, or indulge in some great PVP. It's kept me me captivated for similar reasons, but it is a far cry from EVE.
My question to you is, what keeps you going in WOW? Are you still learning new things all the time? Is it the friends you have made, or perhaps things you can achieve down the line? Or is it something completely different that keeps you logging in? I'm genuinely curious as I havn't had a sub since approximately 2 months after BGs were introduced.
Interesting discussion.
I do not stay in WoW alone, I have a lot of options when I am not working. Picking fresh fruits with sister's baby killed the last weekend.
WoW, yes lots of things to learn and explore. With new bosses every few months, I can try to test out options, tactics gearing, gemming, talents, rotations, for each new boss, for each of my maxed characters, for each role (heal, dps, tank). I can only try each boss kill once a week per character, but with enough maxed characters, I never can test all options within the week.
I understand the whole idea about EvE. I never bother about DF. In comparison, WoW is more like an academic exercise, with probability, theorycrafting and manual conditioning of fingers in one package. Whenever there is a new boss, I spend quite a bit of time on my calculator or spreadsheet, making models and testing them out. Say a boss with 200million HP, with certain events slowing stopping DPS, I can only fit in so many (say) fireballs before the boss goes rage (kills all in 1 stroke). So I can impute the minimal average damage per fireball to kill him, or changes in rotation to estimate the average gains/losses. And so many bosses, so many raid composition that will favour alternate way of playing from my characters. That is what we do in WoW. Not just blindly chasing gear or spamming the same few button.
Now I can use a mage for magic damage, a hunter for 2 ways of playing, 3 healers that serves very different heal purposes and roles, and a tank. It is just more than enough materials for me to feel "mentally engaged".
Well of course. WoW was the simplest, easiest, most user friendly game, without any penalties whatsover when it released. It didn't go over well with regular MMORPG gamers, which is why they targetted people who never played MMORPGs. There are far more of them, which is why we now get WoW clones, and MMORPGs without new ideas, cause WoW didn't have any new game mechanics, just made things really simple and instant gratification, and tried to hook the masses.
Detailed complex social games are sadly a thing of the past. I really think there needs to be a category splitting old MMORPG social complex formula, vs the new one, that are becoming less and less massive and seamless by the year.
Well of course. WoW was the simplest, easiest, most user friendly game, without any penalties whatsover when it released. It didn't go over well with regular MMORPG gamers, which is why they targetted people who never played MMORPGs. There are far more of them, which is why we now get WoW clones, and MMORPGs without new ideas, cause WoW didn't have any new game mechanics, just made things really simple and instant gratification, and tried to hook the masses. Detailed complex social games are sadly a thing of the past. I really think there needs to be a category splitting old MMORPG social complex formula, vs the new one, that are becoming less and less massive and seamless by the year.
Didn't go over well with "regular" mmo players? Then why did so many other mmos see steep declines in population when wow released.
I think this notion that only new mmo players are attracted to wow needs to be put to rest.
How big of a moron do you have to be to not undestand even the most complicated MMO?
Sadly, there are tons of huge morons out there. Not just in WoW, either. I still don't think someone deserves a pat on the back, because they play a video game. Get over yourselves.
Well of course. WoW was the simplest, easiest, most user friendly game, without any penalties whatsover when it released. It didn't go over well with regular MMORPG gamers, which is why they targetted people who never played MMORPGs. There are far more of them, which is why we now get WoW clones, and MMORPGs without new ideas, cause WoW didn't have any new game mechanics, just made things really simple and instant gratification, and tried to hook the masses. Detailed complex social games are sadly a thing of the past. I really think there needs to be a category splitting old MMORPG social complex formula, vs the new one, that are becoming less and less massive and seamless by the year.
Didn't go over well with "regular" mmo players? Then why did so many other mmos see steep declines in population when wow released.
I think this notion that only new mmo players are attracted to wow needs to be put to rest.
There was a decline in other MMOs population because those MMOs quickly changed their game through patches and expansions to resemble WoW. DAoC and EQ are nowhere near as great as they used to be, or people would still be playing them. There are always people that try out the new shiney, at the time my guild leader left to play WoW, than came back a month later, like most people did.
The reason WOW does well is because the developers remember it's a game, first and foremost they focus all effort to make it a fun one. There's really not much more to it than that.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The decline began long before the "changes" were made to those games. Most of those changes were being made in response to the decline happening in those games.
