There would be if people would get rid of their preconceived notions that all MMO's are WoW clones or comparing to WoW.
I always found this sentiment ironic, seeing as WoW essentially started with game systems and mechanics cloned from many of the MMOs of the time, like EverQuest and AnarchyOnline, just to name a couple off the top of my head.
My take on this is that with more and more mmorpgs being created, there will be more and more mmorpgs and they will be averaging out at about 100-500k players. I think developers ned to realize this and try to all be making different game to cater to a certain 100k or so players that no other games cater to, and not expect their game to be hearding in 1mil+ players as with more and more mmorpgs this is getting more and more unrealistic. SUre this may mean that companies may need to put less money into them but there are so many well made mmorpg engines around nowadays that we should have designers working on cheaper experimental games that cater to a small handful of people who no one else caters to. This is my take on it anway.
Originally posted by velmax We all know the most successful MMO was WOW, with 12 million players at it's peak , its nearly impossible for another MMO to reach this number, in my opinion. Were starting to see a pattern here withe every new MMO, tons of players at launch, then it lowers down again untill it goes F2P. Another reason i see it impossible, is because of the number of MMO's out their, their's over 1,000 mmos and the number is growing, so if 1 mmo steals all thoses subs or goes over 5,000,000+ its highly rare. Indie games are going crazy in the market, look at Minecraft and Dayz, Indie games are getting more attention adding a new group of players. My last reason, is the decreaseing of subbed based games, years ago in the good days, all you saw was subbed based games, so it was either sub or not play at all, when now adays we see a vary of different types of paying options. Overall, i would like to know your opinons on this topic.
I think there will most likely be another game that sets the "standard to beat". With the saturation of the market, I don't think any MMO game will get back to the level WOW was when it came out. There are just so many fantasy MMOs out there that players probably just don't have the time to play all of them.
If we are talking by stick player base, it might be possible if a hugely popular MMO came out that was FTP from the beginning. But then the sup count wouldn't be there. I honestly just think that allot of gamers don't want to pay for subscription games when there are so many FTP equivalents out there. Just look at all the "WOW clones" there are.
Celerion Contact me on Twitter @IAMCelerion and chat.
No because Blizzard has Asia wrapped around it's little finger. The key to major success is wining the Asian game market. Their population surpasses everyone elses astronomically so to speak.
Blizzard created plenty of faithful fans over the years, but they've also created plenty of bitter ex-fans.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I think with all the lore behind this game, it creates something that people could really dive into and get become really attached to. It would take another great game with this kind of lore, and years of loyal followers to even come close to being as successful....and with the way games are rapidly turned out these days, I dont see that happening any time soon.
In subs? No, is it possible a f2p game brings in more revenue then wow monthly sometime in the future? probably, might have even happened already in them korean lands.
most points of view would say that wow is a huge success it makes tons of money.
my point of view is wow is a huge travesty to the MMO genre. because of the money it has made, we now have tons of MMOs all trying to copy it. and now we are left with a bunch of dumbed down sort of MMO games that hold our hands and walk us threw panzy land makeing sure we get everything along the way.
and if you die its ok nothing happens. infact alot of games people die just to travel faster.
Well, hardly. Why? Because Blizzard had turned out the mentallity of MMORPG players to demand same thing as WoW...
For instance, look what happened to GW2. Even they went WoW's path because majority demanded it to be the same as WoW, while devs said that they want it to be different. But i guess it is the population and profit that have the last word.
This being said, i dont think that even Titan will live up to that popularity. Sure, many will buy it only because it have that "Blizzard" stamp on cover (same as for Diablo III) but considering Blizzard's design desicions for last couple of games (and even they confirmed "RMAH being implemented in their future titles") Titan will be hardly ever popular as WoW was. Especially now when you got MOBAs being more and more popular...
On other hand, we may see Elder Scrolls Online being somewhat close, only because it is Elder Scrolls and stuff, but i am eager to see how that story will end up. I wont be surprised to even see Pandas in TESO (Zenimax: well, herp derp, Pandas are popular in WoW, if we add them we will regain some of WoW's audience).
