I don't see that guy making any good points, nor is that post relevant to the matter at hand. That's just the same "it's 2010, we need to go forwards not backwards" talk that gets thrown around by people who don't like seeing the specific features they wanted get left out.
Looks good to me. All the WoW trash will buy enough boxes for the devs to launch content after a month and those of us who liked there last game will stay.
"Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness". No one can stop anyone from pursuing happiness, but life and liberty are said to only exist if they are deliberately sought and paid for".
I don't see that guy making any good points, nor is that post relevant to the matter at hand. That's just the same "it's 2010, we need to go forwards not backwards" talk that gets thrown around by people who don't like seeing the specific features they wanted get left out.
Sorry, by that, I didn't just mean the first opening post. I meant the thread. Good arguments on both side of the fences.
The only keyword in all you said is ''currently''. I'm sorry but thats a fact.
Not even mentioning that the game is in beta, that SHOULD be obvious.
Leves will not change from this point on. In the most recent interview from Gamescon, SE has said Leves are not going to change at all -- except for a little more bonus added for those who party play.
"Currently though most feel there's not enough benefit to group up and as such do the guildleves solo instead. We are working on adressing that so group play will be more encouraged, so maybe either you get more skillpoints for example."
Sorry, but this does not fix all of the other issues with the guild leve system. Overlapping is a major issue I have with the system, and it needs to be taken out. There's no reason I should lose my item and guild mark reward because someone else has the same leve.
I've preached the "but it's a beta!" garbage before. But now that SE has so vehemently shown us, they are just not listening to their testers at all. It's fine if SE is following their vision of things, but broken mechanics need to be fixed. As it stands, I will not be doing my leves with other people come launch.
Are people just not reading all the replies here? The leve cooldown doesn't encourage grouping, because you'd have to be a complete moron to share a leve without someone who doesn't have leves to share in return because you'd be severely nerfing your EXP rate at the expense of 6 or so extra gil. Even if you did share a leve without someone who had leves to share in return, you'd gain a lot more gil, but again at the expense of your EXP rate (agruably more important, especially to the "hardcore"). Parties aren't even needed for a majority of the content (including guild leves, which don't really change much even when you crank the difficulty all the way up). The loot doesn't even improve, just the gil.
Square Enix did mention they are working on finding a way to increase party incentives. So we can hope, but the guild leve system isn't perfect as it is now, needs difficulty tweaking, and better rewards at higher difficulty then just an 1 or 2% more gil "bonus". Partying right now is a real mess and just unnecessary, a solo player is going to find their progression a lot faster and easier. A "leech" (someone who doesn't share leves and only feeds off others) is going to find their progression even better. Someone who doesn't know better and shares their leves is going to have their progression severely slowed down. This is a major problem.
I have no idea what you're talking about. Let's say you use your 8 leaves and finish them in 2 hours.
What's stopping you from joining other groups that are forming. Let's say you join a group with someone who hasn't done his 8 yet. You do his 8 for the next two hours. Then you find another group,etc etc. You may have 15 hours a day wher eyou want everyone in your group to have 8 of their leves not completed so that you can do your xp gaming in one fell swoop, but that's not the way it's designed.
You join a group for a few hours, if you run of leves, you join another group with people that still have theirs.
What's the problem here?
Problem is a combination of things as I already mentioned and seemed to be completely ignored by anyone responding to my posts. I suppose I have to spell out the problems.
Let's say I do leves with 15 members of a linkshell. We all appropiately share our leves with each other. Now here comes the problem:
1. Currently the difficulty is so easy that I could probably handle the leve with only 2 or 3 people on the highest difficulty (LEGION), making it a ridiculously easy zerging exercise. Usually, the MOBs will be dead before you can even hit them.
2. EXP is slowed to a halt because instead of the usual 600/700 EXP earned for killing something in a leve solo, it's now 20/30 because so many people are hitting it. There is no bonus experience for grouping.
3. EXP is further gimped because you wind up spending more time travelling between leves than fighting (because again, with this many people everything is going to die in a single round of hits, even on legion difficulty).
4. You have to spend all the additional time sorting out leves to make sure members don't have additional leves. Members have to run back and forth between town and camp to pick up leves after someone completed them. They don't overlap. If you both have the same leve and someone starts a leve, that counts as your leve being completed to.
5. All this trouble and you only get extra gil for your efforts. You will not get extra loot items and marks for doing other people's leves, just gil. You spent 10 or so hours that doing leves for the SAME EXP that someone who spent 5 minutes soloing. Yes, it's that bad. If you continuing doing this whenever your leves are up, you'll have tons of gil for someone in your tier, but the person who solos and moves on to grinding is going to be a far higher tier than you, and thus probably have even more gil than you.
Now you assume you can continue doing leves with other people even when you yourself doesn't have them, but this really isn't the case. Since the other person really gets no benefit (aside from a few extra gil for being able to increase the difficulty bonus, no it does not improve the loot item you get) and has their EXP halfed for inviting you, why should they invite you? Most people in beta realize this, that's why there are no groups going on when you get to Bloodskull on, because people will have realized by now that groups currently are more of a negative than positive, which is definitely not the way it should be and I'm sure Square Enix didn't intend for this.
