People Are calling this a WoW clone . So i want to ask HOW is it a clone ? In detail please.
I Have some Questions that people can awnser PLEASE BE HONEST!
Question one Did you ever play FFXI and for how long? approx. 3 weeks in 2009ish at the requests of freinds who were trying to "get back into it"
Question two Did you play V1 of FFXIV and for how long? 4 months of the free periods
Question three Did you play WoW and for how long? 2 months maybe
Question four Be specific what aspects of FFXIV:ARR are like WoW ? uh..its fantasy...it has people going from place to place.
Question five Define what a "clone" is?
A cell, group of cells, or organism that is descended from and genetically identical to a single common ancestor, such as a bacterial colony whose members arose from a single original cell.
An organism descended asexually from a single ancestor, such as a plant produced by layering or a polyp produced by budding.
A DNA sequence, such as a gene, that is transferred from one organism to another and replicated by genetic engineering techniques.
One that copies or closely resembles another, as in appearance or function: "filled with business-school clones in gray and blue suits" (Michael M. Thomas).
Question six What specific aspects are like FFXI if any ? Too unfamiliar with FFXI to say. both made by square is all I can say off my head right now.
Question seven Do you think it is fair to pass judgement on a game that is only in a alpha build? IMO...nah
Question eight On a scale of one to ten rate your excitement to play ARR? 9
Question nine Are you a Hard Core gamer or a casual one ? IM a 'tardcore Casual.
Question ten How old are you ? 39
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
Originally posted by DarknessReign evilastro , do me a favor and look at the thread called All FFXIV ARR INFO found here , who started that thread ? who maintains that thread ? you assume to much. What I don't like is how people make the entire game to sound like it just totally copied WoW every aspect of it. That is not true. The same point I make that Call of Duity and say Battlefield have the same weapons , same controls , same general features , but different areas they set there games in.b No one calls it a clone and by this communitys standards just implementing a updated quest system like WoWs and a jump suddenly its a exact replica of WoW. so you miss interpreted what my questions are.
Your entire questionaire set out to be obnoxious and elitist.
I don't need to look at your thread, and it doesnt make you the authority on FFXIV, just makes you a fanboy. You assume too much, I have a very good understanding of the state of the new game... for undisclosed reasons obviously.
What I dont like is people who argue for the sake of it when they dont even understand the arguement. Did you even read my post? You didnt play WoW, how would you know that it isnt a clone?
They have adopted from WoW very heavily for ARR. This isnt a bad thing, the User Interface and questing in the original version of FFIV were horrendous. I played WoW for I guess 2 years off and on. I also played FFXIV for a few months while it was free, but eventually couldnt even bear to bother with that. Also played FFXI for about a year and I can guarantee that FFXIV has more in common with WoW than FFXI, aside from the lore and world obviously.
It essentially comes down to this: "... this game has quests! It's a WoW clone!" Who cares if a community prone to blind hatred dislikes something you like? Keep liking what you like. The best way to ruin a game is to visit the forums for that game.
The best way to ruin a game is to visit the forums for that game.
Somewhere in one of the threads here, I posted a gigantic post filled with all kinds of jarble and somewhere in there; I mentioned there was almost a harmful infighting particularly with the Final Fantasy crowd. And yeah everytime I felt a need for some lolz and such I'd go hit the forums up and watch people eat eachothers intestines. Sadly, it's the type of the thing that drives many away or is in some cases the last straw before the hopeful person says fck it and bails. That post dealt with a lot of topics, also about a fairly racist following of the game as well. I can't count how many times I personally would be trying to get in a group in FFXI and be told <English> <Thanks for the offer but I'll have to pass.>.
I did a bit of research on XIV when it came out, and just thought omg, this looks awful. The fact these guys take the time to make this totally beautiful CGI scenes which have like NOTHING to do with the actual in game situations really irked me. And the name Eoarzia just rubbed me wrong from the get go. Seeing it spell out I was like do each of the letters mean something or is this just a bunch of random syllables that escaped somebodies mouth and they though it sounde.. oh it's a bunch of random syllables that somebody thought sounded cool together.
I have been bent over more than a couple times by MMO companies and will never EVER pre-order or life time sub or any "insert expletives of choice" like that ever, I think the most recent wave of vomit inducing horse fecies to hit the market has re-affirmed that logic for me even moreso (SW:ToR is particularly foul). I will never fund a kickstarter, but I will follow a game, and rarely will I jump up and cast something down or brand it, until I've played it. In general I liked final fantasy, up until XIII most games were palatable for me. I even had a strange inkling to play XII from time to time even though before XIII I found it to be by far the worst in the series for it's butchering of the mmo style play into a single player set some macros up and go boil some ramen. Additionally the story of XII far and away was awful. I've seen people say VIII was awful story, and drawing sucked out the few enjoyable aspects of combat etc.. but XII was stupid. That you had to buy your gambits to set your macros up was beyond ball crushingly stupid imo; and money was a total cluster fck most of the time; liscense board was not my cup of tea either, Vaan.. you know I'll get off it, this is about XIV.
WoWclone or not, it will stand or fall on it's own merits. Honestly I like most of what I've seen of ARR. I think adding jumping but not having it used as a way to circumvent walking around a ledge is just sloppy/lazy, but not a game breaker for me. I'd rather have the option to jump around like a jack ass or walk like a jack ass as opposed to just walking like a jack ass. The combat still seems kinda lifeless to me. Although grapically the game is amazing it just seems kinda plasticy. I saw some voiced videos a while back, and saw a Taru Taru (not sure what the XIV version of that word is) talk and was put off by the Euro Trash voice acting he got. I just always imagined them to sound like angry kids or something. Again that they would take the time to put the polish on the game like CGI trailers and cut scenes is awesome. That they'd go and just demolish other aspects of play astounds me. It seems like priorities were all wrong before. Let's totally go for the WHOA factor and give them flashing lights and stuff and it will distract them enough so they won't see we forgot what makes an MMO an enjoyable MMO. I think at some point the people who were making this game stopped making the game players wanted to see and were making a game they thought they wanted to play, until they actually played it @ _@. Not sure if that makes sense. Anyhow I've drizzled enough of my bs on whoever is reading this eyes'. Overall I'm fascinated by it, and would like to play it.
