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Who really wants to play a free game ..?
Phelcher
Member CommonPosts: 1,053
The MMORPG industry has changed into the MMO industry.
But the luminaries & oldschoolers who built this genre of gaming are now in the 30's & 40's. Brad McQuaid, John Smedley, Lord British and any of the people who played Meridain, Ultima & EQ. We are all adults now, all earning income & have homes, boats, sportscars, Jet ski's, etc..
So who exactly is asking for, & seeking out Free to Play games..?
It is children and adolescent youth from ages 12 ~22^ who have limited, or no source of income.
Just had my NFL draft this past weekend and looked around the room at many of my EQ guildmates and wondered why they would want a free game to play... So I asked. The response was unanimous "No!" They don't want to be troubled with "free realms" community & mentality. (easy is not challenging)
So why are the oldschooler being under sold..? An adult can easily throw $240 ~ $500/year (at a game) if we want... yet most Dev's are making games for children and try to nickel & dime their parents. Instead of going strait to the revenue source.
Why not go strait to the revenues and make a premium game... and charge a premium..?
FWIW: I am 43 and spent $155 on 4 tanks of gasoline this holiday weekend. (<---- Why don't developers want any of that money..? ^^)
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
Comments
Your data sample appears skewed, as many ex-EQers seem to feel that if they aren't being regularly held back or penalized, then the content sucks. Of course they'd want to pay when given the option of pay or free.
However, since the conclusion you presented is stated as fact, it's entirely possible you're basing that on some kind of actual data. Could you link that, please?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
The actual data is based on the fact, as people get older... they have more wealth. Thus more to spend.
You know (?), as these strange creatures called "adults" as the mature from adolescents. These adults tend to seek out more and more challenging things to quench their thirst.
The move from checkers, to chess... as their thinking and problem solving grow dynamically.
How old are you?
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
I played Eq 1 from the middle days of Kunark for years.
Free games aren't for me. The communities are usually horrible (Blizzard owns some of this blame) I would much rather pay a monthly fee for a game then be nickle and dimed to death.
I spent years in Eve DAOC, Shadowbane (RIP) and EQ 1 & 2 when i went to look for a new game the content, quality, horrible communities would turn me off in weeks.
I thought GW2 as going to be it but it got boring fast. I hoped Rift would be good, when it went F2P it just didnt seem the same to me and the community went from low key to awful in a few days. I tried Dragon Prophet and thought it was going to be great but the cost is 100's a month and Sony barely pays attention to it and its a ghost town.
Maybe Ive out grown MMO's because F2p isnt free and isn't fun to play. Not that I wont try another game but Sony has ruined so many games Eq Next doesnt hold any interest for me. Gw2 was such a let down Wildstar barely registers with me.
None of which shows any correlation between how people choose to pay or not pay for their entertainment.
None of which shows that free to play games are less challenging than pay to play games.
So have any data at all?
I have real life for challenging.
In games I'm looking for problems that have guaranteed solutions, well defined problems, and the ability to just change your mind.
EDIT: this of course means I could care very little about free to play or not. except to the extent that F2P lets me see if a game can prove itself or not, or in the case of a PvPer F2P game puts you in impossible situations(most F2P games are drifting away from such it seems).
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
I play MMOs for the Forum PVP
You've made the question of my age irrelevant, as that gem of a post you have there has clearly demonstrated there is no correlation between age and knowledge of how the world works.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I have lots of reasons, some have nothing to do with the game.
Community is a big one.
Not wanting to be nickle and dimed to death, free games arent free. If i need a credit card sitting next to me how is that bettering myself?
silly limitations, like withholding content or player slots.
Free games dont have the support either, at least in my experience.
Subscription is the better model for a long lasting game if the developer really sees the game as a investment and not as a cash grab.
Yeah, not necessary buddy.
One might ask how old you are.
As far as people having greater income, "yes" there are people (I would hope many people) who are making more than they used to make as "kids/teenagers".
However, something I"ve noticed in my family among those with greater wealth, they actually are more careful about how they spend their money and are more (as i would think) "cheap".
