Its times like these that I feel inclined to quote that font of all knowledge: Homer Simpson
"If its too hard its not worth doing"
/sarcasmOff
Playing: Darkfall New Dawn (and planning to play Fallout 76) Favourite games have included: UO, Lineage2, Darkfall, Lotro, Baldur's Gate, SSX, FF7 and yes the original Wizardry on an Apple IIe
1. You complain that inventory in TESO is immersion breaking yet you praise GW2... How exactly running around with a few tons of junk on your back is immersive? Not saying that TESO is good here but then GW2 is simply far worse and in fact far more immersion breaking I'd say.
My suggestion would be to bring old backpack behaviour known from other TES games - that would include also slowdowns and immobilise effect. Granted it also has no inventory slot limits like in GW2 but it has other mechanics in place to cover for it.
2. You must be more often dead than alive in game. Or you simply have nothing to complain about.
3. Who cares really? In Pve there are enough wayshrines everywhere it seems. In RvR eventually mostly pugs will use it. More organised groups will use it only occasionally or they will anyway prefer old tactics called "respawn, regroup, run together".
Seriously again the game has currently far more real issues than what you say.
1. I never "praised" GW2 but simply pointed out you have vastly more inventory space for crafting items than you do in ESO, where you have nothing other than your regular inventory space to store stuff.
Being out in the field exploring, finding quests and killing stuff is why I play MMOs. If I have to stop what i am doing constantly to go empty my bags how is that NOT immersion breaking? It is a direct interference with my game play every bit as annoying as an unwanted phone call or other emergency that distracts me from my play. Not having to deal with inventory means I can stay out in the field doing what I like, rather than having to run back and sort through a bunch of crap every hour or two.
2. An unnecessarily snide comment.
3. I care, because I don't like wasting my precious time on stuff that is neither fun or necessary.
The existence of other problems in the game doesn't negate mine.
Your comparing apples to oranges. GW2 gave you tons of free bank space where you can deposit crafting mats and gathered materials. There is no comparison whatsoever with this game where those items have to share limited inventory space. It was easy and cheap to craft or buy bags in GW2 to increase inventory space, and there were vendors everywhere you could sell junk items to. Inventory space is extremely expensive in ESO and gets more expensive with each upgrade. By the time I got to level 17 I only had enough money to buy two personal upgrades and 1 bank upgrade, or 30 slots total. This was despite farming the hell out of mobs due to broken quests keeping me from moving on in the game.
As I mentioned crafting supplies could be sent back to your bank from everywhere. Finally, you could make your own personal bank guilds for additional space. You could enter WvW from anywhere and use the crafting stations in your home base, then go right back to where you left off in PVE by relogging.There simply is no comparing these two games and how they handle inventory.
Repair costs are NOT negligible, even if you don't die. I farmed a boss at level 15 with a group of players while honing my bow skills and didn't get hit once. At then end of an hour I had a 450 g repair bill, at a time when I had just 2000g to my name (having spent the rest on overpriced bag upgrades). That is exorbitant.
Soul gems are expensive, and get even more pricey as you gain in level. Gems you bought earlier then become obsolete.They add nothing to the game but cost. You need them to rez others and recharge your weapons and you will never find enough to meet that need.
I never claimed these mechanics were not similar to other MMOs, instead I criticized them for that very reason and the fact they are even more regressive than many other games including the ones you mentioned.
I'm not. All three games mentioned have both pack and bank space for general use. GW2 does mix it up by having a crafting bank with an initial limit of 250 with the overflow having to go to general space. This can be upgraded to 1000 units through cash purchase. That does not diminish the fact that GW2 general bank space was exceedingly restrictive when you count crafting overflow, repair kits, boosters, event items, siege plans, etc... 30 slots was design to railroad players into a monetary purchase. Even with no crafting bank slots I find ESO starting out much less restrictive bank wise.
Now ESO also offsets this with space GW2 does not have (pack mounts up to 50 slots). The strictly GW2 mentioned mechanics are hardly mainstream... So expecting them in ESO is presumptive. I already provided the general numbers showing ESO gives significantly more general space at start and comparable space at end game.
It sounds like the problem is your play style not game mechanics. Farming bosses sounds like you are trying to grind in this game which has already been indicated to be very inefficient. Trying to power your way through will leave you deficient in funds and heavily dependent on high cost resources. I have found none of the issues you have experienced. I take the time to run back/fast travel to a merchant. My gold generation has comfortably exceeded my costs (repair, soul gems, crafting purchases).
Adapt to the game or move to something you are more comfortable with, the choice is yours, but I don't expect significant changes to the systems you are complaining about.
Another "adapt to the game" post. Thanks, I'll pass.
To op imo you have got it wrong ,,,think about it for a second ,no think about it for as long as it takes ,people just want everything now ,in mmos they need saved from what they want it seems .Cut a long story short
1 Inventory space , imagine its unlimited you would be swamped by mats for a start ,a limit means you will be able to trade /sell /buy stuff from others excatly what mmos need more of interaction.
2 We need some form of death penalty money drain or xp drain seem to be where its at with mmos(not fussed on armour wear during fights thow) you can get enchants for it if u give up some stats,,choices choices is what its all about.
