You asked for a link greatsky then you insult the person who provided it as not having better things to do with their time. Then perhaps you should not ask for a link if you cannot be bothered to search for it. Did that occur to you ?
Originally posted by mrputts If every game was at the same quality out the gate as FFARR. NONE of them would be F2P.
I would agree with this. I quit SWTOR because it was buggy as all hell even though I am a star wars fan and liked the game. However when end game was so buggy and the game really felt like I was in a shoe box I wouldnt continue to play the game. I still dont play the game even though is F2P because its not worth my time or my money. People dont realize how high Quality ARR is really and how much content they put out in each patch.
Originally posted by mrputts If every game was at the same quality out the gate as FFARR. NONE of them would be F2P.
Isn't "FFXIV-ARR" a remake of "FFXIV" though? By what I mean: it was complete trash out of the gate, then when through a transition period to be remade to the current (apparently good) version.
Originally posted by mrputts If every game was at the same quality out the gate as FFARR. NONE of them would be F2P.
Isn't "FFXIV-ARR" a remake of "FFXIV" though? By what I mean: it was complete trash out of the gate, then when through a transition period to be remade to the current (apparently good) version.
Yes the game was trash right out of the gate in 1.0. If I remember correctly it was F2P at some point because it was so bad. So they Revamped the game and made ARR. SE did the right thing which a lot of MMOs do not do is shut the game down and revamp it. Now its very successful. The problem is people continue to trash the game because its a P2P game and they find any reason to say it should not be. Really the game is doing good and people who play it are fine with the sub. SE is making money so they dont care about trying to make short term large money games at the cost of long term success.
Originally posted by Malabooga Originally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by MalaboogaOriginally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by MalaboogaOriginally posted by kitaradThe four million is registered accounts ,how is that false show me where it is false. Show me a quote where they said registered accounts equals current subs. If they said registered subs equals current subs then they lied otherwise you have no case.
Just check these forums. And how 4 mil fared on these forums until it was straighten up. Yup.Oh, and touting that "FFXIV is last P2P MMO" is completely false.Its HYBRID model of box+mandatory sub+CASH SHOP(+expansions)Quadriple dipping. And F2P games get ripped apart for just having....cash shop. lolFfxiv's cash shop compared to a f2p or b2p's cash shop. Ffxiv's content updates compared to everyone else. Huge differences.Yup, but its not P2P game, its HYBRID game and has every monetization known to MMOs included.Oh, and i asked already, just for information, whats payment model in China? Yeah, im lazy China has their own rules mandated by their government in regards to how an mmo is monetized there. BTW, I hate cash shops including the one in ffxiv. Fact remains, the sub keeps that cash shop to a minimum. I hope it stays that way or I'm out. There's no cash shop currency that carries over in game which is sadly quite rare these days. And lastly, it hands down outpaces every mmo in patched content. How long will that last? Who knows. Definitely not forever. So just like everyone else and their mmo of choice, in not gonna worry about it and just enjoy the gaming goodness for as long as I can. So i would say it F2P in China.
And thats the point, they felt the need to include cash shop on top of mandatory sub. Just like that they can change to F2P at any point, expand cash shop in any way they see fit.
If they were so satisfied with what they make, why did they introduced cash shop? Greed?
Who knows their personal motivations. All I know is that there was a high demand for vials of fantasia to be placed in a cash shop by the majority of forum goers. And with all cash shops, they only get bigger heh. And apparently, this bothers the hell out of you... Why exactly?
The four million is registered accounts ,how is that false show me where it is false. Show me a quote where they said registered accounts equals current subs. If they said registered subs equals current subs then they lied otherwise you have no case.
Just check these forums. And how 4 mil fared on these forums until it was straighten up. Yup.
Oh, and touting that "FFXIV is last P2P MMO" is completely false.