So it's very possible that there are people out there with larger amounts of money who are more careful with it and are looking to funnel their funds into better places. Heck, I know that as of 5 years ago I had no problem spending money on several mmo's as well as many other games; but as retirement looms closer and as I might want to buy a loft, I find myself cutting back on games in order to use my money for other social things and then upping my retirement contributions and putting money aside for a hefty future down payment.
games have become lower on the totem pole in regards monthly spending.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I agree^ wholeheartedly..
But we are talking about hobbyist & enthusiast... the same people who spend $$ to travel to EQlive.. Dragoncon, etc..
The same people who 14 years ago.. paid PER HOUR to connect to the internet, to then pay $15/month to play Everquest, then bought a second account and build another $2k computer, just so his friends can play too..?
Where you not part of the evercrack community of 99'... or did u jump in after EQ was dumbed down... thus the dumbed down price..?
There are 500k of us, then our kids and a few million more that would slowly latch on to a premium oldschool game. One Million, all paying $20/month is better than baby-sitting 18 million WoW'tardz..
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
Sample size is too small, and data is based on mirrored social circle so factual argument is not strong enough to speak for all mmo gaming adults while simultaneously asserting that F2P players all must be children.
I am 27 and have a career, and I admit that while I do not normally play F2P games it is because most are shoddy quality, do not appeal to me aesthetically, and/or gameplay wise.
I will say that I play GW2 (B2P is my favorite business model) and I will still consider F2P games based on the quality and IP of the game despite lack of interest in most F2P games.
Point being, as an adult, I will play an F2P based on its individual merits and not the industry as a whole. Plus there is little risk associated with trying a game for free to test it myself on a case by case basis compared to buying a game, and subscribing.
So in the end why wouldn't anyone, child or adult, want to play a F2P game that looks interesting with such little risk? Then if you like the game you can always set a monthly limit for cash shop purchases to contribute to your games success.
Last point, IMO games should start making all payment options available just for the sake of options to maximize player recruitment and allow for more stable profitability (Subscriptions):
-If you play the game F2P you are restricted to cash shop with limitations (Character slots, classes, etc)
-If you play B2P in the game you are restricted to cash shop items with no limitations (Character slots, classes, etc)
-If you subscribe to the game you have no restrictions, all cash shop items are open to the subscriber in limited quantities or they are given the virtual currency equivalent in subscription while having 0 limitations to the account.
Assuming the game is worthy of course ^^^
C'mon dude... stop with the scenario trolls.
1st: Did you actually read my OP.. I stated my age already.
2nd: I am not talking about "people"... I am talking about "Adult MMORPG Players". which make nearly your whole post moot.
3rdly: If a premium game is not what you want, or can afford. Then know this about yourself and simply don't chime in. That's what I do when I am on the Ferrari forums... I sit and loath and want. But what do I have to offer them other than a child's view from the outside..?
I had to work 60h work weeks to afford my internet & EQ accounts. I know many youth that built their system with lawn money, etc. Point was, we WANTED to wade threw all that, to get our hands on these games. It wasn't casual.. it like mentally climbing a mountain.
None of that^ takes away from hockey practice, running a household, & again 60h work weeks.
We are not discussing "casual gamers" who happen bye a free game and will tinker in it over the next few months and occasionally spend a few coins on some trinkets.
I am talking about the go-getter, headstrong gamer.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
The OP is stereo-typing and over-generalizing, which is never a good thing to do, but his point is without a doubt truth. F2P games, by their very nature, breeds bad communities. Truth be told, whenever there is a low entry fee to anything in life, it naturally opens itself up to the lowest denominator. If there is a no entry fee, well ... you know where that's headed. To argue against the OPs point, is simply arguing for arguments sake.
I like your post.
But, do you consider that simply "playing the game" is a the same thing , than wanting to sink your heart into a game your never imagined possible..?
Or more simply put; When you play these F2P games, do you play them with the same passion you have done with your subscription based games..?
I find the lack of community, no-matter-what, just makes it a video game. (<-- GW2.. I have 2 collector's editions too)
.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
The remark was aimed at your dissing his post.
Your response wasn't necessary.
My post is more relevant because it's "Adult Players'. you are assuming that adult players who are enthusiasts don't also act like "Adults" and take care of the other important things in their life. There is a difference between a die hard enthusiast and someone who has lost perspective.
