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World of Warcraft: Editorial: Casual vs. Hardcore
Dana
Member Posts: 2,415
Garrett Fuller dives back into World of WarCraft in his latest article. Today he looks at Casual vs. Hardcore Players in the popular game.
;) In any MMORPG there is such a thing as Time Played. Time Played can tell you a lot about your gaming experience. Has your time been spent grinding away to get the highest level, and once you reach that high level what is next? Do you spend your time getting loot, killing other players, or joining huge raids to progress in end game content? How does time played factor into a casual lifestyle or a lifestyle bent on being the best in a particular game. A very hot topic right now in MMORPGs is the notion of both casual and hardcore gamers playing on the same server and going after the same goals. This brings up the question what is the difference between a casual gamer and a hardcore gamer?
Currently, I have been playing World of Warcraft so please understand this article will be based around that particular game. However there are elements that may apply to EVE Online, City of Heroes, Everquest, Shadowbane, etc. So with that said how much time do I spend playing World of Warcraft? I would say an average of about twenty hours a week. Please understand I do work and have a family, luckily my wife plays too. Still with our schedules as they are I would say about three to four nights a week I am playing Warcraft. I do not think this makes me a casual player by any means. Many people will disagree with that. Hardcore players spend much more time than that working towards end game goals, because really that is what it is all about, the end game. |
You can read the full article here.
Dana Massey
Formerly of MMORPG.com
Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
Comments
This is definately an easy one to sum up which I have done countless amount of times in the forums.
Casual = People who have lives, real jobs and real responsibilties, 20 hours a week is still feasible but some real life resonsibilties might go undone.
Hardcore = People with no life, real job or real responsibilties, these are people who generally have someone else supporting their lazy a$$ giving them 24/7 to devote their worthless life entirely to a game. Also arrogant thinking somehow this makes them elite because they are ahead of the casual gamers, geez I wonder why.
I have to agree, WoW is offering very little to semi-casula-players.
I think the real casual gamer will hardly reach level 60. I've seen a rl-friend playing who didn't even reach level 30 after half a year.
Personally I got bored after half a year - partly because of the reason stated in the article. I do not like to camp instances for 5h+ each and every day, the pvp in its current form is pointless and there is very little that I can do elsewise.
Good article. Kinda shares my views on things. Being a father of 2 and being a retired hardcore, newly casual player makes things hard for me too. I still love WoW and to beat the reptetive boredom from many MMOs, I create alts in different classes. I have 12 toons in WoW and at least 1 of each class. Differing races and classes makes it that I experience many different quests that don't take hours to do. That is why I still play WoW.
To equate hardcore vs casual to time played is pretty insulting in my opinion. It's the same basic garbage that you find on the boards all the time. "I play 40 hours a week, I MUST know more than you". I knew guys who only played 10 hours a week and were totally hardcore. They KNEW their classes. They KNEW what their skill/spells would do and what their limitations were.
Hardcore/casual is in my opinion, an attittude. I played somewhere around 20 hours a week. I consider myself absolutely casual. I understood my class and was competent playing it. But I didn't make a study of it. I also played lots of alts. I didn't make a study of any of them either. I played for the enjoyment of playing.
When I quit, I had a 60, a 51, and a ton of lower level alts on several different servers. I quit when I realized just how little Blizzard cared about my plight. My 60 had 18 quests in his book EVERY one of the them was elite. I normally played with a partner and the 2 of us kept a 2 hour limit on our nightly sessions. 3 hours on Fridays. We just didn't have the time commitment for elite quests. For me when I game ceases to be fun, I move on to something else. So that's what we're doing. Although at the moment, nothing is really looking that good.
Hardcore vs Casual is NOT time dependant as I said. Beyond that, we can all get into yet another pissing contest over it all, but I've given up on that.
I play for fun.
This pretty much sums it up.
Most hardcore players dont beleive it's an issue to play for more than 30 hours in a week.
Let me burst that bubble.If your playing 6 hours a day or even 5 hours that's between 35 and 48 hours a week WASTED on a GAME.When i did play mmo's wich im not doing ATM(i love having my life back btw)i couldnt do more than 2 hours at a time.
