theme park all the way .. you are nothing more then a herd to them .. try going to an area above your lvl ... you will then see how much of a theme park it is and if you think its not a theme park then you have either not played it or are just plain ...well you get idea
I don't really see how it's not a themepark. I know we all have different definitions of these things though. It is linear, not as linear as most of the new releases, but it is still linear to the point that everything tells you what level range you should be. Fixed classes. You don't build anything. I'm hard pressed to come up with a non-themepark mechanic in the game. It has lots of rides with the DE's. The word themepark has turned into a slur around here, so I get why people don't want the game they like to be labeled a themepark, but I don't really see why that has to be the case. It doesn't have to be a "wow clone" (whatever that means these days) to be a themepark.
Well for me the only term I can think of to classify this kind of gameplay is freepark.
Themepark gameplay is to follow the quest hub from A to B till the end and raid till you are blue in the face while sandbox is more free play.
This is the most natural way of doing progress.
GW2 you are not forced to follow A to B to C in the manner you have to in a themepark game but yet you cant roam the world how you see fit.
Normally. If you are new to jungle, only madman would run into wilds on his first day.
GW2 falls in the middle of these to gameplays in my opinion, so is freepark a new genre being born in your opinion?
GW2 is good game with very active combat which I like. Other games looks now to much static when I return, mainly my beloved wow, swtor is somewhere in the middle.
They also implemented in gw2 very well group play without need for true tanks or healers (but some classes that have better abilities in that area are very handy to have). But ... more I'm playing it ... more I miss classic quest hubs. Now all one does to progress when need to be higher level to progress class quest, is to jump randomly from heart to heart, wantering aimlessy for some "random" event to occur in area suited to one level or any below as lower areas scale with players level. I would for sure play Gw2 much more and for longer if just old good quest hubs and no random jumping would be implemented. But I'm sure many love game exactly for what it is. Anyway is like with TV switch ... you do not like program, just press button and change channel. :-)) Or change game.
Originally posted by Piiritus GW2 is an MMO Light without RPG part, and yes, it's absolutely themepark.
if GW2 doesnt have RPG then no mmorpgs have rpg in them. In case you are thinking of the level scaling as an rpg breaker, levels dont make an rpg, an rpg.
Originally posted by Piiritus GW2 is an MMO Light without RPG part, and yes, it's absolutely themepark.
if GW2 doesnt have RPG then no mmorpgs have rpg in them. In case you are thinking of the level scaling as an rpg breaker, levels dont make an rpg, an rpg.
Actually it kind of does. You need some form of continued character development and progression. This has always been a tenet of roleplaying games since the very beginning when Dave Arneson and Gary Gygax turned their miniature wargaming hobby into what would later become Dungeons and Dragons.
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
But ... more I'm playing it ... more I miss classic quest hubs. Now all one does to progress when need to be higher level to progress class quest, is to jump randomly from heart to heart, wantering aimlessy for some "random" event to occur in area suited to one level or any below as lower areas scale with players level. I would for sure play Gw2 much more and for longer if just old good quest hubs and no random jumping would be implemented. But I'm sure many love game exactly for what it is. Anyway is like with TV switch ... you do not like program, just press button and change channel. :-)) Or change game.
Well with some of the new API tools like the GW2 Event tracker, http://www.soistheman.com/gw2et/ , it is a lot easier to "program" your leveling.
It becomes less random though, for the good and for the bad.
Once the Queen Jubilee is gone, it will be interesting how the loot change for champions coupled with the dungeons loot changes will modify the community behavior.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
Originally posted by Piiritus GW2 is an MMO Light without RPG part, and yes, it's absolutely themepark.
if GW2 doesnt have RPG then no mmorpgs have rpg in them. In case you are thinking of the level scaling as an rpg breaker, levels dont make an rpg, an rpg.
Actually it kind of does. You need some form of continued character development and progression. This has always been a tenet of roleplaying games since the very beginning when Dave Arneson and Gary Gygax turned their miniature wargaming hobby into what would later become Dungeons and Dragons.
Which is actually totally wrong. RPG means Role Playing Game, and not Spreadsheet Game.
Dungeons and Dragon pen and paper sessions where always about the story and adventure first.
And you played with friends and not random strangers.
MMORPGs main purpose is not that of being social chat rooms.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
Look at the success of GW2. Just because its a themepark doesnt make it a bad game. GW2 is a great themepark. No shame in that. Stop worrying about some bs stigma that has nothing to do with actual gaming.
