Continuing on the value train, the majority of shooters these days consist of a short campaign and rely heavily on their multiplayer. Again, the campaign in Destiny is much longer than the average shooter, it offers the same multiplayer, plus it extends the gameplay by offering PvE content such as dungeons and raids that are geared to your level, so you can, effectively, choose your difficulty.
One last thing on value. You took a dig at DLC but, again, every game these days releases with Season Pass pre-purchases for $40 or $50. Normally what this means for FPS player is that we get 4 or 5 multiplayer maps each quarter. There has NEVER been, in my memory an FPS that actually offered additional story missions. Fact: It's just too expensive to develop additional story missions. However, for the same dollar amount Destiny is saying they will be offering maps, plus story content, plus PvE content (ie raids/dungeons). Huh..... Something here seems amiss.
So because most FPS's are a rip job, that means it's ok for Destiny an FPS-RPG to be one?
I guess Dev's were just more talented in the past. They could make an FPS, add more maps for free and still make a killer profit. So much so that so that they created a multi-billion dollar industry that's now bigger than the movie's.
Whats amiss is that many consumer's are not happy with the quantity they are being delivered for what they're forking out. This includes other franchises in the FPS genre as well.
Then what's the context? How is it that we grade these equally inferior, content-lacking, games 8/10, 9/10 year-over-year?
Also, what a distorted "value" system we have these days. I can't take my family to the movies for less than $100. Shoot, I'd be lucky to have a night out with my wife (dinner and a movie) for less than $100.
I used the FPS genre as a fair, contextually-specific comparison. If I'm making a 2D side-scroller, I could create something procedurally-generated and make you play infinitely. Does that mean it's a greater value? Or does it provide more longevity? Shoot, these days, most 3D games, in general, are less than 20 hours. Check out howlongtobeat.com.
I think that what you're looking for is unrealistic. You're asking for a game that will provide you with an amount of content that is unreasonable based on it's peers. It's all about context. Sorry. Maybe since Destiny blurs the line or suffers from an identity-crisis, they open themselves up for that, but make no mistake, this IS a good value and it does provide more longevity than many games. Sorry, just a fact.
Don't get me started on the movies I stopped going to them when they added TV commercials into the mix. Guess what if everyone stopped going because of the TV commercials, there would be any. Been almost 3 years since I walked into a new release. Maybe those big stars could accept 20 million per picture instead of 50.
It all comes down to what kind of a standard is acceptable. And the more that we lower the standard of what we will accept, the more that standards will be lowered.
They'll shovel you shit if you will accept it. If 10hr campaigns are not acceptable to the consumer, guess what? They will supply more.
Destiny might be a good value for some, but not to all. Holding games up to a higher standard benefits all.
Agreed, but it's sort of a double-edged sword, right? If we don't make those same demands on every game then it creates a problem. It's like letting the "bad" child get away with playing with matches because he didn't punch anyone in the face today. Yet, again, new Titanfall DLC (9/10 rated game) releases a new DLC today with 3 whole new maps!!!! Whoa!!
That's what I'm trying to say here. I'm not trying make excuses for things like poor story-telling or poorly-implemented concepts. What I'm not going to let go, though, is saying it's not a good value or doesn't provide longevity. It's like giving Skyrim a 5/10 for value and longevity, basically. What is enough content? How much do we want? Personally, I think that a 15-20 hour story is nice. I mean give me some stuff to fill my time after than, give me the time sinks, but the campaign doesn't have to be 40 or 50 hours to impress me. Actually, games like Morrowind are artificially higher because of walking. Do I want Destiny to throw in a bunch on filler (like making me march 10km to a target?) Nope, I'm good with getting dropped relatively close to my target.
Continuing on the value train, the majority of shooters these days consist of a short campaign and rely heavily on their multiplayer. Again, the campaign in Destiny is much longer than the average shooter, it offers the same multiplayer, plus it extends the gameplay by offering PvE content such as dungeons and raids that are geared to your level, so you can, effectively, choose your difficulty.
One last thing on value. You took a dig at DLC but, again, every game these days releases with Season Pass pre-purchases for $40 or $50. Normally what this means for FPS player is that we get 4 or 5 multiplayer maps each quarter. There has NEVER been, in my memory an FPS that actually offered additional story missions. Fact: It's just too expensive to develop additional story missions. However, for the same dollar amount Destiny is saying they will be offering maps, plus story content, plus PvE content (ie raids/dungeons). Huh..... Something here seems amiss.
So because most FPS's are a rip job, that means it's ok for Destiny an FPS-RPG to be one?
I guess Dev's were just more talented in the past. They could make an FPS, add more maps for free and still make a killer profit. So much so that so that they created a multi-billion dollar industry that's now bigger than the movie's.
Whats amiss is that many consumer's are not happy with the quantity they are being delivered for what they're forking out. This includes other franchises in the FPS genre as well.
Then what's the context? How is it that we grade these equally inferior, content-lacking, games 8/10, 9/10 year-over-year?
Also, what a distorted "value" system we have these days. I can't take my family to the movies for less than $100. Shoot, I'd be lucky to have a night out with my wife (dinner and a movie) for less than $100.
I used the FPS genre as a fair, contextually-specific comparison. If I'm making a 2D side-scroller, I could create something procedurally-generated and make you play infinitely. Does that mean it's a greater value? Or does it provide more longevity? Shoot, these days, most 3D games, in general, are less than 20 hours. Check out howlongtobeat.com.
I think that what you're looking for is unrealistic. You're asking for a game that will provide you with an amount of content that is unreasonable based on it's peers. It's all about context. Sorry. Maybe since Destiny blurs the line or suffers from an identity-crisis, they open themselves up for that, but make no mistake, this IS a good value and it does provide more longevity than many games. Sorry, just a fact.
Don't get me started on the movies I stopped going to them when they added TV commercials into the mix. Guess what if everyone stopped going because of the TV commercials, there would be any. Been almost 3 years since I walked into a new release. Maybe those big stars could accept 20 million per picture instead of 50.
It all comes down to what kind of a standard is acceptable. And the more that we lower the standard of what we will accept, the more that standards will be lowered.
They'll shovel you shit if you will accept it. If 10hr campaigns are not acceptable to the consumer, guess what? They will supply more.
Destiny might be a good value for some, but not to all. Holding games up to a higher standard benefits all.
I will say that the value of Destiny completely falls under your personal type gaming. Hardcore/no-lifers will most likely burn out on the game quickly (per usual). Those who play the game more casually, will be there for the longer haul.
Destiny seems to be falling into the same category as many newer release mmo style games. They tend to launch with a small amount of content (overall), and then have value added over the course of time. Someone who tries Destiny for the first time a year from now will most likely have a very different experience than most of the early adopters.
The bigger question we should be asking is what impact will this poorly received game will have on the PC user? If the amount of congruent users drops rapidly before the first DLC launch will they scrap the PC version completely or will they speed up production? There's probably not a super great metric on how to determine average hours spent in game console vs. PC, but from a observers stand point, PC gamers seemingly have more staying power to a single title, especially if you look at the amount of users still playing older mmos like UO and EQ1. Would Destiny fare better or worse as a PC title?
It's going to be interesting to see how well Destiny can grow over time.
Originally posted by mayito7777 Well the company that made this game is spending millions of dollars in TV commercials portraying this game as the best thing ever under the Sun.
Totally ignoring the fact that a lot of people, including myself, eschew television. I have not seen a single ad... but the fact that it's console exclusive for the time being makes it a non-factor for me.
I'd knock the visuals down to 9 and longevity to 5 - but overall the review is spot on.
Destiny is fun for the first 15-20 hours for sure, then it nosedives due to repetition and bullet sponge mechanics.
I didn't spend a dime on it (played it at friends house on XBone) so again I am pretty ambivalent as I dont have any personal stake in Destiny (I didn't spend any money on it).
The bullet sponge has been pretty much debunked already. Learn 2 Play directly applies here.
I have seen a whole bunch of people spend over 15 minutes taking down a Fallen Walker (tank) in a Public Event and same in the Devil's Eye Strike.
But when you know it's weak spots, I managed to take one down within 5 minutes solo. There is one on Earth (same spot as in the strike) you can take on during Patrol mode.
It's the same with the endboss in Devil's Eye strike for example. First time we spend over 15-20 minutes trying to take him down. Next time and follow up times we took him down within a few minutes. Again, when you know where to hit him and cooperate with eachother.
Same for Vault of Glass. Most People still spend over 12 hours completing it. Some got better and manage to Complete it now within 4 hours.
But! The current record of completing Vault of Glass now stands on 32 minutes!
These kind of complains are nothing new really. You see it in pretty much every MMO. /shrug
Back to the review. 7 out of 10 is a perfectly fair score. Same as I would have given.
Summed up the pro's and con's nicely.
I still having a blast with the game. Just reached Level 24 today with my Titan. Still haven't finished the main story lol. Too much fun roaming around the planets, having fun exploring and shoot stuff and being blown to pieces by a sudden ambush lol.
You listed the ui as a pro then in the ratings you said the ui needs work. Hahahahah, without "graphics" calculation and "polish" it seems a 7 is generously given, we got a $500,000,000 pile. Good job Bungie, way to fail.
This 500,000,000 figure is more urban legend than reality. Even with the over-excessive and very expensive marketing on behalf of Activision i do not believe that Destiny costed 500 millions. The number is way to high to be real.
Don't get me started on the movies I stopped going to them when they added TV commercials into the mix. Guess what if everyone stopped going because of the TV commercials, there would be any. Been almost 3 years since I walked into a new release. Maybe those big stars could accept 20 million per picture instead of 50.
It all comes down to what kind of a standard is acceptable. And the more that we lower the standard of what we will accept, the more that standards will be lowered.
They'll shovel you shit if you will accept it. If 10hr campaigns are not acceptable to the consumer, guess what? They will supply more.
Destiny might be a good value for some, but not to all. Holding games up to a higher standard benefits all.
Agreed, but it's sort of a double-edged sword, right? If we don't make those same demands on every game then it creates a problem. It's like letting the "bad" child get away with playing with matches because he didn't punch anyone in the face today. Yet, again, new Titanfall DLC (9/10 rated game) releases a new DLC today with 3 whole new maps!!!! Whoa!!
That's what I'm trying to say here. I'm not trying make excuses for things like poor story-telling or poorly-implemented concepts. What I'm not going to let go, though, is saying it's not a good value or doesn't provide longevity. It's like giving Skyrim a 5/10 for value and longevity, basically. What is enough content? How much do we want? Personally, I think that a 15-20 hour story is nice. I mean give me some stuff to fill my time after than, give me the time sinks, but the campaign doesn't have to be 40 or 50 hours to impress me. Actually, games like Morrowind are artificially higher because of walking. Do I want Destiny to throw in a bunch on filler (like making me march 10km to a target?) Nope, I'm good with getting dropped relatively close to my target.
And I understand where your coming from.
Reviews should also be held up to a standard. I don't put much credence into the review score of a game in question. I personally listen to what the reviewer and user's have to say about the game. I find it pretty easy to tell the fanboi from the hater to the everyday joe blow who is just giving you his honest experiances with the game.
Maybe it's my age and the wisdom that comes along with it. But I see Skyrim is a game that is honestly trying to give you alot of bang for your buck. And I see Destiny as a game that is trying to popularize a business model that could be ok, but seems to be more about maximizing profit's. The amount of content in these upcoming DLC's will paint a truer picture. I'm sure very many could give a crap about more PVP maps as we've all been dare done dat a hundred times. It's the campaign story that really going to popularize this game or not. And it's the amount of campaign for dollar that is going to leave people feeling satisfied or swindled.
It's campaign play that I'm interested in, coop and single player.
Personally $1 per hour of campaign play leaves me quite satisfied, 0.5$ an hour I feel I've gotten a great value and $2 an hour I feel I just got ripped.
Remember the game is being marketed as being heavy in story and lore.
Noise has been made about Dinklage's voice work, well maybe if he had a story that wasn't such a boring cliched re-hash to work with he would have done better....
pretty fair review. I'd given it a 6 or 7 as well. I was a huge supporter of destiny, and I feel I got my money's worth out of it.
story is bad. IT is really bad, the grimoires are great but the beginning to end game story is pretty sad considering.
pve combat, you can play around with weapons a lot. In pvp, its mostly auto rifles and shotties. The pvp is smooth and fun, but there is not a lot of variety in it for a "loot" game.
Faction grinds. Why i am done. I left wow because of this, i leave a lot of games because of this. Once i have to do a chore in a game to enjoy my entertainment that's all for me.
Planets are not open, the game is full of boundaries in the "open worlds". It was a let down because of what bungy said about the planets and zones. The areas may be big, but after teh first mission you are on a speeder and it takes less than 2 minutes to really get anywhere. Most , if not, all zones have roads lined up for you to hold your hand.
gathering , is really just for rep and upgrading weapons. There is no crafting of weapons really, it's basically "you can upgrade this click it". Same with armors.
you get ships...but they are just wallpapers for your loading screen...that is all. seriously..that's their purpose.
The mobs are shallow scripted. The most fun thing to do in pve for most people in destiny is go to a location where mobs just keep spawning. It's like farming in lineage or MU or some other game. you tube "we've woken the hive farm" or "treasure cave". This is what people are doing. They are doing this because farming the same mob for 100 hours yields better results than the faction grind or gamble on the cryptarch.
next is the social aspect. I see a ton of people all over. I play with them in pvp. I can't ask them if they need help or to stay at B while i see who is defending C. There is no socializing with people you run into. Just 4 emotes...it's sad.
Despite all my negatives , it may seem like i didn't enjoy the game. I enjoyed it for 2 weeks. I played a lot, it was beautiful, pvp was engaging, and i did the strikes and all. I simply turned it off because who wants to spend their free time doing chores...maybe i am just at an old age. I haven't done the queen's event because the chore isn't worth the reward for me.
i hate to say it but borderlands 1 and 2, provide much much much more for less. PvP would be your only reason to play longterm and again, the pvp fps powerhouses have much more to offer.
Don't get me started on the movies I stopped going to them when they added TV commercials into the mix. Guess what if everyone stopped going because of the TV commercials, there would be any. Been almost 3 years since I walked into a new release. Maybe those big stars could accept 20 million per picture instead of 50.
It all comes down to what kind of a standard is acceptable. And the more that we lower the standard of what we will accept, the more that standards will be lowered.
They'll shovel you shit if you will accept it. If 10hr campaigns are not acceptable to the consumer, guess what? They will supply more.
Destiny might be a good value for some, but not to all. Holding games up to a higher standard benefits all.
Agreed, but it's sort of a double-edged sword, right? If we don't make those same demands on every game then it creates a problem. It's like letting the "bad" child get away with playing with matches because he didn't punch anyone in the face today. Yet, again, new Titanfall DLC (9/10 rated game) releases a new DLC today with 3 whole new maps!!!! Whoa!!
That's what I'm trying to say here. I'm not trying make excuses for things like poor story-telling or poorly-implemented concepts. What I'm not going to let go, though, is saying it's not a good value or doesn't provide longevity. It's like giving Skyrim a 5/10 for value and longevity, basically. What is enough content? How much do we want? Personally, I think that a 15-20 hour story is nice. I mean give me some stuff to fill my time after than, give me the time sinks, but the campaign doesn't have to be 40 or 50 hours to impress me. Actually, games like Morrowind are artificially higher because of walking. Do I want Destiny to throw in a bunch on filler (like making me march 10km to a target?) Nope, I'm good with getting dropped relatively close to my target.
And I understand where your coming from.
Reviews should also be held up to a standard. I don't put much credence into the review score of a game in question. I personally listen to what the reviewer and user's have to say about the game. I find it pretty easy to tell the fanboi from the hater to the everyday joe blow who is just giving you his honest experiances with the game.
Maybe it's my age and the wisdom that comes along with it. But I see Skyrim is a game that is honestly trying to give you alot of bang for your buck. And I see Destiny as a game that is trying to popularize a business model that could be ok, but seems to be more about maximizing profit's. The amount of content in these upcoming DLC's will paint a truer picture. I'm sure very many could give a crap about more PVP maps as we've all been dare done dat a hundred times. It's the campaign story that really going to popularize this game or not. And it's the amount of campaign for dollar that is going to leave people feeling satisfied or swindled.
It's campaign play that I'm interested in, coop and single player.
Personally $1 per hour of campaign play leaves me quite satisfied, 0.5$ an hour I feel I've gotten a great value and $2 an hour I feel I just got ripped.
Remember the game is being marketed as being heavy in story and lore.
As far as value goes, for me, first and foremost I want to be entertained. I can justify paying for content I know will keep me busy outside of a campaign. However, I absolutely need a story with the game. That's where I feel Destiny really fell down. I mean it's not to say that there isn't a story there. It isn't to say there isn't a conclusion. I just felt like there could have been a more definitive conclusion, you know? I appreciate we didn't eradicate all the baddies and they might be back at some point, but to a certain degree I felt a little like "Did I win?"
I totally agree that the content will determine the course for the game. So I'm really hoping it will be a good amount of content and will do more to develop the story. I don't mind paying quarterly if they'll deliver me a good amount of content in that time.
I agree with you about Skyrim, but let's not forget that even Skyrim had DLC.
I think that the biggest problem with Destiny's story and lore, could be (don't know yet) that it's actually too deep to deliver in a single sitting. Like I mentioned above, it feels a bit anti-climactic, despite a pretty satisfying final boss. It could simply be that it was left a little too open, all like "and that's another story for another day"-style. Dammit!! Just give me a medal, tell me everything is awesome and I saved the universe as Darth Vader's Tie Fighter floats off into space with him still alive inside. I think it's the presentation of the end over the actual end itself.
I can't even say that much about the final score, honestly. If I were to rate it, I may end up dropping a couple points from social, and one or two from graphics, but bumping the value and longevity scores up. The end result may not actually be that different, if at all.
Just for the record, I'll be playing Shadow of Mordor come next week, and I'll be playing a bunch of WoW this weekend, so is it compelling enough to keep me playing and shelving other games that I'm really interested in play? No. It's not. That being said, it's compelling enough to have me come back on a weekly basis, run my weekly strikes and missions and even farm for a bit. Despite the unreasonably low drop rates in this game, I can farm the "loot cave" and get rares at a rate of like 10 or 15 an hour, and even though that is really repetitive, the "lottery" factor of the engrams is just outstanding, and if I've got a half hour to burn, I'm not going to get involved with a mission, I'll just go there and pick up a couple items. So there is definitely plenty of options for progression in the game, which is actually a really nice change over the singular progression you see in most games.
This is a fair score, although I found AJ's more accurate. I agree with Nevulus in that the first game that came to mind was Borderlands as far as games to weigh against and imo when compared to that series, Destiny is nowhere close. Me and my closest are all completely in love with those games and it is mostly BECAUSE of BL that I decided to play Destiny. Needless to say I am pretty disappointed, although I hold hope that it improves. Destiny is pretty small in comparison to other FPS I have played and the developers do a lazy job covering it up with their missions that have players running back and forth to the exact same spots to complete tasks. Value is subjective but I will say the value sucks at the moment and I can understand why people are blasting it.
Please do not use a 10 for any category. It should reserved for the greatest you have ever seen. If it needs UI changes for a PC version, then chances are that it is not the best of it's time.
First paragraph was all I had to read to see that you just don't get it... at all...
The story, history, characters, and universe Bungie has crafted for Destiny, which will be revealed and reveled in over the next decade is absolutely top-notch science fiction.
People just don't seem to understand something that isn't neatly placed inside a tiny little box for your immediate consumption.
What ever happened to having a sense of wonder, leaving questions unanswered and having mysteries to solve? People got lazy, and so used to having everything spoon fed to them in nice little packages they forgot how to dream and truly be in awe of the unknown and discovery.
Very sad.
I haven't been super impressed with the post-release content they've been dishing out, but I'm still thoroughly addicted and engrossed in crafting the best Guardian I can be. I'm also playing the game nearly 100% in co-op with friends, like minded individuals who can "see the forest for the trees" so to speak, so that certainly helps create a more engaging experience.
I do greatly appreciate the variety in modifiers Bungie has been throwing into the daily story and weekly heroics, as well as now the Queen's missions. Certainly adds another layer of complexity and challenge.
I don't often do Crucible, yet always seem to joyfully fill my many hours of Destiny played thus far, barely any of it spent shooting into a cave
It's a multiplayer shooter that isn't even on PC and has everyone and their dog talking about..and buying. If anything it showed that the 200 million on advertising made them more money than the 300 million they spent on the game.
That doesn't say much for all the people giving this game negative reviews so early after launch.
I agree with the content of the review, the text portion but the actual score numbers used on this site make me wonder why they have a 1 to 10 scale when just about every game gets a score within one point of a 7.3
Mortal Online - 6.2
Archeage - 6.6
STO - 7.4
PotBS - 7.4
Wildstar gets a 8.4 and then a column asking "What went wrong"
There is no way these games are all in the same class
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
Reviews should be consistent so can Bill compare / justify how:
Destiny gets a 5 for value - seems to be the cost of that DLC / console costs
Wildstar gets an 8 - only $60 to buy and the $15 is well worth while providing Carbine can keep the monthly content drops - whoops!
TESO gets a 8 - again no problem with the sub and, again, content drops are now every other 8-12 weeks.
Not consistent. Factor in:
that PCs are generally more expensive
console membership service (if needed) also gives you e.g. free games
you can get a trial membership if all you want is to do the first 20 hours
And as you do factor in console membership you should factor in that as a result you get built in voice communication and (a form of) friends list
and I struggle.
If you are going to score TESO & WS high on longevity because they have lots of content - fine. But you then need to take into account that playing the 100s of hours of content will cost you 100s of dollars. And score the game accordingly when it comes to value.
If you are going to say its a short campaign then you should judge the value simply on the cost of the campaign. If you are going to weigh the cost of the DLC then you need to factor in what the DLC adds to the story etc. - which we don't know.
I could continue. Destiny gets an 8 for Polish - lack of social UI (despite that being a factor in the social score) but otherwise smooth as silk. So a game with frame rate issues, bugs, UI issues ... that would be a lower score maybe. Absolutely not: Wildstar got an 8 as well.
And a game in which you can't group would score a 6 like Destiny ... nope TESO got an 8.
Innovation: why does it get a 7? If its all been done before give it (and other games) a 0. Was that the fps game being reviewed though or the mmo or the rpg?
I have no issue with reviewers saying what they feel: maybe commenting that only the initial levels have been reviewed and not Vault of Glass / the events (in which bosses and even mobs become much smarter) but no problem. The review is just that but a bit of consistency is expected.
It's a multiplayer shooter that isn't even on PC and has everyone and their dog talking about..and buying. If anything it showed that the 200 million on advertising made them more money than the 300 million they spent on the game.
That doesn't say much for all the people giving this game negative reviews so early after launch.
Just as a bit of perspective, BL2 alone has sold over 8.5M copies (as of Feb 2014) and reported to be 10M as of August. It is still selling strong 2 years later. For success with a single player title with a multi-player component GTA V has grossed over $2Bn in revenue and will release to Steam early next year.
The game is successful, but not any more so than some of its peers (CoD, GoW, BF3). This seems about normal for a highly advertised console title. I think the test will be its staying power and how interested people are down the road. Will they keep clamoring for more DLC? Will they want to see sequels like they have with the FPS I mentioned above or Halo and Mass Effect?
Just FYI, validity completely up in the air and simply for the "huh, interesting" factor. Vgchartz shows BL2 as having sold 5.5 million copies (though mostly on console). It would actually, almost literally be 4.5 million on console alone. Interestingly enough, Destiny shows about 4.5 million in sales across all 4 consoles it's on.
If we accept that the only near valid data on vgchartz at the moment is console retail sales, then Destiny is at least healthy.
Don't agree with you adding xbox live or psn+ as a negative. When you get xbox live it benefits more than just this game and most people don't buy a console to play one game exclusively.
I agree, social score should be no higher than 2 since there is NONE. Give me a chat area on the Tower at least for God's sake so I can find groups when I want too. Is that asking too much since we're in the 21st Century and all that with all the communication tools we have available to us?
I admit, I'm a loner and usually solo things, but if I want to join a group for things, they should give us the tools to do just that. Hell Defiance took a buttload of crap for their terrible chat system, but at least they included one at launch lol. I've tried the sign language emotes to get people interested in teaming up with me, but sadly, "point, point, wave, dance, dance" does not do the trick and they are left wondering wtf I'm even doing.
I wouldn't rate this game any higher than a 5.8 or possibly a generous 6. I don't get paid by them for my score so I won't hold back.
How, if the social and communications is lacking as stated in the cons, does Social score a 6?
I think this is another carefully worded review aimed at not pissing off the publisher.
It's because it is extremely easy to play with people that are already your friends on PSN and XBox Live. It also has the dynamic events in the open world "patrol" maps that groups of people can converge on and play together. The match making for Strikes and PvP is also functional. 6 is a below average and failing score. Compared to what most MMO gamers are used to, however, it is not up to snuff.
I somewhat agree with that response....But the biggest issue is sometimes wanting to group with a player you see in the region that is possibly working on the same content. They make it hard, at least on the PS4, to accept invites. You must toggle out of the game via the PS button and accept it through the notifications menu. They couldnt make it to do this in game via the options button and have an accept or decline window when you first hit the button? Also the invite notifications is not very noticeable when you are so engrossed in a fight. The banner only shows for a few seconds. First time it popped up I thought it was an achievement, so I ignored it and didnt read what it really said. 20 mins later, when I logged out, I then saw what it was. Better score for social would be 4.0.
There has NEVER been, in my memory an FPS that actually offered additional story missions.
Borderlands 1, borderlands 2.
Just like that I proved your entire reply invalid. There are many FPS with 16-40 hour gameplay content, and NOT just multiplayer maps. Stop defending a money-grab. It's NOT OK for companies to rip people off and purposely break down content into day/week one DLCs.
If you think it's OK to rip the consumer off with multiple DLCs & broken stories, then YOU ARE THE PROBLEM.
Totally agree with you, Nevulus. To me the game is fun, but its lacking so many things that would make the game feel less incomplete (story, content AND quality of life small features) that you would think the game didnt have even a fraction of the budget it had. You can see all the money went into marketing. I do think that they left all that out of the game to add them as part of their greedy dlc stuff.
I dont mind buying dlc, i just hate that companies now use dlc and expansions to fill incomplete portions of the game instead of adding new stuff.
I applaud MMORPG with all my heart. I was about to buy the PS4 only to play Destiny, and I've seen several reviews about the game. This is probably the most accurate one. I knew it was far too good to be true.
Certainly, I applaud, again, because MMORPG leaves every misconception and previous judgment about one of the most anticipated games this year. They throw every political aspect and bring the hammer down on Bungie.
First off I am not a FPS fan, I tend to stay away from them.
I am level 25 so far and still not done the story mission as I have been enjoying the game play via patrols and pvp matches.
Did my first raid at level 24 with a really nice group and we got past the first boss and into a cave system, this is where I had to log out as it was getting late in the night for me. But what I did experience I enjoyed.
I have a feeling that the game will open up more as more DLC is added in the future so I would not pull the curtains to quickly on this game.
As for the writing and story line yes it is generic and flat, but its a FPS game with RPG elements at the end of the day so what do you expect?
If it was being sold as a RPG game first with FPS elements to it like Mass Effect was then it would be a different matter, for me at least. I just want to log into the game and shoot people in the face. Also its a better game experience than CCP's wet effort which is called Dust 514.
Comments
Agreed, but it's sort of a double-edged sword, right? If we don't make those same demands on every game then it creates a problem. It's like letting the "bad" child get away with playing with matches because he didn't punch anyone in the face today. Yet, again, new Titanfall DLC (9/10 rated game) releases a new DLC today with 3 whole new maps!!!! Whoa!!
That's what I'm trying to say here. I'm not trying make excuses for things like poor story-telling or poorly-implemented concepts. What I'm not going to let go, though, is saying it's not a good value or doesn't provide longevity. It's like giving Skyrim a 5/10 for value and longevity, basically. What is enough content? How much do we want? Personally, I think that a 15-20 hour story is nice. I mean give me some stuff to fill my time after than, give me the time sinks, but the campaign doesn't have to be 40 or 50 hours to impress me. Actually, games like Morrowind are artificially higher because of walking. Do I want Destiny to throw in a bunch on filler (like making me march 10km to a target?) Nope, I'm good with getting dropped relatively close to my target.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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I will say that the value of Destiny completely falls under your personal type gaming. Hardcore/no-lifers will most likely burn out on the game quickly (per usual). Those who play the game more casually, will be there for the longer haul.
Destiny seems to be falling into the same category as many newer release mmo style games. They tend to launch with a small amount of content (overall), and then have value added over the course of time. Someone who tries Destiny for the first time a year from now will most likely have a very different experience than most of the early adopters.
The bigger question we should be asking is what impact will this poorly received game will have on the PC user? If the amount of congruent users drops rapidly before the first DLC launch will they scrap the PC version completely or will they speed up production? There's probably not a super great metric on how to determine average hours spent in game console vs. PC, but from a observers stand point, PC gamers seemingly have more staying power to a single title, especially if you look at the amount of users still playing older mmos like UO and EQ1. Would Destiny fare better or worse as a PC title?
It's going to be interesting to see how well Destiny can grow over time.
Totally ignoring the fact that a lot of people, including myself, eschew television. I have not seen a single ad... but the fact that it's console exclusive for the time being makes it a non-factor for me.
The bullet sponge has been pretty much debunked already. Learn 2 Play directly applies here.
I have seen a whole bunch of people spend over 15 minutes taking down a Fallen Walker (tank) in a Public Event and same in the Devil's Eye Strike.
But when you know it's weak spots, I managed to take one down within 5 minutes solo. There is one on Earth (same spot as in the strike) you can take on during Patrol mode.
It's the same with the endboss in Devil's Eye strike for example. First time we spend over 15-20 minutes trying to take him down. Next time and follow up times we took him down within a few minutes. Again, when you know where to hit him and cooperate with eachother.
Same for Vault of Glass. Most People still spend over 12 hours completing it. Some got better and manage to Complete it now within 4 hours.
But! The current record of completing Vault of Glass now stands on 32 minutes!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Kc23YLaPao&app=desktop
These kind of complains are nothing new really. You see it in pretty much every MMO. /shrug
Back to the review. 7 out of 10 is a perfectly fair score. Same as I would have given.
Summed up the pro's and con's nicely.
I still having a blast with the game. Just reached Level 24 today with my Titan. Still haven't finished the main story lol. Too much fun roaming around the planets, having fun exploring and shoot stuff and being blown to pieces by a sudden ambush lol.
This 500,000,000 figure is more urban legend than reality. Even with the over-excessive and very expensive marketing on behalf of Activision i do not believe that Destiny costed 500 millions. The number is way to high to be real.
And I understand where your coming from.
Reviews should also be held up to a standard. I don't put much credence into the review score of a game in question. I personally listen to what the reviewer and user's have to say about the game. I find it pretty easy to tell the fanboi from the hater to the everyday joe blow who is just giving you his honest experiances with the game.
Maybe it's my age and the wisdom that comes along with it. But I see Skyrim is a game that is honestly trying to give you alot of bang for your buck. And I see Destiny as a game that is trying to popularize a business model that could be ok, but seems to be more about maximizing profit's. The amount of content in these upcoming DLC's will paint a truer picture. I'm sure very many could give a crap about more PVP maps as we've all been dare done dat a hundred times. It's the campaign story that really going to popularize this game or not. And it's the amount of campaign for dollar that is going to leave people feeling satisfied or swindled.
It's campaign play that I'm interested in, coop and single player.
Personally $1 per hour of campaign play leaves me quite satisfied, 0.5$ an hour I feel I've gotten a great value and $2 an hour I feel I just got ripped.
Remember the game is being marketed as being heavy in story and lore.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
pretty fair review. I'd given it a 6 or 7 as well. I was a huge supporter of destiny, and I feel I got my money's worth out of it.
story is bad. IT is really bad, the grimoires are great but the beginning to end game story is pretty sad considering.
pve combat, you can play around with weapons a lot. In pvp, its mostly auto rifles and shotties. The pvp is smooth and fun, but there is not a lot of variety in it for a "loot" game.
Faction grinds. Why i am done. I left wow because of this, i leave a lot of games because of this. Once i have to do a chore in a game to enjoy my entertainment that's all for me.
Planets are not open, the game is full of boundaries in the "open worlds". It was a let down because of what bungy said about the planets and zones. The areas may be big, but after teh first mission you are on a speeder and it takes less than 2 minutes to really get anywhere. Most , if not, all zones have roads lined up for you to hold your hand.
gathering , is really just for rep and upgrading weapons. There is no crafting of weapons really, it's basically "you can upgrade this click it". Same with armors.
you get ships...but they are just wallpapers for your loading screen...that is all. seriously..that's their purpose.
The mobs are shallow scripted. The most fun thing to do in pve for most people in destiny is go to a location where mobs just keep spawning. It's like farming in lineage or MU or some other game. you tube "we've woken the hive farm" or "treasure cave". This is what people are doing. They are doing this because farming the same mob for 100 hours yields better results than the faction grind or gamble on the cryptarch.
next is the social aspect. I see a ton of people all over. I play with them in pvp. I can't ask them if they need help or to stay at B while i see who is defending C. There is no socializing with people you run into. Just 4 emotes...it's sad.
Despite all my negatives , it may seem like i didn't enjoy the game. I enjoyed it for 2 weeks. I played a lot, it was beautiful, pvp was engaging, and i did the strikes and all. I simply turned it off because who wants to spend their free time doing chores...maybe i am just at an old age. I haven't done the queen's event because the chore isn't worth the reward for me.
i hate to say it but borderlands 1 and 2, provide much much much more for less. PvP would be your only reason to play longterm and again, the pvp fps powerhouses have much more to offer.
As far as value goes, for me, first and foremost I want to be entertained. I can justify paying for content I know will keep me busy outside of a campaign. However, I absolutely need a story with the game. That's where I feel Destiny really fell down. I mean it's not to say that there isn't a story there. It isn't to say there isn't a conclusion. I just felt like there could have been a more definitive conclusion, you know? I appreciate we didn't eradicate all the baddies and they might be back at some point, but to a certain degree I felt a little like "Did I win?"
I totally agree that the content will determine the course for the game. So I'm really hoping it will be a good amount of content and will do more to develop the story. I don't mind paying quarterly if they'll deliver me a good amount of content in that time.
I agree with you about Skyrim, but let's not forget that even Skyrim had DLC.
I think that the biggest problem with Destiny's story and lore, could be (don't know yet) that it's actually too deep to deliver in a single sitting. Like I mentioned above, it feels a bit anti-climactic, despite a pretty satisfying final boss. It could simply be that it was left a little too open, all like "and that's another story for another day"-style. Dammit!! Just give me a medal, tell me everything is awesome and I saved the universe as Darth Vader's Tie Fighter floats off into space with him still alive inside. I think it's the presentation of the end over the actual end itself.
I can't even say that much about the final score, honestly. If I were to rate it, I may end up dropping a couple points from social, and one or two from graphics, but bumping the value and longevity scores up. The end result may not actually be that different, if at all.
Just for the record, I'll be playing Shadow of Mordor come next week, and I'll be playing a bunch of WoW this weekend, so is it compelling enough to keep me playing and shelving other games that I'm really interested in play? No. It's not. That being said, it's compelling enough to have me come back on a weekly basis, run my weekly strikes and missions and even farm for a bit. Despite the unreasonably low drop rates in this game, I can farm the "loot cave" and get rares at a rate of like 10 or 15 an hour, and even though that is really repetitive, the "lottery" factor of the engrams is just outstanding, and if I've got a half hour to burn, I'm not going to get involved with a mission, I'll just go there and pick up a couple items. So there is definitely plenty of options for progression in the game, which is actually a really nice change over the singular progression you see in most games.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.
First paragraph was all I had to read to see that you just don't get it... at all...
The story, history, characters, and universe Bungie has crafted for Destiny, which will be revealed and reveled in over the next decade is absolutely top-notch science fiction.
People just don't seem to understand something that isn't neatly placed inside a tiny little box for your immediate consumption.
What ever happened to having a sense of wonder, leaving questions unanswered and having mysteries to solve? People got lazy, and so used to having everything spoon fed to them in nice little packages they forgot how to dream and truly be in awe of the unknown and discovery.
Very sad.
I haven't been super impressed with the post-release content they've been dishing out, but I'm still thoroughly addicted and engrossed in crafting the best Guardian I can be. I'm also playing the game nearly 100% in co-op with friends, like minded individuals who can "see the forest for the trees" so to speak, so that certainly helps create a more engaging experience.
I do greatly appreciate the variety in modifiers Bungie has been throwing into the daily story and weekly heroics, as well as now the Queen's missions. Certainly adds another layer of complexity and challenge.
I don't often do Crucible, yet always seem to joyfully fill my many hours of Destiny played thus far, barely any of it spent shooting into a cave
It's a multiplayer shooter that isn't even on PC and has everyone and their dog talking about..and buying. If anything it showed that the 200 million on advertising made them more money than the 300 million they spent on the game.
That doesn't say much for all the people giving this game negative reviews so early after launch.
I agree with the content of the review, the text portion but the actual score numbers used on this site make me wonder why they have a 1 to 10 scale when just about every game gets a score within one point of a 7.3
Mortal Online - 6.2
Archeage - 6.6
STO - 7.4
PotBS - 7.4
Wildstar gets a 8.4 and then a column asking "What went wrong"
There is no way these games are all in the same class
Reviews should be consistent so can Bill compare / justify how:
Destiny gets a 5 for value - seems to be the cost of that DLC / console costs
Wildstar gets an 8 - only $60 to buy and the $15 is well worth while providing Carbine can keep the monthly content drops - whoops!
TESO gets a 8 - again no problem with the sub and, again, content drops are now every other 8-12 weeks.
Not consistent. Factor in:
that PCs are generally more expensive
console membership service (if needed) also gives you e.g. free games
you can get a trial membership if all you want is to do the first 20 hours
And as you do factor in console membership you should factor in that as a result you get built in voice communication and (a form of) friends list
and I struggle.
If you are going to score TESO & WS high on longevity because they have lots of content - fine. But you then need to take into account that playing the 100s of hours of content will cost you 100s of dollars. And score the game accordingly when it comes to value.
If you are going to say its a short campaign then you should judge the value simply on the cost of the campaign. If you are going to weigh the cost of the DLC then you need to factor in what the DLC adds to the story etc. - which we don't know.
I could continue. Destiny gets an 8 for Polish - lack of social UI (despite that being a factor in the social score) but otherwise smooth as silk. So a game with frame rate issues, bugs, UI issues ... that would be a lower score maybe. Absolutely not: Wildstar got an 8 as well.
And a game in which you can't group would score a 6 like Destiny ... nope TESO got an 8.
Innovation: why does it get a 7? If its all been done before give it (and other games) a 0. Was that the fps game being reviewed though or the mmo or the rpg?
I have no issue with reviewers saying what they feel: maybe commenting that only the initial levels have been reviewed and not Vault of Glass / the events (in which bosses and even mobs become much smarter) but no problem. The review is just that but a bit of consistency is expected.
Just FYI, validity completely up in the air and simply for the "huh, interesting" factor. Vgchartz shows BL2 as having sold 5.5 million copies (though mostly on console). It would actually, almost literally be 4.5 million on console alone. Interestingly enough, Destiny shows about 4.5 million in sales across all 4 consoles it's on.
If we accept that the only near valid data on vgchartz at the moment is console retail sales, then Destiny is at least healthy.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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I agree, social score should be no higher than 2 since there is NONE. Give me a chat area on the Tower at least for God's sake so I can find groups when I want too. Is that asking too much since we're in the 21st Century and all that with all the communication tools we have available to us?
I admit, I'm a loner and usually solo things, but if I want to join a group for things, they should give us the tools to do just that. Hell Defiance took a buttload of crap for their terrible chat system, but at least they included one at launch lol. I've tried the sign language emotes to get people interested in teaming up with me, but sadly, "point, point, wave, dance, dance" does not do the trick and they are left wondering wtf I'm even doing.
I wouldn't rate this game any higher than a 5.8 or possibly a generous 6. I don't get paid by them for my score so I won't hold back.
I somewhat agree with that response....But the biggest issue is sometimes wanting to group with a player you see in the region that is possibly working on the same content. They make it hard, at least on the PS4, to accept invites. You must toggle out of the game via the PS button and accept it through the notifications menu. They couldnt make it to do this in game via the options button and have an accept or decline window when you first hit the button? Also the invite notifications is not very noticeable when you are so engrossed in a fight. The banner only shows for a few seconds. First time it popped up I thought it was an achievement, so I ignored it and didnt read what it really said. 20 mins later, when I logged out, I then saw what it was. Better score for social would be 4.0.
Totally agree with you, Nevulus. To me the game is fun, but its lacking so many things that would make the game feel less incomplete (story, content AND quality of life small features) that you would think the game didnt have even a fraction of the budget it had. You can see all the money went into marketing. I do think that they left all that out of the game to add them as part of their greedy dlc stuff.
I dont mind buying dlc, i just hate that companies now use dlc and expansions to fill incomplete portions of the game instead of adding new stuff.
I applaud MMORPG with all my heart. I was about to buy the PS4 only to play Destiny, and I've seen several reviews about the game. This is probably the most accurate one. I knew it was far too good to be true.
Certainly, I applaud, again, because MMORPG leaves every misconception and previous judgment about one of the most anticipated games this year. They throw every political aspect and bring the hammer down on Bungie.
Great review, indeed.
First off I am not a FPS fan, I tend to stay away from them.
I am level 25 so far and still not done the story mission as I have been enjoying the game play via patrols and pvp matches.
Did my first raid at level 24 with a really nice group and we got past the first boss and into a cave system, this is where I had to log out as it was getting late in the night for me. But what I did experience I enjoyed.
I have a feeling that the game will open up more as more DLC is added in the future so I would not pull the curtains to quickly on this game.
As for the writing and story line yes it is generic and flat, but its a FPS game with RPG elements at the end of the day so what do you expect?
If it was being sold as a RPG game first with FPS elements to it like Mass Effect was then it would be a different matter, for me at least. I just want to log into the game and shoot people in the face. Also its a better game experience than CCP's wet effort which is called Dust 514.