Its funny when hardcore players get defensive about "time played".They are pretty much like smokers on a "its my right to smoke leave me alone" rant.They end up defending something they KNOW is not right simply because they have no self control and live in denial at the expense of their own health and well being.
Want to ENJOY an mmo?
Dont start a guild and dont be a leader or volunteer to be coleader or captain.
Just play the damn game:)
I stopped playing WoW months ago for the same reasons I didn't enjoy EQ but with EQ I knew what I was getting into when I began.
WoW on the other hand promotes itself as a casual or even solo friendly game and it's does exactly that from L1-L60, then it comes to a sudden halt.
I would guess that this is when the New Dev's that BLizzard hired to replace the original guys who developed WoW takes over, the new lead Dev is straight from EQ and he brought more EQ people with him.
WoW has been out a year now and I ask you this. What new content has been added to PVE besides DM that isn't for the uber EQ Style raiding guild? Aren't you all paying for new content?
That's an opinion that many of us don't share. I've put over 40 hours a week on average into the game since stress test 1, and I don't have a level 60.
The reason I don't have a level 60 yet isn't because I can't level. It is because that is not what I choose to get from the game. Sure, I have more alts than most, but the real reason I don't level much is because I like the "high" helping other people gives you. Sure, I'm greedy and addicted to that feeling, but at least I'm willing to admit that it isn't altruistic.
I've never claimed to be a good person. If other people get enjoyment out of what I do for them, cool. But I don't really do it for their enjoyment, I do it for mine. I pay 15 bucks a month for that privilege.
Alot of people will take offense to this, but DeathWolf2u is right. I would probably take out the "no life, lazy ass, and worthless" adjectives, but he's pretty close.
I considered myself Hardcore about 6 years ago when I started Asheron's Call - no wife, no kids, new location and a first job that paid about 50K a year and required about 12 hours a week on average. I played alot of AC, drank alot of whiskey, ate alot of takeout/delivery, and smoked alot of cigars. Not the healthiest of lifestyles. I'm pretty glad to have moved on to more rewarding things like family, friends, career, and healthier, more moderate gaming habits
I'd love to be "hardcore"... I just spent two weeks on leave, playing anywhere up to 10 hours a day.
BUT.. usually i'm a casual player as I have a job, a wife and kids and other interests. Doing this grind-on-grind goes from being fun to being "what do I have to do now, to level??".
As for the hardcores, as the article says, they know their game, the equipment, they put lots of time in and work at it hard. How many come up with the condescending elitist attitudes that can be seen in some? Yes, sure, if I could spend 60 hours a week playing WoW I would. I'd need a divorce and to get rid of the kids and somehow afford the internet connection after they take my house away...
If you're a Hardcore, good luck to you. But stop being such jerks about us casuals!
I love World of Warcraft, but I would never have played it if the orginal Warhammer Online made it to production which was organised around skill/career advancement based on performing the role within the game. Whilst it still adds benefits for the hardcore players by reaching more difficult career's and honing their skills, it still offered great milestones and targets for the casual gamer.
Games where the players are rewarded for performing "in class" activities within the world are the way forward, with rewards and penalities being equal. Which "side" (good v evil) your on depends on how you act "ninja looters" become outlawed over a period of time, to be hunted by characters whose career's follow that of law & order or justice. Even "consorting" with characters outside the law would affect your characters in game "perception", meaning you actually have to play it appropriately and will alter the options you have in game.
The ebb and flow of development and conflict follows the actual actions of the characters, whilst the dynamics of the game would be very challemging to balance and manage it would be a great adventure playing through this, with evolving and constantly changing player interactions.
That's how casual and hardcore players become more even, when the quality of the game they play, not the length of time they play for, reflects the in game abilities of their character.
And my bank account stands ready for the company that brings that game out........
I do indeed take offense to the Hardcore bashing here.
I have been a hardcore gamer since LONG before MMO's even existed. You have no right to put me down due to my choice in lifestyle.
