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MMO's lost there shine.
Epicent
Member UncommonPosts: 648
Would anyone else agree that MMO's have lost there shine. I remember a time when mmo's where full of awe and wonder. I just don't get that feeling no matter what MMO comes out these days.
Comments
I agree I feel similarly. Many of the games seem as a 'same ol song and dance' . However some of this is from us and not the games. Think about it, if AoC came out in 1999 instead ...we would have thought it was the most amazing game ever. Our standards have changed such that it is very difficult to reclaim that magic.
Torrential: DAOC (Pendragon)
Awned: World of Warcraft (Lothar)
Torren: Warhammer Online (Praag)
Yes, I can agree with that. I think alot of it has to do with systems that take your character into an instanced world too. I actually think what killed warhammer was the fact that the rewards were so much greater from being "transported' into instanced bgs. if the rewards were greater for the world pvp more people would have participated. also, why don't all mmo's have a buddy system where you can mentor down to a buddies level. it's just stupid not to have.
because there any too many mmo's. and they are all gay and free and people buy items and stuff, mmo's were the best abt 6-8years ago, not as good gfx yeah but alot etter comunitys and more fun, and less ebaying
Currently Playing:
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This, sadly.
I remember stepping out the star-port at Mos Eisley in SWG (pre-cu) feeling like i could be anything or go anywhere. Like i had the world at my feet. Or when i first logged into World of Warcraft and the world felt so huge, new and exciting, so much to explore.
Now'a days MMO's are just too much of a theme-park with tightly gated areas, instanced zones, footpaths and fences guiding you from quest to quest. Even in Vanilla WOW you had to go find quest givers to get the real rewards. That's why i think there will eventually be a big divide between old veteran MMO gamers and the new crowd as vets seek something a little extra/familiar from their MMO experience(s). I think that's why you have small-time teams like Darkfall/Perpettum/Mortal Online 'succeeding' to some degree, because vets crave that brave new world, the freedom to do as you choose and actually experience some consequence to your actions.
Saying all this, i'm eagerly anticipating SWTOR, not because of what i described above, but because i am genuinely expecting just a good story, everything else will simply be a bonus. IE: not overhyping it. I don't overhype any MMO's any more, been there too many times only to be sorely disappointed.
Although it may not be the "Best" MMO out there, EQ2 has one of the best character leveling systems out there. Not to put down my current game WoW, but Blizzard got their leveling format all wrong. Also, EQ2, I think, has one of the best, if not the best, crafting make-ups of them all.
I've only really played FFXI, FFXIV and Wow. I liked FFXI because I was in a good linkshell (guild). But I have not seen RPG in any MMORPG. I know every MMORPG claims they have awsome story but tell me, do the single player games, say after year 2000 had the text based sotry? I think almost all had Voice overs. For example, FFX, FFX-2, FFXII, Star Ocean: The Last Hope, Xenosaga I, Xenosaga II, Xenosaga III and the list goes on. These all great titles had voice overs in the cinematics.
So I don't think MMO's have lost their shine, I don't think there ever has been shine in them. In my eyes, WoW is MMO, but not MMORPG.
Guild Wars 2's 50 minutes game play video:
http://n4g.com/news/592585/guild-wars-2-50-minutes-of-pure-gameplay
Everything We Know about GW2:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/287180/page/1
I have to agree that eq2 has absolutely brilliant aspects. My current game is also WoW but I find myself at lvl 85 struggling to motivate myself to do anything. Its like a rehash of WotLK. hell, its a rehash of nearly every mmo out there. get geared all over again. its like all the work you did to gear out your 80 was for shit. I know this is the way of things but surely we can think of a better system. All in all WoW is a great game but it has lost its charm for me personally. This is simply due to the massive amount of hours i put in. But I look around for another game that I enjoy (I am no fanboy. I once got booted from a WoW guild for saying I like warhammer and that it had good ideas that were just implemented wrong.) and nothing seems to be able to draw me in like WoW did. Let me rephrase that. Nothing can draw me in for as LONG as wow did.
sad sad times. lol. the genre is in need of a facelift in my opinion. But this is simply the ramblings of a veteran mmo player.
