Lol at the Firefly reference. I still have no trouble cracking games but now I only use it to test out the game before I buy it. if I don't like a game enough to buy it then I don't like it enought to keep playing it either. I think the bulk of the pirate community has learned their lesson. If we don't provide a market for PC games then everything will go to the consoles. PC gaming is starting to come back in a bit so I want to encourage that as much as I can. many of my friends feel the same way.
Indeed. I think it's sad that so many people think the ‘try before you buy’ justification for piracy is universally bullshit, as it's true for me and more than half of the pirates I know. Not saying this means it must be the reason for most piracy, just that it's true for some.
Without ‘piracy’, I'd be spending less money on games, not more—and not even remotely the same.
So basically you are only a thief HALF of the time? What a bunch of steaming bull! A thief is a thief and in my opinion (and most of societies to be honest) one of the lowest forms of life on the planet.
down troll down! be honest, you dont really care about what I do & I don't really care what you think about it. If you want to know the truth, over my course of my time playing games & computing (since the late '80s), my computer has been %100 pirate. pirated operating system, pirated applications, pirated games. for years I never paid for anything. I even ran a warez site for a while. now its different, I see the damage that has done, not to the companies, they make their money, but to myself & other players. I still run pirate win7 but the games I play I pay for cause I want them to keep making them.
before you get all indignant remember that it doesnt bother me that you don't like it
Then no real reason to respond when people call you out as the criminal you are, right, because you're all good with it.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
lol, judging by most of the comments I read it seems you guys didnt read the full article. It really isnt about pirating, it's about the modders/cheaters/hackers/losers ruining the games.
"OMG an article with the title Game Piracy is B.S." I must post and defend pirating lawl. Go fail again.
Pirating isn't anything new. Hell as a gamer who is 27 years old i will openly admit that when we had the 386 PC we never ever paid for games. I didn't even know you could buy games. They wheren'nt in the stores. You just got a floppy disk from a friend. coppied it and then you owned the game. They magicly appeared out of the blue. No one knew where they came from, it was always from a friend.
Then the CD-rom came, but internet wasn't commen yet and lets admit it, downloading games with a 56k modem as max speed wouldn't be a succes anyway. In the cd-rom time you had these cd-roms called "twillights" they put many many games and other software on it. All illigale. Again no one knew where these twillights came from, people just had them and spread them around.
The game industry survived all those activities. Only know they complain cause people use the internet for it and now its easyer for them to see the numbers. But i doubt there is more piracy then there was in the past. And if there is more piracy then perhaps the devs should look at themselfs. After all singleplayer games become rare and most of them are done in 4 to 5 hours. I mean come one, you demand 50 euro for it and then give us only a shitty amount of gameplay time in return, no wonder people pirate it. Thats what you get when you ask more for less. People aren't willing to pay 50 euro's for 4 to 5 hours gameplay (yes CoD im looking at you with your broken multiplayer for the pc ever since modern warfare 2).
And now we come to the cheaters/modders. I say their penatly for ruining the gameplay experience for others and sometimes killing entire games multiplayer with their hacks...they should get perma bann from the internet. Thats the only penalty that helps. You can't block them from games cause they will find a way to get in again. Perma bann from the internet unless its in a public area where they can't install shit on their pc's, let allone hacks. If you commit a murder in RL you end up behind bars for many years. This is a risk you take when you break the law and you know it. hackers/cheaters should the same penalty. Being caught hacking/cheating in a game and destroying the game for it. 5 to 10 year internet ban. Boom no warnings, screw them its not like they are worthy people anyway. These people hack/cheat to win, infact i see them in many shooters and it are the same kids who call you a noob....who's the noob? Me who can't kill him cause he has god mode one and can see trough walls, or him who can't win without his pathetic hacks. I don't care they are 16 or younger, give hard penalties. I left to many games cause of hackers, games i enjoyed but couldn't enjoy anymore with the huge ammount of hackers.
The simple fact that while hacks, mods, cheats and exploits might annoy or even anger you. Such things happen in games because 1) Programmers do what they can to make sure the game runs as they expect 2) They purposely program in dev codes for themselves and their testers and leave them in the final production and 3) Gamers, by default are intelligent wily bastards and will do whatever they can to crack a game and exploit it like the whore it is.
Lol at the Firefly reference. I still have no trouble cracking games but now I only use it to test out the game before I buy it. if I don't like a game enough to buy it then I don't like it enought to keep playing it either. I think the bulk of the pirate community has learned their lesson. If we don't provide a market for PC games then everything will go to the consoles. PC gaming is starting to come back in a bit so I want to encourage that as much as I can. many of my friends feel the same way.