Theres actually a very easy fix for this. Im pretty sure is the only fix we will see for lv.More of them for your level range, i cant posibly belive that theres only going to be 4 lv for every camp on release. comon , no really think about it for a second. Add 8 more lv and everyones happy.We are asuming theres only 4 per camp becouse is whats in beta right now, that doesnt mean we wont have 8 at release, or somethin around those lines. Also, there NO REGULAR QUESTS on beta at all, none. There will be tons of normal quests at release, most meaningless and story driven of course. but still the quantity of content from ff is what made the game shine, so the fear of lack of it , is not somethin im worried about.
My main concerns at this point it comes down to,
1-- UI, is unplayable at this stage, is just to slow( yes everythin is done server side so i have my hopes this will be fixed, aparently they do everythin server side becouse is more secure, and is understandable. The other problem is they are runing a lot of debuggin code as of now in the beta wich adds a lot more lag on top. Until they put up the new servers with all the horse power thats supoused to have we wont see mayor improvement on this tought)
2- group play not incencitive enough -my Mayor fear right now.
3- that my alienware alx doesnt run it (j-k)
4- armory sistem not working out as it looks on pen and paper, so far on beta is just to short to really test it.
The only keyword in all you said is ''currently''. I'm sorry but thats a fact.
Not even mentioning that the game is in beta, that SHOULD be obvious.
Sorry, but this does not fix all of the other issues with the guild leve system. Overlapping is a major issue I have with the system, and it needs to be taken out. There's no reason I should lose my item and guild mark reward because someone else has the same leve.
I've preached the "but it's a beta!" garbage before. But now that SE has so vehemently shown us, they are just not listening to their testers at all. It's fine if SE is following their vision of things, but broken mechanics need to be fixed. As it stands, I will not be doing my leves with other people come launch.
Yes this is the problem! they are not listening to us from the very begining We have been complaining about the same things UI, Loot system, Auction house needed!, Grabage ass leves and thier on to long of timers, they are not listening to us.... However im hoping they see thier errors after launch so I have pre-order anyway and I do like the game and the ideas in it so it has alot of potential.
And your right the BETA crap is over were a month from launch and they put out there not fixing those issues so we'll see what they do after launch as of right now if my friends will not get the free buddy invite from me because theyll just quite the game since they will not put up with the crappy controls like I will.... Patience is a virtue alot of new gamers dont have...
This beta and subsequent interviews have been an absolute buzzkill. Every part of me wanted FF14 to rock, and I was willing to look past every stupid issue I came across. But sometimes you need to let reality settle in...
- the interview basically says that any and all complaints we beta testers had, doesnt matter or 'is being worked on', without any info in what real plans are.
- this is the laggiest damn UI I have ever used, EVER - I didnt play FF11, but I have tried at least 15-20 other MMO's, and this is just pathetic
- no auction house? wtf
- no recipes, and on top of that, game crashes when you minimize out, lol
- most lacking tutorial I've dealt with in awhile
- too many promises of what is to come rather than what will be here at release
That last one bothers me the most. They are blatantly releasing a half-finished game and promising us 'stuff' will be added later, with guarantees if it will be via patch or expansion. It's 2010, and games from 6-8 years ago dont have half of these issues. I truly, truly gave it my all to love this game, and still have a small bit of hope, but I ain't keeping my CE pre-order much longer and I'd imagine many others feel the same. At some point, you cant keep saying "we're working on it" and you gotta start showing progress. This game needs a few more MONTHS of work (it seems).
Again, I hope I am wrong, but reality has struck tonight.
This beta and subsequent interviews have been an absolute buzzkill. Every part of me wanted FF14 to rock, and I was willing to look past every stupid issue I came across. But sometimes you need to let reality settle in...
- the interview basically says that any and all complaints we beta testers had, doesnt matter or 'is being worked on', without any info in what real plans are.
- this is the laggiest damn UI I have ever used, EVER - I didnt play FF11, but I have tried at least 15-20 other MMO's, and this is just pathetic
- no auction house? wtf
- no recipes, and on top of that, game crashes when you minimize out, lol
- most lacking tutorial I've dealt with in awhile
- too many promises of what is to come rather than what will be here at release
That last one bothers me the most. They are blatantly releasing a half-finished game and promising us 'stuff' will be added later, with guarantees if it will be via patch or expansion. It's 2010, and games from 6-8 years ago dont have half of these issues. I truly, truly gave it my all to love this game, and still have a small bit of hope, but I ain't keeping my CE pre-order much longer and I'd imagine many others feel the same. At some point, you cant keep saying "we're working on it" and you gotta start showing progress. This game needs a few more MONTHS of work (it seems).
Again, I hope I am wrong, but reality has struck tonight.
Some of what you listed is what was standard in ffxi. I understand your points too they are pretty clear but take a sec and look at it like this even of they wanted to push back they couldn't they promised by the end of the year and they sure as gell are going to release. Now as for what they will fix. SE is good at this so yes if they say they are going to fix it then yes that is what they will be doing buy realistically it may not be til a few months in that it all gets done (sigh). As far as it being 2010 the fact is doesnt matter when it was releases sometimes go sh*tty. Play mmos long enough and you see 1 to a dozen. So its no surprise. A lot of the time in the west we don't see the bad parts becuase we get the later release date after the kinks are gone. the price we pay for equal treatment is having to deal with the early on crap also.
Now you didnt come from ffxi and this may be the worst part for at release play. If you deal with Se enough you know the pattern no tricks. So some thing players percieve as a problem SE simply does not see as one. Like the recipes and crafting that is just the way it is.
I dont think the game will fail but I do think the first few months will be (blah) because the honest truth is its hard to get a real feel until a few months in.