There is a graduated scale between extreme theme park and extreme sand box. It's not just about whether or not you build things, either.
It's the design of the game world and how that game world is populated. It's the degree of linearity in playing the game and the degree to which the game supports free form adventure. It's how organic the environment feels. It's about how one can change the environment, whether through building things or destroying things. It's about other elements as well that impact the type of experience you have when playing.
An extreme theme park has an inorganic game world, with no attempt at providing organic, believable terrain, flora and fauna. It provides just the bare essentials for terrain, with mobs placed densely in homogeneous pockets, standing around statically waiting to be killed. Everything is quest driven and those quests are presented in an absolutely linear fashion, with no choice or deviation, from beginning to end. There are no choices in character progression or gear, you get new skills in a linear progression and new gear as you level up, but there is no choice. Nothing you do can have any impact on the world, beyond the fact that when you kill something, it disappears for a minute before it respawns.
That's an extreme theme park.
An extreme Sand Box is easier. It probably looks a lot like Minecraft. No story. No quests. No classes or pre-defined character progression. Players have tools to actually create or destroy the game world, reshape it, build anything they want on it.
If there is only a black and white dichotomy and no in between, then we'd only need two games, one for each extreme and everyone would be happy, right?
A zoo is a theme park. A wild life refuge is a sandbox. Many state or federal parks are some where in between, with conveniences for visitors and active management of the wild life populations and some portion of the environment.
Most MMOs considered Sandbox by the community still offer classes. They still offer quests and story. They don't give players the ability to effect the environment beyond building or destroying certain structures. Many advocates of Sandbox-only MMOs aren't actually looking for absolute sandboxes. There have been a few titles in the last decade that have been extremely "sandboxy", but if you ask, few of the Sandbox advocates play or have ever played any of them.
Wildstar is clearly in the Theme park side of the scale, but players will be able to create structures in the game world, a sand box element in a theme park game. Star Wars Galaxies, with out the ability to build houses, mining platforms, guild halls and, in very limited areas, player cities, was just as "theme park" as GW2. Did the ability to build, in a limited fashion, make that game a Sandbox? Or, did it just move it closer to the midpoint of the scale between two extremes?
GW2 offers a very organic game world. There is structured content, but it's not at all "on rails". Yes, you only gain absolute freedom to adventure anywhere after you level up to 70-80, but as you level, more and more of the game world not only becomes viable, but remains viable. Weapon skills unlock linearly, but you can chose which weapons to use and which to unlock in the order you chose to unlock them. Utility skills are tiered, but you can unlock with in a tier what you chose to unlock and in what order. The game also supports a style of free roaming game play very much akin to Skyrim, except that you scale down to content, rather than content scaling up to you, (with some exceptions).
Some areas of the game look and feel more like a theme park than others. Outside of World vs. World you don't build anything. The game may not be in any danger of slipping into the Sandbox half of the scale, but it's far from being at the extreme Theme Park side of the scale, either.
My sense is that most players would like more Sand Box elements in their MMOs, with the community split on degrees, but just as few are interested in extreme, totally free form Sandbox MMOs as would be interested in a completely linear Theme Park MMO literally set in a virtual representation of a Theme Park. The successful melding of elements from the two sides of the scale will likely provide the next break through in the genre, which makes arguing in extremes unproductive and pointless.
its a themepark, tho it only progresses you through story instead of a ramp up in difficulty which is cool if you just play things for story, sucks if you like more challenge to come
Well for me the only term I can think of to classify this kind of gameplay is freepark.
Themepark gameplay is to follow the quest hub from A to B till the end and raid till you are blue in the face while sandbox is more free play.
GW2 you are not forced to follow A to B to C in the manner you have to in a themepark game but yet you cant roam the world how you see fit.
GW2 falls in the middle of these to gameplays in my opinion, so is freepark a new genre being born in your opinion?
not true what a themepark really is
Quest hub to quest hub to level, thats a themepark, thats what GW2 is
compare to WOW, its exactly the same quest wise.
Haha. That's news to me. I had no idea GW2 forced me in a linear fashion from quest-hub to quest-hub.
And you are wrong about WoW. There are many paths to take while leveling up. Questing, PvP, and Dungeons. Heck, you can even level up strictly from herbalism or mining. This panda did it: http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/level-60-neutral-pandaren/
Well for me the only term I can think of to classify this kind of gameplay is freepark.
Themepark gameplay is to follow the quest hub from A to B till the end and raid till you are blue in the face while sandbox is more free play.
