That doesn't even matter. There are good F2P models and bad F2P models. It is a point of concern, considering it's the same developers as Allods, but the publisher is different. I'm open to seeing it for myself.
That doesn't even matter. There are good F2P models and bad F2P models. It is a point of concern, considering it's the same developers as Allods, but the publisher is different. I'm open to seeing it for myself.
So why pick a F2P model if they believe in their game? ppl are willing to pay for good games, and a buy2play or pay2play model is much more reputable than a f2p model, they are just deter many ppl from playing it because it well be f2p. maybe there a good f2p models, but tbh i didnt even see one in mmorpg.
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
But Skyforge does have progression systems. It measure progression based on Gear, Skill tree progress, and the number of "followers" you have.
There's a few ambitious systems in Skyforge and while I would like to have the utmost confidence in Allods and Obsidian, I know enough to not get over-hyped.
I've been watching it since March and I'll be playing it at launch. It should be a game for people to at least follow since it is trying to be different.
That doesn't even matter. There are good F2P models and bad F2P models. It is a point of concern, considering it's the same developers as Allods, but the publisher is different. I'm open to seeing it for myself.
So why pick a F2P model if they believe in their game? ppl are willing to pay for good games, and a buy2play or pay2play model is much more reputable than a f2p model, they are just deter many ppl from playing it because it well be f2p. maybe there a good f2p models, but tbh i didnt even see one in mmorpg.
Business model tends to be publisher-end. It could very well be that the developers believe in the game and the publishers are erring on the side of caution.
These days, mmo games have levels, because levels. There is no more thought being given to design, only copying of what came before. This is a core business concept, to get what the other guy got, do what he did; i.e. follow the leader. This kind of brain dead design is why we have a flood of samey mmorpgs.
Because gaining statistical advantages is a core part of an rpg. If you take away that then your left with an "action game".
A genre is not a prison to design decisions its a way for people to help identify a feature set they like. Rpg's and MMorpgs are statistically based games which focus on character progression.
A statistic based game, focused on progression for an advantage, is a strategy game, not a *role-play* storytelling game.
Role play has been dropped, in favor of statistical strategy, as statistics are easy to do on a computer, and character based storytelling is much harder, and not subject to quantification.
The gamification is now centered around levels and advancement of levels, rather than around social roles, character motivations, or individual goals. However, this is not role-play, it is strategy, where the principle strategy is repetition.
I think the future of MMO's will come from a very unlikely source, Rockstar games. They already played around a bit with GTA online, which is not so far from an MMO when you think about it. All they'd have to do is add ability to make your own guns, a contrived leveling mechanic, and 4 or 5 little hotkeys at the bottom for abilities that don't make any damn sense, boom a pretty sweet mmo. It has questing, full PVP, a pretty interesting non-player economy. And ironically it's more difficult then pretty much any MMO now in the fact that a ton of stuff requires grouping.
The next GTA could very likely be completely online. They'll probably have some RPG aspects like stamina for running or strength for hitting stuff and aiming, but that to me is not so much "leveling" as it is simple progression. Increase your wallet+inrcrease your ability to aim a gun. Anybody can still kill you with a headshot or run over you with a car though. Maybe they'll make a fully online version for the next Read Dead Redemption, dream come true and a huge market for that.
More importantly, they can tap into a huge market that's been largely untouched by MMOs. Forget Blizzard if that ever happened, they'd get blown out of the water.
While I agree there is potential there, Rockstar views the PC as a dying platform. They are much more invested in the console.
That's what I'm saying though. I could see them making a fully online version of GTA or one of their other open world IP's exclusively for console. I think that is the natural future direction for consoles, and I've been saying it since before this gen consoles were released. We already see that they're going in that direction with Destiny. This game sold a hell lot and is not even that great from what I've heard.
If they release a GTA syle MMO with RPG lite elements, it would smash anything we've seen previously IMO in hype and sales. There's a lot of cool mechanics they could add. Who wouldn't want to be in that environment as a cop? You could have some kind of morality system where you could be good/bad cop or good/bad criminal. Could have players doing the "every day joe" thing and handling the crafting side of stuff, or be scheming corrupt businessmen who swindle and hustle all day. Could support every playstyle, even those not overly interested in combat.This would sell consoles. And absolutely wouldn't need to have any kind of leveling mechanic at all.
I think the future of MMO's will come from a very unlikely source, Rockstar games. They already played around a bit with GTA online, which is not so far from an MMO when you think about it. All they'd have to do is add ability to make your own guns, a contrived leveling mechanic, and 4 or 5 little hotkeys at the bottom for abilities that don't make any damn sense, boom a pretty sweet mmo. It has questing, full PVP, a pretty interesting non-player economy. And ironically it's more difficult then pretty much any MMO now in the fact that a ton of stuff requires grouping.
The next GTA could very likely be completely online. They'll probably have some RPG aspects like stamina for running or strength for hitting stuff and aiming, but that to me is not so much "leveling" as it is simple progression. Increase your wallet+inrcrease your ability to aim a gun. Anybody can still kill you with a headshot or run over you with a car though. Maybe they'll make a fully online version for the next Read Dead Redemption, dream come true and a huge market for that.
More importantly, they can tap into a huge market that's been largely untouched by MMOs. Forget Blizzard if that ever happened, they'd get blown out of the water.
While I agree there is potential there, Rockstar views the PC as a dying platform. They are much more invested in the console.
That's what I'm saying though. I could see them making a fully online version of GTA or one of their other open world IP's exclusively for console. I think that is the natural future direction for consoles, and I've been saying it since before this gen consoles were released. We already see that they're going in that direction with Destiny. This game sold a hell lot and is not even that great from what I've heard.
If they release a GTA syle MMO with RPG lite elements, it would smash anything we've seen previously IMO in hype and sales. There's a lot of cool mechanics they could add. Who wouldn't want to be in that environment as a cop? You could have some kind of morality system where you could be good/bad cop or good/bad criminal. Could have players doing the "every day joe" thing and handling the crafting side of stuff, or be scheming corrupt businessmen who swindle and hustle all day. Could support every playstyle, even those not overly interested in combat.This would sell consoles. And absolutely wouldn't need to have any kind of leveling mechanic at all.
Except that it would not work.
For the same reason Skyrim online would not work.
People.
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
I think the future of MMO's will come from a very unlikely source, Rockstar games. They already played around a bit with GTA online, which is not so far from an MMO when you think about it. All they'd have to do is add ability to make your own guns, a contrived leveling mechanic, and 4 or 5 little hotkeys at the bottom for abilities that don't make any damn sense, boom a pretty sweet mmo. It has questing, full PVP, a pretty interesting non-player economy. And ironically it's more difficult then pretty much any MMO now in the fact that a ton of stuff requires grouping.
The next GTA could very likely be completely online. They'll probably have some RPG aspects like stamina for running or strength for hitting stuff and aiming, but that to me is not so much "leveling" as it is simple progression. Increase your wallet+inrcrease your ability to aim a gun. Anybody can still kill you with a headshot or run over you with a car though. Maybe they'll make a fully online version for the next Read Dead Redemption, dream come true and a huge market for that.
More importantly, they can tap into a huge market that's been largely untouched by MMOs. Forget Blizzard if that ever happened, they'd get blown out of the water.
While I agree there is potential there, Rockstar views the PC as a dying platform. They are much more invested in the console.
That's what I'm saying though. I could see them making a fully online version of GTA or one of their other open world IP's exclusively for console. I think that is the natural future direction for consoles, and I've been saying it since before this gen consoles were released. We already see that they're going in that direction with Destiny. This game sold a hell lot and is not even that great from what I've heard.
If they release a GTA syle MMO with RPG lite elements, it would smash anything we've seen previously IMO in hype and sales. There's a lot of cool mechanics they could add. Who wouldn't want to be in that environment as a cop? You could have some kind of morality system where you could be good/bad cop or good/bad criminal. Could have players doing the "every day joe" thing and handling the crafting side of stuff, or be scheming corrupt businessmen who swindle and hustle all day. Could support every playstyle, even those not overly interested in combat.This would sell consoles. And absolutely wouldn't need to have any kind of leveling mechanic at all.
Except that it would not work.
For the same reason Skyrim online would not work.
People.
The reason Skyrim online wouldn't work is fairly obvious. The whole premise of all ES games is that you are God. There's usually some prophecy surrounding you and the fact that you're going to save the world. It changes the whole concept of the game if there are suddenly 5000 gods.
In GTA games you're just some guy, who happens to be a badass. The draw of the game is entirely on the open world mechanic, not on story like Bethesda.
Conceptually there is a massive difference between the two games. Rockstar has already supported online mode in the last two titles which has been progressing to become more and more involved. It's relatively short sighted to believe console staple games will just remain entirely independent single player experiences. That's not going to happen. Rockstar has already been buttering everyone up for this pretty obvious switch, while ES games have never tried to incorporate mutliplayer in any fashion, for good reason.
Except of course for ESO which isn't really an ES game. It's just another MMO.
for me, i dont like leveling and in the most MMORPGs i dont know why you even have to level up, for me it just make no sense.
just my opinion.
would you enjoy a MMO without leveling? Or is leveling essential for you?
Back in the olden days leveling was the social aspect of MMORPGS. It was the main reason people got together and had adventures (In the original pen and paper mmoprgs and the first computer mmorpgs). It was where memories where created, good and bad. Where epic victories and shaming defeats where written into your book of history.
Leveling was where friendships where formed. It is a vital aspect of a good MMORPG.
----
Today leveling is a solo grind running from one ! to the next while killing random mob x times on the way. I agree, that's obsolete and pointless, might as well give you max level from the start.
Today you are in a quest hub and team up with random players through a random system (party finder) not talking to anyone and afterwards never see each other again. It's anti-social.
Back in the olden days leveling was the social aspect of MMORPGS. It was the main reason people got together and had adventures (In the original pen and paper mmoprgs and the first computer mmorpgs). It was where memories where created, good and bad. Where epic victories and shaming defeats where written into your book of history.
Leveling was where friendships where formed. It is a vital aspect of a good MMORPG.
----
Today leveling is a solo grind running from one ! to the next while killing random mob x times on the way. I agree, that's obsolete and pointless, might as well give you max level from the start.
Today you are in a quest hub and team up with random players through a random system (party finder) not talking to anyone and afterwards never see each other again. It's anti-social.
Yes, and given how solo content is popular, it looks like there are many anti-social players and they are big enough to support the market.
And no ... friendship is not vital to good MMORPG at all. Lots of anti-social players are playing MMO solo .. that should tell you the unimportance of friendship in a game.
Originally posted by Nitth Because gaining statistical advantages is a core part of an rpg. If you take away that then your left with an "action game".A genre is not a prison to design decisions its a way for people to help identify a feature set they like. Rpg's and MMorpgs are statistically based games which focus on character progression.
A statistic based game, focused on progression for an advantage, is a strategy game, not a *role-play* storytelling game.
Role play has been dropped, in favor of statistical strategy, as statistics are easy to do on a computer, and character based storytelling is much harder, and not subject to quantification.
The gamification is now centered around levels and advancement of levels, rather than around social roles, character motivations, or individual goals. However, this is not role-play, it is strategy, where the principle strategy is repetition.
You don't get to make up definitions for the industry. Stop doing that.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Comments
But Skyforge will be F2P.
- Albert Einstein
That doesn't even matter. There are good F2P models and bad F2P models. It is a point of concern, considering it's the same developers as Allods, but the publisher is different. I'm open to seeing it for myself.
So why pick a F2P model if they believe in their game? ppl are willing to pay for good games, and a buy2play or pay2play model is much more reputable than a f2p model, they are just deter many ppl from playing it because it well be f2p. maybe there a good f2p models, but tbh i didnt even see one in mmorpg.
- Albert Einstein
But Skyforge does have progression systems. It measure progression based on Gear, Skill tree progress, and the number of "followers" you have.
There's a few ambitious systems in Skyforge and while I would like to have the utmost confidence in Allods and Obsidian, I know enough to not get over-hyped.
