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The reason why I hate Subscription MMOs...
tixylix
Member UncommonPosts: 1,288
I'm at work most of the time, I'm not a kid any more with loads of time on my hands and even when I'm not working I have other stuff I do in my life. I don't mind games which take a long time to achieve anything, I'm not looking to be rewarded every 5 seconds like games seem to do these days. I used to play EQ back in the day and because my Mum restricted my play time, I never got to end game, over a few years I only managed into the 30s. That doesn't bother me though as I'm more than happy enough to just play for the fun and I don't feel the need to complete everything.
My problem with subscriptions is that it charges you the same rate as everyone else no matter how much you play. So if someone plays 24/7, they're paying exactly the same as someone who only manages to get 4 hours a week in. Sometimes I just don't feel like playing, I haven't bothered with TESO for two weeks now and it is because I haven't felt like going back to it. However what if I have that urge to play it again in a months time to see if they've fixed a lot of issues? I have to pay a subscription, I might only play once and then not bother again. I just end up not bothering with the game at all then...
I think Subscriptions are counter productive and they just put people off and some players feel forced into thinking they need to get as much play time in as possible and get burnt out on the game very fast as a result. So again you'll get a short term income there, but because they got burnt out, they wont be coming back.
F2P is so much better because I can play whenever I want, feel no pressure and I can focus on spending my money on stuff that I feel like I'm getting something out of it, rather than just paying for the privilege to play. I still know many people who say "pay a subscription to play a game?" and it is as alien to them as it was to 99% of gamers before WoW came out. Yet those people pay for bonus content in other games or buy expansions and stuff like that.
I think forced subscriptions have to go and they need to be replaced by optional ones + the F2P model.
Comments
Maybe MMOs could go back to charging by the minute/hour? Would that be better? I do feel for you that you feel "cheated" due to time constraints.
Do you use the same minutes on your landline/cell phone as others that pay the same as you? Do you watch cable/satellite TV as much or less than others with the same packages? Do you get as much use out of your car as others with the same model?
My point being, MMOs went to the subscription as the "unlimited playtime" package, just like phones have "Unlimited minutes", Cable/Satellite has "all the channels" packages. I guess the difference is that these other entertainment services still have the old way. You CAN pay by the minute for phone usage. Cable/Satellite offers many packages to choose from. They did this because players were spending ungodly amounts by paying by the hour. This actually made MMOs more accessible when they went this route. Of course, F2P is even more accessible, but we kind of know what F2P MMOs are like
Maybe if MMOs offered more ways of paying, that would be an improvement
$0.05/minute (long distance rates)
$2.50 for 5 hours/month
$5.00 for 15 hours/month
$7.50 for 25 hours/month
$10.00 for 75 hours/month
$15.00 for unlimited time.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
You should only play an mmo if you have time to play them. Most people that play them have time, so they should not be gimped because of the twice a week, one hour people.
Look at it this way, if you have very limited time, how can you get to know ppl anyway ( your most likely playing by yourself ). This is why we have offline games like Skyrim.
A little extra hint: Dynamic events are solo, say what you like, but that's what they are.
More often than not the f2P players are TRYING TO PLAY FOR FREE !
Your internet connection likely starts at $45 a month but people don't feel a driven need to be online 20 hrs a day to justify it.
Cable bills are usually $60 to $100 a month
Cell phones will run $35 to $200
But I can't handle a $15 a month MMO sub.
I just can't wrap my head around this line of thinking in the current world.
Everything subscription based in life works like this: Gym, cable TV, internet connection...
You just have to decide if it is worth for you to pay for that service and forget about what others do with their time and money.
The diference with mmorpgs is that you don't see people at the Gym demanding it to be free because they can lift weights at the beach for free.
Not talking about you here OP but lately you can see on every P2P (or even B2P) release people really convinced that they deserve to play every mmorpg for free trolling forums everywhere. What do these guys in the outside world everytime they see a new shiny they can't afford?
I'm not sure this argument holds any water.
In a subscription model you are generally paying a monthly fee for the developers to continue working on the game, updating it, and the cost of the servers. You aren't paying based on time played in game.
In a free to play game you are not paying based on time played either. You are paying based on how much money you are willing to spend on virtual items in game. This is a model I loathe and it was born of people selling items, gold, and characters in game.
I believe the subscription model is the most fair to everyone. Everyone pays the same price and gets access to the same things "based on how much time you have to put in". To me it makes no sense to play a time consuming game if you have no time to play it "unless you are willing to accept you wont get some of the things others do".
