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MMORPGs are too damn easy.
SkillCosby
Member Posts: 684
It's been so long...
I've been submerged within the realm of ease and simplicity for over 10 years. I've become "soft".
I don't know why, but I was greatly consumed with this nostalgic-gaming type thing. I loaded up eBay and purchased a RETRON 3 (Nintendo, Super Nintendo, Genesis - All in One). I know I could've just run an emulator. However, it's not the same. It's got to be on the big screen with the original controllers 
I purchased a few of my favorite Nintendo games:
Kid Icarus
Metroid
Rygar
Battle of Olympus
My package arrives! I load up the system on the 42". Wow! How nice it was to experience classic Nintendo in Widescreen! I load up Kid Icarus, one of my favorites.
The music starts. Intensity sets in when the level 1 4/4 beat kicks into full progression. It's harder than I remember. I get to level 2...
WHOA!?!?!? I can barely do this! I keep dying on level 2! I finally get past it after several tries. When I did pass it, however, it was by the skin of my teeth. My heart was pounding at the finish line. I had to actually take a breather. I felt accomplished.
I felt accomplished.
I felt accomplished.
I felt accomplished.
I felt accomplished.
I felt accomplished.
I felt accomplished.
I felt accomplished.
Where was my guiding hand? Where was my help? Where was mommy?
The MMOs of today are insulting. Problem solving? There is none. I load up my map, I follow the quest marker from point A to B, I click the chest, I follow the quest marker back to the quest giver, rinse/repeat etc. The combat is borderline K12. I've experienced this in every game I've played post-WoW.
Comments
Agreed.
It's what the masses want. I am not apart of those masses, so these games aren't for me. Sad but true.
Wow, you're easy to satisfy. A game developers dream customer.
Really? Then why is it I haven't played a game past the free month in over 6 years?
MMOs are easier. Instead of exploring the countryside to find the rare purple jabberwocky you are given a light trail right to it and when you defeat it you get quick travel right back to the quest giver avoiding all monsters or maybe even opposite faction/PVP players. Why not just have a box in the middle of town with a monster inside? The box can say stick sword in slot to kill monster and level up. Repeat as neccesary.
MMOs need to go back to storyline, exploration, crafting, discovery, betrayal, surprise, traps, and villains that truely want to kill you and come out of the blue when you least expect it. Sheesh. At least make a MMO with two servers. Instead of PVP and PVE we can have Hold your Hand Server and Anything goes Server.
Not a very convincing argument. I've seen the end-game bosses in MMOs like WoW and FFXI and I can assure you the amount of skill, preparation and group cooperation required is well beyond anything you will find in old NES titles.
See you already lose, because many of us want something in between.
Something that doesn't hold your hand but something that is still well designed, thoughtful, intelligent, and fun.
There is nothing well designed, thoughtful, intelligent, nor fun about tedius frustration and a lack of choice.
Because MMOs hide all of the challenge in the "end game" or in the PvP, but it's usually so item-centric that skill as a player is still secondary.
The real challenge comes from surving the grind to get to the challenging content, and then not getting too frustrated with the general lack of intelligence and skill of the general MMO gaming community as a whole.
Don't stand in fire? But why would I want to do that?
*face palm*
The problem lies within the very mechanics of MMOs and their combat system. When you fight a mob 1 on 1 it mostly boils down to stats and not strategy or precision. What's even more hilarious? Boost a monster's health and damage 5 times and what's the solution? Get a group of 5 to have the EXACTLY same fight as the 1v1 fight but scaled by 5. Still no skill required but simply pressing 1,2,3,4...
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Your comparing old side scroller twitch games to an MMO? Gimme a break, how about comparing apples to apples?
Archlinux ftw
Well... There is nothing wrong with something inbetween but I really haven't seen MMOs pull off a good mix. Perhaps if they kept holding your hand stuff to lower levels. Of course, this is all relative since everyone is going to have their own tastes. I just find that the level grind and hold your hand MMOs are way too numerous and the many threads that pop up on MMORPG show there is quite a bit of disgust about it by a fair number of players who want more in a MMO. Can't say I blame them.
Well at least the technology seems to be catching up for MMOs and you get "twitch" combat in games like Vindictus or Dragon Nest (instanced yes, but its there). I liken MMORPGs to one of my favorite NES games... Dragon Warrior 1. And you know what? I never... ever beat DW1 without cheating in some way shape or form (eventually beat it emulated by speeding up the game 5x normal speed) because it is boring as hell.
Running around killing monsters repeatedly to level up to run around and kill harder monsters repeatedly, to buy that copper sword, to go run around to kill more monsters repeatedly... I sometimes laugh when I go back to play a game like this and see the "difficulty" and it always reminds me of an MMORPG.
"They essentially want to say 'Correlation proves Causation' when it's just not true." - Sovrath
Yes, the majority are too easy.
Solution: Play the ones that aren't too easy. I 'll give you some suggestions...
Themeparks= Everquest 1, Vanguard, I hear Final Fantasy becomes hard to solo after a certain level
Or if you are a glutton for punishment play Mortal Online(wait for the new AI patch though).
I hear Salem has permadeath when it comes out... although it looks to cute for me.
Many MMOs aren't difficult. Most of all, the tasks are just boring and tedius. An entertaining time sink that numbs the brain, provides a sense of accomplishment, and in exchange they tap our credit card for $15.00.
There's a difference between "Whew, I didn't think I was going to be able to beat that" and "Whew, 75 hours later I have an uber character". The first is difficult. The second is just time consuming.
