Show me where they said they're not possible... And name me all of these MMO's with that stuff that are good?
'good'???
they wrote a cop-out and anyone with a measureable IQ knows it
'cant make player housing like the fans want it'
what do they mean by 'like they want it'? that is a copout much like your 'good' is.
Problem with this is, if I explained what I think they mean "fans want", you'd not even consider it, because that would require an ability to not think you know it all. So why should I bother.
ANd good is key, good is what sets precedent, not bad.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Originally posted by SEANMCAD 1. many of the features they are saying are not possible EXIST TODAY IN MANY MMOs! 2. actually I have created player transformation in neverwinters. Yes I understand that is not a massive game but I did it in about 10 minutes. 3. ever think of 'by night player can transform but by day he can not'? 4. build it yourself if you dont like it. logic means nobodo can express themselves about anything at all. Not your neighboor building a chicken farm, not your govement going to war, not the freeway that is being build over your house, nothing. its silly logic
1. You did not provide any quotes nor the game is released nor there is even enough information out there to make qualified judgement, therefore there is little to discuss.
Then again, just because certain features exist in different games does not make it feasible or desired to be implemented into a single game.
2. Eh..so what?
3. Quite losing a point of whole Vampirism thing as day light cycles are vital part of the thing....
4. You mix public interests and private property.
Just because your logic is ill, does not make mine silly.
Show me where they said they're not possible... And name me all of these MMO's with that stuff that are good?
'good'???
they wrote a cop-out and anyone with a measureable IQ knows it
'cant make player housing like the fans want it'
what do they mean by 'like they want it'? that is a copout much like your 'good' is.
Problem with this is, if I explained what I think they mean "fans want", yo'd not even consider it, because that would require an ability to not think you know it all.
becuase its an easy out. when they say 'fans' which fans are they refering to? and no you dont know anymore than I do.
fans dont always agree and they often do come up with some crazy ideas but they are using that as a reason why no housing AT ALL is justified and that is just plain silly.
besides, housing in say star wars gaxay not only existed more than 10 years ago its pretty much considered to be the pennaical of housing.
That said, I would simply go for a slightly modified Darkfall platform (not just housing but everything).
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
a lot of the features they are removing and claiming will not work well in an MMO exist in MMOs.
skill based, player housing, FPS as a key example. Cant have vampirism? you must be joking.
Not all of the features have technical limitations but some are more complex and related to design ie. Vampirism is sensitive to day light cycles which is easy to manage in single player game but hard to manage in real time online world.
Originally posted by SEANMCAD
let me check my bank account...nope, turns out I dont have 20+ million dollars. damn!
Then stop telling others how to spend theirs +20M...it is their money, not yours.
1. many of the features they are saying are not possible EXIST TODAY IN MANY MMOs!
2. actually I have created player transformation in neverwinters. Yes I understand that is not a massive game but I did it in about 10 minutes.
3. ever think of 'by night player can transform but by day he can not'?
4. build it yourself if you dont like it. logic means nobodo can express themselves about anything at all. Not your neighboor building a chicken farm, not your govement going to war, not the freeway that is being build over your house, nothing. its silly logic
No it is not a silly logic. Just like how you don't need to be a top chef to know that food you are eating tastes horrible. Feel free to tell the cook, this food tastes bad. But that is where criticism should stop.
But if you insist on telling him that you know how to cook a better meal then be ready to go in the kitchen and prove it, to justify your criticism and claims of 'being better'.
if a chef makes food I do not like I have the freedom to say it. I can say to anyone who will listen 'I am sorry I really dont like the food at X place and here is why'
You are saying I can not
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
1. many of the features they are saying are not possible EXIST TODAY IN MANY MMOs!
2. actually I have created player transformation in neverwinters. Yes I understand that is not a massive game but I did it in about 10 minutes.
3. ever think of 'by night player can transform but by day he can not'?
4. build it yourself if you dont like it. logic means nobodo can express themselves about anything at all. Not your neighboor building a chicken farm, not your govement going to war, not the freeway that is being build over your house, nothing. its silly logic
1. You did not provide any quotes nor the game is released nor there is even enough information out there to make qualified judgement, therefore there is little to discuss.
Then again, just because certain features exist in different games does not make it feasible or desired to be implemented into a single game.
2. Eh..so what?
3. Quite losing a point of whole Vampirism thing as day light cycles are vital part of the thing....
4. You mix public interests and private property.
Just because your logic is ill, does not make mine silly.
