Looking forward to seeing how the crafting is once it hits beta. I enjoyed everything else so far up to this and if the crafting can meet up with the rest of the game, they will have a very good one. I also believe it will have a great community too which is rare to find these days. Thank you.
Every beta test I fall deeper in love with this game. Action combat alone is enough to attract me to an mmo. A true Elder Scrolls themed persistent online world is more than enough.
Haxus Council Member 21 year MMO veteran PvP Raid Leader Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
Not wanting to be negative just for the sake of being negative but really... nothing knew in this game. Levels, no character persistence while offline, grind tastic gameplay, same old guild system that makes no sense witihn the context of the in-game lore/society, no meaningful passage of time because of character immortality, regular crafting/harvesting (doesn't matter how many steps you input it is still watching a bar progress).
Don't get why anyone gets excited by these "new" MMOs. There is hardly anything new in any of them. Just the same old with a fresh coat of paint a maybe a gimmicky tweak or two.
All I will say, is it's only a grind if you're not having fun. Doing something fun is not a grind.
I wonder why they went with locking a handful of skills behind classes if the rest of them can all be unlocked with time. I am guessing that those class skills will be the most defining characteristics of your toon and everything else will be much more secondary. For instance a person who picks ranged caster class will never be a top tier tank or vis versa because the key skills needed to do that job will be locked in the class.
Just a guess on my part. Still it looks much more like a Elder Scrolls game than the videos I saw earlier in the year so if nothing else it does seem like they have been listening to people who want a Elder Scrolls MMO and not WoW with a Elder Scrolls skin.
All weapons and armors are shared skill lines. You get a racial and a bunch of "world, guilds and AvA" skill lines too (some are mutually exclusive like the Vampire vs Werewolf ones). The class skill lines are the minority of everything you will be able to unlock and you can still only have 12 skills in combat (with weapon switching, 6 for each weapon set). Just look at the video above to see how many skills are per line and make the math.
Most players will end up running around with skills that aren't related to their classes.
^^ This
If you want to be a tank, you can go with building class skills. But you can also go with the S&B, Heavy armor and Fighters guild skill lines. Work on building those skills with the active and passive, and you can be a tank with any class. Same for a Mage. Grab a destruction staff, light armor and join the Mages guild.
It would be easier to start with the class and type of character you want to be. But I think with enough skill points, any class can be a top of the line in any of the trinity. Will have to wait and see, but with the limited number of skills as above, it can and will be done.
Oh I'm sure you will be able to do it but the question is would a top 10 raiding guild take a mage as a MT? It's one thing to say you can make a build that will get by for casual content it's quite another to say it will be able to compare toe to toe with a purpose build race/class combination for a specific role.
TSW has north of 500 skills of which you can equip 8 active and 8 passive at any one time but you always have access to the entire tree. ESO seems to be trying to give some of this flexibility without going all the way to the TSW extreme. I'm sure there is a good reason but I still find it interesting they went this path. This is better than 3 trees or even rift's multiple trees you go down but ultimately it's still not as open as Elder Scrolls single player games.
I wonder why they went with locking a handful of skills behind classes if the rest of them can all be unlocked with time. I am guessing that those class skills will be the most defining characteristics of your toon and everything else will be much more secondary. For instance a person who picks ranged caster class will never be a top tier tank or vis versa because the key skills needed to do that job will be locked in the class.
Just a guess on my part. Still it looks much more like a Elder Scrolls game than the videos I saw earlier in the year so if nothing else it does seem like they have been listening to people who want a Elder Scrolls MMO and not WoW with a Elder Scrolls skin.
LOL, not laughing at you. Just the listening part.
"You have your abilities themselves: usually determined by class selection, weapon choice, or even guild allegiance."
Which goes 100% against their pushing this as a "be who you want to be" game like a TES game is.
You cant have freedom to play the type of character you want when your skills are locked in by a class, a weapon choice or a guild.
And no, I don't want to hear that this is an MMO and not an SRPG because we have MMOs without classes or skill limitations. TSW is a prime example.
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
Originally posted by bcbully Originally posted by XiaokiOriginally posted by hovnarrenI am so relived there is not a respec in this game, letting player focus on what they really want to do. this for me is a reason to play in itself
What people really want to do is grind out skill points?Sounds like you can get pretty much everything but you can only have so many skills equipped at a time. Kinda like GW2.Nothing like GW2. Your skills never change. Those same 15 or so weapon skills you get by level 5 are the same skills you will be using at level 80 and beyond in GW2. Next time actually read what I said. I didnt say anything about weapon skills.