Main MMO at the moment: Guild Wars 2 Waiting for: Pathfinder Online
I'm not sure how much money it makes but in terms of sheer numbers playing it Maple Story had in 2009 92 million users . I think World of Tanks has 40 million . How many of these are active remains a good question . But in some terms WoW has been surpassed already .
In terms of subscription based success . I think WoW will eventualy be beaten. It may take many decades to happen though .
Advancements in technology such as 3d , cloud gaming where the internet takes over the processing power from a computer , mmo frienly consoles and even artifical intelligence (which many experts think will surpass human in 30 years ) will all have an effect on the mmo genre .
Imagine a game that has depth without the need for 3d glasses , that can be played on a low spec machine with amazing graphics with mobs that can actually think for themselves .
Sounds like science fiction now but I can say with some degree of certainty such games will happen will in our life time .
There is no doubt that eventually an MMO will be as successful as WoW . Just a matter of time ( maybe a long time )
In reply to the title of the thread alone. NO SMEGGING MMO WILL EVER REACH THE NUMBERS SMEGGIN WOW HAS OR HAD EVER REACHED AND IT DOESN'T SMEGGING NEED TOO!!!!
DEAR SMEGGGING SMEG OF SMEG!!!! Not every single mmorpg in the history of the business needs to sky rocket to trillions of billions of millions of gabagiliiions of subs to be remotely fun and or playable/subscribeableoleoleol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Either smegging play WoW and be happy with your smegging decision or play whatever is the equivilant!!!!!!! smegging jumbo buggers!!!
Playing: Smite, Marvel Heroes Played: Nexus:Kingdom of the Winds, Everquest, DAoC, Everquest 2, WoW, Matrix Online, Vangaurd, SWG, DDO, EVE, Fallen Earth, LoTRo, CoX, Champions Online, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Guild Wars, Rift, Tera, Aion, AoC, Gods and Heroes, DCUO, FF14, TSW, SWTOR, GW2, Wildstar, ESO, ArcheAge Waiting On: Nothing. Mmorpg's are dead.
Originally posted by parrotpholk In a simple word....no
True!
+1
WoW was a polished product launched at the right time to pick up the millions, there is nothing about WoW that is so far ahead of the competition, it relies on inertia and familiarity.
^^ Agree. There is alot of Psychology behind WOW. The Music, colours, the leveliing "Ding", Lootz, etc that make it addictive. Having recently purchased GW2, although it is awesome, I sometimes wish it had more WOW factor in it.
In reply to the title of the thread alone. NO SMEGGING MMO WILL EVER REACH THE NUMBERS SMEGGIN WOW HAS OR HAD EVER REACHED AND IT DOESN'T SMEGGING NEED TOO!!!!
DEAR SMEGGGING SMEG OF SMEG!!!! Not every single mmorpg in the history of the business needs to sky rocket to trillions of billions of millions of gabagiliiions of subs to be remotely fun and or playable/subscribeableoleoleol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Either smegging play WoW and be happy with your smegging decision or play whatever is the equivilant!!!!!!! smegging jumbo buggers!!!
Originally posted by parrotpholk In a simple word....no
True!
+1
WoW was a polished product launched at the right time to pick up the millions, there is nothing about WoW that is so far ahead of the competition, it relies on inertia and familiarity.
^^ Agree. There is alot of Psychology behind WOW. The Music, colours, the leveliing "Ding", Lootz, etc that make it addictive. Having recently purchased GW2, although it is awesome, I sometimes wish it had more WOW factor in it.
what in the hell is wrong with you people? WoW wasn't a polished product in the least, it was a complete mess at launch and it wasn't the right time because at that time there was about 3 mmorpg's to even choose from. The "Ding" as you so gracefully put it was stolen from Everquest, along with the lootz, and the etc!!!