I like sub games (generally), and I could not care less how much time anyone else spends in game.
I work 40-50 hours a week, and if the games fun, I'll play in my free time. For me it's really that simple.
LMAO , this kills me , you do realize that a sub for most games that require it .. amount to .50 a day ....
Thats it .50 .. is that the problem here?
FFXIV-ARR is a sub and box game but they let you expire your account and you can get it back later if you want to sign up again. You don't loose anything. You get the first month free. That would work okay for someone on a month on month off type schedule.
But if you have absolutely no time on your hands (college, military, etc) then you should probably stick with f2p games. Quality of the game may be low tho.
THEN DON"T SUB.
Are you not an adult?
If a subscription is worth it or not... well i guess it all depends how you look at things. I work and have a private life, I pay sub for 2 games, and in totat i dont play them that much. But it is still the entertainment product i get the most value for my money.
I pay a $19 dollar avarage for each of them. For $19 in my country i can go to 1,5 movies at the theatre or buy 2 beers at the pub, buy 1-2 music cd's.... the thing is even if i play them maybe just 5-10 hours a month it still a good investment for me, cause there aren't many other things that will give me better entertainment value for may money. But thats just me.
NB! Aren't we lucky that there are both game with F2P model and subscription based, cheer up.
You do have a good point about the ability to play and enjoy the game first and then pay for it based on the experience.
But... there are so many other negative detractors of F2P that out way that small amount of benefit.
1) Monetization: Since the company doesn't have a set predictable revenue stream from subscriptions they must focus on ways to tempt and force people to spend money on a regular basis. Many of the common techniques are annoying to players and impact the enjoyment of the game to elicit the sale, like severely restricted inventories. Also many of the limits are are staged to help provide multiple purchases in the future are the annoyance grows.
2) Distracted Developers: to keep the revenue stream coming the Developers must focus efforts on new annoying restrictions or chase vanity players with fluff items, instead of focusing on the core game.
3) Whales a P2W: To tempt big spenders Devs often have to resort to selling game game balance affecting items. letting players buy their way to success in the game rather than actually playing the game.
4) Ease of Abuse and Exploit: If the F2P MMO offers any type of competition between players it encourages exploiting because there is little risk to the exploiter since they didn't invest their money in playing the game, they have access to an unlimited number of anonymous disposable accounts to test the limits of the exploit / hacks.
I hate subscription mmos because....
I just can't find one of the new-current ones that are worth it. If teh game's just my type and i can see myself playing for a long time, than maybe, maybe, it'll be worth it.
Unfortunatly, maybe besides EVE, sub based mmorpgs:
- Aren't better or more inovative
- Still have bots, hackers, gold spammers, any of these issues
- Still have tons of bugs at release, and for time forward
- Don't fix or update their games faster, or much faster, than F2P
- Don't have content of superior quality
- Even when they have, it isn't released on a monthly, or even bi-monthly manner
- Don't have better community
- Don't have better service
- Are putting cash shops, or some other monitize mechanic inside. It's almost the norm now.
- Still require you to buy an expansion
TL:DR- Subscription based mmorpgs are suppose to be of higher quality overall, while F2P/B2P should be junk. Nowadays, they're usually at the same level. And there's the main problem:
- There's almost no real sub based mmorpgs nowadays, the ones that remain have high changes of converting to F2P eventually anyway, like ESO, ARR and WS. Not a certanty of course, but still possible.
I love subscription-based games that are designed that way.
I also work a ton, and can't play like I used to, but $15 per month is almost nothing for on-call entertainment.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
This hits close to home, because I have bought subscriptions to games and just got tired of playing them, even though I'm subscribed to the game. Overall I've probably saved alot of money though because my entertainment dollar goes further thru subscriptions to mmorpgs. If you compared a single player game you pay $40 for, and it lasts like 40 hours, which is what pretty much happened to me with a good game like Company of Heroes.
Any money I have spent on mmorpgs or online games I feel is well spent because I'm saving money overall.
==========================
The game is dead not, this game is good we make it and Romania Tv give it 5 goat heads, this is good rating for game.
If there'd be the exactly same MMORPG, once as subscription version and once "free 2 play" (aka pay2win) with cash shop, I'd play the subscription version. Why?
First, I'd play the game the way it would be designed to be most fun. All players play the same game.
