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No originality in MMORPGs? What are your best ideas.
Pynda
Member UncommonPosts: 856
Dynamically Generated Content - I'm not absolutely sure it currently would be technically possible, but I'd love to see it. For example you get a quest to explore a section of an old, half buried ruin. And when you enter the secret entrance you have been directed to, the dungeons interior has been custom generated for you or your group (by linking of 'tilesets' and types). Along with custom content placed within it (mobs, traps, chests, main objective, etc.).
Originality is not possible anymore? - Then I'd love to see a developer rip off the best ideas of Ultima Online, Asheron's Call 1, and Pre-CU Star Wars Galaxies. Why the f*%# is this whole WoW/EQ1 thing so written in stone now? I'm sick to death of it.
Comments
This might sound weird but id love to see a sandbox mmo with terrain that is always changing due to destruction or construction of players (we already have this with xsyon) BUT id love to see a game that takes the next step in the "hardcore" route and have ABSOLUTLY NO PRE-GENERATED MAPS. Meaning once you first join the game and press M, nothing will be there.
BUT
there would be a crafting type system where you can "create" your own map. Just have some tools in it, (call it a sub-photoshop) where people would scale the world and literally draw out maps for others to purchase......sure you would have people that would try and sell faulty maps, but then again, you would have people in the game with a high reputation of being a great map designer.
_The Sauce Man
I'd actually like to see something that was a UO/FFXI hybrid oO.......
Some things FFXI did I loved, Most of what UO did I loved. Combine the best of both and I'd be down for another decade of gaming.
UO = Played for over a decade
FFXI = Played for 5 years
I'm lucky to get 6 months out of an MMO now days
An MMO without killing.
wow i really want to see different game developers' take on this... this would revolutionaize the MMO genre...
Diablo did it on old hardware years ago. Hell an old PSone game did it called DarkStone. It's not too big of a stretch to think it's possible within an MMO.
It would have its benefits and its drawbacks, but certainly not revolutionize the industry.
City of Heroes already did this in a way. They had randomly generated mob types, bosses, etc. The buildinsg might all be the same, but if they were randomly generated there would be no difference as they would feel the same.
If DDO randomized the traps in dungeons, or the dungeons themselves, it would be a HUGE bonus and make the game 10x more fun and amazing, and really hit hard the biggest negative of DDO (lack of replayability) but still... would not revolutionize anything.
Great feature? Yes.
Revolution? No.
If being a developer means being quiet, mature, well-spoken, and disconnected from the community, then by all means do me a favor and believe I'm not one.
A Tale In The Desert?
I would love to see living NPC who has jobs within the game world itself, and keep the world changing as the time passed, and season changes. They abandon town as it been occupied by evil, bandit, or enemy faction, and start a new at other places, send out foresters to collect necessaries materials to rebuild the city, recruit NPC guards (and players) to help protect the city and explores the wilds. Players will be part of the living world, and help out other NPC factions they see fit, or create their own. Every day you login will often find something new and different in the game world as it continue progressing by players and NPCs. In short, living RTS progressive game world with MMORPG play style.
To an extent, Dungeon Runners did that. Most MMO gamers don't really love on it, though.
1) Difficulty scaled to your character or group, however everyone has their own difficulty level they play their character at. Some people like fighting even level stuff, some like mowing through slightly lower level content, and some like to take on the highest possible con they can without facing total annihilation. The majority fall into category 2, which brings us to the next issue:
2) If the dugneon is always scaled to the group or character, a certain measure of progress is lost. One great aspect of repeatable dungeons is they allow the player to see/experience how their character has advanced - things that took 5 hits now take 4, things that wiped the group before are now less difficult. While that is often felt in open world PvE, not everyone enjoys that aspect of PvE, even to the point of seeing that content as tertiary (Raid/Epic > regular dungeons and quests > open world hunting/grinding ).
3) If you liked the layout and style of a particular dungeon, you're SOL because it's gone after you complete it. While it would be cool to have a feature to allow 'locking' a dungeon so it doesn't change, the game would need a really good checks and balance system to provent the inevitable pinata/goldmine dungeon that the RNG spits out now and then.
