They're working on making it find gear on other players (and good thing, too, it's currently a real PITA). However, as pertains to high lvl characters with low level gear, that's working as intended, and where's why:
Each character only has 80 slots (probably more later) and retainers with 80 slots.
Sooner or later they're going to outlevel their gear.
Things crafted will stick around forever (repairs bring them back to 100%)
Nothing is bind on wear in this game.
The game has only been launched for about a week - it will stay around for years.
Put that altogether, and it should be clear that what's going on is we're looking at the early stages of an economy where there will be a ton of hand-me-downs later, we'll soon be up to our ears in available gear, but seeing how we're here at the early stages of the thing there will be a severe shortage in the meanwhile.
Originally posted by Ikkei
Originally posted by Renoaku
Looking this stuff up online, not being able to ALT + TAB from the game is stupid.
I SO agree with that.
Objection!
You can alt-tab the game just fine, you just need to be willing to play the game windowed.
Probably has been said already but I'll repeat it. FFXIV just launched it's Early Start. How can you expect the game to have a steady economy with a decent amount of ressources to make gears, and players to create a trade area, when everyone is just starting.
It will take a while, possibly another month or two before the economy stabilizes.
I really don't know what folks want in a MMO game anymore.
People complain about too much questing, too much grinding, too much solo, too much interdependence, too much casual. (not specific to FF14 but MMO in general.)
There isn't any reason to complain about what FF14 is not or does not have. Pick another game that you enjoy playing. *sigh* I can't say anything that hasn't been said I guess...
The game is different, it is flawed and it is not terrible. You know if I hate Honda's it doesn't make Honda a bad car, it just means I should not buy one.
For me so far FF14 has been about the character I created - the story isn't really there yet but the develoment of this character I started at "Create Character" is. It's ok for me that I still have lvl 1 gear, still able to kill things current level. The economy is still forming and being created. People are learning the systems and determining what works and what does not.
When it comes to gear I see no point in spending 12K on a copper ring - as I suspect others feel the same. This will affect supply and demand and lower price levels. Already seeing it a bit from first couple days.
Perhaps FF14 is a half experience and not an encompassing MMORPG. For awhile I thought that was awful, "what were they thinking?". However, the gameplay has grown on me I don't feel rushed to hit level 20, level 30, level 35 - become afraid of end game or the lack of it as I approach those levels.
The game has challenge, and I don't mean controls but of course those are a challenge in themselves. The challenge is to the player - you are challenged to become successful, challenged to meet and depend on people for things you can't (easily) get on your own. Now whether the gameplay is fun to you is a different question.
For the OP - if you don't enjoy it stop playing. It is ok, though I understand how it can be if you really wanted to like this game. Rather than "just playing because it's new"
The game is a game - let it be one already. Like Bejeweled is a game, Halo is a game, Limbo is a game, Forza, Dragon Quest... Fallout.
Looking this stuff up online, not being able to ALT + TAB from the game is stupid.
I SO agree with that.
Objection!
You can alt-tab the game just fine, you just need to be willing to play the game windowed.
I don't know if this has changed since OB, but in windowed mode you couldn't leave the window out of focus for too long (5 or 10 minutes), or else you experienced a DX crash. So much for taking the time to browse websites while prep'ing coffee. : )
And honestly, I don't like playing in windowed mode via a weird borderless script (nor can I feel immersed with windows borders apparent). I simply expect more of a 2010 windows piece of software.
But let's forget about it, I have two laptops so I don't really care. I guess it was just the top of the UI (User Iceberg) that put me off when I first discovered the game in June--that Alt+Tab cost me a leve back then. Good thing you can start'em over now.
I'm sorry to hear you have a limited understanding of the economy of games at release. The game is about 7 days old now, who is going to have good gear?
I get what they are going for, but how the hell am I supposed to find what i need from hundreds of retainers spread across dozens of market instances? Before I die of old age, I mean.
I have no idea who is selling what...no one is shouting what they are selling, and if they did, I wouldn't be able to read the chat because of all the spam!
Imagine if no stores had signs or names that meant anything. Nothing to tell you if its a grocery store, a hardware store, car parts, pet food, adult videos, etc...imagine how frustrating it would be to shop for ANYTHING!? THAT is what we are currently working with lol Instead of stores, we have piñata's because you have no idea what's inside!!
