Playing TESO + Paying $15 per month for added bonus = bad value
When the company is extorting the customer for access to their character, this is considered a good value. When the company allows access to the character for free, but sells additional bonus while using the character, this is considered a bad value.
Just think about it.
What's to think about? Before March 17th no choice - you like it? You pay and you play,
After March 17th - choice. You like it? you play and either pay or not... was that so hard?
If you considered $15 a month a good value for TESO prior to 17 March... why is it not a good value after 17 March. Has the game suddenly become less enjoyable, less fun, less entertaining? Has $15 become more difficult to obtain?
If you are not willing to pay the $15 a month after 17 March, I suspect the issue is that it was not actually worth $15 a month before... but that you had not really evaluated it recently, and were just paying out of a sunk cost fallacy.
You're over complicating it to try to shoehorn some pet theory into this. It's as simple as having a choice. When you have a choice to pay or not to pay you then look at what you get for your money since it's no longer a play / not play binary decision.
I like the game and will continue to play and if the sub ever becomes something worth something to me, I'll sub it then, In the meantime I just keep on playing and enjoying it on March 17th just like I was on March 16th.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
I think there will be decent retention once the transition takes place. I can tell you right now though, that me and my friends were about to resubscribe in February for 1.6, but after the announcement we decided to wait. I'm sure we're not the only crew to do so
I dont think subs will drop. I think they will increase.
1. Even now there are still new players coming in after the B2P announcement.
2. Some previous players are also coming back now.
3. It will be cheaper to maintain / have a sub for DLC if you wanted.
4. The Crowns you get for subbing will add up over time for you to buy any possible expansion or to buy any DLC you want to keep if you let your sub expire.
I've been a subscriber since about a month after Launch and I don't really see any reason NOT to continue as such. My willingness to pay to play the game hasn't changed. I see the "perks" of being a Prime member, or whatever they're calling it as just a bonus for doing something I already do.
B2P, 6 months without any content update, updates will be slower from now on (not like they were fast to begin with) and on top of that, new content behind paywall masked as DLCs!!! This is gonna be fun to watch.
Originally posted by Razeekster Yup, called it. They're going for the slow SWTOR model where they milk players through the cash shop while also providing players with an option for a sub (with your sub being pretty useless besides unlocking certain things so the game isn't annoying to play), and paid content updates.
I really hope ESO won't go the SWTOR f2p way. As a free player, you cannot do almost any of the end game there. The limitations are too huge.
I would like to see a system like EQ2 or TSW where you can buy DLCs at your own pace. I wouldn't like a system like GW2 where there are almost no new content.
Answering the main topic, I think subs will decrease a lot once it goes B2P but also that the selling numbers both in PC and consoles will raise balancing the game's earnings. Just my opinion :-)
Playing TESO + Paying $15 per month for added bonus = bad value
When the company is extorting the customer for access to their character, this is considered a good value. When the company allows access to the character for free, but sells additional bonus while using the character, this is considered a bad value.
Just think about it.
What's to think about? Before March 17th no choice - you like it? You pay and you play,
After March 17th - choice. You like it? you play and either pay or not... was that so hard?
If you considered $15 a month a good value for TESO prior to 17 March... why is it not a good value after 17 March. Has the game suddenly become less enjoyable, less fun, less entertaining? Has $15 become more difficult to obtain?
If you are not willing to pay the $15 a month after 17 March, I suspect the issue is that it was not actually worth $15 a month before... but that you had not really evaluated it recently, and were just paying out of a sunk cost fallacy.
You're over complicating it to try to shoehorn some pet theory into this. It's as simple as having a choice. When you have a choice to pay or not to pay you then look at what you get for your money since it's no longer a play / not play binary decision.
I like the game and will continue to play and if the sub ever becomes something worth something to me, I'll sub it then, In the meantime I just keep on playing and enjoying it on March 17th just like I was on March 16th.
I dont believe I am overcomplicating at all... here, let me show you a post from someone that actually believed that they were receiving a good value at $15 per month.