I dont have a lot of time left this morning. but yes, around 10 mins. It was a long time ago so I am not exactly sure the timing. How did I do that? change the player stats...simple.
Night falls, yout stats change your model changes. its not that hard.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Yes they have a right to make whatever they want and I have the right to tell as many people as I want that its crap and why I think that it is and I have the right to not play it and I assure you in mass many of us will not play it and we will be vocal about it.
Sorry if that seems unfair.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Why bash ESO and not crap like TERA or SW:TOR? Unlike these games, ESO still has a chance to be an innovative game. Just wait and see, if ESO goes in wrong direction, it will be because of those people who create the hype around shallow games like TERA.
Originally posted by SEANMCAD I dont have a lot of time left this morning. but yes, around 10 mins. It was a long time ago so I am not exactly sure the timing. How did I do that? change the player stats...simple. Night falls, yout stats change your model changes. its not that hard.
It is not only time your are missing, I am afraid...
Try to play Skyrim without Rest button or any other time related feature and tell me how it goes...
a lot of the features they are removing and claiming will not work well in an MMO exist in MMOs.
skill based, player housing, FPS as a key example. Cant have vampirism? you must be joking.
Not all of the features have technical limitations but some are more complex and related to design ie. Vampirism is sensitive to day light cycles which is easy to manage in single player game but hard to manage in real time online world.
Originally posted by SEANMCAD
let me check my bank account...nope, turns out I dont have 20+ million dollars. damn!
Then stop telling others how to spend theirs +20M...it is their money, not yours.
1. many of the features they are saying are not possible EXIST TODAY IN MANY MMOs!
2. actually I have created player transformation in neverwinters. Yes I understand that is not a massive game but I did it in about 10 minutes.
3. ever think of 'by night player can transform but by day he can not'?
4. build it yourself if you dont like it. logic means nobodo can express themselves about anything at all. Not your neighboor building a chicken farm, not your govement going to war, not the freeway that is being build over your house, nothing. its silly logic
No it is not a silly logic. Just like how you don't need to be a top chef to know that food you are eating tastes horrible. Feel free to tell the cook, this food tastes bad. But that is where criticism should stop.
But if you insist on telling him that you know how to cook a better meal then be ready to go in the kitchen and prove it, to justify your criticism and claims of 'being better'.
if a chef makes food I do not like I have the freedom to say it. I can say to anyone who will listen 'I am sorry I really dont like the food at X place and here is why'
You are saying I can not
Umm nope, you can tell him why the food sucks..but if you are going to throw in 'and yes i am a chef too' line....please feel free to prove it. Talk is cheap that is all i am saying.
Umm nope, you can tell him why the food sucks..but if you are going to throw in 'and yes i am a chef too' line....please feel free to prove it. Talk is cheap that is all i am saying.
oh I understand it now.
I am a chef and I have made a meal very close to what he is suggesting and I know exactly how I would go about doing it. But because I havent done it I should not say it.
gotcha!
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
What the fuck is wrong with you people, all we've seen is a CGI trailer and ONE screenshot. How do you even begin to judge a game from just that? we have no information at all to how the game will play. Fuckin' hell i can't express how stupid you look right now.
I dont have a lot of time left this morning. but yes, around 10 mins. It was a long time ago so I am not exactly sure the timing. How did I do that? change the player stats...simple.
Night falls, yout stats change your model changes. its not that hard.
It is not only time your are missing, I am afraid...
Try to play Skyrim without Rest button or any other time related feature and tell me how it goes...
again its not that hard and I have for the most part actually done it.
The game engine knows when its night. and we all know your stats can change because it happens in ALL MMO's. So when night, stats change and model changes.
trust me its not that hard. They are coping out.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Umm nope, you can tell him why the food sucks..but if you are going to throw in 'and yes i am a chef too' line....please feel free to prove it. Talk is cheap that is all i am saying.
oh I understand it now.
I am a chef and I have made a meal very close to what he is suggesting and I know exactly how I would go about doing it. But because I havent done it I should not say it.
gotcha!
Critcising food is not the same as criticisng the method used to cook and ability of the chef. That is why i rolled eyes when you said ' i am a programmer '. That is when people would stop and think 'show us then, you surely know better'.
Originally posted by SEANMCAD again its not that hard and I have for the most part actually done it. The game engine knows when its night. and we all know your stats can change because it happens in ALL MMO's. So when night, stats change and model changes. trust me its not that hard. They are coping out.