Its HYBRID model of box+mandatory sub+CASH SHOP(+expansions)
Quadriple dipping. And F2P games get ripped apart for just having....cash shop. lol
Do you guys even play ff xiv? The box costs less than half of what every other AAA game charges and the subscription is also under-costed. The digital collectors doesn't even cost what other companies charge for a game and the ps3 to ps4 upgrade was free. The cash shop is completely innocuous. All they sell are more character customization potions (that they also give out for free) and seasonal items that you can get completely for free if you participate in the events. It is just for people that missed it the first time because so many people complained that they wouldn't be able to get them once the event passed. The only reason they even charge money for the seasonal items is as a compromise to avoid trivializing the content and upsetting players who were actually there and got the items legitimately. Other than that they sell like two cosmetics that you can't get in game. The shop is so tucked away and under-advertised that most people don't even know it exists. It is completely disingenuous to act like the cash stop is in any way comparable to a f2p game. It isn't even anything close to b2p games like GW2.
They also never claimed or even implied that they have 4 million simultaneous subscribed players. If you twisted their words it's your own fault. You're just looking for things to complain about at this point. The re-launch was a success. You guys need to get over it and move on.
I'm glad someone took a stand on this. Not every game needs a F2P/Freemium model to survive. While it works for some, I think the trade offs are not worth it. I like to pay my sub and get it all, now having said that I think paid DLC/expansions are just fine as long as they add to the game ie... new classes, new lands, quests, recipes for crafting and so on. I also don't have a problem with a cash shop even in a P2P/B2P game as long as it's just fluff stuff. In my experience most but not all F2P games become Bot/Hacker fests that the Devs could give a shit less about as long as they make their money on the cash shop.
Do you guys even play ff xiv? The box costs less than half of what every other AAA game charges and the subscription is also under-costed. The digital collectors doesn't even cost what other companies charge for a game and the ps3 to ps4 upgrade was free. The cash shop is completely innocuous. All they sell are more character customization potions (that they also give out for free) and seasonal items that you can get completely for free if you participate in the events. It is just for people that missed it the first time because so many people complained that they wouldn't be able to get them once the event passed. The only reason they even charge money for the seasonal items is as a compromise to avoid trivializing the content and upsetting players who were actually there and got the items legitimately. Other than that they sell like two cosmetics that you can't get in game. The shop is so tucked away and under-advertised that most people don't even know it exists. It is completely disingenuous to act like the cash stop is in any way comparable to a f2p game. It isn't even anything close to b2p games like GW2.
The thing is that's the only way their argument works: by simplifying everything to their simplest form.
It doesn't matter what kind of cash shop there is; the fact is that there is a cash shop.
It doesn't matter how much the box fee is; the fact is there is a box fee.
It doesn't matter that the sub fee is lower than the competition's: the fact is there is a sub fee.
It doesn't matter how much value SE keeps pumping out for the playerbase in comparison to the competition: the fact is all MMOs update their games.
And like this, voilá, FFXIV:ARR is like any other MMO. Just keep simplifying until the argument fits your agenda. Sadly for them this only works on the discussion boards and not in real life where sensible people understand that there is more to the argument than the mere existence of the cash shop or sub fee.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
I don't see how this is any different than what every CEO for an MMO says. Bioware/EA said it, ZOS said it, etc etc.
There's really no news here. He's just doing a positive soundbite for the game.
I think it would have been more interesting if he said he'd commit seppuki if the game went F2P. But still, I doubt he would do it. Much like Alec Baldwin didn't fulfill his promise to move to Canada once Bush Jr. was elected.
I'm glad someone took a stand on this. Not every game needs a F2P/Freemium model to survive. While it works for some, I think the trade offs are not worth it. I like to pay my sub and get it all, now having said that I think paid DLC/expansions are just fine as long as they add to the game ie... new classes, new lands, quests, recipes for crafting and so on. I also don't have a problem with a cash shop even in a P2P/B2P game as long as it's just fluff stuff. In my experience most but not all F2P games become Bot/Hacker fests that the Devs could give a shit less about as long as they make their money on the cash shop.
Just my 2 cents worth. IMHO
Ah I see you've played ArcheAge lol
I have and that is why I will never again play a F2P game. I played other F2P games that sucked just as bad. DDO, LOTRO, Runes of Magic.
"over 80% of our players are satisfied with the subscription model"
That's kind of like going to a pool and asking the people swimming in it if they like swimming in pools.
Also, only 80% of your players paying for subscriptions are satisfied with paying subscriptions. Seems a bit low even if you take into account that there will always be some complainers.
This is a loaded statistic - over 80% of gun enthusiasts enjoy gun shows.
It would have been more meaningful to say "out of all players who ever tried FFIVARR x% is satiaifed with subscription" - that figure would be a hell of a lot lower - which is why they are not telling.