Have you been around here when SWTOR, GW2, and to lesser extents TERA and TSW are getting hyped? You should have seen this coming from a mile away to know better than to fight it. It's a cycle that every new (Themepark) MMO goes through.
Based on this video it really does feel like the traditional quest system WoW popularized. We all know that's not the entirety of the game, but what they've shown here screams of "traditional". Maybe they do have cutscenes on main quests, I don't know, but I hope they do.
I know it's huge and has been popular for a long time, but to be factual games like EQ popularized the questing hub system that WoW later adopted. Sometimes things become so big you can't see around them to remember there was stuff before it. Games like EQ and Ultima were the founding frame works for what later got implemented into the beast Blizaard created.
This gamer is one who wishes the questing hubs would go away. I enjoy the questing style in GW2 where I am encouraged to be an adventurer. It is enjoyable in games like that to have the quests play out infront of me with voice acting rather than walls of text. I am looking forward to playing ARR, but have my concerns with stuff like the questing in the game. There are many implementations in the game that I do enjoy the idea of, one being the NM fights and the ease of job switching.
People Are calling this a WoW clone . So i want to ask HOW is it a clone ? In detail please. Well i played wow for 1 hour and then unistalled the game ( not lieng). I played Tera wasn't bad but when i played their pet class I unistalled. What im trying to say is WoW and games that copy it went down the drain. But to the quest What i heard is the quests progression is exactly like wow.
I Have some Questions that people can awnser PLEASE BE HONEST!
Question one Did you ever play FFXI and for how long? I played FF XI for 4 years
Question two Did you play V1 of FFXIV and for how long? Yes since the release of FFIV to end of trailer.
Question three Did you play WoW and for how long? HELL NO
Question four Be specific what aspects of FFXIV:ARR are like WoW ? The quest level progression. I think the whole quest idea is a bad move it feels like a copy and a dumb move. However i know these quest aren't a requirment to do to level or to progress to the main story.
Question five Define what a "clone" is? Copy of one self like a duplication of it. Like the iphone and the android for example.
Question six What specific aspects are like FFXI if any ? Hmmm the main core of the came is like FF XI. Like the magic/battle system. The class and jobs are as well. The chocobo raising system ( Some what an aspec most likely an improvement). The main aspect of the games "Avatars" or summons is directly related to the entire final fantasy franchise and XI. To be honest this has many things WoW does not so technically it isn't a clone of the game it just has the quest "SPAM" progression which is a bad move.
Question seven Do you think it is fair to pass judgement on a game that is only in a alpha build? Yes and No. yoshi was going to the right path with all the changes to 1.0. But he completely changed it what we imagined when they released the "2.0" speech that got everyone excited. What he should've done is kept the 1.0 feel with just all the newupdates from AAR. Which hes some what is doing don't get me wrong but when he copy something that people sees in almost every new MMO ( Starwars,Tera, and Raiderz) it just gonna make people think WTF? and that something is quest progression that where he shoul'dve stopped. HOWEVER the game still feels like final fantasy beside the quests. Now this is only alpha and i believe people will change his mind and make him remove the spam of quest and just leave the quest system as it was. But im going to "NO" the game is only in alpha people should just wait until the game is near end of beta before that shout out judgements.
Question nine Are you a Hard Core gamer or a casual one ? Guess im casual the only games I actually play is Final Fantasy MMO and Planetside nothing else.
Question ten How old are you ? 21.
Also so far the only thing they copied was the "quest spam" Nothing else is similar to WoW. Now note this quest spam is optional. You can level the old fashion way like XI or do leves.
This is what ARR has that WoW doesn't
Primals
"Primal Avatars" / "Primal essance"
Housing
Chocobo Raising
Faith
Leve Quest
Armory System
Hamlet Defence
Relic Weapons
Grand Company
Airships
classes/jobs
Other things i can't think of right now and its only in alpha phase.
Now Final Fantasy was a clone of everquest but it had its own core and many things everquest doesn't have. ARR is doing exactly that it adding element from wow and putting their own idea into the game not "CLONE TO THE MAX with just final fantasy skin".
This is a modern game, with a modern-ish/standard style quest system that a player may completely ignore if they so wish.
Other viable (And possibly better) methods of leveling are the old group and grind, and guild leve's. Among others that I have not yet explored.
I urge everyone to remember that other paths of xp and leveling are indeed necessary with the armory and job system. While there are certainly a lot of quests available, I've not come across any that are repeatable.
Calm the anti-hype train. AAR is a vast improvement over 1.0. Let's see how things turn out.
I can't be bothered to answer your little questionare because it's completely pointless, but I will respond to the main question and a few things you've said. For starters, when XIV initially released, NOBODY called it a WoW clone. Everybody called it an awful game. The two games had nothing in common. Second, the way you've presented the question is accusatory and is asking for flames.
There are a few reason why people are calling ARR a WoW clone. The first one is because the producer made some statements about how they would look to WoW and modern MMO's to inform game design. Instead of making an original and "Final Fantasy" feeling MMO from the get-go, they are more concerned with feature parity compared with the modern MMO market, which is a smart move, but one that will obviously make people suspicious and draw heavy criticism from the anti-WoW brigade.
Another reason is because of the latest video showing the incredibly typical ho-hum questing system we've seen for years. Yellow exclamation point offers you a quest. No need for exploration, just look at your map and head to the glowing area. Click on something, kill some stuff, collect some animal parts etc. Return to quest giver for money/XP/items. Rinse and repeat. FFXI had these types of quests that were totally unrelated to everything, but they were almost pointless to do aside from raising reputation. In ARR, they seem like they will fill a larger role.
The last and probably most frustrating reason for you is that people call everything that uses ideas from WoW a WoW clone. Some of them are trolling because people like you constantly feed them. Some of them just really really really REALLY hate WoW because it's "killing the genre" or some such over-emotional rhetoric.
The bottom line is that aside from some features that are considered standard for a themepark MMO, XIV ARR is not a WoW clone just like Rift and GW2 aren't WoW clones. It's an overused and often improperly used word especially on these forums, but I suspect you know that. I'm not expecting ARR to be a WoW clone, but I am expecting the game to have feature parity and offer what modern themeparks offer.