The problem is.. games are seen more as a business than it is about making good games today, it's all about getting as many people able to play and buy it as possible than anything else.
The magic word has been "accessibility" for the past few years now.
The same has been happening with all games in general, not just MMO's. While there are still a few go against the 'build-for-casual' trend of the past few years, there are many many more that go with it. Even beloved franchises of the past that return and were popular because of the challenge they offered have been getting tailor-made for a giant crowd of average joe gamers.
(most recently i'm looking at you Driver:San Francisco)
MMO's are massive mulitplayers that mostly revolve around RPG type game play which usually isn't twitch style. If your looking for that style of play I would instead look for games like these:
King Arthur's gold
Vendetta Online
Bitfighter
Minifighter
Altitude
Openclonk/Clonk Rage
Steel Storm: Burning Retribution
Wings 2
Teeworlds
Alien Swarm.
Vendetta is the only MMO there, but rest can be played multiplayer/LAN.
Archlinux ftw
I dont think its possible to make MMORPGs so much harder.
Memories brings me back to diablo 2 multiplayer, when i and 7 of my friends(we can call it a raid?) entered the icy grounds to try fighting the new enemies.
What do we see? Oh great, 50 skeletal fire archers bombing us with fire arrows, instant death. Resistance aura up, another pally with regenation aura, went fine. Then comes this unique monster. Lighting enhanced and aura that reduces resistances, oh great.
BAM BOM and he died. Item drops didnt make us happy but the amount of experience was great.
The MMOs is different. It punish the players alot more. Its slower to go back. Changing options will make the game change more negativily.
And yes, not to mention the bosses in normal raids. DPS, uh move away a bit, go back DPSing compared to the first time me and my group faced Diablo.
Run away, throw potions, hit him barb, oh crap he got one shoted by fire nova, 10 minutes, how much life left? 50%-_-.
Oh great, grrr. And he finally went down. Thats the hardest boss moment i ever had. We didnt get any loot but man did it feel good to down him finally.
Playing hard games together, laning or whatever and winning at last makes you feel great, but with MMOs, its not the same stuff. The only hard thing you can do is getting a super ultra rare item or mount.
Yawn
I completely agree with the OP, but there is another side to this problem. MMOs aren't immersive, the ROLE PLAYING part of RPG is missing (no stories, mobs on leash, kill 10 quests etc is pure crap) which makes these games centered around grinding numbers.
I agree only wow is dam hard all other its gettin last gear and just pve,mobs do on player pitty dmg.NoT TROLL
All games have become way too easy compared to what was out in the 80s, it isn't just MMOs.
The problem with the OP's arguments is that he compares MMORPGs with Kid Ikarus and other platformers when he should be comparing MMORPGs with platform RPGs, such as the final fantasy series, dragon quests etc etc. These games, like MMOs, were never technically difficult. Sure, some bosses were hard, but these were resolved not by skill, but by grinding exp for a while.
RPGs have always been easier than platformers and other kinds of games. Why should MMORPGs be different?
Actually, yes the end bosses require some knowledge and so on. However the issue with MMO's lies that everything before is so easy a monkey with no hands could complete it.
Don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with a game starting easy or having some easy content, but when 99.9% of the content is piss easy and facerollable it's a bit boring. They could at least give the option to do some challenging content along the road and not force us to grind up and until the end-content before hoping to get a challenge by design.
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.
I think just2duh gives a good explanation and I feel the hard truth of it is that developers are making games to make money from as many people as possible. I imagine games are simple so that the younger crowd as in really young crowd can play. Economic cash models are driving how games are being made so you get a lukewarm game for a general audience rather than an awesome game targetted at a specific audience. I suppose we need more Niche MMOs.
I do not think it is what the masses want at all,i beleive the devs are just real lame and go for the biggest audience.
The real baby type gamers that cry if someone steps on their left toe,are satisfied by easy gaming and the ones who don't like it ,are pretty much forced to accept it and don't complain with their money.Really all the games are copyinmg the same design,so it's not like anyone has a choice,we either quit rpg gaming altogether ,or start forcing devs to get their act together by not buying their products.
The other problem is that i see far too many are not joining these games for the game,but to merely speed to end game level then loot or pvp.This is the current trend and has nothing to do with actual rpg gaming,it is a VERY superficial form of entertainment.
The developer is part to blame for not giving us much in the way of gaming,outside of npc quest to level up in a linear fashion.This was acceepted in EQ1 because it was newish ,advancing from ancient game design of 30x30 maps.
There is a lot of ways to spice up this current stagnant trend in rpg design,but devs are satisfied taking the easy route with no risk.Quit giving them your pre orders,quit buying every game that comes out and quit being fanbois,start to demand devs make their games better.I would rather wait 5 more years and get a superb game than become impatient demanding a release of the same old borefest we are getting now.If the devs see thousands of pre orders it sends them a signal they no longer have to work at their game,people will buy it now as is.Used car salesmen love these type of buyers.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I agree in that I'd rather wait longer for a game than have a terrible game released and the preorders are a definite scam. This is especially true of lifetime preorders which rob you when the game goes free to play such as Hellgate London and even Star Trek Online. However, I doubt Devs will listen. A certain developer of SOE would never listen and only put what he wanted in the game for Star Wars Galaxies and the NGE is an example of how far people will go to be stubborn. A game needs Devs in the game that actually care about the game for them even to start listening to you. If Devs are just there for the buck rather than a love for their creation then it is already a lost cause.
I agree with all of your overall points, especially the last paragraph, which everyone on this site (in my opinion) should read.