So much complaining still...why can't you all just learn to adapt to new styles of play in different games instead of constantly demanding this silly industry standard BS or that everything mirrors and plays exactly like WoW or else...
Anyway, I'm finally responding because there is this great article over on Massively that fits perfectly with this and many other discussions regarding FFXIV these past few months, that I feel you all should read if you havn't already.
So the next time you feel compelled to rip a developer a new one...
Sit down. Cool your heels. Think about it for a moment. Think of all of the decisions a developer has to balance at once. Then, think about how the developers may want to develop their game.
You may hate their design decisions, but they usually have a reason for doing what they do. They might see something you don't, they might want to tweak something to put it in line with their vision, or they may be trying to fix something they already knew was broken.
In short, they're doing this because they want to make a fun game. Fun is not easy to come across. Fun is an elusive little slimebucket that likes to hide in dark corners. Fun takes time to find and everyone, even the best game designer in the world, is going to fail time and time again in the quest for fun.
So be patient. Relax. Point out what you think is wrong and tell the developer, but don't go psychotically crazy over some perceived slight. Understand that developers are just trying to make their game more fun, and they may fail a few dozen times in the process. It's not because they're bad developers, it's just because that's what it takes to make a good game.
Take the time to think about what it's like to actually sit behind the wheel, or try it out for yourself. It's not as easy as it looks.
The content constantly coming in is something SE has always done with FFXI. They had a solid game and constantly released content and even expansions at launch were not fully implemented, but instead the story would be added over time. The game kind of grows with the playerbase at a steady pace so I am not worried about end game content at all right now.
The 48 hour guild leves everyone bitches about but most aren't even out of Bearded Rock. We have no idea how many guild leves will be available when you can travel between all 3 starting cities, take high rank of one guild leve, and low rank of a much higher guild leve with a group, etc.
Everyone is making assumptions, but the fact is that we don't know how it will play out until live, and they have a vision and are trying to steer the game that way. Why have people become so close minded in this genre...
I went back over the thread & all I can say is that my first comment was spot on.There's a lots of these people, that I don't want to hear whining in game once it launch, in this thread.
It seems that while there will be general tweaks to somewhat improve things people are complaining about, there are some issues that won't be addressed for launch.
Tutorials. Expect some improvement to starting player guidance, but they are leaving it up to Fansites to post guides on how to play the game.
Not a big deal. Im in beta and teh one thign i can tell you is, if you have done the main story, you know that it g ives you a great overview of how to play the game. Also at every aetherial stone, there is a tutorial there is a manual embedded in it.
Auction Houses. Not for launch. Better ability to search the retainer vendors for goods you need? Not for launch.
Thsi is a big deal to alot of people more then anything else because in teh beta they have wards , which are places where you can set an npc, to seel you stuff 24/7. The problem is, there is no centralized browser to view all of them. the lack of an auction house will be a big deal.
End Game. Most content at launch for casual players. Hardcore and end game content to be added later.
Im at level 20 right now, and i think teh Leves are awesome, so i can see them being the bulk of teh endgame and being very fun!
Mana Regeneration. Maybe some tweaking for launch, but they want players to be limited by mana and mana management. (Similar to DDO, your mana pool does not regenerate on it's own, in or out of combat).
lol this is really not that big of a deal. All magic classes get actions that dont cost mana, an dthey also get a full mana regenration skill that can be used every 30 minutes. Played correctly, there is no need for mana regeneration. u just have to think outside teh box. I have a conjuere at 15 and i havent gotten to teh point where i couldnt figure out how to keep a good level of mp.
UI lag. Working on it, expect solid improvements with tweaks, fixes and removal of debugging code.
hope they fix this soon because teh lag is dreadfull. Also they need to work more on allowing teh mouse to do alot of point and click functions
Mouse Support. They understand the Software mouse has bad performance, but while e mouse looking into possible hardware mouse in the future, no plans yet to add it to the game. Definitely not for launch.
This one just doesnt make much sense with the reason people are complaining! If SE fixes the mouse so that there is no lag, then why are you sweating whether they are using a hardware mouse or not. givethem a chance to fix it!!
48 Hour Guildleve cooldown. It will stay. They have no plans to change it, at all. If you want more Guildleves, share them with others and have them share theirs with you. (The arguement that 48 hours is fine for casuals is horrible, IMO. 24 hour cooldown would make more sense for the person who plays an hour or so a day).
This one is a mixed bag. If they add more guildleves at current levels, fix battle regimens( which give large exp bonuses when completed) and boost the rewards for grouping. this wont be a big deal. But if the slack on that, its gonna be an issue for sure. people need to remember though that this game is going to be a big grouping game. You can Solo, but depending how much you want to play, you wont be able to do it all the time. this is the core design and will not change. if you dont liek it, then this isnt the game for you.
Graphics performance issues. Expect some improvements with tweaks and removal of debugging code. Still have issues? It must be you and your hardware...
The orginal official benchmark, is skewd bug time. My game plays much better then expected. the are revising it if and putting out a new one soon
So much complaining still...why can't you all just learn to adapt to new styles of play in different games instead of constantly demanding this silly industry standard BS or that everything mirrors and plays exactly like WoW or else...
You are either very disillusioned or just flat our not reading what I have said, and what many agree on me with.
If SE is going for 2 hours of great leveling every 48 hours as a "different style," then by golly they achieved it. I'm not going to type all of the other issues I have with XIV again, because, obviously, you're glossing over them and calling out the overused "adapt to new styles of gameplay."