Only mention good sounding statistics - PR tactic 101 - all ccompnies do this
Why do I care about a statistic about people who are paying a sub that includes people who won't pay a sub? We are talking about ARR specifically. Those people won't play any MMO with a Sub regardless of the title. Your comparison is more about the genre wide argument about sub vs no sub. Pulling in numbers not specific to the ARR question will skew it. So what you are suggesting is as bad as what you are claiming.
A better question might be "Of the gamers willing to pay a sub, how many are satisfied with ARR?"
"This leaves it in the players hands. Want to keep this game P2P, then keep subbing AND buying form cash shop. My guess is they will only look at B2P or F2P as an option is if they are not making enough money.
Everything in the cash shop is cosmetic in function or is a service other AAA games charge for (server transfers/name changes/character alterations)
They could remove the cash shop and still keep the game P2P. I don't think SE is stupid enough to turn down extra money from people willing to spend it though. They've already outlined their plans to reinvest a bulk of the money gained from cash shop sales into an EU data center and to expand on the player housing servers, so it's not like this money is going right into the CEO's pocket or anything.
I don't see how this is any different than what every CEO for an MMO says. Bioware/EA said it, ZOS said it, etc etc.
There's really no news here. He's just doing a positive soundbite for the game.
I think it would have been more interesting if he said he'd commit seppuki if the game went F2P. But still, I doubt he would do it. Much like Alec Baldwin didn't fulfill his promise to move to Canada once Bush Jr. was elected.
True, but in most cases Devs say this before launch or few months after then shit hits the fan. FFXIV has been out 2 - 3 years now with no problems so far . The playerbase is healthy, content is constantly being put out. Right now they've got it good, if they continue as they are the game will be fine. I could only see a F2P conversion if they truly fuck it up by making the cash shop a centrepiece and taking the game down another route.
data that shows that over 80% of our players are satisfied with the subscription model and they feel very assured that it is a constant. You are safe to be in that environment, and you know that you can expect a decent amount of updates and content. So, we don’t believe that FFXIV needs to shift in that direction and not everything that other competitors or titles do will necessarily apply to our title.
If WOW ever goes completely free-to-play, maybe we will consider it. (Laughs)
I can't help but read that as "If WoW can continually overcharge for their product, then we're not about to stop either! (laughs)"
EDIT: I would also like to thank the person who wrote about how they enjoy paying a subscription to get "all" the content, except DLC and expansion packs and cash shop fluff items and so on because that's ok.
I wonder how far they will take the fluff? I mean, fluff is just how things look, so what if the coolest looking stuff was cash shop only? What if everyone rode around on a horse unless you could afford to buy the dragon in the cash shop? What about interfaces and cosmetic makeovers to the games appearance? What about emotes and other gestures/animations like walking and running? Would it be ok to sell a HD pack in the cash shop so you can take your resolution over 800 x 600? Really all those things are just "fluff" and are just cosmetic.
Anyhow, I think that if the players want to pay a subscription, then charge them a sub. If they want to buy stuff in a cash shop, then sell them stuff in a cash shop. And if the publishers want to change gears and market strategy, then we can all ready about how Joe Nobody thinks we should start a class action suit because they've been mislead.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
Originally posted by ThebeastttYou watch, as soon as the chips are down this game will be running to F2P faster then SWTOR.
Oh you must mean like Final Fantasy 14 1.0 that went Free to pl...wait a min... no... that did not happen.
I know right? You take ANY other publisher and put them in the same situation as 1.0 and they would've f2p hatchet jobbed that thing so fast your head would spin. But nope, the one company that cared enough about their IP made a complete overhaul and now it's one of the top mmorpgs on the market. And they fly that sub in the face of all the haters and they go nuts picking apart every little thing to try and validate their worn out rants. It's all quite entertaining lol
Originally posted by ThebeastttYou watch, as soon as the chips are down this game will be running to F2P faster then SWTOR.
Oh you must mean like Final Fantasy 14 1.0 that went Free to pl...wait a min... no... that did not happen.
