Only buy this game if you want to play group PvP 100% of the time

Mors.Magne · May 2013

Enthusiasts of this game say that DFUW is an improvement on the old DF1. This is probably true if you like group PvP and nothing else.

Although I concede that more thought has gone into the character classes and levelling up, the only aim is to group PvP. This is why many people say that "DFUW is a sandbox without the sand". There is no solo exploration or quests.

Be aware though, that the old grind for skill points has only been replaced by a new grind for skill points in a different way - the grind is still very much there.

If you want to solo explore - forget this game - the new map is smaller than the old DF1 map. Some people have said that the new map is designed to be an arena for group PvP and nothing else. This is a perceptive and entirely accurate description.

Akulas · May 2013

Yeah, isn't that the whole point of the game? I would like to see a more solo friendly option but then it wouldn't be DFUW.

mrputts · May 2013

All I see here is be prepared for a Massive amount of Multiplayer. In this MMO

Vesavius · May 2013

Originally posted by mrputts
All I see here is be prepared for a Massive amount of Multiplayer. In this MMO

To be fair, he cam across to me as observing, not necessarily complaining.

Some may want viable solo play though sometimes, so his post is valid I think

Damedius · May 2013

Beware there may be group PvP in this mmo game based on multiplayer PvP.

xpiher · May 2013

Originally posted by Mors.Magne
Enthusiasts of this game say that DFUW is an improvement on the old DF1. This is probably true if you like group PvP and nothing else.

Although I concede that more thought has gone into the character classes and levelling up, the only aim is to group PvP. This is why many people say that "DFUW is a sandbox without the sand". There is no solo exploration or quests.

Be aware though, that the old grind for skill points has only been replaced by a new grind for skill points in a different way - the grind is still very much there.

If you want to solo explore - forget this game - the new map is smaller than the old DF1 map. Some people have said that the new map is designed to be an arena for group PvP and nothing else. This is a perceptive and entirely accurate description.

40hrs of character play time isn't a grind. Sorry.

Solo exploration is still possible since there are still cool looking places in random parts of the world. However, you are right that those cool places aren't interactive

Dungeons will address the PvE experience since AV is adding bosses.

Zooce · May 2013

Solo player here, 54k prowess getting along just fine.

It's a different experience playing solo- more strategy and planning necessary to venture out, but fun if you enjoy that sort of covert thing.

Hairysun · May 2013

Hmmm ........ solo play isn't viable? I completely disagree. Solo play is perfectly viable in DF2. It's that simple.

I find solo play to be more of an option in DF2 than in DF1. To be fair here the role to play solo is "Skirmisher" if you want to go solo. For me at least. In DFUW you will be out in the wild and meet up with a group of people whose only objective is to kill you. By group I mean any number from 3 to 50, take your pick, and count on it. It will happen. At that point the fight or flight decision needs to be considered. I am a bad player so generally if I see more than two my main objective is to get out of dodge. (Note: There are lots of players that make it through these out numbered fights ...... lot's of them.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNGmiX4JQyQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggFn-nBqHQc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSvjhLZ_uKA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7lemf6IusU

Back to getting out of dodge. The "Skirmisher" roll has exceptional mechanics to get away from a losing fight. Evade, Dash and Leap will let you leave the scene quickly and the only one who would be able to keep up is another Skirmisher. At that point however, you have increased your odds of survival by reducing the number of enemies. It's almost common sense to be running around with a mount. You can pop the mount to give yourself more time and speed when needed. If your escaping from decent players they will take out your mount in no time. When solo, I run around with two mounts in my bags.

There are other tricks/tactics that you can use depending on your location in the world and the time of the day. Solo play is about escape, for me at least. What do you expect in a full loot/ clan oriented game ....... welcome to life?

There is no solo exploration or quests?

I don't really get that statement. There is a prowess reward for opening up your map. "x" amount of prowess for 100 tiles and I believe there is another gain for all the tiles. Exploring is up to you, if you want to go explore...... go explore. Agon is massive and there are some really awesome sights.