I've been playing MMOs for close to 13 years now. I played FFXI before it even hit North America and was Japan only. I can adapt to new styles of gameplay, but the absolute atrocious mechanics that are in the game right now need an overhaul. Oh, what the hell, let me review them again. Combat is fine (except targetting with cure/buff spells -- literally impossible to do -- it doesn't let you unless you leave combat), but Leves are not fine at all (Crafting is fine for me once they fix the horrible delay with it.)
@Jadan';s post - I hate to disregard something on the basis of spelling, but an entire post by a user that cannot properly type the word "the" and "this" needs to be retyped then resubmitted. Then I may take him or her seriously.
So much complaining still...why can't you all just learn to adapt to new styles of play in different games instead of constantly demanding this silly industry standard BS or that everything mirrors and plays exactly like WoW or else...
You are either very disillusioned or just flat our not reading what I have said, and what many agree on me with.
If SE is going for 2 hours of great leveling every 48 hours as a "different style," then by golly they achieved it. I'm not going to type all of the other issues I have with XIV again, because, obviously, you're glossing over them and calling out the overused "adapt to new styles of gameplay."
I've been playing MMOs for close to 13 years now. I played FFXI before it even hit North America and was Japan only. I can adapt to new styles of gameplay, but the absolute atrocious mechanics that are in the game right now need an overhaul. Oh, what the hell, let me review them again. Combat is fine (except targetting with cure/buff spells -- literally impossible to do -- it doesn't let you unless you leave combat), but Leves are not fine at all (Crafting is fine for me once they fix the horrible delay with it.)
@Jadan';s post - I hate to disregard something on the basis of spelling, but an entire post by a user that cannot properly type the word "the" and "this" needs to be retyped then resubmitted. Then I may take him or her seriously.
So you are only going to solo level, and solo your leves and you base the entire leveling cycle of the game around this? You know exactly how it's going to play out and be once live? When there are 3 starting areas and converging areas to pull leves from?
I spent 5 hours in the same party and we explored, did a ton of leves, and had a blast. Just in this beta there is so much content people aren't even exploring because for some reason they think they can only solo their 8 leves then stop playing. Why is it SE's responsibility to hold players hands and guide them through the entire game. Experiment a little.
A group can take rank 5 leves from an easier area, rank 3 leves from a higher difficulty area, rank 1 leves from an even more difficult area, and in a group you have the ability to mix up a ton of leves. In the party I mentioned I used 5 of my leve slots. Also after a leve we would hang around and kill monsters or travel back to a camp killing monsters and using our MP.
I think that people are just so close minded and can't experiment and make the system work for them. I don't understand why, but it is the case. 99% of the people I see whining about leves just jump on, solo them in an hour, then log out and probably don't even talk to anyone. If this is the only way you can play and all you can get out of the system then of course it isn't going to appeal to you. These aren't the type of players that this game is going to support and they aren't the type that would stay for longer than a week or two before making gross assumptions and nerd raging on forums because SE didn't give them a direct path from A-B where B is endgame like almost every MMO in the last 5 years. If that is the standard of the genre then F the genre.
So much complaining still...why can't you all just learn to adapt to new styles of play in different games instead of constantly demanding this silly industry standard BS or that everything mirrors and plays exactly like WoW or else...
You are either very disillusioned or just flat our not reading what I have said, and what many agree on me with.
If SE is going for 2 hours of great leveling every 48 hours as a "different style," then by golly they achieved it. I'm not going to type all of the other issues I have with XIV again, because, obviously, you're glossing over them and calling out the overused "adapt to new styles of gameplay."
I've been playing MMOs for close to 13 years now. I played FFXI before it even hit North America and was Japan only. I can adapt to new styles of gameplay, but the absolute atrocious mechanics that are in the game right now need an overhaul. Oh, what the hell, let me review them again. Combat is fine (except targetting with cure/buff spells -- literally impossible to do -- it doesn't let you unless you leave combat), but Leves are not fine at all (Crafting is fine for me once they fix the horrible delay with it.)
@Jadan';s post - I hate to disregard something on the basis of spelling, but an entire post by a user that cannot properly type the word "the" and "this" needs to be retyped then resubmitted. Then I may take him or her seriously.
if you chose to miss the point of my thread because of my spelling, thats your own business. As long as others here arent that thick headed and get it, im ok. Next time ill be sure not to type on my phone for your intellectual convenience.
So much complaining still...why can't you all just learn to adapt to new styles of play in different games instead of constantly demanding this silly industry standard BS or that everything mirrors and plays exactly like WoW or else...
You are either very disillusioned or just flat our not reading what I have said, and what many agree on me with.
If SE is going for 2 hours of great leveling every 48 hours as a "different style," then by golly they achieved it. I'm not going to type all of the other issues I have with XIV again, because, obviously, you're glossing over them and calling out the overused "adapt to new styles of gameplay."
I've been playing MMOs for close to 13 years now. I played FFXI before it even hit North America and was Japan only. I can adapt to new styles of gameplay, but the absolute atrocious mechanics that are in the game right now need an overhaul. Oh, what the hell, let me review them again. Combat is fine (except targetting with cure/buff spells -- literally impossible to do -- it doesn't let you unless you leave combat), but Leves are not fine at all (Crafting is fine for me once they fix the horrible delay with it.)
@Jadan's post - I hate to disregard something on the basis of spelling, but an entire post by a user that cannot properly type the word "the" and "this" needs to be retyped then resubmitted. Then I may take him or her seriously.