3/ Soul gems ,it rains the things my bags are full of them ,such a good resource imo ,(top tip mini bosses /dungeons) keeping all your buffs ressing etc is for the people who want an extra edge you dont need lots if you dont want to be that guy,
I think people now including developers just dont realise restrictions are what make choices meaningful and its ruinging a lot of games and they dont even realise it .Think tht first wow mount .Think that first epic after months of play.Think needing to track down tht imba crafter.Think getting that first 100 gold .Think Leafblower ,thunderfury ,warglaive,we need the shit stuff to be shit so as the good stuff smells so good.
Most of the complaints I have seen about this game are valid, but I am nonetheless having at least some fun with it and would consider buying were it not for the unnecessary and frustrating anti-fun and poorly thought-out crap that hamstrings game play in this MMO.
The following is a list of things that are easily correctable and which I feel would improve game play immensely.
1. INVENTORY: Inventory management is a major anti-fun nightmare in this game. You simply have nowhere near the amount of slots you need to hold all the thousands of items you find, and there is nothing more immersion and fun-killing than running out of bag space and having to return to town to find some way of storing or getting rid of all these items. Even in the Beta where you can just chuck most items because my character is going to be deleted inventory hassles are appalling. With your real toon in the real game where you have to make serious decisions about this stuff I can see it really killing game play and forcing people to quit the game, just as myself and other players I know quit Fallen Earth for the same reason. Lack of adequate inventory space can completely cripple a game.
My suggestion is to give us unlimited inventory, at least in the bank space if not character space. Guild Wars 2 had it right when they gave the player tons of free space with which to store crafting mats and allowed you to send items to your crafting items bank from anywhere in the game. No need to keep disrupting game play and fun with this tedious crap.
I will fight tooth and nail against this one. You speak to immersion and the ability to hold unlimited amount of things? I'm not going to explain the logical fallacy here. The inventory is NOT a burden. Your hoarding probably is. Hey..I hoard too but I adapt. I figure out what I really want and need and break down/give away/sell/or destroy the rest.
2. REPAIR COSTS: Repair costs are absolutely exorbitant in this game, and you take damage to your gear even if you don't die, which amounts to a continual Combat Tax that accrues so long as you are fighting stuff. Taxes in games are as fun as taxes in real life: zero. But at least in real life you get roads and schools and stuff for your money which softens the pain. Here you get nothing but another mindless anti-fun mechanic which serves to force you out of exploring and having fun and running back to town to get repairs or carry overpriced repair kits.
Get rid of repair costs and death penalties. They serve no purpose.
You claim to champion for immersion but don't consider that it would actually cost you money to take your damaged armor to a skilled laborer. And it really is not that much. Guild Wars 2 on the other hand...well, it also wasn't that much but trying to earn gold in that game was a slow crawl making each little repair dreadful. This game, I think I die a moderate amount..pretty average gamer here. I spend maybe 200 gold in repairs for every 1,000 gold earned. That's 800 gold exposable coin.
3. SOUL GEMS: Yet another boring, frustrating make-work mechanic. Soul gems are expensive, hard-to-find and another boring grind to have to fill. Worse, you only have 5 ability slots (way too few) and one of them has to be occupied by a soul-gem ability so you can fill the gems. It adds nothing to my game play to have to find and fill these things other than frustration, and it is a real impediment to cooperative game play when I can't rez people in the field or in RvR because I can't afford to.
Either get rid of this useless and unfun mechanic or at least allow us to rez people without having to use gems.
I agree here for the soul-gems rezzing portion to a point. Mostly because of PvP. Heck, the whole sudden death mechanic feels dated compared to Guild War's 2 downed state (something [I feel] that game did brilliantly well). In PvP it is very unlikly people will even bother rezzing you. By Talos, even in PvE your rotting coprse will get past over most of the time....
..but then...
..Every once in awhile someone will stop and use their soul gem on you. Now...isn't that really meaningful? Isn't there something more deeply appreciating when someone uses their resource to rez a perfect stranger in contrast to what Guild Wars 2 does?
Irregardless of whether a particular player likes inventory management or other boring make-work hassles or feels they are necessary, I doubt there is a single player out there who will quit the game in frustration because you gave them unlimited inventory. There are plenty of people out there who will quit games over issues like this because we feel they cripple game play and kill the fun in the game. As I mentioned I quit Fallen Earth over its horrible inventory system and know others who did the same. I can sadly see myself quitting this game for the same reason.
I would strongly consider quitting the game. Look at Guild Wars 2 economy. It is a mess because people can accumulate without abandon making resources plentiful driving prices AND demand down. Bad economy makes a game very unfun for someone like me. It's not the end all be all...but it certainly is not fun sicne I tend to enjoy crafting and feeling rewarded for the time devoted whatever specialization I go for. The Elder Scrolls is doing this for me. It's like EvE Online but not as complex but complicated just enough to make it interesting and feel Elder Scroll-sy.
