1. Everquest....just because it's EQ....amazing freedom, amazing community, amazing massive raiding. Group dependency in a dangerous world and a trinity system that was perfect. An actual MMO, massive.
Honorable mention..Vanguard...if it wasn't for the bugs and instability, this was a good game.
EveryQuest.. because it was more then just "whack a mole" combat.. You had to manage your character from food/drink to weight to mana, to stamina, etc etc.. Crafting in the beginning had a purpose and meaning.. People were more social, and just not from a group combat point of view, but much more.. Some fulfilled roles as "bankers", some did "taxi" service.. In general people communicated with each other for a purpose and fun.. To me it was not a time sink or inconvenience, I actually believe much of the changes today stem from lazy entitlement players..
Anyways.. I would love to see another game like the original EQ with all the little things fixed.. I can dream..
Originally posted by Lukooone No doubt for me and for many people : Archeage!Why?Trions incompretence + plex dupe abuse + pay to win + 30 hours maintenance on weekend + ... AND At this hour 14:28pm on a tuesday : all USA servers on high populatior or -+500 peep queue! Having a blast everyday, having fun everyday, I am very sorry for you people that are not trying it because of the haters and bad comments in many forums like this one, YOU ARE THE ONES LOSING IT. Enjoy Arathi Basin num. 349857337689...
Forgets to mention that Trion is running the USA servers on backup servers and significantly lowered the server capacity with 80%.
Meanwihle EU population havent seen high since Early acces, and 1 day after the massive succesfull Auroria launch and the brutal sieges o/
Oh thats right...they forget to test and mention the stealth buff to the Walls wich have 1.4 million HP and are tuned for level 55.
Not to mention USA Auroria launch wich 90% of the server coulnt participate in.
Yeah Archeage surely is doing great o/ Cant wait for 2015 and more cash shop whale items o/
/sarcasm off
But seriously our guild who owns a castle on Dahuta is about to leave this game forever due to Trions incompetence.... If you GM wasnt a good leader we would have left this garbage mmo 30 days ago...
We will wait for 1 more patch and see if Trion can still make a miracle happen, but our hopes are not that high....
Archeage could have been the mmo to play for years to come, but instead Trion Worlds decided Greed and cashing in was a better choice then to have a mmo played by milions of people. At least they dont have to hide it anymore that this whole mmo is leaning on the whales.
And once those big boys have no interest anymore they are left with a ruined name for decades to come.
And lets not even talk about the exploits and gains guilds / people did....the magnitude of that is imposible to gauge...
Its a sad story as i would have loved this mmo to death for years if it wasnt ruined the way Trion abused this mmo for their own quick cash grab.
2.daoc -- altho in the early goings i thought the pve was very good ..enuff to to support more pve but now its just not anygood imo..the daoc of now is a stinking turd compared to old daoc imo
All personal and subjective. I would do 2 top 5's ... personal than as objective as one can be.
Personal - top 5
1. Final Fantasy 11 - Cherry was broken with this game. 1st online only friend was made. Many emotions felt from WTF IS THIS CRAP! to I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IAM SUPPOSE TO DO? to I NEED SLEEP!
2. City of Heroes/Villians - Only other game i feel that had a true community. Character creation and conceptualization of superheroes was a game onto itself. Only game I actually wanted to RP in.
3. World of Warcraft - Love/hate relationship with the game. loved what it was , hate what it turned into.
4. EvE Online - The game I wish I would of joined from the beginning. shortest play time on my personal list, I was too late to the party for this one.
5. Elder Scrolls Online - I just liked it. Only issue with me was the grouping options were serveraly limited.
Objective - top 5
Everquest - The original clone
StarWars Galaxies - Best sandbox? not a bad IP
World of Warcraft - you know a mother that has played it. The Michael Jackson of MMOS
Vanguard - The WTF pick!? potential undeniable. The what could of MMOS, a sadden story.
Lineage II - Yep, objective folks.
Honorable
(Dark Age of Camelot can replace Vanguard. Best PvP game?)
playing: Dragon Age Waiting: for FF14, Mass Effect Want to try: Fallen Earth
What has to be understood is that best experience does not equal best MMO. Games like EQ wowed us with their technology - and the idea of virtual worlds before the internet age had truly awoken. Nowadays the game would be trivialized with youtube videos and is mostly about grinding.
Best Art. Best Graphics. Best Music. No gear grind needed - can fully outfit any character in minutes after they hit 80. No social pressure to play (your particular character is not needed for anything) - the guild systems are not strong. There is no raiding - so there is no pressure to recruit the 'best.'. There is no monetary pressure to play. Combat is animation based - not just tacked on animations after hidden dice rolls. Move out of the way - and you won't get hit. The only MMO I would recommend to regular people.