I can't be bothered to answer your little questionare because it's completely pointless, but I will respond to the main question and a few things you've said. For starters, when XIV initially released, NOBODY called it a WoW clone. Everybody called it an awful game. The two games had nothing in common. Second, the way you've presented the question is accusatory and is asking for flames.
There are a few reason why people are calling ARR a WoW clone. The first one is because the producer made some statements about how they would look to WoW and modern MMO's to inform game design. Instead of making an original and "Final Fantasy" feeling MMO from the get-go, they are more concerned with feature parity compared with the modern MMO market, which is a smart move, but one that will obviously make people suspicious and draw heavy criticism from the anti-WoW brigade.
Another reason is because of the latest video showing the incredibly typical ho-hum questing system we've seen for years. Yellow exclamation point offers you a quest. No need for exploration, just look at your map and head to the glowing area. Click on something, kill some stuff, collect some animal parts etc. Return to quest giver for money/XP/items. Rinse and repeat. FFXI had these types of quests that were totally unrelated to everything, but they were almost pointless to do aside from raising reputation. In ARR, they seem like they will fill a larger role.
The last and probably most frustrating reason for you is that people call everything that uses ideas from WoW a WoW clone. Some of them are trolling because people like you constantly feed them. Some of them just really really really REALLY hate WoW because it's "killing the genre" or some such over-emotional rhetoric.
The bottom line is that aside from some features that are considered standard for a themepark MMO, XIV ARR is not a WoW clone just like Rift and GW2 aren't WoW clones. It's an overused and often improperly used word especially on these forums, but I suspect you know that. I'm not expecting ARR to be a WoW clone, but I am expecting the game to have feature parity and offer what modern themeparks offer.
Originally posted by DarknessReign I love the Awnsers and the debate so far. the post with the true definition of clone was funny . I also like the post calling me names that shows total class and maturity keep it up bra. I remember when V1 came out and the community screamed WoW clone . Then ARR there screaming WoW clone . I'm glad we can finally decide what is or is not a WoW clone . But honesty exp parties with chains will be back weapon skill stacking . I do want to know to if it copies some modern mmo standards the WoW added I.e questing exp. Is that a bad thing ?
[mod edit] I haven't seen a single post where anyone called v1 a wow clone.
DarknessReign.. I get that you are frustrated about the subject at hand but I'll give you some advice. If you really want to understand why people don't agree with what you are trying to say and you want to know more about other people's experience with WOW and how that relates to ARR.. you need to learn some netiquette.
In other words.. be the bigger person. Even the trollers, insulters and flamers will at least respect your posts if you keep your cool. They won't say they will, but they will. There is a lot more chance you'll get your point across if you are consistently polite most of the time, even when you feel you are being insulted. As soon as someone reads an insult in a reply to them, all they do is reply to that insult.. everything else you said means nothing to them. You are doing it with their replies to you and they are doing it with your replies to them.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Originally posted by DarknessReign I love the Awnsers and the debate so far. the post with the true definition of clone was funny . I also like the post calling me names that shows total class and maturity keep it up bra. I remember when V1 came out and the community screamed WoW clone . Then ARR there screaming WoW clone . I'm glad we can finally decide what is or is not a WoW clone . But honesty exp parties with chains will be back weapon skill stacking . I do want to know to if it copies some modern mmo standards the WoW added I.e questing exp. Is that a bad thing ?
This is a pathetic lie. I haven't seen a single post where anyone called v1 a wow clone.
No cred left.
Maybe not here in particular but i remember alot of my XI freinds and other say it kinda was just because XIV brought in the hotbar. : /
Huh? So your friends called v1 a wow clone, just because it had a hotbar? In other words, thousands of games in almost every genre are wow clones, according to your friends. Lmfao.
So you are attacking an invisible audience and then you hope they reply?
And I like how you imply they are immature by asking "how old are you" as one of the questions.
Talk about a bunch of loaded questions by an angry fan. We get it, you for some reason like the game. Have you seen the new videos? Have you seen how the quests are kill 6 bees? Name a fina fantasy that had you kill 5 of anything... OH right there isn't one.
This is a wow clone, deal with it.
P.S. You can see ages by looking at profiles if you REALLY are hellbent on aruging that only kiddies call things wow clones.
Originally posted by DarknessReign I love the Awnsers and the debate so far. the post with the true definition of clone was funny . I also like the post calling me names that shows total class and maturity keep it up bra. I remember when V1 came out and the community screamed WoW clone . Then ARR there screaming WoW clone . I'm glad we can finally decide what is or is not a WoW clone . But honesty exp parties with chains will be back weapon skill stacking . I do want to know to if it copies some modern mmo standards the WoW added I.e questing exp. Is that a bad thing ?
This is a pathetic lie. I haven't seen a single post where anyone called v1 a wow clone.
No cred left.
Maybe not here in particular but i remember alot of my XI freinds and other say it kinda was just because XIV brought in the hotbar. : /
Huh? So your friends called v1 a wow clone, just because it had a hotbar? In other words, thousands of games in almost every genre are wow clones, according to your friends. Lmfao.
i was in from the start of V1 (beta) and i went on multiple forums, including the later added offical forums and i never saw this. I saw tons of bitching about how it sucks (did my share), but i dont remember a single thing about a WoW clone.
This version is being build on the "standard" that WoW set, which makes me and what seems to be plenty of others thing its gonna be another game thats a lot like WoW and burns to the ground. I loved many years of FFXI, and a majority of the people who went to 14 wanted it to be something similar to it, but it wasnt, and now this is seemingly going even further from it.
Originally posted by DarknessReign I love the Awnsers and the debate so far. the post with the true definition of clone was funny . I also like the post calling me names that shows total class and maturity keep it up bra. I remember when V1 came out and the community screamed WoW clone . Then ARR there screaming WoW clone . I'm glad we can finally decide what is or is not a WoW clone . But honesty exp parties with chains will be back weapon skill stacking . I do want to know to if it copies some modern mmo standards the WoW added I.e questing exp. Is that a bad thing ?
This is a pathetic lie. I haven't seen a single post where anyone called v1 a wow clone.
No cred left.
Maybe not here in particular but i remember alot of my XI freinds and other say it kinda was just because XIV brought in the hotbar. : /
Huh? So your friends called v1 a wow clone, just because it had a hotbar? In other words, thousands of games in almost every genre are wow clones, according to your friends. Lmfao.
i was in from the start of V1 (beta) and i went on multiple forums, including the later added offical forums and i never saw this. I saw tons of bitching about how it sucks (did my share), but i dont remember a single thing about a WoW clone.
This version is being build on the "standard" that WoW set, which makes me and what seems to be plenty of others thing its gonna be another game thats a lot like WoW and burns to the ground. I loved many years of FFXI, and a majority of the people who went to 14 wanted it to be something similar to it, but it wasnt, and now this is seemingly going even further from it.
Yes, ARR may become a wow clone, there are some indicators to that. But v1 never was.
People Are calling this a WoW clone . So i want to ask HOW is it a clone ? In detail please.
I Have some Questions that people can awnser PLEASE BE HONEST!
Question one Did you ever play FFXI and for how long?
Question two Did you play V1 of FFXIV and for how long?
Question three Did you play WoW and for how long?
Question four Be specific what aspects of FFXIV:ARR are like WoW ?
Question five Define what a "clone" is?
Question six What specific aspects are like FFXI if any ?
Question seven Do you think it is fair to pass judgement on a game that is only in a alpha build?
Question eight On a scale of one to ten rate your excitement to play ARR?
Question nine Are you a Hard Core gamer or a casual one ?
Question ten How old are you ?
1. yes, off and on from launch day for about a year. not solo friendly at the time so stopped.
2. yes, in the beta, i saw that titanic on a direct coarse for an iceberg and jumped ship to get me money back for pre-order LMAO
3. yes, since launch day off and on for about ... everything until pandaland, don't give a **** bout pandas, monks, pokemon ripoffs
4. i wish i KNEW, all i've seen is what the head of development for FF14 2.0 said "Yoshida: One of the reasons why Final Fantasy XI was so successful was that the whole development team went and played Everquest and they thought “Okay, we want to do exactly what they did with Final Fantasy XI!” You know there were times
where you couldn’t contact any of them because of how much they played *laughs*, but because they did that they had a direction. One of the problems with Final Fantasy XIV was that there wasn’t that direction, they didn’t know what the standard was and they never played World of Warcraft, they didn’t know enough and because they didn’t know enough they couldn’t build something up to the standards of current MMOs. Plus when they started creating Final Fantasy XI there was Final Fantasy X that strongly influenced them.
With Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn we don’t want to create many new things, we first want to start of getting this global standard and then adding that Final Fantasy feel. We want to get the crystal tower in and the gold soucer to get that epic Final Fantasy feeling."
5. a clone in this instance means a new IP is taking so many ideas from an existing IP that one may as well consider just playing the product being mimicked than the new product simply because it is older and thus more polished with more content. Now, any MMO worth a hill of beans knows that it is smart to take good ideas that work and use them, hense why FF14 1.0 failed SOHARD! However, some MMO players draw an invisible, unspoken, undefined line in the sand where they see a product as copying TOO much, despite the quality or practicality of what is being copied. They fail to realize that a wheel can only be reinvented so many times, but whatever.
6. Now having played both FF11 and FF14 (even if not very much) i can say that the differences between 11 and 14 1.0 were not tremendous, yet a lot of the great decisions made for 11 (ideas admittedly taken from EQ1) were not carried forward into 14. But then, the people that made 14 1.0 had never played an MMO in their lives, including FF11, so they really had no idea what there even was to copy it would seem.
7. Sort of. You can see a lot from Alpha, such as the primary direction of the game, and information leaked and presented. Knowing that Square is in xtreme financial duress it is obvious that they cannot shift their direction for the game dramatically because everything is riding on this. If 14 2.0 fails then that's it. the literal FINAL fantasy.
8. no.
9. both, simultaneously. i have a life, i don't get payed to game. i have a career, a family, social life. i don't spend every waking hour gaming or thinking about gaming. but when i get into a game, i get into it. at the same time i can only likely play it casually.
10. A/S/L LOL?!?! i'm 27. not sure how this is important. 18 year olds have just as much to say as 41 year olds and their opinions are just as valid because their money (and/or their parent's money) is every bit as influential as yours or mine.
I would like to see FF14 2.0 succeed. for the sake of a company i used to admire and respect, and because for god's sake i wanted to like both 11 and 14 1.0 a lot and was dissappointed in not just square but myself for that not happening. i've herd (by watching a retro gaming video here on MMORPG.com a couple weeks ago that was talking about the newest FF11 expansion coming out next year) that you can now solo in FF11 to max level in like, a couple days. But it is sooooo too little too late for that as the game is old as crap, did not age well (ps1 graphx FTW), and no one plays anymore. Using WoW as the model for FF14 is never something people on these forums wants to here but seems sound from the perspective of a developer trying to please shareholders. It IS the most successful MMO in history. People here just want something new. cause they are content locusts. And they smell. Yet many an mmo has copied wow and still failed miserably so it is no guarentee.
I don't think there is any point in talking about this anymore, people have made their minds up. I just hope enough try ARR at launch and enjoy it for the game to survive.
If it means anything, ARR isn't a WoW clone, that is an over simplification, it is a standard western style fantasy thempark mmo, which it needs to be to have broader, safer, appeal given its budget. It has its own flavour which some will like, and some features that are interesting, when you get deeper into it. Alterholics will love the armoury, and crafters may enjoy the attention they get.
That is as balanced a summation as you will get here.
To be honest, everyone here that saying XIV 2.0 is a WoW clone is delusional or lying. It still has gathering and crafting classes, Chocobo Raising, and storylines (not quest chains).
But ever since Yoshi-P took over, he has been making it more like the "generic" MMO model we see often. Removing the stamina bar, the /check system to gauge enemy strength, letting NPC's repair gear to 99% are just examples I can name off the top of my head.
And 2.0 looks to further the trend to a point I'm cautious on even playing it. When I was watching the latest gameplay video that showed off the typical questing system and reading the interview where Yoshi-P said they have a lot to learn from the modern MMO leveling system I literally thought to myself "Why?".