As far as not wanting a premium game, I'm one of the "pro subbers" and would gladly pay more for a premium game. However, though I would pay more for a premium game I won't pay more for several premium games because I am an adult and I believe in taking care of your finances. And as I've said, I've noticed those with actual wealth who are very careful where they put their money.
So an "adult" go getter headstrong gamer might pay for a premium experience and throw themselves into that experience but that doesn't mitigate the fact that there are other facets of life where an actual responsible adult might put his/her money.
And as was mentioned above, those adults might look for one sub game perhaps or several free games in order to funnel their money. You still have to take care of finances.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
OP
I would re-phrase your question.
(with consistent player disappointment in recent years over many new game introductions)......WHO WANTS TO PAY FOR CONTINUING DISAPPOINTMENT ?
Well said^.
But I do play devil's advocet with myself. I vet my questions... but have considerable knowledge inside & out.
Coincidentally, what is stereo-typing & over-generalizing other than a demographic ..?
Child / adolescent / adult ( <-- age is only a relative indicator)
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
To answer that, I would ask "why would anyone play a game where they wouldn't want to 'sink their heart'"
And the answer to that is "some people are built so that they can "sink their heart" into anything they do (my type of person) and others are built that they can compartmentalize their experiences and don't find it necessary to "sink their heart" into a game.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Great, so you do agree that a high-quality, adult focused premium game subscription game, with about 500k strong (and would likely grow as "others" tried their feet in challenging content) to at least one million strong, would be a viable business model for a developer...?
(is that^ actually one sentence.. lol)
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
yes!
However, I also think that depending on price it would also speak to how many of these games could exist in the marketplace and thrive.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
True, but not all children, adolescents or adults are the same mentally, physically or financially. In many cases, there are children who are much better behaved, possessing of more common sense and good judgment, and perhaps even wealthier, than many adults. Hence is never good to stereo-type by any type of demographic standard ... and perhaps why you are getting a bit of push back, when push back is perhaps not warranted for what, in my opinion, is an obvious statement made on your behalf.
Well I am old , almost very old and back in the early days of my MMO gaming , I probably spent around about $2000 - $3000 on paying for 1 pence a min dial up on PSO on the DC. So when the game came out 2 years later on the GC I was a lot richer playing it on that machine ( when I finally found a broadband adapter for it ). Then again on PSU another subb game. So all this talk of subb games being too expensive , well they aren't. I have noticed the cash shop crowd probably spend more than i did even back on the DC , very confusing market really , nowadays.
Get off my lawn!
Cheers,
BadOrb.
PSO 4 years , EQOA 4 months , PSU 7 years , SWTOR launch ongoing , PSO2 SEA launch ongoing , Destiny 360 launch ongoing.
"SWG was not fun. Let it go buddy." quote from iiNoSkillzii 10/18/13
The original propoganda pixie dust villain :[]
Agree^
But I would argue that those^ people are not enthusiast & hobbyist of MMORPG's, either...
Or, was that your point... he he
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
Me. I dont want to bother with big company greedy money sucking mentality. I want a community developed game, f2p, which is preferably something close to open source. Kinf of like SWG Emu.
What I dont understand is how can people be so lazy to let big companies run their lives even in gaming.
No fate but what we make, so make me a ham sandwich please.
They made f2p model buisness because if it is wellmade it can sell 30-50% more than a subscription only. Besides it´s a good way for players to try it out but also a very good way to hook a player into the game, either from buying in the cash shop or subscription. Strange enough cash shop sells better in the longer run TODAY and has becomed a trend.
Free to play is all about the cash shop to unlock features, but also offers a subscription most of time. And you are free to choose how to spend your money. Some buy from either cash shop or a subscription, even both sometimes. On some games it works like in Rift, some has been a failure like Swtor.
But another reason why they tend to go free to play rather than premium as you say. They struggle to get high playerbase and that´s why company after company have gone free to play to fight for us to play their game
Some makes free to play to squeeze that last juice out of the game to earn as much cash as possible. Usually those kind of cash shops fails. But that´s my opinion.