I get that they are trying to capture more of a real-world economic system here...but in the real world, companies advertise what they are selling. Hell, people used to make a living shopping the market to assess the current value of items, before the internet, of course. HELL, at least real stores have names and markets they cater to...
Buy Low and Sell high is a great concept...but who the hell has the time in FFXIV...it takes HOURS to shop the retainers of one city, and by the time you are done, the instances you just walked though have had new retainers added to them.
It's INSANE!
Give me a Giant Flea market with a fixed number of NPC vendors that sell my stuff via consignment. AT least then If I want my high level toon to have good armor, i shop the armor NPC's in the Market district.
Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone www.spankybus.com -3d Artist & Compositor -Writer -Professional Amature
Looking this stuff up online, not being able to ALT + TAB from the game is stupid.
I SO agree with that.
Objection!
You can alt-tab the game just fine, you just need to be willing to play the game windowed.
I don't know if this has changed since OB, but in windowed mode you couldn't leave the window out of focus for too long (5 or 10 minutes), or else you experienced a DX crash. So much for taking the time to browse websites while prep'ing coffee. : )
I had that happen once or twice in open beta, but not in release, so perhaps it was solved.
Am I the only one that's seeing a lot of players wearing equipment that's a much higher optimal rank than their actual rank? I'm seeing R12 glads in R17 to R42 gear (the swords). Hell, in two days, assuming I sell the armor I made, I'll be able to buy R27 bronze leggings from another crafting for my R10 gladiator.
There are tons of players in the more teen level harnesses and subligars, dodoskin leather armors (gloves and thigh boots), players with much higher ranked weapon and armors. Not to say that's the most common, but I wouldn't call "high level toon with low level gear" a pattern - or I could very well be seeing things x_x I play on Besaid, by the way.
Also, I agree with the current system and layout, the wards truely suck. And frankly, I've had better luck browsing the crafter's personal bazaars in the crafting hotspots of each city. That's how I finally managed to find my dodo leather straps for shields at a reasonable price along with sword grips, swordguards, etc for sword crafting. I haven't really found anything in the actual wards besides the occasional armor, though I do most of my actual selling there.
But honestly, I'd absolutely hate an AH/Broker. I'm positive I would have never found the deals I found through actual players with an AH, as those things would have been bought out and reposted for sale by those that do nothing but watch the AH trends.
okay so let me get this straight in your head because i want you to understand this: you play a mmorpg like a poster said a page or 2 before get in a linkshell help your other people out and they will do the same. there is absolutely no reason whatsoever not to team up with people.
I believe a recent interview with the Devs had one of them state that they are currently working on a categorization system for Market Wards to avoid this problem. Its quite rampant over their forums.
Also, Unlike WoW and other easy MMOs, being in tune with the community is a MUST. Get in a linkshell or something. Things get much easier when you have communication or branches of contacts. Like Eve, If you dont have others with you, you aint got nothing... Except FFXIV has that to a lesser degree.
I believe a recent interview with the Devs had one of them state that they are currently working on a categorization system for Market Wards to avoid this problem. Its quite rampant over their forums.
Also, Unlike WoW and other easy MMOs, being in tune with the community is a MUST. Get in a linkshell or something. Things get much easier when you have communication or branches of contacts. Like Eve, If you dont have others with you, you aint got nothing... Except FFXIV has that to a lesser degree.
Which is one of the reasons I seldom bother with games that "encourage" grouping these days. Given the Japanese culture and traditions, its hardly surprising what their focus tends to be. But this isn't Japan, nor am I interested in collectivist focus games any more. By the way, I've been in EVE for around 4.5 years now. Its a good game, and I quite enjoy aspects of it, but I'm still in SWA(NPC corp) and with around 40 million skill points, I'd hardly term that "nothing"... ^^ Granted some of the old timers have more than 100 million, but thats to be expected.
I believe a recent interview with the Devs had one of them state that they are currently working on a categorization system for Market Wards to avoid this problem. Its quite rampant over their forums.
Also, Unlike WoW and other easy MMOs, being in tune with the community is a MUST. Get in a linkshell or something. Things get much easier when you have communication or branches of contacts. Like Eve, If you dont have others with you, you aint got nothing... Except FFXIV has that to a lesser degree.
Which is one of the reasons I seldom bother with games that "encourage" grouping these days. Given the Japanese culture and traditions, its hardly surprising what their focus tends to be. But this isn't Japan, nor am I interested in collectivist focus games any more. By the way, I've been in EVE for around 4.5 years now. Its a good game, and I quite enjoy aspects of it, but I'm still in SWA(NPC corp) and with around 40 million skill points, I'd hardly term that "nothing"... ^^ Granted some of the old timers have more than 100 million, but thats to be expected.