This just isn't WoW Cataclysm. It won't be race with your pre made guild to eighty five and then hit the dungeon an gear treadmill. I think we are talking a harder PvE curve for XIV where you have to think about how to play the levelling game on launch, and where PvE raiding is going to be patched in post-launch largely. The game is designed to make you linger over what is there rather than just try to blitz through to cap asap. It may be a litmus test for you...but if WoW is your game then I would skip XIV if you cannot easily tolerate anything else.
Sweet! I am actually very happy about number six. lol
That alone should weed out some of the retards that shouldn't even touch this game in the first place.
Hip hip hurray!
Yeah good argument scro.
Mouse is bad, people that use them are tards, but you know they can still live kick ass lifes.
Honest its clear what FF14 is now, old skool mmorpgs. Which is great if thats what you want. I think all the wow haters, and people that don't like: stories, themepark, fluid combat, should all go play FF14; So i no longer have to hear them QQ on forums.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
This just isn't WoW Cataclysm. It won't be race with your pre made guild to eighty five and then hit the dungeon an gear treadmill. I think we are talking a harder PvE curve for XIV where you have to think about how to play the levelling game on launch, and where PvE raiding is going to be patched in post-launch largely. The game is designed to make you linger over what is there rather than just try to blitz through to cap asap. It may be a litmus test for you...but if WoW is your game then I would skip XIV if you cannot easily tolerate anything else.
And you're clearly not understanding what I'm saying. At all.
Originally posted by Jetrpg
Yeah good argument scro.
Mouse is bad, people that use them are tards, but you know they can still live kick ass lifes.
Honest its clear what FF14 is now, old skool mmorpgs. Which is great if thats what you want. I think all the wow haters, and people that don't like: stories, themepark, fluid combat, should all go play FF14; So i no longer have to hear them QQ on forums.
People that do or don't? Because XIV has all three things you listed.
And you're clearly not understanding what I'm saying. At all.
I clearly understand what your saying and it rings to the tune of regardless of how much experience you claim to have from the past, unless this new MMO plays exactly how 'you' expect it too based on this silly industry standard BS, you must complain and bitch and whine about it. Not everyone in the world likes the same things, clearly, but most US & EU players seem to expect every developer to make new games that only applies to what they like...
Apparently you don't understand that fanboi or not, there are millions of players out there that accept what SE are doing and are perfectly fine with the controls and UI and leves as they are. Sure there could be some slight changes and improvements made to them eventually, which I'll still be fine with and adapt to them, but all-in-all they are fine to me and many others. And since nobody seems to believe anything one says here without fact backing it up, just read the new Famitsu ~ Gamescom interview where Komoto clearly says they have recieved very little feedback on the controls from the Japanese players ~ thus millions of other gamers just like myself.
This just isn't WoW Cataclysm. It won't be race with your pre made guild to eighty five and then hit the dungeon an gear treadmill. I think we are talking a harder PvE curve for XIV where you have to think about how to play the levelling game on launch, and where PvE raiding is going to be patched in post-launch largely. The game is designed to make you linger over what is there rather than just try to blitz through to cap asap. It may be a litmus test for you...but if WoW is your game then I would skip XIV if you cannot easily tolerate anything else.
And you're clearly not understanding what I'm saying. At all.
I just think we are different types of human being.
I clearly understand what your saying and it rings to the tune of regardless of how much experience you claim to have from the past, unless this new MMO plays exactly how 'you' expect it too based on this silly industry standard BS, you must complain and bitch and whine about it. Not everyone in the world likes the same things, clearly, but most US & EU players seem to expect every developer to make new games that only applies to what they like...
Apparently you don't understand that fanboi or not, there are millions of players out there that accept what SE are doing and are perfectly fine with the controls and UI and leves as they are. Sure there could be some slight changes and improvements made to them eventually, which I'll still be fine with and adapt to them, but all-in-all they are fine to me and many others. And since nobody seems to believe anything one says here without fact backing it up, just read the new Famitsu ~ Gamescom interview where Komoto clearly says they have recieved very little feedback on the controls from the Japanese players ~ thus millions of other gamers just like myself.
* eagerly awaiting your return BS rant...rofl
*Returns BS rant*
I never said I hated the controls. I love them.
Anyways. Whether you like it or not, Leves are broken. Unless you have personally experienced the mechanic, your opinion has little value to me. Also, I've spoke with Japanese in-game, and they feel the same. Leves are completely broken. That's all I'm trying to say. Honestly have no idea why you keep throwing out other random tidbits like controls and UI when I said I was perfectly fine with them, minus crafting lag.
You call me a "fanboi" when all you're clearly doing is defending the game on every level. I enjoy the game, I'll buy the CE, but I stand by my opinion that the Leve mechanic is broken.
When I can solo a level 10<19 rank 5 (legion) Leve at level 16, something's wrong.
When I join up to party with friends for Leve quests, but half of mine dissappear because my friend activated his (and overlapping occured), something's wrong.
When most people log in for 1 hour a day, do some Leves then log out, something's wrong.
I'm in beta. I've been in beta for awhile. I'm just stating my opinion and telling you what's happening. If you have a problem with that, then I'm sorry. I honestly have no idea what your issue is with this.
