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The good ol' days
tummbler
Member UncommonPosts: 267
man.. i watched a EQ memory film on one of the threads a few minutes ago and it really brought back some good memories..
i really wish there were just 1 or 2 major mmorpgs. that way everyone would be so much happier and there wouldnt be as many fanbois posting in a rival mmorpg's forum or a general mmorpg forum.
all these new mmorpgs are coming out, but its not the same.
they may have better graphics or maybe even more features..
its just not the same
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I watched the EQ movie also. I never played EQ, but the movie was great. Makes me kinda wish I could also be waxing nostalgic. I never tried EQ because I didn't like the graphics, but whoever made the movie put a whole lotta heart into it and it shows.
There is nothing wrong with getting emotional over past memories and experiences. The topic of this thread is "The good ol' days." What makes the good ol' days so emotional, is you don't realize how good they are until they are gone and you take the time to remember how great they were.
Its obvious you never played EQ I. If you had you would understand.
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Honestly, someone else nailed it. It is blatantly obvious that you never played EQ when it first came out. I have yet to experience that emotion again in any MMO. Stepping foot into EQ for the first time was amazing. Nothing like it existed online at the time. Nothing. It was amazing. And the friendships and relationships and all the FIRSTS that we experienced in that game will always be remembered.
I think those of us who were in the EQ Beta have even better memories than those who joined up before the expansions. Basically because we didn't have to deal with the whiners and griefers and the rough startup pains from the unexpected 200,000 users who hit the game on the first week it was out.
Even today there aren't many games out that give you the experience that EQ does.
Swimming in the ocean, going UNDER water for adventures. Seeing the tree city of Kelethin for the first time or visiting Erudin or the Oasis of Marr...
I remember my first trek through the Karanas when we didn't even know where we were going... Getting lost in Rathe mts and being terrified of those damn giants.
EQ set all the firsts for me. No other game will EVER have that 'oh my god' feeling. Even though I like SWG better EQ will always hold my fondest MMORPG memories because everything that was done was done first there. The friends I made there are still good friends to this day.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
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Um no... I never said I didn't like that EQ changed. I said that it brought back fond memories and it held all the real "firsts" in MMO's for me. UO didn't really do anything NEW in an RPG, after all it was pretty much the same as Ultima III and Ultima IV just online.
EQ did the NEW the WOW the OMG
All you are doing is being intentionally insulting. Grow up and realize that people remember things they did with old friends fondly.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
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UO didn't do anything NEW?!? How can you honestly say that? It bought together players from around the globe. It opened up a world as harsh and non-linear as the real one we lived in and it was so huge in it's scope. I mean before the bells and whistles of 3D graphics UO is all we had. And when I first arrived I was thrust in a world where I was not in control of.
Wanted to get cash? You had to figure out how to make items of value that you could sell to vendors/players. I remember heading out into the woods to find sheep to shear, then running back into town to find a spinning wheel to make bolts of cloth, then I had to sell enough rabbit meat to buy a sewing kit, so I could make a shirt and pants.
I remember running into a PKer and shooting off at the mouth, just to get killed and stripped of all my worldly possesions! I was so mad. But in order to get back at him I had to build my skills with the blade. I managed to scrape up enough money to by a cheap sword and found a old practice dummy. I swung and swung on tha dummy until I could not learn anymore.
Forced to find stronger prey I hunted bears, wolves and panthers until my swordsmanship grew. I started to feel proud of my accomplishments and looked for ways to improve my earnings. I'm sorry for rambling on about my memories, but I can't help it. UO struck a chord in me that no other MMO could hope to even achieve again. And when I hear others say it didn't change/do anything for the genre it kinda makes me feel like they are trying to cheapen the experiences I had.......
If it didnt have that effect for you then so be it, but please try not to make such broad statements about a game that put the MMO in MMORPG.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
I think you have missed a point here. Meridian 59 and UO came out before EQ and i'm sure if you ask the players of thouse games they'll argue over whos game is the best.