Originally posted by heavyartillery I've been a subscriber since about a month after Launch and I don't really see any reason NOT to continue as such. My willingness to pay to play the game hasn't changed. I see the "perks" of being a Prime member, or whatever they're calling it as just a bonus for doing something I already do.
This shows that there are people that believe that $15 a month is a good value for this game. Those that now have to question the value (when they are actually receiving more than in the past) should have questioned its value in the past (when it was lower) but did not because they felt that they had to keep spending because of the money already invested.
The bottom line is this. If it was a good value before the 17th, it is only a better value after. However, if you are not finding it a good value after, it might not have been as good a value before either.
I'm thinking subs will decrease over time. The main concern will be consoles. I'm wondering how the character port from PC to console is being tested and if a person will be able to go back to PC if they don't like the way their character plays on a console? Ports will probably end up a cash shop item.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
The bottom line is this. If it was a good value before the 17th, it is only a better value after. However, if you are not finding it a good value after, it might not have been as good a value before either.
Well I can agree with that part. The value for the same game is $15/month before March 17th. After that you get the same thing for free. Now that's what I call better value!
Paying $15/month after that (before any DLC content is released) is paying for something more than we currently get for the sub. It's not anything I'm interested in as I liked, like and will continue to like the game I'm playing without the 10% bonuses.
But your second sentence is where the shoehorning and spinning comes in: what you pay $15 for after March 17th is NOT what I paid for before - that game is now free. If anyone wants to pay $15 a month for bonuses and some crowns, more power to them,
But that means absolutely nothing with respect to the worth of what we currently have. That will become free on March 17th. I don't need any more than that.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Based on Skyrim sales, the console version will be over 80% of total sales, and likely higher.
Will they lose some subs because of B2P? Of course. But it won't have much effect on them, since subs are going to be a small percentage anyway. Let's say they lose 1/2 of the subs (extreme example), it might only affect the bottom line by a few percentage points.
If they had offered a lifetime sub like LoTRO did, I would have bought it. Now, after subbing since the beginning, I've canceled my sub. Why pay for something that is free? I'm not hardcore enough to care about a 10% boost.
There is another not publically know reason for slower future content updates that ZoS can't really mention - since the beginning of the year many experienced devs have left the company (out of of their own volition). They simply don't have the same staff as they did even 3 months ago, as some of the key talent is no longer there.
The studio as whole is in a state of transition so a slowdown is necessary.
Yeah, the only person I know who worked there got let go about three months ago. Said they were downsizing. Of course, some updates don't really need the whole team that was designing the thing in the first place.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Haha, this is hilarious and rings true to just how bad this community has become. Here we have an article claiming how lacking the subscription perks are and yet we have a few threads already started by ESO haters claiming the subscription looks like it's P2W.
Sorry, but this is exactly why I ignore about 90% of what people write anymore. Every game has it's pro's and con's and anyone can make a list. It's up to each individual player to decide if it's worth playing or worth paying for. I'm not saying, speculating isn't fun, but it's become so over the top with people having to reach really deep into the tin foil barrel for something to discuss.
As of right now, I pay for 2 subscriptions and will continue to pay unless I see the F2P model is better. That's what we as consumers do. We look for the bigger, better deal. However, I paid for LOTRO pretty much all 4+ years that I played and was perfectly happy with that. So I'm willing to bet the same will hold true for ESO.
Based on Skyrim sales, the console version will be over 80% of total sales, and likely higher.
Will they lose some subs because of B2P? Of course. But it won't have much effect on them, since subs are going to be a small percentage anyway. Let's say they lose 1/2 of the subs (extreme example), it might only affect the bottom line by a few percentage points.
If they had offered a lifetime sub like LoTRO did, I would have bought it. Now, after subbing since the beginning, I've canceled my sub. Why pay for something that is free? I'm not hardcore enough to care about a 10% boost.
Exactly. And when value is added to the game by way of extra content, I will re-evaluate what I do at that point.
There's a lot of fuzzy thinking in this thread. probably form the same people who believe that "Sub Worthiness" is a real thing instead of just evidence of muddled thinking.
I play what I like because I like it and want to spend my valuable play time there. If I need to pay a sub to play what I want, I pay a sub. If I don't need to pay a sub, I don't.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Originally posted by Octagon7711 I'm thinking subs will decrease over time. The main concern will be consoles. I'm wondering how the character port from PC to console is being tested and if a person will be able to go back to PC if they don't like the way their character plays on a console? Ports will probably end up a cash shop item.
the Diablo 3 character port works great, im sure the ESO developers can come up with something just as good.
Originally posted by Octagon7711 I'm thinking subs will decrease over time. The main concern will be consoles. I'm wondering how the character port from PC to console is being tested and if a person will be able to go back to PC if they don't like the way their character plays on a console? Ports will probably end up a cash shop item.
the Diablo 3 character port works great, im sure the ESO developers can come up with something just as good.
There is no character port. There is a whole account COPY instead. After the copy, the PC and console versions will be identical including all gold, items, etc.
After the copy they each go their separate merry ways and both will be playable without one in any way influencing the other.
This was a limited offer only for those of us who had the game registered as of June 30th, 2014. We get the copy and the console version for the console of our choice for $20 as opposed to having to buy the console game for $60.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
The bottom line is this. If it was a good value before the 17th, it is only a better value after. However, if you are not finding it a good value after, it might not have been as good a value before either.
I don't think that's the correct way to look at it.
Before the 17th one had to pay $15 per month to get whatever value the game offered. However, after the 17th that SAME value no longer requires any money.
Therefore what one should look at is whether or not the new perks, bonuses, Crowns, DLC, etc will, going forward, be worth the $15.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I will wait and see what is in the store and what I get for my sub before deciding if I will continue it. If the amount of crowns is worth subbing and I want a lot of thing from the store, then I will keep it. Once I have enough crowns to buy anything I will lose once the sub ends, I may let it end and then buy what I need. I am doing that with SWTOR.
I will wait and see what is in the store and what I get for my sub before deciding if I will continue it. If the amount of crowns is worth subbing and I want a lot of thing from the store, then I will keep it. Once I have enough crowns to buy anything I will lose once the sub ends, I may let it end and then buy what I need. I am doing that with SWTOR.
I'll keep my sub until I can see what my allotment of crowns buy.
So far I haven't seen anything that is worth it. I'm holding out for an option to redo the looks of one of my characters.
After that, if I don't see anything that I want to buy I will drop the sub.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Originally posted by Octagon7711 I'm thinking subs will decrease over time. The main concern will be consoles. I'm wondering how the character port from PC to console is being tested and if a person will be able to go back to PC if they don't like the way their character plays on a console? Ports will probably end up a cash shop item.
the Diablo 3 character port works great, im sure the ESO developers can come up with something just as good.
There is no character port. There is a whole account COPY instead. After the copy, the PC and console versions will be identical including all gold, items, etc.
After the copy they each go their separate merry ways and both will be playable without one in any way influencing the other.
This was a limited offer only for those of us who had the game registered as of June 30th, 2014. We get the copy and the console version for the console of our choice for $20 as opposed to having to buy the console game for $60.
Sounds like you're saying a person will still be able to play on both systems. I think you mean it's an account transfer. After the transfer the PC account will be gone.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Playing TESO + Paying $15 per month for added bonus = bad value
When the company is extorting the customer for access to their character, this is considered a good value. When the company allows access to the character for free, but sells additional bonus while using the character, this is considered a bad value.
Just think about it.
What's to think about? Before March 17th no choice - you like it? You pay and you play,
After March 17th - choice. You like it? you play and either pay or not... was that so hard?
If you considered $15 a month a good value for TESO prior to 17 March... why is it not a good value after 17 March. Has the game suddenly become less enjoyable, less fun, less entertaining? Has $15 become more difficult to obtain?
If you are not willing to pay the $15 a month after 17 March, I suspect the issue is that it was not actually worth $15 a month before... but that you had not really evaluated it recently, and were just paying out of a sunk cost fallacy.
Every game that transitioned to a Hybrid model, ended up being a cash grab with most content being released in form of Cash Shop items, instead of actual content in the game.
Lets see how long it takes till ESO's cash shop sees the arrival of those stupid gamble.... ehh lock boxes. /shrug
Originally posted by Octagon7711 I'm thinking subs will decrease over time. The main concern will be consoles. I'm wondering how the character port from PC to console is being tested and if a person will be able to go back to PC if they don't like the way their character plays on a console? Ports will probably end up a cash shop item.
the Diablo 3 character port works great, im sure the ESO developers can come up with something just as good.
There is no character port. There is a whole account COPY instead. After the copy, the PC and console versions will be identical including all gold, items, etc.
After the copy they each go their separate merry ways and both will be playable without one in any way influencing the other.
This was a limited offer only for those of us who had the game registered as of June 30th, 2014. We get the copy and the console version for the console of our choice for $20 as opposed to having to buy the console game for $60.
Sounds like you're saying a person will still be able to play on both systems. I think you mean it's an account transfer. After the transfer the PC account will be gone.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Originally posted by Octagon7711 I'm thinking subs will decrease over time. The main concern will be consoles. I'm wondering how the character port from PC to console is being tested and if a person will be able to go back to PC if they don't like the way their character plays on a console? Ports will probably end up a cash shop item.
the Diablo 3 character port works great, im sure the ESO developers can come up with something just as good.
There is no character port. There is a whole account COPY instead. After the copy, the PC and console versions will be identical including all gold, items, etc.
After the copy they each go their separate merry ways and both will be playable without one in any way influencing the other.
This was a limited offer only for those of us who had the game registered as of June 30th, 2014. We get the copy and the console version for the console of our choice for $20 as opposed to having to buy the console game for $60.
Sounds like you're saying a person will still be able to play on both systems. I think you mean it's an account transfer. After the transfer the PC account will be gone.
Nice. At least players will have proof of what was in their account before the copy just in case something goes wrong. Here's hoping for a successful copy then.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Bonuses to sub seem very minor. ESO doesn't appear to be aligning at all with the Swtor model. B2p really means b2p.
Subbing has the drawback of requiring a sub to play the DLCs and like far costlier than just waiting to pay on demand.
For now I feel little draw for the game. I can't even log in. I think many are experiencing this and is akin to pre-expansion feelings. Honestly I'd almost rather start fresh with a new character once 16 hits to experience everything from scratch.
Comments
You're over complicating it to try to shoehorn some pet theory into this. It's as simple as having a choice. When you have a choice to pay or not to pay you then look at what you get for your money since it's no longer a play / not play binary decision.
I like the game and will continue to play and if the sub ever becomes something worth something to me, I'll sub it then, In the meantime I just keep on playing and enjoying it on March 17th just like I was on March 16th.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
I dont think subs will drop. I think they will increase.
1. Even now there are still new players coming in after the B2P announcement.
2. Some previous players are also coming back now.
3. It will be cheaper to maintain / have a sub for DLC if you wanted.
4. The Crowns you get for subbing will add up over time for you to buy any possible expansion or to buy any DLC you want to keep if you let your sub expire.
I really hope ESO won't go the SWTOR f2p way. As a free player, you cannot do almost any of the end game there. The limitations are too huge.
I would like to see a system like EQ2 or TSW where you can buy DLCs at your own pace. I wouldn't like a system like GW2 where there are almost no new content.
Answering the main topic, I think subs will decrease a lot once it goes B2P but also that the selling numbers both in PC and consoles will raise balancing the game's earnings. Just my opinion :-)
^.^'
I dont believe I am overcomplicating at all... here, let me show you a post from someone that actually believed that they were receiving a good value at $15 per month.
This shows that there are people that believe that $15 a month is a good value for this game. Those that now have to question the value (when they are actually receiving more than in the past) should have questioned its value in the past (when it was lower) but did not because they felt that they had to keep spending because of the money already invested.
The bottom line is this. If it was a good value before the 17th, it is only a better value after. However, if you are not finding it a good value after, it might not have been as good a value before either.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I retired retroactively..Haha
Well I can agree with that part. The value for the same game is $15/month before March 17th. After that you get the same thing for free. Now that's what I call better value!
Paying $15/month after that (before any DLC content is released) is paying for something more than we currently get for the sub. It's not anything I'm interested in as I liked, like and will continue to like the game I'm playing without the 10% bonuses.
But your second sentence is where the shoehorning and spinning comes in: what you pay $15 for after March 17th is NOT what I paid for before - that game is now free. If anyone wants to pay $15 a month for bonuses and some crowns, more power to them,
But that means absolutely nothing with respect to the worth of what we currently have. That will become free on March 17th. I don't need any more than that.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Based on Skyrim sales, the console version will be over 80% of total sales, and likely higher.
Will they lose some subs because of B2P? Of course. But it won't have much effect on them, since subs are going to be a small percentage anyway. Let's say they lose 1/2 of the subs (extreme example), it might only affect the bottom line by a few percentage points.
If they had offered a lifetime sub like LoTRO did, I would have bought it. Now, after subbing since the beginning, I've canceled my sub. Why pay for something that is free? I'm not hardcore enough to care about a 10% boost.
------------
2024: 47 years on the Net.
Yeah, the only person I know who worked there got let go about three months ago. Said they were downsizing. Of course, some updates don't really need the whole team that was designing the thing in the first place.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Amen to this.
Exactly. And when value is added to the game by way of extra content, I will re-evaluate what I do at that point.
There's a lot of fuzzy thinking in this thread. probably form the same people who believe that "Sub Worthiness" is a real thing instead of just evidence of muddled thinking.
I play what I like because I like it and want to spend my valuable play time there. If I need to pay a sub to play what I want, I pay a sub. If I don't need to pay a sub, I don't.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
the Diablo 3 character port works great, im sure the ESO developers can come up with something just as good.
There is no character port. There is a whole account COPY instead. After the copy, the PC and console versions will be identical including all gold, items, etc.
After the copy they each go their separate merry ways and both will be playable without one in any way influencing the other.
This was a limited offer only for those of us who had the game registered as of June 30th, 2014. We get the copy and the console version for the console of our choice for $20 as opposed to having to buy the console game for $60.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
I don't think that's the correct way to look at it.
Before the 17th one had to pay $15 per month to get whatever value the game offered. However, after the 17th that SAME value no longer requires any money.
Therefore what one should look at is whether or not the new perks, bonuses, Crowns, DLC, etc will, going forward, be worth the $15.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I actually resubbed.
I will wait and see what is in the store and what I get for my sub before deciding if I will continue it. If the amount of crowns is worth subbing and I want a lot of thing from the store, then I will keep it. Once I have enough crowns to buy anything I will lose once the sub ends, I may let it end and then buy what I need. I am doing that with SWTOR.
I'll keep my sub until I can see what my allotment of crowns buy.
So far I haven't seen anything that is worth it. I'm holding out for an option to redo the looks of one of my characters.
After that, if I don't see anything that I want to buy I will drop the sub.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Sounds like you're saying a person will still be able to play on both systems. I think you mean it's an account transfer. After the transfer the PC account will be gone.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Every game that transitioned to a Hybrid model, ended up being a cash grab with most content being released in form of Cash Shop items, instead of actual content in the game.
Lets see how long it takes till ESO's cash shop sees the arrival of those stupid gamble.... ehh lock boxes. /shrug
Yes. That is exactly what I'm saying.
https://help.elderscrollsonline.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/21326/kw/transfer%20to%20console
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Nice. At least players will have proof of what was in their account before the copy just in case something goes wrong. Here's hoping for a successful copy then.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Bonuses to sub seem very minor. ESO doesn't appear to be aligning at all with the Swtor model. B2p really means b2p.
Subbing has the drawback of requiring a sub to play the DLCs and like far costlier than just waiting to pay on demand.
For now I feel little draw for the game. I can't even log in. I think many are experiencing this and is akin to pre-expansion feelings. Honestly I'd almost rather start fresh with a new character once 16 hits to experience everything from scratch.
You stay sassy!