Thats quite the feat, especially 4.5 years on your own. Although when i mean by "nothing", it is in comparison to some of the corps out there with player owned space in 0 sec, your quite small. However with your skill set you could probably equal a small portion of the smaller corps in low sec. I hope you continue to Enjoy Eve. My Eve "itch" pops up time and time again, I just renew my account and scratch it for a month and let it set. The market really hooks me with that game.
FFXIV is trying a similar set up, but is having a hard time getting it's head around how to make the whole market acessable since its so freaking huge.
As for culture, Japan has a culture that revolved around groups while American culture revolved around the individual... As you had stated. Its kinda why we also have "Western" styled/categorized games and gameplay. Its weird how much culture can affect a game. Interesting line of thought.
It will get easier to craft as supply increases and as they make Markets searchable which they're planning on doing in a week or two.
But that has a downside too. There's not many people currently that have the connections to make decent level stuff (you need other crafters help unless you're a full time crafter). That means they get to set prices (high of course!) and can currently make a killing selling stuff because there is so little finished gear available.
As for me, I have almost all my level-appropriate gear for my THA mage. I made the cowl, pants and gloves myself. A crafter in my LS made my sceptor when I brought him mats. A different member from the Crafting LS I made is going to make me some boots in exchange for socks I can make.
It's just plain fun making your own stuff. If you just want to level one job and rush through the game, this isn't the one for you and there's various ways the game will penalize you for attempting to do it, lack of gear being one of them. But if you take your time and network and meet people and trade, you will do well and if you enjoy interacting with other human beings (this is an online game after all), you will have fun as well.
Ok, well here is how this game is really working right now, not how most feel it is. Behind the scenes for beginners.
I am currently in 4 linkshells with my character (working on getting in more every chance I get).
One of my linkshells is a hardcore adventuring progression type linkshell, they go out all the time to do levequests all over the place. Most of them are already past physical level 20 and main class over 15. They have maybe 2-3 sub classes but thats it. A Majority of them make decent money daily, which they spend on the best gear they can find or have made for them - and the repairs on this nice gear (which can be steep if its higher level than your income can support at your leveling range). They dont craft much, dabble at best. This linkshell is my 'demand' customer.
My Second linkshell is a more casual in style, they spend more time socializing, more of a half and half mix of adventurer types and a casual crafting/gathering crew that craft to sell and help thier mates when they can afford to. They all want to progess, but aren't in a hurry. This linkshell is also a 'demand' customer.
My third linkshell is a pure RP crew, tons of fun to be around, but kind of in the middle of the first two. Not 100% progress dedicated, not 100% casual 'whenever' either. They do have a more dedicated gatherer forcus than the first two however, which is good for me. This linkshell is a 'supply' customer.
And my fourth linkshell is the one I concider my main linkshell, its a crafter/gatherer only one. We all spend our time working together in a combined effort to craft for ourselves, others in our linkshell, and for our customers. We all have our off linkshells that we monitor for 'people with needs' and we take orders from them when they need something. We then work together to make the items. Place an order with our gatherers who go out and get our raw materials, which we pay very well for thier time. We make what parts we can and get our linkshell mates to make the parts we are missing, again paying them very well for thier efforts. And finally finish the order and deliver it to our 'demand customer' in one of our other linkshells. Most times there are 20-30 people on all the time in this linkshell, we laugh, have tons of fun, and make a pretty good business for ourselves. And we are but only one crafting linkshell out there.
Now take all this and imagine it accross 15, 30, 50 crafting/gathering linkshell 'hubs' on a single server. Each hub member being in 5-10 more 'customer' linkshells as thier 'crafter guru' (what they dont know wont hurt them). Just look at how your marketing/crafter economy grows and works. It's not supposed to work like WoW does, your not supposed to make your stuff and sell it all yourself on an AH. You work together in a social economic envirornment. Supply and demand. The customer has a need, places and order directly with the manufacturer, who then places an order with thier supplier who goes out and makes the components, who in turn hits up thier suppliers who go out and gather the raw materials. In the end the hardcore adventurer gets his shiney new whatever and never had to step foot in the markets to get it. The crafter made his profit and skill, the other crafters made thier money and skill, and the gatherer got to wander around for hours and get his money and skill. Everyone is happy.