Read my previous post again...and again..and eventually again...if you do not get it by then, there is little reason to continue the discussion.
Umm nope, you can tell him why the food sucks..but if you are going to throw in 'and yes i am a chef too' line....please feel free to prove it. Talk is cheap that is all i am saying.
oh I understand it now.
I am a chef and I have made a meal very close to what he is suggesting and I know exactly how I would go about doing it. But because I havent done it I should not say it.
gotcha!
Critcising food is not the same as criticisng the method used to cook and ability of the chef. That is why i rolled eyes when you said ' i am a programmer '.
i dont see how it matters. You are saying the exact same logic DOES work as a chef but not as a programmer.
look folks we know vaprism is possible not becuase I say so but because THEY HAVE ALREADY DONE IT.
they are claiming it can not be done in an MMO. not that it cant be done at all.
Would it have to be different? I dont know, why not. different and NOT AT ALL are two radically different things
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
becuase its an easy out. when they say 'fans' which fans are they refering to? and no you dont know anymore than I do.
fans dont always agree and they often do come up with some crazy ideas but they are using that as a reason why no housing AT ALL is justified and that is just plain silly.
besides, housing in say star wars gaxay not only existed more than 10 years ago its pretty much considered to be the pennaical of housing.
That said, I would simply go for a slightly modified Darkfall platform (not just housing but everything).
But is it justified as a pinnacle of housing, as it didn't show to be healthy once players left, this puts a load on development to do something, instead of working on new additions they're left "fixing" problems. This same thing could be said about a lot of the features you as well as others are bringing up, skill based (horrible for balance), housing, freedom, the more freedom the less in control a dev is.
It's funny how a bad implementation in the long run is all of a sudden a pinnacle now.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Anything short of BETHESDA making an Elder Scrolls game built with online capabilities is going to be a betrayal of the series.
Name me ONE series that had a game made by a DIFFERENT company that did not royally screw it up...and now we are talking about a persistant world online game...
TESO is not and never was to be a part of TES series. Got it?
TESO Designers stated they are TARGETING TES fans. Got it? Also, making a TESO game not like TES IS a betrayal of the series...got it?
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
becuase its an easy out. when they say 'fans' which fans are they refering to? and no you dont know anymore than I do.
fans dont always agree and they often do come up with some crazy ideas but they are using that as a reason why no housing AT ALL is justified and that is just plain silly.
besides, housing in say star wars gaxay not only existed more than 10 years ago its pretty much considered to be the pennaical of housing.
That said, I would simply go for a slightly modified Darkfall platform (not just housing but everything).
But is it justified as a pinnacle of housing, as it didn't show to be healthy once players left, this puts a load on development to do something, instead of working on new additions they're left "fixing" problems. This same thing could be said about a lot of the features you as well as others are bringing up, skill based (horrible for balance), housing, freedom, the more freedom the less in control a dev is.
It's funny how a bad implementation in the long run is all of a sudden a pinnacle now.
that is exactly what they are thinking execpt for the 'new addtions' because that too requires maintence concerns. basically they are thinking 'the more features we remove the less likely for maintence concerns'. I however am not that impressed because that can and will be taken to extreemes.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
TESO Designers stated they are TARGETING TES fans. Got it? Also, making a TESO game not like TES IS a betrayal of the series...got it?
Betrayal of the single player series, that is key, which really doesn't make it a betrayal, just a different approach toward a different platform, you're just sensationalizing your gripe, to make it sound that much worse. Got it?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
OP, you are fighting windlmills here. Millions will still buy it, only because it have written "The Elder Scrolls" over it. The same case as for Blizzard games. They built up their glory and now they can live 20 years out of it. Nowadays, people may buy graphically updated version of 'E.T.' for Atari 2600 if it have label "Blizzard" or "Bethesda" over it.
Dont get me wrong, i enjoyed both 'single player' TES games and 'old' Blizzard games, but i find D3, SC2 and... sigh... new Elder Scrolls to be easy money grabs. As an economist i understand both of Development teams, but as a gaming fan, i am astronomically pissed-off.
It only takes 1 or 2 games to ruin a brand.
BIOWARE used to be a brand in my opinion of a great RPG maker, they can make no wrong. The Old Republic, Mass Effect, Dragon Age are just the three biggest games known through them. Then you got SWTOR, ME3, DA2
Will I buy Bioware games because its Bioware games now?? nope, first day purchases are no longer viable for this company anymore, their lack of customer support, and their current track record shows me as a consumer to be careful of their future products.
