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Common Misconception about SWG: It actually Contained "Themeparks"
jiveturkey12
Member CommonPosts: 1,262
Most people think SWG was strictly a sandbox game, but it actually contained several "Themeparks" before the term was used in referance to linear MMO games like WoW or even EQ. (No one called EQ a Themepark in '99)
In SWG Themeparks meant Linear Content based around certain factions story missions.
For example, the Emperor's Retreat in Naboo was the "Imperial" Themepark. You would go there and begin be doing missions for the Guard at the door, then the Captain of the guard, until you were speaking directly with Thrawn, Vader, and then eventually the Emperor himself.
The missions were there almost solely for people who wanted a linear experiance and wanted the Star Wars Lore handed to them rather than interpreted from the game world, as they gave you little in the way of reward....
*I remember a Captain of the Guard giving me three Melons as a mission reward, which was usless until the great melon nerf 2004 which reaped me many credits from AH from selling them a year later.
I just thought I would post this as many people have been unclearly posting on what they assume was a "Thempark SWG" that never exsisted.
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"This is not a game to be tossed aside lightly.
It should be thrown with great force"
You sure as heck took your sweet time informiong us with this epiphany.
Every game has structured questing and gameplay. EVE the ultimate sandbox has missions (quests) that a player shlowly graduates from level I missions to, what do they have now, level IV?
Sandbox is such a miss used term, I stopped bothering trying to correct the 99% of people using it wrong.
But for the sake of making what i said more understandable...
Sandbox - Is the player making a majority of the choices on how to play the game.
Themepark - Is the developers have decided how you are going to play a majority of the game.
Eve, you can decided to be a miner, and industrialist, a market trader, a player pirate, a rat hunter, or a 'plex runner, or farm wormholes, or a salvager, or fuck I could name about 10+ other ways you can play the game.
SWG, allowed you to decided how you wanted to build your character, and in a very real sense on how you wanted to play the game.
Other end of the spectrum.
WoW, you can choose a class and a race, and you have a choice of starting areas you can level in (or move to). But you'll always be a Mage or a Rogue. But you cant decided to be a tailor and advance you game just as that, its just an addon to your class. Most of the choice has been decided by the developers.
Being labeled sandbox and themepark has nothing to do with PvP, or housing, or full loot. Its about choice and who gets to make it.
"I understand that if I hear any more words come pouring out of your **** mouth, Ill have to eat every fucking chicken in this room."
I'm not getting that from him so I dunno why you are. It was well known in SWG's development that linear content was referred to as "themeparks". And it's this tidbit of information for which he's referring to. "Themeparks" were a feature that originated within the context of SWG, even though it was a sandbox mmorpg. Eventually it was applied to all mmorpgs that featured heavy "linear" content.
This is why you get some people here who refuse to acknowledge mmos that were released before the term appeared, particularly when applied to EQ and DAoC, as being themepark mmorpgs. Nevertheless, it seems to be a bit of history that escapes even the most well versed veterans among us.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
I only played SWG at it's early launch and came back a bit later as well. As innovative as the class system was, the thing I remember most about the game was how big the worlds were, at how empty they were as well.
I played before they added in ground vechiles, and traveling to an interesting part of the map could take an upwards of 10-20 minutes of running in a straight line while occasionally evading monsters. Of course when you got to the interesting area of the map, such as a smuggler base or something like that, there wasn't much to do. All the creatures were the same, there weren't any special ones that took extra effort to take down, there weren't any nice items to loot from the base.
It was just 'blah' because while it kinda looked cool being there didn't do anything to advance my character further. It was probably the first game that made me realize lore isn't enough for a game, it needs to have compelling game mechanics too, otherwise I might as well be reading a book with my time instead.
While they did add a few 'quests' late in the game, and expanded the mission terminals (hunt x number of random mob) it really didn't add depth to the game and the worlds still felt very empty.
Don't get me wrong, I love the idea of the sandbox, and there were things I felt SWG did very right in that respect, like having to seek out a player doctor to fix up battle wounds, or having to find a dancer or musician to get rid of battle fatigue. However even with those things that encouraged players relying on each other, without a compelling world to interact in (ie the rides in a theme park) things just fell short.
The problem really is that the Term Sandbox has no definitive definition and means a different thing to everyone.It doesn't help that developers and industry "journalists" use the term loosely to all kinds of gamers all the time too.
Personally to me a Sandbox games is a game where you can affect change on the world in an non temporary way that helps shape the game world.By many definition 99% of the games that are called sandbox aren't at all or are in a very small way.
That includes latest video game darling GTAV which is to me an open world game where you can choose the order you partake in theme park rides and activities but don't affect any real change in the world unless the story of the ride your on at the time does.But most people would disagree with me.
All Sandbox are Open World, Not all Open World's are Sandbox.
An Open world game implies "Free Roaming" within a large virtual-space, while Sandbox is focused on creation within that Open world.
^ this. First time I ever heard the term was when I was asked to join in on the Jabba themepark. I was really hoping to see something awesome..not the Jabba quest series that I had already done.
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
that was always my understanding of where the term came from as well.
The first time I hear the word themepark in MMOs was also in SWG.
But as said before themeparks nowadays are meant as a type of MMO not as a line of tied quests , a themepark MMO means you are tied to areas that open up as you level you have a clear direction and a trail where to go next, this make sense in MMOs where you have the common leveling system from 1-100 or rats to dragons.
SWG did not had a numerical leveling system so it was never made to be a themepark MMO.
But post NGE when they added the level system they did make it in a themepark, Sandbox, Openworld RPG MMO not that it made it better thought you had with NGE a line of quests that took you from different areas of the game as you progress it ingame they still could be avoided thought.
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I dont consider WoW as an Open World, simply because the world isnt actually open. They have multiple instances that serve as a large amount of content like dungeons, raids, etc.
In other words, the game world in WoW is closed in many aspects, enough to take it away from the Open World definition.
This is a bit like saying Disney land Paris is the whole focus and point of Paris. SWG contained multiple themed parks true, but it wasn't the be all and end all of the game, in fact a tiny part you could take or leave.
Did anyone ever question the presence of themepark content in sandbox MMOs?
As far as the terms go, the terms themepark, sandbox and social (oh noes, don't mention that one here!) refer to the predominant gameplay. It doesn't mean to the exclusion of everything else.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
No but people on these forums have been especially bad at calling SWG a Themepark game, and claiming its nota real Sandbox because it featured SOME linear content.
Its not anything to be snide about, mearly trying to reiterate something that is obviously being misinterpreted by a younger, less informed community.
As a crafter, I managed to avoid the theme parks for a long time. Once I got into piloting I was horrified to find out that my next trainer was lingering around Jabba's palace. It meant I had to go through the theme park to get entry! It turned out to be so much fun that I started doing others as time allowed.
That was a great experience to me: living as an Uncle Owen who could occasionally let his inner Luke Skywalker out to play!
There hasn't been a true sandbox MMORPG yet and no EVE isn't one either.
SWG was a LIMITED-themepark MMO. SWTOR is a LINEAR-themepark game. "LINEAR" meaning no sandbox elements whatsoever and solely based upon story.
I should note, SWTOR has a great story for each class. Problem is, it hasn't got much else.
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You don't need one,you have real life
And the SECOND most common misconception is that SWG was doing horribly before CU hit. The bloom was off the rose and many former players were off checking out the newly-launched WoW and EQ2, yes. But all that histrionics about "tens of thousands of players are abandoning SWG every day!" was a steaming load. It was still one of the bigger MMOs, it just wasn't pulling WoW numbers; that's what was ticking off LucasArts.