This guy has a series of videos on DFUW, he seems like a regular theme park guy trying to make the switch. Included are his thoughts both good and bad. I just linked one video, he has a series of them if you want a new guys perspective.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OcvY_VBqks

As far as grinding goes ........ "YES" just like every MMO in existence, you will have to put forth some effort to increase the effectiveness of your character. The prowess system is what they call it in DFUW. Kill "X" rats ..... get "X" prowess. There's not much fluff in DF when it comes to this. You won't walk up to an NPC with a big rotating question mark over their heads only to find out that their child has been kidnapped and the only way to free them is with rat soup. Please help me!

Sigh .....

~Hairysun

svandy · May 2013

I bought this game after reading these forums and others thinking I'd get a deep PVP/Sandbox experience and I have to say I agree with the OP, I was completely let down. I don't care about grouping with others and PVPing in groups, in fact I prefer it, what I don't like is that there is literally nothing to do beyond pvp and craft stuff to PVP in. I'm not asking for a deep PVE experience or anything, but they should at least make the PVP more meaningful than everyone just running around with a "everyone is KOS," attitude.

To me the game felt like a MOBA without a lobby. Not to say it's a bad game, I just think it is portrayed to be a lot more than it is.

drakes821 · May 2013

Really your complaining about the grind? I only play on the weekends and am already able to pvp and have a chance...the grind is nothing compared to DF1 don't even try to hold them on the same level.

Also if you don't like group PvP then why would you buy a FFA full loot PvP game. Everyone knows that since safety is in numbers these types of game result in groups of players going out in the wilderness together. If your looking for solo PvP your going to have to get on in the off hours or just be sneaky and find some people at spawns.

Mors.Magne · May 2013

Originally posted by Hairysun
Hmmm ........ solo play isn't viable? I completely disagree. Solo play is perfectly viable in DF2. It's that simple.

I find solo play to be more of an option in DF2 than in DF1. To be fair here the role to play solo is "Skirmisher" if you want to go solo. For me at least. In DFUW you will be out in the wild and meet up with a group of people whose only objective is to kill you. By group I mean any number from 3 to 50, take your pick, and count on it. It will happen. At that point the fight or flight decision needs to be considered. I am a bad player so generally if I see more than two my main objective is to get out of dodge. (Note: There are lots of players that make it through these out numbered fights ...... lot's of them.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNGmiX4JQyQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggFn-nBqHQc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSvjhLZ_uKA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7lemf6IusU

Back to getting out of dodge. The "Skirmisher" roll has exceptional mechanics to get away from a losing fight. Evade, Dash and Leap will let you leave the scene quickly and the only one who would be able to keep up is another Skirmisher. At that point however, you have increased your odds of survival by reducing the number of enemies. It's almost common sense to be running around with a mount. You can pop the mount to give yourself more time and speed when needed. If your escaping from decent players they will take out your mount in no time. When solo, I run around with two mounts in my bags.

There are other tricks/tactics that you can use depending on your location in the world and the time of the day. Solo play is about escape, for me at least. What do you expect in a full loot/ clan oriented game ....... welcome to life?

There is no solo exploration or quests?

I don't really get that statement. There is a prowess reward for opening up your map. "x" amount of prowess for 100 tiles and I believe there is another gain for all the tiles. Exploring is up to you, if you want to go explore...... go explore. Agon is massive and there are some really awesome sights.

This guy has a series of videos on DFUW, he seems like a regular theme park guy trying to make the switch. Included are his thoughts both good and bad. I just linked one video, he has a series of them if you want a new guys perspective.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OcvY_VBqks

As far as grinding goes ........ "YES" just like every MMO in existence, you will have to put forth some effort to increase the effectiveness of your character. The prowess system is what they call it in DFUW. Kill "X" rats ..... get "X" prowess. There's not much fluff in DF when it comes to this. You won't walk up to an NPC with a big rotating question mark over their heads only to find out that their child has been kidnapped and the only way to free them is with rat soup. Please help me!