I don't know why developers insist on hamstringing their games with tedious and anti-fun crap like this. I suspect it is much like the Army, where we used to say that "there is the right way, the wrong way and the Army way" which meant decisions were rarely made on the basis of whether they were wise or stupid, but simply because that is the way things are done. Inventory management, repair costs, waypoint fees and other frustrations are thrown into MMO games thoughtlessly not because they are right or wrong for the game, but because that's what every other MMO does. This monkey see, monkey do copycat nonsense is why so many MMOs are just stale, carbon-copies of everything that has come before with nothing new, interesting or innovative.
Please think about whether these things add to the game or take way from it. This game has a lot of potential to be fun. Removing the anti-fun shackles will help this game run free and fun as it should be.
There are a LOT of issues with this game. Some of them are down to its very core that I am uncertain can ever be changed. Phasing. Quest bugs. Locked content....I'm sorry...but the inability to swim underwater bothered me a heck of a lot more than any of your points.
3. SOUL GEMS: Yet another boring, frustrating make-work mechanic. Soul gems are expensive, hard-to-find and another boring grind to have to fill. Worse, you only have 5 ability slots (way too few) and one of them has to be occupied by a soul-gem ability so you can fill the gems. It adds nothing to my game play to have to find and fill these things other than frustration, and it is a real impediment to cooperative game play when I can't rez people in the field or in RvR because I can't afford to.
Just to correct you, once you progress further into the game you get the passive ability to fill Soul Gems, making it something you don't even think about other than acquiring empty ones for crafting.
Another "adapt to the game" post. Thanks, I'll pass.
We all adapt to every game we play, games aren't made for any one specific consumer.
Of course not. But the purpose of this overused meme is to negate the right of consumers to complain about aspects of the game they don't like, and that's BS. The reason so many MMOs nowadays suck and are tired, repetitive copies of everything that has come before is this mentality that players just need to adapt to suckage, rather than game developers come up with something that is new, innovative and makes sense rather than throwing a repair bill or inventory hassles at you because everyone else does it.
Sorry OP, it seems you are comparing things to another mmorpg. Try playing a game a bit different for once and think old school. We bitch at how WoW progressed and it's switch from hardcore vanilla to carebear MoP, then when something tough comes along we complain.
Things should be harder and more challenging! Please don't start the ball rolling the wrong way!
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
Most of the complaints I have seen about this game are valid, but I am nonetheless having at least some fun with it and would consider buying were it not for the unnecessary and frustrating anti-fun and poorly thought-out crap that hamstrings game play in this MMO.
The following is a list of things that are easily correctable and which I feel would improve game play immensely.
1. INVENTORY: Inventory management is a major anti-fun nightmare in this game. You simply have nowhere near the amount of slots you need to hold all the thousands of items you find, and there is nothing more immersion and fun-killing than running out of bag space and having to return to town to find some way of storing or getting rid of all these items. Even in the Beta where you can just chuck most items because my character is going to be deleted inventory hassles are appalling. With your real toon in the real game where you have to make serious decisions about this stuff I can see it really killing game play and forcing people to quit the game, just as myself and other players I know quit Fallen Earth for the same reason. Lack of adequate inventory space can completely cripple a game.
My suggestion is to give us unlimited inventory, at least in the bank space if not character space. Guild Wars 2 had it right when they gave the player tons of free space with which to store crafting mats and allowed you to send items to your crafting items bank from anywhere in the game. No need to keep disrupting game play and fun with this tedious crap.
2. REPAIR COSTS: Repair costs are absolutely exorbitant in this game, and you take damage to your gear even if you don't die, which amounts to a continual Combat Tax that accrues so long as you are fighting stuff. Taxes in games are as fun as taxes in real life: zero. But at least in real life you get roads and schools and stuff for your money which softens the pain. Here you get nothing but another mindless anti-fun mechanic which serves to force you out of exploring and having fun and running back to town to get repairs or carry overpriced repair kits.
Get rid of repair costs and death penalties. They serve no purpose.
3. SOUL GEMS: Yet another boring, frustrating make-work mechanic. Soul gems are expensive, hard-to-find and another boring grind to have to fill. Worse, you only have 5 ability slots (way too few) and one of them has to be occupied by a soul-gem ability so you can fill the gems. It adds nothing to my game play to have to find and fill these things other than frustration, and it is a real impediment to cooperative game play when I can't rez people in the field or in RvR because I can't afford to.
Either get rid of this useless and unfun mechanic or at least allow us to rez people without having to use gems.
Irregardless of whether a particular player likes inventory management or other boring make-work hassles or feels they are necessary, I doubt there is a single player out there who will quit the game in frustration because you gave them unlimited inventory. There are plenty of people out there who will quit games over issues like this because we feel they cripple game play and kill the fun in the game. As I mentioned I quit Fallen Earth over its horrible inventory system and know others who did the same. I can sadly see myself quitting this game for the same reason.
I don't know why developers insist on hamstringing their games with tedious and anti-fun crap like this. I suspect it is much like the Army, where we used to say that "there is the right way, the wrong way and the Army way" which meant decisions were rarely made on the basis of whether they were wise or stupid, but simply because that is the way things are done. Inventory management, repair costs, waypoint fees and other frustrations are thrown into MMO games thoughtlessly not because they are right or wrong for the game, but because that's what every other MMO does. This monkey see, monkey do copycat nonsense is why so many MMOs are just stale, carbon-copies of everything that has come before with nothing new, interesting or innovative.