Revolutionary game - took MMOs out of the niche grind world and brought them into the mainstream. Was the first major game to start to use proper 'video game' mechanics in an MMO. Made the game play more like a Mario style game then previous MMOs - more twitch - more timing - more skill. Featured both social pressure to play (guilds needed geared players for raiding) and monetary pressure (hey I am spending that monthy fee). To really enjoy needed ridiculous hours spent (not a problem for some around here).. This makes it much harder to pay nowadays - though Blizz has softened about as much as they can on this.
Amazing game. The only game that really created the feeling of a virtual world. Took "MUDs" to the next level. It's 'too bad' mechanics was absolutely thrilling at times - and the Skyrim style 'exploits' that you could pull off felt glorious. The idea that you could kill off any NPC was wonderful. It was the MMO for true nerds and with people with massive amounts of time to kill. It seemed 10 years ahead of its time. All those cool mechanics make it seem unplayable now for most. Anyone can play Project 1999 to get the old school experience but few people want to..
Now its true that some will say that GW2 feels 'boring' in comparison to other MMOs and that there is nothing to do. But that's simply the result of the stripping of all the normal "non-game' incentives for play. There is no social pressure and no gear pressure. You only play if you WANT to play an MMO. It's relatively manipulation free - so in that aspect its amazing.
GW2 says hey you are blowing time on getting these pretty pixels. They don't even really "do' anything special but we won't stop you if that's what you want. It's a bit mind blowing that a company made a game like that..
Honorable mention: EQ2. Was almost great kinda got swallowed up by WoW. ESO, SWTOR and Wildstar aren't bad either..but didn't really do much for the genre.
Originally posted by Vladamyre Dark Age of Camelot pre ToA and NF. It was by far the best pvp game ever made, and nothing will ever come close.
still remember the first time I went out on my druid with a raid group to the old frontiers and seeing a thanes AE hammer dropping down, my jaw hit the ground and I was in love with the game ever since.
The people that are trying to make the world worse never take a day off , why should I. Light up the darkness Bob Marley
Originally posted by Vladamyre Dark Age of Camelot pre ToA and NF. It was by far the best pvp game ever made, and nothing will ever come close.
still remember the first time I went out on my druid with a raid group to the old frontiers and seeing a thanes AE hammer dropping down, my jaw hit the ground and I was in love with the game ever since.
I still know the old frontiers in and out. The game was great. Playing a hero in DAoC was the most fun I've ever had on any game.
Everquest 1 (in it's pre-Planes of Power years). While the graphics, interface, and smoothness of animations had issues, the concept of an open, dangerous, mysterious world, with many races starting in their own dedicated racial areas, and all you were given was a rusty sword, leather rags for armor, and an inaccurate map made adventuring pure gold.
Challenge (if you conned even with a moonster, the fight could go either way. No face-rolling of "elites". Also, big tough-looking monsters were ... really big and tough.)
Consequences (play carelessly or "zerg" and you paid the price. Scary areas were ... scary because of this.)
Choice (freedom to roam and wander, even into high level areas, none of this "on rails" bull)
Community (you needed friends or had to be a tough hombre to go it alone)
Emergent gameplay (you figured out how to make the world work for you. If you found a good mining or harvesting area that was out of the way, you could take advantage of this opportunity. One time, I killed tons of skeletons, just to harvest the bones and sell to necromancers for a hefty profit. Stuff like that.)
Mystery (There was always a little bit more to the world than you could see. Hidden quests, areas, etc...)
We may see this kind of gaming again (but hopefully with improved graphics, animations, and U.I.). Right now, we are in the phase of game companies presenting single player games as MMO's and scooping up new players for cash.
Cant be better sayd, all is sayed. EQ was my first (tho touched meridian a bit) and stayed there for 4,5 yrs.
So EQ is No. 1
No.2 & 3 I can say a tie between EQ2 and TSW - last having most meaningful quests in MMO history.
Never touched WoW cuz for me WoW was starting of fall of Golden Age of MMOs, dumbdowning and so on.
And No. 4 & 5 close tie are Fallen Earth and LoTRO
Both very good games still devs made them stupid or dull, which is in conclusion the same.
Challenge No game to date has taken on this games form of action combat. You could be swarmed by 20 mobs and survive if you had the right equipment, skills and knowledge.