Sigh .....

~Hairysun

Great start - "You can play DF2 solo...". But the rest of your argument seems to support mine - which is that DF2 is all about group PvP.

What fun is to be had as a solo skirmisher? It strikes me that grinding PvE mobs would be even worse as a skirmisher than as a warrior. Surely, you would grind mobs more slowly and have further grind to replace your arrows?

At least DF1 was big enough so that you had an excellent chance of avoiding PvP altogether by keeping to the sea and the 30 islands. Now, all those islands have gone and the sea is much smaller. Therefore, the option of solo exploration has gone (as far as I know).

It's a great shame because by doing nothing to the map, this problem wouldn't exist. All that effort to make the map smaller has alienated a certain playstyle of solo exploration that is no longer viable.

Zooce · May 2013

Solo exploration is fine. Go on an adventure and dig up some treasure maps. Sail by yourself on the open seas and get your boat stolen by pirates. The consolidation of the world map made no difference to the solo explorer playstyle. If you are mad the world feels more populated...I don't even.

tuneinwill · May 2013

I have been casually soloing Darkfall. I have yet to join a guild or get into any group PVP so far. It is fun, but far from perfect.

You are correct that there are no NPC quests, but you can still give yourself goals like finding a large treasure map, building a house, or building a boat. Yes, it is a grind, but all MMORPGs are and if you could accomplish goals too easily they wouldn't be any fun. Accomplishment is part of the fun. Go out and explore, just wear cheap armor and don't carry anything with you. If you casually play solo most people will be able to easily kill you, but so what.

I would say solo players who like sandbox games should give Darkfall a chance. It has faults, but it is entertaining for what it is.

Zushakon · May 2013

What? I solo PvP loads, it's challenging but that doesn't really bother me.

xpiher · May 2013

Originally posted by svandy
I bought this game after reading these forums and others thinking I'd get a deep PVP/Sandbox experience and I have to say I agree with the OP, I was completely let down. I don't care about grouping with others and PVPing in groups, in fact I prefer it, what I don't like is that there is literally nothing to do beyond pvp and craft stuff to PVP in. I'm not asking for a deep PVE experience or anything, but they should at least make the PVP more meaningful than everyone just running around with a "everyone is KOS," attitude.

To me the game felt like a MOBA without a lobby. Not to say it's a bad game, I just think it is portrayed to be a lot more than it is.

You didn't get into clan politics did you?

aRtFuLThinG · May 2013

Originally posted by xpiher
Originally posted by svandy
I bought this game after reading these forums and others thinking I'd get a deep PVP/Sandbox experience and I have to say I agree with the OP, I was completely let down. I don't care about grouping with others and PVPing in groups, in fact I prefer it, what I don't like is that there is literally nothing to do beyond pvp and craft stuff to PVP in. I'm not asking for a deep PVE experience or anything, but they should at least make the PVP more meaningful than everyone just running around with a "everyone is KOS," attitude.

To me the game felt like a MOBA without a lobby. Not to say it's a bad game, I just think it is portrayed to be a lot more than it is.

You didn't get into clan politics did you?

Come on now be fair clan politics is not something that you can just get "into"... even get "involved" requires you to be in a certain position of importance, in any clan.

xpiher · May 2013

Originally posted by aRtFuLThinG
Originally posted by xpiher
Originally posted by svandy
I bought this game after reading these forums and others thinking I'd get a deep PVP/Sandbox experience and I have to say I agree with the OP, I was completely let down. I don't care about grouping with others and PVPing in groups, in fact I prefer it, what I don't like is that there is literally nothing to do beyond pvp and craft stuff to PVP in. I'm not asking for a deep PVE experience or anything, but they should at least make the PVP more meaningful than everyone just running around with a "everyone is KOS," attitude.

To me the game felt like a MOBA without a lobby. Not to say it's a bad game, I just think it is portrayed to be a lot more than it is.

You didn't get into clan politics did you?