Please think about whether these things add to the game or take way from it. This game has a lot of potential to be fun. Removing the anti-fun shackles will help this game run free and fun as it should be.
1. Your idea of unlimited bag space isn't "immersion breaking"? Oh, everyone gets a Bag of Plenty or Null space to start just screams deep immersion to me. Now, list the game(s) that have no inventory limits?
2. Repair costs are absolutely fine. I've gotten more than enough cash in the betas to take care of repairs and still have thousands of gold. Stop complaining to complain.
3. You obviously have never played an ES game. Soul gems are an important part of the game. If you don't understand that, sorry but its working fine.
3.a. 5 abilities is better than having 5 or 6 tool bars full of crap skills with more than 90% being used in only specific circumstances.
It is very obvious to me that you have an agenda. Don't want to play ESO? Fine. There are plenty of other games out there that have unlimited bag space, no costs or very low costs for gear repairs, no soul gems and tons of useless abilities to pack multiple tool bars with.
Most of the complaints I have seen about this game are valid, but I am nonetheless having at least some fun with it and would consider buying were it not for the unnecessary and frustrating anti-fun and poorly thought-out crap that hamstrings game play in this MMO.
The following is a list of things that are easily correctable and which I feel would improve game play immensely.
1. INVENTORY: Inventory management is a major anti-fun nightmare in this game. You simply have nowhere near the amount of slots you need to hold all the thousands of items you find, and there is nothing more immersion and fun-killing than running out of bag space and having to return to town to find some way of storing or getting rid of all these items. Even in the Beta where you can just chuck most items because my character is going to be deleted inventory hassles are appalling. With your real toon in the real game where you have to make serious decisions about this stuff I can see it really killing game play and forcing people to quit the game, just as myself and other players I know quit Fallen Earth for the same reason. Lack of adequate inventory space can completely cripple a game.
My suggestion is to give us unlimited inventory, at least in the bank space if not character space. Guild Wars 2 had it right when they gave the player tons of free space with which to store crafting mats and allowed you to send items to your crafting items bank from anywhere in the game. No need to keep disrupting game play and fun with this tedious crap.
I will fight tooth and nail against this one. You speak to immersion and the ability to hold unlimited amount of things? I'm not going to explain the logical fallacy here. The inventory is NOT a burden. Your hoarding probably is. Hey..I hoard too but I adapt. I figure out what I really want and need and break down/give away/sell/or destroy the rest.
2. REPAIR COSTS: Repair costs are absolutely exorbitant in this game, and you take damage to your gear even if you don't die, which amounts to a continual Combat Tax that accrues so long as you are fighting stuff. Taxes in games are as fun as taxes in real life: zero. But at least in real life you get roads and schools and stuff for your money which softens the pain. Here you get nothing but another mindless anti-fun mechanic which serves to force you out of exploring and having fun and running back to town to get repairs or carry overpriced repair kits.
Get rid of repair costs and death penalties. They serve no purpose.
You claim to champion for immersion but don't consider that it would actually cost you money to take your damaged armor to a skilled laborer. And it really is not that much. Guild Wars 2 on the other hand...well, it also wasn't that much but trying to earn gold in that game was a slow crawl making each little repair dreadful. This game, I think I die a moderate amount..pretty average gamer here. I spend maybe 200 gold in repairs for every 1,000 gold earned. That's 800 gold exposable coin.
3. SOUL GEMS: Yet another boring, frustrating make-work mechanic. Soul gems are expensive, hard-to-find and another boring grind to have to fill. Worse, you only have 5 ability slots (way too few) and one of them has to be occupied by a soul-gem ability so you can fill the gems. It adds nothing to my game play to have to find and fill these things other than frustration, and it is a real impediment to cooperative game play when I can't rez people in the field or in RvR because I can't afford to.
Either get rid of this useless and unfun mechanic or at least allow us to rez people without having to use gems.
I agree here for the soul-gems rezzing portion to a point. Mostly because of PvP. Heck, the whole sudden death mechanic feels dated compared to Guild War's 2 downed state (something [I feel] that game did brilliantly well). In PvP it is very unlikly people will even bother rezzing you. By Talos, even in PvE your rotting coprse will get past over most of the time....
..but then...
..Every once in awhile someone will stop and use their soul gem on you. Now...isn't that really meaningful? Isn't there something more deeply appreciating when someone uses their resource to rez a perfect stranger in contrast to what Guild Wars 2 does?
Irregardless of whether a particular player likes inventory management or other boring make-work hassles or feels they are necessary, I doubt there is a single player out there who will quit the game in frustration because you gave them unlimited inventory. There are plenty of people out there who will quit games over issues like this because we feel they cripple game play and kill the fun in the game. As I mentioned I quit Fallen Earth over its horrible inventory system and know others who did the same. I can sadly see myself quitting this game for the same reason.
