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Poll - Do you want clearly defined roles in combat for EQ Next

NomadMorlockNomadMorlock Member UncommonPosts: 815
in EverQuest Next

We all understand that player will be able to choose from 40+ classes and will have the ability to switch out the abilities they choose. 

With that said, do you still want to see clearly defined roles available for combat such as a Tank, Healer, Crowd Control, Buff/Debuff Support, DPS for combat encounters?

Do you support play that can be accomplished without any defensive/support focused characters or do you feel there need to be a group with different roles in play to complete group content.

Feel free to leave supporting comments below.

The Differently Geared 
«13

Comments

  • NomadMorlockNomadMorlock Member UncommonPosts: 815
    Personally I support having many different roles but the ability to switch skills to fill multiple roles.  Without roles, everyone is DPS and any encounter can be completed by a large number of cookie cutter characters who are all the same.
    The Differently Geared 
  • DrakynnDrakynn Member Posts: 2,030
    I want roles yes but only in terms like defensive,offensive and support and classes that provide different ways to do those 3 roles.They don't have to mean tank-healer-dps
  • stayBlindstayBlind Member UncommonPosts: 512
    Originally posted by NomadMorlock
    Personally I support having many different roles but the ability to switch skills to fill multiple roles.  Without roles, everyone is DPS and any encounter can be completed by a large number of cookie cutter characters who are all the same.

    Only if you do not give players the incentive/reason to not DPS everything does that happen ...

    Little forum boys with their polished cyber toys: whine whine, boo-hoo, talk talk.

  • NomadMorlockNomadMorlock Member UncommonPosts: 815
    Originally posted by Drakynn
    I want roles yes but only in terms like defensive,offensive and support and classes that provide different ways to do those 3 roles.They don't have to mean tank-healer-dps

    That's exactly what the poll is asking.  Do you support play that can be accomplished without any defensive/support focused characters or do you feel there need to be a group with different roles in play to complete group content.

    The Differently Geared 
  • wizardanimwizardanim Member Posts: 278

    If players can define roles that are rigorous and serve the trinity purpose with their sandbox system - it just isn't given to us, what is the problem?

    Their system opens so many more doors to what we have seen, and provides exactly the same mechanics in certain situations.  It sounds amazing.

  • BlakkrskyrrBlakkrskyrr Member Posts: 230

    aren't classes and abilities simply the foundations for combat roles and you just need to form your character into it?  You can essentially create a class that has tanking abilities and can maintain most of the defensive needs of the group, and then also a character set around healing your party members, and then lastly a role of dps?  They say that there aren't classes that are singularly for a specific purpose over another.  With multi-classing, I can do what I want to in that I stand infront of my mates and take the brunt of the damage and also that my attacks and abilities simultaneously heal me and near by allies, which increases my survivability and reduces the stress of the main source of healing.  I don't see what the issue is. 

    If someone knows what this reduces us to, please elaborate.  But otherwise, I don't see what the fuss is.  As long as someone isn't trying to do everything at once, which in of itself is retarded, aren't there roles to play just by playing well?

  • DatawarlockDatawarlock Member Posts: 338
    Originally posted by Blakkrskyrr

    aren't classes and abilities simply the foundations for combat roles and you just need to form your character into it?  You can essentially create a class that has tanking abilities and can maintain most of the defensive needs of the group, and then also a character set around healing your party members, and then lastly a role of dps?  They say that there aren't classes that are singularly for a specific purpose over another.  With multi-classing, I can do what I want to in that I stand infront of my mates and take the brunt of the damage and also that my attacks and abilities simultaneously heal me and near by allies, which increases my survivability and reduces the stress of the main source of healing.  I don't see what the issue is. 

    If someone knows what this reduces us to, please elaborate.  But otherwise, I don't see what the fuss is.  As long as someone isn't trying to do everything at once, which in of itself is retarded, aren't there roles to play just by playing well?

    You've essentially just made it clear to everyone that they'll never need to group. You can tank, dps, and heal yourself all in one. Way to give your vote for single player games.

     

    Godmode for all!