Blizzard is also getting some bad press for not upgrading their games, its not as strong an reaction because they didn't change the formula that made those games popular. SC2 played pretty much just like SC1 only with updated graphics , and Diablo 3 is pretty much a reskinned Diablo 2 with a new color swap. But it will still be popular because it will play just like what everyone remembers.
Bethesda really have to thread carefully, consumers are getting smarter to not fall into the brands = good buys anymore. And with another few years of development in TESO, I really hope they go back to the drawing board and think really hard on what made The Elder Scroll Popular in the first place.
Life is a Maze, so make sure you bring your GPS incase you get lost in it.
that is exactly what they are thinking execpt for the 'new addtions' because that too requires maintence concerns. basically they are thinking 'the more features we remove the less likely for maintence concerns'. I however am not that impressed because that can and will be taken to extreemes.
Maybe and I'll cross that bridge when it comes, for now their reasoning isn't without sense in my eyes. I'd think anyone who has been around this genre for long enough should understand what a difference not having to constantly backtrack can have.
Games that didn't have to backtrack all that much: WOW, EVE, DAOC, GW1 and.. well I can't say that for many others. A majority of the rest have been left constantly fixing things they probably would have been better off never implementing and realizing something else works better.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Bethesda really have to thread carefully, consumers are getting smarter to not fall into the brands = good buys anymore. And with another few years of development in TESO, I really hope they go back to the drawing board and think really hard on what made The Elder Scroll Popular in the first place.
Thing is it's not bethesda creating this game. It's someone else, within the same overall organization. That's a bit different than slapping the Bioware name on a bunch of different studios and releasing games under that banner that are not recieved well by certain people.
Bethesda's wording has been "we don't want to do an MMO", and they're still not doing an MMO. TES will live or die by Bethesda not by a side project featuring the license, as it should be
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
When i read that TESO was officially announced i was like "yay a sandbox set in the world of TES" What we have seen so far makes me cry. Theres really nothing special about it. Im sure people will buy it. But until something changes i see it no more as a cash grab. They are either lazy or just plain oblivious. IM DONE. I feel like we need to get our voice across. Becuase of this i made a Facebook cause. Elder Scrolls Online Betrayal Campaign
Join and let your voice be heard!
Reason for edit. To clarify my position. I do not think its a wow clone (that comment was out of anger and frustration) I only wish to have an TES mmo that the franchise deserves. I will admit when im wrong, i just did.
Comments
Problem with this is, if I explained what I think they mean "fans want", you'd not even consider it, because that would require an ability to not think you know it all. So why should I bother.
ANd good is key, good is what sets precedent, not bad.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
1. You did not provide any quotes nor the game is released nor there is even enough information out there to make qualified judgement, therefore there is little to discuss.
Then again, just because certain features exist in different games does not make it feasible or desired to be implemented into a single game.
2. Eh..so what?
3. Quite losing a point of whole Vampirism thing as day light cycles are vital part of the thing....
4. You mix public interests and private property.
Just because your logic is ill, does not make mine silly.
becuase its an easy out. when they say 'fans' which fans are they refering to? and no you dont know anymore than I do.
fans dont always agree and they often do come up with some crazy ideas but they are using that as a reason why no housing AT ALL is justified and that is just plain silly.
besides, housing in say star wars gaxay not only existed more than 10 years ago its pretty much considered to be the pennaical of housing.
That said, I would simply go for a slightly modified Darkfall platform (not just housing but everything).
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
if a chef makes food I do not like I have the freedom to say it. I can say to anyone who will listen 'I am sorry I really dont like the food at X place and here is why'
You are saying I can not
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
I dont have a lot of time left this morning. but yes, around 10 mins. It was a long time ago so I am not exactly sure the timing. How did I do that? change the player stats...simple.
Night falls, yout stats change your model changes. its not that hard.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
I have to go now but I will say this.
Yes they have a right to make whatever they want and I have the right to tell as many people as I want that its crap and why I think that it is and I have the right to not play it and I assure you in mass many of us will not play it and we will be vocal about it.
Sorry if that seems unfair.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Why bash ESO and not crap like TERA or SW:TOR? Unlike these games, ESO still has a chance to be an innovative game. Just wait and see, if ESO goes in wrong direction, it will be because of those people who create the hype around shallow games like TERA.
It is not only time your are missing, I am afraid...
