could someone please tell me how to add the block i'm responding to in my response?
Talking about quoting? Bottom right of their chat box, there is "edit" "Quote" and "reply", you want quote.
i saw that.. but i cant figure out how to write under the quote box... oh well i can do this .. thank you for responding
Either:
A: you just click under the text box and just start typing, or
B: you are having a problem with the editor that some people have from time to time. In which case the only fix seems to be what you just did right there.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Dumb arguement, considering you can skip dialogue in ToR from the get go. There was also no interaction, just god awful voice acting.
Exactly what I'm saying. If they are are so focused on voice-over content, will there be anything else?
They say yes.
If you decide to skip the voice-overs will you find yourself at the "wall" after a week of playing?
They say no.
I will say that they were rather smart on making the game voice acted.
Probably, I'm just thankful I can be even more lazy.
This would slow down game progression for anyone that sits through all the chatter they have put together.
And the people without patience quit, all active players win.
this really shouldnt be an issue cause if u dont want to play a story based game, u would have to be really stupid to spend 50 dollars on one
Ah, but you question peoples judgement. Explain to me why people are complaining about a BioWare game being a BioWare game? When I pick up a BioWare game, I expect the usual, I expected companions, I expected amazing story telling, and choice. Without these, it may as well not be a BioWare game at all. These are hallmarks for them.
I don't usually pick up an MMO without knowing completely about PvP, but I feel this is a special case. And not to sound cliche here, I enjoy BioWare games, so why not?
could someone please tell me how to add the block i'm responding to in my response?
Talking about quoting? Bottom right of their chat box, there is "edit" "Quote" and "reply", you want quote.
i saw that.. but i cant figure out how to write under the quote box... oh well i can do this .. thank you for responding
Either:
A: you just click under the text box and just start typing, or
B: you are having a problem with the editor that some people have from time to time. In which case the only fix seems to be what you just did right there.
Bioware is assuming that MMO players just want story and movie like stuff. They're wrong. All kinds of people like all kinds of stuff and only if a developer understands that will they ever be able to create an MMO that everybody likes and that kicks Blizz off it's throne. Oh yeah and Bioware act like a bunch of pretentious douches....
This is starting to really piss me off...
Who the hell does Bioware think they are? Hey wow they've been the leading publisher in the SPRPG genre the last couple of years.... was there any "real" competition? it's like declaring yourself the winner of a solo Squash session -.-
And just because they made some successful SPRPGs they are now all of a sudden the kings of MMORPGs? That's like the Squash Player from the example above declaring all tennis players are noobs and he can pwn them all...
What Bioware is pulling with all this trash talking is nothing short of the stuff that goes on in various forums every day... not really something I expect from "professionals"... then again... it's basically EA...
What they and a lot of people here don't understand is that a "Storydriven MMO" doesn't have to be completely voiced and acted and all... a game can have a rich story while going easy on all that... Whatever you guys think of WoW - in terms of Story and the presentation of said Story, Wrath of the Lich King is brilliant. The quests you do have an impact on the world (phazing), You play a part in dismantling the Scourge step by step via phazing main story quest lines and dungeons, all leading up to the destruction of the Lich King... and there's 2 videos as sort of icing on the cake there's also tons of other storylines to explore (the history of the Vrykul in Howling Fjord f.e.)
The key to a REAL next gen MMO is COMBINING all these factors... not focusing on one... those factors being Impact on the world, immersive story maybe with voice stuff and videos, the inevitable grind, maybe a nice conflict aka PvP, challenging end game content, interactive Events (including a changing world) and kick ass graphics that work and are downscaleable...
Blizzard kind of understands that... you have to give em that much... btw I'm not really a big WoW/Blizz fan... have lots of issues with it all but they are taking some big steps towards next gen.
Bioware is not doing that... they are just declaring that they are the bringers of Truth and Hope for all "real" MMORPG players, because all "real" MMORPG players HAVE to love movie like story stuff..... it's God's Will!!! don't blaspheme...
But that's not how it works. Different MMO players like different things in MMOs, Period! just like different people like , say, different cars.
If any company ever wants to throw Blizzard off the throne, they have to do exactly that. Create an MMO that actually and wholeheartedly caters to ALL player preferences while not neglecting another group. You need great PvP, great Story, great PvE, great High end content, great Graphics and great Events/a world that can be changed by players.
Since Bioware is apparently just aiming at a crowd that also liked their SP stuff, they're gonna fail... 2 mio subs to break even? lol ^^
<S.T.E.A.L.T.H> An Agency that kicks so much ass it has to be written in all capital letters... divided by dots! www.stealth-industries.de
Dumb arguement, considering you can skip dialogue in ToR from the get go. There was also no interaction, just god awful voice acting.
Exactly what I'm saying. If they are are so focused on voice-over content, will there be anything else?
They say yes.
If you decide to skip the voice-overs will you find yourself at the "wall" after a week of playing?
They say no.
I will say that they were rather smart on making the game voice acted.
Probably, I'm just thankful I can be even more lazy.
