Originally posted by nilden The real joke here is that they didn't put in a basic feature like swimming under water and people are praising them for it.
except it's not really a basic feature. I suppose there is a a certain sadness to the idea of the game world "being a world" but LOTRO doesn't allow you to dive and I don't really think anything is taken away from the game "because of that".
Can't swim in Aion at all.
I don't believe Tera has it. I don't remember it in "The Secret World".
Was it in City of Heroes? Or "Champions Online"? I don't recall ever swimming in those games but maybe I'm wrong.
If it was "basic" then wouldn't all games have it?
What would you call it if it's not a basic feature? This is like not being able to jump and people saying yeah F jumping this game is way better because it doesn't have jumping.
Is swimming under water some kind of luxury feature EQ1 was able to bring to the table in 1999 and all these newer games just refuse to go to that lofty high of luxury that is swimming under water? Just because a lot of these games leave something as basic as swimming out doesn't make it any less of a basic feature.
The idea being, if it was a "basic feature' then every game would have it. But since every game doesn't have it it's not really a "basic feature".
EQ had it and Lineage 2 didn't (until later) as I said, lotro never had it and neither does Aion, etc etc. yet all those games have a movement feature, all those games have a chat box feature.
I'm not sure what type of feature it is. Something to do with immersion or situational or some other set of parameters.
The Witcher games don't have swimming and neither do the Dragon Age games. The elder scrolls games do have swimming as does Kingdom of Amular. Fable doesn't have swimming.
It seems that Swimming isn't really included in all solo role play games either.
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I'm so glad I don't have these kind of issues. Do I think there should be underwater swimming, sure, why not. Did I even care when playing? Nope, I don't like underwater swimming anyway. Does this mean that others might not be disappointed? Nope...but should that be a reason not to play? My reaction is that if things like this bother you, you probably won't be happy with the limitations that every MMO presents.
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I think any player that tries to swim in plate, robes, or even in full leather gear should sink to the bottom and drown.
What? You mean they can swim?
That's it, I can't believe the devs would break my immersion so much. I quit.
/s
I would love it if games had it where you wouldn't be able to swim in heavy armor . I have read that it is possible though very tiring to swim in plate armor. I imagine it would be very difficult and the person wearing it would have to be in great shape.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Originally posted by nilden The real joke here is that they didn't put in a basic feature like swimming under water and people are praising them for it.
except it's not really a basic feature. I suppose there is a a certain sadness to the idea of the game world "being a world" but LOTRO doesn't allow you to dive and I don't really think anything is taken away from the game "because of that".
Can't swim in Aion at all.
I don't believe Tera has it. I don't remember it in "The Secret World".
Was it in City of Heroes? Or "Champions Online"? I don't recall ever swimming in those games but maybe I'm wrong.
If it was "basic" then wouldn't all games have it?
What would you call it if it's not a basic feature? This is like not being able to jump and people saying yeah F jumping this game is way better because it doesn't have jumping.
Is swimming under water some kind of luxury feature EQ1 was able to bring to the table in 1999 and all these newer games just refuse to go to that lofty high of luxury that is swimming under water? Just because a lot of these games leave something as basic as swimming out doesn't make it any less of a basic feature.
The idea being, if it was a "basic feature' then every game would have it. But since every game doesn't have it it's not really a "basic feature".
EQ had it and Lineage 2 didn't (until later) as I said, lotro never had it and neither does Aion, etc etc. yet all those games have a movement feature, all those games have a chat box feature.
I'm not sure what type of feature it is. Something to do with immersion or situational or some other set of parameters.
The Witcher games don't have swimming and neither do the Dragon Age games. The elder scrolls games do have swimming as does Kingdom of Amular. Fable doesn't have swimming.
It seems that Swimming isn't really included in all solo role play games either.
You guys are using basic to mean different things. Anyway this is irrelevant. What matters is that yes, swimming is a basic gameworld interaction and has been around for a long time. What I find more interesting and would like to point out is that as far as I'm concerned I find all the games that did have swimming to be better than their counterparts. I thought EQ was better than Lineage II, or LOTRO (though I did kind of forgive them since they implemented the pipe smoking and an awesome music playing system that I think more devs should strive to include), or Aion. I also liked Kingdoms of Amalur (despite its many faults) and TES games more than the Witcher and Dragon Age. Is swimming the REASON that I liked these games more? I don't think so, but it certainly helped and the inclusion of it was indicative of the developers intentions for the overall feel of their games (which I was highly in agreement with).