Do you put down the athlete, or other hobbie enthusiast just because he dedicates his time to being as good as he can be in his chosen hobbie?
To the writer,
Battlegrounds arn't the only form of PvP. If you are on a PvP server, or even if you are not, you can kill guards and take out towns of the opposite faction. It will just take alot of people, but it is hugely fun.
I played WoW since beta (took about 3-4 months off in the middle) about 20-40 hours a day, but I do consider myself a casual player, becuase I only have time to raid on weekends. I have 4 active chars, about 6 more inactive, and the highest char is 47. Never reached 60 and thats why I love WoW, i can solo all the way.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
In my opinion certain elements of WoW are almost anti-casual; there is a lot of what is called farming, you farm for money, reputation, PvP honour and of course items. The flaw in the time played is proportional to whether you are your hardcore or not is luck. 2 players can both spend 2 hours in WoW, they both could be in an instance. 1 may win all items they are searching for, plus a few bonus epic ones they werent whilst the other wins nothing but a large repair bill. Only an elitist jerk would say something like "The real game of WoW begnis at level 60", in fact I was in one of those guilds (most people in that guild had spent over 1000 hours playing and had multiple level 60 characters) and I am glad I left, I do feel cheated that WoW is advertised as casual friendly, when there are parts which are definitely not. To me WoW has become less and less casual-friendly.
To the author: you may want to have someone proofread your next article for you. Cheers.
hehe well if i were to evaluate myself i'd probably say i was hardcore. i have a shifting schedule and am not about to ask work for days off when the guild has raids planned. so i pretty much play when i have the chance. I don't have all the gear but i learn as much about the game as possible. alot of people say that us that devote our free time to a game don't have a life.
non gamers spend their time socializing with people and doing fun things together like partying, watching movies, playing billiards, etc.
gamers spend their time socializing with people and doing fun things together like partying, roleplaying, doing raids, PvP, etc.
i don't see much of a difference in these two descriptions. only difference is how much money each group spends to enjoy themselves.
Martykay stated he could play hardcore but it would require a divorce etc. ( Ok, I don't know how to use the quote feature, sorry ). But I wish to relate a story.
I was talking to a new employee at work, and I asked what hobbies he had to which he replied playing Asheron's Call. I stated I played and the usual, what server, toon level type etc conversation took place. He also played WoW. When I asked why he wasn't playing anymore he told me that he and his friend played so much that his friends wife divorced him. Thats when he tried to quit playing and couldn't do it, so he sold his computer so he couldn't play.
That may be more of a descrpiption of addiction, than hardcore. But it could be a thin line.
Here is my story,
I have always played computer games but did not really become hardcore untill, I lost the wife, house, and job. After almost a year of self pity and over endulgence, I stoped playing, got a new wife, a job, kids, and a house (in that order). Now, posting on forums is about all I have time for.
So, at least in my case, the discription of hardcore = unemployed freeloader is accurate. I would have to say if you are uncertain as to weather or not your "hardccore" then quit for a month. If your a casual player you won't even miss it.
Almost all comparsions between hardcore and casual gamers are flawed by the fact that they are written from the perspective of either a hardscore gamer or a casual gamer that would love to be hardcore end envies those that can spend more time in WoW than them. This article is no exception.
Please ... don't count yourself as "casual player" if you're forcefully restricted in your play time by either job or family. Because whether or not you're "hardcore" or "casual" does not depend on how much time you spend in the game, but what you're actually doing in that time. For me, some guy who only plays 8 hours a week but therefore spends every second of it trying to advance in level and farming "phat loot" is still a "hardcore" gamer. Whether or not you're "hardcore" or "casual" depends not on your /played time but on your attitude towards time spent with the game itself.
Answer yourself a few questions:
Do you feel that WoW is all about achievements?
Do you feel that being on a lower level than others makes you inferior?
Do you envy a higher level player for his gear?
Do you feel every hour not spent with leveling or farming is wasted play time?
Do you think helping a lower level party in an lower level instance is a waste of time?
