Originally posted by Viper482 Wow, so many soloists. No wonder the MMO genre and community is sucking. Why you would even play an MMO is baffling to me.
This always comes up and quite frankly you have your answer, just go to the "solo vs group thread" since it's been answered.
I've mostly soloed in these games even though I'm open to groups ... primarily not from @ssh0l3s or whatever idiot feels that the game revolves around him/her.
But I've helped countless new players with gear, money and tours, answered countless questions and did brief grouping with people who needed help on a particular quest or mini boss. Only to then go back to soloing.
I think the answer is to "be among people".
I'm told early mmo's were supposed to be virtual worlds (imagine that?) and even though I'm an extrovert (though in truth probably an ambivert) in "real life" I don't do group activities every single hour of the day.
There's an energy being in a world were you know you are not alone. It's like an old post I made when I compared mmo's to my Oblivion game with the "extra npc's" in the cities.
Even though they gave the impression of life in cities/towns I always knew that I was alone among a series of digital mannequins. Whereas in an mmo I know that there is "life" going on around me.
And that's pretty amazing as anything can happen because of all those players.
Just go play your single player game of choice, but keep facebook/twitter/ etc open in another screen/tab etc. You get exactly the same feeling, with better game play.
I'm a fairly centered, grounded, happy person and I always do what I think I'll enjoy.
Truth is, what you said is a very different experience precisely because the interaction would not be "about" the game.
If what you said would be enjoyable to me I would already be doing it.
Your issue is that you cannot fathom how someone can do something that you would never do.
I would say that it's "not all about game play". I imagine (I could be wrong) that you are one of those "game play comes first" people. That's not the case for me. There are many reasosn why I can play a certain game. Aesthetics is a huge part, community, freedom would be a bigger part.
Games that have "better game play", for me, tend to be games with a lot of story. I find it very difficult to "shoot the shit" while concentrating on the story. This is why I'm not a very good member of my Elder Scrolls Online guild as they are mostly about the teamspeak interaction and drowning them out while listening to the quests is a pain in the neck.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
If I'm playing a MMO then its group play all the way I look for as many activities I can do with either friends or other plays tend to find if I'm not doing group content my interest wains of and I end up falling back to a good single player rpg.
Still don't understand why anyone would want to play a MMORPG a 100% solo when there are many single player rpgs that will give a far better experience.
The way MMORPGs are designed alone would entice most people to choose them over a single player game(Systems, stories, scale, public achievements, reasons to craft...etc.). The constant updates and additions are another. Playing in a world filled with live people makes it more immersive, even if you don't group at all. People do chat when they solo, I know it's hard for some of you to grasp that fact. I'm sure there are a plethora of other reasons to play MMOs over single player games depending on the gamer's tastes.
One of the biggest reasons for me is the combat. It's very hard to find a single player RPG that has tab targeting and auto attack. The majority are now action adventures like Diablo and Skyrim. Unfortunately, it's becoming more and more difficult to find newer MMORPGs that have these features too.
Still don't understand why anyone would want to play a MMORPG a 100% solo when there are many single player rpgs that will give a far better experience.
Because some MMOs have unique gameplay that cannot be find in a single player game?
Case in point, Marvel Heroes .. tell me where I can find another Diablo-ish ARPG with marvel characters (except, of course the ancient MUA, or those iOS crap) and i will be there.
Another example. STO. Is there a Star Trek TNG era RPG with both ship & ground combat? In fact, I am just playing the missions like a single player game. Let me know if there is a better one.
So I guess the point is that I play MMORPGs solo precisely because I cannot get a better experiences in some areas from single player games.
In a perfect world two things could be the case. First is that there was a 50/50 split between solo and group content as there was enough content to satisfy both. Second, and sort of related, would be scaling mechanics where the mobs would be more powerful the more people were in the group. The only problem I have with most of the MMOs out right now is that solo content is the majority of content and if you want to group you get about 5-10% of legitimate group content (content that intended for groups).
Another issue is time allotment which does favor soloing. This is a reality as to why solo content is more prefered than groupm. That's why I think a scaling mechanic is best along with flexible class/role systems. It would allow the group to continue with less people and still be a challange, no matter the role the person filled before they left.
Originally posted by Aelious In a perfect world two things could be the case. First is that there was a 50/50 split between solo and group content as there was enough content to satisfy both. Second, and sort of related, would be scaling mechanics where the mobs would be more powerful the more people were in the group. The only problem I have with most of the MMOs out right now is that solo content is the majority of content and if you want to group you get about 5-10% of legitimate group content (content that intended for groups).