In GW2 you keep grinding skill points until you unlock all of your CLASS skills, even if you are max level.
ESO is similar in that you dont have a cap and you just keep grinding skill points until you unlock everything.
Difference is that in ESO you have more skills to grind because all classes can use all weapons and armor. Then you have like a half dozen other skill trees to grind out.
Sadly i wait for someone,anyone to be unique but nope,more of the same old.
They got one part right or at least adding depth and that is with the buildup aka tactical points/limit break FF developed years ago.
typical games give you a new spell and ability for your class as you level,well now they want to do like so many others and eliminate the class altogether,in essence eliminate the RPG in MMORPG.They really have no business saying you can build your MAGE class any way you want,it is not a class anymore.Others are startin g to catch on to what Sqaure started years ago,you can still maintain the Trinity and the CLASS design and still give player choice AND maintain solo and grouping,there is no need to get lazy on developing each individual class.
I love the "player choice" always the typical PR move to make players feel special.
Those models also look dangerously close to being the same with a different head,i never got to look at them that long but still.Models usually are a dead give away towards telling us if a developer is lazy and cheap or putting in some effort.
I find developers true reason for the class designs of late is laziness.They don't want to balance classes and hear from people crying why one class has better abilities than their class.They also don't want to balance a grouping game,so easier to go the solo route and make everyone a jack of all trades.
This constant push towards removing the Trinity and making everyone just a mush of spells and abilities,has no organized design to it,just a lazy design.
Combat is thew MAIN component i look for in a game,some others like Lore,stories,quests ,what ever but for me that combat had better be solid or i won't even bother with the game.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Originally posted by JJ82 "You have your abilities themselves: usually determined by class selection, weapon choice, or even guild allegiance."Which goes 100% against their pushing this as a "be who you want to be" game like a TES game is.You cant have freedom to play the type of character you want when your skills are locked in by a class, a weapon choice or a guild.And no, I don't want to hear that this is an MMO and not an SRPG because we have MMOs without classes or skill limitations. TSW is a prime example.
you were locked into skill choices in skyrim too before you could respec.
Hard to believe that in 2013 an MMO with a skill based advancement system wouldn't allow for respecs. A system like this is guaranteed to allow for gimped characters. lack of respec will drive many players from the game due to undue frustration and a no respect policy also guarantees that most informed players will follow proven, cookie-cutter builds.
When looking for signs as to whether a developer "get's it", or not, reading about something like this just makes me groan.
I'll check it out in Open Beta, but my expectations are falling...
Hard to believe that in 2013 an MMO with a skill based advancement system wouldn't allow for respecs. A system like this is guaranteed to allow for gimped characters. lack of respec will drive many players from the game due to undue frustration and a no respect policy also guarantees that most informed players will follow proven, cookie-cutter builds.
When looking for signs as to whether a developer "get's it", or not, reading about something like this just makes me groan.
I'll check it out in Open Beta, but my expectations are falling...
There's not much need for respecs when you can learn everything anyway.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The progression system in the game looks pretty good, I like how you have to build your own guy the way you want with the option to learn many other different ways to go. Still waiting on more in depth PvP video's because that will be the main draw for me. I'm sure the story and questing will be good, it's an ES based game and they usually have some good story telling. I will spend most of my time in Cyrodiil though
Originally posted by Bill Murphy A long time ago, Paul Sage told us you’d be able to go back later in the game and learn the other paths of each morphed ability. It remains to be seen if this is true, but we sure hope so.
I would actually hope that you can't eventually learn both. That would diminish the value of the choice. Actually, it would completely eliminate the crucial decision element to the spec. What I would hope for is the ability to respec those choices, this way you're never stuck regretting a poor decision, and your decisions are never completely inconsequential. If there will be respecs in this game, I think this would be their function, since most other skills aren't earned at the expense of another; with all other abilities, you can just keep learning more and more of them.
I wonder why they went with locking a handful of skills behind classes if the rest of them can all be unlocked with time. ...
To provide a little bit of class differentiation that MMO players like and are used to, while not having class choices totally dominate or limit a player's ability to broadly customize their characters. I mean I imagine some MMO fans are still a little unhappy with the fact that classes aren't ultra unique in this system, just as I'm sure some ES fans aren't happy that progression isn't completely 100% open ended, but I personally think this is a pretty solid compromise between the two.
Did this game get a boost in graphics quality? This video seems to demonstrate far superior graphics than previous videos, and in fact, my interest in it has piqued significantly.