Who in their right mind would even think of attributting ETC to wow? what is this world coming too.. my god. You smegging wow borg people need to be taken offline.
Playing: Smite, Marvel Heroes Played: Nexus:Kingdom of the Winds, Everquest, DAoC, Everquest 2, WoW, Matrix Online, Vangaurd, SWG, DDO, EVE, Fallen Earth, LoTRo, CoX, Champions Online, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Guild Wars, Rift, Tera, Aion, AoC, Gods and Heroes, DCUO, FF14, TSW, SWTOR, GW2, Wildstar, ESO, ArcheAge Waiting On: Nothing. Mmorpg's are dead.
Maybe it will but don't hold your breath, it won't be anytime soon. WoW's position as #1 classical western MMO is fairly safe imho because...
1) Being #1 by a large margin gives Blizzard enough time to copy any sucessful innovation some other studio comes up with.
2) Having the largest population is a huge advantage. It's same as with, say, Facebook. Google+ is a great platform but if 90% your friends are not moving from facebook... and exactly the same applies to WoW.
3) Many people may disagree with this one but I think WoW is the most polished product out there in terms of overall experience. Major new MMOs are released almost every other month yet they all fail to provide same level of product quality.
* WoW runs well even on poor-spec PCs. I think this is one of the most important things to succeed with MMO yet many major games fail big time in this respect (e.g. Rift)
* The graphics. Some people hate it's low-polygon and some people hate the "cartoony" style. But at least it has a style and artistic value. Many other games are just generic pseudo-realistic meh.
* The music. It's a good music. And it's not guaranteed in MMOs. Get decent headphones, listen to LOTRO music and then listen to WoW music. Those two are just incomparable.
* Game mechanics. Another highly underestimated thing. WoW is very responsive and makes you feel like you really control the character. And it does not matter how it achieves it (by faking some stuff client-side). It actually works!
* The game is attractive to both children and adults. I agree with what someone else already mentioned - there's definitely a lot of psychology involved.
* Easy to learn, hard to master. It's extremely accessible but there are still plenty of things that are really hard to achieve. Many people think WoW is easy but that's just because they didn't set themselves hard enough goals.
Now I'm sure I sound like a diehard WoW fan. Actually, no. I play a wide range of games. I like EVE. I like Rift. I liked LOTRO before I moved from PvE to basically PvP only. But at the same time I must say I compeltely understand why WoW is #1. It's because it IS the best product out there.
So the only way to beat WoW is to actually stop with PR bullshit like "No more elves" and actually make a product that is at least equally good. Then, perhaps, given time, it can beat WoW. After all we could use something fresh, it's getting a bit old...
TL;DR - WoW delivers best overall experience. To beat WoW, someone actually has to make something equally good first.
Originally posted by Prenho A true MMO with 10K players > WoW with its 10KK kids.
Funny... too bad that by far the typical WoW player is an adult in the mid to late twenties.
As for the topic, WoW was a real fluk. It showed up on the scene and dominated the competition which entrenched themselves tremendously. Eventually they will lost it's hold but likely not anytime soon. Right now slowly bit by bit their consumers are leaving for other things. WoW is a dated game and eventually it will "retire" much like EQ and Runescape.
Comments
There would be if people would get rid of their preconceived notions that all MMO's are WoW clones or comparing to WoW.
Just play the game and enjoy.
I always found this sentiment ironic, seeing as WoW essentially started with game systems and mechanics cloned from many of the MMOs of the time, like EverQuest and AnarchyOnline, just to name a couple off the top of my head.
WoW did a good job of optimizing them, though :B
I think there will most likely be another game that sets the "standard to beat". With the saturation of the market, I don't think any MMO game will get back to the level WOW was when it came out. There are just so many fantasy MMOs out there that players probably just don't have the time to play all of them.
If we are talking by stick player base, it might be possible if a hugely popular MMO came out that was FTP from the beginning. But then the sup count wouldn't be there. I honestly just think that allot of gamers don't want to pay for subscription games when there are so many FTP equivalents out there. Just look at all the "WOW clones" there are.