I would strongly consider quitting the game. Look at Guild Wars 2 economy. It is a mess because people can accumulate without abandon making resources plentiful driving prices AND demand down. Bad economy makes a game very unfun for someone like me. It's not the end all be all...but it certainly is not fun sicne I tend to enjoy crafting and feeling rewarded for the time devoted whatever specialization I go for. The Elder Scrolls is doing this for me. It's like EvE Online but not as complex but complicated just enough to make it interesting and feel Elder Scroll-sy.
I don't know why developers insist on hamstringing their games with tedious and anti-fun crap like this. I suspect it is much like the Army, where we used to say that "there is the right way, the wrong way and the Army way" which meant decisions were rarely made on the basis of whether they were wise or stupid, but simply because that is the way things are done. Inventory management, repair costs, waypoint fees and other frustrations are thrown into MMO games thoughtlessly not because they are right or wrong for the game, but because that's what every other MMO does. This monkey see, monkey do copycat nonsense is why so many MMOs are just stale, carbon-copies of everything that has come before with nothing new, interesting or innovative.
Please think about whether these things add to the game or take way from it. This game has a lot of potential to be fun. Removing the anti-fun shackles will help this game run free and fun as it should be.
There are a LOT of issues with this game. Some of them are down to its very core that I am uncertain can ever be changed. Phasing. Quest bugs. Locked content....I'm sorry...but the inability to swim underwater bothered me a heck of a lot more than any of your points.
You "adapt" by vendoring stuff or throwing it away, which is precisely the problem I am complaining about. If you have to get rid of stuff you'd rather keep. have to keep returning to town to empty your bags or otherwise have to continually hassle with inventory you do not have adequate inventory space.
How is it a "logical fallacy" to point out that this kills the fun for me in the game? If adequate inventory space weren't important for most players then f2p developers wouldn't be able to make money selling extra slots as a major means of generating cash.
Did you quit GW2 because of having too much inventory space? If so you have little grounds to chastise me for not focusing on issues in ESO you feel are more worthy of complaint. I enjoy being able to craft everything for my toons myself and would like to be able to do so in this game as well, but that seems it will be impossible. Without an AH exchanging goods between players is going to be really difficult and tiresome, and I expect to see people spamming the hell out of chat trying to sell stuff. You'll wish everyone could just craft their own stuff and get the hell out of your face when that happens.
Another "adapt to the game" post. Thanks, I'll pass.
We all adapt to every game we play, games aren't made for any one specific consumer.
Of course not. But the purpose of this overused meme is to negate the right of consumers to complain about aspects of the game they don't like, and that's BS. The reason so many MMOs nowadays suck and are tired, repetitive copies of everything that has come before is this mentality that players just need to adapt to suckage, rather than game developers come up with something that is new, innovative and makes sense rather than throwing a repair bill or inventory hassles at you because everyone else does it.
YOu don't see the cause and effect in this though, not to mention the slight irony in saying it here in this thread? You don't like the way ESO has this or that incorporated, you want it to be more like x or o. Because you liked it in Y or Z. It's this that causes that stagnation you're complaining about. ESO has it's own systems, it should remain that way. There's nothing wrong with just passing on it.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Although I don't use the word, it is in a well known dictionary. I'm not sure why everyone is having so much trouble with the word, and you would consider it LOL. /shrug
I"ll look at it from a TES point of view. The bag space is really a lot if you compare it to other TES games. Just leaving Helgen in Skyrim, you could be overweight lol. I actually like the limited bag space, it makes you either go sell/decontruct a bunch or pick and choose what you want to loot. I really don't like how MMOs these days are all about killing this monster that drops 10 things, I'm just going to take it all. It's unrealistic.
The repairs aren't too bad. i think they're a little high (maybe a 10% reduction is needed), but it's not going to make you broke, unless you die a bunch.
The soul gem idea I really like. You can use soul gems to recharge your enchants or to resurrect players and yourself. There are actually vendors that sell the soul gems, full or empty. The empty ones are extremely cheap, you can fill them up with the Soul Trap ability (I think that's the name lol). This ability also does a fairly good DoT on the mob as well I actually always have more soul gems than I need.
There are a LOT of issues with this game. Some of them are down to its very core that I am uncertain can ever be changed. Phasing. Quest bugs. Locked content....I'm sorry...but the inability to swim underwater bothered me a heck of a lot more than any of your points.
You "adapt" by vendoring stuff or throwing it away, which is precisely the problem I am complaining about. If you have to get rid of stuff you'd rather keep. have to keep returning to town to empty your bags or otherwise have to continually hassle with inventory you do not have adequate inventory space.
How is it a "logical fallacy" to point out that this kills the fun for me in the game? If adequate inventory space weren't important for most players then f2p developers wouldn't be able to make money selling extra slots as a major means of generating cash.
Did you quit GW2 because of having too much inventory space? If so you have little grounds to chastise me for not focusing on issues in ESO you feel are more worthy of complaint. I enjoy being able to craft everything for my toons myself and would like to be able to do so in this game as well, but that seems it will be impossible. Without an AH exchanging goods between players is going to be really difficult and tiresome, and I expect to see people spamming the hell out of chat trying to sell stuff. You'll wish everyone could just craft their own stuff and get the hell out of your face when that happens.