  • NomadMorlockNomadMorlock Member UncommonPosts: 815
    Originally posted by loopback1199
    Originally posted by Blakkrskyrr

    aren't classes and abilities simply the foundations for combat roles and you just need to form your character into it?  You can essentially create a class that has tanking abilities and can maintain most of the defensive needs of the group, and then also a character set around healing your party members, and then lastly a role of dps?  They say that there aren't classes that are singularly for a specific purpose over another.  With multi-classing, I can do what I want to in that I stand infront of my mates and take the brunt of the damage and also that my attacks and abilities simultaneously heal me and near by allies, which increases my survivability and reduces the stress of the main source of healing.  I don't see what the issue is. 

    If someone knows what this reduces us to, please elaborate.  But otherwise, I don't see what the fuss is.  As long as someone isn't trying to do everything at once, which in of itself is retarded, aren't there roles to play just by playing well?

    You've essentially just made it clear to everyone that they'll never need to group. You can tank, dps, and heal yourself all in one. Way to give your vote for single player games.

     In fact, taking anything less than exactly the primary dps build makes you weaker.  Incentive to all (every player) be the "build of the month" and leave behind anyone who wants to play a different way.

    Godmode for all!

    Godmode...  I tend to think of it as Zerg Mentality.  If group size is 5, then 5 of the top DPS classes (or 5 of the same) can complete all group content.   Just Zerg it with DPS - no tactics needed.

    The Differently Geared 
  • DatawarlockDatawarlock Member Posts: 338
    Originally posted by NomadMorlock
    Originally posted by loopback1199
    Originally posted by Blakkrskyrr

    aren't classes and abilities simply the foundations for combat roles and you just need to form your character into it?  You can essentially create a class that has tanking abilities and can maintain most of the defensive needs of the group, and then also a character set around healing your party members, and then lastly a role of dps?  They say that there aren't classes that are singularly for a specific purpose over another.  With multi-classing, I can do what I want to in that I stand infront of my mates and take the brunt of the damage and also that my attacks and abilities simultaneously heal me and near by allies, which increases my survivability and reduces the stress of the main source of healing.  I don't see what the issue is. 

    If someone knows what this reduces us to, please elaborate.  But otherwise, I don't see what the fuss is.  As long as someone isn't trying to do everything at once, which in of itself is retarded, aren't there roles to play just by playing well?

    You've essentially just made it clear to everyone that they'll never need to group. You can tank, dps, and heal yourself all in one. Way to give your vote for single player games.

     

    Godmode for all!

    Godmode...  I tend to think of it as Zerg Mentality.  If group size is 5, then 5 of the top DPS classes (or 5 of the same) can complete all group content.   Just Zerg it with DPS - no tactics needed.

    I agree with you, but half of this xbox generation isn't old enough to remember starcraft or where the term 'zerg' came from XD lol

  • Agnostic42Agnostic42 Member UncommonPosts: 405

    Get over it, I don't see that option.

     

    I know, I know, change is hard, we get it already!

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member LegendaryPosts: 10,875

    People need to stop jumping the gun. They never said there were no roles. Matter of fact they talked a little about roles. We still know to little to judge.

  • DaakenDaaken Member Posts: 158

    Good thing SOE said they'll still have roles in EQN.

     

    Do I want roles?  Yes!  Do I want the Trinity? Hell no!

    Random Forum Poster: I want an MMO that is different, original and fun.

    Me: So you want something like EQN

    Them: Nah dude, I want a Holy Trinity, Tab Target combat, Instanced Raiding, and Rigid classes.

    Me: Double Facepalm.

  • wizardanimwizardanim Member Posts: 278
    Originally posted by loopback1199
    Originally posted by Blakkrskyrr

    aren't classes and abilities simply the foundations for combat roles and you just need to form your character into it?  You can essentially create a class that has tanking abilities and can maintain most of the defensive needs of the group, and then also a character set around healing your party members, and then lastly a role of dps?  They say that there aren't classes that are singularly for a specific purpose over another.  With multi-classing, I can do what I want to in that I stand infront of my mates and take the brunt of the damage and also that my attacks and abilities simultaneously heal me and near by allies, which increases my survivability and reduces the stress of the main source of healing.  I don't see what the issue is. 