Indeed. I think it's sad that so many people think the ‘try before you buy’ justification for piracy is universally bullshit, as it's true for me and more than half of the pirates I know. Not saying this means it must be the reason for most piracy, just that it's true for some.
Without ‘piracy’, I'd be spending less money on games, not more—and not even remotely the same.
So basically you are only a thief HALF of the time? What a bunch of steaming bull! A thief is a thief and in my opinion (and most of societies to be honest) one of the lowest forms of life on the planet.
down troll down! be honest, you dont really care about what I do & I don't really care what you think about it. If you want to know the truth, over my course of my time playing games & computing (since the late '80s), my computer has been %100 pirate. pirated operating system, pirated applications, pirated games. for years I never paid for anything. I even ran a warez site for a while. now its different, I see the damage that has done, not to the companies, they make their money, but to myself & other players. I still run pirate win7 but the games I play I pay for cause I want them to keep making them.
before you get all indignant remember that it doesnt bother me that you don't like it
So basically you are an admitted thief and don't feel all that bad about it. Well except that you think it might be ruining you gaming experience so you now pay for games at least? Still a thief and no better than a mugger on the street. Actually worse, a mugger at least has to face the people they are stealing from.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
3) Gamers, by default are intelligent wily bastards and will do whatever they can to crack a game and exploit it like the whore it is.
I think you mean.
3) Gamers, by default are intelligent wily bastards and will do whatever they can to crack("rape") a game and whore out the exploits like the pimps they think they are.
I use that term rape because to me thats exactly what these types of ppl are doing. Feeding their power ego preying on our grief.
You call them Pirates/Modders/Cheaters/Exploiters/etc I call them rapists.
3) Gamers, by default are intelligent wily bastards and will do whatever they can to crack a game and exploit it like the whore it is.
I think you mean.
3) Gamers, by default are intelligent wily bastards and will do whatever they can to crack("rape") a game and whore out the exploits like the pimps they think they are.
I use that term rape because to me thats exactly what these types of ppl are doing. Feeding their power ego preying on our grief.
You call them Pirates/Modders/Cheaters/Exploiters/etc I call them rapists.
I think we the (legit) players should band together, create some new jobs and form some organizations. Play our games, catch these ppl, and do something about it! I absolutely hate when I buy a game then only to find that its plagued with this sorta thing.
Sometimes i wonder if a undetectable intelligent bot wouldnt be the best thing that could happen to mmos. People might stop grinding sit back realise what the bot does for them is a stupid skinner box and finally /unsub. Would force devs to produce fun content free of grind.
Yeah blame the devs, for their content being a grind. LOL Don't make me laugh. If i get pulled over for speeding let me try to blame the state for it being their fault I was speeding.
"I'm sorry officer, these speedlimits here are too slow, making my drive to work boring."
"It's the states fault for making it so slow"
"And yes officer, the state is only making ppl speed by setting the limits so slow to make money from all the tickets you issue"
Yeah blame the devs, for their content being a grind. LOL Don't make me laugh. If i get pulled over for speeding let me try to blame the police for it being their fault I was speeding.
Do you relally not understand how the industry works? They want money so they need to keep you subbed. Only way to develop as fast as people consume is grind. So they feed you grind with a carrot (loot) on a stick to keep you subbed. If people would get some distance by not playing themselves through that they might /unsub more likely which would force devs to go other ways.
Oh I understand how the industry work completely. But really if its that bad ppl will unsub period.
One could also argue that ppl will be unsubbing due to seeing all the bots run rampant.
I'm sorry I let my emotions get the best of me, this is a very touchy subject for me. I feel as if I've thrown away money due to this sorta thing. I don't mean to come off as rude.
Even if the game is a grind, and you feel that its not right what the devs do to keep you hooked into playing for as long as possible. It doesnt make it right to take a shortcut there. When the rest of us work, and work hard at it to get to the same finish line. Yes I will agree developers need to come up with a better hook to keep us playing other then a grind. But, resorting to bots to make them see what a waste of time it was for them to do it isnt the answer. If you feel you need to cheat to "payback" the developers. Just stop playing the game. That will hurt them more, and make them think more when their game goes under for being a poor product.
Oh I understand how the industry work completely. But really if its that bad ppl will unsub period.
One could also argue that ppl will be unsubbing due to seeing all the bots run rampant.
It does not count as bad. I'm thinking about heroics and raiding. People continue raiding cleared content just for gear. Farm mobs just for gear/rep . Noone really says oh i enjoy killing those mobs so much i just keep killing them on and on. It is all just a skinner box and frankly i don't like that.
Regarding bots: you only notice the bad ones. Good ones are undistuingishable from real players. (e.g. UT ) We are at a point were computers can drive cars on the street in heavy traffic. Getting a believable bot for a mmo shouldnt be a impossible problem.