Celerion
Contact me on Twitter @IAMCelerion and chat.
Probably not.
Blizzard created plenty of faithful fans over the years, but they've also created plenty of bitter ex-fans.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Yes, population is rising and internet access with it.
See no reason why some moos might not have hundreds of millions one day.
Imagine the people in china and india and other now not so developed countries catching up, having more spare time and more money.
Well there could be a game that could crush wow and its the only one that can.
The game I am talking about is World of warcraft 2.
successful is a point of view.
most points of view would say that wow is a huge success it makes tons of money.
my point of view is wow is a huge travesty to the MMO genre. because of the money it has made, we now have tons of MMOs all trying to copy it. and now we are left with a bunch of dumbed down sort of MMO games that hold our hands and walk us threw panzy land makeing sure we get everything along the way.
and if you die its ok nothing happens. infact alot of games people die just to travel faster.
Well, hardly. Why? Because Blizzard had turned out the mentallity of MMORPG players to demand same thing as WoW...
For instance, look what happened to GW2. Even they went WoW's path because majority demanded it to be the same as WoW, while devs said that they want it to be different. But i guess it is the population and profit that have the last word.
This being said, i dont think that even Titan will live up to that popularity. Sure, many will buy it only because it have that "Blizzard" stamp on cover (same as for Diablo III) but considering Blizzard's design desicions for last couple of games (and even they confirmed "RMAH being implemented in their future titles") Titan will be hardly ever popular as WoW was. Especially now when you got MOBAs being more and more popular...
On other hand, we may see Elder Scrolls Online being somewhat close, only because it is Elder Scrolls and stuff, but i am eager to see how that story will end up. I wont be surprised to even see Pandas in TESO (Zenimax: well, herp derp, Pandas are popular in WoW, if we add them we will regain some of WoW's audience).
Main MMO at the moment: Guild Wars 2
Waiting for: Pathfinder Online
I'm not sure how much money it makes but in terms of sheer numbers playing it Maple Story had in 2009 92 million users . I think World of Tanks has 40 million . How many of these are active remains a good question . But in some terms WoW has been surpassed already .
In terms of subscription based success . I think WoW will eventualy be beaten. It may take many decades to happen though .
Advancements in technology such as 3d , cloud gaming where the internet takes over the processing power from a computer , mmo frienly consoles and even artifical intelligence (which many experts think will surpass human in 30 years ) will all have an effect on the mmo genre .
Imagine a game that has depth without the need for 3d glasses , that can be played on a low spec machine with amazing graphics with mobs that can actually think for themselves .
Sounds like science fiction now but I can say with some degree of certainty such games will happen will in our life time .
There is no doubt that eventually an MMO will be as successful as WoW . Just a matter of time ( maybe a long time )
In reply to the title of the thread alone. NO SMEGGING MMO WILL EVER REACH THE NUMBERS SMEGGIN WOW HAS OR HAD EVER REACHED AND IT DOESN'T SMEGGING NEED TOO!!!!
DEAR SMEGGGING SMEG OF SMEG!!!! Not every single mmorpg in the history of the business needs to sky rocket to trillions of billions of millions of gabagiliiions of subs to be remotely fun and or playable/subscribeableoleoleol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Either smegging play WoW and be happy with your smegging decision or play whatever is the equivilant!!!!!!! smegging jumbo buggers!!!
Playing: Smite, Marvel Heroes
Played: Nexus:Kingdom of the Winds, Everquest, DAoC, Everquest 2, WoW, Matrix Online, Vangaurd, SWG, DDO, EVE, Fallen Earth, LoTRo, CoX, Champions Online, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Guild Wars, Rift, Tera, Aion, AoC, Gods and Heroes, DCUO, FF14, TSW, SWTOR, GW2, Wildstar, ESO, ArcheAge
Waiting On: Nothing. Mmorpg's are dead.