I know right? You take ANY other publisher and put them in the same situation as 1.0 and they would've f2p hatchet jobbed that thing so fast your head would spin. But nope, the one company that cared enough about their IP made a complete overhaul and now it's one of the top mmorpgs on the market. And they fly that sub in the face of all the haters and they go nuts picking apart every little thing to try and validate their worn out rants. It's all quite entertaining lol
This gets back to the Japanese business principle. They're not much different than say Nintendo in this regard. They don't always make the best business decisions or do what their community wants if it goes against how they feel things should be done. Nintendo could make bank porting their games over to Steam or the PC like Squeenix did, but they won't because it violates how they think things should be done.
Squeenix sells XIV this way because they believe that is the way it should work, not because they could make more money or even because it makes their customers happy. They are more flexible in the last few years than they ever have been before and I think that is only because of the broken partnership with Sony. If that hadn't happened we wouldn't be seeing the FF titles on Steam and mobile.
I agree, they are stubborn to a fault. But it is a breath of fresh air to see it in the mmo space. Kick staters failing, games canceled, layoffs, buyouts. The mmo landscape is chaotic right now. So it's nice to have at least one that has a plan and they're sticking to it. Yoshi said they have a four year content roadmap. And from what they've shown they're capable of in the past two years, I believe they will see it through.
This is going to make me try it out again. I'm really not liking all the F2p stuff being introduced into games that were previously sub only. I want to support the developer more than anything.
data that shows that over 80% of our players are satisfied with the subscription model and they feel very assured that it is a constant. You are safe to be in that environment, and you know that you can expect a decent amount of updates and content. So, we don’t believe that FFXIV needs to shift in that direction and not everything that other competitors or titles do will necessarily apply to our title.
If WOW ever goes completely free-to-play, maybe we will consider it. (Laughs)
I can't help but read that as "If WoW can continually overcharge for their product, then we're not about to stop either! (laughs)"
EDIT: I would also like to thank the person who wrote about how they enjoy paying a subscription to get "all" the content, except DLC and expansion packs and cash shop fluff items and so on because that's ok.
I wonder how far they will take the fluff? I mean, fluff is just how things look, so what if the coolest looking stuff was cash shop only? What if everyone rode around on a horse unless you could afford to buy the dragon in the cash shop? What about interfaces and cosmetic makeovers to the games appearance? What about emotes and other gestures/animations like walking and running? Would it be ok to sell a HD pack in the cash shop so you can take your resolution over 800 x 600? Really all those things are just "fluff" and are just cosmetic.
Anyhow, I think that if the players want to pay a subscription, then charge them a sub. If they want to buy stuff in a cash shop, then sell them stuff in a cash shop. And if the publishers want to change gears and market strategy, then we can all ready about how Joe Nobody thinks we should start a class action suit because they've been mislead.
Overcharge? In what universe does Square-Enix have the leverage to overcharge their product? In 10 years WoW has managed to gather 10 million loyal sheep to support them by providing massive amounts of dev support in the past. Sheep that stay loyal even when being overcharged today.
What magic does Square-Enix use to get their customers to pay more for less? You might say it's because of the Final Fantasy brand; I say the brand did them no good whatsoever when their customers abandoned the original 1.0 version. Is it the flawless track record in giving the customers what they want over these past five years? I am being sarcastic of course; for two (or three) out of the five years SE has done the complete opposite.
WoW can continually overcharge for their product today because they managed to create a loyal fanbase yesterday. The history of FFXIV has proven that SE is not even close to a similar position.
FFXIV:ARR came out bearing the name and reputation of its failed precedessor. It is outright delusional to think that they are in a place to overcharge and still manage to grow their customerbase instead of shrinking it. The playerbase has already proven that they are not sheep; just look at FFXIV 1.0 as the proof. Maybe that situation will change someday. But today, they are going to go and have gone as far with the fluff as their customers will allow them. The simple fact is they have a box fee, a sub fee and "a cash shop", as well as a playerbase that has proven that they are more than willing to walk away if not satisfied. Yet these people have decided to stick with A Realm Reborn. The same people are keeping Square-Enix in check because FFXIV:ARR is nothing without them.
You are essentially saying that the customers who abandoned FFXIV 1.0 are voluntarily letting themselves be overcharged by SE. Yes, clearly WoW customers and FFXIV customers have the same history with their respective products so this must be true. Or, just maybe, SE is actually providing so much value in their product that the failed reputation that weighed ARR has turned into a successful business opportunity.