Now, please, return with a post regarding Leves. Do not mention controls, UI, WoW, or whatever else. Return with a comment on Leves. And remember, I'm not saying I want to power level to cap. I'm just saying there's not enough leveling content (LEVELING. Remember, LEVELING CONTENT. Not CONTENT) to last for more than 2 hours a day max, in a group, wihout having to resort to grinding ala FFXI.
Sweet! I am actually very happy about number six. lol
That alone should weed out some of the retards that shouldn't even touch this game in the first place.
Hip hip hurray!
Yeah good argument scro.
Mouse is bad, people that use them are tards, but you know they can still live kick ass lifes.
Honest its clear what FF14 is now, old skool mmorpgs. Which is great if thats what you want. I think all the wow haters, and people that don't like: stories, themepark, fluid combat, should all go play FF14; So i no longer have to hear them QQ on forums.
After reading comments I think the long story short is that every1 is expecting some issues at release and that some people are worried about long run sucess while others aren't. There is nothing really o point counter point here. Some of the issues are real issues (lag in the controls. AH, etc etc) While other thing like the 48 hour cd no mana regen etc etc are just the way it is. No matter how much we argue here the fact is the devs made their choice and they are sticking with it for better or for worse.
Long story short is that some people can't look past their own expectations and see all of the greatness that is waiting within this title. They will screw themselves and continually go to clone after clone wondering how they lost that feeling that they once had not realizing that somewhere within FFXIV that massive deep rich adventurous experience is waiting for them.
Comments
http://www.ffxivcore.com/topic/11180-want-to-know-why-so-many-people-are-unhappy-answers-inside/
A lot of you here need to read that.
I don't see that guy making any good points, nor is that post relevant to the matter at hand. That's just the same "it's 2010, we need to go forwards not backwards" talk that gets thrown around by people who don't like seeing the specific features they wanted get left out.
Looks good to me. All the WoW trash will buy enough boxes for the devs to launch content after a month and those of us who liked there last game will stay.
"Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness". No one can stop anyone from pursuing happiness, but life and liberty are said to only exist if they are deliberately sought and paid for".
Sorry, by that, I didn't just mean the first opening post. I meant the thread. Good arguments on both side of the fences.
Leves will not change from this point on. In the most recent interview from Gamescon, SE has said Leves are not going to change at all -- except for a little more bonus added for those who party play.
"Currently though most feel there's not enough benefit to group up and as such do the guildleves solo instead. We are working on adressing that so group play will be more encouraged, so maybe either you get more skillpoints for example."
Sorry, but this does not fix all of the other issues with the guild leve system. Overlapping is a major issue I have with the system, and it needs to be taken out. There's no reason I should lose my item and guild mark reward because someone else has the same leve.
I've preached the "but it's a beta!" garbage before. But now that SE has so vehemently shown us, they are just not listening to their testers at all. It's fine if SE is following their vision of things, but broken mechanics need to be fixed. As it stands, I will not be doing my leves with other people come launch.
Theres actually a very easy fix for this. Im pretty sure is the only fix we will see for lv.More of them for your level range, i cant posibly belive that theres only going to be 4 lv for every camp on release. comon , no really think about it for a second. Add 8 more lv and everyones happy.We are asuming theres only 4 per camp becouse is whats in beta right now, that doesnt mean we wont have 8 at release, or somethin around those lines. Also, there NO REGULAR QUESTS on beta at all, none. There will be tons of normal quests at release, most meaningless and story driven of course. but still the quantity of content from ff is what made the game shine, so the fear of lack of it , is not somethin im worried about.
My main concerns at this point it comes down to,
1-- UI, is unplayable at this stage, is just to slow( yes everythin is done server side so i have my hopes this will be fixed, aparently they do everythin server side becouse is more secure, and is understandable. The other problem is they are runing a lot of debuggin code as of now in the beta wich adds a lot more lag on top. Until they put up the new servers with all the horse power thats supoused to have we wont see mayor improvement on this tought)
2- group play not incencitive enough -my Mayor fear right now.
3- that my alienware alx doesnt run it (j-k)
4- armory sistem not working out as it looks on pen and paper, so far on beta is just to short to really test it.
Yes this is the problem! they are not listening to us from the very begining We have been complaining about the same things UI, Loot system, Auction house needed!, Grabage ass leves and thier on to long of timers, they are not listening to us.... However im hoping they see thier errors after launch so I have pre-order anyway and I do like the game and the ideas in it so it has alot of potential.
And your right the BETA crap is over were a month from launch and they put out there not fixing those issues so we'll see what they do after launch as of right now if my friends will not get the free buddy invite from me because theyll just quite the game since they will not put up with the crappy controls like I will.... Patience is a virtue alot of new gamers dont have...
This beta and subsequent interviews have been an absolute buzzkill. Every part of me wanted FF14 to rock, and I was willing to look past every stupid issue I came across. But sometimes you need to let reality settle in...
- the interview basically says that any and all complaints we beta testers had, doesnt matter or 'is being worked on', without any info in what real plans are.
- this is the laggiest damn UI I have ever used, EVER - I didnt play FF11, but I have tried at least 15-20 other MMO's, and this is just pathetic
- no auction house? wtf
- no recipes, and on top of that, game crashes when you minimize out, lol
- most lacking tutorial I've dealt with in awhile
- too many promises of what is to come rather than what will be here at release
That last one bothers me the most. They are blatantly releasing a half-finished game and promising us 'stuff' will be added later, with guarantees if it will be via patch or expansion. It's 2010, and games from 6-8 years ago dont have half of these issues. I truly, truly gave it my all to love this game, and still have a small bit of hope, but I ain't keeping my CE pre-order much longer and I'd imagine many others feel the same. At some point, you cant keep saying "we're working on it" and you gotta start showing progress. This game needs a few more MONTHS of work (it seems).
Again, I hope I am wrong, but reality has struck tonight.
Some of what you listed is what was standard in ffxi. I understand your points too they are pretty clear but take a sec and look at it like this even of they wanted to push back they couldn't they promised by the end of the year and they sure as gell are going to release. Now as for what they will fix. SE is good at this so yes if they say they are going to fix it then yes that is what they will be doing buy realistically it may not be til a few months in that it all gets done (sigh). As far as it being 2010 the fact is doesnt matter when it was releases sometimes go sh*tty. Play mmos long enough and you see 1 to a dozen. So its no surprise. A lot of the time in the west we don't see the bad parts becuase we get the later release date after the kinks are gone. the price we pay for equal treatment is having to deal with the early on crap also.
Now you didnt come from ffxi and this may be the worst part for at release play. If you deal with Se enough you know the pattern no tricks. So some thing players percieve as a problem SE simply does not see as one. Like the recipes and crafting that is just the way it is.
I dont think the game will fail but I do think the first few months will be (blah) because the honest truth is its hard to get a real feel until a few months in.
So much complaining still...why can't you all just learn to adapt to new styles of play in different games instead of constantly demanding this silly industry standard BS or that everything mirrors and plays exactly like WoW or else...
Anyway, I'm finally responding because there is this great article over on Massively that fits perfectly with this and many other discussions regarding FFXIV these past few months, that I feel you all should read if you havn't already.
Anti-Aliased: Don't hate the playa, hate the developa
A small piece of the article:
So the next time you feel compelled to rip a developer a new one...
Sit down. Cool your heels. Think about it for a moment. Think of all of the decisions a developer has to balance at once. Then, think about how the developers may want to develop their game.
You may hate their design decisions, but they usually have a reason for doing what they do. They might see something you don't, they might want to tweak something to put it in line with their vision, or they may be trying to fix something they already knew was broken.
In short, they're doing this because they want to make a fun game. Fun is not easy to come across. Fun is an elusive little slimebucket that likes to hide in dark corners. Fun takes time to find and everyone, even the best game designer in the world, is going to fail time and time again in the quest for fun.
So be patient. Relax. Point out what you think is wrong and tell the developer, but don't go psychotically crazy over some perceived slight. Understand that developers are just trying to make their game more fun, and they may fail a few dozen times in the process. It's not because they're bad developers, it's just because that's what it takes to make a good game.
Take the time to think about what it's like to actually sit behind the wheel, or try it out for yourself. It's not as easy as it looks.
The content constantly coming in is something SE has always done with FFXI. They had a solid game and constantly released content and even expansions at launch were not fully implemented, but instead the story would be added over time. The game kind of grows with the playerbase at a steady pace so I am not worried about end game content at all right now.
The 48 hour guild leves everyone bitches about but most aren't even out of Bearded Rock. We have no idea how many guild leves will be available when you can travel between all 3 starting cities, take high rank of one guild leve, and low rank of a much higher guild leve with a group, etc.
Everyone is making assumptions, but the fact is that we don't know how it will play out until live, and they have a vision and are trying to steer the game that way. Why have people become so close minded in this genre...
I went back over the thread & all I can say is that my first comment was spot on.There's a lots of these people, that I don't want to hear whining in game once it launch, in this thread.
Have a nice day!
You are either very disillusioned or just flat our not reading what I have said, and what many agree on me with.
If SE is going for 2 hours of great leveling every 48 hours as a "different style," then by golly they achieved it. I'm not going to type all of the other issues I have with XIV again, because, obviously, you're glossing over them and calling out the overused "adapt to new styles of gameplay."
I've been playing MMOs for close to 13 years now. I played FFXI before it even hit North America and was Japan only. I can adapt to new styles of gameplay, but the absolute atrocious mechanics that are in the game right now need an overhaul. Oh, what the hell, let me review them again. Combat is fine (except targetting with cure/buff spells -- literally impossible to do -- it doesn't let you unless you leave combat), but Leves are not fine at all (Crafting is fine for me once they fix the horrible delay with it.)
@Jadan';s post - I hate to disregard something on the basis of spelling, but an entire post by a user that cannot properly type the word "the" and "this" needs to be retyped then resubmitted. Then I may take him or her seriously.
So you are only going to solo level, and solo your leves and you base the entire leveling cycle of the game around this? You know exactly how it's going to play out and be once live? When there are 3 starting areas and converging areas to pull leves from?
I spent 5 hours in the same party and we explored, did a ton of leves, and had a blast. Just in this beta there is so much content people aren't even exploring because for some reason they think they can only solo their 8 leves then stop playing. Why is it SE's responsibility to hold players hands and guide them through the entire game. Experiment a little.
A group can take rank 5 leves from an easier area, rank 3 leves from a higher difficulty area, rank 1 leves from an even more difficult area, and in a group you have the ability to mix up a ton of leves. In the party I mentioned I used 5 of my leve slots. Also after a leve we would hang around and kill monsters or travel back to a camp killing monsters and using our MP.
I think that people are just so close minded and can't experiment and make the system work for them. I don't understand why, but it is the case. 99% of the people I see whining about leves just jump on, solo them in an hour, then log out and probably don't even talk to anyone. If this is the only way you can play and all you can get out of the system then of course it isn't going to appeal to you. These aren't the type of players that this game is going to support and they aren't the type that would stay for longer than a week or two before making gross assumptions and nerd raging on forums because SE didn't give them a direct path from A-B where B is endgame like almost every MMO in the last 5 years. If that is the standard of the genre then F the genre.
if you chose to miss the point of my thread because of my spelling, thats your own business. As long as others here arent that thick headed and get it, im ok. Next time ill be sure not to type on my phone for your intellectual convenience.
You are either very disillusioned or just flat our not reading what I have said, and what many agree on me with.
If SE is going for 2 hours of great leveling every 48 hours as a "different style," then by golly they achieved it. I'm not going to type all of the other issues I have with XIV again, because, obviously, you're glossing over them and calling out the overused "adapt to new styles of gameplay."
I've been playing MMOs for close to 13 years now. I played FFXI before it even hit North America and was Japan only. I can adapt to new styles of gameplay, but the absolute atrocious mechanics that are in the game right now need an overhaul. Oh, what the hell, let me review them again. Combat is fine (except targetting with cure/buff spells -- literally impossible to do -- it doesn't let you unless you leave combat), but Leves are not fine at all (Crafting is fine for me once they fix the horrible delay with it.)
@Jadan's post - I hate to disregard something on the basis of spelling, but an entire post by a user that cannot properly type the word "the" and "this" needs to be retyped then resubmitted. Then I may take him or her seriously.
This just isn't WoW Cataclysm. It won't be race with your pre made guild to eighty five and then hit the dungeon an gear treadmill. I think we are talking a harder PvE curve for XIV where you have to think about how to play the levelling game on launch, and where PvE raiding is going to be patched in post-launch largely. The game is designed to make you linger over what is there rather than just try to blitz through to cap asap. It may be a litmus test for you...but if WoW is your game then I would skip XIV if you cannot easily tolerate anything else.Yeah good argument scro.
Mouse is bad, people that use them are tards, but you know they can still live kick ass lifes.
Honest its clear what FF14 is now, old skool mmorpgs. Which is great if thats what you want. I think all the wow haters, and people that don't like: stories, themepark, fluid combat, should all go play FF14; So i no longer have to hear them QQ on forums.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
And you're clearly not understanding what I'm saying. At all.
People that do or don't? Because XIV has all three things you listed.
I clearly understand what your saying and it rings to the tune of regardless of how much experience you claim to have from the past, unless this new MMO plays exactly how 'you' expect it too based on this silly industry standard BS, you must complain and bitch and whine about it. Not everyone in the world likes the same things, clearly, but most US & EU players seem to expect every developer to make new games that only applies to what they like...
Apparently you don't understand that fanboi or not, there are millions of players out there that accept what SE are doing and are perfectly fine with the controls and UI and leves as they are. Sure there could be some slight changes and improvements made to them eventually, which I'll still be fine with and adapt to them, but all-in-all they are fine to me and many others. And since nobody seems to believe anything one says here without fact backing it up, just read the new Famitsu ~ Gamescom interview where Komoto clearly says they have recieved very little feedback on the controls from the Japanese players ~ thus millions of other gamers just like myself.
* eagerly awaiting your return BS rant...rofl
And you're clearly not understanding what I'm saying. At all.
I just think we are different types of human being.*Returns BS rant*
I never said I hated the controls. I love them.
Anyways. Whether you like it or not, Leves are broken. Unless you have personally experienced the mechanic, your opinion has little value to me. Also, I've spoke with Japanese in-game, and they feel the same. Leves are completely broken. That's all I'm trying to say. Honestly have no idea why you keep throwing out other random tidbits like controls and UI when I said I was perfectly fine with them, minus crafting lag.
You call me a "fanboi" when all you're clearly doing is defending the game on every level. I enjoy the game, I'll buy the CE, but I stand by my opinion that the Leve mechanic is broken.
When I can solo a level 10<19 rank 5 (legion) Leve at level 16, something's wrong.
When I join up to party with friends for Leve quests, but half of mine dissappear because my friend activated his (and overlapping occured), something's wrong.
When most people log in for 1 hour a day, do some Leves then log out, something's wrong.
I'm in beta. I've been in beta for awhile. I'm just stating my opinion and telling you what's happening. If you have a problem with that, then I'm sorry. I honestly have no idea what your issue is with this.
Now, please, return with a post regarding Leves. Do not mention controls, UI, WoW, or whatever else. Return with a comment on Leves. And remember, I'm not saying I want to power level to cap. I'm just saying there's not enough leveling content (LEVELING. Remember, LEVELING CONTENT. Not CONTENT) to last for more than 2 hours a day max, in a group, wihout having to resort to grinding ala FFXI.
Thank you.
Edit: And to backup my problem with Leves, here is another tester who agrees with me: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/446/view/forums/post/3727438#3727438
Glad we understans each other.
After reading comments I think the long story short is that every1 is expecting some issues at release and that some people are worried about long run sucess while others aren't. There is nothing really o point counter point here. Some of the issues are real issues (lag in the controls. AH, etc etc) While other thing like the 48 hour cd no mana regen etc etc are just the way it is. No matter how much we argue here the fact is the devs made their choice and they are sticking with it for better or for worse.
Long story short is that some people can't look past their own expectations and see all of the greatness that is waiting within this title. They will screw themselves and continually go to clone after clone wondering how they lost that feeling that they once had not realizing that somewhere within FFXIV that massive deep rich adventurous experience is waiting for them.