This would slow down game progression for anyone that sits through all the chatter they have put together.
And the people without patience quit, all active players win.
this really shouldnt be an issue cause if u dont want to play a story based game, u would have to be really stupid to spend 50 dollars on one
Ah, but you question peoples judgement. Explain to me why people are complaining about a BioWare game being a BioWare game? When I pick up a BioWare game, I expect the usual, I expected companions, I expected amazing story telling, and choice. Without these, it may as well not be a BioWare game at all. These are hallmarks for them.
I don't usually pick up an MMO without knowing completely about PvP, but I feel this is a special case. And not to sound cliche here, I enjoy BioWare games, so why not?
i agree with u.... i want the story, i want to be constatntly wondering what will happen next. i want the emotional investment in seeing my character succeed or fail... i personally dont care if me and 9 other people are argueing over who need rolled on a polearm when they should've greed rolled
Bioware is assuming that MMO players just want story and movie like stuff. They're wrong. All kinds of people like all kinds of stuff and only if a developer understands that will they ever be able to create an MMO that everybody likes and that kicks Blizz off it's throne. Oh yeah and Bioware act like a bunch of pretentious douches....
This is starting to really piss me off...
Who the hell does Bioware think they are? Hey wow they've been the leading publisher in the SPRPG genre the last couple of years.... was there any "real" competition? it's like declaring yourself the winner of a solo Squash session -.-
And just because they made some successful SPRPGs they are now all of a sudden the kings of MMORPGs? That's like the Squash Player from the example above declaring all tennis players are noobs and he can pwn them all...
What Bioware is pulling with all this trash talking is nothing short of the stuff that goes on in various forums every day... not really something I expect from "professionals"... then again... it's basically EA...
What they and a lot of people here don't understand is that a "Storydriven MMO" doesn't have to be completely voiced and acted and all... a game can have a rich story while going easy on all that... Whatever you guys think of WoW - in terms of Story and the presentation of said Story, Wrath of the Lich King is brilliant. The quests you do have an impact on the world (phazing), You play a part in dismantling the Scourge step by step via phazing main story quest lines and dungeons, all leading up to the destruction of the Lich King... and there's 2 videos as sort of icing on the cake there's also tons of other storylines to explore (the history of the Vrykul in Howling Fjord f.e.)
The key to a REAL next gen MMO is COMBINING all these factors... not focusing on one... those factors being Impact on the world, immersive story maybe with voice stuff and videos, the inevitable grind, maybe a nice conflict aka PvP, challenging end game content, interactive Events (including a changing world) and kick ass graphics that work and are downscaleable...
Blizzard kind of understands that... you have to give em that much... btw I'm not really a big WoW/Blizz fan... have lots of issues with it all but they are taking some big steps towards next gen.
Bioware is not doing that... they are just declaring that they are the bringers of Truth and Hope for all "real" MMORPG players, because all "real" MMORPG players HAVE to love movie like story stuff..... it's God's Will!!! don't blaspheme...
But that's not how it works. Different MMO players like different things in MMOs, Period! just like different people like , say, different cars.
If any company ever wants to throw Blizzard off the throne, they have to do exactly that. Create an MMO that actually and wholeheartedly caters to ALL player preferences while not neglecting another group. You need great PvP, great Story, great PvE, great High end content, great Graphics and great Events/a world that can be changed by players.
Since Bioware is apparently just aiming at a crowd that also liked their SP stuff, they're gonna fail... 2 mio subs to break even? lol ^^
LOL, wow BioWare , you've ruined someones life. It's like you're about to leap from a tower while everone watchs.
i agree with u.... i want the story, i want to be constatntly wondering what will happen next. i want the emotional investment in seeing my character succeed or fail... i personally dont care if me and 9 other people are argueing over who need rolled on a polearm when they should've greed rolled
Truth, I don't want to see it coming from a mile away. Attachment to a toon, imo, means the game is working. This is what I've always enjoyed about BioWare games, you encounter companions you love, or love to hate. Since this is a Old republic game I eagerly await finding that one companion like "Carth Onasi" and putting him 6 feet under.
As for grouping, I'm more interested to see what happens when players can't agree on a decision. Kill Him? Rob him? Beat him? set him free? Give him money? People will have different perspectives and I hope BioWare is not avoiding the drama on this one.
Bioware continues to set itself up for the inevitable fall when their over-confident hype falls flat when faced with the reality at launch. They should just shut up about anything other than things directly linked to their game. "We'll be better than X is" is not linked to their game, but their increasingly over-inflated egos.
Spot on dude. They should get on amd make a great game than start smack talking down everyone elses games. Hmmmm not sure about SWTOR...
THE SECRET WORLD - PAY ONCE PLAY FOREVER - Give it a go!
Bioware is assuming that MMO players just want story and movie like stuff. They're wrong. All kinds of people like all kinds of stuff and only if a developer understands that will they ever be able to create an MMO that everybody likes and that kicks Blizz off it's throne. Oh yeah and Bioware act like a bunch of pretentious douches....