TL;DR: I think you need new reading glasses. Also, satirical is my pick. You got me there mate.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
And thats the point, they felt the need to include cash shop on top of mandatory sub. Just like that they can change to F2P at any point, expand cash shop in any way they see fit.
If they were so satisfied with what they make, why did they introduced cash shop? Greed?
They've explained why they introduced the cash shop multiple times. The money they're making with the cash shop is used to, for example, launch the game in other regions (Korea this year), expand the game's infrastructure (opening an EU datacenter) and more than likely localizing the game to other languages (spanish has been rumored previously).
Also all the FFXIV cash shop has is literally 1 mount, a couple pets and some costumes that were obtainable in game from various events.
You're trying way to hard to make it sound like FFXIV is a cash grab, but you're forgetting multiple things, for example that the game is cheap as fuck, that the subscription is also cheaper than usual, and the most important thing: a single FFXIV patch has more meaningful content than the last 3 years of GW2.
So yeah, I'll keep supporting a company that actually works hard to keep their players happy, because I've already had enough trying to support games like GW2, that had such a huge potential to be something great, and ended up being not more than a sad joke.
Btw, you're also making it sound like the 4 million copies sold (GW2, ESO, Wildstar, etc. all've sold way less than that) are nothing to brag about. The thing is, in September of last year, they announced the game had sold 2.5 million copies, you know what that means? Yeah, 1.5 million new players have joined the game in the last 6 months (and it's reflected in game, since pretty much every server has some kind of queue and new character restrictions), and all this is happening BEFORE the expansion comes out, which will introduce the same amount of content A Realm Reborn had at launch(that's 2-3 times more than a WoW expansion).
I wont knock Yoshida for his work on XIV because honestly I think he's on the right track more or less with the game. Whether people like to admit it or not, he more than likely doesn't have a say in whether the game has a cash shop or not since that's left to other people. And those people work for someone else. More likely than not SE puts out pretty good games and XV will be good regardless of people think it will or wont. The problem is their business is just shady and greedy. That's not saying the games are, just the business. Sure the cash shop has loads of cosmetics which isn't a problem tbh, even the wedding tiers which can be sold in game (which is an excellent idea imo). But seasonal costumes have me worried since who's to say they dont allow you to get them in game anymore and just offer them in shop only. Mounts and pets should be sold in cash shop, Blizzard has been doing that for years. Its just when you take out the option to acquire in game content and sell it instead, that's shady and greedy. Now if you want to have it both, meaning you can buy it but also still acquire it through the seasonal event, then no one should care. Point is, the game isn't bad and people need to learn who to blame/support rather than blindly assuming one guy like Yoshida has all the power when he doesn't.
data that shows that over 80% of our players are satisfied with the subscription model and they feel very assured that it is a constant. You are safe to be in that environment, and you know that you can expect a decent amount of updates and content. So, we don’t believe that FFXIV needs to shift in that direction and not everything that other competitors or titles do will necessarily apply to our title.
If WOW ever goes completely free-to-play, maybe we will consider it. (Laughs)
I can't help but read that as "If WoW can continually overcharge for their product, then we're not about to stop either! (laughs)"
EDIT: I would also like to thank the person who wrote about how they enjoy paying a subscription to get "all" the content, except DLC and expansion packs and cash shop fluff items and so on because that's ok.
I wonder how far they will take the fluff? I mean, fluff is just how things look, so what if the coolest looking stuff was cash shop only? What if everyone rode around on a horse unless you could afford to buy the dragon in the cash shop? What about interfaces and cosmetic makeovers to the games appearance? What about emotes and other gestures/animations like walking and running? Would it be ok to sell a HD pack in the cash shop so you can take your resolution over 800 x 600? Really all those things are just "fluff" and are just cosmetic.
Anyhow, I think that if the players want to pay a subscription, then charge them a sub. If they want to buy stuff in a cash shop, then sell them stuff in a cash shop. And if the publishers want to change gears and market strategy, then we can all ready about how Joe Nobody thinks we should start a class action suit because they've been mislead.
Overcharge? In what universe does Square-Enix have the leverage to overcharge their product? In 10 years WoW has managed to gather 10 million loyal sheep to support them by providing massive amounts of dev support in the past. Sheep that stay loyal even when being overcharged today.
