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Another F2P game goes pay to win - LOTR
Puremallace
Member Posts: 1,856
My opinion: The payment model is completely broken and this is the obvious result of it. Hate on P2P games all you want, but the prime example of a game that suceeded as F2P has gone pay to win. Sad day for the damn genre right here.
In July 2010, Massively was told by Turbine that the then-coming LotRO store "would not sell any gear with stats attached." And while the studio has so far kept to the letter of the law, it has fudged the spirit of it with the sales of stat tomes (which boost stats independently of gear) and the addition of statted gear to PvMP (monster play).
Consider the law cast aside today, then, as Turbine's announced the coming sale of statted gear in the LotRO store to normal PvE play as well. Light, medium, and heavy armor pieces will soon be available for purchase in the cash shop, and will come with beneficial stats attached. In addition to the typical stats, the store boots will come with a 8% run out-of-combat run speed boost attached.
While the gear in question has reasonable stats, it certainly raises the specter of the game's heading toward pay-to-win territory by having it for sale at all.
Massively has reached out to Turbine for an official comment.
Comments
Totally NOT surprised. I will sound like a douche ,but I saw that coming and that's why I left Lotro in middle of 2011 (I played it as p2p and then for quite a few months after change to freemium).
Is that equipment even consider good in lotro? And how much is 195-295 turbine dollar in real life?
I thought you can grind those through quest or something.
In the p2w game I play it literally cost 50,000$ to fully gear up yourself. I just take it as it's probably not that bad.
I am not surprised. Turbine did a great job with the store and F2P conversion of DDO, but I never really like what they did to LOTRO. I think this one should have stayed P2P.
The issue is this is exactly how it starts. Marketers throw the line in the water and see how many bites they get. If you learn one thing from Blizzard it is how to condition your players and brainwash them into thinking bad crap is good. Turbine is pulling a page out of Blizzards book here.
I have to act mad about this because if there isnt a huge outcry SoE will see they can get away with it and do it for EQ2 so. RAGE ABOUT A GAME I DONT CARE ABOUT IT
(I honestly dont think its *that* big of deal, it really doesnt affect anything and the thread title i smisleading, this is *not* pay to win. Pay to win involves the best gear being bought with money)
It is still P2win no matter how much we are talking about.
And yeah, you can grind at least some but it is a lot of work and you need to unlock stuff like quests and expansions as well.
Hook, line, sinker!
Free online MMOs
How good is those gear in Lotro, and how much is 195-295 turbine money.
I curious, because I'm thinking of playing lotro again. I tried it for a few days before I quit.
Mordor will be pleased with this corruption.
Well, now its a case of wait and see the results.
Will P2W make lots of real money in Lotro, if it does we will see it spread to all major MMO's that have investor groups fairly rapidly, or will it fail and the players of lotro either desert it in droves or raise an uproar to have the decision reversed?
Though with the involvement of Warner Bros (and their position on SOPA/PIPA) i dont see them reversing the decision.
F2P/P2P excellent thread.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/282517/F2P-An-Engineers-perspective.html
I will never play another Turbine game again. It doesn't matter if the gear they're selling is only low to mid level or not. The whole P2W thing is for people with more money than brains. Think about it. People are actually paying companies to play the game for them essentially. Why in the hell do these people even play games in the first place?
whats LOTR?
Sooo, they added Pay to Win to his former Pay to Advance model, this is a perfect example of what F2P mmorpgs must avoid at all costs. Very bad Turbine, very bad...
So where is this posted at the main site cause I went looking for info on there main forums and on the test forums and nothing nowhere on this can you link to more real info then a post made at massivly thank you.
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Indeed, if this move makes them more money from store sales, the range of P2W gear will be expanded. And other games with cash shops will follow their lead. And games without cash shops will start thinking very hard about all the money they could be losing out on...
But a lot of people will buy the stuff, of course. The age-old argument of "I don't have time to grind for decent gear, I have a real life too" will no doubt prevail. Everybody wants everything quickly these days, so game companies simply cater to demand
The stats on that gear are terrible, but it's a slippery slope and I would imagine we'll eventually see stuff at least on par with level 75 crafted armour. Poor decision, Turbine.
Of course.
Most f2p companies takes baby step with things like that and Turbine is exceptionally good at this, especially that Lotro has some almost fanatically loyal LOTR IP fans playing (up to a point, when I was still playng few Tolkien fans left as well from my guild & fr list)so they are pushing boundaries bit by bit by bit.
Current armor is just testing waters
Once community reaction will calm dawn, then'll wait a bit and add something more. They always do. That's what f2[ / freemium business model is all about.
One cannot simply buy their way into Mordor.
In away its the PLAYERS fault as long many players are willing to pay for this and its legal to implement this why would this stop a company of not implement it.
With so many Korean/Chinese/Philipines F2P TSUNAMI of mmo's released every month this is result.
Stop buying then and problem solved it self or dont play the game. But im almost 100% convince all who come complain here with maybe few exceptions are still playing the games they constantly complain about.
Only way solve problems is not paying or buying.
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Same thing with me but I left right before the change. Loved the game but knew where the F2P crap was leading it...
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
it's newbie levelling gear. basically, at low levels, if you don't pick a crafting profession to make your own armor then you have a hard time getting any decent defense. no newbies have the amount of silver/gold required to pay the insane AH prices on crafting mats or equipment, and you're lucky to find skirmish vendor equips tailored to your needs unless you're a guardian, minstrel, or hunter.
it's convenience, which they have ALWAYS sold in the cash shop. this is further proven by the fact that it has a run speed buff on it. almost no equipment buffs your move speed. this armor exists to make the early levels a little more about just getting things done and progressing in the game, rather than spending loads of time farming mats or replaying skirmishes in order to gear up.
if that's not enough for you, turbine have stated that this is the intention of the cash shop armor. they're not stupid. the LOTR playerbase is much smaller than it used to be, and they won't do something to alienate the players they have left.
the 'pay to win' notion is also completely ridiculous when referring to LOTR. paying to win at what? lotro is a PvE game. too many people who don't know what they're looking at are overreacting to something they dont understand in a game they don't play.
I really enjoyed the game till they implemented F2P then my respect went down for them. They didn't need to go F2P, they had a solid and loyal playerbase more mature than most communities out there that could forgive their blunders and be patient. Despite interesting innovations like skirmishes, F2P really nagged on me everytime I saw the "in-your-face" Lotro Store even in loading screens between zones and instances, talk about immersion breaking! I felt betrayed as a lifetime supporter.
The basic line of what mmo represented for me when I started them in 2003 was that we lived in a equal world where everyone could achieve the same level of skills and get the same gear if they put the same time and efforts for it. With F2P LOTRO started selling a lot of conveniences that introduced inequality, reduced grind, augmented virtues if you PAID REAL MONEY FOR IT. Selling gear is destroying the crafting economy too and killing the virtual world by reminding us it's only a product to make money and not the cool virtual world it was back in 2007 :°(
I think that was this what really changed lately: mmos lost the appeal of a virtual world where you can be anything or anyone else and unwind. I'm also a lifetimer at LOTRO. I'm a very casual player. I LOTRO I never felt rushed because I didn't have to pay, but the Shop advertisements screens really put me off. LOTRO, like WoW, as a matter of fact, are losing, for different reasons, the "virtual world, be anything, roleplay" appeal. They are just online games. Maybe only the gamers, the consumers, are to blame about this, I don't know...
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I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.
This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.
Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.
Such a major IP, wasted to such an unable company as Turbine.
I said from the very beginning on, this IP deserved a huge sandbox-game supported by a real company. I wonder how Turbine got the license in first place.
"Lord of the rings" could and should have been so much more than this.