Another issue is time allotment which does favor soloing. This is a reality as to why solo content is more prefered than groupm. That's why I think a scaling mechanic is best along with flexible class/role systems. It would allow the group to continue with less people and still be a challange, no matter the role the person filled before they left.
you mean Diablo 3? The content is the same .. so 50-50. Group of 2-4 will get scaled up mobs ... except as you have suggested. The time allotment .. is exactly the same ... 15 min for a GR.
Originally posted by Hrimnir 40% balanced my ass. I'm guesing about 35% of that 40% are people that should have answered solo or antisocial grouper.
Why do you think so? Balanced is a common approach - it's the people who like to do a dungeon run either once a day or 2-3 times a week, and solo or be with a single partner (or single opponent) the rest of the time. It's really natural for humans to like to alternate gameplay that uses different areas of the brain, such as crafting or minigames vs. combat; social vs. non-social. The brain just gets tired of doing one type of thing (uses up the relevant neurotransmitters) then wants to switch to something else, then switch back later.
I want to help design and develop a PvE-focused, solo-friendly, sandpark MMO which combines crafting, monster hunting, and story. So PM me if you are starting one.
Originally posted by Hrimnir 40% balanced my ass. I'm guesing about 35% of that 40% are people that should have answered solo or antisocial grouper.
Why do you think so? Balanced is a common approach - it's the people who like to do a dungeon run either once a day or 2-3 times a week, and solo or be with a single partner (or single opponent) the rest of the time. It's really natural for humans to like to alternate gameplay that uses different areas of the brain, such as crafting or minigames vs. combat; social vs. non-social. The brain just gets tired of doing one type of thing (uses up the relevant neurotransmitters) then wants to switch to something else, then switch back later.
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
Originally posted by Vorthanion You obviously hate soloers, both solo options are anti-social in the way you described them. I'm a social soloer who likes to occasionally group. I chat, haggle and lend a hand as good as any rabid grouper / raider. I didn't choose any of your rather biased options. Even the balanced option is slanted more towards grouping.
Let me help you out here.
Originally posted by StoneRoses
Looks like it's pretty much said and done!
I am not going to apologize to those who choose not to participate, I was counting on that, and you all had your reason.
In all fairness I did suggest that someone else do it.
Originally posted by Vorthanion You obviously hate soloers, both solo options are anti-social in the way you described them. I'm a social soloer who likes to occasionally group. I chat, haggle and lend a hand as good as any rabid grouper / raider. I didn't choose any of your rather biased options. Even the balanced option is slanted more towards grouping.
Let me help you out here.
Originally posted by StoneRoses
Looks like it's pretty much said and done!
I am not going to apologize to those who choose not to participate, I was counting on that, and you all had your reason.
In all fairness I did suggest that someone else do it.
Anyhow, Happy MMORPGing!!!!
I do think you mean Asocial, someone who isn't interested in socialising/grouping rather than anti-social. But you can still be very social in MMO's even without grouping up.
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
Because people play these games for combat, and gameplay, not waiting around to chat with others.
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
Because people play these games for combat, and gameplay, not waiting around to chat with others.
Thus supporting my contention of them being antisocial groupers.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
Because people play these games for combat, and gameplay, not waiting around to chat with others.
Thus supporting my contention of them being antisocial groupers.
nope .. it supports the contention of them being antisocial .. they can be antisocial soloers as well as antisocial groupers.
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
Because people play these games for combat, and gameplay, not waiting around to chat with others.
Thus supporting my contention of them being antisocial groupers.
nope .. it supports the contention of them being antisocial .. they can be antisocial soloers as well as antisocial groupers.
I think it supports the fact that MMO's simply aren't being made with the groupers in mind. The MMO's with the solo content are the most popular because.. well.. have you seen any grouping focused game? I think people chose Balanced for the same reason I did - they want to group but the games don't let them or don't allow them to often enough, so they end up with a forced balanced gameplay.
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
Because people play these games for combat, and gameplay, not waiting around to chat with others.
Thus supporting my contention of them being antisocial groupers.
nope .. it supports the contention of them being antisocial .. they can be antisocial soloers as well as antisocial groupers.
I think it supports the fact that MMO's simply aren't being made with the groupers in mind. The MMO's with the solo content are the most popular because.. well.. have you seen any grouping focused game? I think people chose Balanced for the same reason I did - they want to group but the games don't let them or don't allow them to often enough, so they end up with a forced balanced gameplay.
I have a daughter and need to be able to get off my game whenever she wants me to and that means I need to go afk or quit at a moments notice.