Your first paragraph is exactly what you have to do in the ES games, but instead of bag space you are working with weight. Either way, it is much more immersive to have to go into town and sell/empty your inventory.
edit: snip
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
Sorry OP, it seems you are comparing things to another mmorpg. Try playing a game a bit different for once and think old school. We bitch at how WoW progressed and it's switch from hardcore vanilla to carebear MoP, then when something tough comes along we complain.
Things should be harder and more challenging! Please don't start the ball rolling the wrong way!
Managing inventory is not "challenging" in any meaningful or fun way. Any game that substitutes tedious make-work tasks for genuinely fun and challenging content isn't going to go very far. If you want that kind of game Star Trek Online blows away all competitors: lots of tedious make-work and grinding, little to do that is fun or truly challenging.
If I thought managing inventory was fun why would I pay someone for the dubious pleasure of having to sort through tons of crap when I could get a job at my local warehouse club where they will pay me to do this and I get to drive the forklift and talk to female co-workers. I'm not even being facetious here. Which is a more productive and fun use of my time? I work at home and use MMOs to escape the stress of work, yet there are some out there that are so tedious and grindy I have found myself going back to my work to escape the stress of playing them, because they are more like a job than my job is. The crap inventory system in this game heads dangerously in that direction.
I"ll look at it from a TES point of view. The bag space is really a lot if you compare it to other TES games. Just leaving Helgen in Skyrim, you could be overweight lol. I actually like the limited bag space, it makes you either go sell/decontruct a bunch or pick and choose what you want to loot. I really don't like how MMOs these days are all about killing this monster that drops 10 things, I'm just going to take it all. It's unrealistic.
The repairs aren't too bad. i think they're a little high (maybe a 10% reduction is needed), but it's not going to make you broke, unless you die a bunch.
The soul gem idea I really like. You can use soul gems to recharge your enchants or to resurrect players and yourself. There are actually vendors that sell the soul gems, full or empty. The empty ones are extremely cheap, you can fill them up with the Soul Trap ability (I think that's the name lol). This ability also does a fairly good DoT on the mob as well I actually always have more soul gems than I need.
(red) What it is is diablo and I hate me some diablo .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
There are a LOT of issues with this game. Some of them are down to its very core that I am uncertain can ever be changed. Phasing. Quest bugs. Locked content....I'm sorry...but the inability to swim underwater bothered me a heck of a lot more than any of your points.
You "adapt" by vendoring stuff or throwing it away, which is precisely the problem I am complaining about. If you have to get rid of stuff you'd rather keep. have to keep returning to town to empty your bags or otherwise have to continually hassle with inventory you do not have adequate inventory space.
How is it a "logical fallacy" to point out that this kills the fun for me in the game? If adequate inventory space weren't important for most players then f2p developers wouldn't be able to make money selling extra slots as a major means of generating cash.
Did you quit GW2 because of having too much inventory space? If so you have little grounds to chastise me for not focusing on issues in ESO you feel are more worthy of complaint. I enjoy being able to craft everything for my toons myself and would like to be able to do so in this game as well, but that seems it will be impossible. Without an AH exchanging goods between players is going to be really difficult and tiresome, and I expect to see people spamming the hell out of chat trying to sell stuff. You'll wish everyone could just craft their own stuff and get the hell out of your face when that happens.
Your first paragraph is exactly what you have to do in the ES games, but instead of bag space you are working with weight. Either way, it is much more immersive to have to go into town and sell/empty your inventory.
edit: snip
No, it is more immersive to stay immersed in whatever fun thing you are doing than to constantly have to stop what you are doing and run back to town and empty your bags. This is as much fun as having your mom interrupt your game play to send you to the store for some milk...only having her do it every one to two hours.
The first thing I do in an ES game is look for the inventory cheats online that liberate my game play from this hassle. You never had to wait more than a week from release to find one, they were that in demand.
If they ever gave the ability to choose unlimited inventory or a more "immersive" restricted version at the start of your toon's career statistics would show most people opting for the former over the latter.
Sorry OP, it seems you are comparing things to another mmorpg. Try playing a game a bit different for once and think old school. We bitch at how WoW progressed and it's switch from hardcore vanilla to carebear MoP, then when something tough comes along we complain.
Things should be harder and more challenging! Please don't start the ball rolling the wrong way!
Managing inventory is not "challenging" in any meaningful or fun way. Any game that substitutes tedious make-work tasks for genuinely fun and challenging content isn't going to go very far. If you want that kind of game Star Trek Online blows away all competitors: lots of tedious make-work and grinding, little to do that is fun or truly challenging.
If I thought managing inventory was fun why would I pay someone for the dubious pleasure of having to sort through tons of crap when I could get a job at my local warehouse club where they will pay me to do this and I get to drive the forklift and talk to female co-workers. I'm not even being facetious here. Which is a more productive and fun use of my time? I work at home and use MMOs to escape the stress of work, yet there are some out there that are so tedious and grindy I have found myself going back to my work to escape the stress of playing them, because they are more like a job than my job is. The crap inventory system in this game heads dangerously in that direction.
