You must be a pretty good player, around level 14-15, I was trying to solo because my friends were offline. I died all the time lol. The starting areas are pretty easy, but once you start to get up in levels it becomes hard to survive. It's like almost every fight is a fight for your life.
Really my only complaint that I have with the game as it is right now, is that there are single player only dungeons. Maybe that's what you mean, and I agree. You should at least be able to take your party in your instances with you. I don't know how far along you got, but I can remember in the Fighter's Guild quest line, Doshia. As a pure melee tank, this fight was one of the hardest fights I have ever been in, and that's in 20+ years of playing MUDs and MMOs lol.
You wont like my review of the game, and you may even think I am being far too critical. But I wanted to get this off of my chest and talk about the reasons why I am disappointed in this game.
I started to form this impression a long time ago, however, I was tied by the NDA. I will try not to make this too long, but I have a lot I want to say.
I am very disappointed:
Reason 1: Solo... again: The game revolves around the solo experience. If you are like me and come from games like EQ, DAOC, these solo centric games are very underwhelming. The game phases everything, almost every quest affects what phase you are in. You will never see the same people twice, and the game does not have any social aspects. Outside of clicking a LFG panel, the game has zero social systems. Why mmo developers dump so much money into solo gameplay I will never understand.
Reason 2: Questing, all questing: The only real way to get EXP is to do what you have been doing in every single mmo since 2005. Grab quests, skip the voice overs, kill x, return. The questing in this game is so tedious and unexciting.
Reason 3: very sloppy and dull combat: Skyrim's combat pretty fun, it was tight, and strategic. ESO's combat is a sloppy version of that, mixed with mmo tab targeting. About 20 minutes into the game I was already extremely bored with my character.
Reason 4: what I loved about Skrim, is not in ESO: Exploration in ESO is very underwhelming. Exploration in ESO is about as exciting as it was in SWTOR.
Reason 5: MMO on rails: This sort of ties in with reason 1. The game is all scripted, besides going to Cyrodil and doing some PVP. Other than that, you jump from quest to quest following a primary story line. This “story driven mmo” trend destroys any excitement mmos have for me. Devs dump all their resources into writing story lines and making cut scenes, which makes the actual game really shallow.
Reason 5: Players are just scenery: there is no reason in this game to communicate or team up with a anyone. Simply use a dungeon finder for a group, and that's it. I thought SWTOR was anti social, Eso is far worse. This game does not promote any player collaboration. Dark anchors and dungeon finders are not it.
Reason 6: My BIGEEST reason.. phasing: The point of phasing is to try and make the world feel like it is changing, but it destroys immersion. The experience isn't shared and that's what makes phasing so pointless in an mmo. It feels so artificial because the phase I am seeing is different for everyone else, so it isn't truly what the world is. It separates players and makes the game feel really lonely. Phasing has no place in an mmo where it is supposed to be a shared world.
ESO is a single player game with a subscription fee.
Conclusion: For me, mmo excitement derives from shared experience with players, exploring a world that is unknown and dangerous. An MMO that tries to force feed a story, or create a game that is phased with scripts will not create lasting gaming memories.
The bottom line is, if you did not like swtor, you will not like this. Besides combat, it has almost the exact same game design; solo questing and scripts, with virtually no community.
Well I disagree with most everything you said except for the "solo" and "phasing" part. Other than that it's hard to believe you've even played this game or any other MMO to compare it to. I was very disappointed in seeing people in my group disappear right in front of me for really no reason at all. Groups should NOT be phasing no matter what the reason or whatever, it's very bad for the game and the dev's should have known this from the beginning.
The questing I thought was one of the best features in this game. The quest actually had meaning if you took the time to listen to the voice overs and get involved in the quest and not just try to rush through them. I save a whole town and they cheered for me as I ran through it, c'mon Man that's some good questing there.
No offense OP but I think you and several others are making yourself look very ignorant when you compare the exploration in this game to a game like TOR. You obviously haven't scratched the surface of this game if you came out thinking like that.
Also, there are more than enough Multiplayer options and Massive multiplayer PVP options that to say this is a solo game is silly. Is it solo friendly? Absolutely. The game caters to all types of players.
An Elder Scrolls game focused on questing...who would have thought this would be the focus for PVE lol. /rhetorical question. Where do folks come up with this crap lol.
Also, why are you writing a review when you barely saw most of the game and you are playing off of an old build during a STRESS TEST! If you wrote impression of the stress test, at least then it wouldn't be such an illogical thread, or at least less illogical.
You wont like my review of the game, and you may even think I am being far too critical. But I wanted to get this off of my chest and talk about the reasons why I am disappointed in this game.
I started to form this impression a long time ago, however, I was tied by the NDA. I will try not to make this too long, but I have a lot I want to say.
I am very disappointed:
Reason 1: Solo... again: The game revolves around the solo experience. If you are like me and come from games like EQ, DAOC, these solo centric games are very underwhelming. The game phases everything, almost every quest affects what phase you are in. You will never see the same people twice, and the game does not have any social aspects. Outside of clicking a LFG panel, the game has zero social systems. Why mmo developers dump so much money into solo gameplay I will never understand.
Won't argue here. In addition to certain combat lacks there are times when it's simply not that fun (see i.e. how some ppl critiicised certain solo fights why it's not possible to allow even only two players fight same enemy).
Reason 2: Questing, all questing: The only real way to get EXP is to do what you have been doing in every single mmo since 2005. Grab quests, skip the voice overs, kill x, return. The questing in this game is so tedious and unexciting.
Yeah but then if they did make it as in other TES games then it would easily end up as Darkfall without full loot. Not saying that it would be bad but then it's not like whole crowd of players can't live without it, is it? Or we could have a typical grinder. This time not grinding for character level exp but skill level exp. So much difference really.
Reason 3: very sloppy and dull combat: Skyrim's combat pretty fun, it was tight, and strategic. ESO's combat is a sloppy version of that, mixed with mmo tab targeting. About 20 minutes into the game I was already extremely bored with my character.
Combat depends alot not just on your personal preferences but more importantly how they match with weapon and skills you are using. I.e. it's different experience to play templar with 2h sword and even 1h sword + shield. However I have to agree with the fact that as much as certain combos are alot of fun, other not so much.
Reason 4: what I loved about Skrim, is not in ESO: Exploration in ESO is very underwhelming. Exploration in ESO is about as exciting as it was in SWTOR.
Reason 5: MMO on rails: This sort of ties in with reason 1. The game is all scripted, besides going to Cyrodil and doing some PVP. Other than that, you jump from quest to quest following a primary story line. This “story driven mmo” trend destroys any excitement mmos have for me. Devs dump all their resources into writing story lines and making cut scenes, which makes the actual game really shallow.
TES was always mostly about storylines, even Daggerfall, sorry. You you are saying that just because game is built around storylines is what makes game shallow then it seems that every TES game is shallow. Why would TESO be any different then? Agreed that game currently is lacking content that makes you go back to places you thought you already completed. And this is far worse than in any TES game but then this has nothing to do with the story or it's amount.
Reason 5: Players are just scenery: there is no reason in this game to communicate or team up with a anyone. Simply use a dungeon finder for a group, and that's it. I thought SWTOR was anti social, Eso is far worse. This game does not promote any player collaboration. Dark anchors and dungeon finders are not it.
Weird DC chat seems to say opposite. Also as much as lfg tool may work for PvE content it totally doesn't work in Cyrodiil. But then in Cyrodiil it's a wise choice to actually join some group even if you join for only one keep.
Reason 6: My BIGEEST reason.. phasing: The point of phasing is to try and make the world feel like it is changing, but it destroys immersion. The experience isn't shared and that's what makes phasing so pointless in an mmo. It feels so artificial because the phase I am seeing is different for everyone else, so it isn't truly what the world is. It separates players and makes the game feel really lonely. Phasing has no place in an mmo where it is supposed to be a shared world.
Phasing works only locally. If player A and player B are on a totally different step of the SAME QUEST or they made different choices during SAME QUEST AGAIN then they end up in different phase IN SINGLE QUEST HUB. It doesn't work tho between hubs so player A and player B will see each other elsewhere. Also that statement about everyone in own instance. Where did you really get this? Or was there something wrong with my eyes as I actually could see players around me everywhere. Some bug maybe...:-)
ESO is a single player game with a subscription fee.
Conclusion: For me, mmo excitement derives from shared experience with players, exploring a world that is unknown and dangerous. An MMO that tries to force feed a story, or create a game that is phased with scripts will not create lasting gaming memories.
The bottom line is, if you did not like swtor, you will not like this. Besides combat, it has almost the exact same game design; solo questing and scripts, with virtually no community.
Seriously I think that you should go back and do your homework again as while I have to say that regarding certain points you made you are not really that far from the truth it seems (judging not just on what I think about the game) but then in others your statements seem to be detached really.
I agree on many of the OPs points from what I experienced in beta so far.
1. I realize the strong solo approach is the way many mmos have been heading in the last decade. And because of this I have come expect it, or not really be surprised by it. But this trend does not excuse ESO. Especially when they are sacrificing so much of the SP Elder Scrolls experience to make it an MMO. This just shows that In most cases when you try to please too many people, you end up with a mediocre experience overall.
Maybe its coming from my first mmo being FFXI in which there was essentially "forced grouping." And while I don't agree with new mmos going with that 'extreme end of the spectrum approach' either, I believe there should be a much better balance and current mmos should put at least a little more focus in grouping aspects mechanics instead of just tacking on groupable side events (dungeons, etc.) How about incentive like better xp, tougher mobs, group dynamics, spell chains, combos. FFXI had many failings and things that are outdated, but these are not them.
Anyway, a bit of tangent...On to the next point
2. The Questing I experienced in ESO was standard fare. No better, no less than recent previous MMOs except maybe to some degree GW2. Again this doesnt excuse it and I expected much more from an "Elder Scrolls game," mmo or not. Some of the quests so far have been kinda cool, but so the majority of them feel just like your generic, run of the mill mmo filler quests.
When I did several quests in a row that were just "run to these 5 things and press 'e' on them," I almost threw up a bit. Never in Skyrim did I feel like any of the adventures or quests/missions I was doing were generic unimmersive mmo chores. Again I understand this is an mmo, but I feel like they just threw alot of these uninspiring quests in to make the game feel like it has more content. C'mon give me something that is engaging: Give me (more) puzzles, escorts, area defense, etc. Hell, I'd rather have a Kill X of Y quest, because at least then the focus is on combat and battling something, not just walking, pressing 'e' and watching the game play itself.
3. I don't agree about the combat as much however. So far the combat seems fine to me. Better than your standard MMO fare, and different enough (not better or worse) than skyrim's. I also don't feel like I got far enough to experience the combat to its full potential, but am exited about it nonetheless.
4. Again, I havent gotten too far in, but so far I agree it seems they kinda dropped the ball on this. Not much to explore compared to your standard mmo. Still expect better.
5. I like a good story. Then again it doesn't and should always have a huge place in an mmo: Other important mmo features/experiences like combat, exploration, grouping, etc. should not be sacrificed for a grand story. The sad thing is in terms of story, writing, and voiceover I actually feel SWTOR did a much better job.
Comments
You must be a pretty good player, around level 14-15, I was trying to solo because my friends were offline. I died all the time lol. The starting areas are pretty easy, but once you start to get up in levels it becomes hard to survive. It's like almost every fight is a fight for your life.
Really my only complaint that I have with the game as it is right now, is that there are single player only dungeons. Maybe that's what you mean, and I agree. You should at least be able to take your party in your instances with you. I don't know how far along you got, but I can remember in the Fighter's Guild quest line, Doshia. As a pure melee tank, this fight was one of the hardest fights I have ever been in, and that's in 20+ years of playing MUDs and MMOs lol.
@OP: there is like one valid answer to your topic:
you are doing it wrong.
so, how many grp content did you have in daoc up to lvl 15 again?
and farming in vanern does NOT count as lvl15 grp content in that case
seriously. did you try to find a grp and play with them? or did you solo through everything?
if so, how have you dont the elite areas designed for grps?
or the dungeon at the end of the "starting" area?
and you think exploring was dull?
did you find all skyshards and crafting areas? did you find ALL questareas?
you said questing is boring? lol. yea, area farming mobs in daoc was so much more interesting!
conclusion: don't play games you don't wanna play, and stop making up excuses
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
Well I disagree with most everything you said except for the "solo" and "phasing" part. Other than that it's hard to believe you've even played this game or any other MMO to compare it to. I was very disappointed in seeing people in my group disappear right in front of me for really no reason at all. Groups should NOT be phasing no matter what the reason or whatever, it's very bad for the game and the dev's should have known this from the beginning.
The questing I thought was one of the best features in this game. The quest actually had meaning if you took the time to listen to the voice overs and get involved in the quest and not just try to rush through them. I save a whole town and they cheered for me as I ran through it, c'mon Man that's some good questing there.
Peace
Lascer
No offense OP but I think you and several others are making yourself look very ignorant when you compare the exploration in this game to a game like TOR. You obviously haven't scratched the surface of this game if you came out thinking like that.
Also, there are more than enough Multiplayer options and Massive multiplayer PVP options that to say this is a solo game is silly. Is it solo friendly? Absolutely. The game caters to all types of players.
An Elder Scrolls game focused on questing...who would have thought this would be the focus for PVE lol. /rhetorical question. Where do folks come up with this crap lol.
Also, why are you writing a review when you barely saw most of the game and you are playing off of an old build during a STRESS TEST! If you wrote impression of the stress test, at least then it wouldn't be such an illogical thread, or at least less illogical.
There Is Always Hope!
Seriously I think that you should go back and do your homework again as while I have to say that regarding certain points you made you are not really that far from the truth it seems (judging not just on what I think about the game) but then in others your statements seem to be detached really.
I agree on many of the OPs points from what I experienced in beta so far.
1. I realize the strong solo approach is the way many mmos have been heading in the last decade. And because of this I have come expect it, or not really be surprised by it. But this trend does not excuse ESO. Especially when they are sacrificing so much of the SP Elder Scrolls experience to make it an MMO. This just shows that In most cases when you try to please too many people, you end up with a mediocre experience overall.
Maybe its coming from my first mmo being FFXI in which there was essentially "forced grouping." And while I don't agree with new mmos going with that 'extreme end of the spectrum approach' either, I believe there should be a much better balance and current mmos should put at least a little more focus in grouping aspects mechanics instead of just tacking on groupable side events (dungeons, etc.) How about incentive like better xp, tougher mobs, group dynamics, spell chains, combos. FFXI had many failings and things that are outdated, but these are not them.
Anyway, a bit of tangent...On to the next point
2. The Questing I experienced in ESO was standard fare. No better, no less than recent previous MMOs except maybe to some degree GW2. Again this doesnt excuse it and I expected much more from an "Elder Scrolls game," mmo or not. Some of the quests so far have been kinda cool, but so the majority of them feel just like your generic, run of the mill mmo filler quests.
When I did several quests in a row that were just "run to these 5 things and press 'e' on them," I almost threw up a bit. Never in Skyrim did I feel like any of the adventures or quests/missions I was doing were generic unimmersive mmo chores. Again I understand this is an mmo, but I feel like they just threw alot of these uninspiring quests in to make the game feel like it has more content. C'mon give me something that is engaging: Give me (more) puzzles, escorts, area defense, etc. Hell, I'd rather have a Kill X of Y quest, because at least then the focus is on combat and battling something, not just walking, pressing 'e' and watching the game play itself.
3. I don't agree about the combat as much however. So far the combat seems fine to me. Better than your standard MMO fare, and different enough (not better or worse) than skyrim's. I also don't feel like I got far enough to experience the combat to its full potential, but am exited about it nonetheless.
4. Again, I havent gotten too far in, but so far I agree it seems they kinda dropped the ball on this. Not much to explore compared to your standard mmo. Still expect better.
5. I like a good story. Then again it doesn't and should always have a huge place in an mmo: Other important mmo features/experiences like combat, exploration, grouping, etc. should not be sacrificed for a grand story. The sad thing is in terms of story, writing, and voiceover I actually feel SWTOR did a much better job.
MMOs Played: FFXI,Age of Conan, Aion, Rift, SWTOR, TERA, TSW, GW2
Playing:None
Waiting For: Wildstar, The Repopulation, Archeage, TESO, Warhammer 40K:EC, EQN