A dynamic dungeon system (with dynamic quests and content to match) is something I'd really like to see some dev conquer, but I doubt it would be popular with mainstream MMO gamers. The predicatability and the comfortable feel of familiarity probably wouldn't exist to a great enough degree for them.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
More MMO's need to make proffessions needed, and removing automatically generated items from all places throughout the game other than the starting area, leaving in NPC's that will have to purchase regents, or products from the player. You want health and mana potions? You'll have to do 3 things: 1. Find the materials and craft it yourself, 2. Find a person to craft it for you, and option 3. Buy it from an NPC Potion dealer (Basically as i said, no automatically generated items so those potions are actually player crafted and the NPC will buy for a set price and generate experience. The more the NPC has, the less it would buy it for and exp rewarded). The same can be done with weapons and armor, but you're only limited to a few professions so need to make friends or find a guild in order to actually get everything you need. When crafting, each item will have a chance of increasing in 'rarity' or effectiveness when it comes to potions.
Off the top of my head...
ATITD
Business Tycoon Online
zOMG!
vMTV
7Million (dueling is possible, though)
Get7
Playboy Manager MMO
Muxlim Online
Freestyle
Project Torque, GoGoRacer, CTRacer, Need for Speed World, Tales Runner and other racing MMOs
SmashStar
Pangya, Shot Online, MLB Dugout Heroes and other sports MMOs
Muxlim
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
That very first sentence....
That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!
I'd say some of the basic things could be looked at eg:
Persistent world. Make a server that runs a world that players could destroy ie after a month and then reset it if it is indeed destroyed etc...
Devs control some of the mobs and are actively antagonistic to players...
etc etc... plenty of room for adjustments.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
do you mean like the diablo dungeon system? Cos I saw a video of Rift http://www.g4tv.com/videos/51369/Rift-Endgame-Walkthrough---Greenscales-Blight-Zone/ (the 20 man dungeon raid part starts around 11:00)
and the dungeon is generated in a large room, and the maze reforms as you progress through dungeon.
will post again once I formulated my own idea :P
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW?
As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
I hate "originality".
Its another word for: introduce random changes to the game without actually changing anything, just for the sake of "being different".
So yeah, I want the classic MMO experience done right for once, nothing else.
If people finally give me the game I'm looking for, I might be interested in "originality". Before that point, I am going to keep searching.
I'm not worried about originality so much... I just want more single player type gameplay in a MMO. I'm basically tired of the quest systems and the combat in MMOs. It's always the same crap over and over.
i think Anarchy Online's "missions" did all that. i'm kinda surprised it didn't become a standard feature for MMOs.
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Corpus Callosum
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I'm not sure if you can call this 'original' but I would love to see a system similar to Assassin's creed's system.
If you play a rogue in most mmo, rogue only use 1-2 weapons, but in most fantasy lore, rogue/assassin/archer use/has a much much bigger arensal. not to mention jumping from rooftops killing enemies? VERY COOL! :P The only problem with jumping off rooftops will be like......a lot of people doing it......then the world looks a bit weird.
Ability to apply different weapon to differing situation calls for much higher variety of tactics in a gameplay environment that pressing hotkeys with a tab target system can ever achieve.
As for the class system, instead of making warrior/rogue/scout/mage/priest with distinguish skill/talent trees, use a affinity system where certain race/ human traits makes you more expert in certain areas of skills. There is almost no explanation why a mage/priest can't hold a cross bow and shoot, or warrior learn a bit of side magic for travelling (given stroyline isn't making magic an affinity to certain race/human traits, like in dragon age lore), but just that a mage will almost never shoot as expertly as a ranger, or have as much 'tricks' in their bags.
Moving onto healthbars, todays mmo is very very shall I say, sloppy with the health system, the more you have the better you survive? I understand the fantasy genre is given a bit of freedom into the unexplained, but having 100,000 health points and taking 50 giant cuts from a monster twice your size, and possibly twice your strength, and not die is just plain stupid, if you think about it. Similar to Assassin's creed health system, where you will rely more on dodging and parrying to keep you alive, than having a fatter health bar.