You really have to just STOP trying to make this game function like other games, because it doesn't have to. It works perfect as it is if you give it a try. There is a reason they give you access to 10 dfifferent linkshells in this game instead of one guild like in other games. Just stop thinking linear, join more than one linkshell, you do NOT need to be only in one. You want to be an adventurer AND take time out occassionally to gather for orders, then by all means ask to join a crafters hub linkshell as one of your 10. You dont have to do it all the time, but one day you may hear someone in there asking for a stack of dodo skins and you have them in yoru pack - easy sell. Not only that, everyone might just make some friends, become part of the community, the world.
Oh and why is all this on-topic for this thread you might ask? Well simple, if your do this, you wont be level 10 wearing level 1 gear. You wont be spending days browsing market retainers for that ONE thing your looking for. You might just be having fun instead of trying to force the world to bend to your awesomeness and getting kickback at every turn.
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
Ok, well here is how this game is really working right now, not how most feel it is. Behind the scenes for beginners.
I am currently in 4 linkshells with my character (working on getting in more every chance I get).
One of my linkshells is a hardcore adventuring progression type linkshell, they go out all the time to do levequests all over the place. Most of them are already past physical level 20 and main class over 15. They have maybe 2-3 sub classes but thats it. A Majority of them make decent money daily, which they spend on the best gear they can find or have made for them - and the repairs on this nice gear (which can be steep if its higher level than your income can support at your leveling range). They dont craft much, dabble at best. This linkshell is my 'demand' customer.
My Second linkshell is a more casual in style, they spend more time socializing, more of a half and half mix of adventurer types and a casual crafting/gathering crew that craft to sell and help thier mates when they can afford to. They all want to progess, but aren't in a hurry. This linkshell is also a 'demand' customer.
My third linkshell is a pure RP crew, tons of fun to be around, but kind of in the middle of the first two. Not 100% progress dedicated, not 100% casual 'whenever' either. They do have a more dedicated gatherer forcus than the first two however, which is good for me. This linkshell is a 'supply' customer.
And my fourth linkshell is the one I concider my main linkshell, its a crafter/gatherer only one. We all spend our time working together in a combined effort to craft for ourselves, others in our linkshell, and for our customers. We all have our off linkshells that we monitor for 'people with needs' and we take orders from them when they need something. We then work together to make the items. Place an order with our gatherers who go out and get our raw materials, which we pay very well for thier time. We make what parts we can and get our linkshell mates to make the parts we are missing, again paying them very well for thier efforts. And finally finish the order and deliver it to our 'demand customer' in one of our other linkshells. Most times there are 20-30 people on all the time in this linkshell, we laugh, have tons of fun, and make a pretty good business for ourselves. And we are but only one crafting linkshell out there.
Now take all this and imagine it accross 15, 30, 50 crafting/gathering linkshell 'hubs' on a single server. Each hub member being in 5-10 more 'customer' linkshells as thier 'crafter guru' (what they dont know wont hurt them). Just look at how your marketing/crafter economy grows and works. It's not supposed to work like WoW does, your not supposed to make your stuff and sell it all yourself on an AH. You work together in a social economic envirornment. Supply and demand. The customer has a need, places and order directly with the manufacturer, who then places an order with thier supplier who goes out and makes the components, who in turn hits up thier suppliers who go out and gather the raw materials. In the end the hardcore adventurer gets his shiney new whatever and never had to step foot in the markets to get it. The crafter made his profit and skill, the other crafters made thier money and skill, and the gatherer got to wander around for hours and get his money and skill. Everyone is happy.
You really have to just STOP trying to make this game function like other games, because it doesn't have to. It works perfect as it is if you give it a try. There is a reason they give you access to 10 dfifferent linkshells in this game instead of one guild like in other games. Just stop thinking linear, join more than one linkshell, you do NOT need to be only in one. You want to be an adventurer AND take time out occassionally to gather for orders, then by all means ask to join a crafters hub linkshell as one of your 10. You dont have to do it all the time, but one day you may hear someone in there asking for a stack of dodo skins and you have them in yoru pack - easy sell. Not only that, everyone might just make some friends, become part of the community, the world.
Oh and why is all this on-topic for this thread you might ask? Well simple, if your do this, you wont be level 10 wearing level 1 gear. You wont be spending days browsing market retainers for that ONE thing your looking for. You might just be having fun instead of trying to force the world to bend to your awesomeness and getting kickback at every turn.