Come on now be fair clan politics is not something that you can just get "into"... even get "involved" requires you to be in a certain position of importance, in any clan.

The "kill everything on sight" comment is directly linked to clan politics. My clan has several do not kill unless X happens to several clans and players. If you don't get into a clan that actively participates in these you'll only see the game as a giant "gank fest" because it essentially EvE null space outside the safe zone. Yet I don't see anyone claiming EvE is just a giant gank fest do you?

Bjarka · May 2013

Yeah,

this game is just like a large pvp-arena with some nodes thrown in. Exploring and treasure-mapping isn't enough. This COULD be a great game (not taking into account performance issues) - but it is just so shallow, empty.

corpusc · May 2013

even tho i joined one of the biggest clans early on, in my entire first month, i didn't play with a single one of them. 8)

i solo'ed the whole time. i didn't even visit the clan city, cuz i spent so much active gametime exploring all the starter cities and their immediate surroundings.

the world is smaller and the world is more populated, so its harder to PVE without being attacked. but its much easier to defend yourself when you are.

there's a ton of PVE out there to solo still.

i did quite a bit of exploring and my map is like %90 black. there's SOOOO much more out there

xpiher · May 2013

Originally posted by Bjarka
Yeah,

this game is just like a large pvp-arena with some nodes thrown in. Exploring and treasure-mapping isn't enough. This COULD be a great game (not taking into account performance issues) - but it is just so shallow, empty.

If EvE didn't have FvF and high sec space would EvE be so shallow and empty?

corpusc · May 2013

all this arena talk has nothing to do with arenas.

Darkfall is very much the opposite of arena setups.

the only reason people use that word is because the gameplay is more skill based and less vertical grind progression based.

more FPS, less RPG in combat/character mechanics. something more like what you see in arena games.

thats the ONLY reason for "arena" being abused so much.

Bjarka · May 2013

Originally posted by xpiher
Originally posted by Bjarka
Yeah,

this game is just like a large pvp-arena with some nodes thrown in. Exploring and treasure-mapping isn't enough. This COULD be a great game (not taking into account performance issues) - but it is just so shallow, empty.

If EvE didn't have FvF and high sec space would EvE be so shallow and empty?

Lol...DF have "high-sec" and EVE have much more than the two you mentioned. EVE has much more depth to it than DF ...Im not going to continue the "comparision" since it isn't valid.

Muke · May 2013

Originally posted by mrputts
All I see here is be prepared for a Massive amount of Multiplayer. In this MMO

No, a MMO doesn't mean you have to grouphug 100% of the time like most of the (WOW)community do like to think. MMO means you are in a game/persistant virtual world with a LOT of people, more then in a traditional shooter game.

There are MMOs out there that let you be viable playing solo too outside of the traditional cookie cutter templates.

And my guess is that this is what the OP is posting about, that this game PVP is only viable when doing it in groups or not at all.

Flipsyde10 · May 2013

I havent played this game yet, just been reading on sone of the newer games. I really like the premise of the game, as it seems to resemble asherons call darktide server quite a bit. In fact, aside from the improved ui and real aiming, the premise seems like a near clone. Which i love btw, i think ac1 was the greatest mmo ever created.

I wonder if the devs might make pve servers like ac1's old "carebear" servers. You would still need to corpse run and lose gear when mobs kill you, but it would allow for more folks to play and explore without the risk of getting ganked. You could even turn on a pvp flag of sorts in the pve servers for some pvp on your own terms.

just a thought. Overall i am happy to see a game like this emerge. May even buy a new rig to run it.

Damedius · May 2013

Originally posted by Muke
And my guess is that this is what the OP is posting about, that this game PVP is only viable when doing it in groups or not at all.

It really depends on the skill level of the player as to whether or not they can PvP solo.

Some players will be able to do it a great deal of the time.

Some won't be able to do it at all.

ShakyMo · May 2013

bit of a silly post.

It's like saying "only bother with Neverwinter if you like running small group dungeons" or "only bother with swtor if you like star wars"

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