Is it a WoW clone? No. Is it becoming more and more like WoW while putting it's own "spin" on the game just like most MMO's try to do now? Yes.
People Are calling this a WoW clone . So i want to ask HOW is it a clone ? In detail please.
I Have some Questions that people can awnser PLEASE BE HONEST!
Question one Did you ever play FFXI and for how long?
Question two Did you play V1 of FFXIV and for how long?
Question three Did you play WoW and for how long?
Question four Be specific what aspects of FFXIV:ARR are like WoW ?
Question five Define what a "clone" is?
Question six What specific aspects are like FFXI if any ?
Question seven Do you think it is fair to pass judgement on a game that is only in a alpha build?
Question eight On a scale of one to ten rate your excitement to play ARR?
Question nine Are you a Hard Core gamer or a casual one ?
Question ten How old are you ?
1. Yes. About five years. I played until ToAU was released and quit for about a year. Then I came back for about a year.
2. Yes. I played the initial release for a couple months. Then I played it for a couple months right before the servers shut down.
3. Yes. I probably played it for four months.
4. Short ladder to the top. End game focused. Being led by the nose from point to point. Heavy use of instances. Increased number of hybrids. Race is insignificant in terms of how you play, ie stats are basically the same. Monsters are incredibly easy to kill.
5. If we are sticking to the dictionary definition of the word then the word clone is a bad choice. The point is that a "WoW clone" is a game that doesn't dare to be different to any significant degree.
6. I donm't know what this question means.
7. Six years ago I would have answer no to this question. Everyone knows that 90% of the games released either fail or are only playable for a few months. With the kind of games I see being released over and over it makes game quality very predictable.
8. 2
9. I don't know what this means either. Time spent gaming? Quality of games? Pickiness? What?
Originally posted by DarknessReign I love the Awnsers and the debate so far. the post with the true definition of clone was funny . I also like the post calling me names that shows total class and maturity keep it up bra. I remember when V1 came out and the community screamed WoW clone . Then ARR there screaming WoW clone . I'm glad we can finally decide what is or is not a WoW clone . But honesty exp parties with chains will be back weapon skill stacking . I do want to know to if it copies some modern mmo standards the WoW added I.e questing exp. Is that a bad thing ?
This is a pathetic lie. I haven't seen a single post where anyone called v1 a wow clone.
As for the FFXIV V1 a WoW clone compairing Beta V1 with Alpha V2 Just before the game Ended people were talking about how much it was starting to feel like WoW
I don't think there is any point in talking about this anymore, people have made their minds up. I just hope enough try ARR at launch and enjoy it for the game to survive.
If it means anything, ARR isn't a WoW clone, that is an over simplification, it is a standard western style fantasy thempark mmo, which it needs to be to have broader, safer, appeal given its budget. It has its own flavour which some will like, and some features that are interesting, when you get deeper into it. Alterholics will love the armoury, and crafters may enjoy the attention they get.
That is as balanced a summation as you will get here.
I'll agree with this and im done.
A standard western style themepark MMO is a wow clone. Only minor things change from game to game so that the WoW adventure can continue indefinitely. You have to play a themepark that was developed before WoW to see the difference. Unfortunately most of those have now been patched to be more WoW like.
I have played all of FFXI, FFXIV v1, and WoW a lot, although not recently for any of them. I am also mid-40s and older than you and am married and have a few kids, although I am not sure why that is relevant and you asked it. I also have a registration date a lot earlier than you so am not a "newcomer" unlike you.
It does sound like they are basically making FFXIV:ARR a WoW clone with a FF veneer. So be it. The WoW engine means it will be a solid game. The FF veneer means it will appeal to a lot of people. Don't underestimate the importance of a veneer: people tend to do what they do for stylistic reasons more than anything else.
I am looking forward to it and will give it a chance.
A standard western style themepark MMO is a wow clone. Only minor things change from game to game so that the WoW adventure can continue indefinitely. You have to play a themepark that was developed before WoW to see the difference. Unfortunately most of those have now been patched to be more WoW like.
That is still an over-simplification, yes WoW typifies the standard model, but due to it being derived from mmos before and "borrowing" ideas after, it reflects the zeitgeist, and ARR has to too. Yes Yoshida has put in elements that will remind many people of WoW, but that is only due to so many more having played it, and not much else. After playing a great many western mmos ARR looks more like 1,0 mixed with a generic quest mechanic, not WoW in particular. (semantics a little bit I admit)
I did play many mmos before WoW, they had features I miss, and many I don’t, WoW was considerably less of a hassle, and it’s hard to go backwards. Playing FFXIV 1.0 made you miss basic features we now take for granted. ARR needs to provide common ground, the quest hubs it now has are for the starting class you pick, the rest will be using leves, grinding, and dungeons, just as 1.0, giving it an older mmo feel. In many ways ARR reminds me more of Ragnarok in its atmosphere, classes given their own areas and stories, lack of quests (eventually) and the crafting.
I cannot wait for this period to end, people judging the game via NDA leaks and a few mins of footage is pissing me off, and I wish I was free to really respond.
I have played all of FFXI, FFXIV v1, and WoW a lot, although not recently for any of them. I am also mid-40s and older than you and am married and have a few kids, although I am not sure why that is relevant and you asked it. I also have a registration date a lot earlier than you so am not a "newcomer" unlike you.
It does sound like they are basically making FFXIV:ARR a WoW clone with a FF veneer. So be it. The WoW engine means it will be a solid game. The FF veneer means it will appeal to a lot of people. Don't underestimate the importance of a veneer: people tend to do what they do for stylistic reasons more than anything else.
I am looking forward to it and will give it a chance.
One of meany honest awnsers . The reason why i asked the Age question is because if someone who is say 20 and played WoW from day 1 that would make them 12 when they started or if someone started FFXI from day one at the same age it would make them 10 its a way to see how honest they are . Things from 10~12 years in age might seem Bigger or smaller then they really were . And i would agree with you. Its ok to copy somethings like WoW it is after all the biggest MMO . And is what players in NA are used to. Just as long as its not a total Copy witch i dont think it will be.