The point is everyones first MMO is always their best and they'll search all the other MMOs to try and replicate that experience, going from one to the other in an endless quest.
I think its important to remember that you'll never find that perfect MMO so force yourself to try games you thought would be boring, because you might just enjoy them. What i mean is just because you don't like a certain feature for a MMO like perma death, doesn't mean you shouldn't try the game.
I do have to agree that the EQ world is/was probably the best ever designed. You just have to look at the screenshots to see all the different variaties.
My personal faviourite was the underwater level near the estate of unrest. In some ways because of the massive penalties on dieing you were always on the edge in thouse types of places, and you seem to feel fear, etc. You were really connected to your character.
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UO didn't do anything NEW?!? How can you honestly say that? It bought together players from around the globe. It opened up a world as harsh and non-linear as the real one we lived in and it was so huge in it's scope. I mean before the bells and whistles of 3D graphics UO is all we had. And when I first arrived I was thrust in a world where I was not in control of.
Wanted to get cash? You had to figure out how to make items of value that you could sell to vendors/players. I remember heading out into the woods to find sheep to shear, then running back into town to find a spinning wheel to make bolts of cloth, then I had to sell enough rabbit meat to buy a sewing kit, so I could make a shirt and pants.
I remember running into a PKer and shooting off at the mouth, just to get killed and stripped of all my worldly possesions! I was so mad. But in order to get back at him I had to build my skills with the blade. I managed to scrape up enough money to by a cheap sword and found a old practice dummy. I swung and swung on tha dummy until I could not learn anymore.
Forced to find stronger prey I hunted bears, wolves and panthers until my swordsmanship grew. I started to feel proud of my accomplishments and looked for ways to improve my earnings. I'm sorry for rambling on about my memories, but I can't help it. UO struck a chord in me that no other MMO could hope to even achieve again. And when I hear others say it didn't change/do anything for the genre it kinda makes me feel like they are trying to cheapen the experiences I had.......
If it didnt have that effect for you then so be it, but please try not to make such broad statements about a game that put the MMO in MMORPG.
Did you ever play Ultima III?
Did you ever play Ultima IV?
All UO was was a blend of Ultima III and Ultima IV online and with PVP.
Yes it did all the things you said it did. But it didn't really do anything that the single player games didnt do. Well ok... the crafting and economy were new. I guess I have to give it that. But the gameplay wasn't anything really new. It was the same interface we'd always seen (which was GREAT for the time, don't get me wrong) it just wasn't ground breaking that way. The SKILL system was the same as in U3 and U4. I'm a HUGE fan of UO and have always said that if all a company did was take that exact game and make it into a 3D game it'd be a overnight hit. It was and is that good. The interface is dated is all. OLD UO not that new crap they have now.
The big NEW that UO brought was crafting. Which was excellently done, I'll grant that. And the economy was great as well. So yes, UO was relatively ground-breaking because it introduced crafting to the MMORPG universe and because of UO other games that came out were forced to implement crafting as well. SWG is the only game that tops UO in overall immersiveness in my opinion. I tend to think of SWG as the next generation of UO though I think they locked professions down a tad too much. I'm looking forward to the CURB in SWG because they're unlocking the skill trees and making it easier to customize your skillsets.
But the environment in EQ was so completely different from what we'd experienced before. 3D, New effects, beautiful (for the time) graphics, amazing vistas. I remember one day I just sat and watched the sunrise over the bridge in the Karanas.....
Anyway, yes UO brought a lot to the table, but mostly it was the crafting that was "new" to players. Those of us who'd always played Ultima weren't really surprised by the interface or the skill system. They were pretty much the same as they'd always been. Crafting an PVP was new.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
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Still in: A couple Betas
I think you have missed a point here. Meridian 59 and UO came out before EQ and i'm sure if you ask the players of thouse games they'll argue over whos game is the best.