In all honesty, I bet there are more people with prior mmo experience in wow than there are in the next several games combined.
@tobias4 The decline began long before the "changes" were made to those games. Most of those changes were being made in response to the decline happening in those games.
In all honesty, I bet there are more people with prior mmo experience in wow than there are in the next several games combined.
And that is because there are no more games left running that cater to the old social seamless world of old time MMORPGs, so those veterans are forced to play WoW or one of its various clones. Or, they hide out in games like Eve, Darkfall, Fallen Earth, unique titles.
@tobias4 The decline began long before the "changes" were made to those games. Most of those changes were being made in response to the decline happening in those games.
In all honesty, I bet there are more people with prior mmo experience in wow than there are in the next several games combined.
And that is because there are no more games left running that cater to the old social seamless world of old time MMORPGs, so those veterans are forced to play WoW or one of its various clones. Or, they hide out in games like Eve, Darkfall, Fallen Earth, unique titles.
Isn't it just possible that maybe those "real mmo" players who moved to wow actually enjoy it and find it a better game?
It isn't like there was a gun being held to their head and they were forced to go play wow.
As for there being no games that aim for the old seemless social aspect of mmos, are you saying that because there absolutely are not any being made or perhaps overlooking those that tried, but delivered a game that just wasn't compelling enough to play?
There is no secret to WoWs success. It is a complete, robust, artistic, catchy, charming game that is pretty easy to get into and is often updated and given attention. Its simple, Blizzard made a good game.
Originally posted by Scagweed22 is it the graphics? the repetativenesses? i mean what is the point? you could be so much more productive in real life Real life brings repetition and pointlessness too. The only thing real life offers is Great graphics. Its kinda expensive too and way to dependent on the cash shop. Totally pay to win as well. No thank you. Ill stick to my games.
There is no secret to WoWs success. It is a complete, robust, artistic, catchy, charming game that is pretty easy to get into and is often updated and given attention. Its simple, Blizzard made a good game.
There's nothing "robust" about WoW. It still lacks features and gameplay mechanics that games in 2001 had standard.
It'd be more accurate to say, they made a simple game at the right time, when there were no simple games out there, and the market for simple MMO goers was untapped.
There is no secret to WoWs success. It is a complete, robust, artistic, catchy, charming game that is pretty easy to get into and is often updated and given attention. Its simple, Blizzard made a good game.
There's nothing "robust" about WoW. It still lacks features and gameplay mechanics that games in 2001 had standard.
It'd be more accurate to say, they made a simple game at the right time, when there were no simple games out there, and the market for simple MMO goers was untapped.
Comments
Thanks for telling us something we didn't know.
WoW is not for purists, its for people new to the genre.
Not true at all pal people who like mmo's in general. The only game that is more complicated than WoW is Eve.
The underlined part....yeah, that's a real "WTF moment" there...
WTF? Oooookay.
Let me guess....
The only MMOs you have PLAYED are WoW and EVE.
Yeah, this is actually one of the most idiotic comments I've ever seen on this site. And let me tell you....that's saying a LOT.
EDIT:
I should add here, that I played WoW from release until a few months ago. But I've also played a myriad of other MMOs.
I don't have anything particularly terrible to say about WoW. I enjoyed it while I was playing it, but....
to say that the only game that is more complicated than WoW is EVE? Well that....that's just downright delusional at worst, and stupid at best. It's delusional if you've played anything other than WoW and EVE, because there are assorted games out there that make WoW look like a feisty game of Candyland. It's stupid to say what you said if you haven't played any games other than WoW and EVE, because then...you'd just be talking out your ass. But if that's the case....dont' feel bad....it's a common occurrence around here.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
What she said.
And I wish most of them would raise some decent issues about it.
There are a few people on this forum who do that, but most of them are some really uneducated rants.
It's like I'm in high school again: You must do everything you can to badmouth your former girlfriend!
And I wish most of them would raise some decent issues about it.
There are a few people on this forum who do that, but most of them are some really uneducated rants.
It's like I'm in high school again: You must do everything you can to badmouth your former girlfriend!
LOL
You said what I was thinking.
And I wish most of them would raise some decent issues about it.
There are a few people on this forum who do that, but most of them are some really uneducated rants.
It's like I'm in high school again: You must do everything you can to badmouth your former girlfriend!
LOL
You said what I was thinking.