What magic does Square-Enix use to get their customers to pay more for less? You might say it's because of the Final Fantasy brand; I say the brand did them no good whatsoever when their customers abandoned the original 1.0 version. Is it the flawless track record in giving the customers what they want over these past five years? I am being sarcastic of course; for two (or three) out of the five years SE has done the complete opposite.
WoW can continually overcharge for their product today because they managed to create a loyal fanbase yesterday. The history of FFXIV has proven that SE is not even close to a similar position.
FFXIV:ARR came out bearing the name and reputation of its failed precedessor. It is outright delusional to think that they are in a place to overcharge and still manage to grow their customerbase instead of shrinking it. The playerbase has already proven that they are not sheep; just look at FFXIV 1.0 as the proof. Maybe that situation will change someday. But today, they are going to go and have gone as far with the fluff as their customers will allow them. The simple fact is they have a box fee, a sub fee and "a cash shop", as well as a playerbase that has proven that they are more than willing to walk away if not satisfied. Yet these people have decided to stick with A Realm Reborn. The same people are keeping Square-Enix in check because FFXIV:ARR is nothing without them.
You are essentially saying that the customers who abandoned FFXIV 1.0 are voluntarily letting themselves be overcharged by SE. Yes, clearly WoW customers and FFXIV customers have the same history with their respective products so this must be true. Or, just maybe, SE is actually providing so much value in their product that the failed reputation that weighed ARR has turned into a successful business opportunity.
TL;DR: I think you need new reading glasses. Also, satirical is my pick. You got me there mate.
Actually, I am essentially saying that there is zero credibility gained from justifying ones own actions by the actions of someone else.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
"If WOW ever goes completely free-to-play, maybe we will consider it. (Laughs)"
Lol that actually made me laugh a lot more than it should have. Truth is though SE isn't gonna do much f2p because they are too cheap/greedy/stubborn.
Every 2-3 months they release a rather large content update. All included in the fees. I just can't call that cheap if I compare it to other subscription games. And most F2P games barely have any new content, and if they do, you need to pay in the shop it.
Personally, I hope they continue what they are doing. I'm happy to pay every month for this steady stream of new awesome content.
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Playing: Final Fantasy Online: ARR, Destiny Most memorable games for me: UO, GW1, LoTRO
Comments
I would agree with this. I quit SWTOR because it was buggy as all hell even though I am a star wars fan and liked the game. However when end game was so buggy and the game really felt like I was in a shoe box I wouldnt continue to play the game. I still dont play the game even though is F2P because its not worth my time or my money. People dont realize how high Quality ARR is really and how much content they put out in each patch.
Isn't "FFXIV-ARR" a remake of "FFXIV" though? By what I mean: it was complete trash out of the gate, then when through a transition period to be remade to the current (apparently good) version.
Yes the game was trash right out of the gate in 1.0. If I remember correctly it was F2P at some point because it was so bad. So they Revamped the game and made ARR. SE did the right thing which a lot of MMOs do not do is shut the game down and revamp it. Now its very successful. The problem is people continue to trash the game because its a P2P game and they find any reason to say it should not be. Really the game is doing good and people who play it are fine with the sub. SE is making money so they dont care about trying to make short term large money games at the cost of long term success.
Ffxiv's cash shop compared to a f2p or b2p's cash shop. Ffxiv's content updates compared to everyone else. Huge differences.
Yup, but its not P2P game, its HYBRID game and has every monetization known to MMOs included. Oh, and i asked already, just for information, whats payment model in China? Yeah, im lazy
China has their own rules mandated by their government in regards to how an mmo is monetized there. BTW, I hate cash shops including the one in ffxiv. Fact remains, the sub keeps that cash shop to a minimum. I hope it stays that way or I'm out. There's no cash shop currency that carries over in game which is sadly quite rare these days. And lastly, it hands down outpaces every mmo in patched content. How long will that last? Who knows. Definitely not forever. So just like everyone else and their mmo of choice, in not gonna worry about it and just enjoy the gaming goodness for as long as I can.
So i would say it F2P in China.
And thats the point, they felt the need to include cash shop on top of mandatory sub. Just like that they can change to F2P at any point, expand cash shop in any way they see fit.
If they were so satisfied with what they make, why did they introduced cash shop? Greed?
Who knows their personal motivations. All I know is that there was a high demand for vials of fantasia to be placed in a cash shop by the majority of forum goers. And with all cash shops, they only get bigger heh. And apparently, this bothers the hell out of you... Why exactly?
Do you guys even play ff xiv? The box costs less than half of what every other AAA game charges and the subscription is also under-costed. The digital collectors doesn't even cost what other companies charge for a game and the ps3 to ps4 upgrade was free. The cash shop is completely innocuous. All they sell are more character customization potions (that they also give out for free) and seasonal items that you can get completely for free if you participate in the events. It is just for people that missed it the first time because so many people complained that they wouldn't be able to get them once the event passed. The only reason they even charge money for the seasonal items is as a compromise to avoid trivializing the content and upsetting players who were actually there and got the items legitimately. Other than that they sell like two cosmetics that you can't get in game. The shop is so tucked away and under-advertised that most people don't even know it exists. It is completely disingenuous to act like the cash stop is in any way comparable to a f2p game. It isn't even anything close to b2p games like GW2.
They also never claimed or even implied that they have 4 million simultaneous subscribed players. If you twisted their words it's your own fault. You're just looking for things to complain about at this point. The re-launch was a success. You guys need to get over it and move on.
Ah I see you've played ArcheAge lol
The thing is that's the only way their argument works: by simplifying everything to their simplest form.
It doesn't matter what kind of cash shop there is; the fact is that there is a cash shop.
It doesn't matter how much the box fee is; the fact is there is a box fee.
It doesn't matter that the sub fee is lower than the competition's: the fact is there is a sub fee.
It doesn't matter how much value SE keeps pumping out for the playerbase in comparison to the competition: the fact is all MMOs update their games.
And like this, voilá, FFXIV:ARR is like any other MMO. Just keep simplifying until the argument fits your agenda. Sadly for them this only works on the discussion boards and not in real life where sensible people understand that there is more to the argument than the mere existence of the cash shop or sub fee.
I don't see how this is any different than what every CEO for an MMO says. Bioware/EA said it, ZOS said it, etc etc.
There's really no news here. He's just doing a positive soundbite for the game.
I think it would have been more interesting if he said he'd commit seppuki if the game went F2P. But still, I doubt he would do it. Much like Alec Baldwin didn't fulfill his promise to move to Canada once Bush Jr. was elected.
I have and that is why I will never again play a F2P game. I played other F2P games that sucked just as bad. DDO, LOTRO, Runes of Magic.
Why do I care about a statistic about people who are paying a sub that includes people who won't pay a sub? We are talking about ARR specifically. Those people won't play any MMO with a Sub regardless of the title. Your comparison is more about the genre wide argument about sub vs no sub. Pulling in numbers not specific to the ARR question will skew it. So what you are suggesting is as bad as what you are claiming.
A better question might be "Of the gamers willing to pay a sub, how many are satisfied with ARR?"
Everything in the cash shop is cosmetic in function or is a service other AAA games charge for (server transfers/name changes/character alterations)
They could remove the cash shop and still keep the game P2P. I don't think SE is stupid enough to turn down extra money from people willing to spend it though. They've already outlined their plans to reinvest a bulk of the money gained from cash shop sales into an EU data center and to expand on the player housing servers, so it's not like this money is going right into the CEO's pocket or anything.
True, but in most cases Devs say this before launch or few months after then shit hits the fan. FFXIV has been out 2 - 3 years now with no problems so far . The playerbase is healthy, content is constantly being put out. Right now they've got it good, if they continue as they are the game will be fine. I could only see a F2P conversion if they truly fuck it up by making the cash shop a centrepiece and taking the game down another route.
Oh you must mean like Final Fantasy 14 1.0 that went Free to pl...wait a min... no... that did not happen.
I can't help but read that as "If WoW can continually overcharge for their product, then we're not about to stop either! (laughs)"
EDIT: I would also like to thank the person who wrote about how they enjoy paying a subscription to get "all" the content, except DLC and expansion packs and cash shop fluff items and so on because that's ok.