In a f2p game, there are three classes of players. The ones who don't pay anything. They play a crippled version of the game. They get less xp, have less bank space, take longer for everythything, things are supposed to be fun are a chore. Then there are those who always buy everything in the shop. They basically faceroll through the game. And then there are those inbetween. They basically pay as much as people would in a subscription game, to get some of the features, but not all of them. I don't like to play a crippled crappy game.
And second: in a f2p game, there is no fair pvp. The ones who pay most kill the others more easily since they have better equipment.
Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)
Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)
I like subscriptions because usually you don't have the developers competing with gold sellers for my attention to buy from their cash shops. I get clear eestimate of the value of what I am paying for 15 a month for access. I get to voice my dissatisfaction with the game by unsubscribing vs. being another powerless prop for thr whales who are the real paying customers.
I do think developers should offer other models so we can get our money's worth. Maybe hour or daily cost like 1 dollar a day which equals 30 a month but for those who don't play everyday it feels like a better value. Or lower monthly subs for less characters and bank space or whatever.
I also got a job, in fact it's alittle more then just a job but that aside. Have my friends/family/wife etc.
So those 15,- €/$ a month I can honostly say I spend more on things that last allot shorter then a MMORPG.
Not sure why you really are complaining about a sub when you clearly have found games that you do enjoy. (F2P's)
I also have very limited time to play, last week only played on monday/tuesday's, simply didn't have much time even today (sunday) I was doing mostly work related things. Perhaps I take some hours tonight...not sure really depends....
I really do not see a sub game as a problem. Actually like a subgame allot more then most F2P games, Rift is the only exception, followed by Neverwinter.
If I would have no job or financial issue's I just wouldn't play any games because there are far more important things to spend money on. But since I am not in that position those 15 a month do not hurt me regardless if I put in 10 hours a month or 40 hours a month. And I definitly don't care of unknown person X is able to play 24/7 for the same price.
I don't look at it that way. I allow myself 2 subscription games each month. One pretty much has always been the same game and the other has changed as my tastes come and go. I also play F2P and B2P games but I find their worlds pretty shallow in comparison other than the Sub conversions and even than I find the new content sub conversions add is very low quality compared to the content they released pre F2P conversion.
I don't need to get hundreds of hours of play time a month to feel like I got my money's worth. I only need to get enjoyment a few times a week and it's worth having around.
It's nice to have F2P and B2P games available for when I feel like doing something different but I don't look to them for the same kind of immersion that I get from sub games. There is no free lunch and being F2P/B2P has a cost. You might be able to play for free or lower price but if you don't enjoy what your playing or can't really get sucked in to the world whats the point?
I don't know why everyone thinks between F2P, B2P or Sub one model has to dominate the market. Why can't they coexist? My ideal healthy MMO market would be mostly F2P and B2P games with a handful of very good sub games with tons of high quality crafted content being released on a ongoing basis. That gives everyone options which isn't a bad thing.
Transactions cost the developer money,if they have to make a transaction every time someone plays for a few minutes,they would not make any money.
The sub system just works,it offers you the chance to play a LOT,like 24/7 if you wanted with no added charge.If for some reason everything in life was free and the dev could charge only by the minute or hour,it would suffocate those people that WANT to play.A system should never cater to someone who is in the minority,so a sub system works because there are no hidden costs,if you can play 16 hours on a Sunday you are free to do so.
Even if you have very little time the cost of a subscription is 50 cents a day,there is no such entertainment value to be found anywhere at that cost.Even if you only played 15 minutes a day 50 cents is worth it,geesh there is a VERY high % that sit around puffing cigarettes all day at 10+ bucks a pack.
Geesh i doubt you can even play an arcade/pinball game anymore for under a buck that last about 2 minutes.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
How many MMO P2P games exist which offer no F2P option also ? 3? 4 ?
How many F2P MMOs exist ? Hundreds ?
Sorry, I see no issue.
Paying for daily access seems better but they used to charge by the hour lol.
I have spent thousands with subscriptions that I've forgotten I've had.
It is a good idea to change out your credit card every few years for a quick fix to combat the auto-renewal scourge.
I would rather pay a fee each month than be nickel and dimed.
That's why when I go back to Lotro now and then, I just re-start my subscription. I would rather have access to everything than pay for each zone and mount skill and bag space, and a million other things you have to pay for if you play for "Free"
and the few things I do want from the store, I get from my 500 points a month I earn from paying for the game. I have never had to pay more than fifteen dollars a month.
Then when I get tired of the game (I usually do) I just stop my subscription.