I miss most off all the dificulty level as the new mmos are all easy mode except maybe TSW but that also has no death penality.
Difficulty makes peeps group to over come hard mobs and thats what made old mmos great cause you had to make friends or you spent your life kiteing greens which droped junk.
Originally posted by Loktofeit Community tools and community support. In the bright-eyed and naive effoft to create one big happy lovefest on the server, developers have designed mechanics that actually work against community building and make it more difficult for player bonds to form in game.
Yeah, I'll go along with this sentiment. It seems the more developers tried to improve MMORPG gameplay, the more damage they did to the community.
These days people point to LFG and DF tools and hold them up as evidence of socialization, not realizing they are the result of a lack of community instead and provided as a solution to an inherent flaw in modern game design.
Some tools are actually nice to have. It'd be a real pain in the ass if all you had was /say to look for a group.
Might work if a game had taverns with mini games or something to pass the time while you wait for more people to show up.
I think it's more about the bottom line though for developers, and bored players = unhappy players. Unhappy players = lost subs. So we have things like LFD.
Combat was slower, levelling was slower, travel was slower, crafting was slower, getting gear was slower, buying things from crafters was slower, we had downtime and could lose xp and there wasn't this constant need for action. And this slower pace created a community because to have a community you first need time to communicate with the people around you.
Modern games cater to a different demographic. Logging in, having action right from the get go, combat, run, combat, teleport, combat, run, teleport, log out - who needs other players? The games even make the groups for you while you run. No need to stand still. Action!
I maintain this List of Sandbox MMORPGs. Please post or send PM for corrections and suggestions.
The huge explorable world. You could actually get lost in those games, and for a long time.
Most modern MMOs are small and leads you holding your hand between questhubs. The maps makes the gamesworld seems even smaller than it is as well. I rather just have a few "you are here" maps in the game instead, or at least that they take away the point showing exactly where you are.
GMs directly involved, in their worlds and player bases.
We lost a lot when they were sealed off from the public.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I didn t level so quick. I mean, nowadays, you can hit max in weeks, sometimes days. I miss the long hard levels, where people actually had to know how to use their class.
City building. I love the idea of coming together with a group of strangers, carefully placing houses and defenses, and then going about the oderly business of maintaining a settlement. While I never want to see the terrible empty house sprawl of UO and SWG repeated, I believe a future game could solve this by making certain areas of a map capable of being settled. And, in order to keep things fluid, these settlements could be either captured or razed by rival factions -- who would, by necessity, be living out of camps somewhere in the wilderness.
How cool would it be, not only to build such a town and defend it but, ultimately, lose said city and be driven suddenly into the wild? Yet, despite the loss, you still have the bonds you built with others. You train harder to be stronger and better; to one day reclaim what was taken from you.
Being able to listen to certain public chat channels.
You remember, back when moderators actually watched them.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
The sense of being in a vast, free, open world with a strong community and seemingly endless ways to make your way within it, whichever way you wanted.
Not sure that counts as a single thing but meh.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
Originally posted by Leucent I didn t level so quick. I mean, nowadays, you can hit max in weeks, sometimes days. I miss the long hard levels, where people actually had to know how to use their class.
It is still exactly the same, except that you grind gear tiers instead of levels now. You w'still need to either know your class well or have some really helpful friends to get good gear, just as it was with max level before.
The only real difference is that you did gain new skills before, and that noobs had higher respect for you when you were maxed out.
For me neither way is that great, both tends to be very grindy and not so exciting as it could be. I think we need a good leveless system, something closer to "Runequest" than TSW is, a bump up in difficulty and a huge decrease in gap between noobs and vets.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
there is so many things i miss from Asherons Call but one really stands out to me right now.
I miss needing multiple weapons and none of them were " the best " and i will explain for those who never played AC1.
In AC1 each creature was vulnerable to a certain attack, it could be fire, frost, lightning, acid, bludge, pierce, slash. the game had weapons for all elements of attacks, such as fire swords acid maces and so on. so you needed to have multiple weapons depending on the situation.
and since the game was random loot you never had " the best " weapon in the game. you didnt get some giant glowing sword of doom off a raid boss that you camped for 8 months and now thats the only weapon you used till the end of time. the games loot system was totally random, no 2 weapons were the same. so you never knew when you could find somthing better off a mob you just killed.
also to cast magic you had to actually equip somthing to cast with, a wand, staff, orb. you didnt just run around with your giant sword doing everything all the time.
this is just a small aspect of a game made in 1999 that is so far more advanced than any newer game that has come out.