^^ Agree. There is alot of Psychology behind WOW. The Music, colours, the leveliing "Ding", Lootz, etc that make it addictive. Having recently purchased GW2, although it is awesome, I sometimes wish it had more WOW factor in it.
LOL
what in the hell is wrong with you people? WoW wasn't a polished product in the least, it was a complete mess at launch and it wasn't the right time because at that time there was about 3 mmorpg's to even choose from. The "Ding" as you so gracefully put it was stolen from Everquest, along with the lootz, and the etc!!!
Who in their right mind would even think of attributting ETC to wow? what is this world coming too.. my god. You smegging wow borg people need to be taken offline.
Playing: Smite, Marvel Heroes
Played: Nexus:Kingdom of the Winds, Everquest, DAoC, Everquest 2, WoW, Matrix Online, Vangaurd, SWG, DDO, EVE, Fallen Earth, LoTRo, CoX, Champions Online, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Guild Wars, Rift, Tera, Aion, AoC, Gods and Heroes, DCUO, FF14, TSW, SWTOR, GW2, Wildstar, ESO, ArcheAge
Waiting On: Nothing. Mmorpg's are dead.
Just my opinion friend. After playing pretty much every MMORPG out there since "Shadowbane" I am inexplicably drawn back to Blizzard's creation.
Populations Increase + Time + More and More MMO's being created = Yes, Eventually / I dunno these game devs. are pretty unoriginal.
Next question will WoW ever be as good as Anarchy Online? Answer Never!
Maybe it will but don't hold your breath, it won't be anytime soon. WoW's position as #1 classical western MMO is fairly safe imho because...
1) Being #1 by a large margin gives Blizzard enough time to copy any sucessful innovation some other studio comes up with.
2) Having the largest population is a huge advantage. It's same as with, say, Facebook. Google+ is a great platform but if 90% your friends are not moving from facebook... and exactly the same applies to WoW.
3) Many people may disagree with this one but I think WoW is the most polished product out there in terms of overall experience. Major new MMOs are released almost every other month yet they all fail to provide same level of product quality.
* WoW runs well even on poor-spec PCs. I think this is one of the most important things to succeed with MMO yet many major games fail big time in this respect (e.g. Rift)
* The graphics. Some people hate it's low-polygon and some people hate the "cartoony" style. But at least it has a style and artistic value. Many other games are just generic pseudo-realistic meh.
* The music. It's a good music. And it's not guaranteed in MMOs. Get decent headphones, listen to LOTRO music and then listen to WoW music. Those two are just incomparable.
* Game mechanics. Another highly underestimated thing. WoW is very responsive and makes you feel like you really control the character. And it does not matter how it achieves it (by faking some stuff client-side). It actually works!
* The game is attractive to both children and adults. I agree with what someone else already mentioned - there's definitely a lot of psychology involved.
* Easy to learn, hard to master. It's extremely accessible but there are still plenty of things that are really hard to achieve. Many people think WoW is easy but that's just because they didn't set themselves hard enough goals.
Now I'm sure I sound like a diehard WoW fan. Actually, no. I play a wide range of games. I like EVE. I like Rift. I liked LOTRO before I moved from PvE to basically PvP only. But at the same time I must say I compeltely understand why WoW is #1. It's because it IS the best product out there.
So the only way to beat WoW is to actually stop with PR bullshit like "No more elves" and actually make a product that is at least equally good. Then, perhaps, given time, it can beat WoW. After all we could use something fresh, it's getting a bit old...
TL;DR - WoW delivers best overall experience. To beat WoW, someone actually has to make something equally good first.
Funny... too bad that by far the typical WoW player is an adult in the mid to late twenties.
As for the topic, WoW was a real fluk. It showed up on the scene and dominated the competition which entrenched themselves tremendously. Eventually they will lost it's hold but likely not anytime soon. Right now slowly bit by bit their consumers are leaving for other things. WoW is a dated game and eventually it will "retire" much like EQ and Runescape.
no