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MMO sites branches out to cover "pseudo-MMO"?
nariusseldon
Member EpicPosts: 27,775
http://massively.joystiq.com/2014/09/05/ask-massively-destiny-is-not-the-boss-of-me/#continued
Well, it seems that even when the devs has said it themselves that Destiny is not a MMO, MMO sites (in this case massively) has no problem covering it ... because it is "close enough"?
I suppose Destiny is obviously going to be a popular game, and MMO sites want to lay claim to anything that have some MMO elements, and are popular. No wonder the definition of MMO is broadening.
Incidentally, THIS site also lists Destiny on the MMO list, with its own forum. No wonder LoL, WoT, and many instanced games are "considered" MMOs now. Good for the MMO genre.
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Comments
I just wish sites such as this one would identify the genre (maybe by a logo next to article titles) for each category of game, be that mmorpg, sprpg, moba etc.
Simple equation: More games = More site visitors = More ad dollars.
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
That would be a good idea. I play lots of other genres than just mmos and like reading the news and reviews from other games but there are some types I just have no interest in and reading them they often don't make it very clear what kind of game it is. MOBAs are guilty of this the most...and it's a genre I have no interest in.
This and
this.
MMORPG.com has long had games on its list that aren't MMOs, and now they're blatantly covering singleplayer RPGs to expand their brand, they've admitted as much.
Massively has been covering stuff like LoL for a while.
The MMO genre has been too dead for too long for them to make a living off of JUST MMOs.
This was exactly my angle as well. I enjoy all types of games, RPG's, TPS, FPS, Strategy, Racers etc, but MOBAs are the one category I have zero interest in and would rather have this identified upfront so as not to waste my time.
Incidentally, THIS site also lists Destiny on the MMO list, with its own forum. No wonder LoL, WoT, and many instanced games are "considered" MMOs now. Good for the MMO genre."
Covering them does not mean placing them into another category. Comments above mine have stated why these sites cover them and it has nothing to do with relabeling. Other than to aggravate people I don't know why this continues to pop up.
Ironically, WoW Insider is still one of the most largest website covering ONE MMO.
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
I say this every time this sort of thread comes up.
by my main problem I have with MMO sites like this covering non-MMOs, is that many of these MMO sites don't go out of their way enough to let us(the readers and consumers) know which and which are not MMOs.
this went on so much to the point where people started to question the definition of what a MMO is, and the lines were blurred.
10 years ago nobody in their right mind would call World of Tanks or LoL, a MMO.
Guild Wars 1 was the first big game that wasn't a MMO to blur the lines and change the definition of MMO to not even requiring an open world. People argued and argued even tho the developers said it isn't a MMO. But the community still wanted to label it a MMO due to the 3D gameplay nature of it, and the city 3D lobbies.
from there, people changed the definition of MMO to being simply a game that requires Online Connection. From Guild Wars 1, we saw games like Dynasty Warriors Online and Age of Empires Online, simply require an online always requirement and Dynasty Warrior Online had 3D Lobbies, and people made that the definition of MMO.
Massively did an article which they said that any game, ANY GAME, with ONLINE OPTION is a MMO!!
Now today we see Developers and Producers exploiting the silence and vagueness of the game's hype and pre-release info by calling their hyped up products a MMO, before giving the intelligent MMO community members who know to question everything the developers/producers hype, a chance to see and get their hands on the game.
game gets hyped up as something it's not, and releases. A massive amount of people buy the game at first due to the misleading nature of the marketing,and once reality sets in, the masses leave in disappointment.
we saw this happen with Guild Wars 1, since it was hyped up to be a Free-of-Sub MMO, but lots of people learned the truth after buying the game and trying it, to realize its simply a 3D Diablo game. Mass disappointment came from that.
Guild wars 2 had to start its hype up by pointing out that it would be a REAL non-sub MMO unlike the first game...smh
we saw this again with Star Trek Online as well.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
A while back, this site announced that sometime in the not so distant future the Game's List would be revamped to make more sense; we'll just have wait and see how that works out.
At the same time they also announced that they would be covering other genres such as RPGs as there just wasn't enough incoming MMORPG news to justify a complete focus. Something that would explain the changes that other sites seem to be making in order to adjust and keep their visitors.
Just because we have a little confusion on the part of gaming sites (and clearly some of those that are members to those sites) it doesn't mean the genre has been redefined. Things will settle soon enough and the OP will have no choice but to move on to the next beehive to find his pleasure.
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Yo, Seldon! The underlined is why we classifying things correctly (and not by what feels "close enough" to you or any other random person) which also makes thing more convenient; something that seems to be ranked pretty high on your priorities list. You talk it in virtually all of your posts.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
who are "we"?