I miss a true open world.. Games today have too much instancing.. I also miss big social raids like EQ1.. It gulls me that raids live and die due to who does or doesn't log on that night.... I miss trains, I hate that mobs LOSE agro after you run away 20 feet.. give me a break.. I miss zone wide wandering mobs.. Today's games are just too carebear for me.. I miss camping for exp and loot.. I get bored of runing back and forth to a quest hub to be rewarded.. I miss a true social gaming experience, such as the days I would be farming Giants in Everfrost and I would become encumbered.. It was great I could get a low level toon that wanted to earn some cash to be my banker.. Those were the days..
For me it has got to be near endless horizontal progression. Playing Asherons Call for years and never reaching the level cap. Having something to always strive for in character progression that didnt include gear or having to group with 80 other individuals is what I miss the most.
This & the fear of dieing in game. EQ when I first stepped into befallen it was actually creepy and I was scared to go in. You didn't know what to expect, and if you died deep in the dungeon it meant a long corpse run. Which made me actually fearful to die. Now death is just like meh, what ever. I feel like there's no consequences in MMO's anymore. Which makes them borring and listless.
The closest feeling I"ve had to that fear of death, of late, has to be Dayz. Where once again death actually means something. Not that it's incredibly hard to gear back up, but it is a little painful loosing your progress.
Originally posted by Leucent I didn t level so quick. I mean, nowadays, you can hit max in weeks, sometimes days. I miss the long hard levels, where people actually had to know how to use their class.
It is still exactly the same, except that you grind gear tiers instead of levels now. You w'still need to either know your class well or have some really helpful friends to get good gear, just as it was with max level before.
The only real difference is that you did gain new skills before, and that noobs had higher respect for you when you were maxed out.
For me neither way is that great, both tends to be very grindy and not so exciting as it could be. I think we need a good leveless system, something closer to "Runequest" than TSW is, a bump up in difficulty and a huge decrease in gap between noobs and vets.
Not even close. When it took time, you made friends, good communities, and people did know how to play their class better. Gear grind at end game is not the same at all. A monkey can gear grind, not all can level the old hard way because they are so wowified, they last a week max. Alot of games nowadays, hand hold you so much you don t even really have to try. Back in the day of DAOC for example, it wasn t how many levels are you going to gain that day, it was what can you accomplish today.
Comments
I miss most off all the dificulty level as the new mmos are all easy mode except maybe TSW but that also has no death penality.
Difficulty makes peeps group to over come hard mobs and thats what made old mmos great cause you had to make friends or you spent your life kiteing greens which droped junk.
* Community-driven content
* Living world with players everywhere
* Adventure, unknown dephs, unwalked paths, secret groves etc
* Large scale PVP, large scale PVE (40+)
* Long lasting PVP / PVE encounters (like Vanilla BRD or AV)
* Death penalty that actually matters
* Anti-homogenisation of classes/specs/ etc (like, not every class has interrupt, not every class has slow, not every class has stun, etc)
Some tools are actually nice to have. It'd be a real pain in the ass if all you had was /say to look for a group.
Might work if a game had taverns with mini games or something to pass the time while you wait for more people to show up.
I think it's more about the bottom line though for developers, and bored players = unhappy players. Unhappy players = lost subs. So we have things like LFD.
this stuff
The above is my personal opinion. Anyone displaying a view contrary to my opinion is obviously WRONG and should STHU. (neener neener)
-The MMO Forum Community
I'd say it's the slower pace.
Combat was slower, levelling was slower, travel was slower, crafting was slower, getting gear was slower, buying things from crafters was slower, we had downtime and could lose xp and there wasn't this constant need for action. And this slower pace created a community because to have a community you first need time to communicate with the people around you.
Modern games cater to a different demographic. Logging in, having action right from the get go, combat, run, combat, teleport, combat, run, teleport, log out - who needs other players? The games even make the groups for you while you run. No need to stand still. Action!
I maintain this List of Sandbox MMORPGs. Please post or send PM for corrections and suggestions.
risk vs reward
exploration
A real virtual world with a functional virtual society.
It's the defining feature of this genre, and developers have gone to great lengths to eliminate it.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
The huge explorable world. You could actually get lost in those games, and for a long time.
Most modern MMOs are small and leads you holding your hand between questhubs. The maps makes the gamesworld seems even smaller than it is as well. I rather just have a few "you are here" maps in the game instead, or at least that they take away the point showing exactly where you are.
GMs directly involved, in their worlds and player bases.
We lost a lot when they were sealed off from the public.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
City building. I love the idea of coming together with a group of strangers, carefully placing houses and defenses, and then going about the oderly business of maintaining a settlement. While I never want to see the terrible empty house sprawl of UO and SWG repeated, I believe a future game could solve this by making certain areas of a map capable of being settled. And, in order to keep things fluid, these settlements could be either captured or razed by rival factions -- who would, by necessity, be living out of camps somewhere in the wilderness.
How cool would it be, not only to build such a town and defend it but, ultimately, lose said city and be driven suddenly into the wild? Yet, despite the loss, you still have the bonds you built with others. You train harder to be stronger and better; to one day reclaim what was taken from you.
Being able to listen to certain public chat channels.
You remember, back when moderators actually watched them.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
RIP Orc Choppa
The sense of being in a vast, free, open world with a strong community and seemingly endless ways to make your way within it, whichever way you wanted.
Not sure that counts as a single thing but meh.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
It is still exactly the same, except that you grind gear tiers instead of levels now. You w'still need to either know your class well or have some really helpful friends to get good gear, just as it was with max level before.
The only real difference is that you did gain new skills before, and that noobs had higher respect for you when you were maxed out.
For me neither way is that great, both tends to be very grindy and not so exciting as it could be. I think we need a good leveless system, something closer to "Runequest" than TSW is, a bump up in difficulty and a huge decrease in gap between noobs and vets.
EQ2 fan sites
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
i miss that game
EQ2 fan sites
there is so many things i miss from Asherons Call but one really stands out to me right now.
I miss needing multiple weapons and none of them were " the best " and i will explain for those who never played AC1.
In AC1 each creature was vulnerable to a certain attack, it could be fire, frost, lightning, acid, bludge, pierce, slash. the game had weapons for all elements of attacks, such as fire swords acid maces and so on. so you needed to have multiple weapons depending on the situation.
and since the game was random loot you never had " the best " weapon in the game. you didnt get some giant glowing sword of doom off a raid boss that you camped for 8 months and now thats the only weapon you used till the end of time. the games loot system was totally random, no 2 weapons were the same. so you never knew when you could find somthing better off a mob you just killed.
also to cast magic you had to actually equip somthing to cast with, a wand, staff, orb. you didnt just run around with your giant sword doing everything all the time.
this is just a small aspect of a game made in 1999 that is so far more advanced than any newer game that has come out.
and i could list dozens of examples.
This & the fear of dieing in game. EQ when I first stepped into befallen it was actually creepy and I was scared to go in. You didn't know what to expect, and if you died deep in the dungeon it meant a long corpse run. Which made me actually fearful to die. Now death is just like meh, what ever. I feel like there's no consequences in MMO's anymore. Which makes them borring and listless.
The closest feeling I"ve had to that fear of death, of late, has to be Dayz. Where once again death actually means something. Not that it's incredibly hard to gear back up, but it is a little painful loosing your progress.
none of this instant gratification crap like push button to max pvp lvl and so on...
Of course like others have said a fear of getting killed.. but i mainly play Darkfall so i still ahve that fear haha
Not even close. When it took time, you made friends, good communities, and people did know how to play their class better. Gear grind at end game is not the same at all. A monkey can gear grind, not all can level the old hard way because they are so wowified, they last a week max. Alot of games nowadays, hand hold you so much you don t even really have to try. Back in the day of DAOC for example, it wasn t how many levels are you going to gain that day, it was what can you accomplish today.
Gear grinds are not even close to the same.