It's basically the same system as in Oblivion and Skyrim and they did fairly well!
edit: I think what the developers are trying to do is stay within some of the same boundaries set by the ES games. If you didn't like Morrowind, Oblivion, or Skyrim, you probably won't like this and should find something else.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
Comments
Its times like these that I feel inclined to quote that font of all knowledge: Homer Simpson
"If its too hard its not worth doing"
/sarcasmOff
Playing: Darkfall New Dawn (and planning to play Fallout 76)
Favourite games have included: UO, Lineage2, Darkfall, Lotro, Baldur's Gate, SSX, FF7 and yes the original Wizardry on an Apple IIe
1. I never "praised" GW2 but simply pointed out you have vastly more inventory space for crafting items than you do in ESO, where you have nothing other than your regular inventory space to store stuff.
Being out in the field exploring, finding quests and killing stuff is why I play MMOs. If I have to stop what i am doing constantly to go empty my bags how is that NOT immersion breaking? It is a direct interference with my game play every bit as annoying as an unwanted phone call or other emergency that distracts me from my play. Not having to deal with inventory means I can stay out in the field doing what I like, rather than having to run back and sort through a bunch of crap every hour or two.
2. An unnecessarily snide comment.
3. I care, because I don't like wasting my precious time on stuff that is neither fun or necessary.
The existence of other problems in the game doesn't negate mine.
Another "adapt to the game" post. Thanks, I'll pass.
To op imo you have got it wrong ,,,think about it for a second ,no think about it for as long as it takes ,people just want everything now ,in mmos they need saved from what they want it seems .Cut a long story short
1 Inventory space , imagine its unlimited you would be swamped by mats for a start ,a limit means you will be able to trade /sell /buy stuff from others excatly what mmos need more of interaction.
2 We need some form of death penalty money drain or xp drain seem to be where its at with mmos(not fussed on armour wear during fights thow) you can get enchants for it if u give up some stats,,choices choices is what its all about.
3/ Soul gems ,it rains the things my bags are full of them ,such a good resource imo ,(top tip mini bosses /dungeons) keeping all your buffs ressing etc is for the people who want an extra edge you dont need lots if you dont want to be that guy,
I think people now including developers just dont realise restrictions are what make choices meaningful and its ruinging a lot of games and they dont even realise it .Think tht first wow mount .Think that first epic after months of play.Think needing to track down tht imba crafter.Think getting that first 100 gold .Think Leafblower ,thunderfury ,warglaive,we need the shit stuff to be shit so as the good stuff smells so good.
We all adapt to every game we play, games aren't made for any one specific consumer.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I will fight tooth and nail against this one. You speak to immersion and the ability to hold unlimited amount of things? I'm not going to explain the logical fallacy here. The inventory is NOT a burden. Your hoarding probably is. Hey..I hoard too but I adapt. I figure out what I really want and need and break down/give away/sell/or destroy the rest.
You claim to champion for immersion but don't consider that it would actually cost you money to take your damaged armor to a skilled laborer. And it really is not that much. Guild Wars 2 on the other hand...well, it also wasn't that much but trying to earn gold in that game was a slow crawl making each little repair dreadful. This game, I think I die a moderate amount..pretty average gamer here. I spend maybe 200 gold in repairs for every 1,000 gold earned. That's 800 gold exposable coin.
I agree here for the soul-gems rezzing portion to a point. Mostly because of PvP. Heck, the whole sudden death mechanic feels dated compared to Guild War's 2 downed state (something [I feel] that game did brilliantly well). In PvP it is very unlikly people will even bother rezzing you. By Talos, even in PvE your rotting coprse will get past over most of the time....
..but then...
..Every once in awhile someone will stop and use their soul gem on you. Now...isn't that really meaningful? Isn't there something more deeply appreciating when someone uses their resource to rez a perfect stranger in contrast to what Guild Wars 2 does?
I would strongly consider quitting the game. Look at Guild Wars 2 economy. It is a mess because people can accumulate without abandon making resources plentiful driving prices AND demand down. Bad economy makes a game very unfun for someone like me. It's not the end all be all...but it certainly is not fun sicne I tend to enjoy crafting and feeling rewarded for the time devoted whatever specialization I go for. The Elder Scrolls is doing this for me. It's like EvE Online but not as complex but complicated just enough to make it interesting and feel Elder Scroll-sy.
There are a LOT of issues with this game. Some of them are down to its very core that I am uncertain can ever be changed. Phasing. Quest bugs. Locked content....I'm sorry...but the inability to swim underwater bothered me a heck of a lot more than any of your points.
Just to correct you, once you progress further into the game you get the passive ability to fill Soul Gems, making it something you don't even think about other than acquiring empty ones for crafting.
Of course not. But the purpose of this overused meme is to negate the right of consumers to complain about aspects of the game they don't like, and that's BS. The reason so many MMOs nowadays suck and are tired, repetitive copies of everything that has come before is this mentality that players just need to adapt to suckage, rather than game developers come up with something that is new, innovative and makes sense rather than throwing a repair bill or inventory hassles at you because everyone else does it.
Thanks for being the umpteenth person to point that out.
LOL
Sorry OP, it seems you are comparing things to another mmorpg. Try playing a game a bit different for once and think old school. We bitch at how WoW progressed and it's switch from hardcore vanilla to carebear MoP, then when something tough comes along we complain.