    If someone knows what this reduces us to, please elaborate.  But otherwise, I don't see what the fuss is.  As long as someone isn't trying to do everything at once, which in of itself is retarded, aren't there roles to play just by playing well?

    You've essentially just made it clear to everyone that they'll never need to group. You can tank, dps, and heal yourself all in one. Way to give your vote for single player games.

     

    Godmode for all!

    It is not godmode if you need certain defensive abilities to not die, and giving them up for a healing or dps ability limits your ability to not die for certain monsters.

    There will be certain classes with more defensive abilities than others. you will need to work with other people everywhere.  These classes will be considered tanks for the content they are best at evading, not like we have known, but still tanks.  They will take the damage, or keep the mobs attention in some way.

    In certain situations, for certain mobs, the roles will be reversed.  Other classes will be tanks, based upon the encounter.  

    I love this idea.

  • evilastroevilastro Member Posts: 4,270
    I like heals, cc and support. I don't like the way tanks are handled in trinity. Short duration distraction, interrupts, damage debuffs and area control should be given to defensive classes rather than artificial hatred.
  • fyerwallfyerwall Member UncommonPosts: 3,240
    Originally posted by Blakkrskyrr

    aren't classes and abilities simply the foundations for combat roles and you just need to form your character into it?  You can essentially create a class that has tanking abilities and can maintain most of the defensive needs of the group, and then also a character set around healing your party members, and then lastly a role of dps?  They say that there aren't classes that are singularly for a specific purpose over another.  With multi-classing, I can do what I want to in that I stand infront of my mates and take the brunt of the damage and also that my attacks and abilities simultaneously heal me and near by allies, which increases my survivability and reduces the stress of the main source of healing.  I don't see what the issue is. 

    If someone knows what this reduces us to, please elaborate.  But otherwise, I don't see what the fuss is.  As long as someone isn't trying to do everything at once, which in of itself is retarded, aren't there roles to play just by playing well?

    I think it is because for a lot of people it takes too much effort to figure out and build the type of character that fits a role than it does to click a button that gives you this role at creation. To most of them its the "Why plot and plan to make the role when I can just pick it?" mentality. Other people are just used to the 'pick a role and stay that role' soft of game play and cant fathom playing a game without it.

    In UO we didn't have dedicated anything. We still ran dungeons and had a blast.

    In AO, while there were classes that were meant for specific roles, you didn't really need them and no one had an issue doing anything. We didn't need the Atrox Enforcer or the Doctor to run instances or raids. I tanked my fair share of Mercs on my Fixer before getting GAmkIV, using a combination of my Hots and an NT pitty heal now and then to stay alive. 

    Sadly people just want to log in and 'win'. And the fastest path to winning is not messing with finding the perfect balance.

    There are 3 types of people in the world.
    1.) Those who make things happen
    2.) Those who watch things happen
    3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"


  • WylfWylf Member UncommonPosts: 376
    Originally posted by NomadMorlock
     

    Godmode...  I tend to think of it as Zerg Mentality.  If group size is 5, then 5 of the top DPS classes (or 5 of the same) can complete all group content.   Just Zerg it with DPS - no tactics needed.

     Zerg Mode= Defiance. play that for awhile and you can see how a game without clearly defined roles plays.

  • NomadMorlockNomadMorlock Member UncommonPosts: 815

    1 Person finally voted GW2 Dungeons are fun!

     

    That's kind of my point.  They don't require roles.

    The Differently Geared 
  • DatawarlockDatawarlock Member Posts: 338
    Originally posted by wizardanim
    Originally posted by loopback1199
    Originally posted by Blakkrskyrr

    aren't classes and abilities simply the foundations for combat roles and you just need to form your character into it?  You can essentially create a class that has tanking abilities and can maintain most of the defensive needs of the group, and then also a character set around healing your party members, and then lastly a role of dps?  They say that there aren't classes that are singularly for a specific purpose over another.  With multi-classing, I can do what I want to in that I stand infront of my mates and take the brunt of the damage and also that my attacks and abilities simultaneously heal me and near by allies, which increases my survivability and reduces the stress of the main source of healing.  I don't see what the issue is. 