I do miss the days when I could sit in front of the computer for 14 hours a day grouping and chatting with people but to be honest my daughter is a lot more rewarding than any game
So I guess my real category would be "Soloist but enjoy grouping when I can".
I'm the same way at times and may have to temporarily jet if a child is up. I had a funny thought though related to Landmark's grapling hooks. If they carry those over to EQN that would be a great AFK tool in a group: "Daughter afk brb" *zip*
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
Because people play these games for combat, and gameplay, not waiting around to chat with others.
Thus supporting my contention of them being antisocial groupers.
nope .. it supports the contention of them being antisocial .. they can be antisocial soloers as well as antisocial groupers.
I think it supports the fact that MMO's simply aren't being made with the groupers in mind. The MMO's with the solo content are the most popular because.. well.. have you seen any grouping focused game? I think people chose Balanced for the same reason I did - they want to group but the games don't let them or don't allow them to often enough, so they end up with a forced balanced gameplay.
You're given the same options that I have,...clearly it's the Developers fault for giving you more options of how to play a game.
Look at GW2 a great example of a more modern game giving you more ways to level and not just running around killing things. But even that wasn't acceptable for some of you because it wasn't Old School or Innovative enough.
Oh no... you can't complete some of the Dynamics Events without a group? Now we have the other argument of being FORCED to group.
I think technology will come to the rescue. There are already examples of difficulty scaling both in and out of dungeons in EQ2. Granted, that has to do with scaling the player. Hopefully at some point the scaling can happen from a content perspective that way if you want to play in a group, just group up and the mobs adjust.
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
Because people play these games for combat, and gameplay, not waiting around to chat with others.
Thus supporting my contention of them being antisocial groupers.
nope .. it supports the contention of them being antisocial .. they can be antisocial soloers as well as antisocial groupers.
As you said, the key point here is Antisocial. If they're antisocial and playing group content primarily, they're antisocial groupers.
How long are we going to beat the pedantry horse today narius?
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
Thus supporting my contention of them being antisocial groupers.
nope .. it supports the contention of them being antisocial .. they can be antisocial soloers as well as antisocial groupers.
I think it supports the fact that MMO's simply aren't being made with the groupers in mind. The MMO's with the solo content are the most popular because.. well.. have you seen any grouping focused game? I think people chose Balanced for the same reason I did - they want to group but the games don't let them or don't allow them to often enough, so they end up with a forced balanced gameplay.
Yes, all MOBAs require playing in teams of 5?
Yes, because MOBA's are MMORPGs. Narius, you're killin me man, you're usually better than this...
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
well i would like to say that i am a Grouper, but honestly nowadays i don't feel there is a game that implements well a guild system... best thing since lineage2 interlude, i found was quite a few months back in age of wulin/wushu... I surely miss those sieges and planing sessions in clan houses... or castles.
Wannabe grouper: Wants to group but am forced to solo because of RL only allowing short playsessions. Probably ought to stop MMO'ing, but still dream of being able to interact socially like in the good old days without commitments. Plans to do all the group-content, but slowly sees it disappear as soloplay keeps the levels going.
*sigh*
I'm with ya, there. Funny thing is, I can actually have 3-4 hours of gaming time reasonably often, but I find myself having to go AFK frequently for 5-10 minutes at a time. And unlike some folks that group up, there's no friggin' way I'm gonna subject other people to that kind of crap. Their time is just as valuable as mine.
So yep... I like groups, but I refuse to be that D-bag that keeps groups waiting.
Nope. I insist on being an entirely different kind of d-bag.
Comments
I'm a fairly centered, grounded, happy person and I always do what I think I'll enjoy.
Truth is, what you said is a very different experience precisely because the interaction would not be "about" the game.
If what you said would be enjoyable to me I would already be doing it.
Your issue is that you cannot fathom how someone can do something that you would never do.
I would say that it's "not all about game play". I imagine (I could be wrong) that you are one of those "game play comes first" people. That's not the case for me. There are many reasosn why I can play a certain game. Aesthetics is a huge part, community, freedom would be a bigger part.
Games that have "better game play", for me, tend to be games with a lot of story. I find it very difficult to "shoot the shit" while concentrating on the story. This is why I'm not a very good member of my Elder Scrolls Online guild as they are mostly about the teamspeak interaction and drowning them out while listening to the quests is a pain in the neck.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
The way MMORPGs are designed alone would entice most people to choose them over a single player game(Systems, stories, scale, public achievements, reasons to craft...etc.). The constant updates and additions are another. Playing in a world filled with live people makes it more immersive, even if you don't group at all. People do chat when they solo, I know it's hard for some of you to grasp that fact. I'm sure there are a plethora of other reasons to play MMOs over single player games depending on the gamer's tastes.