It does sound like they are basically making FFXIV:ARR a WoW clone with a FF veneer. So be it. The WoW engine means it will be a solid game. The FF veneer means it will appeal to a lot of people. Don't underestimate the importance of a veneer: people tend to do what they do for stylistic reasons more than anything else.
Actually the veneer, (though fairly thick at first) are the WoW elements, true the UI and combat are a big permanent change, but the questing hub game play is finite, and there are a lot of classes to lvl with the armoury system, that is why leves from 1.0 and exp chains from FFXI will become more important the longer you play, until it won't feel remotely like WoW, (providing they get endgame combat right).
Comments
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
Your entire questionaire set out to be obnoxious and elitist.
I don't need to look at your thread, and it doesnt make you the authority on FFXIV, just makes you a fanboy. You assume too much, I have a very good understanding of the state of the new game... for undisclosed reasons obviously.
What I dont like is people who argue for the sake of it when they dont even understand the arguement. Did you even read my post? You didnt play WoW, how would you know that it isnt a clone?
They have adopted from WoW very heavily for ARR. This isnt a bad thing, the User Interface and questing in the original version of FFIV were horrendous. I played WoW for I guess 2 years off and on. I also played FFXIV for a few months while it was free, but eventually couldnt even bear to bother with that. Also played FFXI for about a year and I can guarantee that FFXIV has more in common with WoW than FFXI, aside from the lore and world obviously.
Too much drama and too many overreactions.
People in this community will often:
a) Hate on WoW for no logical reason
b) call anything they dislike a "WoW clone"
It essentially comes down to this: "... this game has quests! It's a WoW clone!" Who cares if a community prone to blind hatred dislikes something you like? Keep liking what you like. The best way to ruin a game is to visit the forums for that game.
Somewhere in one of the threads here, I posted a gigantic post filled with all kinds of jarble and somewhere in there; I mentioned there was almost a harmful infighting particularly with the Final Fantasy crowd. And yeah everytime I felt a need for some lolz and such I'd go hit the forums up and watch people eat eachothers intestines. Sadly, it's the type of the thing that drives many away or is in some cases the last straw before the hopeful person says fck it and bails. That post dealt with a lot of topics, also about a fairly racist following of the game as well. I can't count how many times I personally would be trying to get in a group in FFXI and be told <English> <Thanks for the offer but I'll have to pass.>.
I did a bit of research on XIV when it came out, and just thought omg, this looks awful. The fact these guys take the time to make this totally beautiful CGI scenes which have like NOTHING to do with the actual in game situations really irked me. And the name Eoarzia just rubbed me wrong from the get go. Seeing it spell out I was like do each of the letters mean something or is this just a bunch of random syllables that escaped somebodies mouth and they though it sounde.. oh it's a bunch of random syllables that somebody thought sounded cool together.
I have been bent over more than a couple times by MMO companies and will never EVER pre-order or life time sub or any "insert expletives of choice" like that ever, I think the most recent wave of vomit inducing horse fecies to hit the market has re-affirmed that logic for me even moreso (SW:ToR is particularly foul). I will never fund a kickstarter, but I will follow a game, and rarely will I jump up and cast something down or brand it, until I've played it. In general I liked final fantasy, up until XIII most games were palatable for me. I even had a strange inkling to play XII from time to time even though before XIII I found it to be by far the worst in the series for it's butchering of the mmo style play into a single player set some macros up and go boil some ramen. Additionally the story of XII far and away was awful. I've seen people say VIII was awful story, and drawing sucked out the few enjoyable aspects of combat etc.. but XII was stupid. That you had to buy your gambits to set your macros up was beyond ball crushingly stupid imo; and money was a total cluster fck most of the time; liscense board was not my cup of tea either, Vaan.. you know I'll get off it, this is about XIV.
WoWclone or not, it will stand or fall on it's own merits. Honestly I like most of what I've seen of ARR. I think adding jumping but not having it used as a way to circumvent walking around a ledge is just sloppy/lazy, but not a game breaker for me. I'd rather have the option to jump around like a jack ass or walk like a jack ass as opposed to just walking like a jack ass. The combat still seems kinda lifeless to me. Although grapically the game is amazing it just seems kinda plasticy. I saw some voiced videos a while back, and saw a Taru Taru (not sure what the XIV version of that word is) talk and was put off by the Euro Trash voice acting he got. I just always imagined them to sound like angry kids or something. Again that they would take the time to put the polish on the game like CGI trailers and cut scenes is awesome. That they'd go and just demolish other aspects of play astounds me. It seems like priorities were all wrong before. Let's totally go for the WHOA factor and give them flashing lights and stuff and it will distract them enough so they won't see we forgot what makes an MMO an enjoyable MMO. I think at some point the people who were making this game stopped making the game players wanted to see and were making a game they thought they wanted to play, until they actually played it @ _@. Not sure if that makes sense. Anyhow I've drizzled enough of my bs on whoever is reading this eyes'. Overall I'm fascinated by it, and would like to play it.
I know it's huge and has been popular for a long time, but to be factual games like EQ popularized the questing hub system that WoW later adopted. Sometimes things become so big you can't see around them to remember there was stuff before it. Games like EQ and Ultima were the founding frame works for what later got implemented into the beast Blizaard created.
This gamer is one who wishes the questing hubs would go away. I enjoy the questing style in GW2 where I am encouraged to be an adventurer. It is enjoyable in games like that to have the quests play out infront of me with voice acting rather than walls of text. I am looking forward to playing ARR, but have my concerns with stuff like the questing in the game. There are many implementations in the game that I do enjoy the idea of, one being the NM fights and the ease of job switching.
People Are calling this a WoW clone . So i want to ask HOW is it a clone ? In detail please. Well i played wow for 1 hour and then unistalled the game ( not lieng). I played Tera wasn't bad but when i played their pet class I unistalled. What im trying to say is WoW and games that copy it went down the drain. But to the quest What i heard is the quests progression is exactly like wow.
I Have some Questions that people can awnser PLEASE BE HONEST!
Question one Did you ever play FFXI and for how long? I played FF XI for 4 years
Question two Did you play V1 of FFXIV and for how long? Yes since the release of FFIV to end of trailer.