And yet I assume that you somehow think comments like "the only game harder than WoW is EVE," coming from a WoW player are what....brilliant?
Please, come on here. There are two sides to this coin. Neither the fanbois NOR the haters generally make comments that have much of real value to say. So it becomes a "Pot, meet Kettle" sort of conversation.
Sadly, there are not many people able to be completely objective about WoW. Why? Well, your girlfriend analogy is pretty spot on, in a way.....
ANALOGY:
When you break up with someone, say...that you've been seeing for oh...5 years...there's usually a reason that you're breaking up. Maybe the things about her that you ONCE thought were cute....aren't so cute anymore. Like...it used to be really adorable how she'd smack her gum when she chewed it...but after five years of listening to that...now it's just fucking annoying, and yet....she won't stop....even when you tell her it's driving you insane.
Or maybe....maybe you used to spend time together and it was just so much fun...adventure, exciting....you felt like kids together. But as time went on...you changed...you grew apart. She didn't seem to grow with you, or in the same direction....but she changed, nonetheless, although....the changes just drove a wedge further and further between you, until she suddenly didn't seem AT ALL like the girl you knew five years ago....and you just weren't having fun any more. Her personality seemed to change to the point, you didn't feel like you even knew her anymore, and the "new her"....wasn't someone you liked.
So, eventually...... you break up.
Now...when you think of her (remember...you're now irritated and disillusioned, probably a little disappointed, maybe feeling like the last five years was wasted, and you might even be a little heartsick, and hurt)....do you think of "gee all the good times we used to have together" or....do you remember how fucking annoying it was when she smacked her gum?
Yeah. I thought so.
(And THAT.....is what I think, makes objectivity about it....difficult for most people.) But you're right in the fact...that even though her gum smacking is all I can remember....I, personally, don't find a need to go tell everyone that on a web forum, but hey....people have different ways of working through gamer angst, I guess. lol
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
"Another thought I have is that you have to also remember that the subscriber base of WoW today is not just the one we had when we launched. There's a whole bunch of people who tuned out of WoW two years ago or four years ago, but who really enjoyed it, and when another MMO comes out that tickles their fancy, they'll jump into it. I don't know what the exact number is off-hand, but the total number of subscribers we've had is easily more than double - maybe closer to triple - the current subscriber base. "
http://www.warcry.com/articles/view/interviews/6773-Five-Years-of-Warcraft-Speaking-With-Blizzards-Rob-Pardo.2
Maybe read what you post.
So with what was said and considering the 12 million number to be the total number they have had, could one say that WOW currently has 6-8 million subs? Ive seen these numbers posted here on this site.
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
Everyone has opinions, but does that make them the universal truth??? NO!
WoW is just a well polished game with much to do and works on the most basic computers.. WoW targets the largest base of players, not just some lil segment of gamers..
Is wow starting to stumble.. a lil because end game is getting boring.. BUT.. There is NOTHING out there as clean and simple as WoW is to compete with it.. Why? That part boggles me.. I and friends have written down a great idea for a MMO.. We've even done alot of the data and number crunching on computer programs.... Why no one since LoTRO has tried to buck the giant is beyond me.. I know that our small guild is looking for new blood, Aion failed
Who's next?
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
I'm curious why someone who says 12 million without a credible source is guessing, but when you say it isn't 12 million you don't feel that you are making a guess without credible source.
"Another thought I have is that you have to also remember that the subscriber base of WoW today is not just the one we had when we launched. There's a whole bunch of people who tuned out of WoW two years ago or four years ago, but who really enjoyed it, and when another MMO comes out that tickles their fancy, they'll jump into it. I don't know what the exact number is off-hand, but the total number of subscribers we've had is easily more than double - maybe closer to triple - the current subscriber base. "
http://www.warcry.com/articles/view/interviews/6773-Five-Years-of-Warcraft-Speaking-With-Blizzards-Rob-Pardo.2
Maybe read what you post.
So with what was said and considering the 12 million number to be the total number they have had, could one say that WOW currently has 6-8 million subs? Ive seen these numbers posted here on this site.
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
That's not the point. The point is that the number of active and non-active subscribers is approximately 3 times that number. What is the current active subscriber number is irrelevent. Grandpagamer had misunderstood the quote, that's all I was pointing out.