Originally posted by thunderC OP If water combat is what sells a game for you try GuildWars 2 .
I already said I don't care about underwater combat. But inability to swim underwater completely is just silly to me. It's like not allowing me to jump. I don't care for GW2 either for other reasons. I actually find much bigger flaws in that game than this one.
Your sounding like you want to be mad at this game. If it does not matter to you, why are you complaining?
Guess i'm failing to get my point across. It's like jumping or emotes; I may not do it much but choosing to leave it out is still gamebreaking to me. I get very attached to the MMO's that I play for any extended period of time. It's hard to get attached to a gameworld I can't properly swim in, even if most of the time I wouldn't have payed attention to that feature anyway. It's just disappointing cause I did like quite a bit of things about this game.
Don't worry, I get your point clearly. Intelligent people are a dying breed. Don't waste your time here.
Trolls have run out of food? I'm surprised someone hasn't started a thread complaining that they have to download the game or go to a store at launch to buy the game disc...really people?
There has never been a game where I liked underwater content, never. If you ask a WoW player, "What's the worst zone in WoW history?" 99% will say Vashj'ir because it was a horrible idea to have an underwater zone. It just doesn't work.
The only game that I have ever played that I even remotely liked underwater content was Assassin's Creed 4. The diving bell quests were something different, but still had more fun doing the ship battles and normal combat.
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Originally posted by Gravarg Trolls have run out of food? I'm surprised someone hasn't started a thread complaining that they have to download the game or go to a store at launch to buy the game disc...really people?
lol I was complaining the other day that my download for the game as going at 6.5MB/s and suddenly stopped for ~18 hours at 2/3 downloaded before I could get the patcher to start again.
Dang, I knew it was coming lol XD But that's different, I can see if your dl stops. That's annoying lol.
Man people really do only see what they want to see. There’s a massive trend in this thread whereby people are obsessing over their hate of underwater combat and using it to justify why they think the OP is wrong / has no point. Stop yammering on about underwater combat; it’s irrelevant to this thread, you're arguing with your own biases and preconceptions.
What the OP is talking about is immersion (you’re too kind.) In the same way that not being able to jump with your character detracts from being immersed in the game world, not being able to dive underwater creates a disconnect between said character and his/her surroundings/environment, and thus makes the game feel more artificial.
This is an issue for me as well however it is not remotely a deal-breaker and I do feel as though some people are blowing the issue out of proportion.
Immersion is one of the most important things I look for in an MMORPG and so I want as much as possible without it detracting from the core game experience, but I do remember reading that the developers opted to pass on creating + implementing any kind of underwater content so that they could focus on other areas of the game; if no underwater content means better features in other areas then I am fine with it, however the importance of the “smaller” features are not lost on me and they all add up along with everything else to paint a final picture.
I just hope that deciding to avoid any kind of underwater development was a way of adding/improving more prominent features as opposed to cutting corners and saving a bit of time/money. Sadly there is no way of knowing for sure.
While I could never say that this would stop me from playing a game... it's definitely something that bothers me. I wouldn't really even think about it that much, but I just spent the weekend on timeless isle in WoW and as a Drood, I spent a good amount of time swimming around the island underwater collecting shit. Found four purples under there! lol. It was cool just to see the sunken ships and whatnot.
Like I said, it wouldn't keep me from buying a game, but I really would prefer it.
Originally posted by nilden The real joke here is that they didn't put in a basic feature like swimming under water and people are praising them for it.
except it's not really a basic feature. I suppose there is a a certain sadness to the idea of the game world "being a world" but LOTRO doesn't allow you to dive and I don't really think anything is taken away from the game "because of that".
Can't swim in Aion at all.
I don't believe Tera has it. I don't remember it in "The Secret World".
Was it in City of Heroes? Or "Champions Online"? I don't recall ever swimming in those games but maybe I'm wrong.
If it was "basic" then wouldn't all games have it?
What would you call it if it's not a basic feature? This is like not being able to jump and people saying yeah F jumping this game is way better because it doesn't have jumping.