Consequences Death took your most expensive items on you and you had to recover them requiring you to make sure you had just enough items of higher value than your equipement.
Choice A game that actually allowed you to totally gimp your character with the wrong skill choices since you could train any skill on any character with a set total to use on your choices (so you could train sword use and healing magic and not take melee defense and end up getting owned in close combat) and a complete open world, no zones at all...you could be fighting level 10 mobs one minute and mistakenly wander into an area with mobs over level 20 without knowing it.
Community Never played a game with a better community than Asherons Call. Used to love doing loot hand outs to lowbies on the weekends.
Monthly Updates Thats right, the only game ever released that had a content update each and every single month.
Mystery Since there were no actual quests, if you didn't read books laying around you really had no idea where anything was so every time you went someplace new it was completely unexpected...and if you were reading the books it was crazy exciting actually finding what you read about.
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
Originally posted by Scot Did anyone bother to read the OP's post? Not sure he meant this to be a serious thread, so my award goes to TERA for boob physics.
While I was not a fan of Tera, I find it difficult to argue your logic and while my opinion may be titular, it is what it is. I am suddenly craving melons, hmmmm...
Originally posted by Scot Did anyone bother to read the OP's post? Not sure he meant this to be a serious thread, so my award goes to TERA for boob physics.
Yeah but doesn't that mean Scarlet Blade should win because it not only has boob physics but also bares them for all to see?
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
Everquest 1 (in it's pre-Planes of Power years). While the graphics, interface, and smoothness of animations had issues, the concept of an open, dangerous, mysterious world, with many races starting in their own dedicated racial areas, and all you were given was a rusty sword, leather rags for armor, and an inaccurate map made adventuring pure gold.
Challenge (if you conned even with a moonster, the fight could go either way. No face-rolling of "elites". Also, big tough-looking monsters were ... really big and tough.)
Consequences (play carelessly or "zerg" and you paid the price. Scary areas were ... scary because of this.)
Choice (freedom to roam and wander, even into high level areas, none of this "on rails" bull)
Community (you needed friends or had to be a tough hombre to go it alone)
Emergent gameplay (you figured out how to make the world work for you. If you found a good mining or harvesting area that was out of the way, you could take advantage of this opportunity. One time, I killed tons of skeletons, just to harvest the bones and sell to necromancers for a hefty profit. Stuff like that.)
Mystery (There was always a little bit more to the world than you could see. Hidden quests, areas, etc...)
We may see this kind of gaming again (but hopefully with improved graphics, animations, and U.I.). Right now, we are in the phase of game companies presenting single player games as MMO's and scooping up new players for cash.
So many good things of the past.... And SOE realises the MMO market went in the wrong dieection, they are moving back to the roots,
how do you figure this when EQN is going to be a free to play with cash shop game?
Everquest 1 (in it's pre-Planes of Power years). While the graphics, interface, and smoothness of animations had issues, the concept of an open, dangerous, mysterious world, with many races starting in their own dedicated racial areas, and all you were given was a rusty sword, leather rags for armor, and an inaccurate map made adventuring pure gold.
Challenge (if you conned even with a moonster, the fight could go either way. No face-rolling of "elites". Also, big tough-looking monsters were ... really big and tough.)
Consequences (play carelessly or "zerg" and you paid the price. Scary areas were ... scary because of this.)
Choice (freedom to roam and wander, even into high level areas, none of this "on rails" bull)
Community (you needed friends or had to be a tough hombre to go it alone)
Emergent gameplay (you figured out how to make the world work for you. If you found a good mining or harvesting area that was out of the way, you could take advantage of this opportunity. One time, I killed tons of skeletons, just to harvest the bones and sell to necromancers for a hefty profit. Stuff like that.)
Mystery (There was always a little bit more to the world than you could see. Hidden quests, areas, etc...)
We may see this kind of gaming again (but hopefully with improved graphics, animations, and U.I.). Right now, we are in the phase of game companies presenting single player games as MMO's and scooping up new players for cash.
So many good things of the past.... And SOE realises the MMO market went in the wrong dieection, they are moving back to the roots,
how do you figure this when EQN is going to be a free to play with cash shop game?
SOE game model for EQ2 is perfect and i am sure it will be the same for EQN. But then again P2P model isn't always a guarantee for a good game *cough Wildstar *cough*!!
Payment model got nothing to do with how good or bad the game is. AA for example an awesome game despite of how the cash shop is run.
Comments
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
For me personally,
1. Everquest....just because it's EQ....amazing freedom, amazing community, amazing massive raiding. Group dependency in a dangerous world and a trinity system that was perfect. An actual MMO, massive.