This sums up how the game actually works very well, although you seem to be doing better than me because I'm only in 2 linkshells (one for crafting and one general) hehe.
The game should be judged on whether or not what you describe is fun to the individual person, because this really is the game. If you're not into socializing and networking and working with others, than it's just not going to work for you, and that's fine, it's really not going to be for everybody. But if you come on here after playing the game for 10 hours and not even joining a single linkshell and call the game a giant turd, then you're not being fair, because you haven't even seen the "real" game.
For people like me, this game is totally amazing. I've been looking for an MMORPG with a focus on socializing and player interaction (beyond pwning face) basically since I started playing mmorpgs 10 years ago, and here it is, finally. I keep trying to explain why this game is intricate and interesting to me, but I don't think I've done as well myself as it is described in this quoted post by Kaocan.
Ok, well here is how this game is really working right now, not how most feel it is. Behind the scenes for beginners.
Good piece of information/advice. Thanks.
So if I'm reading this correctly you can choose to be a pure adventurer type and leave the crafting to someone else.
You can sure if thats yoru thing, one of my linkshells is pretty much just that. But I will warn you, they make and spend tons of cash to be that way. Your repair costs are going to hit you hard fast, especially if you dont pick up some crafter friends to help your out there. And those repair costs from the NPC will go up even faster the better your gear gets.
But yeah sure, if all you want to do is adventure, you can join a nice hardcore linkshell and hit the levequests and dungeons when your able. Hell I'm all for it, another customer for me, and more money in mah pocket. Hardcore adventurer only people spend good.
"Well come on over, check out my wares! You like shiney ? Oh that looks GREAT on you, you should buy it. Why sure you can afford it, besides nobody else has one of those yet, you will be the first! *wink wink*"
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
A game that has crafting as a major component....has no auction house or broker services? O.o So is this like the typical Asian style game where you have to set up a "fruit stand," so to speak, in town and just sit there and try to sell things, or what?
That seems utterly impractical and archaic. I'm sorry.
A game that has crafting as a major component....has no auction house or broker services? O.o So is this like the typical Asian style game where you have to set up a "fruit stand," so to speak, in town and just sit there and try to sell things, or what?
That seems utterly impractical and archaic. I'm sorry.
Yes this game has no AH but this decision was based on past experince of FF mmo. Also, AH will be implemented just not immediately after release. SE is giving us a search function in a week or two. For now you can use retainers to sell stuff in market wards or you can paddle your own ware.
Retainers work fine for me. i sell everything i put in there.
Comments
They're working on making it find gear on other players (and good thing, too, it's currently a real PITA). However, as pertains to high lvl characters with low level gear, that's working as intended, and where's why:
Each character only has 80 slots (probably more later) and retainers with 80 slots.
Sooner or later they're going to outlevel their gear.
Things crafted will stick around forever (repairs bring them back to 100%)
Nothing is bind on wear in this game.
The game has only been launched for about a week - it will stay around for years.
Put that altogether, and it should be clear that what's going on is we're looking at the early stages of an economy where there will be a ton of hand-me-downs later, we'll soon be up to our ears in available gear, but seeing how we're here at the early stages of the thing there will be a severe shortage in the meanwhile.
Objection!
You can alt-tab the game just fine, you just need to be willing to play the game windowed.
Probably has been said already but I'll repeat it. FFXIV just launched it's Early Start. How can you expect the game to have a steady economy with a decent amount of ressources to make gears, and players to create a trade area, when everyone is just starting.
It will take a while, possibly another month or two before the economy stabilizes.
I really don't know what folks want in a MMO game anymore.
People complain about too much questing, too much grinding, too much solo, too much interdependence, too much casual. (not specific to FF14 but MMO in general.)
There isn't any reason to complain about what FF14 is not or does not have. Pick another game that you enjoy playing. *sigh* I can't say anything that hasn't been said I guess...
The game is different, it is flawed and it is not terrible. You know if I hate Honda's it doesn't make Honda a bad car, it just means I should not buy one.
For me so far FF14 has been about the character I created - the story isn't really there yet but the develoment of this character I started at "Create Character" is. It's ok for me that I still have lvl 1 gear, still able to kill things current level. The economy is still forming and being created. People are learning the systems and determining what works and what does not.
