WoW haters saying WoW players only stay because "they don't know better" is rather ironic...
(to explain for those who can't figure it out, many WoW players actually do leave WoW from time to time to try out other things, and in the end go back to WoW. Now, a WoW hater would probably just stick with the "They don't know better" or "they don't want to leave their stuff in WoW" explanation, but really, the most logical explanation is that WoW was better for them. Otherwise, they would have stuck with that other game...)
I've yet to see anyone post WHY other subscription games are better than WoW anyways. They always just use that lame "They don't know better" or "They don't want to leave their stuff in WoW behind" excuse without ever going into detail on what other sub games allegedly do BETTER than WoW.
Originally posted by hayes303 With the limits on f2p archeage accounts, I can't see anyone playing it that way long term. It would be like playing a facebook game.
What limits specifically? As a F2P I believe I can still enjoy all of the ArcheAge combat, graphics, PvP system and so forth. After all that's what the game is about - PvP. On top it will be a new experience/adventure.
You got better F2P MMO's to suggess that truly feels engaging in a persistant world with the community?
For a given definition of enjoyment, I suppose. The fact that Archeage is doing so terribly in other countries because so many people are tired of being sheep to the wolves seems to imply they aren't enjoying it much. I guess we'll see how it goes in this country but it's rather immature to say that 80-90% of the players will stick around as F2P when F2P is so restricted and perhaps more subtlely importantly, HUGELY DISADVANTAGED in a gear-based game. This is a game where gear makes a HUGE difference, and good luck keeping up in the gear race without a farm and on an F2P labor point regen rate (and also queues if those stick around).
WoW haters saying WoW players only stay because "they don't know better" is rather ironic...
(to explain for those who can't figure it out, the vast majority of WoW players actually do leave WoW from time to time to try out other things, and in the end go back to WoW. Now, a WoW hater would probably just stick with the "They don't know better" or "they don't want to leave their stuff in WoW" explanation, but really, the most logical explanation is that WoW was better for them. Otherwise, they would have stuck with that other game...)
I've yet to see anyone post WHY other subscription games are better than WoW anyways. They always just use that lame "They don't know better" or "They don't want to leave their stuff in WoW behind" excuse without ever going into detail on what other sub games allegedly do BETTER than WoW.
I feel like this is a challenge! what WoW does better than most mmo's is being more polished. I can't stand WoW and never could cause it doesn't appeal to the things i like or look for in a game.but we are all different and look for different things.Even tho i'm what many would call a hardcore WoW hater i'm not ignorant enough to just classify those who enjoy WoW into the they don't know better crowd or any crowd for that matter.
For me the only things WoW has ever impressed me with is Polish,endgame and customer support. Only time i have ever enjoyed WoW was in a group with a friend.Given if i could ever actually make it to end game without wanting to blow my brains out i might like it since in WoW anything that isn't endgame is just filler material and doesn't matter.The benefit to WoW is since they only truly focus on their endgame once you get there. there is so much to do,sadly it seems yearly that their goal is to make everything so simple and streamlined there is no real choices to make and anyone can play it. Just not my cub of tea.
WoW haters saying WoW players only stay because "they don't know better" is rather ironic...
(to explain for those who can't figure it out, the vast majority of WoW players actually do leave WoW from time to time to try out other things, and in the end go back to WoW. Now, a WoW hater would probably just stick with the "They don't know better" or "they don't want to leave their stuff in WoW" explanation, but really, the most logical explanation is that WoW was better for them. Otherwise, they would have stuck with that other game...)
I've yet to see anyone post WHY other subscription games are better than WoW anyways. They always just use that lame "They don't know better" or "They don't want to leave their stuff in WoW behind" excuse without ever going into detail on what other sub games allegedly do BETTER than WoW.
I feel like this is a challenge! what WoW does better than most mmo's is being more polished. I can't stand WoW and never could cause it doesn't appeal to the things i like or look for in a game.but we are all different and look for different things.Even tho i'm what many would call a hardcore WoW hater i'm not ignorant enough to just classify those who enjoy WoW into the they don't know better crowd or any crowd for that matter.
For me the only things WoW has ever impressed me with is Polish,endgame and customer support. Only time i have ever enjoyed WoW was in a group with a friend.Given if i could ever actually make it to end game without wanting to blow my brains out i might like it since in WoW anything that isn't endgame is just filler material and doesn't matter.The benefit to WoW is since they only truly focus on their endgame once you get there. there is so much to do,sadly it seems yearly that their goal is to make everything so simple and streamlined there is no real choices to make and anyone can play it. Just not my cub of tea.
This.... um........ to be really honest, this is exactly what I mean. You go into a whole host of reasons why you don't like WoW, but there's nothing about what makes a different game BETTER. From your post, if I were to accept it as true, you've listed several pros and cons of WoW, but you've given me absolutely nothing to COMPARE it to.
That's like saying "Oh, the grass is somewhat green on this side, not exactly a flavor I like, and it's really not my cup of tea. Meanwhile, the grass on that side is better (be it for me or in general) because *REDACTED CENSORED REMOVED*"
WoW haters saying WoW players only stay because "they don't know better" is rather ironic...
(to explain for those who can't figure it out, the vast majority of WoW players actually do leave WoW from time to time to try out other things, and in the end go back to WoW. Now, a WoW hater would probably just stick with the "They don't know better" or "they don't want to leave their stuff in WoW" explanation, but really, the most logical explanation is that WoW was better for them. Otherwise, they would have stuck with that other game...)
I've yet to see anyone post WHY other subscription games are better than WoW anyways. They always just use that lame "They don't know better" or "They don't want to leave their stuff in WoW behind" excuse without ever going into detail on what other sub games allegedly do BETTER than WoW.
I feel like this is a challenge! what WoW does better than most mmo's is being more polished. I can't stand WoW and never could cause it doesn't appeal to the things i like or look for in a game.but we are all different and look for different things.Even tho i'm what many would call a hardcore WoW hater i'm not ignorant enough to just classify those who enjoy WoW into the they don't know better crowd or any crowd for that matter.
For me the only things WoW has ever impressed me with is Polish,endgame and customer support. Only time i have ever enjoyed WoW was in a group with a friend.Given if i could ever actually make it to end game without wanting to blow my brains out i might like it since in WoW anything that isn't endgame is just filler material and doesn't matter.The benefit to WoW is since they only truly focus on their endgame once you get there. there is so much to do,sadly it seems yearly that their goal is to make everything so simple and streamlined there is no real choices to make and anyone can play it. Just not my cub of tea.
This.... um........ to be really honest, this is exactly what I mean. You go into a whole host of reasons why you don't like WoW, but there's nothing about what makes a different game BETTER. From your post, if I were to accept it as true, you've listed several pros and cons of WoW, but you've given me absolutely nothing to COMPARE it to.
That's like saying "Oh, the grass is somewhat green on this side, not exactly a flavor I like, and it's really not my cup of tea. Meanwhile, the grass on that side is better (be it for me or in general) because *REDACTED CENSORED REMOVED*"
that may be because saying one game is better or the best is totally subjective.An pretty much your asking me to do something i never would do.I'm just sharing why I am the WoW hater i am.What's best or better for a person is totally up to every single person to decide. not all WoW haters are closed minded trolls.
Sorry if i dont find comparing every single feature and system in a game or design choice a constructive discussion,that would go no where fast i would say.
AA isn't a great game, and you can see ample evidence on the official forums. I know it's routine for new F2P games to get a lot of bile on their own forums, but in this instance it's a whole new level of bile. The bile is even coming from Founders, and that crowd usually staunchly defend their game against all comers, at least for the first 3 or 4 months.
I've subbed for a month, which is what i usually do, so I'll see how it goes. It's screaming "generic Korean grinder" to me at the moment...
Obviously you didn't actually read the forum. 99% of complaints are about Trion , the publisher, not the game. Trion didn't seem to learn anything from the Russian release of the game or they could have handled the NA/EU release better. People have been asking for refund because Trion didn't give them their founder rewards and the queue times are 3-9 hours. A week into release and queue in EU servers start at 6am gmt til 2-3am gmt but Trion is still being cautious about bring up new servers. Don't even want to guess how many customers they have lost forever.
I don't think you can use the word best anymore, you have to go with least worst. Plus, it depends on the criteria you use for best, I played WoW for about 5 years from launch and enjoyed it, the only MMO I've really stuck with. But when I returned recently I thought it was a hollow shell of what it used to be. ArcheAge I can't comment as I only played for 30 minutes during beta, I will wait for it to become a ghost town before I return as it may be the type of MMO I am looking for - not as quest oriented and no end game raiding.
WoW haters saying WoW players only stay because "they don't know better" is rather ironic...
(to explain for those who can't figure it out, the vast majority of WoW players actually do leave WoW from time to time to try out other things, and in the end go back to WoW. Now, a WoW hater would probably just stick with the "They don't know better" or "they don't want to leave their stuff in WoW" explanation, but really, the most logical explanation is that WoW was better for them. Otherwise, they would have stuck with that other game...)
I've yet to see anyone post WHY other subscription games are better than WoW anyways. They always just use that lame "They don't know better" or "They don't want to leave their stuff in WoW behind" excuse without ever going into detail on what other sub games allegedly do BETTER than WoW.
I feel like this is a challenge! what WoW does better than most mmo's is being more polished. I can't stand WoW and never could cause it doesn't appeal to the things i like or look for in a game.but we are all different and look for different things.Even tho i'm what many would call a hardcore WoW hater i'm not ignorant enough to just classify those who enjoy WoW into the they don't know better crowd or any crowd for that matter.
For me the only things WoW has ever impressed me with is Polish,endgame and customer support. Only time i have ever enjoyed WoW was in a group with a friend.Given if i could ever actually make it to end game without wanting to blow my brains out i might like it since in WoW anything that isn't endgame is just filler material and doesn't matter.The benefit to WoW is since they only truly focus on their endgame once you get there. there is so much to do,sadly it seems yearly that their goal is to make everything so simple and streamlined there is no real choices to make and anyone can play it. Just not my cub of tea.
This.... um........ to be really honest, this is exactly what I mean. You go into a whole host of reasons why you don't like WoW, but there's nothing about what makes a different game BETTER. From your post, if I were to accept it as true, you've listed several pros and cons of WoW, but you've given me absolutely nothing to COMPARE it to.
That's like saying "Oh, the grass is somewhat green on this side, not exactly a flavor I like, and it's really not my cup of tea. Meanwhile, the grass on that side is better (be it for me or in general) because *REDACTED CENSORED REMOVED*"
that may be because saying one game is better or the best is totally subjective.An pretty much your asking me to do something i never would do.I'm just sharing why I am the WoW hater i am.What's best or better for a person is totally up to every single person to decide. not all WoW haters are closed minded trolls.
Sorry if i dont find comparing every single feature and system in a game or design choice a constructive discussion,that would go no where fast i would say.
Originally posted by maji How can ArcheAge be the best F2P game, if you can't do anything that's fun if you don't pay. And if ArcheAge is only fun if you pay, how can it be a F2P game?
I'm so tired of reading comments like this. The ONLY thing you can't do as a f2p player is own land. Get friends and you can use their land through the family system. You can still farm and craft, albeit at a slower rate due to reduced labor, although as a patron I typically have more labor than I need. Literally everything else in the game is fully accessible. All the zones, gear, vehicles, trading and PvP have no restrictions placed on them. If you only want to play to be a farmer, which I actually do understand as I find that portion of the game to be very enjoyable, then yes, you sort of need to be a patron. But you can make plenty of money in the game without owning your land through fishing, tradepacks, crafting or what-have-you. Also, you can make up for the labor difference through potions which you can buy in-game from other players. If you're talking about being the richest player on the server, then yes, you're at a distinct disadvantage, but that doesn't mean the game can't still be tremendously fun and that you can't be tremendously successful and well-off in game without paying a dime of real money.
I'm assuming your post was meant as a troll anyway, and I'm not trying to convince you as you likely won't be convinced, but I hope others will see this and realize how full of shit you are.
Archeage is a pretty awful game, people just haven't realized it yet. NO end game, piss poor PvE, mediocre PvP that is thrust on you so the carebear crowd will hate it. I expect most servers to be ghost worlds in under 3 months to be honest.
That's how the community goes:
*Complains the game is not sandbox* -> *makes comment about no end game*
*Complains about PvE* -> *OMG YOU PEOPLE ARE ALL CAREBEARS!*
Genius!
Just so people don't understand the connection:
Everything is so-called "end game" in a sandbox.
In sandbox, players define PvE by being so-called "carebear*.
WoW haters saying WoW players only stay because "they don't know better" is rather ironic...
(to explain for those who can't figure it out, the vast majority of WoW players actually do leave WoW from time to time to try out other things, and in the end go back to WoW. Now, a WoW hater would probably just stick with the "They don't know better" or "they don't want to leave their stuff in WoW" explanation, but really, the most logical explanation is that WoW was better for them. Otherwise, they would have stuck with that other game...)
I've yet to see anyone post WHY other subscription games are better than WoW anyways. They always just use that lame "They don't know better" or "They don't want to leave their stuff in WoW behind" excuse without ever going into detail on what other sub games allegedly do BETTER than WoW.
I feel like this is a challenge! what WoW does better than most mmo's is being more polished. I can't stand WoW and never could cause it doesn't appeal to the things i like or look for in a game.but we are all different and look for different things.Even tho i'm what many would call a hardcore WoW hater i'm not ignorant enough to just classify those who enjoy WoW into the they don't know better crowd or any crowd for that matter.
For me the only things WoW has ever impressed me with is Polish,endgame and customer support. Only time i have ever enjoyed WoW was in a group with a friend.Given if i could ever actually make it to end game without wanting to blow my brains out i might like it since in WoW anything that isn't endgame is just filler material and doesn't matter.The benefit to WoW is since they only truly focus on their endgame once you get there. there is so much to do,sadly it seems yearly that their goal is to make everything so simple and streamlined there is no real choices to make and anyone can play it. Just not my cub of tea.
This.... um........ to be really honest, this is exactly what I mean. You go into a whole host of reasons why you don't like WoW, but there's nothing about what makes a different game BETTER. From your post, if I were to accept it as true, you've listed several pros and cons of WoW, but you've given me absolutely nothing to COMPARE it to.
That's like saying "Oh, the grass is somewhat green on this side, not exactly a flavor I like, and it's really not my cup of tea. Meanwhile, the grass on that side is better (be it for me or in general) because *REDACTED CENSORED REMOVED*"
that may be because saying one game is better or the best is totally subjective.
Then why agree with a guy that said those that do like the game for their own subjective reasons simply "don't know any better?" Care to explain that?
Originally posted by Chrisbox Yea, a game that doesn't release content for 14 months is really the best p2p evur.
If you know anything about Blizzard you would know that they aren't the fastest releasing Game developer out there.
The formula worked for them i guess, being a multi billion dollar company.
I never looked at anything from a financial POV, what sells doesn't necessarily mean its a good move for the game. Just look at diablo 3......
If we're going to talk about money though, the amount of money and WoW subs they've been losing these past two years is rather large...perhaps that formula could use some revisiting.
I am playing AA as f2p at the moment. Its extremely restrictive. Basically you have to just grind quests, which are ok/mediocre. The combat again is just ok/mediocre. The game has some interesting stuff in it- the gliders are fun and boats are neat, but I don't see it as the best f2p option because 1) so much of the game is cut out from the f2p experience- its more of a trial with the sub payers having access to the full game, and 2) the overall feeling of game mechanics like combat is lacking.
I would put GW2, Tera, and NWO as the best f2p (or b2p) games I have played. GW2 has some amazing game mechanics. The feel of the combat and its detail and depth are unique among the mmos I have played. Tera also has a great combat system and the BAM fights and dungeon bosses are pretty epic. The graphics are also superb. NWO has a fairly good combat system, what I like about it though is that it feels something like a 3d version of Diablo. The graphics are not as nice as the other 2 games though, and it is not open world.
As for pay to play (sub games), that is actually something I am trying to figure out now. ESO was pretty good, but had some serious flaws, I tried the trial of FF14 and loved the feel of the game but the combat seemed lacklustre and the world was instanced in a confusing/annoying fashion, a sub to AA would allow me to get into some of its more interesting content- but do I really want to spend my time watching plants grow?, I thought the pve and combat in WoW was boring, although the new expansion looks like it has some interesting ideas for pve.
Hmmm, are any of these sub games even as good as GW2 or Tera anyway? Maybe AA because it at least offers something different?
There is nothing best about WOW anymore so stop trying to push it. It does what it always has....keeping player sucked in. Not cause it's better, cause they know no better.
Except for the fact that WoW players generally migrate to other newly released games, and keep coming back to WoW. So your opinion that they "don't know any better" really doesn't hold water, since many WoW players have actually tested other games and have not found the grass greener on the other side.
This is MMO players in general. I've been doing that for years, since before WOW was even a glimmer on Blizzard's radar. Yes, I quit and go back to my favorite < insert game here >. I've done it for EQ, EQ2, WOW, Shadowbane (RIP), and SWG (RIP and ,,!,, SOE ). WOW right now is my current game, but only because I'm interested in WoD (mainly garrisons). I quit during CATA and just now started back up.
WOW is the most successful P2P, but being the best is a matter of opinion. There are a few games with P2P options that I feel are superior to WOW. The only reason I'm not playing those is the simple fact that my buds aren't playing.
As far as AA being the best F2P, I really can't comment. I like the idea/concepts behind the game, but it is receiving far too much bad press due to their subscription model (among other things) for me to be willing to take the time to try it out.
Raquelis in various games Played: Everything Playing: Nioh 2, Civ6 Wants: The World Anticipating:Everquest NextCrowfall, Pantheon, Elden Ring
Have you tried ff14, I used to play wow i played for 3 years and i liked it now not so much between the aweful community and the revamping of the dungeons i lost intrest in the game. IMHO ff14 was a fresh new start and there is new content every 3 mths and to me thats worth the sub there is even a new xpac in october with 2 new classes to play in it and if you missed the old days of wow when things were not easy like i did there is real challenge in ff14.
P.S. the sub goes down the more time you buy at once.
Alright... OP I think your first issue is choosing between two completely different gameplay mindsets. If you want great PvE and meaningless PvP a WoW-type game would probably work. If you're willing to Pay, I'd try ESO (alot more meaningful PvP then most P2P games) or Wildstar until you think you've gotten your money's worth. If you don't want to pay try WoW for free or Rift first. If you want something more sandboxy/pvp oriented play ArcheAge. It probably has the best progression-based PvP without paying. Between WoW/Rift/Archeage there's a ton of content to try out for free first.
If you care about consistent and frequent content additions and high production values then there really is no better P2P MMO than FFXIV. WoW had this down but then they dropped the ball.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Comments
WoW haters saying WoW players only stay because "they don't know better" is rather ironic...
(to explain for those who can't figure it out, many WoW players actually do leave WoW from time to time to try out other things, and in the end go back to WoW. Now, a WoW hater would probably just stick with the "They don't know better" or "they don't want to leave their stuff in WoW" explanation, but really, the most logical explanation is that WoW was better for them. Otherwise, they would have stuck with that other game...)
I've yet to see anyone post WHY other subscription games are better than WoW anyways. They always just use that lame "They don't know better" or "They don't want to leave their stuff in WoW behind" excuse without ever going into detail on what other sub games allegedly do BETTER than WoW.
For a given definition of enjoyment, I suppose. The fact that Archeage is doing so terribly in other countries because so many people are tired of being sheep to the wolves seems to imply they aren't enjoying it much. I guess we'll see how it goes in this country but it's rather immature to say that 80-90% of the players will stick around as F2P when F2P is so restricted and perhaps more subtlely importantly, HUGELY DISADVANTAGED in a gear-based game. This is a game where gear makes a HUGE difference, and good luck keeping up in the gear race without a farm and on an F2P labor point regen rate (and also queues if those stick around).
I feel like this is a challenge! what WoW does better than most mmo's is being more polished. I can't stand WoW and never could cause it doesn't appeal to the things i like or look for in a game.but we are all different and look for different things.Even tho i'm what many would call a hardcore WoW hater i'm not ignorant enough to just classify those who enjoy WoW into the they don't know better crowd or any crowd for that matter.
For me the only things WoW has ever impressed me with is Polish,endgame and customer support. Only time i have ever enjoyed WoW was in a group with a friend.Given if i could ever actually make it to end game without wanting to blow my brains out i might like it since in WoW anything that isn't endgame is just filler material and doesn't matter.The benefit to WoW is since they only truly focus on their endgame once you get there. there is so much to do,sadly it seems yearly that their goal is to make everything so simple and streamlined there is no real choices to make and anyone can play it. Just not my cub of tea.
This.... um........ to be really honest, this is exactly what I mean. You go into a whole host of reasons why you don't like WoW, but there's nothing about what makes a different game BETTER. From your post, if I were to accept it as true, you've listed several pros and cons of WoW, but you've given me absolutely nothing to COMPARE it to.
That's like saying "Oh, the grass is somewhat green on this side, not exactly a flavor I like, and it's really not my cup of tea. Meanwhile, the grass on that side is better (be it for me or in general) because *REDACTED CENSORED REMOVED*"
that may be because saying one game is better or the best is totally subjective.An pretty much your asking me to do something i never would do.I'm just sharing why I am the WoW hater i am.What's best or better for a person is totally up to every single person to decide. not all WoW haters are closed minded trolls.
Sorry if i dont find comparing every single feature and system in a game or design choice a constructive discussion,that would go no where fast i would say.
Obviously you didn't actually read the forum. 99% of complaints are about Trion , the publisher, not the game. Trion didn't seem to learn anything from the Russian release of the game or they could have handled the NA/EU release better. People have been asking for refund because Trion didn't give them their founder rewards and the queue times are 3-9 hours. A week into release and queue in EU servers start at 6am gmt til 2-3am gmt but Trion is still being cautious about bring up new servers. Don't even want to guess how many customers they have lost forever.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
....okay, I guess.
yes and this is why I don't play mmos anymore look at the choises!
if its to difficult to make good mmos rather make good rpgs like dark souls.
I'm so tired of reading comments like this. The ONLY thing you can't do as a f2p player is own land. Get friends and you can use their land through the family system. You can still farm and craft, albeit at a slower rate due to reduced labor, although as a patron I typically have more labor than I need. Literally everything else in the game is fully accessible. All the zones, gear, vehicles, trading and PvP have no restrictions placed on them. If you only want to play to be a farmer, which I actually do understand as I find that portion of the game to be very enjoyable, then yes, you sort of need to be a patron. But you can make plenty of money in the game without owning your land through fishing, tradepacks, crafting or what-have-you. Also, you can make up for the labor difference through potions which you can buy in-game from other players. If you're talking about being the richest player on the server, then yes, you're at a distinct disadvantage, but that doesn't mean the game can't still be tremendously fun and that you can't be tremendously successful and well-off in game without paying a dime of real money.
I'm assuming your post was meant as a troll anyway, and I'm not trying to convince you as you likely won't be convinced, but I hope others will see this and realize how full of shit you are.
That's how the community goes:
*Complains the game is not sandbox* -> *makes comment about no end game*
*Complains about PvE* -> *OMG YOU PEOPLE ARE ALL CAREBEARS!*
Genius!
Just so people don't understand the connection:
Everything is so-called "end game" in a sandbox.
In sandbox, players define PvE by being so-called "carebear*.
Then why agree with a guy that said those that do like the game for their own subjective reasons simply "don't know any better?" Care to explain that?
If you know anything about Blizzard you would know that they aren't the fastest releasing Game developer out there.
The formula worked for them i guess, being a multi billion dollar company.
I would say the best P2P is Eve Online. If you're looking for a more traditional experience, Final Fantasy XIV is better than WoW currently, IMO.
While people are going to scream about it being technically B2P, Guild Wars 2 can't really be beat by any other free games in the genre currently.
I never looked at anything from a financial POV, what sells doesn't necessarily mean its a good move for the game. Just look at diablo 3......
If we're going to talk about money though, the amount of money and WoW subs they've been losing these past two years is rather large...perhaps that formula could use some revisiting.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
best P2P: WOW?agree. but since now I don‘t know anything about WoD, so can't judge
However? ArcheAge performs quite normal. Even WoT is better than it, I think
I am playing AA as f2p at the moment. Its extremely restrictive. Basically you have to just grind quests, which are ok/mediocre. The combat again is just ok/mediocre. The game has some interesting stuff in it- the gliders are fun and boats are neat, but I don't see it as the best f2p option because 1) so much of the game is cut out from the f2p experience- its more of a trial with the sub payers having access to the full game, and 2) the overall feeling of game mechanics like combat is lacking.
I would put GW2, Tera, and NWO as the best f2p (or b2p) games I have played. GW2 has some amazing game mechanics. The feel of the combat and its detail and depth are unique among the mmos I have played. Tera also has a great combat system and the BAM fights and dungeon bosses are pretty epic. The graphics are also superb. NWO has a fairly good combat system, what I like about it though is that it feels something like a 3d version of Diablo. The graphics are not as nice as the other 2 games though, and it is not open world.
As for pay to play (sub games), that is actually something I am trying to figure out now. ESO was pretty good, but had some serious flaws, I tried the trial of FF14 and loved the feel of the game but the combat seemed lacklustre and the world was instanced in a confusing/annoying fashion, a sub to AA would allow me to get into some of its more interesting content- but do I really want to spend my time watching plants grow?, I thought the pve and combat in WoW was boring, although the new expansion looks like it has some interesting ideas for pve.
Hmmm, are any of these sub games even as good as GW2 or Tera anyway? Maybe AA because it at least offers something different?
This is MMO players in general. I've been doing that for years, since before WOW was even a glimmer on Blizzard's radar. Yes, I quit and go back to my favorite < insert game here >. I've done it for EQ, EQ2, WOW, Shadowbane (RIP), and SWG (RIP and ,,!,, SOE ). WOW right now is my current game, but only because I'm interested in WoD (mainly garrisons). I quit during CATA and just now started back up.
WOW is the most successful P2P, but being the best is a matter of opinion. There are a few games with P2P options that I feel are superior to WOW. The only reason I'm not playing those is the simple fact that my buds aren't playing.
As far as AA being the best F2P, I really can't comment. I like the idea/concepts behind the game, but it is receiving far too much bad press due to their subscription model (among other things) for me to be willing to take the time to try it out.
Raquelis in various games
Played: Everything
Playing: Nioh 2, Civ6
Wants: The World
Anticipating: Everquest Next Crowfall, Pantheon, Elden Ring
Have you tried ff14, I used to play wow i played for 3 years and i liked it now not so much between the aweful community and the revamping of the dungeons i lost intrest in the game. IMHO ff14 was a fresh new start and there is new content every 3 mths and to me thats worth the sub there is even a new xpac in october with 2 new classes to play in it and if you missed the old days of wow when things were not easy like i did there is real challenge in ff14.
P.S. the sub goes down the more time you buy at once.
Best PTP: Elder Scrolls Online or Final Fantasy XIV
Best FTP: TERA or Rift or Aion
Alright... OP I think your first issue is choosing between two completely different gameplay mindsets. If you want great PvE and meaningless PvP a WoW-type game would probably work. If you're willing to Pay, I'd try ESO (alot more meaningful PvP then most P2P games) or Wildstar until you think you've gotten your money's worth. If you don't want to pay try WoW for free or Rift first. If you want something more sandboxy/pvp oriented play ArcheAge. It probably has the best progression-based PvP without paying. Between WoW/Rift/Archeage there's a ton of content to try out for free first.
If you care about consistent and frequent content additions and high production values then there really is no better P2P MMO than FFXIV. WoW had this down but then they dropped the ball.
For me WoW and archeage are bad games but we all like different things..
Good luck in finding a game OP.