    If someone knows what this reduces us to, please elaborate.  But otherwise, I don't see what the fuss is.  As long as someone isn't trying to do everything at once, which in of itself is retarded, aren't there roles to play just by playing well?

    You've essentially just made it clear to everyone that they'll never need to group. You can tank, dps, and heal yourself all in one. Way to give your vote for single player games.

     

    Godmode for all!

    It is not godmode if you need certain defensive abilities to not die, and giving them up for a healing or dps ability limits your ability to not die for certain monsters.

    There will be certain classes with more defensive abilities than others. you will need to work with other people everywhere.  These classes will be considered tanks for the content they are best at evading, not like we have known, but still tanks.  They will take the damage, or keep the mobs attention in some way.

    In certain situations, for certain mobs, the roles will be reversed.  Other classes will be tanks, based upon the encounter.  

    I love this idea.

    Reread the highlighted portion to see what my post is in reference to. You can give up every dps ability in the game, but you still have a weapon, so you can still do "DAMAGE PER SECOND". Hell, you could kick an orc in the shin and still be doing dps, however minor. I was just pointing out the ridiculous example the op I quoted posted... the claim of being the tank and having each attack (dps) also aoe healing. It's what SK's were for, and they never needed a group until endgame raiding either lol.

  • LidaneLidane Member CommonPosts: 2,300

    Classes are fine. Predetrmined ROLES are not.

    I've played enough healers in these games to know that getting stuck as nothing but a healbot is boring as all hell. It's why I never played a Cleric to any real degree except in WAR, since the Warrior Priest was expected to get into the middle of things and fight. In the past, when a tank would tell me to just stand back and spam heal him over and over and over rather than have any more of an active role in an encounter, I got bored very quickly. What's the point of even being in the group if the only contribution you're going to be asked for is one specific thing?

    If EQN can design a system where a player isn't forced into a singular role, I'm all for it. People should be able to play in whatever style suits them best in the context of what they're doing at the time. Being forced into a strict role is boring.

  • czombieczombie Member Posts: 82

    It is not godmode if you need certain defensive abilities to not die, and giving them up for a healing or dps ability limits your ability to not die for certain monsters.

    There will be certain classes with more defensive abilities than others. you will need to work with other people everywhere.  These classes will be considered tanks for the content they are best at evading, not like we have known, but still tanks.  They will take the damage, or keep the mobs attention in some way.

    In certain situations, for certain mobs, the roles will be reversed.  Other classes will be tanks, based upon the encounter.  

    I love this idea.

    I think this idea is great too.  It reminds me of what you see among comic book teams.  Imagine how dull the Fantastic Four would be if every battle was the Thing standing there taking damage from multiple villains while they all completely ignored the fact that the Human Torch was raining fireballs down on them.

  • DatawarlockDatawarlock Member Posts: 338
    Originally posted by Lidane

    Classes are fine. Predetrmined ROLES are not.

    I've played enough healers in these games to know that getting stuck as nothing but a healbot is boring as all hell. It's why I never played a Cleric to any real degree except in WAR, since the Warrior Priest was expected to get into the middle of things and fight. In the past, when a tank would tell me to just stand back and spam heal him over and over and over rather than have any more of an active role in an encounter, I got bored very quickly. What's the point of even being in the group if the only contribution you're going to be asked for is one specific thing?

    If EQN can design a system where a player isn't forced into a singular role, I'm all for it. People should be able to play in whatever style suits them best in the context of what they're doing at the time. Being forced into a strict role is boring.

    This would beg the simple question: Why did you play a healer? If you didn't want to heal what was the point? You can't complain about your status in life if you chose it freely. Nobody said you couldn't roll a new toon and play a class you wanted to play. No matter what EQN might be trying to hypnotize you with, if you're in a group, and you're fighting some heavy mobs, and you're the only one that brought heals with, guess what..... you're gonna be stuck healing.