I dont want to stray off topic here, but I will go ahead and say it. I'm pretty sure there will always be some sort of "grind" in any MMO genre. Weither it be lvls, for gear, for talent, rep, whatever. It's always gonna be there we will just add another tag to the "grind" cloud. I think the key would be to make it as fun as possible and perhaps dynamic (enemies change tactics, or learn from you countering your skill set etc)
This article is about the ppl who ruin our gaming experience by "cheating" or "modding" doing this because the game is boring, a grind, or even too hard, or easy. Doesn't make it right for you to ruin it for other players who enjoy playing the game. Besides, what is boring for you. Just might not be for everyone. Everything is subject to ones opinion. Except cheating, and even that is subject to opinion LOL I failed.
Any thread about piracy brings out the idiots who think there is no such thing as ownership etc. Go and see what the real world is like, get a job and a life; don’t just rely on what you heard in Sociology 101 and can find on the internet.
Ownership is a concept thus cannot be found "in real life" as you seam to pretend, its not an apple or anything physical. As any concept it is subject to history of mankind, and history isn't writen in your job, or life, it is written in the knowledge of people as any other concept.
This naturally if you don't consider yourself as getting your knowledge directly from God in your real life, naturally
Of course it's a concept. It differs from cultures to cultures and from time period to time period.
Luckily we know where we are and what time period we are in.
For instance, if I take your car or occupy your house or use your pants you might say "I don't want you to do those things, you are not entitled to it.
Unless you live in a culture and country that is somewhat sequestered away or adheres to some sort of community idea of ownership or that idea that land can't be owned it would be safe to say that when someone uses the word ownership we all know what they mean and practice it in some way in our own lives.
Or do you just go into a store and take a few tV's and then start telling the manager about ownership as a concept.
They like that you know.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
If I cracked it the way YOU whould then yeah I'd have a problem, but I use a modded CMOS
ok, BIOS. tomato/tomato
ok, that's not really what I do, sounds impressive tho. I actually paid $20 for a win7ultimate key on ebay. it's long since been blacklisted but I still use it & reload my operating system. I actually have a custom bios for my MB but have never been brave enough to try it out. lol
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
I buy all my games a friend of mine dl all games illegally he never payed for any of his games ever. Thats in my book STEALING.
I know few small game companys like IRONLORE (Titan Quest) who where bankrupt becouse most of there game was illegally downloaded.
And iron lore is not the only one. Sure maybe big boys still earn alot cash but many smaller ones will bankrupt if there game is downloaded by THIEFS/CRIMINALS.
Who cares about diablo its made by Blizzard a money grabbing bastard company, im more concerned with small indie companys who make great games but are at risk by these pirate sites.
I think your topic is rather dumb, becouse its in your own intrest piratesites should be left alone, so you can keep stealing games/movies/music or software for your PC as my friend do, i estimate he steals for at least over 1000euro prolly more a year.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77 CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now)) MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB PSU:Corsair AX1200i OS:Windows 10 64bit
I buy all my games a friend of mine dl all games illegally he never payed for any of his games ever. Thats in my book STEALING.
I know few small game companys like IRONLORE (Titan Quest) who where bankrupt becouse most of there game was illegally downloaded.
And iron lore is not the only one. Sure maybe big boys still earn alot cash but many smaller ones will bankrupt if there game is downloaded by THIEFS/CRIMINALS.
Who cares about diablo its made by Blizzard a money grabbing bastard company, im more concerned with small indie companys who make great games but are at risk by these pirate sites.
I think your topic is rather dumb, becouse its in your own intrest piratesites should be left alone, so you can keep stealing games/movies/music or software for your PC as my friend do, i estimate he steals for at least over 1000euro prolly more a year.
When you are stealing something the owner don't have it left. This is also wrong of course but more a case of copyright fraud, and slightly better.
Piracy have indeed hurt some companys badly. I remember the game Gianna sisters that were pulled back after a week due to a court decision (it was too close the super Mario bros). Everybody had it and closed to no one paid for it.
But computer piracy is lowest ever now and not the problem it used to be 20 years ago.
If I loan the same movie out to 50 people, it's different from burning 50 copies and giving those away because 1. Not everyone can watch it at the same time, and those who have to wait their turn might very well go buy the movie instead. 2. The original, purchased movie is likely to get lost in the process and never make it around to 50 people anyway.
As for loaning it to one person who then views it with 49 people, how many people can fit 50 into their living room?
If you went out and rented a movie theater and showed a movie to 50 of your friends, I'm not sure what the law would say, but I imagine if you did it once, without trying to profit, you wouldn't be sued, much less charged with any crime, because it wouldn't be worth it to the company and it would certainly be bad publicity. If you tried to charge money for it, however, you would probably not get away with it, or at least not very often, because then you and others who witnessed your profitable example would have motivation to keep renting out that theater and showing that movie.