The point is everyones first MMO is always their best and they'll search all the other MMOs to try and replicate that experience, going from one to the other in an endless quest.
I think its important to remember that you'll never find that perfect MMO so force yourself to try games you thought would be boring, because you might just enjoy them. What i mean is just because you don't like a certain feature for a MMO like perma death, doesn't mean you shouldn't try the game.
I do have to agree that the EQ world is/was probably the best ever designed. You just have to look at the screenshots to see all the different variaties.
My personal faviourite was the underwater level near the estate of unrest. In some ways because of the massive penalties on dieing you were always on the edge in thouse types of places, and you seem to feel fear, etc. You were really connected to your character.
JFYI:
I played M59
I also beta'd and played UO
And before them I played NWN on AOL and BattleTech on GEnie
And Tradewars and other games of that type before that on MPBBS's
Yes they were first.
But EQ broke ground they hadn't even dreamed of. I will always love UO I still log in occasionally on the free shards that are run old UO style. I don't pay for a subscription to the "real" UO any longer because it's just not worth 14 bucks a month (they're on crack). It is a fantastic skill system and crafting system. I think SWG has cracked that code and from what I've seen of the CURB the skill system in SWG is now ust as fun as UO's was. And even more customizable. Anyone who loved UO should really enjoy SWG unless they were rampant PK Griefers. Those folks should go play Shadowbane
M59 was merely a mud with graphics. Trust me, I designed and implemented enough Muds to know and one or two MUDS out there have GUI's that they've developed that compare very well with M59 in graphics quality. UO was Ultima 3/4 with Multiplayer and a really cool crafting system and PVP. EQ broke new ground in graphics quality, immersiveness and just plain "WOW" factor. I'm not saying those other games weren't great, They were or I wouldn't have played them (in UO's case I'm pushing my 8th year now). But EQ has more memories for me when I think back on significant events in my MMORPG life EQ comes to mind most often. Next is actually MPBT 3055 MUSE that I played back in the early 90's. Then UO Then BattleTech on the GEnie Network. Then DAOC..
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
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Sorry Elnator but you are missing my point....then you support it.
I'm not trying to knock your experiences, but at the time UO was working with what it had. Didn't do anything new you say?:
UO-Crafting system (Still unequal)
UO-Player-based economy
UO-PvP system (Still unequal)
UO-Skill based system (Completely open and MORE advanced than 3 or 4)
UO-Massive online aspect
UO-Player housing (Still unequal)
UO-Player pets/mounts (Still unequal)
UO-Profession system (Still unequal)
UO-Questing system (Escorts)
UO-Guild system
As a matter of fact for me I enjoy the skill based system over the level based one used in current MMOs (I love the way you title changed reflecting what your strengths were).EQ transformed the worldwe played in from 2D to 3D which further immersing the players.
UO just brought too much to the table to brush off as nothing new or not honoring it as a game that DEFINED how MMOs after it would model themselves. But I would never try to make your fond memories of EQ any less important than UO was to mine. I just hope you can return the gesture.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
UO-Crafting system (Still unequal) - SWG's is equal to, and in some ways better.
UO-Player-based economy - Been around sine MUDS began
UO-PvP system (Still unequal) - Dissagree, I like SWG's better
UO-Skill based system (Completely open and MORE advanced than 3 or 4) - Said I agreed. SWG is closest
UO-Massive online aspect - M59 some MUDS, NWN, MBPT, Solaris
UO-Player housing (Still unequal) - Actually SWG is better imo.
UO-Player pets/mounts (Still unequal) - Dissagree... multiple games have player pets and mounts. Different but I'd say equal.
UO-Profession system (Still unequal) - Actually SWG is comparable but yes I agreed with you
UO-Questing system (Escorts) - Numerous MUDS had this.
UO-Guild system - Every MUD/MUSE and even M59 had this
Summary: I agree but I dissagree
UO had 1 thing it REALLY added: Crafting
And to a lesser extent: Pets
And the Skill system was good too. And, as we agree, has yet to be equalled but it's not NEW every UO game ever written had this skill system. They just incorporated it to the online game.
And, as I said in my original post: These are MY opinions. Others may differ
But my response to this thread is fact.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
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i played Ultima 4 and i really, REALLY cannot remember rising my skill by using sword. it was level based.
So nope.... UO and U IV were quite different.
But this is beside the point. 'Cause i could tell you, Elnator, that EQ did nothing new as well. it is a Diku-MUD. just with a graphic interface and a quite vast world (but then some Muds, like AVatar Mud , have as huge a world if not bigger as writing texts and creating 3D graphics do not exactly amount in the same time categories). Happy now?
Let's stop it already. UO and EQ were BOTH groundbreaking. Who cares which one was first? or most succesfull? Fact is without Lord British and McQuaid, the Mmorpg era might have never happened... or would have happened years in the future.
Also, yes, first experiences are remembered vividly, but let's try to look forward, not backward. It seems to me to hear those old people we always are told about "at my times...... everything was better/younger/more perfumed..."
So, end of the line, treasure your memories but do not make an hinderance of them. those times are gone and if you can't let them go, you will never enjoy a Mmorpg again.
I frankly prefer the latter to the former.
Have a nice day.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
It's obvious that you are stroking a ego far bigger than I made you out to have. Admitting that UO brought so much more new to the table than you would have others believe, is obviously a hard pill for you to swallow. So I'll leave you with this:
On my list of new and innovating things that UO introduced to the gaming masses, 60% of those things you listed that you disagree with are from a game released 9+ years after it.......Mind you I have no quarms with you disagreeing with my opinions, but if you are going to argue a point try to stay focused. UO may not have WOWed, NEWed or OMGed you as it did me, but then again back then PCs were a luxury few could afford in the "good ol' days". So when I did get one and I played UO, my senses were blown away.
***And for the records MUDs were very limited in the amount of players that could participte at one time, UO broke that barrier and added the term MASSIVE to MMO making it the first to truely do so.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion.cfm/load/forums/loadforum/141/loadthread/37681/setstart/1/loadclass/41
Sorry no, I'm not the one that came onto a thread about the good old days of EQ and how it brought back fond memories and started saying "just play this". I merely pointed out why people who have fond memories of EQ do so. Then you started yapping about how no other games came first. So I responded that if we went to that point there were games long before UO or M59 that did those same things too. It's an endless arguement. Hell if you want to look at the genesis of MMO's? Look no further than 1973 and Dungeons And Dragons. That, my friends, is where it all started.
The point is this: While UO was awesome, as I said, I still play it. For me, and those who fondly recollect EQ, EQ was the more memorable.
I am not the one stroking my ego. I didn't come here and say EQ was the best at this or the best at that just that it was the first to build a truely impressive online world taht made *ME* (and others) go.... WOW... OMG... and it left an impression. For me? And most of my friends? It was an impression greater than UO did. Yes, I loved (and still do) UO. I came right out and said that. And yes, UO brought a lot to the table.
But the bottom line is that FOR ME and FOR OTHERS IN THIS THREAD EQ is where their truely impressive memories lie. I have fond memories about UO too... this thread wasn't about UO though, now was it? It was about EQ.
*I* am not the one that started yapping about a different MMO on this thread. I merely explained why I remember EQ so fondly. You remember UO fondly, that's fine, I have no beef with it. But kindly have the decency to realize that some of us found UO to be fun and exciting but didn't have much of a WOW factor for us because we'd been playing similar games since we were kids. And, face it, on the surface UO didn't feel all that different from the Ultima games. Which, imo, was it's greatest strength. It took a familliar setting, stuck it online with thousands of people, and managed to maintain the Ultima feel.
As I said, it's fine if you have fond memories from other games. I was merely pointing out why I, and others, have fond memories of EQ first and foremost.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
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Still in: A couple Betas