Is swimming under water some kind of luxury feature EQ1 was able to bring to the table in 1999 and all these newer games just refuse to go to that lofty high of luxury that is swimming under water? Just because a lot of these games leave something as basic as swimming out doesn't make it any less of a basic feature.
The idea being, if it was a "basic feature' then every game would have it. But since every game doesn't have it it's not really a "basic feature".
EQ had it and Lineage 2 didn't (until later) as I said, lotro never had it and neither does Aion, etc etc. yet all those games have a movement feature, all those games have a chat box feature.
I'm not sure what type of feature it is. Something to do with immersion or situational or some other set of parameters.
The Witcher games don't have swimming and neither do the Dragon Age games. The elder scrolls games do have swimming as does Kingdom of Amular. Fable doesn't have swimming.
It seems that Swimming isn't really included in all solo role play games either.
You guys are using basic to mean different things. Anyway this is irrelevant. What matters is that yes, swimming is a basic gameworld interaction and has been around for a long time. What I find more interesting and would like to point out is that as far as I'm concerned I find all the games that did have swimming to be better than their counterparts. I thought EQ was better than Lineage II, or LOTRO (though I did kind of forgive them since they implemented the pipe smoking and an awesome music playing system that I think more devs should strive to include), or Aion. I also liked Kingdoms of Amalur (despite its many faults) and TES games more than the Witcher and Dragon Age. Is swimming the REASON that I liked these games more? I don't think so, but it certainly helped and the inclusion of it was indicative of the developers intentions for the overall feel of their games (which I was highly in agreement with).
well 'great' but as I've pointed out not every game has had swimming therefore it's not really a feature that one would say "well sure, every game has it." How basic can it be when not every game has it? Not every game has sitting in chairs either and if one wanted to, they could refer to that as a "basic" game world interaction. One that is more rare than swimming it seems.
Baldur's gate and neverwinter nights didn't have it either. and those games are consdidered rpg pillars.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
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Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
It doesn't bother me, the only thing that bothers me is that they don't expand on underwater as an Exploration value, it doesn't need combat, it needs explorable content - think about it - shipwrecks, caves ancient lore architecture, it could be done and also be awesome - swimming under a cliff base just to come up underneath it into an expansive natural enclosure that leads into a sub-terrain culture that eats crystals to survive... Lol, idk. It could be pretty sweet if they thought about it.
But there's still a lot of awesomeness in ESO yet to be. Just keep hoping that things will shape up into a ES online instead of a MMO with an ES skin. There's a lot that I like and a lot that could be but I'm not shuttering the game based on waterplay. Phasing or UI. There's so much just in the lore and skill development. Just hold on man and see what it shapes up to be.
You guys are using basic to mean different things. Anyway this is irrelevant. What matters is that yes, swimming is a basic gameworld interaction and has been around for a long time. What I find more interesting and would like to point out is that as far as I'm concerned I find all the games that did have swimming to be better than their counterparts. I thought EQ was better than Lineage II, or LOTRO (though I did kind of forgive them since they implemented the pipe smoking and an awesome music playing system that I think more devs should strive to include), or Aion. I also liked Kingdoms of Amalur (despite its many faults) and TES games more than the Witcher and Dragon Age. Is swimming the REASON that I liked these games more? I don't think so, but it certainly helped and the inclusion of it was indicative of the developers intentions for the overall feel of their games (which I was highly in agreement with).
well 'great' but as I've pointed out not every game has had swimming therefore it's not really a feature that one would say "well sure, every game has it." How basic can it be when not every game has it? Not every game has sitting in chairs either and if one wanted to, they could refer to that as a "basic" game world interaction. One that is more rare than swimming it seems.
Baldur's gate and neverwinter nights didn't have it either. and those games are consdidered rpg pillars.