This is starting to really piss me off...
Who the hell does Bioware think they are? Hey wow they've been the leading publisher in the SPRPG genre the last couple of years.... was there any "real" competition? it's like declaring yourself the winner of a solo Squash session -.-
And just because they made some successful SPRPGs they are now all of a sudden the kings of MMORPGs? That's like the Squash Player from the example above declaring all tennis players are noobs and he can pwn them all...
What Bioware is pulling with all this trash talking is nothing short of the stuff that goes on in various forums every day... not really something I expect from "professionals"... then again... it's basically EA...
What they and a lot of people here don't understand is that a "Storydriven MMO" doesn't have to be completely voiced and acted and all... a game can have a rich story while going easy on all that... Whatever you guys think of WoW - in terms of Story and the presentation of said Story, Wrath of the Lich King is brilliant. The quests you do have an impact on the world (phazing), You play a part in dismantling the Scourge step by step via phazing main story quest lines and dungeons, all leading up to the destruction of the Lich King... and there's 2 videos as sort of icing on the cake there's also tons of other storylines to explore (the history of the Vrykul in Howling Fjord f.e.)
The key to a REAL next gen MMO is COMBINING all these factors... not focusing on one... those factors being Impact on the world, immersive story maybe with voice stuff and videos, the inevitable grind, maybe a nice conflict aka PvP, challenging end game content, interactive Events (including a changing world) and kick ass graphics that work and are downscaleable...
Blizzard kind of understands that... you have to give em that much... btw I'm not really a big WoW/Blizz fan... have lots of issues with it all but they are taking some big steps towards next gen.
Bioware is not doing that... they are just declaring that they are the bringers of Truth and Hope for all "real" MMORPG players, because all "real" MMORPG players HAVE to love movie like story stuff..... it's God's Will!!! don't blaspheme...
But that's not how it works. Different MMO players like different things in MMOs, Period! just like different people like , say, different cars.
If any company ever wants to throw Blizzard off the throne, they have to do exactly that. Create an MMO that actually and wholeheartedly caters to ALL player preferences while not neglecting another group. You need great PvP, great Story, great PvE, great High end content, great Graphics and great Events/a world that can be changed by players.
Since Bioware is apparently just aiming at a crowd that also liked their SP stuff, they're gonna fail... 2 mio subs to break even? lol ^^
again with the "bioware is trash talking".. what are u reading or watching? you cant possible think that the little bit they have actually said about the game is any of this dribble. They have every right to be excited about the product they are creating... what kind of dumbass would spend millions of dollars and years of their lives on somethin, and then come out and be " well we think our game will be ok to play, to a select minority of u gamers"? they are creating the game they want to play... so as far as they are concerned, they are bringing the truth and hope. also, if they created a "something for everyone" game, no one would play. everyone would hate it. these games aren't asian all u can eat buffets. they have to pick their spot and go with it.WoW doesnt appeal to "everyone", nor should they. And finally, u suggest a successful game needs " great pvp, great story,great pve, great high end content...." that sounds like exactly what bioware is promiseing with TOR. pretty hard to call them liars without a playable game to prove it
Bioware continues to set itself up for the inevitable fall when their over-confident hype falls flat when faced with the reality at launch. They should just shut up about anything other than things directly linked to their game. "We'll be better than X is" is not linked to their game, but their increasingly over-inflated egos.
Spot on dude. They should get on amd make a great game than start smack talking down everyone elses games. Hmmmm not sure about SWTOR...
i agree with u.... i want the story, i want to be constatntly wondering what will happen next. i want the emotional investment in seeing my character succeed or fail... i personally dont care if me and 9 other people are argueing over who need rolled on a polearm when they should've greed rolled
Truth, I don't want to see it coming from a mile away. Attachment to a toon, imo, means the game is working. This is what I've always enjoyed about BioWare games, you encounter companions you love, or love to hate. Since this is a Old republic game I eagerly await finding that one companion like "Carth Onasi" and putting him 6 feet under.
As for grouping, I'm more interested to see what happens when players can't agree on a decision. Kill Him? Rob him? Beat him? set him free? Give him money? People will have different perspectives and I hope BioWare is not avoiding the drama on this one.
how great would it be if u could get pissed off at ur partner and kill him... awesome drama, and it would certainly add a whole new meaning to watching ur back.
I think you're stretching a bit too far there. You are trying to hate the haters a bit too much.
Stopped here, skimmed the rest. Here's is why.
I don't hate anybody.
(now this is me being serious)
I don't give a damn if they're tired of current MMOs, they can go back to these games they claimed were amazing, the ones with no subs. Their opinion will change nothing here.
I don't care if you like my negativity torwards negativy.
If this MMO sucks I'm done with the genre, oh well, don't see me squeezing tears out about it.
Not sorry for the lack of sympathy against the manbabies on this forum.
Also there is a problem when somebody says "ToR is a single player RPG" while never posting evidence and evading the question of proof to follow it. You can find multiple examples like this litered all around the board.