Question three Did you play WoW and for how long? HELL NO
Question four Be specific what aspects of FFXIV:ARR are like WoW ? The quest level progression. I think the whole quest idea is a bad move it feels like a copy and a dumb move. However i know these quest aren't a requirment to do to level or to progress to the main story.
Question five Define what a "clone" is? Copy of one self like a duplication of it. Like the iphone and the android for example.
Question six What specific aspects are like FFXI if any ? Hmmm the main core of the came is like FF XI. Like the magic/battle system. The class and jobs are as well. The chocobo raising system ( Some what an aspec most likely an improvement). The main aspect of the games "Avatars" or summons is directly related to the entire final fantasy franchise and XI. To be honest this has many things WoW does not so technically it isn't a clone of the game it just has the quest "SPAM" progression which is a bad move.
Question seven Do you think it is fair to pass judgement on a game that is only in a alpha build? Yes and No. yoshi was going to the right path with all the changes to 1.0. But he completely changed it what we imagined when they released the "2.0" speech that got everyone excited. What he should've done is kept the 1.0 feel with just all the newupdates from AAR. Which hes some what is doing don't get me wrong but when he copy something that people sees in almost every new MMO ( Starwars,Tera, and Raiderz) it just gonna make people think WTF? and that something is quest progression that where he shoul'dve stopped. HOWEVER the game still feels like final fantasy beside the quests. Now this is only alpha and i believe people will change his mind and make him remove the spam of quest and just leave the quest system as it was. But im going to "NO" the game is only in alpha people should just wait until the game is near end of beta before that shout out judgements.
Question nine Are you a Hard Core gamer or a casual one ? Guess im casual the only games I actually play is Final Fantasy MMO and Planetside nothing else.
Question ten How old are you ? 21.
Also so far the only thing they copied was the "quest spam" Nothing else is similar to WoW. Now note this quest spam is optional. You can level the old fashion way like XI or do leves.
This is what ARR has that WoW doesn't
Primals
"Primal Avatars" / "Primal essance"
Housing
Chocobo Raising
Faith
Leve Quest
Armory System
Hamlet Defence
Relic Weapons
Grand Company
Airships
classes/jobs
Other things i can't think of right now and its only in alpha phase.
Now Final Fantasy was a clone of everquest but it had its own core and many things everquest doesn't have. ARR is doing exactly that it adding element from wow and putting their own idea into the game not "CLONE TO THE MAX with just final fantasy skin".
This is a modern game, with a modern-ish/standard style quest system that a player may completely ignore if they so wish.
Other viable (And possibly better) methods of leveling are the old group and grind, and guild leve's. Among others that I have not yet explored.
I urge everyone to remember that other paths of xp and leveling are indeed necessary with the armory and job system. While there are certainly a lot of quests available, I've not come across any that are repeatable.
Calm the anti-hype train. AAR is a vast improvement over 1.0. Let's see how things turn out.
I can't be bothered to answer your little questionare because it's completely pointless, but I will respond to the main question and a few things you've said. For starters, when XIV initially released, NOBODY called it a WoW clone. Everybody called it an awful game. The two games had nothing in common. Second, the way you've presented the question is accusatory and is asking for flames.
There are a few reason why people are calling ARR a WoW clone. The first one is because the producer made some statements about how they would look to WoW and modern MMO's to inform game design. Instead of making an original and "Final Fantasy" feeling MMO from the get-go, they are more concerned with feature parity compared with the modern MMO market, which is a smart move, but one that will obviously make people suspicious and draw heavy criticism from the anti-WoW brigade.
Another reason is because of the latest video showing the incredibly typical ho-hum questing system we've seen for years. Yellow exclamation point offers you a quest. No need for exploration, just look at your map and head to the glowing area. Click on something, kill some stuff, collect some animal parts etc. Return to quest giver for money/XP/items. Rinse and repeat. FFXI had these types of quests that were totally unrelated to everything, but they were almost pointless to do aside from raising reputation. In ARR, they seem like they will fill a larger role.
The last and probably most frustrating reason for you is that people call everything that uses ideas from WoW a WoW clone. Some of them are trolling because people like you constantly feed them. Some of them just really really really REALLY hate WoW because it's "killing the genre" or some such over-emotional rhetoric.
The bottom line is that aside from some features that are considered standard for a themepark MMO, XIV ARR is not a WoW clone just like Rift and GW2 aren't WoW clones. It's an overused and often improperly used word especially on these forums, but I suspect you know that. I'm not expecting ARR to be a WoW clone, but I am expecting the game to have feature parity and offer what modern themeparks offer.
Well put.
[mod edit] I haven't seen a single post where anyone called v1 a wow clone.
[mod edit]
DarknessReign.. I get that you are frustrated about the subject at hand but I'll give you some advice. If you really want to understand why people don't agree with what you are trying to say and you want to know more about other people's experience with WOW and how that relates to ARR.. you need to learn some netiquette.
In other words.. be the bigger person. Even the trollers, insulters and flamers will at least respect your posts if you keep your cool. They won't say they will, but they will. There is a lot more chance you'll get your point across if you are consistently polite most of the time, even when you feel you are being insulted. As soon as someone reads an insult in a reply to them, all they do is reply to that insult.. everything else you said means nothing to them. You are doing it with their replies to you and they are doing it with your replies to them.
Huh? So your friends called v1 a wow clone, just because it had a hotbar? In other words, thousands of games in almost every genre are wow clones, according to your friends. Lmfao.
So you are attacking an invisible audience and then you hope they reply?
And I like how you imply they are immature by asking "how old are you" as one of the questions.
Talk about a bunch of loaded questions by an angry fan. We get it, you for some reason like the game. Have you seen the new videos? Have you seen how the quests are kill 6 bees? Name a fina fantasy that had you kill 5 of anything... OH right there isn't one.
This is a wow clone, deal with it.
P.S. You can see ages by looking at profiles if you REALLY are hellbent on aruging that only kiddies call things wow clones.
i was in from the start of V1 (beta) and i went on multiple forums, including the later added offical forums and i never saw this. I saw tons of bitching about how it sucks (did my share), but i dont remember a single thing about a WoW clone.