Try to play Skyrim without Rest button or any other time related feature and tell me how it goes...
Umm nope, you can tell him why the food sucks..but if you are going to throw in 'and yes i am a chef too' line....please feel free to prove it. Talk is cheap that is all i am saying.
oh I understand it now.
I am a chef and I have made a meal very close to what he is suggesting and I know exactly how I would go about doing it. But because I havent done it I should not say it.
gotcha!
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
What the fuck is wrong with you people, all we've seen is a CGI trailer and ONE screenshot. How do you even begin to judge a game from just that? we have no information at all to how the game will play. Fuckin' hell i can't express how stupid you look right now.
again its not that hard and I have for the most part actually done it.
The game engine knows when its night. and we all know your stats can change because it happens in ALL MMO's. So when night, stats change and model changes.
trust me its not that hard. They are coping out.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Critcising food is not the same as criticisng the method used to cook and ability of the chef. That is why i rolled eyes when you said ' i am a programmer '. That is when people would stop and think 'show us then, you surely know better'.
Read my previous post again...and again..and eventually again...if you do not get it by then, there is little reason to continue the discussion.
i dont see how it matters. You are saying the exact same logic DOES work as a chef but not as a programmer.
look folks we know vaprism is possible not becuase I say so but because THEY HAVE ALREADY DONE IT.
they are claiming it can not be done in an MMO. not that it cant be done at all.
Would it have to be different? I dont know, why not. different and NOT AT ALL are two radically different things
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
But is it justified as a pinnacle of housing, as it didn't show to be healthy once players left, this puts a load on development to do something, instead of working on new additions they're left "fixing" problems. This same thing could be said about a lot of the features you as well as others are bringing up, skill based (horrible for balance), housing, freedom, the more freedom the less in control a dev is.
It's funny how a bad implementation in the long run is all of a sudden a pinnacle now.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
TESO Designers stated they are TARGETING TES fans. Got it? Also, making a TESO game not like TES IS a betrayal of the series...got it?
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
Link?
that is exactly what they are thinking execpt for the 'new addtions' because that too requires maintence concerns. basically they are thinking 'the more features we remove the less likely for maintence concerns'. I however am not that impressed because that can and will be taken to extreemes.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Betrayal of the single player series, that is key, which really doesn't make it a betrayal, just a different approach toward a different platform, you're just sensationalizing your gripe, to make it sound that much worse. Got it?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
In an MMO you can put on a suit of armour and your stats change. In some MMO's mobs exist only at night.
Yet some of you have bought into the line that they can not change you into some type of vampire at night.
nearly hysterical
and only not be able to do it because its an MMO I might add
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
It only takes 1 or 2 games to ruin a brand.
BIOWARE used to be a brand in my opinion of a great RPG maker, they can make no wrong. The Old Republic, Mass Effect, Dragon Age are just the three biggest games known through them. Then you got SWTOR, ME3, DA2
Will I buy Bioware games because its Bioware games now?? nope, first day purchases are no longer viable for this company anymore, their lack of customer support, and their current track record shows me as a consumer to be careful of their future products.
Blizzard is also getting some bad press for not upgrading their games, its not as strong an reaction because they didn't change the formula that made those games popular. SC2 played pretty much just like SC1 only with updated graphics , and Diablo 3 is pretty much a reskinned Diablo 2 with a new color swap. But it will still be popular because it will play just like what everyone remembers.
Bethesda really have to thread carefully, consumers are getting smarter to not fall into the brands = good buys anymore. And with another few years of development in TESO, I really hope they go back to the drawing board and think really hard on what made The Elder Scroll Popular in the first place.
Life is a Maze, so make sure you bring your GPS incase you get lost in it.
Maybe and I'll cross that bridge when it comes, for now their reasoning isn't without sense in my eyes. I'd think anyone who has been around this genre for long enough should understand what a difference not having to constantly backtrack can have.
Games that didn't have to backtrack all that much: WOW, EVE, DAOC, GW1 and.. well I can't say that for many others. A majority of the rest have been left constantly fixing things they probably would have been better off never implementing and realizing something else works better.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Thing is it's not bethesda creating this game. It's someone else, within the same overall organization. That's a bit different than slapping the Bioware name on a bunch of different studios and releasing games under that banner that are not recieved well by certain people.
Bethesda's wording has been "we don't want to do an MMO", and they're still not doing an MMO. TES will live or die by Bethesda not by a side project featuring the license, as it should be
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson