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New Player pays to win and loses
Calfis
Member UncommonPosts: 381
in EVE Online
TL;DR Russian dude plays EVE for less than a month, spends over $210 on PLEX which he sells for isk and buys the most expensive items he can for a cruiser that looks like the Serenity then proceeds to shoot at a pirate in high sec because he had the most expensive shit, what could go wrong? EVERYTHING.
Comments
It seems like every EvE story is people getting screwed. Why the hell would I want to play a game like this in my precious spare time lol.
I've stopped playing EVE 5 years ago, and I don't remember it being P2W? What good is a trillion isk cruiser if you're only a few months old? Perhaps buying PLEX to then use the isk to buy a 6-7 year old toon, other then that EVE isn't P2W, the game has become a cluster of multi clienting, where 80,000 players online actually equals to 40,000.
On a side note why even post about EVE-Online? It's not really getting any new blood and it's going down the pipe hole by the end of 2015 / Q1 2016. CCP are like GM / Ford, they thought being the kings of the road for so long, they had plenty of opportunities to change their way of doing business, yet they are now getting screwed by newer, refined technologies. EVE-Online "WAS" great 7-8 years ago, but they've done nada to improve the game besides adding new useless ships and more skills. 3 games are releasing in 2015, that will fade EVE-Online's once upon time awesomeness down the drain.
It's a real shame, because EVE had a lot of potential, but CCP decided to use that potential and create lame spin off games that aren't doing anywhere near as good as people expected. Dust 514 will get blown away by Blizzard's Destiny in a heart beat. EVE Valkyrie, they decide to give this a go now when 2 major releases will blow it away in 2015.
Star Citizen has way over a million people that pre ordered the game, while EVE-Online doesn't even have half a million subs after 10+ years of existence. More people are playing and enjoying Space Engineers then EVE-Online, and the bloody thing is still in Alpha. EVE-Online is a dead cause, there is no denying it, CCP had multiple chances of making EVE "THE" sci-fi game for the next 20-30 years, but they blew it, BIG TIME!
I'm amazed that Eve is still around. Played it about 5 or 6 years ago for only a year because i had friends playing it after Earth & Beyond got shut down but they all left the game too. Its just not a very fun game to began with.
It isn't a story about anyone getting screwed. It's a PSA for those that think they can "pay to win" in EVE.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I guess a better way to put it is that every time I see something about EvE, its laughing at someone's misfortune. Whether self inflicted or not, it doesn't really compel me to want to be a part of any of it.
Well the comedy comes from the fact that he screwed himself, bling items make people who have no idea what they are doing, think that they know what they are doing, when in fact they don't know jack shit. He could have simply not shot at the pirate and been on his way, all his bling intact. But no, let me play Mal Reynolds and shoot this baddie and poof.
Kind of mixed feelings here. It is just a game and this person just lost $200 with nothing to show for it. Pretty decent kick in the nuts honestly. But tbh it's nothing new. Other mmo's do this in terms of lock boxes. So whatever...
I can sympathize that they lost real money. Though they should have done a bit of research as well. That said just because a person makes a mistake or doesn't have their brain engaged doesn't mean that it should be open season on them (in a sense.) Torn on the subject.
I didn't know Eve had a finish line where you could win.
Does this mean that of someone wins Eve will be over till the competition starts again?
Understandable, but this is kinda true of any MMO news outside expansion and update stuff. Other than "Player hit X in Y [days/hours]!!" do we really ever see any positive news about player activities in game? At least with EVE it's something other than leveling/bosskill dings. The two games I look forward to news on are EVE and LOTRO. One is Wall Street in Space and the other is a Hippy Hobbit Lovefest, but news about the players from both of them is refreshingly different. The players are doing something other than repetitive zombie-like grinding to a cap - they're being a community. True, they're communities of people that do some really weird things with and to each other, but I'd take that over DKP and arguing over loot drops any day.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Mostly agree but, sorry had to fix that for ya.
Not to mention the community was as refined as trade chat in WoW....
It may not have a win in that regard but it certainly has winning and losing on a more micro level of encounters between players and corporations.
Plex does give the opportunity to buy your way to bigger and better guns than you might otherwise be able to afford which could under some circumstances result in a Pay to Win scenario but it's also not a guaranteed win button either. But than again few P2W games really are now are they? I mean just because you spent hundreds of dollars getting +20 gear for that Asian grinder doesn't mean you can stand still and let your free play opponent beat on you without reacting.
It's hard to be 'pay to win' when the game is pretty hardcore 'rock-paper-scissors'. Just as the OP mentioned, the guy had the most expensive shit you could buy on a ship and got dropped because of that.
Haters gonna hate.
My guess is that 20-30 years from now, EVE will still be around after those other titles are just forgotten memories. Very unlikely that the new games will offer many of the features and environments that EVE does, hence they won't be able to easily replace it.
I agree, there are many ways it could have been improved, but then again, 10+ years later and they are still one of the largest subscription games out there, so they must have done a few things right, even if it all didn't result in them dethroning WOW.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I guess a better way to put it is that every time I see something about EvE, its laughing at someone's misfortune. Whether self inflicted or not, it doesn't really compel me to want to be a part of any of it.
Understandable, but this is kinda true of any MMO news outside expansion and update stuff. Other than "Player hit X in Y [days/hours]!!" do we really ever see any positive news about player activities in game? At least with EVE it's something other than leveling/bosskill dings. The two games I look forward to news on are EVE and LOTRO. One is Wall Street in Space and the other is a Hippy Hobbit Lovefest, but news about the players from both of them is refreshingly different. The players are doing something other than repetitive zombie-like grinding to a cap - they're being a community. True, they're communities of people that do some really weird things with and to each other, but I'd take that over DKP and arguing over loot drops any day.
hehe yeah. But to be fair, how many threads about DKP do you read around here? I suppose every game has its trash: bots, bugs, faceroll, grind, treadmill, shallow crafting, boring combat, yadda yadda. I guess I can tolerate that bs more because its mostly arguing about preferred game mechanics. EvE is almost alway about a specific person getting brutalized, and its usually an argument over whether they brought it upon themselves or not. Yeah its a break from the normal redundancies here, but for me thats not enough to warrant it refreshing heh.
You can spend all the isk you want. But if you lack the skills someone else in a much cheaper ship can kill you. Isk means nothing if you do not understand the mechanics.
Rule #1 in Eve: Don't fly what you cant afford to lose.
One of the tutorials even sets you up to die so you learn how harsh it can be. Only the player can be blamed.
Eve is not game about space ships or sci fi,Eve is game about players interaction and none mmo game is on horizon what can replace Eve , it is good for CCP but bad for us ,Eve players.
Eve is still unique game on mmo market , we ,have no other sandbox game to go.We are try with Perpetuum but again , we back to Eve .
Not even skills. Just knowledge. Counter fit, bait, gank, whatever. I guess after thinking about it. My conclusion is that there's enough knowledge out there that it isn't CCP's responsibility to protect people from themselves. Thinking that they can pay to win with PLEX. Seen or heard plenty of stories of situations like this. Much worse, bigger loss. I won't laugh at a person that this happens to personally but I don't think it's CCP's responsibility to protect people from themselves either. Enough info is out there that just a few minutes of reading could have informed them. Still I sympathize but whatever. Some people need to learn the hard way.
Your limiting your definition of P2W to just new players going up against experienced ones. What happens if two people fairly new to the game one who just subs and one who buys/sells plex goes up against each other? What happens if two experienced players go up against each other? What happens if a experienced corp decides to upgrade all their members ships with items bought from Plex?
Don't get me wrong as far as real world money to in game influence goes EVE is one of the least offensive in my book but it's influence is still there. Don't ever doubt for a second that Plex can and has changed the way EVE works at a fundamental level. Now maybe your fine with that change and if so more power to you but you can't deny it's there.
Eve is constantly evolving, so its hard to not see it still being around for at least another 10 years, but really i had to laugh about the Destiny bit, the Blizzard one or the Bungie one
unfortunately for 'Bungie' Destiny is about as viable as a chocolate fireguard, already there is competition incoming that it cannot hope to compete with - Dust 514 was always going to be a none competitor tbh, no, the biggest problem for Bungie, is a game called Planetside 2, and its coming to PS4, and its F2P, no box price afaik, and its an actual MMO in all the ways that Destiny is not, and better still, it runs at 60 fps, not a very mediocre 30 fps which is still one of the most embarrassing features of the game, that Bungie has been unable to optimise Destiny well enough to run properly on the next gen consoles is something of an embarrassment, its just a shame that Planetside 2 won't be on the XB1, because frankly Destiny Belongs on the 360 and PS3, and its no surprise its also going to be on those consoles, which makes its lack of performance on the next gen consoles doubly perplexing and a testament of Bungies abilities, albeit in the sense that they appear to lack competency.
But, the Dust 514 comparison is probably correct, the game is doomed to continued failure, whether Legion will change this is moot, it may already be far too late.
Star Citizen and Elite Dangerous, their not really in a competing market with Eve anyway, if all goes well with them, they will probably do well, but we're still in the 'wait and see' phase for those, so at the moment its all little more than supposition, we'll need to see some actual meat on those bones before start making any predictions.
As for Eve though, there is as yet nothing out there to suggest that the game will not continue its slow but steady growth for the foreseeable future, Eve has earned its title as the foremost Sci Fi sandbox MMO, and its a title that will not be easily taken from them, although it is definitely an area that needs more competition imo, there are far too many fantasy themeparks these days, and more Sandbox 'variety' would only be a good thing.
Pretty much agree with your above. But rule number one is Trust No One. Rule number TWO, is don't fly what you can't afford to replace. ^^
Well he was in highsec so he was for the most part safe, he saw a "flashy" pirate (someone who has been naughty and can be shot by everybody for his crimes) so new player decides that since he has all this uber gear on his spaceship he can take said pirate. Then when he loses he expresses "disappointment" in the article because CCP was "punishing" him for selling PLEX. I dunno if its just this guy or some kind of mentality connected to people who pay cash for items but can he really not make the connection that CCP had nothing to do with this? There is a clear path of personal decisions he made that led him to lose a stupidly expensive ship.
Actually even you just made a mistake. High sec is probably the most dangerous space because of the false sense of security it gives. Sure you can for the most part stay fairly safe with a bit of knowledge. Stuff like insta dock and undocks. Warping to 0 on gates and jumping. No bullshitting around while sitting on them. No afking in space anywhere ever. No exceptions, ever! If doing missions staying aligned and warping out when if someone shows up. Not bragging about your loot pinata, making yourself a target. I know some stuff alludes me because I have not played in awhile. But basically the idea is to make yourself an hard target. Often as long as you don't provoke people they will pass you by fairly quickly if they are fishing for prey.
You are right about ganking in highsec but for this specific situation the new player could have walked away, instead we have a comedy killmail.
Actually this time it is not a misfortune really. Short investigation + actually willing to learn the game step by step (as much as it sound boring, yeah, starting from tutorials) is the way but then I guess there will be always someone new and "wiser". Obviously this guy was one of those knowing better.
The truth is that following really simple rules in EvE does pay off and can take away all drama.
It's funny because people have been saying the exact same thing since 2005.