Am I the only one who thinks this? Or has it looked like this always and I'm just completely insane?
Originally posted by Rastan1 It doesn't matter how many skill lines they give you if you can only use 5 things then you have 5 things. Very shallow combat system.
It's not 5 though
You have 5 normal ability slots then another 5 with weapon swap, 2 ultimate slots, 2 are tied to your left mouse button, block tied to your right, interrupt is hold block tap left mouse button, cc break is tap both mouse buttons, dodge is double tap a direction, stealth is ctrl, synergy is assigned to "x" and potions are assigned to another button (I think they said "r" but not 100%).
5 slots does NOT mean you will only have 5 things to do, a lot of the abilities normally tied to your action bar in most mmo's are actually just part of the control scheme as a whole
Did this game get a boost in graphics quality? This video seems to demonstrate far superior graphics than previous videos, and in fact, my interest in it has piqued significantly.
Am I the only one who thinks this? Or has it looked like this always and I'm just completely insane?
I don't know what the "earlier videos" looked like, but I thought the game looked great during the last beta test. I certainly encountered several screenshot-worthy scenes. I'm pretty easy to please graphically, though. I recently discovered where all my hard drive space had been disappearing to: it turns out I've taken over 76 GIGAbytes in GW2 screenshots over the past year...
Originally posted by evilastro The models and world look good, but they really need to work on the combat animations. Pretty stark contrast if you look at this video and Wildstar. Still going to check it out for ES nostalgia, but could be a game killer.
I have no idea what your talking about. The animations are fluid and natural looking. Maybe you meant to say the characters weren't flying around the screen like 12 year olds on a sugar rush like most MMO's coming out today.
Originally posted by Tierless Sounds ok. Any word on that thing that defines TES games, you know, the open sandboxy game world? No one seems to want to talk about the world itself which as a TES fan is a fairly big selling point for me.
I have heard that the world looks and feels like TES. That said it is hard for me to imagine that being the case. I am sure they can pull off making the graphics feeling similar. What I have a hard time believing is though, let's say I am exploring a dungeon out in the world by myself sneaking across the room towards a chest my heart pounding hoping to remain hidden from the vampires walking about. Then in runs 5 guys, pew pew pew, telling anal jokes in chat and killing the vampires, and one of them runs up and grab that chest. That moment will feel very different than the feeling you would get in a TES game.
I just hope there is a way to progress your character without out doing quest after quest. Hopefully crafting, gathering and mob grinding will be viable.
Did this game get a boost in graphics quality? This video seems to demonstrate far superior graphics than previous videos, and in fact, my interest in it has piqued significantly.
Am I the only one who thinks this? Or has it looked like this always and I'm just completely insane?
no, not that I've seen. I will say that if you ever watched the "leaked videos" that they were not a good representation of what the game looked like.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Comments
21 year MMO veteran
PvP Raid Leader
Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
All I will say, is it's only a grind if you're not having fun. Doing something fun is not a grind.
Oh I'm sure you will be able to do it but the question is would a top 10 raiding guild take a mage as a MT? It's one thing to say you can make a build that will get by for casual content it's quite another to say it will be able to compare toe to toe with a purpose build race/class combination for a specific role.
TSW has north of 500 skills of which you can equip 8 active and 8 passive at any one time but you always have access to the entire tree. ESO seems to be trying to give some of this flexibility without going all the way to the TSW extreme. I'm sure there is a good reason but I still find it interesting they went this path. This is better than 3 trees or even rift's multiple trees you go down but ultimately it's still not as open as Elder Scrolls single player games.
LOL, not laughing at you. Just the listening part.
"You have your abilities themselves: usually determined by class selection, weapon choice, or even guild allegiance."
Which goes 100% against their pushing this as a "be who you want to be" game like a TES game is.
You cant have freedom to play the type of character you want when your skills are locked in by a class, a weapon choice or a guild.
And no, I don't want to hear that this is an MMO and not an SRPG because we have MMOs without classes or skill limitations. TSW is a prime example.
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
Nothing like GW2. Your skills never change. Those same 15 or so weapon skills you get by level 5 are the same skills you will be using at level 80 and beyond in GW2.
Next time actually read what I said. I didnt say anything about weapon skills.
In GW2 you keep grinding skill points until you unlock all of your CLASS skills, even if you are max level.
ESO is similar in that you dont have a cap and you just keep grinding skill points until you unlock everything.
Difference is that in ESO you have more skills to grind because all classes can use all weapons and armor. Then you have like a half dozen other skill trees to grind out.