Honorable mention..Vanguard...if it wasn't for the bugs and instability, this was a good game.
EveryQuest.. because it was more then just "whack a mole" combat.. You had to manage your character from food/drink to weight to mana, to stamina, etc etc.. Crafting in the beginning had a purpose and meaning.. People were more social, and just not from a group combat point of view, but much more.. Some fulfilled roles as "bankers", some did "taxi" service.. In general people communicated with each other for a purpose and fun.. To me it was not a time sink or inconvenience, I actually believe much of the changes today stem from lazy entitlement players..
Anyways.. I would love to see another game like the original EQ with all the little things fixed.. I can dream..
Dark Age of Camelot.
Why???? Because!
Forgets to mention that Trion is running the USA servers on backup servers and significantly lowered the server capacity with 80%.
Meanwihle EU population havent seen high since Early acces, and 1 day after the massive succesfull Auroria launch and the brutal sieges o/
Oh thats right...they forget to test and mention the stealth buff to the Walls wich have 1.4 million HP and are tuned for level 55.
Not to mention USA Auroria launch wich 90% of the server coulnt participate in.
Yeah Archeage surely is doing great o/
Cant wait for 2015 and more cash shop whale items o/
/sarcasm off
But seriously our guild who owns a castle on Dahuta is about to leave this game forever due to Trions incompetence....
If you GM wasnt a good leader we would have left this garbage mmo 30 days ago...
We will wait for 1 more patch and see if Trion can still make a miracle happen, but our hopes are not that high....
Archeage could have been the mmo to play for years to come, but instead Trion Worlds decided Greed and cashing in was a better choice then to have a mmo played by milions of people.
At least they dont have to hide it anymore that this whole mmo is leaning on the whales.
And once those big boys have no interest anymore they are left with a ruined name for decades to come.
And lets not even talk about the exploits and gains guilds / people did....the magnitude of that is imposible to gauge...
Its a sad story as i would have loved this mmo to death for years if it wasnt ruined the way Trion abused this mmo for their own quick cash grab.
o/
pve
1. org.EQ.not the watered down version of today
2. same as above
3. same as above
4. same as above
5. SWG
pvp
1.shadowbane
2.daoc -- altho in the early goings i thought the pve was very good ..enuff to to support more pve but now its just not anygood imo..the daoc of now is a stinking turd compared to old daoc imo
3.UO
4. AO
5. org.EQ of old
In a world of sharp knives, you would be a spoon.
All personal and subjective. I would do 2 top 5's ... personal than as objective as one can be.
Personal - top 5
1. Final Fantasy 11 - Cherry was broken with this game. 1st online only friend was made. Many emotions felt from WTF IS THIS CRAP! to I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IAM SUPPOSE TO DO? to I NEED SLEEP!
2. City of Heroes/Villians - Only other game i feel that had a true community. Character creation and conceptualization of superheroes was a game onto itself. Only game I actually wanted to RP in.
3. World of Warcraft - Love/hate relationship with the game. loved what it was , hate what it turned into.
4. EvE Online - The game I wish I would of joined from the beginning. shortest play time on my personal list, I was too late to the party for this one.
5. Elder Scrolls Online - I just liked it. Only issue with me was the grouping options were serveraly limited.
Objective - top 5
Everquest - The original clone
StarWars Galaxies - Best sandbox? not a bad IP
World of Warcraft - you know a mother that has played it. The Michael Jackson of MMOS
Vanguard - The WTF pick!? potential undeniable. The what could of MMOS, a sadden story.
Lineage II - Yep, objective folks.
Honorable
(Dark Age of Camelot can replace Vanguard. Best PvP game?)
playing: Dragon Age
Waiting: for FF14, Mass Effect
Want to try: Fallen Earth
Havent played that one yet.
Ofc at the moment I like WoD, mostly because all the "old" Warcraft feeling, and Im also still subbed to Swtor, jumping in there from time to time.
The one that I thought would be "the best of them all" ruined my beliefs on the genre, it will not be any better than this, I just have to accept it.
----
----
I like these kind of threads.
What has to be understood is that best experience does not equal best MMO. Games like EQ wowed us with their technology - and the idea of virtual worlds before the internet age had truly awoken. Nowadays the game would be trivialized with youtube videos and is mostly about grinding.
So my list:
#1 GW2.