This version is being build on the "standard" that WoW set, which makes me and what seems to be plenty of others thing its gonna be another game thats a lot like WoW and burns to the ground. I loved many years of FFXI, and a majority of the people who went to 14 wanted it to be something similar to it, but it wasnt, and now this is seemingly going even further from it.
Yes, ARR may become a wow clone, there are some indicators to that. But v1 never was.
1. yes, off and on from launch day for about a year. not solo friendly at the time so stopped.
2. yes, in the beta, i saw that titanic on a direct coarse for an iceberg and jumped ship to get me money back for pre-order LMAO
3. yes, since launch day off and on for about ... everything until pandaland, don't give a **** bout pandas, monks, pokemon ripoffs
4. i wish i KNEW, all i've seen is what the head of development for FF14 2.0 said "Yoshida: One of the reasons why Final Fantasy XI was so successful was that the whole development team went and played Everquest and they thought “Okay, we want to do exactly what they did with Final Fantasy XI!” You know there were times
With Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn we don’t want to create many new things, we first want to start of getting this global standard and then adding that Final Fantasy feel. We want to get the crystal tower in and the gold soucer to get that epic Final Fantasy feeling."
Man this thread is depressing.
I don't think there is any point in talking about this anymore, people have made their minds up. I just hope enough try ARR at launch and enjoy it for the game to survive.
If it means anything, ARR isn't a WoW clone, that is an over simplification, it is a standard western style fantasy thempark mmo, which it needs to be to have broader, safer, appeal given its budget. It has its own flavour which some will like, and some features that are interesting, when you get deeper into it. Alterholics will love the armoury, and crafters may enjoy the attention they get.
That is as balanced a summation as you will get here.
To be honest, everyone here that saying XIV 2.0 is a WoW clone is delusional or lying. It still has gathering and crafting classes, Chocobo Raising, and storylines (not quest chains).
But ever since Yoshi-P took over, he has been making it more like the "generic" MMO model we see often. Removing the stamina bar, the /check system to gauge enemy strength, letting NPC's repair gear to 99% are just examples I can name off the top of my head.
And 2.0 looks to further the trend to a point I'm cautious on even playing it. When I was watching the latest gameplay video that showed off the typical questing system and reading the interview where Yoshi-P said they have a lot to learn from the modern MMO leveling system I literally thought to myself "Why?".
Is it a WoW clone? No. Is it becoming more and more like WoW while putting it's own "spin" on the game just like most MMO's try to do now? Yes.
1. Yes. About five years. I played until ToAU was released and quit for about a year. Then I came back for about a year.
2. Yes. I played the initial release for a couple months. Then I played it for a couple months right before the servers shut down.
3. Yes. I probably played it for four months.
4. Short ladder to the top. End game focused. Being led by the nose from point to point. Heavy use of instances. Increased number of hybrids. Race is insignificant in terms of how you play, ie stats are basically the same. Monsters are incredibly easy to kill.
5. If we are sticking to the dictionary definition of the word then the word clone is a bad choice. The point is that a "WoW clone" is a game that doesn't dare to be different to any significant degree.
6. I donm't know what this question means.
7. Six years ago I would have answer no to this question. Everyone knows that 90% of the games released either fail or are only playable for a few months. With the kind of games I see being released over and over it makes game quality very predictable.
8. 2
9. I don't know what this means either. Time spent gaming? Quality of games? Pickiness? What?
10. 28
[mod edit]
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/4838581#4838581
As for the FFXIV V1 a WoW clone compairing Beta V1 with Alpha V2 Just before the game Ended people were talking about how much it was starting to feel like WoW
http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link
A standard western style themepark MMO is a wow clone. Only minor things change from game to game so that the WoW adventure can continue indefinitely. You have to play a themepark that was developed before WoW to see the difference. Unfortunately most of those have now been patched to be more WoW like.
Hi DarknessReign,
I have played all of FFXI, FFXIV v1, and WoW a lot, although not recently for any of them. I am also mid-40s and older than you and am married and have a few kids, although I am not sure why that is relevant and you asked it. I also have a registration date a lot earlier than you so am not a "newcomer" unlike you.
It does sound like they are basically making FFXIV:ARR a WoW clone with a FF veneer. So be it. The WoW engine means it will be a solid game. The FF veneer means it will appeal to a lot of people. Don't underestimate the importance of a veneer: people tend to do what they do for stylistic reasons more than anything else.
I am looking forward to it and will give it a chance.
That is still an over-simplification, yes WoW typifies the standard model, but due to it being derived from mmos before and "borrowing" ideas after, it reflects the zeitgeist, and ARR has to too. Yes Yoshida has put in elements that will remind many people of WoW, but that is only due to so many more having played it, and not much else. After playing a great many western mmos ARR looks more like 1,0 mixed with a generic quest mechanic, not WoW in particular. (semantics a little bit I admit)
I did play many mmos before WoW, they had features I miss, and many I don’t, WoW was considerably less of a hassle, and it’s hard to go backwards. Playing FFXIV 1.0 made you miss basic features we now take for granted. ARR needs to provide common ground, the quest hubs it now has are for the starting class you pick, the rest will be using leves, grinding, and dungeons, just as 1.0, giving it an older mmo feel. In many ways ARR reminds me more of Ragnarok in its atmosphere, classes given their own areas and stories, lack of quests (eventually) and the crafting.
I cannot wait for this period to end, people judging the game via NDA leaks and a few mins of footage is pissing me off, and I wish I was free to really respond.
One of meany honest awnsers . The reason why i asked the Age question is because if someone who is say 20 and played WoW from day 1 that would make them 12 when they started or if someone started FFXI from day one at the same age it would make them 10 its a way to see how honest they are . Things from 10~12 years in age might seem Bigger or smaller then they really were . And i would agree with you. Its ok to copy somethings like WoW it is after all the biggest MMO . And is what players in NA are used to. Just as long as its not a total Copy witch i dont think it will be.
http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link
Actually the veneer, (though fairly thick at first) are the WoW elements, true the UI and combat are a big permanent change, but the questing hub game play is finite, and there are a lot of classes to lvl with the armoury system, that is why leves from 1.0 and exp chains from FFXI will become more important the longer you play, until it won't feel remotely like WoW, (providing they get endgame combat right).