  • NomadMorlockNomadMorlock Member UncommonPosts: 815
    Originally posted by Lidane

    Classes are fine. Predetrmined ROLES are not.

    I've played enough healers in these games to know that getting stuck as nothing but a healbot is boring as all hell. It's why I never played a Cleric to any real degree except in WAR, since the Warrior Priest was expected to get into the middle of things and fight. In the past, when a tank would tell me to just stand back and spam heal him over and over and over rather than have any more of an active role in an encounter, I got bored very quickly. What's the point of even being in the group if the only contribution you're going to be asked for is one specific thing?

    If EQN can design a system where a player isn't forced into a singular role, I'm all for it. People should be able to play in whatever style suits them best in the context of what they're doing at the time. Being forced into a strict role is boring.

    I get that you don't like healing.  But others do.  They like being depended on for this.  You do realize what is left when you remove these roles?  Nothing but chaos.  No strategy, very little ability to play as a team, etc.

    The Differently Geared 
  • LidaneLidane Member CommonPosts: 2,300
    Originally posted by loopback1199

    This would beg the simple question: Why did you play a healer? If you didn't want to heal what was the point? You can't complain about your status in life if you chose it freely. Nobody said you couldn't roll a new toon and play a class you wanted to play. No matter what EQN might be trying to hypnotize you with, if you're in a group, and you're fighting some heavy mobs, and you're the only one that brought heals with, guess what..... you're gonna be stuck healing.

    I said I didn't like playing a Cleric, since they end up as nothing but a healbot in these games. 

    I didn't mind healing. I hated the fact that a healing class -- Druid, Shaman, etc. -- was automatically plugged into the healbot role by some tanks and players. To me, those classes have more to offer than just healing, but since so many people got stuck into the Trinity gameplay, healing classes weren't allowed to show what else they could offer. It was just all spam heals all the time. Very boring. 

  • fyerwallfyerwall Member UncommonPosts: 3,240
    Originally posted by NomadMorlock
    Originally posted by Lidane

    Classes are fine. Predetrmined ROLES are not.

    I've played enough healers in these games to know that getting stuck as nothing but a healbot is boring as all hell. It's why I never played a Cleric to any real degree except in WAR, since the Warrior Priest was expected to get into the middle of things and fight. In the past, when a tank would tell me to just stand back and spam heal him over and over and over rather than have any more of an active role in an encounter, I got bored very quickly. What's the point of even being in the group if the only contribution you're going to be asked for is one specific thing?

    If EQN can design a system where a player isn't forced into a singular role, I'm all for it. People should be able to play in whatever style suits them best in the context of what they're doing at the time. Being forced into a strict role is boring.

    I get that you don't like healing.  But others do.  They like being depended on for this.  You do realize what is left when you remove these roles?  Nothing but chaos.  No strategy, very little ability to play as a team, etc.

    And again, those who like to heal will still be able to heal if they wish. Those who like to play the part of the defender can still be defensive. So while you think the roles are gone, you are mistaken.  So how will strategy and the ability to play as a team be gone? It's there if you want it.

    There are 3 types of people in the world.
    1.) Those who make things happen
    2.) Those who watch things happen
    3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"


  • LidaneLidane Member CommonPosts: 2,300
    Originally posted by NomadMorlock

    I get that you don't like healing.  But others do.  They like being depended on for this.  You do realize what is left when you remove these roles?  Nothing but chaos.  No strategy, very little ability to play as a team, etc.

    Way to completely miss the point of what I was saying. I don't mind healing CLASSES. I mind getting stuck in the predetermined healbot ROLE. There's a difference. 

    I like the idea of EQN's more open system without predetermined roles. Anything that gets away from strict Trinity gameplay is a good thing, IMO. Allowing players to switch their abilities and their class on the fly to fit whatever they're doing at the time is appealing. Sticking people into the usual Tank/Heabot/DPS roles is boring.

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