Best Art. Best Graphics. Best Music. No gear grind needed - can fully outfit any character in minutes after they hit 80. No social pressure to play (your particular character is not needed for anything) - the guild systems are not strong. There is no raiding - so there is no pressure to recruit the 'best.'. There is no monetary pressure to play. Combat is animation based - not just tacked on animations after hidden dice rolls. Move out of the way - and you won't get hit. The only MMO I would recommend to regular people.
#2. WoW
Revolutionary game - took MMOs out of the niche grind world and brought them into the mainstream. Was the first major game to start to use proper 'video game' mechanics in an MMO. Made the game play more like a Mario style game then previous MMOs - more twitch - more timing - more skill. Featured both social pressure to play (guilds needed geared players for raiding) and monetary pressure (hey I am spending that monthy fee). To really enjoy needed ridiculous hours spent (not a problem for some around here).. This makes it much harder to pay nowadays - though Blizz has softened about as much as they can on this.
#3. EQ.
Amazing game. The only game that really created the feeling of a virtual world. Took "MUDs" to the next level. It's 'too bad' mechanics was absolutely thrilling at times - and the Skyrim style 'exploits' that you could pull off felt glorious. The idea that you could kill off any NPC was wonderful. It was the MMO for true nerds and with people with massive amounts of time to kill. It seemed 10 years ahead of its time. All those cool mechanics make it seem unplayable now for most. Anyone can play Project 1999 to get the old school experience but few people want to..
Now its true that some will say that GW2 feels 'boring' in comparison to other MMOs and that there is nothing to do. But that's simply the result of the stripping of all the normal "non-game' incentives for play. There is no social pressure and no gear pressure. You only play if you WANT to play an MMO. It's relatively manipulation free - so in that aspect its amazing.
GW2 says hey you are blowing time on getting these pretty pixels. They don't even really "do' anything special but we won't stop you if that's what you want. It's a bit mind blowing that a company made a game like that..
Honorable mention: EQ2. Was almost great kinda got swallowed up by WoW. ESO, SWTOR and Wildstar aren't bad either..but didn't really do much for the genre.
still remember the first time I went out on my druid with a raid group to the old frontiers and seeing a thanes AE hammer dropping down, my jaw hit the ground and I was in love with the game ever since.
The people that are trying to make the world worse never take a day off , why should I. Light up the darkness Bob Marley
I still know the old frontiers in and out. The game was great. Playing a hero in DAoC was the most fun I've ever had on any game.
In a world of sharp knives, you would be a spoon.
Cant be better sayd, all is sayed. EQ was my first (tho touched meridian a bit) and stayed there for 4,5 yrs.
So EQ is No. 1
No.2 & 3 I can say a tie between EQ2 and TSW - last having most meaningful quests in MMO history.
Never touched WoW cuz for me WoW was starting of fall of Golden Age of MMOs, dumbdowning and so on.
And No. 4 & 5 close tie are Fallen Earth and LoTRO
Both very good games still devs made them stupid or dull, which is in conclusion the same.
Still Asherons Call 1 for me.
Challenge No game to date has taken on this games form of action combat. You could be swarmed by 20 mobs and survive if you had the right equipment, skills and knowledge.
Consequences Death took your most expensive items on you and you had to recover them requiring you to make sure you had just enough items of higher value than your equipement.
Choice A game that actually allowed you to totally gimp your character with the wrong skill choices since you could train any skill on any character with a set total to use on your choices (so you could train sword use and healing magic and not take melee defense and end up getting owned in close combat) and a complete open world, no zones at all...you could be fighting level 10 mobs one minute and mistakenly wander into an area with mobs over level 20 without knowing it.
Community Never played a game with a better community than Asherons Call. Used to love doing loot hand outs to lowbies on the weekends.
Monthly Updates Thats right, the only game ever released that had a content update each and every single month.
Mystery Since there were no actual quests, if you didn't read books laying around you really had no idea where anything was so every time you went someplace new it was completely unexpected...and if you were reading the books it was crazy exciting actually finding what you read about.
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
While I was not a fan of Tera, I find it difficult to argue your logic and while my opinion may be titular, it is what it is. I am suddenly craving melons, hmmmm...
I would make a thread on sexually exploiting women but it would get the lock. Especially since my angle is "why wont they exploit gay males???"
*sighs*
Yeah but doesn't that mean Scarlet Blade should win because it not only has boob physics but also bares them for all to see?
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
how do you figure this when EQN is going to be a free to play with cash shop game?
SOE game model for EQ2 is perfect and i am sure it will be the same for EQN. But then again P2P model isn't always a guarantee for a good game *cough Wildstar *cough*!!
Payment model got nothing to do with how good or bad the game is. AA for example an awesome game despite of how the cash shop is run.