GW2 you are not forced to follow A to B to C in the manner you have to in a themepark game but yet you cant roam the world how you see fit.
GW2 falls in the middle of these to gameplays in my opinion, so is freepark a new genre being born in your opinion?
not true what a themepark really is
Quest hub to quest hub to level, thats a themepark, thats what GW2 is
compare to WOW, its exactly the same quest wise.
Haha. That's news to me. I had no idea GW2 forced me in a linear fashion from quest-hub to quest-hub.
And you are wrong about WoW. There are many paths to take while leveling up. Questing, PvP, and Dungeons. Heck, you can even level up strictly from herbalism or mining. This panda did it: http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/level-60-neutral-pandaren/
taking what I am saying completely wrong
if you want to level VIA QUESTS, its exactly the same. You cant goto the level 80 zone at level 1, you have to follow quest hub to quest hub. There may be zones you can skip, or hubs you can skip, but you have to be "height" (level) appropriate to ride this "ride" zone
Well for me the only term I can think of to classify this kind of gameplay is freepark.
Themepark gameplay is to follow the quest hub from A to B till the end and raid till you are blue in the face while sandbox is more free play.
GW2 you are not forced to follow A to B to C in the manner you have to in a themepark game but yet you cant roam the world how you see fit.
GW2 falls in the middle of these to gameplays in my opinion, so is freepark a new genre being born in your opinion?
not true what a themepark really is
Quest hub to quest hub to level, thats a themepark, thats what GW2 is
compare to WOW, its exactly the same quest wise.
Haha. That's news to me. I had no idea GW2 forced me in a linear fashion from quest-hub to quest-hub.
And you are wrong about WoW. There are many paths to take while leveling up. Questing, PvP, and Dungeons. Heck, you can even level up strictly from herbalism or mining. This panda did it: http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/level-60-neutral-pandaren/
taking what I am saying completely wrong
if you want to level VIA QUESTS, its exactly the same. You cant goto the level 80 zone at level 1, you have to follow quest hub to quest hub. There may be zones you can skip, or hubs you can skip, but you have to be "height" (level) appropriate to ride this "ride" zone
Then I take it sandbox games are in reality also a themepark game with your logic.
Kill rabbits around noob town to progress to kill clown rabbits across the pond to progress kill infected rabbit across the hill.
You see GW2 dont have quest hub per say they do have level restriced zones and you can pick anyone you want to level in and you are not funnled into quest camp A with 5 ! to quest camp B with 3 ! to quest camp 4 with 7 ! ect.
.. its not either imo................felt like a multi player Beat im Up console game like Street Fighter .. with some Sonic the Hedgehog jumping puzzles mixed in ...
Well for me the only term I can think of to classify this kind of gameplay is freepark.
Themepark gameplay is to follow the quest hub from A to B till the end and raid till you are blue in the face while sandbox is more free play.
GW2 you are not forced to follow A to B to C in the manner you have to in a themepark game but yet you cant roam the world how you see fit.
GW2 falls in the middle of these to gameplays in my opinion, so is freepark a new genre being born in your opinion?
not true what a themepark really is
Quest hub to quest hub to level, thats a themepark, thats what GW2 is
compare to WOW, its exactly the same quest wise.
Haha. That's news to me. I had no idea GW2 forced me in a linear fashion from quest-hub to quest-hub.
And you are wrong about WoW. There are many paths to take while leveling up. Questing, PvP, and Dungeons. Heck, you can even level up strictly from herbalism or mining. This panda did it: http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/level-60-neutral-pandaren/
taking what I am saying completely wrong
if you want to level VIA QUESTS, its exactly the same. You cant goto the level 80 zone at level 1, you have to follow quest hub to quest hub. There may be zones you can skip, or hubs you can skip, but you have to be "height" (level) appropriate to ride this "ride" zone
Then I take it sandbox games are in reality also a themepark game with your logic.
Kill rabbits around noob town to progress to kill clown rabbits across the pond to progress kill infected rabbit across the hill.
You see GW2 dont have quest hub per say they do have level restriced zones and you can pick anyone you want to level in and you are not funnled into quest camp A with 5 ! to quest camp B with 3 ! to quest camp 4 with 7 ! ect.
every sandbox I have played, you can goto any zone any time, you might now be as effective, but you can go. GW2 might not have 5 ! but it does have some, and the triangles are just spaced out, its still finish zone, or level enough to advance. Every Sandbox I have also played is open world.
Well for me the only term I can think of to classify this kind of gameplay is freepark.
Themepark gameplay is to follow the quest hub from A to B till the end and raid till you are blue in the face while sandbox is more free play.
GW2 you are not forced to follow A to B to C in the manner you have to in a themepark game but yet you cant roam the world how you see fit.
GW2 falls in the middle of these to gameplays in my opinion, so is freepark a new genre being born in your opinion?
not true what a themepark really is
Quest hub to quest hub to level, thats a themepark, thats what GW2 is
compare to WOW, its exactly the same quest wise.
Haha. That's news to me. I had no idea GW2 forced me in a linear fashion from quest-hub to quest-hub.
And you are wrong about WoW. There are many paths to take while leveling up. Questing, PvP, and Dungeons. Heck, you can even level up strictly from herbalism or mining. This panda did it: http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/level-60-neutral-pandaren/
taking what I am saying completely wrong
if you want to level VIA QUESTS, its exactly the same. You cant goto the level 80 zone at level 1, you have to follow quest hub to quest hub. There may be zones you can skip, or hubs you can skip, but you have to be "height" (level) appropriate to ride this "ride" zone
Then I take it sandbox games are in reality also a themepark game with your logic.
Kill rabbits around noob town to progress to kill clown rabbits across the pond to progress kill infected rabbit across the hill.
You see GW2 dont have quest hub per say they do have level restriced zones and you can pick anyone you want to level in and you are not funnled into quest camp A with 5 ! to quest camp B with 3 ! to quest camp 4 with 7 ! ect.
every sandbox I have played, you can goto any zone any time, you might now be as effective, but you can go. GW2 might not have 5 ! but it does have some, and the triangles are just spaced out, its still finish zone, or level enough to advance. Every Sandbox I have also played is open world.
Comments
100% themepark
0% sand
its a GoOd dAy to diE !!
I got it...
Litterbox?
Premium MMORPGs do not feature built-in cheating via cash for gold pay 2 win. PLAY to win or don't play.
This is the most natural way of doing progress.
Normally. If you are new to jungle, only madman would run into wilds on his first day.
GW2 is good game with very active combat which I like. Other games looks now to much static when I return, mainly my beloved wow, swtor is somewhere in the middle.
They also implemented in gw2 very well group play without need for true tanks or healers (but some classes that have better abilities in that area are very handy to have). But ... more I'm playing it ... more I miss classic quest hubs. Now all one does to progress when need to be higher level to progress class quest, is to jump randomly from heart to heart, wantering aimlessy for some "random" event to occur in area suited to one level or any below as lower areas scale with players level. I would for sure play Gw2 much more and for longer if just old good quest hubs and no random jumping would be implemented. But I'm sure many love game exactly for what it is. Anyway is like with TV switch ... you do not like program, just press button and change channel. :-)) Or change game.
if GW2 doesnt have RPG then no mmorpgs have rpg in them. In case you are thinking of the level scaling as an rpg breaker, levels dont make an rpg, an rpg.
i though all MMO are like this or ???
anyway GW2 is a hard themepark, everything you are doing is heavily scripted but they have done it right .
for me the next innovative MMO will be EQN and that cause of voxels and Storybricks ..
Actually it kind of does. You need some form of continued character development and progression. This has always been a tenet of roleplaying games since the very beginning when Dave Arneson and Gary Gygax turned their miniature wargaming hobby into what would later become Dungeons and Dragons.
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
Well with some of the new API tools like the GW2 Event tracker, http://www.soistheman.com/gw2et/ , it is a lot easier to "program" your leveling.
It becomes less random though, for the good and for the bad.
Once the Queen Jubilee is gone, it will be interesting how the loot change for champions coupled with the dungeons loot changes will modify the community behavior.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
And you played with friends and not random strangers.
MMORPGs main purpose is not that of being social chat rooms.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
Look at the success of GW2. Just because its a themepark doesnt make it a bad game. GW2 is a great themepark. No shame in that. Stop worrying about some bs stigma that has nothing to do with actual gaming.
GW2 is PURE AWESOMENESS!
GW2 is Awesomepark!
Buy the game and play your hearts out! 15 minutes at a time or 6 hours straight it don't matter you'll still end up having some fun!
Guarantee!!!
There is a graduated scale between extreme theme park and extreme sand box. It's not just about whether or not you build things, either.
It's the design of the game world and how that game world is populated. It's the degree of linearity in playing the game and the degree to which the game supports free form adventure. It's how organic the environment feels. It's about how one can change the environment, whether through building things or destroying things. It's about other elements as well that impact the type of experience you have when playing.
An extreme theme park has an inorganic game world, with no attempt at providing organic, believable terrain, flora and fauna. It provides just the bare essentials for terrain, with mobs placed densely in homogeneous pockets, standing around statically waiting to be killed. Everything is quest driven and those quests are presented in an absolutely linear fashion, with no choice or deviation, from beginning to end. There are no choices in character progression or gear, you get new skills in a linear progression and new gear as you level up, but there is no choice. Nothing you do can have any impact on the world, beyond the fact that when you kill something, it disappears for a minute before it respawns.
That's an extreme theme park.
An extreme Sand Box is easier. It probably looks a lot like Minecraft. No story. No quests. No classes or pre-defined character progression. Players have tools to actually create or destroy the game world, reshape it, build anything they want on it.
If there is only a black and white dichotomy and no in between, then we'd only need two games, one for each extreme and everyone would be happy, right?
A zoo is a theme park. A wild life refuge is a sandbox. Many state or federal parks are some where in between, with conveniences for visitors and active management of the wild life populations and some portion of the environment.
Most MMOs considered Sandbox by the community still offer classes. They still offer quests and story. They don't give players the ability to effect the environment beyond building or destroying certain structures. Many advocates of Sandbox-only MMOs aren't actually looking for absolute sandboxes. There have been a few titles in the last decade that have been extremely "sandboxy", but if you ask, few of the Sandbox advocates play or have ever played any of them.
Wildstar is clearly in the Theme park side of the scale, but players will be able to create structures in the game world, a sand box element in a theme park game. Star Wars Galaxies, with out the ability to build houses, mining platforms, guild halls and, in very limited areas, player cities, was just as "theme park" as GW2. Did the ability to build, in a limited fashion, make that game a Sandbox? Or, did it just move it closer to the midpoint of the scale between two extremes?
GW2 offers a very organic game world. There is structured content, but it's not at all "on rails". Yes, you only gain absolute freedom to adventure anywhere after you level up to 70-80, but as you level, more and more of the game world not only becomes viable, but remains viable. Weapon skills unlock linearly, but you can chose which weapons to use and which to unlock in the order you chose to unlock them. Utility skills are tiered, but you can unlock with in a tier what you chose to unlock and in what order. The game also supports a style of free roaming game play very much akin to Skyrim, except that you scale down to content, rather than content scaling up to you, (with some exceptions).
Some areas of the game look and feel more like a theme park than others. Outside of World vs. World you don't build anything. The game may not be in any danger of slipping into the Sandbox half of the scale, but it's far from being at the extreme Theme Park side of the scale, either.
My sense is that most players would like more Sand Box elements in their MMOs, with the community split on degrees, but just as few are interested in extreme, totally free form Sandbox MMOs as would be interested in a completely linear Theme Park MMO literally set in a virtual representation of a Theme Park. The successful melding of elements from the two sides of the scale will likely provide the next break through in the genre, which makes arguing in extremes unproductive and pointless.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
mmm tastes terrific!
and just look at that shine!
not true what a themepark really is
Quest hub to quest hub to level, thats a themepark, thats what GW2 is
compare to WOW, its exactly the same quest wise.
Haha. That's news to me. I had no idea GW2 forced me in a linear fashion from quest-hub to quest-hub.
And you are wrong about WoW. There are many paths to take while leveling up. Questing, PvP, and Dungeons. Heck, you can even level up strictly from herbalism or mining. This panda did it: http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/level-60-neutral-pandaren/
taking what I am saying completely wrong
if you want to level VIA QUESTS, its exactly the same. You cant goto the level 80 zone at level 1, you have to follow quest hub to quest hub. There may be zones you can skip, or hubs you can skip, but you have to be "height" (level) appropriate to ride this "ride" zone
Then I take it sandbox games are in reality also a themepark game with your logic.
Kill rabbits around noob town to progress to kill clown rabbits across the pond to progress kill infected rabbit across the hill.
You see GW2 dont have quest hub per say they do have level restriced zones and you can pick anyone you want to level in and you are not funnled into quest camp A with 5 ! to quest camp B with 3 ! to quest camp 4 with 7 ! ect.
If it's not broken, you are not innovating.
every sandbox I have played, you can goto any zone any time, you might now be as effective, but you can go. GW2 might not have 5 ! but it does have some, and the triangles are just spaced out, its still finish zone, or level enough to advance. Every Sandbox I have also played is open world.
GW2 will always be a themepark to me
?
If it's not broken, you are not innovating.