Things should be harder and more challenging! Please don't start the ball rolling the wrong way!
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
1. Your idea of unlimited bag space isn't "immersion breaking"? Oh, everyone gets a Bag of Plenty or Null space to start just screams deep immersion to me. Now, list the game(s) that have no inventory limits?
2. Repair costs are absolutely fine. I've gotten more than enough cash in the betas to take care of repairs and still have thousands of gold. Stop complaining to complain.
3. You obviously have never played an ES game. Soul gems are an important part of the game. If you don't understand that, sorry but its working fine.
3.a. 5 abilities is better than having 5 or 6 tool bars full of crap skills with more than 90% being used in only specific circumstances.
It is very obvious to me that you have an agenda. Don't want to play ESO? Fine. There are plenty of other games out there that have unlimited bag space, no costs or very low costs for gear repairs, no soul gems and tons of useless abilities to pack multiple tool bars with.
You "adapt" by vendoring stuff or throwing it away, which is precisely the problem I am complaining about. If you have to get rid of stuff you'd rather keep. have to keep returning to town to empty your bags or otherwise have to continually hassle with inventory you do not have adequate inventory space.
How is it a "logical fallacy" to point out that this kills the fun for me in the game? If adequate inventory space weren't important for most players then f2p developers wouldn't be able to make money selling extra slots as a major means of generating cash.
Did you quit GW2 because of having too much inventory space? If so you have little grounds to chastise me for not focusing on issues in ESO you feel are more worthy of complaint. I enjoy being able to craft everything for my toons myself and would like to be able to do so in this game as well, but that seems it will be impossible. Without an AH exchanging goods between players is going to be really difficult and tiresome, and I expect to see people spamming the hell out of chat trying to sell stuff. You'll wish everyone could just craft their own stuff and get the hell out of your face when that happens.
YOu don't see the cause and effect in this though, not to mention the slight irony in saying it here in this thread? You don't like the way ESO has this or that incorporated, you want it to be more like x or o. Because you liked it in Y or Z. It's this that causes that stagnation you're complaining about. ESO has it's own systems, it should remain that way. There's nothing wrong with just passing on it.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Although I don't use the word, it is in a well known dictionary. I'm not sure why everyone is having so much trouble with the word, and you would consider it LOL. /shrug
Merriam-Webster
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
I"ll look at it from a TES point of view. The bag space is really a lot if you compare it to other TES games. Just leaving Helgen in Skyrim, you could be overweight lol. I actually like the limited bag space, it makes you either go sell/decontruct a bunch or pick and choose what you want to loot. I really don't like how MMOs these days are all about killing this monster that drops 10 things, I'm just going to take it all. It's unrealistic.
The repairs aren't too bad. i think they're a little high (maybe a 10% reduction is needed), but it's not going to make you broke, unless you die a bunch.
The soul gem idea I really like. You can use soul gems to recharge your enchants or to resurrect players and yourself. There are actually vendors that sell the soul gems, full or empty. The empty ones are extremely cheap, you can fill them up with the Soul Trap ability (I think that's the name lol). This ability also does a fairly good DoT on the mob as well
I actually always have more soul gems than I need.
The cash shop that won't sell p2w items but will sell "make life easier" items.
Your first paragraph is exactly what you have to do in the ES games, but instead of bag space you are working with weight. Either way, it is much more immersive to have to go into town and sell/empty your inventory.
edit: snip
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
Managing inventory is not "challenging" in any meaningful or fun way. Any game that substitutes tedious make-work tasks for genuinely fun and challenging content isn't going to go very far. If you want that kind of game Star Trek Online blows away all competitors: lots of tedious make-work and grinding, little to do that is fun or truly challenging.
If I thought managing inventory was fun why would I pay someone for the dubious pleasure of having to sort through tons of crap when I could get a job at my local warehouse club where they will pay me to do this and I get to drive the forklift and talk to female co-workers. I'm not even being facetious here. Which is a more productive and fun use of my time? I work at home and use MMOs to escape the stress of work, yet there are some out there that are so tedious and grindy I have found myself going back to my work to escape the stress of playing them, because they are more like a job than my job is. The crap inventory system in this game heads dangerously in that direction.
(red) What it is is diablo and I hate me some diablo
.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
No, it is more immersive to stay immersed in whatever fun thing you are doing than to constantly have to stop what you are doing and run back to town and empty your bags. This is as much fun as having your mom interrupt your game play to send you to the store for some milk...only having her do it every one to two hours.
The first thing I do in an ES game is look for the inventory cheats online that liberate my game play from this hassle. You never had to wait more than a week from release to find one, they were that in demand.
If they ever gave the ability to choose unlimited inventory or a more "immersive" restricted version at the start of your toon's career statistics would show most people opting for the former over the latter.
It's basically the same system as in Oblivion and Skyrim and they did fairly well!
edit: I think what the developers are trying to do is stay within some of the same boundaries set by the ES games. If you didn't like Morrowind, Oblivion, or Skyrim, you probably won't like this and should find something else.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
+1 ^^
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"