When it comes to gear I see no point in spending 12K on a copper ring - as I suspect others feel the same. This will affect supply and demand and lower price levels. Already seeing it a bit from first couple days.
Perhaps FF14 is a half experience and not an encompassing MMORPG. For awhile I thought that was awful, "what were they thinking?". However, the gameplay has grown on me I don't feel rushed to hit level 20, level 30, level 35 - become afraid of end game or the lack of it as I approach those levels.
The game has challenge, and I don't mean controls but of course those are a challenge in themselves. The challenge is to the player - you are challenged to become successful, challenged to meet and depend on people for things you can't (easily) get on your own. Now whether the gameplay is fun to you is a different question.
For the OP - if you don't enjoy it stop playing. It is ok, though I understand how it can be if you really wanted to like this game. Rather than "just playing because it's new"
The game is a game - let it be one already. Like Bejeweled is a game, Halo is a game, Limbo is a game, Forza, Dragon Quest... Fallout.
I don't know if this has changed since OB, but in windowed mode you couldn't leave the window out of focus for too long (5 or 10 minutes), or else you experienced a DX crash. So much for taking the time to browse websites while prep'ing coffee. : )
And honestly, I don't like playing in windowed mode via a weird borderless script (nor can I feel immersed with windows borders apparent). I simply expect more of a 2010 windows piece of software.
But let's forget about it, I have two laptops so I don't really care. I guess it was just the top of the UI (User Iceberg) that put me off when I first discovered the game in June--that Alt+Tab cost me a leve back then. Good thing you can start'em over now.
I'm sorry to hear you have a limited understanding of the economy of games at release. The game is about 7 days old now, who is going to have good gear?
reminds me when i was walking in bone armor and realized i was better off without it.
Hmm, as in UO Bone Armor?
TBH, the Bazzar system as it stands now, sucks.
I get what they are going for, but how the hell am I supposed to find what i need from hundreds of retainers spread across dozens of market instances? Before I die of old age, I mean.
I have no idea who is selling what...no one is shouting what they are selling, and if they did, I wouldn't be able to read the chat because of all the spam!
Imagine if no stores had signs or names that meant anything. Nothing to tell you if its a grocery store, a hardware store, car parts, pet food, adult videos, etc...imagine how frustrating it would be to shop for ANYTHING!? THAT is what we are currently working with lol Instead of stores, we have piñata's because you have no idea what's inside!!
I get that they are trying to capture more of a real-world economic system here...but in the real world, companies advertise what they are selling. Hell, people used to make a living shopping the market to assess the current value of items, before the internet, of course. HELL, at least real stores have names and markets they cater to...
Buy Low and Sell high is a great concept...but who the hell has the time in FFXIV...it takes HOURS to shop the retainers of one city, and by the time you are done, the instances you just walked though have had new retainers added to them.
It's INSANE!
Give me a Giant Flea market with a fixed number of NPC vendors that sell my stuff via consignment. AT least then If I want my high level toon to have good armor, i shop the armor NPC's in the Market district.
Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone
www.spankybus.com
-3d Artist & Compositor
-Writer
-Professional Amature
I had that happen once or twice in open beta, but not in release, so perhaps it was solved.
Am I the only one that's seeing a lot of players wearing equipment that's a much higher optimal rank than their actual rank? I'm seeing R12 glads in R17 to R42 gear (the swords). Hell, in two days, assuming I sell the armor I made, I'll be able to buy R27 bronze leggings from another crafting for my R10 gladiator.
There are tons of players in the more teen level harnesses and subligars, dodoskin leather armors (gloves and thigh boots), players with much higher ranked weapon and armors. Not to say that's the most common, but I wouldn't call "high level toon with low level gear" a pattern - or I could very well be seeing things x_x I play on Besaid, by the way.
Also, I agree with the current system and layout, the wards truely suck. And frankly, I've had better luck browsing the crafter's personal bazaars in the crafting hotspots of each city. That's how I finally managed to find my dodo leather straps for shields at a reasonable price along with sword grips, swordguards, etc for sword crafting. I haven't really found anything in the actual wards besides the occasional armor, though I do most of my actual selling there.