Sadly i wait for someone,anyone to be unique but nope,more of the same old.
They got one part right or at least adding depth and that is with the buildup aka tactical points/limit break FF developed years ago.
typical games give you a new spell and ability for your class as you level,well now they want to do like so many others and eliminate the class altogether,in essence eliminate the RPG in MMORPG.They really have no business saying you can build your MAGE class any way you want,it is not a class anymore.Others are startin g to catch on to what Sqaure started years ago,you can still maintain the Trinity and the CLASS design and still give player choice AND maintain solo and grouping,there is no need to get lazy on developing each individual class.
I love the "player choice" always the typical PR move to make players feel special.
Those models also look dangerously close to being the same with a different head,i never got to look at them that long but still.Models usually are a dead give away towards telling us if a developer is lazy and cheap or putting in some effort.
I find developers true reason for the class designs of late is laziness.They don't want to balance classes and hear from people crying why one class has better abilities than their class.They also don't want to balance a grouping game,so easier to go the solo route and make everyone a jack of all trades.
This constant push towards removing the Trinity and making everyone just a mush of spells and abilities,has no organized design to it,just a lazy design.
Combat is thew MAIN component i look for in a game,some others like Lore,stories,quests ,what ever but for me that combat had better be solid or i won't even bother with the game.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
you were locked into skill choices in skyrim too before you could respec.
Hard to believe that in 2013 an MMO with a skill based advancement system wouldn't allow for respecs. A system like this is guaranteed to allow for gimped characters. lack of respec will drive many players from the game due to undue frustration and a no respect policy also guarantees that most informed players will follow proven, cookie-cutter builds.
When looking for signs as to whether a developer "get's it", or not, reading about something like this just makes me groan.
I'll check it out in Open Beta, but my expectations are falling...
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
There's not much need for respecs when you can learn everything anyway.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I would actually hope that you can't eventually learn both. That would diminish the value of the choice. Actually, it would completely eliminate the crucial decision element to the spec. What I would hope for is the ability to respec those choices, this way you're never stuck regretting a poor decision, and your decisions are never completely inconsequential. If there will be respecs in this game, I think this would be their function, since most other skills aren't earned at the expense of another; with all other abilities, you can just keep learning more and more of them.
To provide a little bit of class differentiation that MMO players like and are used to, while not having class choices totally dominate or limit a player's ability to broadly customize their characters. I mean I imagine some MMO fans are still a little unhappy with the fact that classes aren't ultra unique in this system, just as I'm sure some ES fans aren't happy that progression isn't completely 100% open ended, but I personally think this is a pretty solid compromise between the two.
Did this game get a boost in graphics quality? This video seems to demonstrate far superior graphics than previous videos, and in fact, my interest in it has piqued significantly.
Am I the only one who thinks this? Or has it looked like this always and I'm just completely insane?
It's not 5 though
You have 5 normal ability slots then another 5 with weapon swap, 2 ultimate slots, 2 are tied to your left mouse button, block tied to your right, interrupt is hold block tap left mouse button, cc break is tap both mouse buttons, dodge is double tap a direction, stealth is ctrl, synergy is assigned to "x" and potions are assigned to another button (I think they said "r" but not 100%).
5 slots does NOT mean you will only have 5 things to do, a lot of the abilities normally tied to your action bar in most mmo's are actually just part of the control scheme as a whole
I don't know what the "earlier videos" looked like, but I thought the game looked great during the last beta test. I certainly encountered several screenshot-worthy scenes. I'm pretty easy to please graphically, though. I recently discovered where all my hard drive space had been disappearing to: it turns out I've taken over 76 GIGAbytes in GW2 screenshots over the past year...
I have no idea what your talking about. The animations are fluid and natural looking. Maybe you meant to say the characters weren't flying around the screen like 12 year olds on a sugar rush like most MMO's coming out today.
I have heard that the world looks and feels like TES. That said it is hard for me to imagine that being the case. I am sure they can pull off making the graphics feeling similar. What I have a hard time believing is though, let's say I am exploring a dungeon out in the world by myself sneaking across the room towards a chest my heart pounding hoping to remain hidden from the vampires walking about. Then in runs 5 guys, pew pew pew, telling anal jokes in chat and killing the vampires, and one of them runs up and grab that chest. That moment will feel very different than the feeling you would get in a TES game.
no, not that I've seen. I will say that if you ever watched the "leaked videos" that they were not a good representation of what the game looked like.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo