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Game Mechanic: Full Loot PVP?
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I kind of liked the system in PoTBS: you don't have to PvP if you don't want to, but if the enemy has attacked your port, you can't get in or out without being exposed to PvP, therefore it's not really ffa. And it's not really full "loot" as much as full "loss". You get sunk, and your ship and its mods are gone.
Pirates can capture your ship, instead of fully sinking it, and that is their main supply of ships. Other factions will just sink you, perhaps looting some of your cargo.
Otherwise, losing your ship means you have to build another one, and the economy is important. You make rigging in Cuba, but the enemy has created a PvP zone around Cuba. Do you try to sneak in? Take a bigger ship, with a group maybe, and fight your way in? Bigger ship means a bigger chance of loss.
For the game, PvP loss consumes resources, which keeps the economy going. For the players, it makes it more exciting, and more frustrating at times.
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2024: 47 years on the Net.
I've tried it, don't like it: the PvP is too scarce and most of it is just ganks. There's practically no honor or chivalry in such PvP despite what some people say. Not that I care much: if you can kill someone just kill him/her. You take the little PvP you get. Even if it is just a gank. Anything to fend off boredom.
There's nothing you can do to the fact that most players are cowards and unwilling to risk anything. Especially in games with harsh death penalty. So you're stuck with either waiting for something to happen or spending most of your time looking for good fights than fighting in them. Not worth it imo.
I'd much rather have my PvP in a more condensed and frequent form. And I don't need to grind to recouperate my losses.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
Ill agree with this.
I would like to see a game were this issue is combated.
my personal opionion on this dick.....whatever game your playing im ging to go in there and fck it all up from toe up to toe down after you play it you will not want to play it again.
sincerely
all mmorg games head designer, game developer, contributer, moderator and gm impersonator
You're tying "full loot" to PVP. If you separate it then you'll probably remove a lot of bias from the both the question itself and the answers you get.
One benefit to dropping items on death is the risk factor it creates. In games like Puzzle Pirates, EVE and UO, it prompts the player to assess what he's willing to risk in battle. In Asheron's Call, it also allows players to manage or mitigate their loss by giving them a certain amount of control over what drops.
Dropping items on death is also a sort of reward system for the victor - spoils of war and all.
By throwing 'pvp' in there you definitely skew the responses.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Almost every game with a low death penalty. No risk .. people are more incline to try things. The only reason why people will try a raid wipe after wipe, is that they don't lose much. Heck, sometimes just losing time is too much.
You can't change people. And this is about entertainment. So design to them. If they have fun doing stuff .. let them do stuff withotu risk.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Yes, that was purposeful on my part. I'm specifically interested in the mechanic and its impact where the items are not at all removed from the world, but simply transferred from one player's possession to another. As one of the respondants has pointed out, the economic benefits of "full loot" seem dubious to me.
But that happens in PvE, too. You're working on two bad assumptions - that items dropped on death are somehow different between PvE and PvP, and that there are many instances of where a game has items drop on death only in PVP.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Full loot? No thanks, and don't bring up Ultima Online because people didn't play that game because it had item looting, they played it because it was one of the few online games available.
Take a look at the games that have PVP looting, and look at how few players play those games.
Now, single item loot like the old PVP EQ servers....now THAT might be the thing. Getting everything taken is just awful, but only being able to loot one piece of gear is kind of exciting for both the ganker and the gankee. There was a real sense of fear in EQ's PVP because of the group nature of the game when it came to acquiring loot. You spent a lot of time getting that sword from Lower Guk....of course the whole point of EQ was to acquire loot and how long/difficult it was to do so.
If loot is easy to acquire, is there even a point to item loot? In EQ1 you looted an item to actually use it or put it on your alts or sell it back to the guy you killed for it...lol.
I'm not that savvy on all the MMO games. What PVE games allow players to loot the items from other players that have died?
This is disgusting.
You and players like you should stay away from video games.
Ya theres already enough wow and copies of wow type easy mode games. It's aggravating to people who want a challenge.
In WoW, the pvp is 100% positive, when you win you win, when you lose you win.
They reward you for going to arena and losing. They just reward you more for winning.
If you're happy and you know it clap your hands, because so many people don't want to take any risks but want all kinds of rewards
Are you intentionally changing what I said or do you really not understand this?
Since you're making this topic, you must be basing it on MMOs that you played. If so, which of those had item drop on death where players could only be looted if another player killed them?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
EQ and POTBS. UO was the first MMORPG that I played, and even though another player could loot your corpse if you died from a PVE encounter, it still only transfers the demand from one player to another without necessarily creating new demand.
EDIT: Also, I wasn't changing what you said. So I guess I'm not understanding what you said.
It's not an MMO, but: go to any casino in the world, and you'll find them filled to the brim with such games.
Are you saying you'd play instanced PvP if you could bet on yourself?
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
Even if I could bet on myself, I'd still treat instanced PvP the way I treat blackjack: I'll play a few hands if it's the only game in town, but wishing there was a decent poker room the whole time.
I've done some instanced PvP. I didn't hate it, but I didn't particularly like it either.
Actually, Eve online has quite the stable and sizeable playerbase. It is one of the most successful MMOs to date.
Eve is also designed extremely well and isn't riddled with the problems most of those indie games are that you're asking us to take a look at.
I like full loot games because it ties crafting very close to the players.
I like it because it almost always means that gear is less important. To me an uneven PvP fight has no meaning, and if gear is too powerful then a fight is almost always lopsided.
I like full loot because it gives meaning to death, I'm not against non-full loot games with a harsh death penalty, but I dislike games like WoW where death has no real meaning.
If my stuff is going to get taken then I pay attention to my surroundings.
I don't like full loot because it seems to draw the kind of players who take too much joy in taunting and gloating.
Asdar
Yep this is it, whether you are fighting fungus beasts in the forest of farol (are they still there?), your eyes constantly flickering across the screen for signs of near invisible random PK's, organizing a taskforce to take care of a particulary nasty pk or pk-posse, fighting a war of words for weeks with a rival guild with skirmishes taking place all across the world culminating in an epic guildhall battle where the guildmaster of the opposing force lose his enchanted superhard to get battleaxe of shining badass...DAMN I MISS MERIDIAN 59, too bad my eyes bleed from looking at it these days..
"Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day!"
- it gives gear a meaning. You can lose it which means you need to think twice to put on your good set of items
- it gives death a meaning since you lose time ( the time to get the items)
- it gives meaning to territory control since you need a constant flow of ressources
- it adds adrenaline to combat, which makes victories much more rewarding
- it creates a demand ( combined with durability)
Full Loot usually means also no random item drops but a player driven economy with player crafted goods. Which is much more interesting than doing 30 runs of the same dungeon
And it is laughable that you reply on a thread like this. You do not have anything in common with that particular genre of full loot pvp.. so why you participate in? Just stop it. It is laughable.