I'm not 100% for the whole 'action combat' where you have to aim for every single target, no target lock, but I really like the whole idea that you have to actually do something to be able to dodge an attack, not relying on a stupid dice-roll. In today's gaming technology, collision detection between two objects is not hard at all. I did one semester in programming for designers and I have already got an idea of how this is possible, not to mention unity engine just does it for you. (I realise latency will play a lot into this idea, but hopefully game designers can get past this hurdle, DCUO wasn't great, but one thing I realise in that game is that, lag is almost unrecognisable.)
This leads me into the dodge/dash and parry button/function, this is a very small feature, but will make combat a lot more interactive than the norm of mmo, In a few games I have seen, there is this reactive skill that some classess will get, (notably Aion will their chain skill system, DCUO with the parry button and Rift with the whole 'this skill can only be use after dodging). Similar idea but apply differently, Dash/dodge and Parry combine with a collision system, can make a combat very interactive without making it a button mash hack n slash game.
And lastly, a counter system, requiring rhythm to counter-attack an opponent, engaging the players into the combat, less hack n slash as well.
You probably realise if mmo intrgrate a lot of features from our single player counterpart, we would have a much richer online experience. None is this is 'original', but I guess is new to the mmo market.
ps: and pls for the love of god, no flying.
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW?
As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
Originality doesn't really apply to MMO's, IMO, because MMO itself is a classification of another genre, which means it comes down to taking some other game and adding the MMO portion to it. And so far very few games have been taken.
MMO's are missing the world modification kind of game. Xsyson Earth seems to be doing it but it looks horrible and I'm suspicious of the company making it, besides, I don't want another Darkfall, nor do I appreciate the cars. But overall a game where you can actively change the world both in terms of physical elements (build towers, chop down trees, w/e) and modify NPC behavior (affect animal migrations, collect NPC parties to do stuff for you, hire NPC's to guard stuff, etc.) is something we'll be missing for a while.
And I'm tired of how gimmicky MMO's are. You have a sniper who shoots only 50 ft for the sake of "balance". You have soulbinding (ugh, ugh, ugh). There's a lot of things in MMO's it really doesn't come down to innovation, it comes down to more variety in the already explored fields more than anything.
MMO's also need to stop being coop games (40 people in a copied room) and become massive games. No instances. If you can't make an MMO without instances you shouldn't be making an MMO in the first place. Instances are nothing more, nothing less, simulation of SP/coop experiences.
Several problems are often co-related when the use of instances is non-existant.
Most mmo are very gear-centric games, to get rid of the instances will make attaining epic gears to a horrible quene and grind, or force players to crafting, which I can certainly say, isn't everyones cup of tea.
Also a flaw in the idea of mmo, what if a group of players wanting to tackle a certain PvE content, but another group of players is already in the mist of completing the content. Should content come at a first come first serve ideal? I don't think so, since most AAA mmo require a subscription fee, you have to pay in order to play, therefore you are just as much as entitle to play this content as the next guy, therefore there are no reason that you should have to wait for them to finish. Unless you can pay for the amount of content you play per month, (by content I mean real, require a brain kind of content, not some collect 5 wood content)
Of course you can make this kind of idea to work, but the very basis of MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE GAME will need to be changed. And i doubt much developer are willing to tackle such an enormous task.
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW?
As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
...Are you serious?
Not only is it definitely 100% possible, but it's already been done repeatedly throughout MANY MMORPG's, even spanning old ones.
I really don't understand why so few here are intelligent enough to understand the capabilities of MMORPG's.
They can do anything any other game can do... which is nearly anything.
Sending bits of information to players based on their vicinity is not this overwhelming task people make it out to be. Dynamically generated content is entirely possible in any video game, so of course it's possible in a MMORPG. There is no reason it is not possible.