I wonder how far they will take the fluff? I mean, fluff is just how things look, so what if the coolest looking stuff was cash shop only? What if everyone rode around on a horse unless you could afford to buy the dragon in the cash shop? What about interfaces and cosmetic makeovers to the games appearance? What about emotes and other gestures/animations like walking and running? Would it be ok to sell a HD pack in the cash shop so you can take your resolution over 800 x 600? Really all those things are just "fluff" and are just cosmetic.
Anyhow, I think that if the players want to pay a subscription, then charge them a sub. If they want to buy stuff in a cash shop, then sell them stuff in a cash shop. And if the publishers want to change gears and market strategy, then we can all ready about how Joe Nobody thinks we should start a class action suit because they've been mislead.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
It's all quite entertaining lol
-Unconstitutional laws aren't laws.-
Overcharge? In what universe does Square-Enix have the leverage to overcharge their product? In 10 years WoW has managed to gather 10 million loyal sheep to support them by providing massive amounts of dev support in the past. Sheep that stay loyal even when being overcharged today.
What magic does Square-Enix use to get their customers to pay more for less? You might say it's because of the Final Fantasy brand; I say the brand did them no good whatsoever when their customers abandoned the original 1.0 version. Is it the flawless track record in giving the customers what they want over these past five years? I am being sarcastic of course; for two (or three) out of the five years SE has done the complete opposite.
WoW can continually overcharge for their product today because they managed to create a loyal fanbase yesterday. The history of FFXIV has proven that SE is not even close to a similar position.
FFXIV:ARR came out bearing the name and reputation of its failed precedessor. It is outright delusional to think that they are in a place to overcharge and still manage to grow their customerbase instead of shrinking it. The playerbase has already proven that they are not sheep; just look at FFXIV 1.0 as the proof. Maybe that situation will change someday. But today, they are going to go and have gone as far with the fluff as their customers will allow them. The simple fact is they have a box fee, a sub fee and "a cash shop", as well as a playerbase that has proven that they are more than willing to walk away if not satisfied. Yet these people have decided to stick with A Realm Reborn. The same people are keeping Square-Enix in check because FFXIV:ARR is nothing without them.
You are essentially saying that the customers who abandoned FFXIV 1.0 are voluntarily letting themselves be overcharged by SE. Yes, clearly WoW customers and FFXIV customers have the same history with their respective products so this must be true. Or, just maybe, SE is actually providing so much value in their product that the failed reputation that weighed ARR has turned into a successful business opportunity.
TL;DR: I think you need new reading glasses. Also, satirical is my pick. You got me there mate.
They've explained why they introduced the cash shop multiple times. The money they're making with the cash shop is used to, for example, launch the game in other regions (Korea this year), expand the game's infrastructure (opening an EU datacenter) and more than likely localizing the game to other languages (spanish has been rumored previously).
Also all the FFXIV cash shop has is literally 1 mount, a couple pets and some costumes that were obtainable in game from various events.
You're trying way to hard to make it sound like FFXIV is a cash grab, but you're forgetting multiple things, for example that the game is cheap as fuck, that the subscription is also cheaper than usual, and the most important thing: a single FFXIV patch has more meaningful content than the last 3 years of GW2.
So yeah, I'll keep supporting a company that actually works hard to keep their players happy, because I've already had enough trying to support games like GW2, that had such a huge potential to be something great, and ended up being not more than a sad joke.
Btw, you're also making it sound like the 4 million copies sold (GW2, ESO, Wildstar, etc. all've sold way less than that) are nothing to brag about. The thing is, in September of last year, they announced the game had sold 2.5 million copies, you know what that means? Yeah, 1.5 million new players have joined the game in the last 6 months (and it's reflected in game, since pretty much every server has some kind of queue and new character restrictions), and all this is happening BEFORE the expansion comes out, which will introduce the same amount of content A Realm Reborn had at launch(that's 2-3 times more than a WoW expansion).
Actually, I am essentially saying that there is zero credibility gained from justifying ones own actions by the actions of someone else.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
Every 2-3 months they release a rather large content update. All included in the fees. I just can't call that cheap if I compare it to other subscription games. And most F2P games barely have any new content, and if they do, you need to pay in the shop it.
Personally, I hope they continue what they are doing. I'm happy to pay every month for this steady stream of new awesome content.
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Playing: Final Fantasy Online: ARR, Destiny
Most memorable games for me: UO, GW1, LoTRO
Yes, you did say that too.