But honestly, I'd absolutely hate an AH/Broker. I'm positive I would have never found the deals I found through actual players with an AH, as those things would have been bought out and reposted for sale by those that do nothing but watch the AH trends.
aw man! I really like the insta-quit option
okay so let me get this straight in your head because i want you to understand this: you play a mmorpg like a poster said a page or 2 before get in a linkshell help your other people out and they will do the same. there is absolutely no reason whatsoever not to team up with people.
and for gear what you will be looking for:
http://www.eorzeapedia.com/wiki/en/Category:Armor
I believe a recent interview with the Devs had one of them state that they are currently working on a categorization system for Market Wards to avoid this problem. Its quite rampant over their forums.
Also, Unlike WoW and other easy MMOs, being in tune with the community is a MUST. Get in a linkshell or something. Things get much easier when you have communication or branches of contacts. Like Eve, If you dont have others with you, you aint got nothing... Except FFXIV has that to a lesser degree.
Which is one of the reasons I seldom bother with games that "encourage" grouping these days. Given the Japanese culture and traditions, its hardly surprising what their focus tends to be. But this isn't Japan, nor am I interested in collectivist focus games any more. By the way, I've been in EVE for around 4.5 years now. Its a good game, and I quite enjoy aspects of it, but I'm still in SWA(NPC corp) and with around 40 million skill points, I'd hardly term that "nothing"... ^^ Granted some of the old timers have more than 100 million, but thats to be expected.
Faction leve's drop very nice gear upon completion, arguably better than crafted gear i've seen.
Just throwing it out there, since no one else seemed to have mentioned it. :P
Thats quite the feat, especially 4.5 years on your own. Although when i mean by "nothing", it is in comparison to some of the corps out there with player owned space in 0 sec, your quite small. However with your skill set you could probably equal a small portion of the smaller corps in low sec. I hope you continue to Enjoy Eve. My Eve "itch" pops up time and time again, I just renew my account and scratch it for a month and let it set. The market really hooks me with that game.
FFXIV is trying a similar set up, but is having a hard time getting it's head around how to make the whole market acessable since its so freaking huge.
As for culture, Japan has a culture that revolved around groups while American culture revolved around the individual... As you had stated. Its kinda why we also have "Western" styled/categorized games and gameplay. Its weird how much culture can affect a game. Interesting line of thought.
It will get easier to craft as supply increases and as they make Markets searchable which they're planning on doing in a week or two.
But that has a downside too. There's not many people currently that have the connections to make decent level stuff (you need other crafters help unless you're a full time crafter). That means they get to set prices (high of course!) and can currently make a killing selling stuff because there is so little finished gear available.
As for me, I have almost all my level-appropriate gear for my THA mage. I made the cowl, pants and gloves myself. A crafter in my LS made my sceptor when I brought him mats. A different member from the Crafting LS I made is going to make me some boots in exchange for socks I can make.
It's just plain fun making your own stuff. If you just want to level one job and rush through the game, this isn't the one for you and there's various ways the game will penalize you for attempting to do it, lack of gear being one of them. But if you take your time and network and meet people and trade, you will do well and if you enjoy interacting with other human beings (this is an online game after all), you will have fun as well.
Ok, well here is how this game is really working right now, not how most feel it is. Behind the scenes for beginners.
I am currently in 4 linkshells with my character (working on getting in more every chance I get).
One of my linkshells is a hardcore adventuring progression type linkshell, they go out all the time to do levequests all over the place. Most of them are already past physical level 20 and main class over 15. They have maybe 2-3 sub classes but thats it. A Majority of them make decent money daily, which they spend on the best gear they can find or have made for them - and the repairs on this nice gear (which can be steep if its higher level than your income can support at your leveling range). They dont craft much, dabble at best. This linkshell is my 'demand' customer.
My Second linkshell is a more casual in style, they spend more time socializing, more of a half and half mix of adventurer types and a casual crafting/gathering crew that craft to sell and help thier mates when they can afford to. They all want to progess, but aren't in a hurry. This linkshell is also a 'demand' customer.
My third linkshell is a pure RP crew, tons of fun to be around, but kind of in the middle of the first two. Not 100% progress dedicated, not 100% casual 'whenever' either. They do have a more dedicated gatherer forcus than the first two however, which is good for me. This linkshell is a 'supply' customer.
And my fourth linkshell is the one I concider my main linkshell, its a crafter/gatherer only one. We all spend our time working together in a combined effort to craft for ourselves, others in our linkshell, and for our customers. We all have our off linkshells that we monitor for 'people with needs' and we take orders from them when they need something. We then work together to make the items. Place an order with our gatherers who go out and get our raw materials, which we pay very well for thier time. We make what parts we can and get our linkshell mates to make the parts we are missing, again paying them very well for thier efforts. And finally finish the order and deliver it to our 'demand customer' in one of our other linkshells. Most times there are 20-30 people on all the time in this linkshell, we laugh, have tons of fun, and make a pretty good business for ourselves. And we are but only one crafting linkshell out there.