As for friends and family vs strangers, what is the motive of someone copying a movie for a friend or family member? Non-profit and not to do harm to the company or deprive it of profit, or at least that's a fair assumption. It's simply an act of kindness toward a loved one. What is the motivation for sharing a movie with 10,000 strangers on the internet, though?
The only problem with the first part of yor post is that you are only dealing in the details not the main subject. This is all hypothetical. It doesn't matter if I can or can not fit 50 people in to my living room. It doesn't matter if the original purchase gets lost or not and it does not matter if everyone can watch it at the same time. It is a matter of one copy being purchased and 50 people watching it for free. Even the amount of people really does not matter 50 or 50,000. If you are of the opinion that piracy is wrong the amount of people involved should never matter. Something does not become right or wrong depending on the number of people.
The second part of your post involves renting a theater. This happens all the time for birthdays or events. Now renting the theater and then trying to charge people just wouldn't work and I'm pretty sure its illegal. I am against people profiting off of pirated content. I always have been and so are all of the people that pirate that I know of. I have never known anyone who has made money from doing it although I am sure there are many that do. Once you profit from it you cross the line. You are then taking money away from the people who created the product. You are taking away paying cutomers and that is wrong.
The third part talks about motive. Well what is the motive of people who do not profit from pirating games? Why would it have to be any different from someone who does it for friends or family. A lot of pirating groups see themselves as part of the gaming community. Maybe thats why they do it. Maybe they do it just because they can. They do not do it for profit though. Not the ones I know of.
Thats the problem..there is no easy answer no matter where we start from.
Stealing is wrong. Yes? Can we agree on that? If I go take your car its wrong. If I go take a car from the manufacturer its wrong. If I buy a car its right. Done, nuff said.
No. Stealing is only wrong depending on the circumstances and the perception of the people involved. Look through out history and tell me I am wrong.
If you don't have enough money for a car, you don't get the car. Right? If you borrow a friends car, they no longer have that car in their possession, you have it, therefore there is 1 car, that 2 people have used.
But what if I could make a copy of that car? If I had a magic cloning device? Would that still be stealing? The guy has his car that he paid for so the company that made the car also made money. I did not steal anything because no one lost anything.
Simple enough, right?
So far...no. If only it was that black and white.
You can sit in the car while your friend drives, or you can drive the car while your friend sits in it, or it could be one of those silly cars where both driver and passenger have steering wheels and breaks and gas pedals and you can both drive together, but at the end of the day, one person owns the car, the other does not.
Do we understand how ownership works? If you could duplicate the exact model car and give it away for free at no cost, name it the same, have all features the same, even use the manufactureres same employees and plants to build the cars, but have every car hotwired so the manufacturers laser cut keys no longer protect the cars, the manufacturer would see something wrong with that, don't you think? You are taking their work, what they did, and giving it away at no cost. The company loses.
Well yes at the point where I am using the labor and plants of the car company. Then they are losing money by me using their people and equipment to actually build cars. This is a pretty unrealistic example though I know where you are going with it. It is probably the worst example I have seen yet.
I know, hard to understand right? What if that car is a ford and you don't buy fords? But its free, so you'll take it, right? You weren't going to buy it anyway, you don't have the money, and since they weren't going to get your business its okay to just, take a car. Its stealing. Remember up there, where stealing is wrong? You can't rationalize it. Stealing is wrong. Pirating is stealing. Thats all there is to it.
We will go back to the stealing part. What am I stealing? Does Ford still have their cars? Does Ford still have the ability to sell their cars? Did I stop the progress of Ford at all by cloning a car?
If you are going to use cars then I would say that my cloned car is not as good as the ford. I can not get my car serviced, I can only drive on a limited amount of roads, I can not put accessories on my car, and I can only fit one person in my car unless I go find a private road. The real car will also in all likely hood go faster and run better. My cloned car also has the potential of exploding or just not working from the get go.
If it wasn't "wrong" in moral standards, its still "wrong" in societal standards, which then is "wrong" in legal standards too. Stealing is as wrong as, say, using your neighbors wi-fi. You aren't paying for it, you don't have the money for it, and since your neighbors encryption is so easy to crack, why not steal it? Thats not wrong is it? Well, actually, yes it is, very much so, and its the same thing here.
You see that is only your perception. As another poster said it is not illegal in his country to download pirated games. I believe he said it was only illegal to profit from them. So his country must have a lesser moral standards than yours, the standards of his society are lower than yours, and his legal system is inferior to yours. You must be American.