It has come to my occurence I need to begin ignoring your posts, as brain isn't working for you good. *block*
If being a developer means being quiet, mature, well-spoken, and disconnected from the community, then by all means do me a favor and believe I'm not one.
EQ was like this. If you haven't experienced it, you have a rather weak perspective on the matter.
Having only a single instance of anything was a mixed bag. The good was meeting people and developing a good community. The neutral was dealing with trains from others, and epic gear actually being damn rare. The bad was gear competition.
Though considering everyone tended to be involved in the in game community, KSing, and greifing was rare, as you can get ostricized for being an ass. It makes a big difference when you can't just pug with people that don't know you, be it cross server, or insulating multi instances.
I personally thought more good came from a single instance design vs multi instance design. Gear trickled in slower, things didn't have to be Bind on Pickup. Every scrap you got made you feel good. Unlike WoW where I'm just like,"oh? nother epic? *toss in the pile*" People communicated with strangers daily. Guilds became very close knit. As said before Greifing and cheating were low because there were reprecussions with the server community.
You just can't get that kind of community if everyone is playing co-op in their own instances and looking like carbon copies.
You really only have to go back as far as AoC to have experienced public dungeons. Every game I have played with them I thought was terrible. There is nothing worse than spending an hour of your time getting to a boss only to find it camped, stolen, or already killed with a long respawn timer. The days of wasting a player's time like this is long past and will never return.
The ONLY way I could see public dungeons work in future MMOG's is if the dungeon itself were absolutely huge (or numerous like AC's dungeons). Also, loot drops would have to be random. If you have one boss that drops items X, Y, or Z and another boss that drops A, B, or C, then players have an incentive to stay and camp the boss since its the only way to get the item they want. If its a popular item then its guaranteed to be camped continuously.
These issues can be overcome, but its not like you could take a game like WoW, turn everything into a public instance and improve the community. That just isn't going to happen.
Greed can be an ugly thing and rarely does it help a community. Back in EQ I had a few guildmates that found a hidden boss that dropped a rare mace. They wouldn't tell anyone where the boss is because they were affraid it would be camped. They wouldn't even tell me, their guild leader. Had it been a private instance that never would have been an issue.
As for original ideas... (not really original though and in no particular order... really just a bitch list about modern MMOG's)
- A mage-tanking tree or class that relies on stoneskin, magical shields, etc and can perform on par with a traditional armored tank.
- Quest givers that wave, yell, motion, or just look like they need help rather than having a stupid ! or ? over their head.
- Quest objectives that can be completed even without the quest in your log. Have you ever been out exploring, killed a boss you randomly found, then later gone back to town and found the quest giver asking you to kill that boss and you just wanted to yell in his face "I JUST KILLED THE DUDE NOT 5 MINUTES AGO!" but nooooo, you now have to go back and kill them again. Most MMOG quests are handicapped by this flaw.
- Dungeons that are more than just hallways full of monsters. What ever happened to locks, traps, secrets, puzzles or even things as simple as doors and darkness? Would it be so F-ing hard to bring a torch? It would be nice to know why the monsters are there and how they survive.
- Respawns that make sense. Materializing out of thin air is a major immersion breaker. I miss TR.
- Crafting resources that are not retarded node collection. Okay herb gathing I understand. Skinning and harvesting animal parts is pretty well worked out. But what's with the static piles of ore you see sitting on the surface in most modern MMOG's? Maybe I'm just spoiled by Minecraft now.
- I like the OP's suggestion of randomized dungeons, but I think I would prefer user-created dungeons more. It solves the same problem but has the potential for more originality and also provides another task or hobby for the player.
- NPC schedules (The convenience kiddies will cry but I could care less)
- Dark night time, but with torches lanterns and other lighting options
- Land ownership, deeds, buildings that serve a purpose beyond decoration
- Minigames in taverns
Probably because nothing about AO's missions gave the player the impression they'd want to experience that sort of gameplay again.
Dynamic can be done well, but AO's implementation was fairly far off the mark.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Dynamically generated content?
... Diablo? Really?
Am I the only person here who ever played a Roguelike?
Now there's some manly random dungeoneering.