Now take all this and imagine it accross 15, 30, 50 crafting/gathering linkshell 'hubs' on a single server. Each hub member being in 5-10 more 'customer' linkshells as thier 'crafter guru' (what they dont know wont hurt them). Just look at how your marketing/crafter economy grows and works. It's not supposed to work like WoW does, your not supposed to make your stuff and sell it all yourself on an AH. You work together in a social economic envirornment. Supply and demand. The customer has a need, places and order directly with the manufacturer, who then places an order with thier supplier who goes out and makes the components, who in turn hits up thier suppliers who go out and gather the raw materials. In the end the hardcore adventurer gets his shiney new whatever and never had to step foot in the markets to get it. The crafter made his profit and skill, the other crafters made thier money and skill, and the gatherer got to wander around for hours and get his money and skill. Everyone is happy.
You really have to just STOP trying to make this game function like other games, because it doesn't have to. It works perfect as it is if you give it a try. There is a reason they give you access to 10 dfifferent linkshells in this game instead of one guild like in other games. Just stop thinking linear, join more than one linkshell, you do NOT need to be only in one. You want to be an adventurer AND take time out occassionally to gather for orders, then by all means ask to join a crafters hub linkshell as one of your 10. You dont have to do it all the time, but one day you may hear someone in there asking for a stack of dodo skins and you have them in yoru pack - easy sell. Not only that, everyone might just make some friends, become part of the community, the world.
Oh and why is all this on-topic for this thread you might ask? Well simple, if your do this, you wont be level 10 wearing level 1 gear. You wont be spending days browsing market retainers for that ONE thing your looking for. You might just be having fun instead of trying to force the world to bend to your awesomeness and getting kickback at every turn.
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
This sums up how the game actually works very well, although you seem to be doing better than me because I'm only in 2 linkshells (one for crafting and one general) hehe.
The game should be judged on whether or not what you describe is fun to the individual person, because this really is the game. If you're not into socializing and networking and working with others, than it's just not going to work for you, and that's fine, it's really not going to be for everybody. But if you come on here after playing the game for 10 hours and not even joining a single linkshell and call the game a giant turd, then you're not being fair, because you haven't even seen the "real" game.
For people like me, this game is totally amazing. I've been looking for an MMORPG with a focus on socializing and player interaction (beyond pwning face) basically since I started playing mmorpgs 10 years ago, and here it is, finally. I keep trying to explain why this game is intricate and interesting to me, but I don't think I've done as well myself as it is described in this quoted post by Kaocan.
the best solution find a nice LS and make a new craft friends
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
Good piece of information/advice. Thanks.
So if I'm reading this correctly you can choose to be a pure adventurer type and leave the crafting to someone else.
You can sure if thats yoru thing, one of my linkshells is pretty much just that. But I will warn you, they make and spend tons of cash to be that way. Your repair costs are going to hit you hard fast, especially if you dont pick up some crafter friends to help your out there. And those repair costs from the NPC will go up even faster the better your gear gets.
But yeah sure, if all you want to do is adventure, you can join a nice hardcore linkshell and hit the levequests and dungeons when your able. Hell I'm all for it, another customer for me, and more money in mah pocket.
Hardcore adventurer only people spend good.
"Well come on over, check out my wares! You like shiney ? Oh that looks GREAT on you, you should buy it. Why sure you can afford it, besides nobody else has one of those yet, you will be the first! *wink wink*"
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
Wow. A whole page on the FFXIV forum that I could QFT. Amazing! lol.
Edit: NVM. Good streak broken by opinion. lol
vvvvvvvvvvvvv
So let me get this straight....
A game that has crafting as a major component....has no auction house or broker services? O.o So is this like the typical Asian style game where you have to set up a "fruit stand," so to speak, in town and just sit there and try to sell things, or what?
That seems utterly impractical and archaic. I'm sorry.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
Yes this game has no AH but this decision was based on past experince of FF mmo. Also, AH will be implemented just not immediately after release. SE is giving us a search function in a week or two. For now you can use retainers to sell stuff in market wards or you can paddle your own ware.
Retainers work fine for me. i sell everything i put in there.