No evidence, role-playing a forum parrot. Nah I'll stick to telling these guys their opinions are dumb.
As Carlin said, "Well, I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion.".
No, that is not targeted at you.
Its kind of amusing that you skimmed the content of my post and only focused on the first line of text. I find it amusing because that first line is the only bit that referred to you directly and it is the only part of my post which has no real relevance to this discussion.
Hence my line later which was "If thats what they think then thats what they think. Whether its positive or negative is irrelevant". By that I mean there isnt much point in getting aggravated by what others are saying. It's all just food for thought. Mind you I'm a fine one to talk considering some of my snarky replies to some people in other threads lol. You might not "hate" anyone but you certainly dislike a lot of people (or their opinions at least) but then thats life I suppose. A lot of peoples thoughts and ideas rub me up the wrong way too. Human beings were never destined to get along.
You say you dont care but I say you do. You wouldnt be here argueing your points and dismissing others "negativity" otherwise. The text highlighted in blue kind of gives that one away quite blatantly.
The orange text isnt true by the way. Everything has an impact on something. Otherwise you wouldnt choose to respond to it. Peoples opinions might not be able to directly change the outcome of a game but thats no reason to not express them. Otherwise why do you express yours, which is to dismiss the "unworthy" opinions of others? If they cant change anything when why does it bother you? Whether peoples shared opinions will change anything here is kind of irrelevant anyway as this is just a forum for discussion based on the OPs article. Besides how do you know that some developer from Bioware isnt reading this in their spare time? All of these opinions could in fact be influencing decisions in various games design without any of us being any the wiser.
As for evidence regarding SWTOR being a single player rpg, well what kind of evidence would you expect them to post? We're all talking about a game which isnt out yet so no-one has access to anything really solid other than what has been shown to us by the devs. It's pretty obvious though why people are concerned about this game having a heavy focus on single player gameplay. When the player is being told a story in the form of an interactive movie then its hardly painting a picture of a strong multiplayer game is it. Thats not to say that SWTOR doesnt have any multiplayer aspect to it because it obviously does. Its just that mmos have been focusing more and more on telling stories and at the same time they seem to be becoming more solo friendly too.......mmos that can easily be treated as single player games with teaming up as an option. Who knows though maybe the open world sections of the game will be like living in a virtual world that changes all the time due to player actions. I dount it mind you but I guess its possible.
Anyway blah blah blah wall of text yadda yadda yadda lol
Indeed. The fact is most mmos dont really allow you to make any decisions at all other than where to walk in the virtual landscape......
You have all sorts of choices in an MMO - in your dealings with other players, rather than NPCs.
Yeah sure but those "dealings" are very limited. In general you can chat, sell things on an auction house perhaps and trade items and maybe challenge each other to a duel. Hardly any of them allow you to collaborate with others and put plans in motion that actually have a decent impact on the game world and its inhabitants. In fact you can literally walk through other players in these games. They cant do anything to hinder or alter your experience at all other than group up. These are static game worlds that are generally immune to player intervention.......and the players are also immune to each other. The only thing to do is level yourself up as you plough through a story. Thats fine for single player games but shouldnt multiplayer games offer more than just the same thing but with a co-op option? Some games actually do but they seem to be in the minority.
could someone please tell me how to add the block i'm responding to in my response?
Talking about quoting? Bottom right of their chat box, there is "edit" "Quote" and "reply", you want quote.
i saw that.. but i cant figure out how to write under the quote box... oh well i can do this .. thank you for responding
Either:
A: you just click under the text box and just start typing, or
B: you are having a problem with the editor that some people have from time to time. In which case the only fix seems to be what you just did right there.
mine must have a glitch
No its not just you. I get it as well. Keeping clicking in the area in the bottom left below the grey quote box. It will work eventually. Its very annoying though.
I'm gonna stick it out with Bioware and continue to be really interested, since I've really enjoyed their single-player games.
But its the unknown of whether they can meld their single-player expertise and story-telling with what should be depth and breadth of massively multiplayer content, dynamic and community-involved content in a persistnet world that has me wondering.
I just love when a newbie developer to the MMO market comes charging in with all these grand statements. For all its successin the single player market, BioWare has little credibility to make such grandiose statements. They haven't proven themselves in the MMO market yet.
Here's the thing...
Every MMO I've ever played has a storyline to go along with the various missions and quests you do. Some are very short and simple and not terribly interesting. Some are long and epic and quite deep (look at the story arcs in Final Fantasy XI for example). I take the time to read the quest dialog and am quite often impressed by the storylines, the lore and even the depth of emotion some of them go into.
The problem?
Many players can't be bothered to read them. For them, the quest begins and ends with "what do I have to do, what's the reward and where's the walk-through to get it done?"
I would bet money that, even with all its voice-acting that BioWare is putting so much emphasis on, if there's a way to skip the cut-scenes and not listen to all the dialog, *many* players will be doing just that. If you can't... expect complaints about having to sit through long, boring dialog that the players couldn't care less about. Not because the dialog is poorly done necessarily; rather because they just want the xp and loot.
Are there those who will appreciate the dialog and such? Of course, just like there are in any other MMO.
I just think BioWare doesn't really understand the market they're entering very well and are overestimating the importance story has to a large portion of MMO players overall. I highly doubt they're going to have much effect on the innumerable players who couldn't care less what horrible fate they are saving the galaxy from or what anyone has to say about it ... Just give them their damn new weapon and let them move on to getting the next one.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
As a bioware game I have certain gameplay expectations...
I have played most of there games and enjoyed the trip.. I like the way you can morph the story with your answers to questions, its CALLED ROLE PLAYING.
I think many of us have played a fair number of mmorpgs along the way, so lets all take a pill and wait for release, on this one.
I had high hopes for the star trek game WOW did that suck.. so we must wait and see..
played:WoW and Eve off and on 5 years Tried:CoH/V, PoTBS, War, TR, STO, FE TOR is likely to rock
Its kind of amusing that you skimmed the content of my post and only focused on the first line of text. I find it amusing because that first line is the only bit that referred to you directly and it is the only part of my post which has no real relevance to this discussion.
Because it's untrue about me :O I have no hateful feelings torwards these people. I do not know them personally and when anonymity is in play I feel I can't properly decide if I like them or not.
Hence my line later which was "If thats what they think then thats what they think. Whether its positive or negative is irrelevant". By that I mean there isnt much point in getting aggravated by what others are saying. It's all just food for thought. Mind you I'm a fine one to talk considering some of my snarky replies to some people in other threads lol. You might not "hate" anyone but you certainly dislike a lot of people (or their opinions at least) but then thats life I suppose. A lot of peoples thoughts and ideas rub me up the wrong way too. Human beings were never destined to get along.
In their opinions? Certainlly there isn't a "we hate greed0104" committee, is there?How do you know of their dislike for me? Can I join?
You say you dont care but I say you do. You wouldnt be here argueing your points and dismissing others "negativity" otherwise. The text highlighted in blue kind of gives that one away quite blatantly.
As, I said, I don't care about their happiness with the genre, the tears of full grown (supposadly) men sulking over a game with them not in mind is hilarious. I don't care if you like my negativity, or me.
And why should I care? Do I know them? Remember this doesn't mean I dislike them, I just don't give a damn about them. Big difference.
The orange text isnt true by the way. Everything has an impact on something. Otherwise you wouldnt choose to respond to it. Peoples opinions might not be able to directly change the outcome of a game but thats no reason to not express them. Otherwise why do you express yours, which is to dismiss the "unworthy" opinions of others? If they cant change anything when why does it bother you? Whether peoples shared opinions will change anything here is kind of irrelevant anyway as this is just a forum for discussion based on the OPs article. Besides how do you know that some developer from Bioware isnt reading this in their spare time? All of these opinions could in fact be influencing decisions in various games design without any of us being any the wiser.
A developer reading the opinions on this site, no serious developer I'll bet. The only one I recall was from "Fury" Remeber that game? UNLEASH THE FURY? Anyways, that game turned out well.
Anyways, you got a little truth. There is a certain type of dismissle I'm abiding by. Misinformation will be dismised. I will do my best to repair this false information, but it's constantly reapplied by those you believe have opinions. Now I agree, some opinions are real concerns and some of these people do bring up good questions. Example, what is going to happen with voice acting as the game expands, what happens when the original voice is no longer around? Plenty I've seen that make up for some good questions, but most of these guys to ask, get it, we don't know, nothing has been anounced, they don't continue to spread negativity. Do you honestly believe this forum would be full of praise without the parrots around? The people actually following this game provide information, not insults, not negativty. They may share a concerns but they don't shove it in everybodies face on a daily basis. This, here, I think is healthy debate. And it's fun.
As for evidence regarding SWTOR being a single player rpg, well what kind of evidence would you expect them to post? We're all talking about a game which isnt out yet so no-one has access to anything really solid other than what has been shown to us by the devs.
It isn't a question, they're stating it as fact. They're saying ToR WILL be a SPRG. This is misinformation. BioWare claims the game to be 90% open 10% instanced. Players can see players just about everywhere. There is group content, there is solo content, There will be endgame raids. There is content solo players will never see. All of this has been said. There is evidence to support everything I've said, and all though not complete visual evidence. It's still better then some no proof opinionated claim.
It's pretty obvious though why people are concerned about this game having a heavy focus on single player gameplay. When the player is being told a story in the form of an interactive movie then its hardly painting a picture of a strong multiplayer game is it. Thats not to say that SWTOR doesnt have any multiplayer aspect to it because it obviously does. Its just that mmos have been focusing more and more on telling stories and at the same time they seem to be becoming more solo friendly too.......mmos that can easily be treated as single player games with teaming up as an option. Who knows though maybe the open world sections of the game will be like living in a virtual world that changes all the time due to player actions. I dount it mind you but I guess its possible.
Yup, concerns are fine, but don't state it as fact unless you have the evidence to support. Just like I'm not saying ToR will be a full fledged MMO. I don't know this, but I have more proof then they do. So I say, It sounds like a MMO thus far. Not that it will be. I'm also interested to see these open world(s).
I have my concerns for this game, I've shared them before. Why continuasly bring them up? Is there a reward for such a thing? I'm completely ready to see the game succeed, I'm also prepared for failure. But I'm not claiming what ToR will be, not once, have I ever said ToR would be an amazing game, the most I've said is "It looks good so far" and please note the "so far" part.
Anyway blah blah blah wall of text yadda yadda yadda lol
Not to mention we are talking about Sprind 2011 at the earliest, in a years time who knows what other games will be out and what sort of story will be in them by then. ToR could launch and already be dated and seem like a copy of other MMO's even more so if it gets delayed.
We know exactly what games are likely to be out, they are all listed on this site. THe only one that you might consider comparible in nature to what SWTOR is doing is The Secret World, which will also be fully voice acted.
ToR isn't even close to comparable with TSW. For one, TSW has no levels or classes.
Read the underline areas and you might understand why pointing that out was kinda stupid.
They are right though, most MMOs have no point in playing them once you complete all the content. If Bioware thinks that throwing better content that can be eaten through at the same rate will save the game 3-4 months in, they need to take more notes.
The point of an MMO is to advance your character and progress with the most common of all human characteristics: greed and need.
Shaping it in a pleasant format and keeping it up is what makes an mmorpg.
We brag with a new car and pants in real life. Just like we want to show off a new mount or sword or achievement title.
That's the driving force of prolonged play, not the fixed scenario movie part.
Yep, but even that hit's *the wall* once you've done/collected it all.
Is the statement wrong? In my opinion, no...it is totally correct. MMORPG's have become a pretty convoluted idea at this point with all the copy catting and unwillingness to progress with new ideas. At their core, these games have hardly progressed at all. They are for the mostpart, hollow level grinders that have "raids" at the end.
Bioware has criticised current MMO games for having "no point" - and pledged that mammoth creation Star Wars: The Old Republic will finally bring real story to the genre.
The title - due for release next year - contains 'over 50 novels-worth' of voice-over content, according to Bioware.
Bioware designer and writing director Daniel Erickson told CVG that the Mass Effect studio had been disappointed by the "lack of fun" in other MMO titles on the market.
He said: "In the early days when they first announced that there were MMOs, like the existence of them, I knew in my head what that meant - because I played Role Playing Games. It was just giant Role Playing Games.
"And then MMO [games] showed up, and it wasn't that. It was the ruleset to an RPG: There was combat, and there were areas, but that was all. Someone had left out the module. There was no story, there was no point. You just kind of wandered around. And that hasn't really changed all that much over the years.
"We've always had that thought in the back of our heads: That Old Republic should be all the things we thought an MMO would be in the first place - which is all the parts of an RPG. Which means - and this is the most radical idea - it should just be fun. Like, just fun to play. You shouldn't be trying to ignore all of the content to get to the end as fast as possible."
He added: "I don't think that [MMO creators] set out in the beginning to say: 'Hey, let's make this a grind. Let's not have any interesting content here.' A lot of the better ones more recently have interesting content for the first few levels, you know - and some of them for the first 20 levels, whatever. But it's still not the interesting content you'd expect in a single-player game.
"The thing that has been a challenge for us on Old Republic is that people tried to convince us these limitations were canon - that they were to be respected, you know? That you could not, in fact, put interesting bits in an MMO because that was now sacrilege."
Comments
Either:
A: you just click under the text box and just start typing, or
B: you are having a problem with the editor that some people have from time to time. In which case the only fix seems to be what you just did right there.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Ah, but you question peoples judgement. Explain to me why people are complaining about a BioWare game being a BioWare game? When I pick up a BioWare game, I expect the usual, I expected companions, I expected amazing story telling, and choice. Without these, it may as well not be a BioWare game at all. These are hallmarks for them.
I don't usually pick up an MMO without knowing completely about PvP, but I feel this is a special case. And not to sound cliche here, I enjoy BioWare games, so why not?
Could try another browser and see if that fixes the problem. I'm currently using Firefox 3.5.9, haven't experienced any of these problems
TL:DR:
Bioware is assuming that MMO players just want story and movie like stuff. They're wrong. All kinds of people like all kinds of stuff and only if a developer understands that will they ever be able to create an MMO that everybody likes and that kicks Blizz off it's throne. Oh yeah and Bioware act like a bunch of pretentious douches....
This is starting to really piss me off...
Who the hell does Bioware think they are? Hey wow they've been the leading publisher in the SPRPG genre the last couple of years.... was there any "real" competition? it's like declaring yourself the winner of a solo Squash session -.-
And just because they made some successful SPRPGs they are now all of a sudden the kings of MMORPGs? That's like the Squash Player from the example above declaring all tennis players are noobs and he can pwn them all...
What Bioware is pulling with all this trash talking is nothing short of the stuff that goes on in various forums every day... not really something I expect from "professionals"... then again... it's basically EA...
What they and a lot of people here don't understand is that a "Storydriven MMO" doesn't have to be completely voiced and acted and all... a game can have a rich story while going easy on all that... Whatever you guys think of WoW - in terms of Story and the presentation of said Story, Wrath of the Lich King is brilliant. The quests you do have an impact on the world (phazing), You play a part in dismantling the Scourge step by step via phazing main story quest lines and dungeons, all leading up to the destruction of the Lich King... and there's 2 videos as sort of icing on the cake
there's also tons of other storylines to explore (the history of the Vrykul in Howling Fjord f.e.)
The key to a REAL next gen MMO is COMBINING all these factors... not focusing on one... those factors being Impact on the world, immersive story maybe with voice stuff and videos, the inevitable grind, maybe a nice conflict aka PvP, challenging end game content, interactive Events (including a changing world) and kick ass graphics that work and are downscaleable...
Blizzard kind of understands that... you have to give em that much... btw I'm not really a big WoW/Blizz fan... have lots of issues with it all but they are taking some big steps towards next gen.
Bioware is not doing that... they are just declaring that they are the bringers of Truth and Hope for all "real" MMORPG players, because all "real" MMORPG players HAVE to love movie like story stuff..... it's God's Will!!! don't blaspheme...
But that's not how it works. Different MMO players like different things in MMOs, Period! just like different people like , say, different cars.
If any company ever wants to throw Blizzard off the throne, they have to do exactly that. Create an MMO that actually and wholeheartedly caters to ALL player preferences while not neglecting another group. You need great PvP, great Story, great PvE, great High end content, great Graphics and great Events/a world that can be changed by players.
Since Bioware is apparently just aiming at a crowd that also liked their SP stuff, they're gonna fail... 2 mio subs to break even? lol ^^
<S.T.E.A.L.T.H>
An Agency that kicks so much ass it has to be written in all capital letters... divided by dots!
www.stealth-industries.de
LOL, wow BioWare , you've ruined someones life. It's like you're about to leap from a tower while everone watchs.
Do a flip when you do.
Truth, I don't want to see it coming from a mile away. Attachment to a toon, imo, means the game is working. This is what I've always enjoyed about BioWare games, you encounter companions you love, or love to hate. Since this is a Old republic game I eagerly await finding that one companion like "Carth Onasi" and putting him 6 feet under.
As for grouping, I'm more interested to see what happens when players can't agree on a decision. Kill Him? Rob him? Beat him? set him free? Give him money? People will have different perspectives and I hope BioWare is not avoiding the drama on this one.
Spot on dude. They should get on amd make a great game than start smack talking down everyone elses games. Hmmmm not sure about SWTOR...
THE SECRET WORLD - PAY ONCE PLAY FOREVER - Give it a go!
http://www.thesecretworld.com/buy/
OR PM ME FOR A BUDDY KEY (need your email address).
Pretty much sums it up.
Its kind of amusing that you skimmed the content of my post and only focused on the first line of text. I find it amusing because that first line is the only bit that referred to you directly and it is the only part of my post which has no real relevance to this discussion.
Hence my line later which was "If thats what they think then thats what they think. Whether its positive or negative is irrelevant". By that I mean there isnt much point in getting aggravated by what others are saying. It's all just food for thought. Mind you I'm a fine one to talk considering some of my snarky replies to some people in other threads lol. You might not "hate" anyone but you certainly dislike a lot of people (or their opinions at least) but then thats life I suppose. A lot of peoples thoughts and ideas rub me up the wrong way too. Human beings were never destined to get along.
You say you dont care but I say you do. You wouldnt be here argueing your points and dismissing others "negativity" otherwise. The text highlighted in blue kind of gives that one away quite blatantly.
The orange text isnt true by the way. Everything has an impact on something. Otherwise you wouldnt choose to respond to it. Peoples opinions might not be able to directly change the outcome of a game but thats no reason to not express them. Otherwise why do you express yours, which is to dismiss the "unworthy" opinions of others? If they cant change anything when why does it bother you? Whether peoples shared opinions will change anything here is kind of irrelevant anyway as this is just a forum for discussion based on the OPs article. Besides how do you know that some developer from Bioware isnt reading this in their spare time? All of these opinions could in fact be influencing decisions in various games design without any of us being any the wiser.
As for evidence regarding SWTOR being a single player rpg, well what kind of evidence would you expect them to post? We're all talking about a game which isnt out yet so no-one has access to anything really solid other than what has been shown to us by the devs. It's pretty obvious though why people are concerned about this game having a heavy focus on single player gameplay. When the player is being told a story in the form of an interactive movie then its hardly painting a picture of a strong multiplayer game is it. Thats not to say that SWTOR doesnt have any multiplayer aspect to it because it obviously does. Its just that mmos have been focusing more and more on telling stories and at the same time they seem to be becoming more solo friendly too.......mmos that can easily be treated as single player games with teaming up as an option. Who knows though maybe the open world sections of the game will be like living in a virtual world that changes all the time due to player actions. I dount it mind you but I guess its possible.
Anyway blah blah blah wall of text yadda yadda yadda lol
Yeah sure but those "dealings" are very limited. In general you can chat, sell things on an auction house perhaps and trade items and maybe challenge each other to a duel. Hardly any of them allow you to collaborate with others and put plans in motion that actually have a decent impact on the game world and its inhabitants. In fact you can literally walk through other players in these games. They cant do anything to hinder or alter your experience at all other than group up. These are static game worlds that are generally immune to player intervention.......and the players are also immune to each other. The only thing to do is level yourself up as you plough through a story. Thats fine for single player games but shouldnt multiplayer games offer more than just the same thing but with a co-op option? Some games actually do but they seem to be in the minority.
No its not just you. I get it as well. Keeping clicking in the area in the bottom left below the grey quote box. It will work eventually. Its very annoying though.
I just love when a newbie developer to the MMO market comes charging in with all these grand statements. For all its successin the single player market, BioWare has little credibility to make such grandiose statements. They haven't proven themselves in the MMO market yet.
Here's the thing...
Every MMO I've ever played has a storyline to go along with the various missions and quests you do. Some are very short and simple and not terribly interesting. Some are long and epic and quite deep (look at the story arcs in Final Fantasy XI for example). I take the time to read the quest dialog and am quite often impressed by the storylines, the lore and even the depth of emotion some of them go into.
The problem?
Many players can't be bothered to read them. For them, the quest begins and ends with "what do I have to do, what's the reward and where's the walk-through to get it done?"
I would bet money that, even with all its voice-acting that BioWare is putting so much emphasis on, if there's a way to skip the cut-scenes and not listen to all the dialog, *many* players will be doing just that. If you can't... expect complaints about having to sit through long, boring dialog that the players couldn't care less about. Not because the dialog is poorly done necessarily; rather because they just want the xp and loot.
Are there those who will appreciate the dialog and such? Of course, just like there are in any other MMO.
I just think BioWare doesn't really understand the market they're entering very well and are overestimating the importance story has to a large portion of MMO players overall. I highly doubt they're going to have much effect on the innumerable players who couldn't care less what horrible fate they are saving the galaxy from or what anyone has to say about it ... Just give them their damn new weapon and let them move on to getting the next one.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
As a bioware game I have certain gameplay expectations...
I have played most of there games and enjoyed the trip.. I like the way you can morph the story with your answers to questions, its CALLED ROLE PLAYING.
I think many of us have played a fair number of mmorpgs along the way, so lets all take a pill and wait for release, on this one.
I had high hopes for the star trek game WOW did that suck.. so we must wait and see..
played:WoW and Eve off and on 5 years
Tried:CoH/V, PoTBS, War, TR, STO, FE
TOR is likely to rock
Read the underline areas and you might understand why pointing that out was kinda stupid.
Kind of like single player games...
Aside from "who" said it,
Is the statement wrong? In my opinion, no...it is totally correct. MMORPG's have become a pretty convoluted idea at this point with all the copy catting and unwillingness to progress with new ideas. At their core, these games have hardly progressed at all. They are for the mostpart, hollow level grinders that have "raids" at the end.
That isn't what an RPG is about.
Daniel Erickson lays down some truth:
Bioware has criticised current MMO games for having "no point" - and pledged that mammoth creation Star Wars: The Old Republic will finally bring real story to the genre.
The title - due for release next year - contains 'over 50 novels-worth' of voice-over content, according to Bioware.
Bioware designer and writing director Daniel Erickson told CVG that the Mass Effect studio had been disappointed by the "lack of fun" in other MMO titles on the market.
He said: "In the early days when they first announced that there were MMOs, like the existence of them, I knew in my head what that meant - because I played Role Playing Games. It was just giant Role Playing Games.
"And then MMO [games] showed up, and it wasn't that. It was the ruleset to an RPG: There was combat, and there were areas, but that was all. Someone had left out the module. There was no story, there was no point. You just kind of wandered around. And that hasn't really changed all that much over the years.
"We've always had that thought in the back of our heads: That Old Republic should be all the things we thought an MMO would be in the first place - which is all the parts of an RPG. Which means - and this is the most radical idea - it should just be fun. Like, just fun to play. You shouldn't be trying to ignore all of the content to get to the end as fast as possible."
He added: "I don't think that [MMO creators] set out in the beginning to say: 'Hey, let's make this a grind. Let's not have any interesting content here.' A lot of the better ones more recently have interesting content for the first few levels, you know - and some of them for the first 20 levels, whatever. But it's still not the interesting content you'd expect in a single-player game.
"The thing that has been a challenge for us on Old Republic is that people tried to convince us these limitations were canon - that they were to be respected, you know? That you could not, in fact, put interesting bits in an MMO because that was now sacrilege."
Watching cutscenes is not playing a game.
MMO devs are incredibly stupid. People play games for gameplay. They read books or watch movies for story.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2