Just wrap it up, stealing internet service is wrong, stealing cable is wrong, stealing songs, stealing games, ponies, cars, people, guitars, lemons, taco trucks, website domain names, lobster bisque. Stealing all those things are wrong whether you have the money to buy them or not. Twist it how you want, companies do lose money when you steal shit. If you want it enough to steal it, then you'll buy it. Thats all.
None of those things can compare to pirated games and you know it. They are completely different much like your car example that I indulged you with. In your mind stealing is stealing and thats bad mmmmkay. The world is not as simple as that. I'm sorry you really can not see the differences. You see when you steal any of those other things people actually lose something. When you pirate a game it does not hurt anyone and indeed there are many cases where it has actually helped them.
You'll never understand that taking software is wrong. Lets address your questions because people obviously don't understand:
First:
Stealing is only wrong depending on the circumstances and the perception of the people involved. Look through out history and tell me I am wrong.
You are wrong.
But what if I could make a copy of that car? If I had a magic cloning device? Would that still be stealing?
Yes. It would. You didn't design the car, you didn't pay for the engineers to design it, you didn't crash test it or give it ratings, you didn't spend money on advertising and production. You stole their designs, one of the reasons pattent laws are what they are. Litigation from such is very big right now.
We will go back to the stealing part. What am I stealing? Does Ford still have their cars? Does Ford still have the ability to sell their cars? Did I stop the progress of Ford at all by cloning a car?
You stole a car that you did not pay for. Thats what you stole. You took the exact car, which was against the law and against most peoples morals (to create an exact copy of something that you didn't create and not give the creators their credit or compensation). If you did not have another option to steal it, you would have had to buy it. Case closed. No "I can borrow it from a friend" well your friend had to buy it, and its still 1 purchased copy no matter how many times you play it, or if you sell it afterwards.
As another poster said it is not illegal in his country to download pirated games.
I'd like to know what country that is. You hear a lot of bullshit on these forums. "My country doesn't care if you steal software" Well, in a country like albania or something yeah, I'm sure theres plenty of things that aren't considered illegal having to do with intellectual properties and patents. Doesn't mean its right morally, or that a company even considers that country a market for the games people are stealing.
None of those things can compare to pirated games and you know it. ... You see when you steal any of those other things people actually lose something. When you pirate a game it does not hurt anyone and indeed there are many cases where it has actually helped them.
Actually, all of those things compare. The company still loses something. They lose customers. While everyone wants to pretend "Oh if I pirate the game, I'll just buy it later." What a load of crap and everyone who pirates knows it. You can try a trial for a game, not steal the damn thing, and furthermore if you already have a full working version, you aren't going to buy it. Where are you statistics? Everyone says how Pirating games HELPS developers, but I can't seem to find anything talking about how awesome pirating games happens to be for developers. In fact, I see the opposite quite a bit:
Some interesting notes... Dantes inferno was pirated much more than it sold. Projections stated football manager would have doubled in sales had they not have had to worry about piracy. In some cases they are saying that piracy rates are up to 90% of the title, that means overall sales are only 10% of the games overall potential if they didn't have pirates stealing copies to play them.
But you're saying "but they wouldn't have bought them anyways" yeah, well take into consideration over 1 million people stole dantes inferno, you don't think that if they couldn't steal it that at least 10K of those people wouldn't have just buckled and bought the game within 6 months instead of never buying it?
""If the game gets pirated heavily, if it's a good game that people really like, they're going to either buy it eventually or they're going to tell other people about it. Either way it's just going to come back to a sale." " but later ...
"There's a strange paradox going on here. Because although these guys believe piracy is a good thing, its utility as a marketing tool partly depends on people feeling guilty about the act of stealing. "
And another "piracy may be good" article, lots of caveats and theories, but nothing in practice:
"Many pirates say that they would never have bought much of the stuff they downloaded or copied. If you fall into this category, you might be a ‘good’ or ‘promotional’ pirate. " But no real information to back it up other than : “Building a theoretical model of `promotional piracy’,” says Croxson, “it is possible to distinguish markets that are best advised to put considerable resource into safeguarding their products from others which may live quite comfortably with a higher incidence of digital piracy.”
Comments
Then no real reason to respond when people call you out as the criminal you are, right, because you're all good with it.
Works both ways.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
lol, judging by most of the comments I read it seems you guys didnt read the full article. It really isnt about pirating, it's about the modders/cheaters/hackers/losers ruining the games.
"OMG an article with the title Game Piracy is B.S." I must post and defend pirating lawl. Go fail again.
Pirating isn't anything new. Hell as a gamer who is 27 years old i will openly admit that when we had the 386 PC we never ever paid for games. I didn't even know you could buy games. They wheren'nt in the stores. You just got a floppy disk from a friend. coppied it and then you owned the game. They magicly appeared out of the blue. No one knew where they came from, it was always from a friend.