Besides, this quote was from an interview about WoW turning 5 which was in November, so the quote pertains to whatever the active subscriber count was in November approximately a year after WoTLK was released. I only used the 12 million number to illustrate my point, it wasn't meant to be taken literally.
And then again maybe you should heed your own advice.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3346205#3346205
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
I'm curious why someone who says 12 million without a credible source is guessing, but when you say it isn't 12 million you don't feel that you are making a guess without credible source.
Last time Blizzard posted any numbers was last year(sorry i don't have a link). I also never said I wasn't guessing.
I guess you missed the point I was trying to make in that post.
Everyone has opinions, but does that make them the universal truth??? NO!
No shite Sherlock.
Hehe...
But ya, this is a well known factor in the success of WoW man.
"The question that sometimes drives me hazy: Am I, or the others crazy?" - Albert Einstein
"Another thought I have is that you have to also remember that the subscriber base of WoW today is not just the one we had when we launched. There's a whole bunch of people who tuned out of WoW two years ago or four years ago, but who really enjoyed it, and when another MMO comes out that tickles their fancy, they'll jump into it. I don't know what the exact number is off-hand, but the total number of subscribers we've had is easily more than double - maybe closer to triple - the current subscriber base. "
http://www.warcry.com/articles/view/interviews/6773-Five-Years-of-Warcraft-Speaking-With-Blizzards-Rob-Pardo.2
Maybe read what you post.
So with what was said and considering the 12 million number to be the total number they have had, could one say that WOW currently has 6-8 million subs? Ive seen these numbers posted here on this site.
Even though it's already been said, I wanted to clarify that you have misunderstood what he said in this quote. 12 million is the number of ACTIVE subscribers. The TOTAL number of subscribers (active and non-active) is somewhere between 24 and 36 million at least according to Pardo.
If you don't have a credible source for actually subscribers, please don't post guesses. Last time blizzard posted any numbers was 1st or 2nd quarter(don't remember exaclty off the top of my head) of last year and it was 12 million ACTIVE subscribers. This was also when wotlk was still some what new. To say that they have 12 million still active is way to far fetched. I don't doubt that 24-36 million have subscribed.
That's not the point. The point is that the number of active and non-active subscribers is approximately 3 times that number. What is the current active subscriber number is irrelevent. Grandpagamer had misunderstood the quote, that's all I was pointing out.
Besides, this quote was from an interview about WoW turning 5 which was in November, so the quote pertains to whatever the active subscriber count was in November approximately a year after WoTLK was released. I only used the 12 million number to illustrate my point, it wasn't meant to be taken literally.
And then again maybe you should heed your own advice.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3346205#3346205
Never said those numbers I gave about EQ2 are true. I just doubted his numbers. I guess you also missed the keyword "prolly".
Everyone has opinions, but does that make them the universal truth??? NO!
Not true at all pal people who like mmo's in general. The only game that is more complicated than WoW is Eve.
Possibly the worst troll attempt ever or the most ignorant thing stated as of yet.
Complications being good, for the sake of being complicated? Or you have specific aspects of depth of gameplay you want to talk about? The most complicated MMO is one you play when blind folded and try to listen to teammates on vent.
Having complications just for the sake of making things complicated does not make for a good game if you ask me. However I found the shear amount of things I needed to learn along the way with EVE, kept my interest for the game at a high rate for a very long time. I still don't know everything about the game. I like that. But everything has purpose in EVE. It all fits together like an expertly well spun spider web.
Now if you take a glance at my new infatuation (Darkfall), even though it is nowhere near as complex, I find myself excited to log in just to explore, taking out some of my favorite mobs, or indulge in some great PVP. It's kept me me captivated for similar reasons, but it is a far cry from EVE.
My question to you is, what keeps you going in WOW? Are you still learning new things all the time? Is it the friends you have made, or perhaps things you can achieve down the line? Or is it something completely different that keeps you logging in? I'm genuinely curious as I havn't had a sub since approximately 2 months after BGs were introduced.
Interesting discussion.
I do not stay in WoW alone, I have a lot of options when I am not working. Picking fresh fruits with sister's baby killed the last weekend.
WoW, yes lots of things to learn and explore. With new bosses every few months, I can try to test out options, tactics gearing, gemming, talents, rotations, for each new boss, for each of my maxed characters, for each role (heal, dps, tank). I can only try each boss kill once a week per character, but with enough maxed characters, I never can test all options within the week.