No one has any authorization to define a "correct" definition. In fact, the article explicitly pointed out that massively is going to define MMO as whatever they like.
and nah .. i talk about how i dislike old school MMO, and like newer games much more than just definitions of MMOs ... and I probably talk about whales also more.
Tell that to massively, MMORPG.com, and gaming review sites.
They are the ones who put games like WoT in the MMO category, or MMO lists.
I've never actually seen an article on Massively or MMORPG claiming that LoL/WoT/DoTA2 are MMOs. The cover them because they are hot and trendy right now and there is probably some crossover appeal with the MMORPG audience.
If you can point to an actual article on those sites claiming those games should be considered MMORPGs I'll reconsider my opinion.
Aside from reviews clready classified WoT as a MMOs, there are plenty of examples in massively.
The most clear example:
massively.joystiq.com/2014/03/31/world-of-tanks-unveils-new-7v7-combat-mode/
And i quote "Wargaming.net has just announced a brand-new combat mode for its tank-flavored MMO World of Tanks."
Other examples:
http://massively.joystiq.com/2014/07/04/massivelys-fourth-of-july-weekend-mmo-event-roundup/
And I quote "It's Independence Day in the U.S., the day when gamers scarf down BBQ and try to flee family events so they can log back into MMOs. What? You know you do it. Here's a few of the events and sales and promotions MMO players can look forward to this weekend"
And what does those "MMO" events include? You guess it ...
"world of Tanks celebrates Canada Day and Independence Day with discounts on cash-shop stuff and experience bonuses."
How about this one?
http://massively.joystiq.com/2014/06/15/mmo-week-in-review-massivelys-e3-roundup/
And i quote "This week, the Massively staff on the ground in LA and manning the fort back home were preoccupied with E3 2014, which surprised us with some great MMO offerings. Here's a roundup of our best coverage from this year's con!"
And what is included in the "great MMO offerings"?
"E3 2014: Hands-on with World of Warships and World of Tanks Blitz"
.... i guess you don't read massively much.
nah .. it is just based on convenience.
Hence, WoT is a MMO but CoD is not.
I don't care much about arguing about definitions or what a particular site should or shouldn't cover, mainly because I am not pedantic or overly offended about such things.
I don't think there is any "arguing". Obviously websites can do whatever they want ... just that it is interesting to see that massively (and many other) is no longer adhering to the old definition of MMOs, no doubt because of how the market is going.
There are really not many games that are pure mmorpgs anymore, but mmorpg dot com have explained they need to cover more broadly to stay alive. This makes sense with the current strategy, and it would probably be a gamble to downsize to a pure mmorpg site anyways.
Moving on to the point. Since games are so much cross genre, maybe it does not make sense to categorize them under a specific genre. On the other hand, it would really be useful when you read about an new game, to be able to place it. Understanding a games basic premises will also help not putting false expectations into a game and subsequent pointless forum wars.
Instead of labelling games with a genre, it is also a possibility to create an attribute system, so that each game could hold a number of attributes describing its nature. What these attributes should be is up for discussion, but it should be something that would help users get a rough idea of a game. Maybe even some kind of user driven categorising system.
A few (not thought through) ideas for attributes.. Box price, sub fee, ingame currency, class/skill based, coop, pvp, lobby/open world, destructable world, player content, art style. I can't decide if I think genres (like arpg, card game, etc) is an attribute.. But I guess You could and games could just be labelled with several genres if that is what they are?
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MMORPG games themself were gradually less and less 'MMORPG-ish' - it is a long process than is present for last decade.
Still even this process and even F2P/microtransaction change have not saved MMORPG genre popularity in the west. MMORPG genre popularity in west is going down and there are plenty of good reason why this is happening.
MMORPG sites are now reporting all kind of games with any sort of multiplayer and even on many single player games, as a desperate attempt to hold visitors numbers. Aside of that some of previously mainly mmorpg sites had lay-offs and/or less work contracted to employees.
MMORPG genre has a lot of unsolved problems + it's popularity was artificial (most players that plays or have played MMORPG did not really want to play MMORPGs - they wanted to play an online game and were not interested in virtual world concept or many other MMORPG features or concepts).
Now genre and industry is scaling back and to be honest - it goes back to normal.
I don't envy MMORPG.com or other big MMORPG-focused sites though. They will suffer and branching out to cover almost every kind of games will not help in long run.
If the "problem" is that most don't care about classical "core" MMO design, then the solution is clear .. evolve to something different, which is what MMOs are doing anyway.
And you are right. Personally, i don't really like the original MMORPG design, and i find incorporating elements of other genre suits me ... and I don't particularly care if a game is a "true" MMO or not, as long as it is fun for me. I guess i am not alone.