The way I'm interpreting it yes I would consider sitting in chairs to be a "basic" interaction as well. One that I also lament the loss of. One thing I want to point out is the reason I choose to play an MMORPG as opposed to a single player RPG is for these types of features. I consider Ni No Kuni to be an RPG masterpiece but I would never be able to play it for as long nor be convinced to pay a subscription for it (even if they expanded it constantly) because it lacks even the most rudimentary gameworld interactions. On the other hand you could convince me to pay a subscription for an ever expanding GTA V or Skyrim (even if there's no other people in it).....DOUBLY so if they had multiplayer gameplay options. My point is a game can be a great game without these features, but I don't see the value in an MMORPG that asks for a subscription without them. At the core of every genre is WHY we play those games and for MMORPG's my reason is that....take it out and I'd rather play a different genre.
This is a joke post. Please people stop posting and replying. OMG don't feed this guys joke. He's completely jerking everyone's chain. hahahah.
I can't believe you guys think that the OP is serious. hahaha. Wow, people will believe anything they read. He's clearly kidding and taking the joke as far as people will allow him to.
Wanna know whats even funnier. People attacking the OP and rabidly defending this game like its their baby. Now THAT is funny.
For me personally a game lacking these features is not gamebreaking, and ESO has many more significant flaws than that. However many people come into an mmo not just for a 'game' experience, but for an immersive virtual world. Skyrim had diving underwater, and several other mmos do too. But I bet you the rabid defenders are gonna say "its not possible in mmos" anyway....
Basically, you don't have to agree with the OP, but to try and belittle him and other posters to make you feel better about "your baby" is just sad.
id like to be able to swim underwater too. it is just one of those little things that help make the game better.
swim underwater. being able to jump. being able to do emote. a button to sell junk items etc. small things sure but every little bit help.
though if you changed the topic heading to 'id love to able to swim underwater' you probably would have avoided rather extreme retaliations. the game has enough flaws as is (hopefully these will get fixed soon and then it goes on to become a great game) so some people can get really sensitive to criticism.
well 'great' but as I've pointed out not every game has had swimming therefore it's not really a feature that one would say "well sure, every game has it." How basic can it be when not every game has it? Not every game has sitting in chairs either and if one wanted to, they could refer to that as a "basic" game world interaction. One that is more rare than swimming it seems.
Baldur's gate and neverwinter nights didn't have it either. and those games are consdidered rpg pillars.
Good point...SWG is largely considered one of the pillars of the MMORPG around these parts, which had far worse water implementation than ESO. It never detracted from that experience for me. Nor does it here in ESO's case. Of course it's a matter of what floats your own personal boat.
---------------------------- Toward the thread:-------------------------
There's a line that's being crossed here and on both sides. I really don't see the point in expressing these extreme views (the hate toward underwater combat, the hate toward ESO for not having it or something more in the water). There's no real value in it. This type of thing is about compromise, that's how it's handled in any studio on the drawing board. If a person can't understand that trade offs are made, something was more important to the core of the game than this or that novelty. There's no real discussion to be had with said person, as they don't understand what a compromise is. Which kills any chance of a rational debate.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Some developers want to sell you a game. Some want to sell you a world. Some want to sell you a story. Some want to sell you activities.
The OP sounds like he wants a 'world' while ESO is a 'game.' Which is legit. However, what is not is assuming that developers that are selling a game are somehow 'doing you wrong' by making a game, and not what you personally want, a world. Feel free to not buy it, your reasons are your own. And their reasons are theirs.
But you are not telling them 'you won't get away with this!' or 'I won't pay for cut corners!' or anything else by not buying. All you are saying is 'I am not your intended audience.' And if their market projections were any good, they already knew that.
Not being able to explore underwater like in EQ2 does spoil the immersion a bit for me. The lack of housing is a real downer too. Maybe this will be added later. One can only hope.
However, it's not a big enough issue to stop me buying and enjoying TESO. I understand the Devs made the decision to concentrate their limited resources on other parts of the game.
In the end you just cannot have the perfect game with everything, for everyone, and some compromises need to be made.
I agree with you. I don't care for the underwater combat part but I do like to explore and some exploration under water would be nice. I'm also a housing fan and would love to see this feature at some point.
But it this isn't stopping me from buying the game. As you say, no game is perfect.
Comments
I think any player that tries to swim in plate, robes, or even in full leather gear should sink to the bottom and drown.
What? You mean they can swim?
That's it, I can't believe the devs would break my immersion so much. I quit.
/s
The idea being, if it was a "basic feature' then every game would have it. But since every game doesn't have it it's not really a "basic feature".
EQ had it and Lineage 2 didn't (until later) as I said, lotro never had it and neither does Aion, etc etc. yet all those games have a movement feature, all those games have a chat box feature.
I'm not sure what type of feature it is. Something to do with immersion or situational or some other set of parameters.
The Witcher games don't have swimming and neither do the Dragon Age games. The elder scrolls games do have swimming as does Kingdom of Amular. Fable doesn't have swimming.
It seems that Swimming isn't really included in all solo role play games either.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
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I would love it if games had it where you wouldn't be able to swim in heavy armor . I have read that it is possible though very tiring to swim in plate armor. I imagine it would be very difficult and the person wearing it would have to be in great shape.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
You guys are using basic to mean different things. Anyway this is irrelevant. What matters is that yes, swimming is a basic gameworld interaction and has been around for a long time. What I find more interesting and would like to point out is that as far as I'm concerned I find all the games that did have swimming to be better than their counterparts. I thought EQ was better than Lineage II, or LOTRO (though I did kind of forgive them since they implemented the pipe smoking and an awesome music playing system that I think more devs should strive to include), or Aion. I also liked Kingdoms of Amalur (despite its many faults) and TES games more than the Witcher and Dragon Age. Is swimming the REASON that I liked these games more? I don't think so, but it certainly helped and the inclusion of it was indicative of the developers intentions for the overall feel of their games (which I was highly in agreement with).
Don't worry, I get your point clearly. Intelligent people are a dying breed. Don't waste your time here.
In DDO you have to take heavy armour off to swim I recall that in the early quests.
Trolls have run out of food? I'm surprised someone hasn't started a thread complaining that they have to download the game or go to a store at launch to buy the game disc...really people?
There has never been a game where I liked underwater content, never. If you ask a WoW player, "What's the worst zone in WoW history?" 99% will say Vashj'ir because it was a horrible idea to have an underwater zone. It just doesn't work.
The only game that I have ever played that I even remotely liked underwater content was Assassin's Creed 4. The diving bell quests were something different, but still had more fun doing the ship battles and normal combat.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Dang, I knew it was coming lol XD But that's different, I can see if your dl stops. That's annoying lol.
Man people really do only see what they want to see. There’s a massive trend in this thread whereby people are obsessing over their hate of underwater combat and using it to justify why they think the OP is wrong / has no point. Stop yammering on about underwater combat; it’s irrelevant to this thread, you're arguing with your own biases and preconceptions.
What the OP is talking about is immersion (you’re too kind.) In the same way that not being able to jump with your character detracts from being immersed in the game world, not being able to dive underwater creates a disconnect between said character and his/her surroundings/environment, and thus makes the game feel more artificial.
This is an issue for me as well however it is not remotely a deal-breaker and I do feel as though some people are blowing the issue out of proportion.
Immersion is one of the most important things I look for in an MMORPG and so I want as much as possible without it detracting from the core game experience, but I do remember reading that the developers opted to pass on creating + implementing any kind of underwater content so that they could focus on other areas of the game; if no underwater content means better features in other areas then I am fine with it, however the importance of the “smaller” features are not lost on me and they all add up along with everything else to paint a final picture.
I just hope that deciding to avoid any kind of underwater development was a way of adding/improving more prominent features as opposed to cutting corners and saving a bit of time/money. Sadly there is no way of knowing for sure.While I could never say that this would stop me from playing a game... it's definitely something that bothers me. I wouldn't really even think about it that much, but I just spent the weekend on timeless isle in WoW and as a Drood, I spent a good amount of time swimming around the island underwater collecting shit. Found four purples under there! lol. It was cool just to see the sunken ships and whatnot.
Like I said, it wouldn't keep me from buying a game, but I really would prefer it.
well 'great' but as I've pointed out not every game has had swimming therefore it's not really a feature that one would say "well sure, every game has it." How basic can it be when not every game has it? Not every game has sitting in chairs either and if one wanted to, they could refer to that as a "basic" game world interaction. One that is more rare than swimming it seems.
Baldur's gate and neverwinter nights didn't have it either. and those games are consdidered rpg pillars.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
It doesn't bother me, the only thing that bothers me is that they don't expand on underwater as an Exploration value, it doesn't need combat, it needs explorable content - think about it - shipwrecks, caves ancient lore architecture, it could be done and also be awesome - swimming under a cliff base just to come up underneath it into an expansive natural enclosure that leads into a sub-terrain culture that eats crystals to survive... Lol, idk. It could be pretty sweet if they thought about it.
But there's still a lot of awesomeness in ESO yet to be. Just keep hoping that things will shape up into a ES online instead of a MMO with an ES skin. There's a lot that I like and a lot that could be but I'm not shuttering the game based on waterplay. Phasing or UI. There's so much just in the lore and skill development. Just hold on man and see what it shapes up to be.
The way I'm interpreting it yes I would consider sitting in chairs to be a "basic" interaction as well. One that I also lament the loss of. One thing I want to point out is the reason I choose to play an MMORPG as opposed to a single player RPG is for these types of features. I consider Ni No Kuni to be an RPG masterpiece but I would never be able to play it for as long nor be convinced to pay a subscription for it (even if they expanded it constantly) because it lacks even the most rudimentary gameworld interactions. On the other hand you could convince me to pay a subscription for an ever expanding GTA V or Skyrim (even if there's no other people in it).....DOUBLY so if they had multiplayer gameplay options. My point is a game can be a great game without these features, but I don't see the value in an MMORPG that asks for a subscription without them. At the core of every genre is WHY we play those games and for MMORPG's my reason is that....take it out and I'd rather play a different genre.
Wanna know whats even funnier. People attacking the OP and rabidly defending this game like its their baby. Now THAT is funny.
For me personally a game lacking these features is not gamebreaking, and ESO has many more significant flaws than that. However many people come into an mmo not just for a 'game' experience, but for an immersive virtual world. Skyrim had diving underwater, and several other mmos do too. But I bet you the rabid defenders are gonna say "its not possible in mmos" anyway....
Basically, you don't have to agree with the OP, but to try and belittle him and other posters to make you feel better about "your baby" is just sad.
MMOs Played: FFXI,Age of Conan, Aion, Rift, SWTOR, TERA, TSW, GW2
Playing:None
Waiting For: Wildstar, The Repopulation, Archeage, TESO, Warhammer 40K:EC, EQN
id like to be able to swim underwater too. it is just one of those little things that help make the game better.
swim underwater. being able to jump. being able to do emote. a button to sell junk items etc. small things sure but every little bit help.
though if you changed the topic heading to 'id love to able to swim underwater' you probably would have avoided rather extreme retaliations. the game has enough flaws as is (hopefully these will get fixed soon and then it goes on to become a great game) so some people can get really sensitive to criticism.
Good point...SWG is largely considered one of the pillars of the MMORPG around these parts, which had far worse water implementation than ESO. It never detracted from that experience for me. Nor does it here in ESO's case. Of course it's a matter of what floats your own personal boat.
---------------------------- Toward the thread:-------------------------
There's a line that's being crossed here and on both sides. I really don't see the point in expressing these extreme views (the hate toward underwater combat, the hate toward ESO for not having it or something more in the water). There's no real value in it. This type of thing is about compromise, that's how it's handled in any studio on the drawing board. If a person can't understand that trade offs are made, something was more important to the core of the game than this or that novelty. There's no real discussion to be had with said person, as they don't understand what a compromise is. Which kills any chance of a rational debate.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
It's just a different expectation.
Some developers want to sell you a game. Some want to sell you a world. Some want to sell you a story. Some want to sell you activities.
The OP sounds like he wants a 'world' while ESO is a 'game.' Which is legit. However, what is not is assuming that developers that are selling a game are somehow 'doing you wrong' by making a game, and not what you personally want, a world. Feel free to not buy it, your reasons are your own. And their reasons are theirs.
But you are not telling them 'you won't get away with this!' or 'I won't pay for cut corners!' or anything else by not buying. All you are saying is 'I am not your intended audience.' And if their market projections were any good, they already knew that.
Good luck finding your world, OP.
I say that everyday I come to this site and read a new post.
And today is no different.
I agree with you. I don't care for the underwater combat part but I do like to explore and some exploration under water would be nice. I'm also a housing fan and would love to see this feature at some point.
But it this isn't stopping me from buying the game. As you say, no game is perfect.