Do you leave an instance party if you feel it's not strong enough to fight the boss?
Do you think it's all just about the "endgame"?
If you answer "yes" to all or most of the above questions, you're a hardcore player, regardless of how much time you spend in the game. The casual player would say no to most of these things. He's playing the game for the fun of playing it, not for the need for accomplishment. Achievements and rewards are what gives the game a nice extra flavor but isn't what drives him to play the game. He's here for the atmosphere of the game, for the many secrets to discover (casual players don't spoil themselves the game by reading everything on Thotthbot), for meeting new players (bad ones and good ones alike), the joy of experiencing how pick up group can work well together in an instance (even if nothing drops for him in the end).
The casual player knows that there are dragons, epics and raid dungeons out there just as he knows that there are people in RL that drive Ferraris, have private jetplanes, huge houses and probably bathtubs made from gold while he works from 9 to 5 to make his living. He knows that he may never see some of these things during all of his game time and yet that makes it even more exciting because ... you never know ... someday he just may, because he'll get an invitation by a friend to fill a gap in a raid perhaps. And for him, going to MC or seeing one of the dragons won't be a matter of routine like for the hardcore gamers - to him, it will be an event he'll remember for days. Just like a day he may get to ride in a Ferrari some day - routine for the guy who owns such a car but still something special for someone who knows he'll never be able to afford one on his own.
You might think that this point of view is rare and I'm just talking romantic rubbish. Suit yourself. But the reason you think it's unusual is, that an occassional player rarely ever bothers to read or write in a game forum. For him the game is all he needs. He turns on his computer, starts the client, plays the game and quits when he had enough. Few of them actually feel the need to communicate on a forum with others about the game, because they know there's nothing there for them - just hardcore players telling each other stories about a view of the game he doesn't share nor would he want to.
I have said it a countless times, and will keep on saying it until people (especially developers) start to listen. The ONLY real way to extend PvE game play is to copy the player-created content mechanisms of old text-based MUD games. When a player reached top level in a MUD, he became an archmage or something and gained the ability to create new dungeons, quests and areas. He could place items won from other adventures to his dungeons, etc. In MMORPGs it would need to be combined with a player-run testing and evaluation process to make sure only the best stuff gets to the official game servers.
Neverwinter Nights had the Aurora Toolset, and many would agree that many player-made modules were far better than the official material. The problem was that you had to download the modules and play them privately or set up your own server instead of being able to upload them to official servers. Once some company finally does that, and does it right, we will have a game that never really ends.
Saga of Ryzom has announced that they will be trying something like this. However, I feel that they're not doing it right. There is no player-controlled testing and evaluation system, the creative powers are apparently quite limited, and on the other hand, everyone has those powers. Ideally, one should have very limited powers at first, and gain power to create larger areas based on the success of one's past projects in the test / evaluation process. But nevertheless it is still a giant leap in the right direction.
While no major game has such a system, PvE players will be confined to switching endlessly from one game to another in search of new content. Having different character classes is one work around, you can play through the same content several times since the experience changes because of your class. Raids also work for some people, although I always found them mostly a waste of time; what are you getting the items for when the game is already over? So both of these are just temporary solutions.
PvP players have always been more inclined to stay after using up game content because they are not playing the game because of the story anyway. I guess the same goes for power players as well. They already have pretty much all they need to keep playing forever - people to grief and items to show off with - so new ideas should be aimed at increasing staying power for other groups of players. The most important of these are the "adventurers", and this is exactly the group that needs what I proposed.
As for the above questions, I guess I'm something like a "hardcore casual" gamer - I play a lot, 30-40 hours a week at best, but I'm in it for the story. I hate raids but love small instance runs (as you can't really connect with people in raids), I often help lower levels just for fun, and while I tend to level fast I usually slow it down completely when I get in range of an interesting instance. When I finally get into max level, I tend to roll a new character rather than continue to end game content. Why bother? So I guess I would answer "No" to pretty much every one of those questions... although a few are a bit "iffy".