:-)
It's us. If you started playing MMO's right now you would feel that same sense of wonder because you would be seeing something that you had never seen before. Unless you started with Champions Online or Star Trek...then you might dismiss the entire thing as a silly fad.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
There's way too many MMO coming out and most just try to copy what EQ and WoW did.
Even the best food will start to taste bad if you eat it every day.
Luckily the MMO bubble should burst when more and more new projects fail. My beta ears tell me it won't be long before another MMO goes up in flames.
Collector's editions are scams.
I don't feel that way infact i think things are getting interesting as of recently. Maybe, because i am not a hardcore player and haven't burned myslef yet.
Bite Me
i'd love to know which beta that would be. with a cherry on top.
I'd have to agree with about 90 percent of the posts here.
Although, the fact that MMOs of the earlier days were better is more just in nastalgia than reality. The themepark comment is very true, however. The difficult part is the same issue MTV had. It started out great, but then kept having to push the envelope to keep ratings that the envelope was pushed off the edge of the table and fell in the garbage.
TORG - Text Only Roleplaying Game, the only way to go. http://www.ateraan.com
I agree with this comment. I try one or two new MMOs per year (while still playing my main MMO) and still get a sense of wonder and excitement from all of them. However, that wonder lasts longer for some games than others so I usually stop playing them once the wonder is gone. Even for the current MMO that I've been continuously playing for 3 years, I can still occasionally feel a sense of wonder as there are still maps that I haven't visit, characters to meet, items to collect, storyline quests to do, etc.
If you remember the wonder you had at sending your first email or such, the technology of mmos is more established these days and that is a contribution to plain old familiarity... but take Minecraft, (you can/could try it for free) that emulates a sense of wonder in about 5 seconds of playing despite the low quality graphics. That's a good achievement for a blocky game with no real world-building (I decided against playing beyond a trial).
There's a valid lesson there, MMOs could still be made that create a sense of wonder, but a lot of releases most do not because they ar selling a packaging that the "market" will accept. Still optimistic about a few future releases, however.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
That happened a long time ago. The moment they introduced casual and themepark play to MMO is where they killed most of the awe and wonder.
Basically what happened is that the devs stopped thinking big and instead of trying to create worlds they are thinking small and creating themepark, single player type games.
I just saw another video of GW 2 and honestly it looked very similar to Dragon Age Origins. A great game, but it is a SINGLE PLAYER GAME.
My gaming blog
And what is wrong with that, and what does that have to do with this topic?
@ The Topic
I'm not a vet and have only been playing MMOs since 06 but I can see where all the complaints about MMOs are coming from. I guess the only way to not be dissapointed by anything in general is not to expect much from them. If you walked into any MMO world right now its quite easy to forget its downsides (unless those downsides affect your gameplay) and play the game for what it is. Just like the guy looking forward to SWTOR, I'd say our expectations and hype should be toned down in order to enjoy games (and life in general) for what it is whether it 'looks' like a single player game or another game rip-off.... nah scratch the rip-off part we don't like rip-offs.
This is not a game.
I have always liked the idea of MMORPGs and what they could become. However, IMO they are not there yet. The problem is that the player cannot really affect the world. You really can't win or lose the game. I think many people feel a sense of excitement until they realize that these games are really one big treadmill. It doesn't matter of your character dies, there is no way to affect the happenings in the world. Even if you succeed in completeing major quests, you know the game world has not changed- the monster or boss you killed will soon be back.
I would love to see a game with real territorial aquisition, politics, realisitic economics, less reliance on combat and some form of permanent death. I know the death idea would be very controversial but I envision something where the players main avatar is a leader (who would not die) and he has multiple heroes or underlings. The idea would not be to get to the highest levels but have your minions perform tasks or quests that further the goals of the main character. While this is just a basic idea, I think anything that moves the genre away from gear and leveling would be an improvement. Anything that adds an element of risk without forcing the players to start from scratch would help with immersion IMO.
We are the shine, and that's what MMo's are losing. There is only a bunch of "me's" now. Massive multiplayer is just an excuse to charge money. Being massive multiplayer was the shine, now it's a marketing gimmick. Quest, kill, level, log off, pay money, next game, repeat. Maybe that's exact;y what they want?
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
Yep.
Collector's editions are scams.
MMO's have lost their shine, and I think it's partly because developers are catering to the casual market. It does make them more money, but this has caused everybody to just want everything without much effort. People new to the genre develop a "gimme gimme" attitude and will expect no less, attributing to a much lower sense of accomplishment.
The proper timesink is what made the games of old so special. Ultimately we all play games to have fun and achieve great things, and when all you have to do is knock on the door and say "trick or treat!" and the game tosses a bunch of goodies in your bag, the fire is lost since it's just not challenging enough to make it feel special.
Also much of the old games had very good open world pvp, with no instances. Which is it's own fuel and drives itself to allow timesinks that shouldn't even bother you in the slightest.
Yes, they've lost their mojo but people shouldn' t blame the devs for this blame the ones responsible which are the damn suits without any knowledge. The WoW formula worked for WoW it won't work for other games, which is simple:
Cola is selling millions and millions of bottles so if you copy them you will do the same right? Wrong you fail miserable because there are 2 sorts of people: those that already like Cola and those who don't.
Same with MMORPGS you have the WoW players and those who don't like WoW, that why you have to look at your own strength instead of lookinsg at WoW and trying to copy as many features as possible.
I highly believe there is a still a market for the gold ol' "heres your world, now play in" market instead of the tutorial, quest driven handholding easy mode style (which is fine for those who like it it just isn't my cup of tea).
We need a MMORPG Cataclysm asap, finish the dark age of MMORPGS now!
"Everything you're bitching about is wrong. People don't have the time to invest in corpse runs, impossible zones, or long winded quests. Sometimes, they just want to pop on and play."
"Then maybe MMORPGs aren't for you."
I think when people say devs, they mean the decision makers, not the majority who have no say and just do their job.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
The main problem I find with MMO's is the sense of wonder has gone. With your first MMO you really feel like somehow your going to be able to really achieve something - that the level 50/60/70/80/90/100 lands are going to offer something completely different, you will actually grow, you will fight bigger and better things, that you might be able to have a go at becoming a god (as in dragonlance) and really affecting things...
But they don't.
The main problem I had with MMO's is, when I got to max level, I thought - is that it? Just the same as before but everything I fight is max level rather than level 1? It was a real let down. Then you go raiding and all of a sudden it all seems worth while... right up until you meet the morons who are 20+ years old and converted the game into some kind of factual spreadsheet. Instead of creating a unique character you must serve the roll - be it tank, dps or healer (or crowd control).
At first I really hated them for it but then I realised they were right. It is exactly what the game is - a massive spreadie where there is no true inventiveness or growth - just a role/position you must fulfill. The obtainment of a full set of end raid gear says more about your stamina to withstand repetitive boredom rather than your playing ability. And that's just got to be wrong.
I do feel a time will come where char's will be unique and no-one can really tell you how to play your char because of this uniqueness - but that's a long old way off and, until then, the hope of what could be has been converted into spreadsheets of facts and numbers and timings.
Till that day comes, well,I've gone back to single player games again... the thing which makes me laugh is all the things I wish MMO's would do, single player games do do.
It's all just so ironic.
You buy crap you get crap. Stop buying it and perhaps it will force devs to make better mmos you really want to play.
Next step in world gaming: Laser outlined introductory user grid phase morphing? Eg. TRON?
TORG - Text Only Roleplaying Game, the only way to go. http://www.ateraan.com