Who said anything about western market? I didn't.. My OP definately had the word "GLOBAL" in it.. Maybe some of you missed it, but if you only plan to target and market a game for ONE region of the world, Yeah, then making a million in the US alone would be a daunting task, (even thouugh WoW has over 1 million US subs)..
The Asian market is huge, and it's silly for companies to ignore it.. IF properly marketed, I have no doubts that a well made Star Wars or Star Trek MMO could easily surpass the million number mark.. BTW.. being a fan of Star Trek is more then just TV shows and movies.. Star Trek was about a dream and posibilities, just like the medival fans of knights and dragons..
I said something about the western market because I think your post simply tries to hold this company to a standard that no one else has yet to reach one million subs. And let's make this clear for you we are not talking about free to play games many of them have over a million accounts and some may easily see a million different players a month, as smart as you seem to think you are about the industry you should be able to see the truth in what I keep having to say that you ignore, simply by looking at DDO and the massive increase in subs they got by going free to play.
Now maybe I can concede your point when you can level the playing field by naming us a game with a million western subs that is NOT either free to play, an eastern metric sub based game or one designed as also free to play simply for kids.
I also want to add that maybe you are right people shouldn't ignore the eastern market (if they even do) I don't know and honestly don't care because I don't need a massive amount of people playing something I like to validate it or anything. But I still maintain you are wrong when you try to imply that the Star Trek Ip is so huge it should be able to so easily do something that much bigger ips have equally not done which is serve over a million subs.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
I think Blizard would be my fist choice for almost any game. That said, I still hate WOW because of it's payers and I hate getting lead around by the nose.
I would really like to see Disney start making MMOs. They have the money and the creative talent to get the job done. I think Disney could give Sony a run for it's money.
I think Blizard would be my fist choice for almost any game. That said, I still hate WOW because of it's payers and I hate getting lead around by the nose.
I would really like to see Disney start making MMOs. They have the money and the creative talent to get the job done. I think Disney could give Sony a run for it's money.
I don't think Blizzard is very good at making virtual worlds, just addictive simple games.
Actually, considering Freelancer if Microsoft were to put some real effort into an MMO (instead of pulling out as they always do) then I'm sure they could make a good job.
Actually, considering Freelancer if Microsoft were to put some real effort into an MMO (instead of pulling out as they always do) then I'm sure they could make a good job.
Damn good point I forgot about Freelancer, very good game, microsoft just gets way to nervous around games, who were the people that did Freespace1 and 2 they had good story lines and the space combat was brillant for a game that is over 10 years old.
Originally posted by Garvon3 Originally posted by TheHellfire
Originally posted by MMO_Doubter
Originally posted by TheHellfire
Since STO is an official bomb, who do you want to see develop Star Trek? I think Bioware is best suited for the job
I posted a few months ago that BioWare and Cryptic should have swapped IPs. BW doing Trek, and Cryptic doing SWTOR. Horrible idea, they would have borked up Star Wars Bioware is already doing a grand job of doing that.
Welcome to the future, single player RPGs with monthly fees and cartoon graphics!
May we assume then that such a future would not feature people who judge things before they've had a chance to experience them?
Sounds grand. I'm gonna go rev up the flux capacitor.
May we assume then that such a future would not feature people who judge things before they've had a chance to experience them?
Welcome to the future.
The mind is such an intricate, complex machine that given years of experience and knowledge on a given subject that provided with the smallest scraps of information it is actually able to make reasonablly accurate predictions, especially where it comes to predicting fellow humans behavior where money is concerned.
but i suggest they could have had a 13 year old from any country watch one epsiode of any of the series
and use them as the head writer and idea person and they could have a more accurate adaptaion
art is really good in this tho
keep the art guys/gals and pay them an extra few thousand to put actual animals and aliens on all the beautiful
non populated planets
although they could hire the 94 year old guy that came up with stars whizzing by in like 1953 and on screen savers when you go into warp
i say give the ip to a small company - a tiny company- with someone on the staff that has the guts to say things like
"most of the show's settings were on the ship" and "just have a ship and fly around in space sometimes seeing a planet or others and sometimes fighting or making allies"
and the 13 year old head writer can say "and have two headed dragon things attack when you click a glowing thing and half your crew turns into jello monster things" - trek fans would be thankful
As much as I like CCP, I doubt they could have done Star Trek Justice, they'd have been too heavily focused on the PVP aspect and ST is more about the journey and story, and not the combat.
ST should have had a house that had a lot of experience in story telling, and they company would have had to be willing to put aside 'conventional MMORPG design' wisdom to build the game it should have been.
I'm not sure a development house exists today with the proper resources who would also be willing to take such a risk.
Some have suggested Bioware, but they are part of the evil EA empire now and we've yet to see their first MMORPG yet so who can say how that might turn out.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
In my opinion.. and what I find silly regardless on what numbers are told.. We're talking Star Trek IP..... As far as I'm concerned, with a global audience anything less then 2 million active subscribers is Fail.. Anything under 1 million is
EPIC FAIL
but that is just my opinion.. Having 100K subs in a global audience should demand the immediate resignation of all top execs.. This is STAR TREK and all they can muster up is enough people to fill a football stadium.. In 2009 the Star Trek convention in Las Vegas had over 15,000 people in attendance.. BlizzCon 2009 sold 20,000 tickets.. See the problem? If Blizzard can get over 2 million subs from US and Euro market, Star Trek should be able to come close to that.. However, they fell way SHORT of that target..
I think alot of folks on these boards have a bad habit of overestimating things, I don't think anyone would argue that globally Star Wars is a far more well known ip yet it's first mmo never broke the 500k mark so what in the world makes you think that the lesser known and lesser celebrated Star Trek would possibly pull in a million? Star Trek other than the love of it's fans (Trekkies) has largely been a dissapointment in everything they've released, while some of it's major motion pictures have been acclaimed none have moved Star Trek beyond the niche it occupies which is a far second to Star Wars as far as popularity.
Again I think people really need to look at the track record of everything Trek and you'll see most Star Trek based productions under perform way more than they over perform.
SWG at its launch with its lowly 500K subscriptions was a HUGE success back in its days. You need to remember that WoW was the first MMO that broke the 1 million subs mark
Also Star Wars vs Star Trek is pretty even number wise when you factor in SW only has 6 movies and some cartoon shows and Trek has 10+ movies, 5 TV shows + cartoon show + 40+ years of being in the public domain.
In my opinion.. and what I find silly regardless on what numbers are told.. We're talking Star Trek IP..... As far as I'm concerned, with a global audience anything less then 2 million active subscribers is Fail.. Anything under 1 million is
EPIC FAIL
but that is just my opinion.. Having 100K subs in a global audience should demand the immediate resignation of all top execs.. This is STAR TREK and all they can muster up is enough people to fill a football stadium.. In 2009 the Star Trek convention in Las Vegas had over 15,000 people in attendance.. BlizzCon 2009 sold 20,000 tickets.. See the problem? If Blizzard can get over 2 million subs from US and Euro market, Star Trek should be able to come close to that.. However, they fell way SHORT of that target..
I think alot of folks on these boards have a bad habit of overestimating things, I don't think anyone would argue that globally Star Wars is a far more well known ip yet it's first mmo never broke the 500k mark so what in the world makes you think that the lesser known and lesser celebrated Star Trek would possibly pull in a million? Star Trek other than the love of it's fans (Trekkies) has largely been a dissapointment in everything they've released, while some of it's major motion pictures have been acclaimed none have moved Star Trek beyond the niche it occupies which is a far second to Star Wars as far as popularity.
Again I think people really need to look at the track record of everything Trek and you'll see most Star Trek based productions under perform way more than they over perform.
SWG at its launch with its lowly 500K subscriptions was a HUGE success back in its days. You need to remember that WoW was the first MMO that broke the 1 million subs mark
Also Star Wars vs Star Trek is pretty even number wise when you factor in SW only has 6 movies and some cartoon shows and Trek has 10+ movies, 5 TV shows + cartoon show + 40+ years of being in the public domain.
OMG stop with the 500k SWG spew....300....maybe 350k subs at LAUNCH.
It dropped from there. Fast like.
Until WoW launched, my native EQ1 held the MMO market by the neck at 450k subs in the western market. I know some folks are talking about global in thread, but eastern model of gaming not the same(we have to bu box/subscribe...they do the cafe house thing). I suppose you could agrue which model brings in most money....but that is neither here nor there.
Being born in 68, I was one of those that couldnt stand Trek growing up in 70/80s. SW fan all the way. A few episodes I watched were OK(original/TNG)...but didnt hit the "cult" status button for me. However I really did enjoy the latest movie by Abrahms.
I agree with the idea that 200 to 400k should of been the mark for this game....with more possibly if Cryptic had delivered a great game combined with regular updates/another movie to pull new fans.
Asking Devs to make AAA sandbox titles is like trying to get fine dining on a McDonalds dollar menu budget.
Comments
I said something about the western market because I think your post simply tries to hold this company to a standard that no one else has yet to reach one million subs. And let's make this clear for you we are not talking about free to play games many of them have over a million accounts and some may easily see a million different players a month, as smart as you seem to think you are about the industry you should be able to see the truth in what I keep having to say that you ignore, simply by looking at DDO and the massive increase in subs they got by going free to play.
Now maybe I can concede your point when you can level the playing field by naming us a game with a million western subs that is NOT either free to play, an eastern metric sub based game or one designed as also free to play simply for kids.
I also want to add that maybe you are right people shouldn't ignore the eastern market (if they even do) I don't know and honestly don't care because I don't need a massive amount of people playing something I like to validate it or anything. But I still maintain you are wrong when you try to imply that the Star Trek Ip is so huge it should be able to so easily do something that much bigger ips have equally not done which is serve over a million subs.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Bethesda
CCP. This never should have been given to Cryptic. As a matter of fact Cryptic should just stop making games period. Nothing can save them now.
Bioware is already doing a grand job of doing that.
Welcome to the future, single player RPGs with monthly fees and cartoon graphics!
True. And I can't wait until CCP's next game.
Striving for Silver Stars since Gold is so effeminate.
I would say throw the team that worked on Earth & Beyond (Westwood Studios) with original SWG team.
Raph Koster would be in charge of the bridge, with Rich Vogel as his number one.
Then throw Derek Smart in there just for chits & giggles.
DarkFall FAQ - Read then Question with Boldness
To be honest, there isn't a single MMORPG company out there that has made their second MMORPG better than their first.
Asheron's Call 2 was a disaster.
Warhammer imploded on itself, instead of the grand success DAoC had.
EQ2 got crippled out of the gate.
So, no one really has a good track record here.
I think Blizard would be my fist choice for almost any game. That said, I still hate WOW because of it's payers and I hate getting lead around by the nose.
I would really like to see Disney start making MMOs. They have the money and the creative talent to get the job done. I think Disney could give Sony a run for it's money.
I don't think Blizzard is very good at making virtual worlds, just addictive simple games.
Weird answer, but Turbine using the LOTRO engine at least it could be an open world type of deal.
Or ArenaNet but then it would take around five years to make.
Actually, considering Freelancer if Microsoft were to put some real effort into an MMO (instead of pulling out as they always do) then I'm sure they could make a good job.
My three picks would be Turbine, CCP or Stardock.
Horrible idea, they would have borked up Star Wars
Bioware is already doing a grand job of doing that.
Welcome to the future, single player RPGs with monthly fees and cartoon graphics!
May we assume then that such a future would not feature people who judge things before they've had a chance to experience them?
Sounds grand. I'm gonna go rev up the flux capacitor.
Alltern8 Blog | Star Wars Space Combat and The Old Republic | Cryptic Studios - A Pre Post-Mortem | Klingon Preview, STO's Monster Play
Welcome to the future.
The mind is such an intricate, complex machine that given years of experience and knowledge on a given subject that provided with the smallest scraps of information it is actually able to make reasonablly accurate predictions, especially where it comes to predicting fellow humans behavior where money is concerned.
CCP
well i am not up on developers
but i suggest they could have had a 13 year old from any country watch one epsiode of any of the series
and use them as the head writer and idea person and they could have a more accurate adaptaion
art is really good in this tho
keep the art guys/gals and pay them an extra few thousand to put actual animals and aliens on all the beautiful
non populated planets
although they could hire the 94 year old guy that came up with stars whizzing by in like 1953 and on screen savers when you go into warp
i say give the ip to a small company - a tiny company- with someone on the staff that has the guts to say things like
"most of the show's settings were on the ship" and "just have a ship and fly around in space sometimes seeing a planet or others and sometimes fighting or making allies"
and the 13 year old head writer can say "and have two headed dragon things attack when you click a glowing thing and half your crew turns into jello monster things" - trek fans would be thankful
As much as I like CCP, I doubt they could have done Star Trek Justice, they'd have been too heavily focused on the PVP aspect and ST is more about the journey and story, and not the combat.
ST should have had a house that had a lot of experience in story telling, and they company would have had to be willing to put aside 'conventional MMORPG design' wisdom to build the game it should have been.
I'm not sure a development house exists today with the proper resources who would also be willing to take such a risk.
Some have suggested Bioware, but they are part of the evil EA empire now and we've yet to see their first MMORPG yet so who can say how that might turn out.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
SWG at its launch with its lowly 500K subscriptions was a HUGE success back in its days. You need to remember that WoW was the first MMO that broke the 1 million subs mark
Also Star Wars vs Star Trek is pretty even number wise when you factor in SW only has 6 movies and some cartoon shows and Trek has 10+ movies, 5 TV shows + cartoon show + 40+ years of being in the public domain.
OMG stop with the 500k SWG spew....300....maybe 350k subs at LAUNCH.
It dropped from there. Fast like.
Until WoW launched, my native EQ1 held the MMO market by the neck at 450k subs in the western market. I know some folks are talking about global in thread, but eastern model of gaming not the same(we have to bu box/subscribe...they do the cafe house thing). I suppose you could agrue which model brings in most money....but that is neither here nor there.
Being born in 68, I was one of those that couldnt stand Trek growing up in 70/80s. SW fan all the way. A few episodes I watched were OK(original/TNG)...but didnt hit the "cult" status button for me. However I really did enjoy the latest movie by Abrahms.
I agree with the idea that 200 to 400k should of been the mark for this game....with more possibly if Cryptic had delivered a great game combined with regular updates/another movie to pull new fans.
Asking Devs to make AAA sandbox titles is like trying to get fine dining on a McDonalds dollar menu budget.