I'm not a game designer, but I know this much. Once you hit end game, whether you are casual or hardcore, you need MORE CONTENT. If a MMORPG does not release new, quality content on a regular basis there is no reason to keep playing it regardless of your playstyle. Thank goodness WoW seems to understand this. The Xpac looks very promising.
On the gameplay end of things I think I can throw out a few nuggets of wisdom here. Gaming for the Hardcore player is never a problem (they are always online). Gaming for casual players can be difficult if two things are not provided for:
1.) The game must have many important objectives that can be met in a small window of time. (like 2-3 hours)
Most casual players won't get to fight Onyxia in WoW - but lets be honest, there's a TON of other really cool stuff to do in that game that can be easily done in a 2-3 hour window without much practice or prep-time.
2.) The casual player must have access to a guild that supports their playstyle.
Most causal players will be stuck with pick-up groups because MOST guilds WILL NOT support a casual playstyle. I think it's possible, and I think it's something we do well in our guild, but there has to be a change in the gaming culture before you see any major progress in this area.
In our guild we tend to treat our gaming sessions the same way you see traditional pencil & paper RPGer's treat theirs. On the nights we play, we ONLY play those characters on those nights so we don't out-level each other. We meet weekly, kind of like a poker night. The TEAM comes before the individual character.
Most MMORPG gamers will not make that level of commitment - mostly because they don't have to (the way tabletop gamers have to). At the end of a traditional Dungeons and Dragons game you pack up your dice and go home. At the end of a MMORPG event the players can keep on playing, and playing, and playing by themselves or with pick-up groups if they want to.
So in a nutshell I think guilds CAN support a casual playstyle if they CHOOSE TO. Most won't however.
~
Stormgaard
The Se7en Samurai: For Adults & Casual Gamers
http://www.se7ensamurai.com/
As for WoW, the reason this is such a hot topic is that the game was advertised to be casual friendly and, at release, definitly was.
What WoW did better than any other game to date was the low and mid levels, almost to level cap. Until players started hitting 60, you heard very little complaining...that first trip to 60 was fun and totally addictive. All the press applauded the game in every aspect....the world, the quests, everything.
Then for some reason, almost as if it was a totally different dev team pulled from Battle.net who programmed for themselves, Blizzard went totally for the hardcore player.
In pvp they went for a system that rewards the extreme hardcore player...the player that plays WoW above all other endeavors.
In PvE they made all advancement dependant on being a mega guild made up of hardcore players who could farm 40 man raid instances demanding huge chunks of time.
In battlefields they made it possible to "enter as group", thus those mega guilds rack up easy pvp points by rolling over pick-up groups.
.....all this by a game that even has a rested bonus to experience to slow down the hardcore so the casual and normal players could keep up somewhat...but is of course useless once most are at level cap.
It's simply a case of intentions being forgotten by devs in favor of what devs enjoy....after all the devs were once the mega-guild and raid leaders who got a dream job....when they play for fun , they are playing with their friends in mega guilds, deep down they actually have little respect for normal players...they really think normal and casual players should be happy with the early game and program the end game to be what the devs and their friends enjoy.
I seem to loose interest in most mmorpgs, wow is no exeption.
I just hate the way that everything becomes so competitive and everyone (it seems like) is just working overtime to become
Just one thing I don't understand about the article...
World of Warcraft and end game. There is one?
From what I've heard from others, the end game is waiting in a line to get into a battleground or instance to get some armour you can wear and stand in town for people to look in awe at you. I've got no plans in the near future of reaching level 60 so I'm not sure myself. Just what I've heard from forum after forum.
But I'll say this too. I'm about to quit playing WoW. Because whether people say it or not, WoW has a grind. I just sat for two days near Auberdine, just to get some stupid meat off of one of those ostrich birds. I am sick of it. If that ain't grinding then what is? I started to think I was bugged because I killed like 100 of those ugly birds and never got the drops. I relogged just to see, but still didn't get the loot.
=============================
It all seems so stupid
It makes me want to give up
But why should I give up
When it all seems so stupid