Then the CD-rom came, but internet wasn't commen yet and lets admit it, downloading games with a 56k modem as max speed wouldn't be a succes anyway. In the cd-rom time you had these cd-roms called "twillights" they put many many games and other software on it. All illigale. Again no one knew where these twillights came from, people just had them and spread them around.
The game industry survived all those activities. Only know they complain cause people use the internet for it and now its easyer for them to see the numbers. But i doubt there is more piracy then there was in the past. And if there is more piracy then perhaps the devs should look at themselfs. After all singleplayer games become rare and most of them are done in 4 to 5 hours. I mean come one, you demand 50 euro for it and then give us only a shitty amount of gameplay time in return, no wonder people pirate it. Thats what you get when you ask more for less. People aren't willing to pay 50 euro's for 4 to 5 hours gameplay (yes CoD im looking at you with your broken multiplayer for the pc ever since modern warfare 2).
And now we come to the cheaters/modders. I say their penatly for ruining the gameplay experience for others and sometimes killing entire games multiplayer with their hacks...they should get perma bann from the internet. Thats the only penalty that helps. You can't block them from games cause they will find a way to get in again. Perma bann from the internet unless its in a public area where they can't install shit on their pc's, let allone hacks. If you commit a murder in RL you end up behind bars for many years. This is a risk you take when you break the law and you know it. hackers/cheaters should the same penalty. Being caught hacking/cheating in a game and destroying the game for it. 5 to 10 year internet ban. Boom no warnings, screw them its not like they are worthy people anyway. These people hack/cheat to win, infact i see them in many shooters and it are the same kids who call you a noob....who's the noob? Me who can't kill him cause he has god mode one and can see trough walls, or him who can't win without his pathetic hacks. I don't care they are 16 or younger, give hard penalties. I left to many games cause of hackers, games i enjoyed but couldn't enjoy anymore with the huge ammount of hackers.
The short of it is
The simple fact that while hacks, mods, cheats and exploits might annoy or even anger you. Such things happen in games because 1) Programmers do what they can to make sure the game runs as they expect 2) They purposely program in dev codes for themselves and their testers and leave them in the final production and 3) Gamers, by default are intelligent wily bastards and will do whatever they can to crack a game and exploit it like the whore it is.
However I posted about this at length on my blog http://theknightednerd.wordpress.com
So basically you are an admitted thief and don't feel all that bad about it. Well except that you think it might be ruining you gaming experience so you now pay for games at least? Still a thief and no better than a mugger on the street. Actually worse, a mugger at least has to face the people they are stealing from.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
I think you mean.
3) Gamers, by default are intelligent wily bastards and will do whatever they can to crack("rape") a game and whore out the exploits like the pimps they think they are.
I use that term rape because to me thats exactly what these types of ppl are doing. Feeding their power ego preying on our grief.
You call them Pirates/Modders/Cheaters/Exploiters/etc I call them rapists.
Mwahahahaha!
Hey bakagami I hope you like being part of botnet. Enjoy your exploited system. LoL pirated win 7.
If I cracked it the way YOU whould then yeah I'd have a problem, but I use a modded CMOS
Anyways back on topic...
I think we the (legit) players should band together, create some new jobs and form some organizations. Play our games, catch these ppl, and do something about it! I absolutely hate when I buy a game then only to find that its plagued with this sorta thing.
I want to add an interesting article I found : http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2003/may/22/games.onlinesupplement
Sometimes i wonder if a undetectable intelligent bot wouldnt be the best thing that could happen to mmos. People might stop grinding sit back realise what the bot does for them is a stupid skinner box and finally /unsub. Would force devs to produce fun content free of grind.
Pi*1337/100 = 42
Yeah blame the devs, for their content being a grind. LOL Don't make me laugh. If i get pulled over for speeding let me try to blame the state for it being their fault I was speeding.
"I'm sorry officer, these speedlimits here are too slow, making my drive to work boring."
"It's the states fault for making it so slow"
"And yes officer, the state is only making ppl speed by setting the limits so slow to make money from all the tickets you issue"
Do you relally not understand how the industry works? They want money so they need to keep you subbed. Only way to develop as fast as people consume is grind. So they feed you grind with a carrot (loot) on a stick to keep you subbed. If people would get some distance by not playing themselves through that they might /unsub more likely which would force devs to go other ways.
Pi*1337/100 = 42
Oh I understand how the industry work completely. But really if its that bad ppl will unsub period.
One could also argue that ppl will be unsubbing due to seeing all the bots run rampant.
I'm sorry I let my emotions get the best of me, this is a very touchy subject for me. I feel as if I've thrown away money due to this sorta thing. I don't mean to come off as rude.
Even if the game is a grind, and you feel that its not right what the devs do to keep you hooked into playing for as long as possible. It doesnt make it right to take a shortcut there. When the rest of us work, and work hard at it to get to the same finish line. Yes I will agree developers need to come up with a better hook to keep us playing other then a grind. But, resorting to bots to make them see what a waste of time it was for them to do it isnt the answer. If you feel you need to cheat to "payback" the developers. Just stop playing the game. That will hurt them more, and make them think more when their game goes under for being a poor product.
It does not count as bad. I'm thinking about heroics and raiding. People continue raiding cleared content just for gear. Farm mobs just for gear/rep . Noone really says oh i enjoy killing those mobs so much i just keep killing them on and on. It is all just a skinner box and frankly i don't like that.
Regarding bots: you only notice the bad ones. Good ones are undistuingishable from real players. (e.g. UT ) We are at a point were computers can drive cars on the street in heavy traffic. Getting a believable bot for a mmo shouldnt be a impossible problem.
Pi*1337/100 = 42
I dont want to stray off topic here, but I will go ahead and say it. I'm pretty sure there will always be some sort of "grind" in any MMO genre. Weither it be lvls, for gear, for talent, rep, whatever. It's always gonna be there we will just add another tag to the "grind" cloud. I think the key would be to make it as fun as possible and perhaps dynamic (enemies change tactics, or learn from you countering your skill set etc)
This article is about the ppl who ruin our gaming experience by "cheating" or "modding" doing this because the game is boring, a grind, or even too hard, or easy. Doesn't make it right for you to ruin it for other players who enjoy playing the game. Besides, what is boring for you. Just might not be for everyone. Everything is subject to ones opinion. Except cheating, and even that is subject to opinion LOL I failed.
Of course it's a concept. It differs from cultures to cultures and from time period to time period.
Luckily we know where we are and what time period we are in.
For instance, if I take your car or occupy your house or use your pants you might say "I don't want you to do those things, you are not entitled to it.
Unless you live in a culture and country that is somewhat sequestered away or adheres to some sort of community idea of ownership or that idea that land can't be owned it would be safe to say that when someone uses the word ownership we all know what they mean and practice it in some way in our own lives.
Or do you just go into a store and take a few tV's and then start telling the manager about ownership as a concept.
They like that you know.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
ok, that's not really what I do, sounds impressive tho. I actually paid $20 for a win7ultimate key on ebay. it's long since been blacklisted but I still use it & reload my operating system. I actually have a custom bios for my MB but have never been brave enough to try it out. lol
Paging Dr. Lawrence Kohlberg!
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
I buy all my games a friend of mine dl all games illegally he never payed for any of his games ever. Thats in my book STEALING.
I know few small game companys like IRONLORE (Titan Quest) who where bankrupt becouse most of there game was illegally downloaded.
And iron lore is not the only one. Sure maybe big boys still earn alot cash but many smaller ones will bankrupt if there game is downloaded by THIEFS/CRIMINALS.
Who cares about diablo its made by Blizzard a money grabbing bastard company, im more concerned with small indie companys who make great games but are at risk by these pirate sites.
I think your topic is rather dumb, becouse its in your own intrest piratesites should be left alone, so you can keep stealing games/movies/music or software for your PC as my friend do, i estimate he steals for at least over 1000euro prolly more a year.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77
CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k
GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now))
MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB
PSU:Corsair AX1200i
OS:Windows 10 64bit
When you are stealing something the owner don't have it left. This is also wrong of course but more a case of copyright fraud, and slightly better.
Piracy have indeed hurt some companys badly. I remember the game Gianna sisters that were pulled back after a week due to a court decision (it was too close the super Mario bros). Everybody had it and closed to no one paid for it.
But computer piracy is lowest ever now and not the problem it used to be 20 years ago.
The only problem with the first part of yor post is that you are only dealing in the details not the main subject. This is all hypothetical. It doesn't matter if I can or can not fit 50 people in to my living room. It doesn't matter if the original purchase gets lost or not and it does not matter if everyone can watch it at the same time. It is a matter of one copy being purchased and 50 people watching it for free. Even the amount of people really does not matter 50 or 50,000. If you are of the opinion that piracy is wrong the amount of people involved should never matter. Something does not become right or wrong depending on the number of people.
The second part of your post involves renting a theater. This happens all the time for birthdays or events. Now renting the theater and then trying to charge people just wouldn't work and I'm pretty sure its illegal. I am against people profiting off of pirated content. I always have been and so are all of the people that pirate that I know of. I have never known anyone who has made money from doing it although I am sure there are many that do. Once you profit from it you cross the line. You are then taking money away from the people who created the product. You are taking away paying cutomers and that is wrong.