I've been watching it since March and I'll be playing it at launch. It should be a game for people to at least follow since it is trying to be different.
Business model tends to be publisher-end. It could very well be that the developers believe in the game and the publishers are erring on the side of caution.
Leveling is dated, it was first introduced into computer virtual worlds by Bartle and Trubshaw, as detailed around slides 18-19 in the link below:
http://mud.co.uk/richard/RAB GDC Online.pdf
These days, mmo games have levels, because levels. There is no more thought being given to design, only copying of what came before. This is a core business concept, to get what the other guy got, do what he did; i.e. follow the leader. This kind of brain dead design is why we have a flood of samey mmorpgs.
A statistic based game, focused on progression for an advantage, is a strategy game, not a *role-play* storytelling game.
Role play has been dropped, in favor of statistical strategy, as statistics are easy to do on a computer, and character based storytelling is much harder, and not subject to quantification.
The gamification is now centered around levels and advancement of levels, rather than around social roles, character motivations, or individual goals. However, this is not role-play, it is strategy, where the principle strategy is repetition.
That's what I'm saying though. I could see them making a fully online version of GTA or one of their other open world IP's exclusively for console. I think that is the natural future direction for consoles, and I've been saying it since before this gen consoles were released. We already see that they're going in that direction with Destiny. This game sold a hell lot and is not even that great from what I've heard.
If they release a GTA syle MMO with RPG lite elements, it would smash anything we've seen previously IMO in hype and sales. There's a lot of cool mechanics they could add. Who wouldn't want to be in that environment as a cop? You could have some kind of morality system where you could be good/bad cop or good/bad criminal. Could have players doing the "every day joe" thing and handling the crafting side of stuff, or be scheming corrupt businessmen who swindle and hustle all day. Could support every playstyle, even those not overly interested in combat.This would sell consoles. And absolutely wouldn't need to have any kind of leveling mechanic at all.
Except that it would not work.
For the same reason Skyrim online would not work.
People.
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
The reason Skyrim online wouldn't work is fairly obvious. The whole premise of all ES games is that you are God. There's usually some prophecy surrounding you and the fact that you're going to save the world. It changes the whole concept of the game if there are suddenly 5000 gods.
In GTA games you're just some guy, who happens to be a badass. The draw of the game is entirely on the open world mechanic, not on story like Bethesda.
Conceptually there is a massive difference between the two games. Rockstar has already supported online mode in the last two titles which has been progressing to become more and more involved. It's relatively short sighted to believe console staple games will just remain entirely independent single player experiences. That's not going to happen. Rockstar has already been buttering everyone up for this pretty obvious switch, while ES games have never tried to incorporate mutliplayer in any fashion, for good reason.
Except of course for ESO which isn't really an ES game. It's just another MMO.
Back in the olden days leveling was the social aspect of MMORPGS. It was the main reason people got together and had adventures (In the original pen and paper mmoprgs and the first computer mmorpgs). It was where memories where created, good and bad. Where epic victories and shaming defeats where written into your book of history.
Leveling was where friendships where formed. It is a vital aspect of a good MMORPG.
----
Today leveling is a solo grind running from one ! to the next while killing random mob x times on the way. I agree, that's obsolete and pointless, might as well give you max level from the start.
Today you are in a quest hub and team up with random players through a random system (party finder) not talking to anyone and afterwards never see each other again. It's anti-social.
Yes, and given how solo content is popular, it looks like there are many anti-social players and they are big enough to support the market.
And no ... friendship is not vital to good MMORPG at all. Lots of anti-social players are playing MMO solo .. that should tell you the unimportance of friendship in a game.
A statistic based game, focused on progression for an advantage, is a strategy game, not a *role-play* storytelling game.
Role play has been dropped, in favor of statistical strategy, as statistics are easy to do on a computer, and character based storytelling is much harder, and not subject to quantification.
The gamification is now centered around levels and advancement of levels, rather than around social roles, character motivations, or individual goals. However, this is not role-play, it is strategy, where the principle strategy is repetition.
You don't get to make up definitions for the industry. Stop doing that.Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"