I understand the whole idea about EvE. I never bother about DF. In comparison, WoW is more like an academic exercise, with probability, theorycrafting and manual conditioning of fingers in one package. Whenever there is a new boss, I spend quite a bit of time on my calculator or spreadsheet, making models and testing them out. Say a boss with 200million HP, with certain events slowing stopping DPS, I can only fit in so many (say) fireballs before the boss goes rage (kills all in 1 stroke). So I can impute the minimal average damage per fireball to kill him, or changes in rotation to estimate the average gains/losses. And so many bosses, so many raid composition that will favour alternate way of playing from my characters. That is what we do in WoW. Not just blindly chasing gear or spamming the same few button.
Now I can use a mage for magic damage, a hunter for 2 ways of playing, 3 healers that serves very different heal purposes and roles, and a tank. It is just more than enough materials for me to feel "mentally engaged".
Well of course. WoW was the simplest, easiest, most user friendly game, without any penalties whatsover when it released. It didn't go over well with regular MMORPG gamers, which is why they targetted people who never played MMORPGs. There are far more of them, which is why we now get WoW clones, and MMORPGs without new ideas, cause WoW didn't have any new game mechanics, just made things really simple and instant gratification, and tried to hook the masses.
Detailed complex social games are sadly a thing of the past. I really think there needs to be a category splitting old MMORPG social complex formula, vs the new one, that are becoming less and less massive and seamless by the year.
Didn't go over well with "regular" mmo players? Then why did so many other mmos see steep declines in population when wow released.
I think this notion that only new mmo players are attracted to wow needs to be put to rest.
How big of a moron do you have to be to not undestand even the most complicated MMO?
Sadly, there are tons of huge morons out there. Not just in WoW, either. I still don't think someone deserves a pat on the back, because they play a video game. Get over yourselves.
Didn't go over well with "regular" mmo players? Then why did so many other mmos see steep declines in population when wow released.
I think this notion that only new mmo players are attracted to wow needs to be put to rest.
There was a decline in other MMOs population because those MMOs quickly changed their game through patches and expansions to resemble WoW. DAoC and EQ are nowhere near as great as they used to be, or people would still be playing them. There are always people that try out the new shiney, at the time my guild leader left to play WoW, than came back a month later, like most people did.
The reason WOW does well is because the developers remember it's a game, first and foremost they focus all effort to make it a fun one. There's really not much more to it than that.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
@tobias4
The decline began long before the "changes" were made to those games. Most of those changes were being made in response to the decline happening in those games.
In all honesty, I bet there are more people with prior mmo experience in wow than there are in the next several games combined.
And that is because there are no more games left running that cater to the old social seamless world of old time MMORPGs, so those veterans are forced to play WoW or one of its various clones. Or, they hide out in games like Eve, Darkfall, Fallen Earth, unique titles.
And that is because there are no more games left running that cater to the old social seamless world of old time MMORPGs, so those veterans are forced to play WoW or one of its various clones. Or, they hide out in games like Eve, Darkfall, Fallen Earth, unique titles.
Isn't it just possible that maybe those "real mmo" players who moved to wow actually enjoy it and find it a better game?
It isn't like there was a gun being held to their head and they were forced to go play wow.
As for there being no games that aim for the old seemless social aspect of mmos, are you saying that because there absolutely are not any being made or perhaps overlooking those that tried, but delivered a game that just wasn't compelling enough to play?
There is no secret to WoWs success. It is a complete, robust, artistic, catchy, charming game that is pretty easy to get into and is often updated and given attention. Its simple, Blizzard made a good game.
Originally posted by Scagweed22
is it the graphics? the repetativenesses? i mean what is the point? you could be so much more productive in real life
Real life brings repetition and pointlessness too. The only thing real life offers is Great graphics. Its kinda expensive too and way to dependent on the cash shop. Totally pay to win as well. No thank you. Ill stick to my games.
There's nothing "robust" about WoW. It still lacks features and gameplay mechanics that games in 2001 had standard.
It'd be more accurate to say, they made a simple game at the right time, when there were no simple games out there, and the market for simple MMO goers was untapped.
There's nothing "robust" about WoW. It still lacks features and gameplay mechanics that games in 2001 had standard.
It'd be more accurate to say, they made a simple game at the right time, when there were no simple games out there, and the market for simple MMO goers was untapped.
Which features are you exactly talkign about?