The third part talks about motive. Well what is the motive of people who do not profit from pirating games? Why would it have to be any different from someone who does it for friends or family. A lot of pirating groups see themselves as part of the gaming community. Maybe thats why they do it. Maybe they do it just because they can. They do not do it for profit though. Not the ones I know of.
You'll never understand that taking software is wrong. Lets address your questions because people obviously don't understand:
First:
Stealing is only wrong depending on the circumstances and the perception of the people involved. Look through out history and tell me I am wrong.
You are wrong.
But what if I could make a copy of that car? If I had a magic cloning device? Would that still be stealing?
Yes. It would. You didn't design the car, you didn't pay for the engineers to design it, you didn't crash test it or give it ratings, you didn't spend money on advertising and production. You stole their designs, one of the reasons pattent laws are what they are. Litigation from such is very big right now.
We will go back to the stealing part. What am I stealing? Does Ford still have their cars? Does Ford still have the ability to sell their cars? Did I stop the progress of Ford at all by cloning a car?
You stole a car that you did not pay for. Thats what you stole. You took the exact car, which was against the law and against most peoples morals (to create an exact copy of something that you didn't create and not give the creators their credit or compensation). If you did not have another option to steal it, you would have had to buy it. Case closed. No "I can borrow it from a friend" well your friend had to buy it, and its still 1 purchased copy no matter how many times you play it, or if you sell it afterwards.
As another poster said it is not illegal in his country to download pirated games.
I'd like to know what country that is. You hear a lot of bullshit on these forums. "My country doesn't care if you steal software" Well, in a country like albania or something yeah, I'm sure theres plenty of things that aren't considered illegal having to do with intellectual properties and patents. Doesn't mean its right morally, or that a company even considers that country a market for the games people are stealing.
None of those things can compare to pirated games and you know it. ... You see when you steal any of those other things people actually lose something. When you pirate a game it does not hurt anyone and indeed there are many cases where it has actually helped them.
Actually, all of those things compare. The company still loses something. They lose customers. While everyone wants to pretend "Oh if I pirate the game, I'll just buy it later." What a load of crap and everyone who pirates knows it. You can try a trial for a game, not steal the damn thing, and furthermore if you already have a full working version, you aren't going to buy it. Where are you statistics? Everyone says how Pirating games HELPS developers, but I can't seem to find anything talking about how awesome pirating games happens to be for developers. In fact, I see the opposite quite a bit:
http://www.cracked.com/article_19162_6-hilarious-ways-game-designers-are-screwing-with-pirates.html
http://www.insidegamingdaily.com/2010/12/29/the-most-pirated-games-of-2010/
http://www.tuaw.com/2011/07/15/developer-frustrated-over-game-center-use-by-pirates/
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-30-how-bad-is-pc-piracy-really-article
http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/news/2005/12/69785
http://articles.cnn.com/2009-04-17/entertainment/online.piracy.for.against_1_file-sharing-online-piracy-pirate-bay?_s=PM:SHOWBIZ
And of course I could keep going all day.
Some interesting notes... Dantes inferno was pirated much more than it sold. Projections stated football manager would have doubled in sales had they not have had to worry about piracy. In some cases they are saying that piracy rates are up to 90% of the title, that means overall sales are only 10% of the games overall potential if they didn't have pirates stealing copies to play them.
But you're saying "but they wouldn't have bought them anyways" yeah, well take into consideration over 1 million people stole dantes inferno, you don't think that if they couldn't steal it that at least 10K of those people wouldn't have just buckled and bought the game within 6 months instead of never buying it?
Heres a good one from the "proponents" of piracy:
http://pc.ign.com/articles/118/1184546p1.html
but if you read closely:
""If the game gets pirated heavily, if it's a good game that people really like, they're going to either buy it eventually or they're going to tell other people about it. Either way it's just going to come back to a sale." " but later ...
"There's a strange paradox going on here. Because although these guys believe piracy is a good thing, its utility as a marketing tool partly depends on people feeling guilty about the act of stealing. "
And another "piracy may be good" article, lots of caveats and theories, but nothing in practice:
http://torrentfreak.com/good-pirates-help-businesses-sell-more-product-080324/
"Many pirates say that they would never have bought much of the stuff they downloaded or copied. If you fall into this category, you might be a ‘good’ or ‘promotional’ pirate. " But no real information to back it up other than : “Building a theoretical model of `promotional piracy’,” says Croxson, “it is possible to distinguish markets that are best advised to put considerable resource into safeguarding their products from others which may live quite comfortably with a higher incidence of digital piracy.”