One of the biggest reasons for me is the combat. It's very hard to find a single player RPG that has tab targeting and auto attack. The majority are now action adventures like Diablo and Skyrim. Unfortunately, it's becoming more and more difficult to find newer MMORPGs that have these features too.
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/Because some MMOs have unique gameplay that cannot be find in a single player game?
Case in point, Marvel Heroes .. tell me where I can find another Diablo-ish ARPG with marvel characters (except, of course the ancient MUA, or those iOS crap) and i will be there.
Another example. STO. Is there a Star Trek TNG era RPG with both ship & ground combat? In fact, I am just playing the missions like a single player game. Let me know if there is a better one.
So I guess the point is that I play MMORPGs solo precisely because I cannot get a better experiences in some areas from single player games.
Another issue is time allotment which does favor soloing. This is a reality as to why solo content is more prefered than groupm. That's why I think a scaling mechanic is best along with flexible class/role systems. It would allow the group to continue with less people and still be a challange, no matter the role the person filled before they left.
you mean Diablo 3? The content is the same .. so 50-50. Group of 2-4 will get scaled up mobs ... except as you have suggested. The time allotment .. is exactly the same ... 15 min for a GR.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Why do you think so? Balanced is a common approach - it's the people who like to do a dungeon run either once a day or 2-3 times a week, and solo or be with a single partner (or single opponent) the rest of the time. It's really natural for humans to like to alternate gameplay that uses different areas of the brain, such as crafting or minigames vs. combat; social vs. non-social. The brain just gets tired of doing one type of thing (uses up the relevant neurotransmitters) then wants to switch to something else, then switch back later.
Because the numbers from the industry don't match up with the poll. The MMO's that have the most solo/casual non group content are far and away the most popular. And in most of those less than 20% of the player base participates in any group content unless there is some kind of LFG tool that takes all of the work out of it. Thus the antisocial grouper. Back when you had to actually communicate with people to form a group a whole hell of a lot of people complained about it, and very few actually did it.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
I do think you mean Asocial, someone who isn't interested in socialising/grouping rather than anti-social. But you can still be very social in MMO's even without grouping up.
Because people play these games for combat, and gameplay, not waiting around to chat with others.
Thus supporting my contention of them being antisocial groupers.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
nope .. it supports the contention of them being antisocial .. they can be antisocial soloers as well as antisocial groupers.
I think it supports the fact that MMO's simply aren't being made with the groupers in mind. The MMO's with the solo content are the most popular because.. well.. have you seen any grouping focused game? I think people chose Balanced for the same reason I did - they want to group but the games don't let them or don't allow them to often enough, so they end up with a forced balanced gameplay.
Yes, all MOBAs require playing in teams of 5?
I play solo but only because I am forced to
I have a daughter and need to be able to get off my game whenever she wants me to and that means I need to go afk or quit at a moments notice.
I do miss the days when I could sit in front of the computer for 14 hours a day grouping and chatting with people but to be honest my daughter is a lot more rewarding than any game
So I guess my real category would be "Soloist but enjoy grouping when I can".
I'm the same way at times and may have to temporarily jet if a child is up. I had a funny thought though related to Landmark's grapling hooks. If they carry those over to EQN that would be a great AFK tool in a group: "Daughter afk brb" *zip*
You're given the same options that I have,...clearly it's the Developers fault for giving you more options of how to play a game.
Look at GW2 a great example of a more modern game giving you more ways to level and not just running around killing things. But even that wasn't acceptable for some of you because it wasn't Old School or Innovative enough.
Oh no... you can't complete some of the Dynamics Events without a group? Now we have the other argument of being FORCED to group.
As you said, the key point here is Antisocial. If they're antisocial and playing group content primarily, they're antisocial groupers.
How long are we going to beat the pedantry horse today narius?
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Yes, because MOBA's are MMORPGs. Narius, you're killin me man, you're usually better than this...
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
I'm with ya, there. Funny thing is, I can actually have 3-4 hours of gaming time reasonably often, but I find myself having to go AFK frequently for 5-10 minutes at a time. And unlike some folks that group up, there's no friggin' way I'm gonna subject other people to that kind of crap. Their time is just as valuable as mine.
So yep... I like groups, but I refuse to be that D-bag that keeps groups waiting.
Nope. I insist on being an entirely different kind of d-bag.