I think that in terms of every objective metric you could find, MMO's are more healthy today than they were in the heyday of EQ. More people play, more dollars are spent, and more games are available. Are they better? That depends on what you mean. They are better in the sense that they have brought more people to what was a very nitche market. They are better in that they took the genre mainstream.
Mind you, I hope someone makes your game for you. I am all about hoping people get the choices they want. However, I just don't see it. There's not enough of a market to justify the expense and risk to doing something that has not proven to be very popular as of late.
Wildstar catered to the hardcore and failed miserably. Yes, they had problems, but the challenge of their raid content was not one of them. Most people complained about that same challenge and guilds left in droves. 40 man raids? No thank you, people said. Huge attunement keeping people away from the endgame? I'm quitting said the population.
They may be weak, entitled, or coddled, or whatever. However, dollars speak volumes and vocal minorities on forums do not.
Developers listen when people stop playing their game. Harcore is not a good market to pursue becasue there are far more casuals who are not nearly as critical. Again, I hope you get your game. Not what I would want, but diversity is good. Good luck in your wish.
Step away from the forums for a year. Let's drop in and have a peek.
Hmm...nope, nothing's changed. Same faces, same complaints.
See you next year!
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Second because people start everything its grind(i remember this * word dont exist ever its magic)
Third most people want instant gratification people forget how hard is archive something in hardcore games
Four developer forget about replay value to dont need add contet every week , most actual mmo and futures people going burn 3yr developing in 1 moth or less
Main because contet are easy and people want consume everytime more fast and fast
Like or not developer can project , code , debug , qa in same speed has player consume
its why developer need focus in hard contet - Skill wise , Grind wise , or Replay value
MOBA's can peacefully coexist with MMORPGs, as their audience tends to be quite different. Sure, they're both "gamers", but most hardcore MOBA players have little interest in traditional MMOs, and those who adore MMOs won't switch full time to MOBAs either, since they find themselves missing the kind of character progress and attachment that an MMORPG offers.
MMOs are far from dead. If one were to add up the total population of people playing them these days you'd end up with a huge friggin' nation. The big titles have several hundred thousands of players, with some of them even upwards of one million (I believe FFXIV had 1,7 mil or subs or something?). If MMOs were dead then there wouldn't be such a ridiculous amount of them, all being profitable enough to remain in business (and in many cases for their publishers to keep churning out new ones. PWE is a good example of one such publisher).
Ridiculously hardcore MMOs are dead because you have to live glued to your PC to get anywhere in them. Or have five accounts like some SWG players boasted about.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
Step away from the forums for a year. Let's drop in and have a peek.
Hmm...nope, nothing's changed. Same faces, same complaints.
See you next year!
Lol, sad but true. And happy new years!
Tbh I don't even know why i still visit these forums most of the time.
- As for the OP and his severely dead horse. He's not looking for an innovative game, or even a new game. He's looking for an older game that feels new. Him and most of the people on these forums. Demanding MMOs exist, challenging MMOs exist (though that is subjective to your personal skill lvl), difficult lvling curves and gear progression exists. However, as has been said, ALL of these things are a niche. They may have been acceptable when there were only ~300k or so players in the entire genre. Now we have 10s of millions.
If a game as you described is what you truly want, you can go play some of the older MMOs that are still around. But you won't, because that's not what you actually want. You want your own personal shopping list of features unrestrained by the reality of their tradeoffs.
This whole forum is about people with depression disorder and a lot of stress about MMOS. Ya there's good arguments, what not. Look Wow is good mmo and Ever quest is a good mmo, but some people don't like wow or Ever Quest.. Maybe a lot of people in this forum are just Completely burnt out of mmos. People who make it level 80 or 50 all in one day doesn't really have good solid review of the mmo at all because he never toke his time to play the game or read the stories. Goes on the internet forums says the game sucks, but really he just rush through everything or just camp poop out or constantly do dungeons. Which by the way is really boring for a lot of people, but still do it because its fastest way to level up. It could be he doesn't like the game, which is fine. When ever mmo does something you like. You end up hating it because you nick pick the poop out of it. You ask me mmo do a lot of stuff new these days and a lot of it still have old mechanics.
The reason why Ever quest and World of war craft was great mmo for you is because of the friends ships you had in there. There's a lot of mmos out there that can fit a persons requirements. What ever they want in a mmo. There's a whole bafay out there for you.
Long travel times could be a great asset, people just do not see it. This is simply a matter of designing an enormous virtual world, while actually making travel interesting. Nothing says that a 6 hour journey from one major city to another, necessarily needs to be accomplished in one sitting. Why not do 30 minutes this day? And then maybe 2 hours the next? You may even make the journey longer if the world is designed interestingly enough to sidetrack people, on their own accord.
nah .. just make the interesting parts (like fighting through a canyon and what not) assessible right away. People don't like long travel times not because of the interesting parts, but because of the boring parts (walking walking walking looking at slowly changing scenarios).
If you make the route like a dungeon, with interesting combat, and traps, and scripted stories every step of the way, people won't complain as much, but that won't be "travel", and will just be a dungeon run.
Comments
I think that in terms of every objective metric you could find, MMO's are more healthy today than they were in the heyday of EQ. More people play, more dollars are spent, and more games are available. Are they better? That depends on what you mean. They are better in the sense that they have brought more people to what was a very nitche market. They are better in that they took the genre mainstream.
Mind you, I hope someone makes your game for you. I am all about hoping people get the choices they want. However, I just don't see it. There's not enough of a market to justify the expense and risk to doing something that has not proven to be very popular as of late.
Wildstar catered to the hardcore and failed miserably. Yes, they had problems, but the challenge of their raid content was not one of them. Most people complained about that same challenge and guilds left in droves. 40 man raids? No thank you, people said. Huge attunement keeping people away from the endgame? I'm quitting said the population.
They may be weak, entitled, or coddled, or whatever. However, dollars speak volumes and vocal minorities on forums do not.
Developers listen when people stop playing their game. Harcore is not a good market to pursue becasue there are far more casuals who are not nearly as critical. Again, I hope you get your game. Not what I would want, but diversity is good. Good luck in your wish.
Step away from the forums for a year. Let's drop in and have a peek.
Hmm...nope, nothing's changed. Same faces, same complaints.
See you next year!
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
MOBA's can peacefully coexist with MMORPGs, as their audience tends to be quite different. Sure, they're both "gamers", but most hardcore MOBA players have little interest in traditional MMOs, and those who adore MMOs won't switch full time to MOBAs either, since they find themselves missing the kind of character progress and attachment that an MMORPG offers.
MMOs are far from dead. If one were to add up the total population of people playing them these days you'd end up with a huge friggin' nation. The big titles have several hundred thousands of players, with some of them even upwards of one million (I believe FFXIV had 1,7 mil or subs or something?). If MMOs were dead then there wouldn't be such a ridiculous amount of them, all being profitable enough to remain in business (and in many cases for their publishers to keep churning out new ones. PWE is a good example of one such publisher).
Ridiculously hardcore MMOs are dead because you have to live glued to your PC to get anywhere in them. Or have five accounts like some SWG players boasted about.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/
Lol, sad but true. And happy new years!
Tbh I don't even know why i still visit these forums most of the time.
- As for the OP and his severely dead horse. He's not looking for an innovative game, or even a new game. He's looking for an older game that feels new. Him and most of the people on these forums. Demanding MMOs exist, challenging MMOs exist (though that is subjective to your personal skill lvl), difficult lvling curves and gear progression exists. However, as has been said, ALL of these things are a niche. They may have been acceptable when there were only ~300k or so players in the entire genre. Now we have 10s of millions.
If a game as you described is what you truly want, you can go play some of the older MMOs that are still around. But you won't, because that's not what you actually want. You want your own personal shopping list of features unrestrained by the reality of their tradeoffs.
This whole forum is about people with depression disorder and a lot of stress about MMOS. Ya there's good arguments, what not. Look Wow is good mmo and Ever quest is a good mmo, but some people don't like wow or Ever Quest.. Maybe a lot of people in this forum are just Completely burnt out of mmos. People who make it level 80 or 50 all in one day doesn't really have good solid review of the mmo at all because he never toke his time to play the game or read the stories. Goes on the internet forums says the game sucks, but really he just rush through everything or just camp poop out or constantly do dungeons. Which by the way is really boring for a lot of people, but still do it because its fastest way to level up. It could be he doesn't like the game, which is fine. When ever mmo does something you like. You end up hating it because you nick pick the poop out of it. You ask me mmo do a lot of stuff new these days and a lot of it still have old mechanics.
The reason why Ever quest and World of war craft was great mmo for you is because of the friends ships you had in there. There's a lot of mmos out there that can fit a persons requirements. What ever they want in a mmo. There's a whole bafay out there for you.
nah .. just make the interesting parts (like fighting through a canyon and what not) assessible right away. People don't like long travel times not because of the interesting parts, but because of the boring parts (walking walking walking looking at slowly changing scenarios).
If you make the route like a dungeon, with interesting combat, and traps, and scripted stories every step of the way, people won't complain as much, but that won't be "travel", and will just be a dungeon run.